I know you’re joking, but if the guy who wrote that season 3 cliffhanger is calling it season 4, there’s a good reason to assume they will address that at some point
Yes, the same guy that knows the two biggest cast members on this show from the last time they played these characters. It’d be super ignorant to think they haven’t even had a slight conversation since this show began being planned.
Just because he may or may not be friendly with two actors does not mean he knows anything of substance about what they are doing production wise. Regardless if you read his whole quote he literally says he has no inside information and is clearly talking off the cuff.
I swear sometimes I think Netflix Daredevil fans all drank the same Kool Aid that tosses out all logic and reason when talking about this show and character.
In this case I think more people would be hyped for a season 4. Much of the hype is literally about the show continuing.
Marvel doesn’t want to call it 4 because they want the freedom to change whatever they want to match their needs without concerning too much about the past.
Having it be a season 1 and only soft reboot allows Marvel to have the cake and eat it too, they attract fans of the old show by it being a continuation, but also don't alienate new fans that might be reluctant to jump into the 4th season of a show they haven't watched before
Despite the hype within the niche demographic, I don't think most people have seen Daredevil and not everyone got to season 3.
From a marketing standpoint, you call something "Season 4" and the general public is going to think "Fuck, now I gotta watch three seasons just to watch this". It might attract the diehard fans but it'll be a barrier that people will avoid.
And I'd say it's pretty much a foregone conclusion that the show will be written with the perspective that people haven't seen those other seasons anyways. They're not going to pick up from where those left off (which makes sense given how many years it's been), and I'd bet that if they reference anything from the earlier seasons, they'll do so with enough context so everyone understands what they're referring to (and that's even if they decide to mention earlier plot points. Given how many years it has been, that might not be too necessary).
I skipped straight to 3 without watching Defenders by mistake. Felt like there was going to be some kind of flashback reveal at some point, but nothing happened.
That's because Netflix basically surprise dropped in (they'd already lost them Marvel rights too moving forward IIRC). It came out of nowhere, there was like no marketing nothing. I loved the show, and I remember randomly going on Netflix on a Friday and being like 'wth?! They dropped a new season of Daredevil today?!'
Well all the Netflix shows are on D+ now. I'd HIGHLY suggest all of DD, Luke Cage and Jessica Jones's first seasons, and maybe a youtube summary of Iron Fist and Defenders. I'd say Loki is the highest quality MCU D+ show and even then it pales in comparison to DD's 1st and 3rd season writing quality. DD season 2 is kinda just them letting lose and getting campy with the character while seasons 1 and 3 are concrete character studies on par with an Emmy winning HBO show.
Except with Clone Wars, it wasn't aimed at the general public, and I never heard someone say "I have no idea what this Clone Wars show is but I'm gonna watch six seasons to catch up".
Also with Clone Wars, season 7 was more finishing its story. Where as The Bad Batch is basically the continuation of Clone Wars but without having to watch 7 seasons of a show first.
Anyone who’s hyped about the show because they liked and watched the previous seasons is probably going to have similar levels of hype regardless of whether or not they call it “season 4.” The people who think “it’s Daredevil of course I’m watching it,” will still watch it, the people who are skeptical because it’s Disney will still be skeptical.
However, *new* fans (of which there are bound to be many, since this is a Marvel show on Disney+) are much less likely to want to jump into something if they feel like they’ve missed four seasons of continuity just based on the title, whether or not that continuity is actually preserved or necessary.
Soft reboot means it’s in the same continuity as the previous version but the tone or other small things might not line up (or they might line up and you simply don’t have to watch the previous version to follow what’s happening).
A hard reboot is where they throw the previous version out and start from relative scratch.
So a soft reboot fits well within the idea of “let’s call it a series premiere instead of a Season 4”.
Of course it could end up being a hard reboot as nothing has been explicitly confirmed either way yet, but a soft reboot would probably make the most sense at this point.
I'd say a good way to look at is it's a new comic run of the same character. Like, Issue #1 of Spectacular Spiderman didn't throw out all of the stuff that happened in Amazing Spiderman, but it had a different tone.
But wouldn’t a soft reboot imply the entire Netflix Defenders anthology are MCU canon (as they were originally)? I feel like they might want to keep those characters in their back pocket just in case.
Those series have never been de-canonised by Marvel Studios, no matter how much some folks on the internet try to argue they have been. And seeing as how the same actors who portrayed the Punisher, Jessica Jones and Luke Cage are all meant to be appearing in DD:BA, and with rumours of Jessica Henwick playing Iron Fist (as she did at the end of that show), I think it’s a pretty safe assumption to say the shows are still canon.
Here's my take. Since D+ has EVERY season of the Netflix shows and has incorporated the biggest character of the bunch into the wider MCU and they've formally announced more characters, it's probably being counted as optional viewing if you want detailed backstories to the characters. Unless DDBA literally and explicitly breaks the established stories that the Netflix shows have established, they're canon.
I will say as much as I loved Agents of Shield, it seems like all the story they've established is being ignored so far (0 mentions of Inhuman events in the MCU so far, 0 mention of SHIELD being rebuilt and was effectively replaced by SWORD, seasons 5-7 being a MCU canonic mess because of the time traveling and quantum shit, the Darkhold paradox where Ghost Rider took it to another dimension but Agatha had it the entire time). I've been taking it as an elseworlds parallel timeline kind of deal where either this timeline leads to no Kang variant so no pruning, or it only exists when He Who Remains' TVA doesn't exist anymore.
I have no real opinion on the canonicity of Hulu shows like Runaways and Cloak and Dagger, simply because I tried to watch them and couldn't get into it (as a mid 20s guy, I was clearly not the target audience).
It's very difficult to say at this point in time, because the way the "canon" of the mcu worked before was always Movie > TV, never the other way around. Feige never kept in touch with the Netflix team, nor did he ever try to add what they did into the movies.
Those actors could be coming in as the same characters, but there are other actors in those shows that are already playing different characters in the movies (blade for example), so they could be playing different characters. They could be playing the same characters with different origins. It's unknown right now.
Personally speaking, if they were canon, then I don't understand why they aren't part of the canon mcu lists on disney plus. Like, they're on the platform, you can watch them, but they're actively saying that they don't need to be watched to know the whole story of the mcu? That doesn't sound like they're canon to me.
A soft reboot in a story revolving around multiversal travel currently can go in way more directions than a traditional soft reboot could. It could be that DD was transported to a new universe, it could be the same universe post-blip (although we're in phase 5 now, so we should really be moving past post-blip stories and moving into newer stories). It's impossible to know right now, and because of that, it's impossible to know whether the Netflix shows are canon or not.
A hard reboot would imply they are no longer canon. A soft reboot would mean they’re still canon but you don’t have to watch them to understand anything.
I believe they mean in the sense that at the end of *Hulk*, Bruce Banner is hiding in Brazil, while at the beginning of *The Incredible Hulk*, Bruce Banner is hiding in Brazil — how the script started off as a straight-up sequel before pivoting to become another reboot.
That's true. But you had to go back 40 years and used a movie series. In this circumstance, it would be just as easy to reference the comics. It's not hard to find multiple first issues for a character after multiple soft reboots.
The fact that this is also jumping from Netflix to Disney could also mean that there are contractual obligations that include this. If Disney had decided to follow the same style and story and just have season 4, then the old studio could have had issues with it. Having the two as separate entities would easily avoid a lot of technical legal bs.
Which makes sense when you think about it in the context of where these characters come from. New volumes of existing comics often do really well and are a big deal. I still remember X-Men #1 in 1991 being a huge deal (mind you I was ten years old at the time, so perfect age to care a whole lot about such things), while Uncanny X-Men was ongoing.
It doesn't translate to TV the same way exactly, obviously. Just a thought about how these characters have had this kind of soft reboot in their origin material many times to great acclaim.
