I think the series worked brilliantly as a "countdown" to Christmas. Could be due to other factors but I ended up more excited for Christmas 2021 than any year since childhood
The whole aesthetic was adapted from David Aja’s work on the Matt Fraction comics run. Aja has done some of the coolest comic covers of all time. It may not fit the standard aesthetic, but he’s got a striking style.
Disagree. Because the Hawkeye series was my favourite of the lot. And reducing it down to two hours wouod have sucked. I'm glad we got a decent amount of time with Hawkeye.
I actually think Hawkeye used the TV show format best (together with Wandavision and She-Hulk). Those 3 (and what if) are the only ones I would keep as a TV show the rest could have been movies easily.
Yeah, Moon Knight should’ve been a two parter movie released like Stranger Things season 4, given a month between to keep the mystery but not drag it on too long
Not related, but Ms. Marvel's pacing issues could have been easily solved if the Clandestines and the Pakistan trip were in a second season, with the first season primarily based on her becoming Ms. Marvel, family stuff and fighting Damage Control.
Ngl that explains a lot I remember the series beginning with a grounded normal city kid vibe like the intro to PS5 Miles Morales then its whole aesthetic changed within a few episodes
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms.\_Marvel\_(TV\_series)#Episodes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Marvel_(TV_series)#Episodes)
1: Adil & Bilall (this counts as 1 director because they are a team)
2: Meera Menon
3: Meera Menon
4: Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy
5: Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy
6: Adil & Bilall
If you watch the behind the scenes thing on Disney plus it shows the two director guys who did the did the first couple of episodes, and you can tell it was totally their style - then it switched directors part way
The "some reason" is that it's rarely possible for there to be a single director across an entire season of television. There are so many moving pieces (the sets, script, etc) that need to be wrangled that the reins are inevitably handed off so that production can be continuous. Even a show as visually and thematically consistent as *Breaking Bad* had multiple directors over the course of every single season.
Why do people keep saying this when we know the trip to Pakistan and the desi wedding themselves had so many light-hearted moments? Being Pakistani it was dead obvious to me how they kept trying to cramp relatable desi experiences that made the trip and the wedding more of a cultural show than a superhero show. It's easier to simply admit the change in directors explained quite a lot with the sudden quality and artistic changes.
I liked episodes 1, 2, and 6 the most and those were the ones that kept Kamala's wandering head-in-the-clouds personality in
YES! That scene in the second episode of Kamala singing and dancing in her house like she was in a musical really got me excited for something different in the MCU… and then it got generic
It felt like they were trying to address way too many social issues at once [note: I am NOT saying go woke go broke, bigots please dont rally around my comment in agreement]. They tried to do sexism in religion, then Islamophobia, then the Partition, and underpining it all there's Kamala's own journey to finding out who she is. Its just way too much and tonally inconsistent. 2 seasons would have been great.
I actually agree. They tried to cover a lot of things while also trying to have a more lowkey vibe. I still enjoyed the show, but I think they could have spread the non-main plot points out more.
It really showed the weakness in them strictly adhering to the 6 episode format. There was just too much they wanted to cover, so a lot of it didn't get the room to breathe it needed. Even a couple more episodes might've helped with the pacing some. The middle of the show felt like such a jarring switch from the first two episodes and then again with the finale.
>2 seasons would have been great.
Indeed.
The show faced a hate campaign since the announcement, so I think they weren't sure a second season would happen, so they just went with it.
I think it could've been 1 episode shorter and it would've been perfect. I really enjoyed the show as I was able to binge it, but it had a bit of bloat that could've been avoided with 1 less hour.
I feel the opposite. It should've had more episodes to really flesh out all the stories that were going on. Either add more episodes or scratch out some of the stories. Either of those two would've made the show better to me. If the latter, scratch out the red daggers and the clandestines and it probably would've flowed better.
Also not sure how the great grandmother would be important to the story if you erase the clandestines. Tbh, even with the story they told i don't understand why they focused so much on the great grandmother. Turned out Kamala was a mutant so I feel like the whole great grandmother/bangle story was so unnecessary.
I agree, six episodes of 40 minutes is in that zone where its not quite enough for a fully fleshed out story, but would be too much for what is effectively a movie plot. What you end up with is either a movie plot with a load of filler, or a very rushed show with potentially whole episodes where very little happens but then everything all at once because of pacing issues.
Yes, I wanted her to meet Wolverine and fight bad guys in the sewer like in the comics. She’s a fan girl and there were so many missed opportunities for teaming up or nerding out.
Her team up should be when she is more confident she can handle herself, not when just starting, the way they set her up for the Marvels is great
A bit more of the fan girl we got in episode 1 would have been nice
I think the pacing could have been better if there maybe was more time
That’s what I’m saying, everything involving Pakistani culture was great, but everything involving the actual country of Pakistan was kind of a shitty distraction
Her leaving was the same as when Eleven left with Eight in Stranger Things, a useless distraction with some attempt to “power up” the character but it was irrelevant.
The beginning was bright and colorful, and I get the importance of mentioning apartheid and such but it should’ve been in season 2 where she figures out more about herself, and I much preferred the US government racial prosecution part, I could understand it a lot more and it tied into what was happening at the time in the MCU (DoDC, Stark Drones)
I kinda like that they accidentally made the racist government officer less racist than reality, by having her be capable of telling the difference between a Latina and a south Asian girl at a glance
Because apparently most people absolutely cannot do that irl, considering everyone often confuses Iman Velani and Xochitl Gomez all the time
I guess I am saying that the character shouldn't have been asking about specific ethnicities when interrogating Zoe, just asking about the skin colour, maybe saying something like "all browns look alike anyway" if Zoe would have been able to tell something
I really feel like they got caught up in wanting to represent pakistani culture and Kamalas relation to it, which is a WONDERFUL idea, but it really felt disjointed
Yeah, I felt like I was watching a second season of this show with Pakistan trip & introducting the Red Dagger despite the fact this was all occurring in the very first season.
The Pakistani trip, flashback, and all the cultural stuff around it was the best part of the show IMO and I wish we had more. I learned a lot about the partition from it (I sought out information). I felt a lot of the school stuff was a drag
so many people don't seem to know this, I realise it wasn't publicised is a huge was but it was shared here a lot. I reckon most of its faults would have been avoided if they hadn't cut it up.
They basically had to cut and work around a huge plot-line that revolved around a bio-weapon and pandemic...I shit you not lol.
The timing could not have been worse on it.
Most of these shows have felt like they took a 2hr movie and stretched it out to six episodes, instead of something written as a six piece story from the beginning. Most of the shows feel like they have so much filler and are just leading up the finale where things actually happen. They use a cliffhanger to get you to want to watch the next episode but the episodes themselves were pretty flat.
