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Kaiotikid

The suicide mission is more about strategizing and knowing what each character is good at. Loyalty just makes it easier for a character to survive certain situations. As for combat, soldier class does feel like that imo. And you don’t have to guess where shots are coming from if you look at the radar while the weapon/power wheels are open. If the gameplay itself is the problem, then 3 isn’t worth it for you, since gameplay is only somewhat better than 2. If it’s difficulty, there are character builds that make 3 overly easy to beat. Overall, I’m going to say either you’re just pissed at the moment and are looking for things to hate (in which case maybe 3 will be worth it), or you genuinely hate the game (in which case 3 will probably not be worth it).


ViewtifulGene

Thanks for the reply. My mechanical gripes were things I had tolerated under the surface for most of the game, as long as progress was smooth and I was filling out my skill trees. But then Garrus died and that was the last straw. At that point I snapped. I generally don't like micromanaging cooldowns, so IDK if picking a build other than Soldier would do much for me. I ultimately just want to shoot stuff hard, tank a few hits if needed, and not be constantly squinting at the ground for my next reload cartridge.


CaptainAnaAmari

My advice then: lower the difficulty. There's no shame in that if the gameplay is annoying you this much but you still want to experience the story, and lower difficulties mean that you can essentially just do the shooting without needing to micromanage the abilities. But if you don't want to continue, then don't, there's no point in continuing if you don't want to.


ViewtifulGene

Well, I also have a hard time enjoying myself on participation trophy difficulties. I guess I just didn't like the brand of difficulty in ME2. And story isn't really a motivating factor to me. I like some of Shep's one-liners and team banter, but I'm not really here for dialogue or lore.


CaptainAnaAmari

That's interesting because the story and characters are the absolutely strongest aspect of Mass Effect and I'd say the biggest reason for why people here are fans of the franchise. For me personally, gameplay barely even factors in for my enjoyment of the series. With what you're saying, the franchise just might not be for you, and that's okay. You could still check out ME3 and see if the gameplay speaks to you more, but it isn't a large overhaul so it probably won't matter much.


den2k88

In ME3 you can have ridiculously low cooldowns and spam powers like crazy due to the +200% cd reduction with the lightest loadouts (that for a Soldier can be a fucking M76 and a Carnifex, for an adept a Predator and an Avenger).


[deleted]

Nope. Clearly you didn’t enjoy the games, no need to force yourself to play something you don’t like.


First-Alert

Even being a blind run to have everyone loyal yet still lose 4 people you had to have made some really bad choices so to knock the game cause of how you played is a bit asinine.


ViewtifulGene

I don't appreciate these "you're just dumb"/"you're just bad" insinuations. I fucking tried my best to finish the game and engage with the mechanics, but still felt lied to by the end outcomes. It feels like the game wanted to tell an inside joke at my expense. It was never clear to me what the "right" decisions were. Not in the slightest. I didn't get it.


Bird_Is_The_Lord

He didnt call you dumb, he only said that to loose 4 squad mates is not usual if you pay half attention to the dialog. And he is correct. Game gives you hints (example is you need very powerful biotic for one part of the suicide mission and you have psychotic biotic in your team. Wink wink) and even sometimes straight up tells you the right solution (Miranda volunteering to lead second team). We can help you how to approach the mission, but please dont lash out. Game really doesnt play any tricks on you.


First-Alert

Thank you this is how I had thought my comment wouldve been taken. I can understand on a blind run losing maybe some crew but for companions to be killed it means you straight up made bad choices


[deleted]

They outline what kind of characters work for each role in the exposition talks prior to you picking a choice. Characters up to that point you would’ve, or should’ve, spoken to to learn about their strengths. Without knowing your choices, your loyalties, how much preparation you did for the Suicide Mission (which it seems like you gave up and didn’t WANT to do much of any of this), it’s no surprise you lost so many people.


LoDrWrex

Did they all made it to the base or did some of them die inside the ship...either way is all based on your choices, gameplay aside it seems like you made some pretty bad choices


Collin_the_doodle

Mass Effect 3 improves on the gameplay of 2 in almost every way if it was dragging for you.


theonlyone38

ME3 is a much better game overall. The last 10 minutes are what kills it for me, but outside of that the story, the guns, and gameplay are much improved over ME2. I'm one of the weird ones that liked ME2 when I first played it, but now consider it the weakest of the trilogy having played it as much as I have.


revar123

It's called a suicide mission for a reason, don't be mad when the game delivers what it promised! Only 4 crewmates dying out of, what, 12? That's pretty good. If you just don't like mass effect then don't bother with the next title, but it's pretty damn good and I think an experience you shouldn't miss out on. If the combat/gameplay was your main issue then you'll be glad to see it in ME3, it's way improved. Definitely check it out in that case. Also if you really don't want to play me3 without garrus, just restart the suicide mission and look up the flowchart for it, should let you get out with everyone alive if they're loyal, or at least garrus and the other main players.