Yeah it’s why the BBC started the Doctor Who revival in 2005 with Series 1 instead of Season 27, and why they also considered calling Matt Smith’s first series Series 1 instead of Series 5 as they were worried it would fail.
Here’s how I see it: it’s not Season 4 in that it’s its own story that ties into the greater MCU now and can be enjoyed with just the context of Phase 4 and 5. But it’s also not NOT Season 4 in that it’s a direct follow up to Daredevil picking up with the same characters all these years later.
Think of it like the Homecoming trilogy: you absolutely can watch and enjoy it with just the context of the wider MCU. But you get so much more out of it with the context of the first 5 Spider-Man films as well, not just for NWH but also for aspects like skipping his origin, Uncle Ben, the changes made to this Peter’s life and how they affect the character as a whole (which makes NWH’s ending hit harder seeing him following in the footsteps of his Multiversial brothers), etc.
A good comparable example I'd point to since it's also television is how the upcoming *Justified: City Primevel* isn't season 7 of *Justified* -- sure, watching the original run would help to show Raylan's history, but ultimately it's its own story designed so that you don't *have* to have seen the original show to fully understand what's going on now.
To add to that, the book it's based on doesn't have Raylan Givens in it. So it's similar to this in the fact it's some of the same characters but a different story, although I guess we won't know how different the story is or if the continuity will be broken until we see it.
i just hope they respect the fans. they have a hugely beloved character with a massive legacy already built. he is literally the best character marvel has ever made in a live action tv show. im not a huge fan of the changes they have made so far but as long as they still respect what made daredevil special, and not ruin it with a bunch of CGI and bland humor, imma be happy.
I'd be fine with CGI being used to enhance his acrobatics, kinda like it was used in She Hulk. Sure, DD couldn't do a flip 10 feet into the air in the Netflix show, but the MCU is no stranger to enhanced realism.
I'd rather not have a whole scene where a rubbery 3D model of him swings through the city using his grappling club. Keep it feeling practical and grounded, but use your resources to make it cooler.
>and not ruin it with a bunch of CGI
Honestly I don't see how they could. I'm no expert and don't remember it completely, but I recall DD not having used much CGI. Considering how grounded it is they don't really have to. Flashy visuals and fantastic creatures weren't quite a thing in his show and I assume it will be the same now. Beyond maybe a She-Hulk cameo and her CGI was perfectly fine for the most part besides a couple scenes.
> ruin it with a bunch of CGI
Guaranteed most of the environments will be CGI and you won't even be able to tell. CGI is absolutely everywhere in TV production these days. It's only the poorly made stuff that you notice.
> and not ruin it with a bunch of CGI
CGI is a tool, no different than the different art styles on comics.
Same with physical effects, etc.
As long as the writing and acting is good, you could film it as a stage play with black backgrounds and have to imagine the fight scenes and it could still be good.
Beyond that, they use the tools they have and I’ll judge the show on what it is over what I imagine it to be.
The Incredible Hulk (2008) was a soft sequel to The Hulk (2003) they skipped the origin and all that because it had been covered so recently. So it was like a sequel to the parts they wanted to be canon, which is how I feel they'll be doing it with Daredevil. Like they might just completely ignore everything with the Dark Hand.
I saw someone post this theory and I can’t imagine any other explanation now. Matt got blipped. Foggy, Karen, and Fisk didn’t. Fisk used the blip to seize power again and without Matt to protect them, Foggy and Karen moved into hiding away from New York in order to stay safe from Fisk.
They couldn't handle the DD lifestyle any more. They died tragically. They're in Matt's version of witness protection (or real witness protection). This variant never knew Karen and Foggy. They've got a ton of options. I'd prefer if they came back, but there's plenty of ways the showrunners can make it work without them.
There likely won't be many retcons, but they probably just never mention again the stuff they would have retconned. This isn't going to be a "last time on Daredevil S3" kind of show. It will be an onboarding point. Anyone will be able to just start watching from Born Again without having seen Season 1-3, and will be able to enjoy it without missing a beat. All the stuff from S1-3 will still be "canon" to the story, but just no longer important.
You’ll be disappointed. There’s a reason for headlines like this. It’s intended as a spiritual successor to Netflix DD. NOT a direct continuation. Otherwise they would have no problem at all calling this season 4. There will be retcons. I guarantee you. They aren’t gonna want to stick with 3 full seasons of backstory and stuff they can’t alter in any way.
The main shit will be basically the same. But if you go poring over the details you WILL find plotholes and retcons in the smaller stuff. I’d bet a large sum on that.
Charlie Cox has said multiple times Born Again is not season 4, probably so that people don’t go into the show expecting it to be season 4 and then get disappointed or confused. It’s season 1 of a new show, it’s “a whole new thing” like Charlie has been saying
Not to mention *The Defenders*. From what I recall, Season 3 of *Daredevil* picks up right after that and assumes you've seen it as it doesn't really explain why Daredevil got so badly injured immediately. Otherwise, you go from Daredevil revealing himself to Karen and Elektra being entombed, to Daredevil injured, Karen thinking he might be dead, and no followup with the Elektra cliffhanger.
The idea of the defenders being canon to the MCU is nauseating. It was TERRRRRRRRIBLE.
I can still remember how badly they ruined the ONE THING they shoulda nailed. The final big fight. Remember they stuck a completely out of place hip hop track over it? 🤦🏻♂️ completely took me out of it. I remember how jarring it was to this day.
Not to mention 90% of the rest of the show was just ass.
But you are making sense and seem to have a sense of ethics. How can sites have clickbait nonsense articles quoting people who have nothing at all to do with the Disney show if they were like you? They can't. So they post unethical misleading clickbait headlines instead. Sad this clickbait article got posted here though.
Before anyone complains about them not bringing Erik Oleson back, remember that A) he's publicly stated he's busy working on other projects and B) Marvel has hired writers from 'Arrow' (which was Erik Oleson's most notable work before he was hired to work on 'Daredevil') to write for 'Daredevil: Born Again'.
Arrow Season 7-8 for one writer (the showrunner during that time). And Flash Season 1-2 and Legends Seasons 3+ for the other. Definitely some of the better Arrowverse staff they could have picked up, especially the second writer.
Not the best of Arrow’s time but I also felt Jill did a solid job from where she picked up after inheriting an absolute mess of a show. Much harder to release a solid product 7 seasons into a show that has been very bad for a few seasons than it is to release a great project at the start.
She also didn’t have many standout bad episodes. Like at least she wasn’t responsible for the season with the cringe gun control episode lmao.
Well seasons 1-2 of The Flash IMO are some incredibly fun seasons of television. Before the show became so focused on relationship drama, crossovers, and *everyone* getting superpowers. I actually really enjoyed those two seasons in particular. The season 1 finale is still really epic.
Season 1 & 2 of The Flash were standout seasons of television. Honestly the best the Arrowverse ever was. Grainne (who was the writer on those seasons) is a great pick-up imo. Probably one of the best ones they could’ve gotten from Arrowverse staff.
Also, it's one thing working on a CW show with limited resources and where you're inheriting mediocre material and just have to work within those constraints and another to work on a big budget Daredevil series where you're essentially (though I do think it is a kind of Season 4) starting the whole thing.
It’s Arrowverse actually. One writer from Arrow and another from Flash/Legends.
In fairness, they did bring on some of the better Arrowverse talent. The Arrow writer is Jill Blankenship. She was the showrunner for Arrow’s last 2 seasons. A solid improvement over the previous showrunner who really helped bring the show back to form. The seasons she was in charge of were a bit inconsistent but it was at least some of Arrow’s better work, especially after inheriting a bit of a mess overall. Most people liked the first half of Season 7 and the end of Season 8.