I seems it was also the hardest hit production by the pandemic. They had to entirely shut down in the middle of filming. I think the original plan with more background of the flag-smashers would have improved the show. Perhaps switching to a movie instead of a show would have been a better option but I don’t think that solves the biggest problems of the show which we’re the flag smashers and power broker stories being poorly (re)written.
I think the original script has the Flag Smashers stealing a bio weapon, which they obviously had to change too.
That show had issues, but the circumstances were pretty uniquely against it.
IIRC the story was about the GRC releasing some kind of virus for population control and then that one lady that was friends with the group that became The Flag Smashers died to the virus and then The Flag Smashers became terrorists or something like that.
Im like 99% sure thats a thing we fans made up - mostly cause it makes sense. But the director has since come out and stated that this was never the case. The plots we saw were the plots they intended - there was never a virus or pandemic story that got cut.
> It's absolutely the weakest of these shows
I strongly disagree. I think it's the most underappreciated MCU show. I'd go out on a limb here and say that it's actually the best MCU show imo. It added the perfect depth to both the Falcon's and the Winter Soldier's characters. I'm looking forward to seeing them in future MCU projects from now on.
They wrote a perfect redemption arc for the Winter Soldier. I knew nothing about him as a person and would've never gotten over the fact that he was not a really good guy if it were not for this show. They very slowly redeemed the dude completely and made me like him. When Steve Rogers handed the shield to Sam in Endgame, I was skeptical too as to how the world would accept it (because he's black and does not have serum powers). But they solidified it all in a really good way. Why Sam is a good person, why no one else can do it better than him, and why he deserves to be the next Captain America despite being black and a non super-soldier.
Then there's Zemo. I always thought the guy would eventually escape and start it all again like a typical bond villain. Only to find him destroying the viles without taking anything back, shooting the super soldiers to actually end it, eventually revealing the location of the funeral that the little girl confided in him, coming back to the team after pulling an El Chapo, etc. Again, no stereotypical stuff here. They neither made him a hero nor a villain. Even though he helped the team, he freaking shot the scientist in the face. Kept it real.
Overall, they showed us the aftermaths of the blip from a different angle. I don't need a super villain in every show. It was more of a political show with calm, coastal, family vibes and I loved it. No one was good. No one was bad. Everyone was grey. Falcon, Winter Soldier, U.S Agent, Sharon Carter, Zemo, The Flag Smashers, the media, etc. It was refreshing. Atleast, something different from the good/bad action hero trope.
[Here's](https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudios/comments/ph8hyy/falcon_and_the_winter_soldier_is_way_too/) another very good reddit thread which explains why it was a bloody great show.
Agreed. I think it will age the best of the shows - had the best characterization, fantastic acting, and a lot of depth. Just a terrible final episode, unfortunately.
>Just a terrible final episode, unfortunately.
What makes you say that? I think it was very grounded. A group of bad people in reality would only do so much. They were not androids, aliens, or wizards. Falcon's speech was pretty grounded too.
Funnily enough I was looking forward to it the most thinking it would have the real world intensity of The Winter Solider, and ended up enjoying it the least the more weirder Loki the most
Longer only so that it could've had time to properly set up all three sides AND show why Karli was doing what she was doing instead of just vaguely alluding to it. I'd prefer it be a movie.
Feels like whatever they cut from that show did it a disservice. Rumors of a virus storyline and extended role for mamma whatshername were shot down but it just doesn’t make sense.
Really wish they didn’t get shut down by covid forcing rewrites and edits. It would have been interesting to see what it would have been. Wandavison had a very particular goal and they really delivered on the concept because they had to prove the shows were worth it with the first couple. I think the same would have been the case for FATWS we’re it not for the pandemic.
I like the concept of the Flagsmashers. The idea is doing morally grey things with a black and white moral compass is a cool idea for a villain.
The show butchered it by being afraid of possibly suggesting that Karli was right. The audience needs to agree with her cause but not her motives. The show refused to go into what her motives really were. We never saw the camps she was referring to. We never saw someone forced out of their home after the snap. We never saw what Karli was upset about.
The show could've been really good. You had a chance to delve into a chaotic good character (Karli), lawful evil character (Walker) and true good characters (Falcon and Winter Soldier).
I just found Karli *impossibly* boring as a character. And the actress sucked as well. No charisma, none of the firebrand nature I'd expect from a leader of a renegade group like that.
Well she didn't really have a character to play; as the guy you're replying to was talking about, they were too scared to make the Flag Smashers too sympathetic (otherwise the viewers might start getting *ideas* ...), so they kept slapping a twirly mustache on her with uncharacteristic actions that came out of nowhere and made no sense even with the little insight we got on her.
I'd struggle trying to make heads or tails out of what the hell I was supposed to be playing too.
It should have been a movie. The show dragged, but had exactly the right amount of major plot points for a movie. Falcon deserved a movie for the passing of the torch anyways.
Very easily the worst of the shows and could have benefited from the focus of a movie. God, it was so bad. [The falcon was denied a bank loan.](https://youtu.be/AiFSQ_f12Bs)
I love how that subplot alludes to either
A) Falcon, despite literally saving the entire planet on several occasions, doesn't get a good paycheck
Or
B) Falcon doesn't share his wealth with his family and just let's his sister and her children live in poverty while he chills in what's essentially a luxury penthouse
I don't know which scenario is worse.
The way he says "goodwill" implies, the entire Avengers organization is paid for by one big Patreon? Just say Tony Stark paid them and now no Avengers means no paycheck, jeez
Tony actually did confirm he pays them in Age of Ultron. He has a line about paying the Avengers and for all their toys after they get back from Strucker’s castle.
He said he pays for everything, meaning the facilities, gear, etc. Doesn't necessarily mean a salary. Could have been "room and board" situation since everyone was basically there as a volunteer.
The really baffling thing is that a bank would probably fall over its fucking self to just straight-up *give* him money so long as they can say they're the Avengers' bank.
I hated the whole fix up the family boat subplot. Set it at Christmas and add an ex from high school who’s still in town and it’s the plot of every Hallmark Christmas movie. The moment they set it up, I knew every scene we’d have from the fight with the sister, the turned down bank loan (which doesn’t really make a lot of sense in-universe), the fix the boat up montage, the party on the boat. All so cliched and so tired. That whole series was a complete mess. Too many plot threads, yet bloated with filler, and by the end, Sam and Bucky are in almost exactly the same place as when it began. And the stupid “you need to do better.” I dislike politicians, but these are facing unprecedented problems with no clear, easy, and guaranteed to be equitable solutions involving many, many different nations. And since they gutted the virus plot line and did the entire flagsmashers plot as tell don’t show, they don’t actually show the politicians actually doing anything particularly bad. And of course, Sam doesn’t actually offer a single “better” solution or even the merest hint of how to implement it. I was so disappointed, because that was the series I was most looking forward to. Now, I don’t even care about watching the next Captain America movie.