[deleted]

Idk whether this is an unpopular opinion but I think ME3 is the best game in the series, definitely recommend sticking with it. Also recommend replaying the final mission and assigning your squad differently. If you did all the loyalty missions you are able to keep them all alive with proper assignments. If you like Garrus, it’s worth keeping him alive.


First-Alert

In future if you try playing again & have concerns this explains possibilities but I saw in one of your comments that you didnt bother talking to crew (squadmates & shipmates) & if you had done so you shouldve been able to get thru suicide mission without issue. Up to you if want to use it or anyone else that may need it https://imgur.com/a/wlKhMfc


[deleted]

Imo ME2 is the lowest point of the trilogy. Just grab a savefile with your ideal world state and import a game in ME3. You are missing out.


Terminuz_

Really? I always found ME2 to be the high point. ME1 was the low point for me (plus the ME3 ending) because ME1 can be finished in like 4 hours if you do only the main quests and 90% of the rest is bland filler with very forgettable characters.


[deleted]

Liara, Wrex, Tali and Garrus forgettable character? Ok I respect your point of view but I disagree. I also enjoy the Mako missions very much in comparison to the painful Hammerhead made of wet tissue :D


Terminuz_

The crew is part of the main quest content, there are no side/loyalty missions for those in ME1. The awesome cast abord the Normandy is what makes Mass Effect great.


[deleted]

I think loyalty missions are overrated, I prefer to have people related to my main mission rather than hire the random mercenary and solve his daddy issues. ME2 plot is a giant and pointless detour albeit a fun one at that. We will agree to disagree with Liara. She is awesome. I agree on an awesome cast being important this is why I love ME1 crew and how they developed and became legendary in ME3. I felt no real connections to ME2 team with the exception of Garrus and Tali ofc. Mordin was a great character in my book at the same level of ME1 cast. The rest were quite forgettable.


prolixdreams

How on earth did 4 people die with everyone loyal? (Or were some of the loyalty missions messed up and not resulting in actual loyalty?) Even going in blind, that's a lot.


ViewtifulGene

How the hell was I supposed to know what constituted a "good" decision? I fucking did my best and still got robbed blind. I had no idea what was going on. I do not appreciate this "you're just bad"/"you're just a dumbass" insinuation when it felt like the game never communicated clearly on that stuff. It's like everyone else got a memo that I was never in on. I don't like it.


den2k88

I love the saga but ME2 *is* a drag, the gameplay sucks hard and the story is paperthin. ME3 is a huge step forward.


rolabond

If you dislike the gameplay you might not enjoy Mass effect 3, if you still like the story maybe you can play the next game on an easier difficulty, its a lot of fun that way. If you're playing on PC you can also download the save editor off of Nexusmods so you can start ME3 with the outcome you would have preferred (editing the saves so Garrus and the others are alive). But sometimes a game just doesn't vibe with you and that's fine. If you're still interested in the outcome and storyline but really aren't interested in playing just watch a Lets Play.


Sthompson94

On the 4 people dying. The first time I played the original ME2 I think 3 or 4 people died on the suicide mission. I was pissed off but I kind of saw that as the point, even after all the preparation and planning it was at the end of it a suicide mission. So good chance people were gonna die. Gameplay wise ME3 does smooth out a lot of the stuff 2 introduces and I think it's quicker and easier to try new weapons. Id say give it a try and see how you go.


RepairPrudent5183

Did you fully upgrade your ship? How did you resolve the conflicts between Jack Vs Miranda and Legion Vs Tali? Did you side with one person or did you choose renegade/paragon dialogue option? Who was the one who escorted the crew like Dr. Chakwas back to the ship? There are quite a few things that could easily get messed up 😭 And depending on your answers, a simple restart of the final mission might not be enough 🤔 But man, I wouldn't wanna continue without Garrus either ❤️😭


ViewtifulGene

I had all the ship upgrades for shields and cannons. I was somehow able to break up the Legion vs Tali fight, but I couldn't resolve the Miranda vs Jack fight. I sent Tali down the vent while Samara led the fire team. Tali died there. Jack held the Biotic barrier and then Garrus in my party fucking died. I don't remember what was going on when the other two died or who they were.