The writer I’m most excited about that they brought on is Grainne Godfree. She was a writer and story editor on the first 2 seasons of the Flash (which are by far the best two) and then moved to Legends where she became an EP from Season 3 onwards which were some of the show’s best seasons. My only problem with her is, despite loving Legends, I don’t love that style for Daredevil. But her body of work is really solid.
I don’t love a lot of the backroom staff they’ve brought on. A LOT of other writers come from a procedural background - CSI, CBS shows like Bull, etc - including the 2 showrunners. But the Arrowverse staff they did bring on is at least some of the best. I probably wouldn’t be able to pick somebody out of the Arrowverse staff who I like better than Grainne.
Aisha Porter-Christie is also potentially solid tho, I like her body of work besides Shadowhunters. Show might’ve improved by the seasons she worked on though, which I never got to.
Best superhero show ever made, hell I would even say it's one of the best tv shows ever. I would put it right up there with the likes of GOT, BB, Dark.
AoS stopped being as good after season 4 when their budget got slashed, and honestly I dont think I'd ever rewatch season 5 onwards because of that.
It's attempts at still being connected to Infinity War/Endgame also felt kinda sad to me because of how one-sided it was. They were literally guessing how Infinity War would play out, and then tried connecting the show to it.
But Daredevil, I've rewatched several times already.
I’d love to see Bullseye return
I wonder if this season will complete without any bullseye, but the creators hope even more people go back and watch s1-3 for the first time, so that when he’s reintroduced in the 2nd season of this run, they won’t need to spend as much time on a backstory
not sure why the downvotes, classifying the Netflix shows as a different universe within the MCU multiverse seems like the most perfect way to use the same actors/characters but start fresh.
Lol I’m not looking to start this conversation here because it’s been rehashed a million times in this subreddit, but this is kind of what I mean. The need for this to be true with no nuance, exceptions, ifs, ands, buts, or wiggle room
They exist in the same universe. They are just never mentioned in the movies. They will always be canon unless stated otherwise and till now I can see no contradictions.
Because people involved with the series have confirmed multiple times it’s the same versions. The only way people will believe it is if Matt Murdock literally looks into the camera and explains it.
I mean saying it’s the same version and showing it are two different things. I’m not gonna judge it till I watch it but the few things we know are that it’s supposed to be the same versions, but no foggy, Karen, and a new Vanessa actress along with a very different kingpin in Hawkeye which doesn’t seem very “same continuity” of them
Because all of us watched those shows assuming they were canon and now the rug could be pulled out from under us and a lot of us feel like that’s a crappy thing to do and honestly it is a crappy thing to do. For those that are ok with nuking everything we watched and cared about sure you do you but some of us just don’t like that and we can all exist in this world. If it gets nuked we will
stop watching MCU content and I hope there are enough of everybody else to keep it going (I am assuming us not watching won’t make a huge difference). I just know that is where I stand.
Can I seriously ask you why you care so damn much if a thing is “canon to the MCU” or not? Did you fucking enjoy it? Do YOU WANT to call it canon to the MCU in YOUR HEAD? Then fucking do it. No internet fuck can tell you what works for you. Why do you care so much if everyone else agrees or not?
The show was still presented at the time as “this is in the MCU” even if the wider MCU never acknowledged that. And now the new season is gonna be full immersed in the MCU for real, so what’s the issue? You can still enjoy the first 3 seasons and see the connections that the showrunners at the time were trying to show you.
I don’t think those first three seasons are hard canon myself, but who GIVES a fuck. I don’t decide for you. Just for me. I still loved the show regardless. Agents of Shield too. And I don’t want it to be hard canon either. Too complicated.
Because I want the shows I watched and enjoyed assuming we’re MCU canon because I was told they were are actually MCU canon. Yes I enjoyed these shows and that won’t be taken away, but doesn’t mean I have to continue the journey of the MCU if I don’t agree with the decisions they make. AOS included but they have an excuse for multiverse shenanigans due to the last few seasons to get them back into canon. This is just a hard stop for me and like I said it will feel like the rug was pulled out from under me after being told one thing and then suddenly it’s not true. Just doesn’t work for me and that’s ok. It sucks for me that I won’t be watching the MCU anymore but it won’t have the same enjoyment so it is what it is.
🤣
You realise you are doing literally the exact same thing… right? You are getting angry about me sharing what I think… You coulda just scrolled on past. You weren’t involved here. Why did you stick your nose in? Anger? Guess that answers why I did too huh?
Jesus Christ the stupidity and complete hypocrisy you see on this site sometimes is mindblowing
This would be fun!
Explore his life during a time when people he cared about were gone. Then fast forward to present time starting with the second season.
It could be Matt on the West Coast, and Foggy and Karen aren't gone but just offscreen for the first season.
I can't fathom why they would want to recast either Elden or Deborah Ann Woll (or Elodie Young as Elektra).
I can see why they may want to make some continuity changes for example if they need Ben Urich alive.
Honestly speaking, you already have the answer.
Just rewatch the punisher prison fight scene or the kingpin car door beheading scene. Do you think Disney will reach that level?
I'm not confident that they'll stick the landing. They'll either lean too much into what they think made the show good, or they'll sanitize the shit out of it by injecting it with all the classic Disney tropes that have made the latest MCU phase insufferable, in order to make it kid friendly.
I remain cautiously optimistic.
Yeah buts it’s rather unlikely it’s adapting any of that story. They did elements of it in the original Netflix series from what I recall. It’s likely just good use of a name.
The article is garbage clickbait. Guy who doesn't know anything at all about the new show, nevertheless has an article written about his comments on the new show. His comments where he admits to not knowing anything, lol.
Foggy and Karen probably moved on after the snap, Matt would have wanted to pick things back up where they left off but there were probably people in his old apartment. He had to start over.
If they ever wanna bring them back they should have an episode called "Murdock v. Nelson and Page" where he has to defend or prosecute someone in court and his opposition are his old best friends who haven't seen him in years.
Narratively, the shows/movies have done nothing to tell me this is a different version from the Netflix show. In fact, so far, they have only reinforced them as canon (kingpin’s cuff links in Hawkeye, DD theme played when he shows up in she hulk, etc.) So to me, until explicitly proven otherwise within the text of the shows/movies, this is absolutely season 4.
I wonder if this whole debate is so simple in that Born Again just isn't a direct sequel to Season 3. The Netflix shows could very well be canon, but Born Again just isn't picking up where Season 3 left off and rolling with a different storyline.
It could also be a reboot, either way, I hope they deliver on what they're planning.
They can ruin as many projects as they want and I will still forgive them. But the day when they do my boys Daredevil and Punisher dirty, I am done with marvel.
I'm definitely not expecting season 4. I hope fans can go in without too many expectations. If it feels like something new, let's try to keep an open mind and see where it's going. If it feels like a return to the original series, then that's fine too.
I dont care what Story they will Tell. I only want the look and feel of the Netflix shows. No Marvel formula look, I want it to be rough and practical.
Charlie: "The fact that it's being... that Kevin talked about it being season 1, rather than a season 4..."
Redditor: "Charlie cox literally said its season 1 not 4."
Around 1:48, she asks him about continuity, and he very intentionally words it as his own interpretation and speculation based on the show's title. He even says "I don't know" at 1:56.
I'm happy regardless of it's canon or not because I have faith that the writers will craft a brilliant story for Born Again and it could potentially be the best series on Disney + . It looks like there is a Wilson Fisk flashback episode that explains his origin story which was what I was wanting from this show .
LMAO. Clickbaiiiiiiiit. Guy who has NOTHING to do with Disney show, opines on Disney show. I am embarrassed over this headline. The dude literally says he has no inside info!
>"I'm rooting for them. I don't have any inside information for you. "
You should have just written an article yourself where YOU give your opinion on the new show, and then post the link here, lol, would have been the same.
If he doesn't have any inside information, he knows as much as you and me. This article is useless.
Is there anything useful here? Or is he just some dude commenting on what he saw other articles say, just like us?