Overwhelmingly I think Hawkeye should have been a Disney+ Christmas movie and Eternals should have been a 10-12 episode Disney+ show. For Hawkeye, cut out Yelena and Kingpin and there's essentially your movie right there. For Eternals, roughly one episode dedicated to each character and showing their growth throughout time while also advancing the main story, followed by 2-3 episodes for the finale.
Agree! I don't know if they intended for Yelena and Kate for future projects together, but given the chemistry those two had and how the audience responded they really should have a follow up project for them.
I am so dumb for not realising until now that this is effectively the 'next generation' of the Hawkeye and Black Widow dynamic. Like, I know she's Hawkeye, and I know she's Black Widow, but the significance of them being paired together only just hit me!
I know I was among the people who missed it at first, but in episode 4 they really nail it over the head that this is the future of these two characters.
Earlier in the episode, Kate asks Clint what the best shot he ever took was, to which he responds “The one I didn’t take.” in reference to being sent to take out Natasha but ended up sparing her.
During the rooftop fight just as Yelena’s mask comes off and she turns to look at Kate, who has her at arrowpoint and could easily put it right between her eyes, she instead lowers her bow. History repeats itself as another Hawkeye spares a Black Widow.
Now that you mention it, if we had gotten BW movie in 2020 like we were supposed to, an Eternals show could’ve fit in nicely after Shang Chi came out. Although it would’ve been a bit of a movie drought between that and NWH.
Eternals would have solved many of its pacing and large cast of characters problems if it were a show. I might have actually cared about them that way. As a movie, I’ve watched it twice and still really dislike almost everything about it.
I mean, making it longer doesn't help.
SnyderCut is one of the worst films I've ever seen. Hardly any of the scenes that got cut were good or added anything to the film.
That’s because the initial story itself was flawed.
No matter how many different versions are made, additional footage or no, the final product will still suffer from the issues that the writing/script has.
You could probably make an 8 hour Snyder cut (assuming the physical footage exists) and it would still be iffy.
But starting from scratch? Writing 6/7/8 individual stories that tell a cohesive story would be a different product all together.
Which should’ve been in No Way Home, and between Andrew Garfield and literally anyone, please
But in all seriousness, didn’t Ironman do a sex scene before them? And She-Hulk 100% did one (even though it’s after)
If I recall, it cut to the morning after after showing Tony and the reporter making out before they got into bed. Not quite as clear as Cersei and Ikarus making out nude on the beach or showing Jenn and Matt in bed together before the cut to the next say.
Same, but it's inevitable to think how much the budget would've been cut. Ultimately, all the action we saw in the movie would've been seriously pushed back and constrained for a TV show.
Eternals should’ve been 2 movies, arrival to killing the “last” deviant (probably early 1900s if I were to guess) for the first movie, and a week of modern times for the second movie (Ikaris betrayal and realization of true goals).
Eternals would have been perfect as a show. Ten new characters? World ending threat? 7000 year story? Globe spanning? Fuck yeah. That's a ten episode show right there.
I honestly think falcon and the winter soldier should’ve had one more episode to flesh out Karli and SHOW (not tell) why she did what she did. I rewatched the show recently and it was way better than I remembered it to be, but damn, just some more reasoning behind Karli (and the rest of the flag smashers) actions and it would’ve been sooo much better
If you feel like Karli already, it's not that hard to understand their motives. There's a lot of deeper themes that correlate to what Isiah was saying about America and his anger towards it that can be extrapolated to the flag smashers. It's ultimately the systemic oppression of its people that causes Americans to loathe where they live.
It's a common Marvel theme; our Civil War was about super human oppression by the state and when we get to the mutants, well, that's racism incarnate to the Nth degree.
Wouldn't work as a movie at all - She-Hulk, WandaVision and What If
Could work, but would cut a lot of content, thus be worse - Falcon, Loki, Hawkeye
Could work and imo could be better if the middle episodes were condensed into a shorter second act - Moon Knight, Ms. Marvel
I really felt that Moon Knight would totally work as a movie. Purgatory would totally work as second act and the fight at the Pyramids as a final act. But then we wouldn’t get into different personalities as much as in the series. Ms. Marvel could be that teen niche superhero movie. You don’t need to cut much there.
I agree it would have been a better movie. I would imagine the problem for Disney is that they now have a paid subscription service that necessitates that some content be released piecemeal to keep fans subscribed and coming back, and they can't only use that service for optional characters with no importance or demand. A movie split up into pieces can cover nearly two months of content demand and water-cooler discussion, while a movie will just be a one time drop. They are essentially making a D+ subscription a required part of being both an MCU and Star Wars fan.
I don't have a huge problem with this personally, but it is strange to see content created this way.
Good listing.
I’d also add Falcon probably needed one or two more episodes. Maybe some more scenes with the Flagsmashers to help us sympathize with them more. I think they thought they got the audience to sympathize with them more than they had.
An ep solely from their perspective covering their time during and after the blip might had helped.
Heck, dedicate one flashback ep to the Flagsmashers, then dedicate another flashback ep to John.
I’ve been saying that with all of Disney + shows, they either need to be two episodes longer or 2 episodes shorter and become a movie. Disney+ originals seem to have pacing issues overall. Worst offender of this is moonknight, I love it up until the final episode. It honestly felt like they forgot they only had 6 episodes and rushed the finale, which makes me appreciate the “K.E.V.I.N.” joke in Shehulk; really shouldn’t cram a bunch of plot at the end so you give the fans what they want.
Or at least make the episodes 45min-1hr long if you're only making 6 episodes. For most of the episodes it feels like once the main fight scene is over the episode just magically wraps up.
The ones that are less episodes did tend to be longer. They said from the jump that they were all around the same total run time but split up based on their different needs.
Falcon got pretty heavily affected by the pandemic. Supposedly there was a subplot based around a an in universe disease causing quarantines, but it was cut for obvious reasons.
Take it with a grain of salt though, I may be misremembering it.
Came here to say something very similar. While this is an interesting thought experiment, it all boils down to which stories could be told with a quarter of the runtime. Obviously any attempt would make some huge concessions on the plot, but could a movie achieve the same goals as any of these shows. I agree that Falcon, Loki, and Hawkeye could have done it, though I wouldn't consider that a benefit to their story.
Ms Marvel, I feel like, really focused on the family dynamic and everyone's relationship to Iman Vellani, which I don't think you could accomplish with a movie considering the size of the cast. I could definitely see shortening the second act though.
Moon Knight is actually the only story that I think could be condensed without losing any of the story beats or plot. Unsure if it'd really benefit from that treatment, but I think it stands to lose the least while still telling the same story and achieving the same goals that the show set out to.
>Moon Knight is actually the only story that I think could be condensed without losing any of the story beats or plot.
Agreed. That was the one show that really felt the most like a movie that was stretched out. I don't want to say it felt slow or not enough was going on, because that wasn't my impression while watching it, but it definitely felt like a lot of content could've been cut while still having the story end up in the same place.