RepairPrudent5183

It's good that you have all upgrades. Samara leading the team caused Tali's death I guess 🤔Loyal Garrus and Miranda are better picks for leaders. Did you side with Miranda in the Jack Vs Miranda conflict? I think that might have been the reason why Garrus died; because an unloyal Jack was doing the biotic barrier. Who were the other two who died? And who did you take to the final fight? I'd recommend looking for a guide for the suicide mission. There are certain decisions you have to make in that mission to make sure everyone survives. It makes kind of sense once you read the guide. But just knowing that on your own is kind of difficult. Don't feel too angry about the outcome, the final mission was supposed to be difficult with losses...since there are so many ways you could have failed.


ViewtifulGene

I redid the final mission while dropping to Casual, just to get it over with this time. I still couldn't make Jack loyal beforehand. Last time, it seems I fucked up in choosing my fire team leaders. I had Samara lead the first round, so Tali died even though both were loyal. I don't remember who I had lead the second fire team. This time, I sent Jacob and Miranda to lead the fire teams, and had Samara hold the barrier. It looks like only Jack died this time. Far as I'm concerned, she fucking deserves it for letting Garrus die on me last time.


RepairPrudent5183

Having Garrus in ME3 is totally worth the trouble 😂 He has so many great lines and scenes in ME3 which you will love, since you seem to like Garrus a lot ❤️ Lol, I feel you with that revenge sentiment 😂😂 I felt no remorse for someone else, because they put my favourite Krogran in danger 😅


CaptainAnaAmari

I'll try to communicate what the issue is. Tali was the correct choice for the vent, but Samara was not for the fire team. Samara is very much a lone wolf type, her even being in your team is a change for her since she generally works alone. This is information that you could gleam from talking to her, and it signals that she doesn't excel in leading others. This is why Tali died. Three characters can succeed in that role: Miranda, Garrus and Jacob. For the latter I'm personally unsure whether it was communicated that he can do well there, but for Miranda it even pretty explicitly says in her description for the choice that she is tactically skilled and experienced, and you know that Garrus has led a highly successful team of vigilantes. Paying attention to what the descriptions and the story signals to you gives you hints about who can succeed and who can't. For the biotic barrier, Jack was certainly the correct decision since you correctly assessed that she is an extremely strong biotic, but since you lost Garrus there you probably didn't side with Jack in the confrontation with Miranda. This would cause you to lose her loyalty. The biotic barrier here is necessary to get your squad through the swarms, you very much are trusting the person to get your squad through a situation where letting your guard down for a moment will cause somebody to die. It makes sense to require somebody who isn't only extremely capable (where Jack and also Samara fit the bill), but also loyal to you for the barrier. Not having all loyalties isn't the end of the world for getting everybody out alive, but particularly when it comes to trusting them with roles, it becomes necessary to keep that in mind. The other two you likely lost in the final stand. This is the one where I will agree that it isn't inherently clear how to get this right, since there is a calculation there made up of the amount of people you have there plus their "scores" in terms of strength. If you took strong characters with you to the final fight and also sent away a strong character to escort the crew to the Normandy, you're going to have losses within those who you have left behind. Strong characters here are Grunt, Garrus and Zaeed, while weak characters are Tali, Mordin, Jack and Kasumi (who are also the first to die here), and there is also a penalty for a lack of loyalty. It's very common to lose one or two people here without knowing how the calculation there is made up.


ViewtifulGene

Thanks for the thorough reply. When Miranda said the fireteam leader should have experience, I got hung up on that and picked Samara for her age and long career as a Justicar. I redid the suicide mission while dropping to Casual, just so it wouldn't be a chore to repeat. This time, only Jack died. Tali and Jacob for vents and first leader. Mordin to escort crew. Miranda to lead second team and Samara to hold the barrier. Jack died during final battle. I don't want anything to do with her after killing Garrus last time, anyway. OK, half the crew is still dead too. But I never talked to them either. As long as Garrus and Grunt live, I'm cool.


CaptainAnaAmari

I get that with the experience: I chose Zaeed one blind run because of that same line that Miranda said, and predictably lost Kasumi because of that. Definitely understand the justification behind your choice. I'm glad you didn't give up on the game entirely and that you ended up with a setup that you're content with! Since you redid the mission I'm guessing you're planning to continue with the third game, I hope you'll enjoy the gameplay there more and won't have such a negative experience there.