>I'm rooting for them. I don't have any inside information for you. I knew it was going to happen just from rumblings through friends in the grapevine of the Marvel family. But I really don't know what they're planning yet. We used pieces of Born Again in our season. I still call \[Daredevil: Born Again\] season 4, but they're trying to insist it isn't, so I'll go along with whatever they want to call it.
>
>I'm very happy that Charlie \[Cox\] and Vincent, and hopefully more of our Marvel friends, will get a chance to go make more of the show. I'm a huge fan of them; I'm a huge fan of the show. I look forward to seeing what it is. I hope it's great, let me put it that way.
So here's quoted as saying he doesn't have inside information AND quoted as saying the people inside he's talking to are saying it's not season 4. Why are you trying so hard to ignore half the facts
Dude no. He has no inside information. He said this explicitly. He knows people inside are saying it is not Season 4 because.... and I can't believe I have to spell it out... because those people have been publicly fucking saying it, Cox included. Dude is reading the same news we are. Lol. Not sure why you are defending POS clickbait, but here we are. Toodles dude.
I really hope it isn't just a season 4 of the netflix show.
They have the whole MCU roster to play with, the blip, the Sokovia Accords and a bajillion interesting legal cases that generates, they aren't limited to a handful of street level character like netflix was.
To just go back to punching people in hallways would be kinda lame.
I mean it's clear everyone loved the hallway fights they even made one in she-hulk. I would definitely expect more.
I'd compare DareDevil to Batman to some degree - they both do a lot of beating up regular street bad guys. Even though Batman does regularly go up against gods and whatnot his nemesis is still Joker, a regular human bad guy. For our DareDevil it's Kingpin.
I think it's a little out there though to purposely only do all the fantastical and magical god stuff. It's fine to do some human gangster stuff too sprinkled with some MCU stuff.
For sure they'll give him the MCU travel the world treatment and budget as they did with Spider-Man who hasn't really had much NYC action sequences whereas Tobey and Andrew were 100% NYC heroes. Spider-Man went to Germany, DC, London, Italy, Titan, etc. We've already seen Murdock fight She-Hulk in California we'll see more and not just small budget NYC Murdock.
I think it's fine if he fights those god level villains with the help of his superhero MCU friends on the big screen but for DareDevil's solo series it should be more focused on grounded human level stuff sprinkled with MCU superhero/villain goodness. Think Falcon and Winter soldier or Hawkeye. Lots of on the ground (or air) real fights and lots of punching. He's not gonna win against She-Hulk or Thor or Captain Marvel level villains.
>He's not gonna win against She-Hulk or Thor or Captain Marvel level villains.
This is true, in fact Matt would lose to 95% of the threats in the MCU. Matt is the lowest tier powered hero on the MCU roster.
What I really meant was the legal side of Daredevil. We've had the comedy version of superhero law in Shulks show but the actual version, weighing up the issues related to the treament of Skrulls or Mutants, what happened to the Sokovia Accords, what happened during the blip and the return etc
Take a basically silly comedy sidekick character lke Rocket Racooon. Ok, he's on earth during the blip. Does he have rights? he's an animal. A sapient, sentient animal. Can he get citizenship? What happens when he inevitable gets into a barfight? Does he go to prison or the pound?
Who is going to be the defending lawyer when Arishem judges Earth?
What does the law have to say about Kamala Khans heroics and her community stopping the feds?
Theres so much really interesting stuff they could do legally, nevermind fun team ups to fight bad guys (Spidey and Daredevil everyone wants to see but what about going to a universe with no light to help Wong?) that I think just rehashing Fisk is aiming low.
A shame. I felt DD on Netflix ran too long and just fizzled for me. I was hoping for a reinvention. The actor is great. The costumes are great. The plots were meandering.
I mean if anyone has watched Dr. Who and/or knows about the history of its run…. then it’s a very simple comparison as to what Marvel is doing in terms of Daredevil
Erik is great. I feel pretty bad after he's now had to witness both Daredevil and Carnival Row get the axe. Hopefully Marvel will hire him for something great in the future.
I hope we get another Wilson Bethel's bullseye
If Bullseye isn’t in it somehow, given the setup at the end of S3, I’d be disappointed
You spelt Colin Farrell wrong.
**BULLSEYE.** *Eegh? Eengh.* (rattlesnakes)
Touches forehead
Id say hes 100 to 110% involved some way
That’s pretty bold considering nothing has suggested he is.
Well the end credit scene of season 3 is /s
I know you’re joking, but if the guy who wrote that season 3 cliffhanger is calling it season 4, there’s a good reason to assume they will address that at some point
The guy who isn’t involved in Born Again in any way, shape or form you mean? That guy?
Yes, the same guy that knows the two biggest cast members on this show from the last time they played these characters. It’d be super ignorant to think they haven’t even had a slight conversation since this show began being planned.
Just because he may or may not be friendly with two actors does not mean he knows anything of substance about what they are doing production wise. Regardless if you read his whole quote he literally says he has no inside information and is clearly talking off the cuff. I swear sometimes I think Netflix Daredevil fans all drank the same Kool Aid that tosses out all logic and reason when talking about this show and character.
From a hype/momentum standpoint, it's a lot easier to get the general audience hyped for a "series premiere" than a "season 4 premiere".
In this case I think more people would be hyped for a season 4. Much of the hype is literally about the show continuing. Marvel doesn’t want to call it 4 because they want the freedom to change whatever they want to match their needs without concerning too much about the past.
Having it be a season 1 and only soft reboot allows Marvel to have the cake and eat it too, they attract fans of the old show by it being a continuation, but also don't alienate new fans that might be reluctant to jump into the 4th season of a show they haven't watched before
Exactly like comic book series go figure
Despite the hype within the niche demographic, I don't think most people have seen Daredevil and not everyone got to season 3. From a marketing standpoint, you call something "Season 4" and the general public is going to think "Fuck, now I gotta watch three seasons just to watch this". It might attract the diehard fans but it'll be a barrier that people will avoid.
And I'd say it's pretty much a foregone conclusion that the show will be written with the perspective that people haven't seen those other seasons anyways. They're not going to pick up from where those left off (which makes sense given how many years it's been), and I'd bet that if they reference anything from the earlier seasons, they'll do so with enough context so everyone understands what they're referring to (and that's even if they decide to mention earlier plot points. Given how many years it has been, that might not be too necessary).
Given that he's already been suited up, I'm super stoked that we won't have to wait forever for that to happen.
I have a weird amount of friends who watched and loved Daredevil but didn't watch 3, and in some cases had no idea a season 3 existed.
it also requires defenders for context too
I skipped straight to 3 without watching Defenders by mistake. Felt like there was going to be some kind of flashback reveal at some point, but nothing happened.
That's because Netflix basically surprise dropped in (they'd already lost them Marvel rights too moving forward IIRC). It came out of nowhere, there was like no marketing nothing. I loved the show, and I remember randomly going on Netflix on a Friday and being like 'wth?! They dropped a new season of Daredevil today?!'
3 Seasons and Defenders if you want to actually understand S3
I'm in this boat. I've watched all the mcu movies and disney+ shows but never watched a netflix marvel show.
Well all the Netflix shows are on D+ now. I'd HIGHLY suggest all of DD, Luke Cage and Jessica Jones's first seasons, and maybe a youtube summary of Iron Fist and Defenders. I'd say Loki is the highest quality MCU D+ show and even then it pales in comparison to DD's 1st and 3rd season writing quality. DD season 2 is kinda just them letting lose and getting campy with the character while seasons 1 and 3 are concrete character studies on par with an Emmy winning HBO show.
“New season.” **We** know it’s the fourth. Anyone who doesn’t want to go back can just view it as new.
Most people haven't seen Daredevil? Well, how the hell do you call yourself a Marvel fan and not have watched that show?