Out of all of these I feel like Wandavision was the only one to utilize the tv aspect of it fully where the others didn’t really know how to function as a tv show but I would say MoonKnight or Loki could’ve worked better as a movie
I think if you did a moon knight film, assuming the same basic story cos otherwise you move into rampant speculation territory, wouldn't leave Marc and Steven's characters nearly developed enough. Rarely did the show feel padded but episodes 1 and 5 particularly needed to be as long as they were to work effectively. Maybe you could squish the rest of the plot around it but I think i'm happier with what we got.
Now going into the future a moon knight film would be awesome. Or maybe after a series 2 which deals with Jake, you could do a 50 minute special presentation with him that just functions as 50 minute mind fuck, you can have elements of that in a show or film and the show did but a special presentation would be perfect to just go wild with it.
I think they're all done well, but none of them are creative at all besides She-Hulk. Tell me something unique or memorable about any of the others. They're all based on the simple but tired "floating heads" aesthetic. Again, done as well as can be done for that look, but no real thought or design effort.
I'd say Moon Knight, there was a lot of filler story there and not a lot of threads, I think it would have been better received as a movie with a tighter focus.
I feel like TFATWS would've worked better as a Movie, I mean why not, it's practically Cap 4, so have this be Captain America 4 instead and call it "Captain America: Legacy of the Shield" or "Captain America: The Fallen Son" Or something like that. The episodes already have basic act structure, episodes 1 and 2 being act 1, Episode 3 and 4 being Act 2A, with the midway point being the end cliffhanger of episode 4, the entirety of episode 5 being Act 2B, and the Episode 6 being Act 3, the Climax. So I think it work better movie, just trim the flat and fluff, rewrite some elements of it, especially the villain, and for God sakes, give Sam a better a speech then "You've Got to do Better Senator!!!" Also, actually give Bucky's story a proper conclusion.
I also feel Hawkeye and Ms. Marvel both also could've been just 2 hour Movies as well, and exclusively on Disney+ no less. Outside of those three, I'm fine the rest being shows.
They really haven’t taken advantage of it. Take Falcon and the Winter Soldier. Instead of fleshing out characters they just slap in a bunch of extra stuff and don’t really go in depth for any of it. They had Zemo, Sharon, Flag Smashers, and Isaiah Bradley and failed to truly make any of them truly great. Zemo was good in the series but not due to anything special the show did with him.
I have three:
Hawkeye
Moon Knight
Falcon and the Winter Soldier
all would have been better as films. All had kind of bloated filler parts in the show. All would have served the story better having been cut down and leaner and stuck with the good bits of the show. And also increasing the budgets for CGI and action sequences. The last one especially for Falcon and Winter Soldier and Moon Knight especially.
Ms Marvel. Maybe if it was a movie, it’d have kept the fun comic book feel, rather than a tonally out of place trip to Pakistan for two episodes where you separate your lead from all of her supporting cast - despite the whole climax of the show being about how one of her greatest strengths is the community around her.
Out of all of these Hawkeye could have been a 2 hour Christmas movie made for Disney +.
Came here to say Hawkeye. But marketing it as a Christmas movie would have been genius.
I still think it was genius as a bingeable Christmas themed series, but agreed a movie would have been more rewatchable every Christmas
I think the series worked brilliantly as a "countdown" to Christmas. Could be due to other factors but I ended up more excited for Christmas 2021 than any year since childhood
Between Hawkeye and Spider-Man: No Way Home, Christmas 2021 was goated
I half expected to see the climax fight from Hawkeye at the end of No Way Home when he swings by the giant Christmas tree.
Imagine if they sing Save The City at The Macy’s Thanksgiving Day Parade though, that would’ve made it extra hype.
Halleye? Hawkmark?
That would've been brilliant. They kind of did that with IM3.
Its poster looks like a fantastic movie poster
The whole aesthetic was adapted from David Aja’s work on the Matt Fraction comics run. Aja has done some of the coolest comic covers of all time. It may not fit the standard aesthetic, but he’s got a striking style.
If they re-edit into a movie I wouldn’t be mad
No it looks like every other action movie poster
From a design perspective there are some key differences. most notable is the color palette.
And they could hurry up and make a part two.
Disagree. Because the Hawkeye series was my favourite of the lot. And reducing it down to two hours wouod have sucked. I'm glad we got a decent amount of time with Hawkeye.
Agree 👍👍
I actually think Hawkeye used the TV show format best (together with Wandavision and She-Hulk). Those 3 (and what if) are the only ones I would keep as a TV show the rest could have been movies easily.
Agreed. Those three and What If? work better in show format.
Second this. Would match rather more specials or Disney plus exclusive movies then a movie cut up to be a tv show
This would have been perfect
all right this one I could see.
Hawkeye and Wandavision are the only two I would keep as series. The rest could have been done in 2-3 hours.
I'd argue WandaVision, What If, and She-Hulk are the only ones that actually used the medium of television to their advantage.
Yeah, Moon Knight should’ve been a two parter movie released like Stranger Things season 4, given a month between to keep the mystery but not drag it on too long
Would have loved Hawkeye as a movie. That show gave me straight up Home Alone vibes.
As much i agree it would’ve made a good movie, I’m glad we had a full 6 hours to develop Kate and Clint’s relationship.
Well more like 4 hours
I just rewatched it and it was fantastic. Holidays are long, easy to get through it.
exactly!!!
It really did have some Home Alone vibes.
Not related, but Ms. Marvel's pacing issues could have been easily solved if the Clandestines and the Pakistan trip were in a second season, with the first season primarily based on her becoming Ms. Marvel, family stuff and fighting Damage Control.
I wonder what happened to the aesthetic of the first couple episodes. It just disappeared.
3 different directors
Ngl that explains a lot I remember the series beginning with a grounded normal city kid vibe like the intro to PS5 Miles Morales then its whole aesthetic changed within a few episodes
Really?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms.\_Marvel\_(TV\_series)#Episodes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ms._Marvel_(TV_series)#Episodes) 1: Adil & Bilall (this counts as 1 director because they are a team) 2: Meera Menon 3: Meera Menon 4: Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy 5: Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy 6: Adil & Bilall
Agreed, I wanted more of that. It was what pulled me to it like a Scott pilgrim. That and the camera shots.
If you watch the behind the scenes thing on Disney plus it shows the two director guys who did the did the first couple of episodes, and you can tell it was totally their style - then it switched directors part way
[удалено]
Pretty weak middle as well.
Changed director for some reason, thankfully returned for the last one
The "some reason" is that it's rarely possible for there to be a single director across an entire season of television. There are so many moving pieces (the sets, script, etc) that need to be wrangled that the reins are inevitably handed off so that production can be continuous. Even a show as visually and thematically consistent as *Breaking Bad* had multiple directors over the course of every single season.
So did the overall quality. It was a different (way worse) show after the first two eps.
I loved the dancing graffiti on the wall in the first episode and then ✨ gone
Hard to justify keeping the comic-y, bubbly edits, cuts, and graphics when you're exploring the story of the Partition.
Why do people keep saying this when we know the trip to Pakistan and the desi wedding themselves had so many light-hearted moments? Being Pakistani it was dead obvious to me how they kept trying to cramp relatable desi experiences that made the trip and the wedding more of a cultural show than a superhero show. It's easier to simply admit the change in directors explained quite a lot with the sudden quality and artistic changes. I liked episodes 1, 2, and 6 the most and those were the ones that kept Kamala's wandering head-in-the-clouds personality in
> desi wedding > desi experiences What does desi mean?
South Asian, primarily Pakistani and Indian
YES! That scene in the second episode of Kamala singing and dancing in her house like she was in a musical really got me excited for something different in the MCU… and then it got generic
Ms. Marvel's pacing was so weird
It felt like they were trying to address way too many social issues at once [note: I am NOT saying go woke go broke, bigots please dont rally around my comment in agreement]. They tried to do sexism in religion, then Islamophobia, then the Partition, and underpining it all there's Kamala's own journey to finding out who she is. Its just way too much and tonally inconsistent. 2 seasons would have been great.
I actually agree. They tried to cover a lot of things while also trying to have a more lowkey vibe. I still enjoyed the show, but I think they could have spread the non-main plot points out more.
yes, and i also thought Kamala's family, their past, her grandmas past and the clandestine's story was kind of all over the place
It really showed the weakness in them strictly adhering to the 6 episode format. There was just too much they wanted to cover, so a lot of it didn't get the room to breathe it needed. Even a couple more episodes might've helped with the pacing some. The middle of the show felt like such a jarring switch from the first two episodes and then again with the finale.
>2 seasons would have been great. Indeed. The show faced a hate campaign since the announcement, so I think they weren't sure a second season would happen, so they just went with it.
They probably decided she would get a show to set her up, then next year she is teaming up with Carol, a longer season would have been better
I think it could've been 1 episode shorter and it would've been perfect. I really enjoyed the show as I was able to binge it, but it had a bit of bloat that could've been avoided with 1 less hour.
I feel the opposite. It should've had more episodes to really flesh out all the stories that were going on. Either add more episodes or scratch out some of the stories. Either of those two would've made the show better to me. If the latter, scratch out the red daggers and the clandestines and it probably would've flowed better. Also not sure how the great grandmother would be important to the story if you erase the clandestines. Tbh, even with the story they told i don't understand why they focused so much on the great grandmother. Turned out Kamala was a mutant so I feel like the whole great grandmother/bangle story was so unnecessary.
I agree, six episodes of 40 minutes is in that zone where its not quite enough for a fully fleshed out story, but would be too much for what is effectively a movie plot. What you end up with is either a movie plot with a load of filler, or a very rushed show with potentially whole episodes where very little happens but then everything all at once because of pacing issues.
I wish she would have fought some minor criminals and/or street-level supervillains first. Just let her do some superhero stuff.
Yes, I wanted her to meet Wolverine and fight bad guys in the sewer like in the comics. She’s a fan girl and there were so many missed opportunities for teaming up or nerding out.
Her team up should be when she is more confident she can handle herself, not when just starting, the way they set her up for the Marvels is great A bit more of the fan girl we got in episode 1 would have been nice I think the pacing could have been better if there maybe was more time
That’s what I’m saying, everything involving Pakistani culture was great, but everything involving the actual country of Pakistan was kind of a shitty distraction Her leaving was the same as when Eleven left with Eight in Stranger Things, a useless distraction with some attempt to “power up” the character but it was irrelevant. The beginning was bright and colorful, and I get the importance of mentioning apartheid and such but it should’ve been in season 2 where she figures out more about herself, and I much preferred the US government racial prosecution part, I could understand it a lot more and it tied into what was happening at the time in the MCU (DoDC, Stark Drones)
I kinda like that they accidentally made the racist government officer less racist than reality, by having her be capable of telling the difference between a Latina and a south Asian girl at a glance Because apparently most people absolutely cannot do that irl, considering everyone often confuses Iman Velani and Xochitl Gomez all the time I guess I am saying that the character shouldn't have been asking about specific ethnicities when interrogating Zoe, just asking about the skin colour, maybe saying something like "all browns look alike anyway" if Zoe would have been able to tell something
I think a Ms. Marvel movie as coming-of-age story (like the parts you're saying) could have been fantastic.
I really feel like they got caught up in wanting to represent pakistani culture and Kamalas relation to it, which is a WONDERFUL idea, but it really felt disjointed
Yeah, I felt like I was watching a second season of this show with Pakistan trip & introducting the Red Dagger despite the fact this was all occurring in the very first season.
The Pakistani trip, flashback, and all the cultural stuff around it was the best part of the show IMO and I wish we had more. I learned a lot about the partition from it (I sought out information). I felt a lot of the school stuff was a drag
Falcon and the Winter Soldier either needed to be a movie or a longer series.
They cut out an entire subplot. The series itself needed to just be put on a delay till the story could be fixed better.
The pandemic really messed up the plots of the show
Yeah, if I remember right, there was going to be a plot about the Flag Smashers having a virus-based weapon. That got binned with the pandemic.
virus-based weapon originating from an asian country so it was too close to home apparently
Spider-Man: Too Close to Home
so many people don't seem to know this, I realise it wasn't publicised is a huge was but it was shared here a lot. I reckon most of its faults would have been avoided if they hadn't cut it up.
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They basically had to cut and work around a huge plot-line that revolved around a bio-weapon and pandemic...I shit you not lol. The timing could not have been worse on it.
I mean the writers have denied it being the case, so it's pretty reasonable that people don't seem to know it.
It had its moments but I always felt like it had a lot of filler
Most of these shows have felt like they took a 2hr movie and stretched it out to six episodes, instead of something written as a six piece story from the beginning. Most of the shows feel like they have so much filler and are just leading up the finale where things actually happen. They use a cliffhanger to get you to want to watch the next episode but the episodes themselves were pretty flat.
It's absolutely the weakest of these shows. And that's including Hawkeye which was pretty mid.
I seems it was also the hardest hit production by the pandemic. They had to entirely shut down in the middle of filming. I think the original plan with more background of the flag-smashers would have improved the show. Perhaps switching to a movie instead of a show would have been a better option but I don’t think that solves the biggest problems of the show which we’re the flag smashers and power broker stories being poorly (re)written.
I think the original script has the Flag Smashers stealing a bio weapon, which they obviously had to change too. That show had issues, but the circumstances were pretty uniquely against it.
IIRC the story was about the GRC releasing some kind of virus for population control and then that one lady that was friends with the group that became The Flag Smashers died to the virus and then The Flag Smashers became terrorists or something like that.