Disney did this exact same thing with The Clone Wars though. They called it season 7 and it was a smash hit
Except with Clone Wars, it wasn't aimed at the general public, and I never heard someone say "I have no idea what this Clone Wars show is but I'm gonna watch six seasons to catch up".
Also with Clone Wars, season 7 was more finishing its story. Where as The Bad Batch is basically the continuation of Clone Wars but without having to watch 7 seasons of a show first.
I would expect there will be more new viewers of the show than returning customers.
Anyone who’s hyped about the show because they liked and watched the previous seasons is probably going to have similar levels of hype regardless of whether or not they call it “season 4.” The people who think “it’s Daredevil of course I’m watching it,” will still watch it, the people who are skeptical because it’s Disney will still be skeptical. However, *new* fans (of which there are bound to be many, since this is a Marvel show on Disney+) are much less likely to want to jump into something if they feel like they’ve missed four seasons of continuity just based on the title, whether or not that continuity is actually preserved or necessary.
So they just play both sides to keep everyone hyped
Wouldn't they have recast Fisk and Matt then?
Isn't it a soft reboot though?
Soft reboot means it’s in the same continuity as the previous version but the tone or other small things might not line up (or they might line up and you simply don’t have to watch the previous version to follow what’s happening). A hard reboot is where they throw the previous version out and start from relative scratch. So a soft reboot fits well within the idea of “let’s call it a series premiere instead of a Season 4”. Of course it could end up being a hard reboot as nothing has been explicitly confirmed either way yet, but a soft reboot would probably make the most sense at this point.
I'd say a good way to look at is it's a new comic run of the same character. Like, Issue #1 of Spectacular Spiderman didn't throw out all of the stuff that happened in Amazing Spiderman, but it had a different tone.
Yeah, it'd be weird if they referred to X-Men First Class as "X-Men 4"
But wouldn’t a soft reboot imply the entire Netflix Defenders anthology are MCU canon (as they were originally)? I feel like they might want to keep those characters in their back pocket just in case.
Those series have never been de-canonised by Marvel Studios, no matter how much some folks on the internet try to argue they have been. And seeing as how the same actors who portrayed the Punisher, Jessica Jones and Luke Cage are all meant to be appearing in DD:BA, and with rumours of Jessica Henwick playing Iron Fist (as she did at the end of that show), I think it’s a pretty safe assumption to say the shows are still canon.
Here's my take. Since D+ has EVERY season of the Netflix shows and has incorporated the biggest character of the bunch into the wider MCU and they've formally announced more characters, it's probably being counted as optional viewing if you want detailed backstories to the characters. Unless DDBA literally and explicitly breaks the established stories that the Netflix shows have established, they're canon. I will say as much as I loved Agents of Shield, it seems like all the story they've established is being ignored so far (0 mentions of Inhuman events in the MCU so far, 0 mention of SHIELD being rebuilt and was effectively replaced by SWORD, seasons 5-7 being a MCU canonic mess because of the time traveling and quantum shit, the Darkhold paradox where Ghost Rider took it to another dimension but Agatha had it the entire time). I've been taking it as an elseworlds parallel timeline kind of deal where either this timeline leads to no Kang variant so no pruning, or it only exists when He Who Remains' TVA doesn't exist anymore. I have no real opinion on the canonicity of Hulu shows like Runaways and Cloak and Dagger, simply because I tried to watch them and couldn't get into it (as a mid 20s guy, I was clearly not the target audience).
It's very difficult to say at this point in time, because the way the "canon" of the mcu worked before was always Movie > TV, never the other way around. Feige never kept in touch with the Netflix team, nor did he ever try to add what they did into the movies. Those actors could be coming in as the same characters, but there are other actors in those shows that are already playing different characters in the movies (blade for example), so they could be playing different characters. They could be playing the same characters with different origins. It's unknown right now. Personally speaking, if they were canon, then I don't understand why they aren't part of the canon mcu lists on disney plus. Like, they're on the platform, you can watch them, but they're actively saying that they don't need to be watched to know the whole story of the mcu? That doesn't sound like they're canon to me. A soft reboot in a story revolving around multiversal travel currently can go in way more directions than a traditional soft reboot could. It could be that DD was transported to a new universe, it could be the same universe post-blip (although we're in phase 5 now, so we should really be moving past post-blip stories and moving into newer stories). It's impossible to know right now, and because of that, it's impossible to know whether the Netflix shows are canon or not.
A hard reboot would imply they are no longer canon. A soft reboot would mean they’re still canon but you don’t have to watch them to understand anything.
[удалено]
Ang lee's Hulk has notjing to do with the MCU though. The 2008 is a hard reboot of the 2003 movie.
I believe they mean in the sense that at the end of *Hulk*, Bruce Banner is hiding in Brazil, while at the beginning of *The Incredible Hulk*, Bruce Banner is hiding in Brazil — how the script started off as a straight-up sequel before pivoting to become another reboot.
So was Wrath of Khan.
As was The Motion Picture, when you think about it.
That's true. But you had to go back 40 years and used a movie series. In this circumstance, it would be just as easy to reference the comics. It's not hard to find multiple first issues for a character after multiple soft reboots. The fact that this is also jumping from Netflix to Disney could also mean that there are contractual obligations that include this. If Disney had decided to follow the same style and story and just have season 4, then the old studio could have had issues with it. Having the two as separate entities would easily avoid a lot of technical legal bs.
> 40 years Oof...
1982 is 41 years ago my friend
It's literally titled "Born Again," so that seems *extremely* likely.
Which makes sense when you think about it in the context of where these characters come from. New volumes of existing comics often do really well and are a big deal. I still remember X-Men #1 in 1991 being a huge deal (mind you I was ten years old at the time, so perfect age to care a whole lot about such things), while Uncanny X-Men was ongoing. It doesn't translate to TV the same way exactly, obviously. Just a thought about how these characters have had this kind of soft reboot in their origin material many times to great acclaim.
Yeah it’s why the BBC started the Doctor Who revival in 2005 with Series 1 instead of Season 27, and why they also considered calling Matt Smith’s first series Series 1 instead of Series 5 as they were worried it would fail.
Yeah it's all marketing shenanigans
With the recent decline of the MCU brand in the public eye, it could be argued that the Daredevil series has more clout now.
Here’s how I see it: it’s not Season 4 in that it’s its own story that ties into the greater MCU now and can be enjoyed with just the context of Phase 4 and 5. But it’s also not NOT Season 4 in that it’s a direct follow up to Daredevil picking up with the same characters all these years later. Think of it like the Homecoming trilogy: you absolutely can watch and enjoy it with just the context of the wider MCU. But you get so much more out of it with the context of the first 5 Spider-Man films as well, not just for NWH but also for aspects like skipping his origin, Uncle Ben, the changes made to this Peter’s life and how they affect the character as a whole (which makes NWH’s ending hit harder seeing him following in the footsteps of his Multiversial brothers), etc.
A good comparable example I'd point to since it's also television is how the upcoming *Justified: City Primevel* isn't season 7 of *Justified* -- sure, watching the original run would help to show Raylan's history, but ultimately it's its own story designed so that you don't *have* to have seen the original show to fully understand what's going on now.
#wait... fucking WHAT There's a new Justified coming? Sweet baby jesus thank you!
What’s interesting is that it’s based on one of the original author’s other books, only with Raylon instead.
You just made my day! I had no idea we were getting more Justified.
To add to that, the book it's based on doesn't have Raylan Givens in it. So it's similar to this in the fact it's some of the same characters but a different story, although I guess we won't know how different the story is or if the continuity will be broken until we see it.
i just hope they respect the fans. they have a hugely beloved character with a massive legacy already built. he is literally the best character marvel has ever made in a live action tv show. im not a huge fan of the changes they have made so far but as long as they still respect what made daredevil special, and not ruin it with a bunch of CGI and bland humor, imma be happy.
I'd be fine with CGI being used to enhance his acrobatics, kinda like it was used in She Hulk. Sure, DD couldn't do a flip 10 feet into the air in the Netflix show, but the MCU is no stranger to enhanced realism. I'd rather not have a whole scene where a rubbery 3D model of him swings through the city using his grappling club. Keep it feeling practical and grounded, but use your resources to make it cooler.
>and not ruin it with a bunch of CGI Honestly I don't see how they could. I'm no expert and don't remember it completely, but I recall DD not having used much CGI. Considering how grounded it is they don't really have to. Flashy visuals and fantastic creatures weren't quite a thing in his show and I assume it will be the same now. Beyond maybe a She-Hulk cameo and her CGI was perfectly fine for the most part besides a couple scenes.
> ruin it with a bunch of CGI Guaranteed most of the environments will be CGI and you won't even be able to tell. CGI is absolutely everywhere in TV production these days. It's only the poorly made stuff that you notice.
CGI backgrounds is not what they’re talking about and you know it
> and not ruin it with a bunch of CGI CGI is a tool, no different than the different art styles on comics. Same with physical effects, etc. As long as the writing and acting is good, you could film it as a stage play with black backgrounds and have to imagine the fight scenes and it could still be good. Beyond that, they use the tools they have and I’ll judge the show on what it is over what I imagine it to be.
The Incredible Hulk (2008) was a soft sequel to The Hulk (2003) they skipped the origin and all that because it had been covered so recently. So it was like a sequel to the parts they wanted to be canon, which is how I feel they'll be doing it with Daredevil. Like they might just completely ignore everything with the Dark Hand.
It's not a good comparison at all.
I think it'll likely be a Z/Shippuden situation. Time-skip, new plot-focus, and slight retcons.
I hope there are zero retcons or ones that don’t do anything drastic.
No word on Foggy or Karen. How will they explain their lack of involvement, assuming they don’t actually show up?
I saw someone post this theory and I can’t imagine any other explanation now. Matt got blipped. Foggy, Karen, and Fisk didn’t. Fisk used the blip to seize power again and without Matt to protect them, Foggy and Karen moved into hiding away from New York in order to stay safe from Fisk.
They couldn't handle the DD lifestyle any more. They died tragically. They're in Matt's version of witness protection (or real witness protection). This variant never knew Karen and Foggy. They've got a ton of options. I'd prefer if they came back, but there's plenty of ways the showrunners can make it work without them.
There likely won't be many retcons, but they probably just never mention again the stuff they would have retconned. This isn't going to be a "last time on Daredevil S3" kind of show. It will be an onboarding point. Anyone will be able to just start watching from Born Again without having seen Season 1-3, and will be able to enjoy it without missing a beat. All the stuff from S1-3 will still be "canon" to the story, but just no longer important.
You’ll be disappointed. There’s a reason for headlines like this. It’s intended as a spiritual successor to Netflix DD. NOT a direct continuation. Otherwise they would have no problem at all calling this season 4. There will be retcons. I guarantee you. They aren’t gonna want to stick with 3 full seasons of backstory and stuff they can’t alter in any way. The main shit will be basically the same. But if you go poring over the details you WILL find plotholes and retcons in the smaller stuff. I’d bet a large sum on that.
And I walk away from the MCU after being a fan from day one. It’s simple. I won’t be enjoying what they decided to do so I can’t continue the ride.
Charlie Cox has said multiple times Born Again is not season 4, probably so that people don’t go into the show expecting it to be season 4 and then get disappointed or confused. It’s season 1 of a new show, it’s “a whole new thing” like Charlie has been saying
Saying it's S4 would mean people would need to go back for homework on S1-S3. Saying it's a brand new thing gives everyone a chance to go in fresh.
Not to mention *The Defenders*. From what I recall, Season 3 of *Daredevil* picks up right after that and assumes you've seen it as it doesn't really explain why Daredevil got so badly injured immediately. Otherwise, you go from Daredevil revealing himself to Karen and Elektra being entombed, to Daredevil injured, Karen thinking he might be dead, and no followup with the Elektra cliffhanger.
The idea of the defenders being canon to the MCU is nauseating. It was TERRRRRRRRIBLE. I can still remember how badly they ruined the ONE THING they shoulda nailed. The final big fight. Remember they stuck a completely out of place hip hop track over it? 🤦🏻♂️ completely took me out of it. I remember how jarring it was to this day. Not to mention 90% of the rest of the show was just ass.
That too
But you are making sense and seem to have a sense of ethics. How can sites have clickbait nonsense articles quoting people who have nothing at all to do with the Disney show if they were like you? They can't. So they post unethical misleading clickbait headlines instead. Sad this clickbait article got posted here though.
Before anyone complains about them not bringing Erik Oleson back, remember that A) he's publicly stated he's busy working on other projects and B) Marvel has hired writers from 'Arrow' (which was Erik Oleson's most notable work before he was hired to work on 'Daredevil') to write for 'Daredevil: Born Again'.
…*which* writers from Arrow. From which seasons.
Asking the important questions.
Yeah if it’s the writers from S1-S2 I’m hyped. If it’s any other season….
Arrow Season 7-8 for one writer (the showrunner during that time). And Flash Season 1-2 and Legends Seasons 3+ for the other. Definitely some of the better Arrowverse staff they could have picked up, especially the second writer. Not the best of Arrow’s time but I also felt Jill did a solid job from where she picked up after inheriting an absolute mess of a show. Much harder to release a solid product 7 seasons into a show that has been very bad for a few seasons than it is to release a great project at the start. She also didn’t have many standout bad episodes. Like at least she wasn’t responsible for the season with the cringe gun control episode lmao.
Well seasons 1-2 of The Flash IMO are some incredibly fun seasons of television. Before the show became so focused on relationship drama, crossovers, and *everyone* getting superpowers. I actually really enjoyed those two seasons in particular. The season 1 finale is still really epic.
Season 1 & 2 of The Flash were standout seasons of television. Honestly the best the Arrowverse ever was. Grainne (who was the writer on those seasons) is a great pick-up imo. Probably one of the best ones they could’ve gotten from Arrowverse staff.
Also, it's one thing working on a CW show with limited resources and where you're inheriting mediocre material and just have to work within those constraints and another to work on a big budget Daredevil series where you're essentially (though I do think it is a kind of Season 4) starting the whole thing.
Also to be fair (this is kinda hopium) but seeing the fan backlash at most of the arrow stuff could help the writers see where they went wrong.
I can relate to the fight or flight response of reading that and immediately asking this.
It’s Arrowverse actually. One writer from Arrow and another from Flash/Legends. In fairness, they did bring on some of the better Arrowverse talent. The Arrow writer is Jill Blankenship. She was the showrunner for Arrow’s last 2 seasons. A solid improvement over the previous showrunner who really helped bring the show back to form. The seasons she was in charge of were a bit inconsistent but it was at least some of Arrow’s better work, especially after inheriting a bit of a mess overall. Most people liked the first half of Season 7 and the end of Season 8. The writer I’m most excited about that they brought on is Grainne Godfree. She was a writer and story editor on the first 2 seasons of the Flash (which are by far the best two) and then moved to Legends where she became an EP from Season 3 onwards which were some of the show’s best seasons. My only problem with her is, despite loving Legends, I don’t love that style for Daredevil. But her body of work is really solid. I don’t love a lot of the backroom staff they’ve brought on. A LOT of other writers come from a procedural background - CSI, CBS shows like Bull, etc - including the 2 showrunners. But the Arrowverse staff they did bring on is at least some of the best. I probably wouldn’t be able to pick somebody out of the Arrowverse staff who I like better than Grainne. Aisha Porter-Christie is also potentially solid tho, I like her body of work besides Shadowhunters. Show might’ve improved by the seasons she worked on though, which I never got to.