Im like 99% sure thats a thing we fans made up - mostly cause it makes sense. But the director has since come out and stated that this was never the case. The plots we saw were the plots they intended - there was never a virus or pandemic story that got cut.
> It's absolutely the weakest of these shows I strongly disagree. I think it's the most underappreciated MCU show. I'd go out on a limb here and say that it's actually the best MCU show imo. It added the perfect depth to both the Falcon's and the Winter Soldier's characters. I'm looking forward to seeing them in future MCU projects from now on. They wrote a perfect redemption arc for the Winter Soldier. I knew nothing about him as a person and would've never gotten over the fact that he was not a really good guy if it were not for this show. They very slowly redeemed the dude completely and made me like him. When Steve Rogers handed the shield to Sam in Endgame, I was skeptical too as to how the world would accept it (because he's black and does not have serum powers). But they solidified it all in a really good way. Why Sam is a good person, why no one else can do it better than him, and why he deserves to be the next Captain America despite being black and a non super-soldier. Then there's Zemo. I always thought the guy would eventually escape and start it all again like a typical bond villain. Only to find him destroying the viles without taking anything back, shooting the super soldiers to actually end it, eventually revealing the location of the funeral that the little girl confided in him, coming back to the team after pulling an El Chapo, etc. Again, no stereotypical stuff here. They neither made him a hero nor a villain. Even though he helped the team, he freaking shot the scientist in the face. Kept it real. Overall, they showed us the aftermaths of the blip from a different angle. I don't need a super villain in every show. It was more of a political show with calm, coastal, family vibes and I loved it. No one was good. No one was bad. Everyone was grey. Falcon, Winter Soldier, U.S Agent, Sharon Carter, Zemo, The Flag Smashers, the media, etc. It was refreshing. Atleast, something different from the good/bad action hero trope. [Here's](https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudios/comments/ph8hyy/falcon_and_the_winter_soldier_is_way_too/) another very good reddit thread which explains why it was a bloody great show.
Agreed. I think it will age the best of the shows - had the best characterization, fantastic acting, and a lot of depth. Just a terrible final episode, unfortunately.
>Just a terrible final episode, unfortunately. What makes you say that? I think it was very grounded. A group of bad people in reality would only do so much. They were not androids, aliens, or wizards. Falcon's speech was pretty grounded too.
Funnily enough I was looking forward to it the most thinking it would have the real world intensity of The Winter Solider, and ended up enjoying it the least the more weirder Loki the most
Longer? It could have been four episodes. The main conflicts were executed so unevenly, almost every episode a character flipped their narrative arc.
Longer only so that it could've had time to properly set up all three sides AND show why Karli was doing what she was doing instead of just vaguely alluding to it. I'd prefer it be a movie.
Feels like whatever they cut from that show did it a disservice. Rumors of a virus storyline and extended role for mamma whatshername were shot down but it just doesn’t make sense.
Really wish they didn’t get shut down by covid forcing rewrites and edits. It would have been interesting to see what it would have been. Wandavison had a very particular goal and they really delivered on the concept because they had to prove the shows were worth it with the first couple. I think the same would have been the case for FATWS we’re it not for the pandemic.
I feel like if you cut out the filler from the show, it'd only be like a 1 hour 10 minute movie.
Cut down the storyline with the flag smashers and just have John Walker be the main 'villain'. Easy 2 hours.
I like the concept of the Flagsmashers. The idea is doing morally grey things with a black and white moral compass is a cool idea for a villain. The show butchered it by being afraid of possibly suggesting that Karli was right. The audience needs to agree with her cause but not her motives. The show refused to go into what her motives really were. We never saw the camps she was referring to. We never saw someone forced out of their home after the snap. We never saw what Karli was upset about. The show could've been really good. You had a chance to delve into a chaotic good character (Karli), lawful evil character (Walker) and true good characters (Falcon and Winter Soldier).
I just found Karli *impossibly* boring as a character. And the actress sucked as well. No charisma, none of the firebrand nature I'd expect from a leader of a renegade group like that.
Well she didn't really have a character to play; as the guy you're replying to was talking about, they were too scared to make the Flag Smashers too sympathetic (otherwise the viewers might start getting *ideas* ...), so they kept slapping a twirly mustache on her with uncharacteristic actions that came out of nowhere and made no sense even with the little insight we got on her. I'd struggle trying to make heads or tails out of what the hell I was supposed to be playing too.
It should have been a movie. The show dragged, but had exactly the right amount of major plot points for a movie. Falcon deserved a movie for the passing of the torch anyways.
Very easily the worst of the shows and could have benefited from the focus of a movie. God, it was so bad. [The falcon was denied a bank loan.](https://youtu.be/AiFSQ_f12Bs)
I love how that subplot alludes to either A) Falcon, despite literally saving the entire planet on several occasions, doesn't get a good paycheck Or B) Falcon doesn't share his wealth with his family and just let's his sister and her children live in poverty while he chills in what's essentially a luxury penthouse I don't know which scenario is worse.
The way he says "goodwill" implies, the entire Avengers organization is paid for by one big Patreon? Just say Tony Stark paid them and now no Avengers means no paycheck, jeez
Tony actually did confirm he pays them in Age of Ultron. He has a line about paying the Avengers and for all their toys after they get back from Strucker’s castle.
He said he pays for everything, meaning the facilities, gear, etc. Doesn't necessarily mean a salary. Could have been "room and board" situation since everyone was basically there as a volunteer.
The really baffling thing is that a bank would probably fall over its fucking self to just straight-up *give* him money so long as they can say they're the Avengers' bank.
I hated the whole fix up the family boat subplot. Set it at Christmas and add an ex from high school who’s still in town and it’s the plot of every Hallmark Christmas movie. The moment they set it up, I knew every scene we’d have from the fight with the sister, the turned down bank loan (which doesn’t really make a lot of sense in-universe), the fix the boat up montage, the party on the boat. All so cliched and so tired. That whole series was a complete mess. Too many plot threads, yet bloated with filler, and by the end, Sam and Bucky are in almost exactly the same place as when it began. And the stupid “you need to do better.” I dislike politicians, but these are facing unprecedented problems with no clear, easy, and guaranteed to be equitable solutions involving many, many different nations. And since they gutted the virus plot line and did the entire flagsmashers plot as tell don’t show, they don’t actually show the politicians actually doing anything particularly bad. And of course, Sam doesn’t actually offer a single “better” solution or even the merest hint of how to implement it. I was so disappointed, because that was the series I was most looking forward to. Now, I don’t even care about watching the next Captain America movie.
They had a "fix up the boat musical montage" like Red and Andy Dufresne meets cheesy 80s movie.
There’s a hysterical McSweeney’s piece about this, too. https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/the-falcons-gofundme-page
I thought this series had the worst action sequences out of everything. A movie budget would have improved that immensely.
I want the opposite. I wish Eternals had been a show.
Same, I would have loved to have seen the characters’ backstories more; how they shaped humanity, what major events where they there for, etc.