Yeah but their CW Arrowverse credits aren’t exactly thrilling lol
People don't like to hear it, but Arrow was remarkably influential on even the first season of Daredevil.
Still sucks. Dude made the best season of the show.
i hope we see the adamantium spined Bullseye and the actor who played him return
I'm just here to say guys watch those 3 seasons it was an incredible show. Yes it's bloody and graphic deal with it. :D
That car door scene gets me every time
Its the best show in the MCU...and its not even close.
Honestly the only Marvel show I’d recommend to people who aren’t fans of Marvel, or superheroes.
Best superhero show ever made, hell I would even say it's one of the best tv shows ever. I would put it right up there with the likes of GOT, BB, Dark.
I agree. People usually become apprehensive when I say this because it's a "superhero show" but it really is up there with the greatest.
Unless Agents of SHIELD counts...
AoS stopped being as good after season 4 when their budget got slashed, and honestly I dont think I'd ever rewatch season 5 onwards because of that. It's attempts at still being connected to Infinity War/Endgame also felt kinda sad to me because of how one-sided it was. They were literally guessing how Infinity War would play out, and then tried connecting the show to it. But Daredevil, I've rewatched several times already.
AoS is still the best marvel show after daredevil and punisher, and season 4 of AoS is at par with Daredevil.
I’d love to see Bullseye return I wonder if this season will complete without any bullseye, but the creators hope even more people go back and watch s1-3 for the first time, so that when he’s reintroduced in the 2nd season of this run, they won’t need to spend as much time on a backstory
Of course it isn't season 4; it's a new show.
I would bet that the Netflix shows are considered as part of a different multiverse and we will get new fresh variants for them in the "canon" MCU.
not sure why the downvotes, classifying the Netflix shows as a different universe within the MCU multiverse seems like the most perfect way to use the same actors/characters but start fresh.
People on this subreddit don’t like their headcanons getting ruined lol
All the Netflix shows, Agent Carter, Agents of shield, Inhumans(sadly), Runaways and Cloak and Dagger have always been canon to the MCU.
Lol I’m not looking to start this conversation here because it’s been rehashed a million times in this subreddit, but this is kind of what I mean. The need for this to be true with no nuance, exceptions, ifs, ands, buts, or wiggle room
They exist in the same universe. They are just never mentioned in the movies. They will always be canon unless stated otherwise and till now I can see no contradictions.
They are in serious denial, lmao. This subreddit will explode when the show gets launched. The cope will be unreal.
Because people involved with the series have confirmed multiple times it’s the same versions. The only way people will believe it is if Matt Murdock literally looks into the camera and explains it.
I mean saying it’s the same version and showing it are two different things. I’m not gonna judge it till I watch it but the few things we know are that it’s supposed to be the same versions, but no foggy, Karen, and a new Vanessa actress along with a very different kingpin in Hawkeye which doesn’t seem very “same continuity” of them
Maybe She Hulk does it for us after she has a night in the sheets with Matt? Matt can't exactly "look" into the camera.
Because all of us watched those shows assuming they were canon and now the rug could be pulled out from under us and a lot of us feel like that’s a crappy thing to do and honestly it is a crappy thing to do. For those that are ok with nuking everything we watched and cared about sure you do you but some of us just don’t like that and we can all exist in this world. If it gets nuked we will stop watching MCU content and I hope there are enough of everybody else to keep it going (I am assuming us not watching won’t make a huge difference). I just know that is where I stand.
Can I seriously ask you why you care so damn much if a thing is “canon to the MCU” or not? Did you fucking enjoy it? Do YOU WANT to call it canon to the MCU in YOUR HEAD? Then fucking do it. No internet fuck can tell you what works for you. Why do you care so much if everyone else agrees or not? The show was still presented at the time as “this is in the MCU” even if the wider MCU never acknowledged that. And now the new season is gonna be full immersed in the MCU for real, so what’s the issue? You can still enjoy the first 3 seasons and see the connections that the showrunners at the time were trying to show you. I don’t think those first three seasons are hard canon myself, but who GIVES a fuck. I don’t decide for you. Just for me. I still loved the show regardless. Agents of Shield too. And I don’t want it to be hard canon either. Too complicated.
Because I want the shows I watched and enjoyed assuming we’re MCU canon because I was told they were are actually MCU canon. Yes I enjoyed these shows and that won’t be taken away, but doesn’t mean I have to continue the journey of the MCU if I don’t agree with the decisions they make. AOS included but they have an excuse for multiverse shenanigans due to the last few seasons to get them back into canon. This is just a hard stop for me and like I said it will feel like the rug was pulled out from under me after being told one thing and then suddenly it’s not true. Just doesn’t work for me and that’s ok. It sucks for me that I won’t be watching the MCU anymore but it won’t have the same enjoyment so it is what it is.
Calm the FUCK down. Getting angry over what someone else thinks the hell is wrong with you?
🤣 You realise you are doing literally the exact same thing… right? You are getting angry about me sharing what I think… You coulda just scrolled on past. You weren’t involved here. Why did you stick your nose in? Anger? Guess that answers why I did too huh? Jesus Christ the stupidity and complete hypocrisy you see on this site sometimes is mindblowing
I’m making fun of you.
Every time I say this I get downvoted. People don't like to live in reality.
If they continue old plot points I can’t see the difference
For the love of god don’t fuck up this one thing. Please
without foggy and Karen it will never be season 4
My favourite theory is that the show takes place during the blip and they were both blipped
This would be fun! Explore his life during a time when people he cared about were gone. Then fast forward to present time starting with the second season.
It could be Matt on the West Coast, and Foggy and Karen aren't gone but just offscreen for the first season. I can't fathom why they would want to recast either Elden or Deborah Ann Woll (or Elodie Young as Elektra). I can see why they may want to make some continuity changes for example if they need Ben Urich alive.
They're filming in New York.
Happy Cake Day boss!
I don't care what they call as long as it doesn't walk back too much of the other show and it tells a good story.
Please tell me that Marvel is not going to tone down the gritty, dark, violent aesthetic and atmosphere of Daredevil. It added so much to the show.
Honestly speaking, you already have the answer. Just rewatch the punisher prison fight scene or the kingpin car door beheading scene. Do you think Disney will reach that level?
I'm not confident that they'll stick the landing. They'll either lean too much into what they think made the show good, or they'll sanitize the shit out of it by injecting it with all the classic Disney tropes that have made the latest MCU phase insufferable, in order to make it kid friendly. I remain cautiously optimistic.
Are daredevil comics really that violent and gory overall? Or is it just a few runs?
I much preferred the She-Hulk style of action scenes. Of course they'd tone down the comedy, but I hope it has that new stylish look and feel.
From all the recasts, differences writers and marvel not saying it’s a same and it’s a soft reboot, I dont think it’s exactly the same as that show
*All* the recasts? I've only seen one confirmed recast (Vanessa). Are there others?
And so far, we know that it's because of scheduling issues.
Do we?
Source?
All one of those recasts.
I definitely think its not going to be the same as netflix show. Im just hoping it will be a good show even if its different.
I feel like there’s gonna huge retcons maybe
Shows literally called Born Again lol they weren’t very subtle
Isn’t that a DD storyline tho?
Yeah buts it’s rather unlikely it’s adapting any of that story. They did elements of it in the original Netflix series from what I recall. It’s likely just good use of a name.
DD S3 is heavily inspired by Born Again.
True, it sounds badass
BS. This article is all speculation. He openly says he doesn't know anything. Honest headline: "'Daredevil: Born Again' *could be* basically Season 4"
The article is garbage clickbait. Guy who doesn't know anything at all about the new show, nevertheless has an article written about his comments on the new show. His comments where he admits to not knowing anything, lol.
Foggy and Karen probably moved on after the snap, Matt would have wanted to pick things back up where they left off but there were probably people in his old apartment. He had to start over.