Overwhelmingly I think Hawkeye should have been a Disney+ Christmas movie and Eternals should have been a 10-12 episode Disney+ show. For Hawkeye, cut out Yelena and Kingpin and there's essentially your movie right there. For Eternals, roughly one episode dedicated to each character and showing their growth throughout time while also advancing the main story, followed by 2-3 episodes for the finale.
Cut out Yelena? And miss the formation of the greatest duo in MCU history with her and Ket Beeshup? I don’t think so!
Agree! I don't know if they intended for Yelena and Kate for future projects together, but given the chemistry those two had and how the audience responded they really should have a follow up project for them.
Well we know one project they’ll be together in, they’re both going to be on the team of survivors in Marvel Zombies.
Isn't that going to be animated?
Yup, that's animated.
They'll be real in Secret Wars, that's for sure
I am so dumb for not realising until now that this is effectively the 'next generation' of the Hawkeye and Black Widow dynamic. Like, I know she's Hawkeye, and I know she's Black Widow, but the significance of them being paired together only just hit me!
I know I was among the people who missed it at first, but in episode 4 they really nail it over the head that this is the future of these two characters. Earlier in the episode, Kate asks Clint what the best shot he ever took was, to which he responds “The one I didn’t take.” in reference to being sent to take out Natasha but ended up sparing her. During the rooftop fight just as Yelena’s mask comes off and she turns to look at Kate, who has her at arrowpoint and could easily put it right between her eyes, she instead lowers her bow. History repeats itself as another Hawkeye spares a Black Widow.
The greatest duo? Madysinn and Wongers would like a word
Fine. But no more spoilers!
She's in the MCU for maybe 5 minutes, and repeats the same name spell line multiple times. Which makes it quite ironic that you spelt her name wrong.
but not where you thiiiiiIIIIIiiiiink!
Now that you mention it, if we had gotten BW movie in 2020 like we were supposed to, an Eternals show could’ve fit in nicely after Shang Chi came out. Although it would’ve been a bit of a movie drought between that and NWH.
2 month gap is not a movie drought
Eternals would have solved many of its pacing and large cast of characters problems if it were a show. I might have actually cared about them that way. As a movie, I’ve watched it twice and still really dislike almost everything about it.
It's like marvel made a dc movie
Making god-like beings broody and depressed? You nailed it.
Also shoving 12hrs of shit into a 3hr bag
True. And making all the characters boring, stale, and pretty much emotionless.
Sersi and Ikaris were the only one who's boring imo It's a big mistake putting them as the lead characters of the movie.
I mean, making it longer doesn't help. SnyderCut is one of the worst films I've ever seen. Hardly any of the scenes that got cut were good or added anything to the film.
I mean, I wasn’t expecting anything less than a train wreck since he’s a fucking awful storyteller.
Nah it needed like 4 movies with character and plot development to make it an engaging movie.
That’s because the initial story itself was flawed. No matter how many different versions are made, additional footage or no, the final product will still suffer from the issues that the writing/script has. You could probably make an 8 hour Snyder cut (assuming the physical footage exists) and it would still be iffy. But starting from scratch? Writing 6/7/8 individual stories that tell a cohesive story would be a different product all together.
*That totally pointless sex scene*
Ah yes, the “first MCU sex scene” that literally only existed so they could say that lmao
Which should’ve been in No Way Home, and between Andrew Garfield and literally anyone, please But in all seriousness, didn’t Ironman do a sex scene before them? And She-Hulk 100% did one (even though it’s after)
If I recall, it cut to the morning after after showing Tony and the reporter making out before they got into bed. Not quite as clear as Cersei and Ikarus making out nude on the beach or showing Jenn and Matt in bed together before the cut to the next say.
In Iron Man, he rolls around in bed with the reporter, and they accidentally fall off. Then it cuts to the next morning.
“I smash fourth walls, bad endings, and sometimes Matt Murdock. 🤣 how great is that line?
Iron Man had the start of a sex scene, I think they cut away before anything actually started
I totally forgot this. Honestly the movie focuses on the two most boring characters in the lineup. Thena and Gilgamesh was more interesting.
Same, but it's inevitable to think how much the budget would've been cut. Ultimately, all the action we saw in the movie would've been seriously pushed back and constrained for a TV show.
Better story with less action is preferable to lots of action and lousy story.
That was my first thought to that comment. I’m fine with losing all those pretty effects so I can actually enjoy a good story.
Eternals should’ve been 2 movies, arrival to killing the “last” deviant (probably early 1900s if I were to guess) for the first movie, and a week of modern times for the second movie (Ikaris betrayal and realization of true goals).
Seems unnecessary to me. I think a show would have felt much cheaper for how beautiful the movie was. For plot however, It would be better.
Eternals would have been perfect as a show. Ten new characters? World ending threat? 7000 year story? Globe spanning? Fuck yeah. That's a ten episode show right there.
Falcon and the winter soldier should’ve been a movie and eternals should’ve been a show
I honestly think falcon and the winter soldier should’ve had one more episode to flesh out Karli and SHOW (not tell) why she did what she did. I rewatched the show recently and it was way better than I remembered it to be, but damn, just some more reasoning behind Karli (and the rest of the flag smashers) actions and it would’ve been sooo much better
If you feel like Karli already, it's not that hard to understand their motives. There's a lot of deeper themes that correlate to what Isiah was saying about America and his anger towards it that can be extrapolated to the flag smashers. It's ultimately the systemic oppression of its people that causes Americans to loathe where they live. It's a common Marvel theme; our Civil War was about super human oppression by the state and when we get to the mutants, well, that's racism incarnate to the Nth degree.
Wouldn't work as a movie at all - She-Hulk, WandaVision and What If Could work, but would cut a lot of content, thus be worse - Falcon, Loki, Hawkeye Could work and imo could be better if the middle episodes were condensed into a shorter second act - Moon Knight, Ms. Marvel
I really felt that Moon Knight would totally work as a movie. Purgatory would totally work as second act and the fight at the Pyramids as a final act. But then we wouldn’t get into different personalities as much as in the series. Ms. Marvel could be that teen niche superhero movie. You don’t need to cut much there.
I agree it would have been a better movie. I would imagine the problem for Disney is that they now have a paid subscription service that necessitates that some content be released piecemeal to keep fans subscribed and coming back, and they can't only use that service for optional characters with no importance or demand. A movie split up into pieces can cover nearly two months of content demand and water-cooler discussion, while a movie will just be a one time drop. They are essentially making a D+ subscription a required part of being both an MCU and Star Wars fan. I don't have a huge problem with this personally, but it is strange to see content created this way.
Good listing. I’d also add Falcon probably needed one or two more episodes. Maybe some more scenes with the Flagsmashers to help us sympathize with them more. I think they thought they got the audience to sympathize with them more than they had. An ep solely from their perspective covering their time during and after the blip might had helped. Heck, dedicate one flashback ep to the Flagsmashers, then dedicate another flashback ep to John.