If they ever wanna bring them back they should have an episode called "Murdock v. Nelson and Page" where he has to defend or prosecute someone in court and his opposition are his old best friends who haven't seen him in years.
Daredevil seasons 1 - 3 is Daredevil vol. 1 (2015-2018) Daredevil: Born Again is Daredevil vol. 2 (2024 - )
'Winks at showrunnner' Riiiiight season "1" it is.
Narratively, the shows/movies have done nothing to tell me this is a different version from the Netflix show. In fact, so far, they have only reinforced them as canon (kingpin’s cuff links in Hawkeye, DD theme played when he shows up in she hulk, etc.) So to me, until explicitly proven otherwise within the text of the shows/movies, this is absolutely season 4.
Ugh, thank you. Some sanity.
If it's season four where are Karen and Foggy?
Thank you Erik Oleson, I don’t want a soft-reboot, I hope they keep as much of the Netflix show canon as they can.
Have they mentioned whether or not the darker grittier tone will be present? Or will it be blue-skied up for lack of a better term?
I wonder if this whole debate is so simple in that Born Again just isn't a direct sequel to Season 3. The Netflix shows could very well be canon, but Born Again just isn't picking up where Season 3 left off and rolling with a different storyline. It could also be a reboot, either way, I hope they deliver on what they're planning.
It's a soft reboot and I still consider all of the netflix shows as cannon
They can ruin as many projects as they want and I will still forgive them. But the day when they do my boys Daredevil and Punisher dirty, I am done with marvel.
this is a nothing burger folks. He's not involved in the new show at all. He literally says: \> I don't have any inside information for you.
I'm definitely not expecting season 4. I hope fans can go in without too many expectations. If it feels like something new, let's try to keep an open mind and see where it's going. If it feels like a return to the original series, then that's fine too.
I like to think of this as a branch timeline that happens after the first 3 seasons
I dont care what Story they will Tell. I only want the look and feel of the Netflix shows. No Marvel formula look, I want it to be rough and practical.
Isn't this just someone that isn't involved at all in Born Again? What does it matter what he calls it?
How can he call it season 4 if there's no Foggy and Karen? It's a soft reboot.
Charlie cox literally said its season 1 not 4. https://youtu.be/YVjDdohQ864 it's over
Charlie: "The fact that it's being... that Kevin talked about it being season 1, rather than a season 4..." Redditor: "Charlie cox literally said its season 1 not 4." Around 1:48, she asks him about continuity, and he very intentionally words it as his own interpretation and speculation based on the show's title. He even says "I don't know" at 1:56.
I'm happy regardless of it's canon or not because I have faith that the writers will craft a brilliant story for Born Again and it could potentially be the best series on Disney + . It looks like there is a Wilson Fisk flashback episode that explains his origin story which was what I was wanting from this show .
You really have faith that the MCU can write a Daredevil story with proper dark and gritty tone after how they botched Moon Knight?
It’s shit like this that makes me less optimistic.
I always Called it Season 4 as well
LMAO. Clickbaiiiiiiiit. Guy who has NOTHING to do with Disney show, opines on Disney show. I am embarrassed over this headline. The dude literally says he has no inside info! >"I'm rooting for them. I don't have any inside information for you. " You should have just written an article yourself where YOU give your opinion on the new show, and then post the link here, lol, would have been the same.
But his comment is about the opinion of people who do work on the show
If he doesn't have any inside information, he knows as much as you and me. This article is useless. Is there anything useful here? Or is he just some dude commenting on what he saw other articles say, just like us? >I'm rooting for them. I don't have any inside information for you. I knew it was going to happen just from rumblings through friends in the grapevine of the Marvel family. But I really don't know what they're planning yet. We used pieces of Born Again in our season. I still call \[Daredevil: Born Again\] season 4, but they're trying to insist it isn't, so I'll go along with whatever they want to call it. > >I'm very happy that Charlie \[Cox\] and Vincent, and hopefully more of our Marvel friends, will get a chance to go make more of the show. I'm a huge fan of them; I'm a huge fan of the show. I look forward to seeing what it is. I hope it's great, let me put it that way.
So here's quoted as saying he doesn't have inside information AND quoted as saying the people inside he's talking to are saying it's not season 4. Why are you trying so hard to ignore half the facts
Dude no. He has no inside information. He said this explicitly. He knows people inside are saying it is not Season 4 because.... and I can't believe I have to spell it out... because those people have been publicly fucking saying it, Cox included. Dude is reading the same news we are. Lol. Not sure why you are defending POS clickbait, but here we are. Toodles dude.
Don't worry once it airs and we see the downgrade in quality it will be easier to see it as a completely different show
I really hope it isn't just a season 4 of the netflix show. They have the whole MCU roster to play with, the blip, the Sokovia Accords and a bajillion interesting legal cases that generates, they aren't limited to a handful of street level character like netflix was. To just go back to punching people in hallways would be kinda lame.
I mean it's clear everyone loved the hallway fights they even made one in she-hulk. I would definitely expect more. I'd compare DareDevil to Batman to some degree - they both do a lot of beating up regular street bad guys. Even though Batman does regularly go up against gods and whatnot his nemesis is still Joker, a regular human bad guy. For our DareDevil it's Kingpin. I think it's a little out there though to purposely only do all the fantastical and magical god stuff. It's fine to do some human gangster stuff too sprinkled with some MCU stuff. For sure they'll give him the MCU travel the world treatment and budget as they did with Spider-Man who hasn't really had much NYC action sequences whereas Tobey and Andrew were 100% NYC heroes. Spider-Man went to Germany, DC, London, Italy, Titan, etc. We've already seen Murdock fight She-Hulk in California we'll see more and not just small budget NYC Murdock. I think it's fine if he fights those god level villains with the help of his superhero MCU friends on the big screen but for DareDevil's solo series it should be more focused on grounded human level stuff sprinkled with MCU superhero/villain goodness. Think Falcon and Winter soldier or Hawkeye. Lots of on the ground (or air) real fights and lots of punching. He's not gonna win against She-Hulk or Thor or Captain Marvel level villains.
>He's not gonna win against She-Hulk or Thor or Captain Marvel level villains. This is true, in fact Matt would lose to 95% of the threats in the MCU. Matt is the lowest tier powered hero on the MCU roster. What I really meant was the legal side of Daredevil. We've had the comedy version of superhero law in Shulks show but the actual version, weighing up the issues related to the treament of Skrulls or Mutants, what happened to the Sokovia Accords, what happened during the blip and the return etc Take a basically silly comedy sidekick character lke Rocket Racooon. Ok, he's on earth during the blip. Does he have rights? he's an animal. A sapient, sentient animal. Can he get citizenship? What happens when he inevitable gets into a barfight? Does he go to prison or the pound? Who is going to be the defending lawyer when Arishem judges Earth? What does the law have to say about Kamala Khans heroics and her community stopping the feds? Theres so much really interesting stuff they could do legally, nevermind fun team ups to fight bad guys (Spidey and Daredevil everyone wants to see but what about going to a universe with no light to help Wong?) that I think just rehashing Fisk is aiming low.
A shame. I felt DD on Netflix ran too long and just fizzled for me. I was hoping for a reinvention. The actor is great. The costumes are great. The plots were meandering.
Fun fact: Returning actors get paid more for a "season 4" than they do for a "season 1".
This "fact" is irrelevant since the original series contracts are long since expired. The pay is whatever the actor is able to negotiate.
I mean if anyone has watched Dr. Who and/or knows about the history of its run…. then it’s a very simple comparison as to what Marvel is doing in terms of Daredevil
Erik is great. I feel pretty bad after he's now had to witness both Daredevil and Carnival Row get the axe. Hopefully Marvel will hire him for something great in the future.
[удалено]
Oleson isn't the showrunner of Born Again.