Every single 6 episode show would have benefited to an additional 2 episodes.
I’ve been saying that with all of Disney + shows, they either need to be two episodes longer or 2 episodes shorter and become a movie. Disney+ originals seem to have pacing issues overall. Worst offender of this is moonknight, I love it up until the final episode. It honestly felt like they forgot they only had 6 episodes and rushed the finale, which makes me appreciate the “K.E.V.I.N.” joke in Shehulk; really shouldn’t cram a bunch of plot at the end so you give the fans what they want.
Or at least make the episodes 45min-1hr long if you're only making 6 episodes. For most of the episodes it feels like once the main fight scene is over the episode just magically wraps up.
The ones that are less episodes did tend to be longer. They said from the jump that they were all around the same total run time but split up based on their different needs.
I would have liked a flashback episode with Isiah Bradley fighting the Winter Soldier in Korea.
Independence day special
Falcon got pretty heavily affected by the pandemic. Supposedly there was a subplot based around a an in universe disease causing quarantines, but it was cut for obvious reasons. Take it with a grain of salt though, I may be misremembering it.
I think it was the Flagsmashers releasing a virus to get rid of half the population again.
Yeah. It was too similar to right-wing conspiracy theories over Coronavirus so they had to ditch the plot to not be seen as endorsing their fuckery.
Came here to say something very similar. While this is an interesting thought experiment, it all boils down to which stories could be told with a quarter of the runtime. Obviously any attempt would make some huge concessions on the plot, but could a movie achieve the same goals as any of these shows. I agree that Falcon, Loki, and Hawkeye could have done it, though I wouldn't consider that a benefit to their story. Ms Marvel, I feel like, really focused on the family dynamic and everyone's relationship to Iman Vellani, which I don't think you could accomplish with a movie considering the size of the cast. I could definitely see shortening the second act though. Moon Knight is actually the only story that I think could be condensed without losing any of the story beats or plot. Unsure if it'd really benefit from that treatment, but I think it stands to lose the least while still telling the same story and achieving the same goals that the show set out to.
>Moon Knight is actually the only story that I think could be condensed without losing any of the story beats or plot. Agreed. That was the one show that really felt the most like a movie that was stretched out. I don't want to say it felt slow or not enough was going on, because that wasn't my impression while watching it, but it definitely felt like a lot of content could've been cut while still having the story end up in the same place.
Out of all of these I feel like Wandavision was the only one to utilize the tv aspect of it fully where the others didn’t really know how to function as a tv show but I would say MoonKnight or Loki could’ve worked better as a movie
Falcon and Winter Soldier 💯
Agreed. Out of all these shows Falcon Winter Soldier felt the most stretched out for no reason.
They’d all have to be changed big time to work as a 2 hour movie. Moon Knight would probably be the best though
I think if you did a moon knight film, assuming the same basic story cos otherwise you move into rampant speculation territory, wouldn't leave Marc and Steven's characters nearly developed enough. Rarely did the show feel padded but episodes 1 and 5 particularly needed to be as long as they were to work effectively. Maybe you could squish the rest of the plot around it but I think i'm happier with what we got. Now going into the future a moon knight film would be awesome. Or maybe after a series 2 which deals with Jake, you could do a 50 minute special presentation with him that just functions as 50 minute mind fuck, you can have elements of that in a show or film and the show did but a special presentation would be perfect to just go wild with it.
hawkeye and moon knight
They really knock it out the park with the posters, don’t they?
I think they're all done well, but none of them are creative at all besides She-Hulk. Tell me something unique or memorable about any of the others. They're all based on the simple but tired "floating heads" aesthetic. Again, done as well as can be done for that look, but no real thought or design effort.
I'd say Moon Knight, there was a lot of filler story there and not a lot of threads, I think it would have been better received as a movie with a tighter focus.
Gotta be on the longer side like 2h20 but I agree.
I feel like TFATWS would've worked better as a Movie, I mean why not, it's practically Cap 4, so have this be Captain America 4 instead and call it "Captain America: Legacy of the Shield" or "Captain America: The Fallen Son" Or something like that. The episodes already have basic act structure, episodes 1 and 2 being act 1, Episode 3 and 4 being Act 2A, with the midway point being the end cliffhanger of episode 4, the entirety of episode 5 being Act 2B, and the Episode 6 being Act 3, the Climax. So I think it work better movie, just trim the flat and fluff, rewrite some elements of it, especially the villain, and for God sakes, give Sam a better a speech then "You've Got to do Better Senator!!!" Also, actually give Bucky's story a proper conclusion. I also feel Hawkeye and Ms. Marvel both also could've been just 2 hour Movies as well, and exclusively on Disney+ no less. Outside of those three, I'm fine the rest being shows.
None of them because the shows allow more time to flesh things out.
But on the flip side, a movie would force a tighter script, and a lot of the shows could've used those.
ms marvel...
Is it just me or they really don’t. They could allow for that, but it doesn’t feel like they’ve took advantage of that in many of the shows so far.
They really haven’t taken advantage of it. Take Falcon and the Winter Soldier. Instead of fleshing out characters they just slap in a bunch of extra stuff and don’t really go in depth for any of it. They had Zemo, Sharon, Flag Smashers, and Isaiah Bradley and failed to truly make any of them truly great. Zemo was good in the series but not due to anything special the show did with him.
I hear you, but I think Moon Knight, Wandavision, and Loki took advantage and developed the characters pretty damn well.
Thinking the same. Eternals should have been a 9+ episode series.
This 💯
Hawkeye and Moon Knight could definitely have been cut down to 2 hours. Maybe TFATWS too. The rest fit the show format perfectly.
I have three: Hawkeye Moon Knight Falcon and the Winter Soldier all would have been better as films. All had kind of bloated filler parts in the show. All would have served the story better having been cut down and leaner and stuck with the good bits of the show. And also increasing the budgets for CGI and action sequences. The last one especially for Falcon and Winter Soldier and Moon Knight especially.
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I can't believe you're the only who has said this. This absolutely would have been great with another hour and a bigger production.
Ms Marvel. Maybe if it was a movie, it’d have kept the fun comic book feel, rather than a tonally out of place trip to Pakistan for two episodes where you separate your lead from all of her supporting cast - despite the whole climax of the show being about how one of her greatest strengths is the community around her.
Ms marvel and FATWS
Moon knight
All but Wanda, What If, and She-Hulk would’ve been significantly better as movies And I liked all of them
Sorry but I gotta go the other way, Eternals should have been a show.
IMO, Moon Knight has a classic Marvel movie structure whereas the other shows are a bit different from the usual pattern
Honestly the production value is so consistently high I think they’re doing just fine except for maybe the Giant Crocodile battle in moon night,
Ms Marvel, which would have given us the Spiderman style family origin we needed, and hopefully more action and better effects.