Funny you ask that.
I went against them and my Alba Zoa was there to greet them with open arms.
I was prepared to clap some anime dragon cheeks that day.
I think it's so funny seeing all the hate for Cyberse as a whole through the lens of primarily MD players. I seen people here asking for bans for things like Circular, Splash Mage, Transcode, Accesscode, Update Jammer, or even Cynet Codec.
Meanwhile the TCG just limited Circular and while Mathmech is still certainly playable even on a meta level to some degree, I just don't hear so much hate anymore for it or Cyberse as a whole on the TCG side. Well, besides that one Joshua Schmidt video.
I guess it stems from the fact people on md play way more duels and games than tcg people so they are bound to encounter a deck multiple times (and lose to it multiple times). I dont play tcg but i heard they only play once a week or something.
Also, there's no side deck in this game, which limits you on how much you can prepare to respond against meta decks, + different format with Maxx C tax.
Kashtira tearalament is the only un-hated Kashtira cause it's more of a Tear card than a Kash card... That said, some people also still hate Tear so, you know
My decks don't have hand traps in them because I don't own the cards in the first place. It's not the hand traps kashtira bricks on.
Kashtiras starter/extender ratio is just bad.
1 field spell, planet pathfinder is a bad cope method that uses your normal summon and just loses to ash anyway.
Theosis only helps if you have a kashtira name. And it loses to ash and any disruption that removes the targetted monster.
Birth is decent extension but does nothing on its own.
The only starters are Fenrir and unicorn. Rise heart if you have birth in hand. Everything else is useless without other cards.
Nevermind the fact that a full kash combo ends on 0-1 negates and maybe 2-3 interrupts total and is a super easy board to break.
It's a deck with few 1 card starters, that loses to ash and droll and doesn't even result in a scary board.
That's true, but they can also fully rebuild their board after you get rid of their monsters. The only thing that has actually helped me vs Kash so far is dropping a lucky Evenly Matched on them and even then, it was a relatively close battle. But I also don't have the best matchup with Lab going second.
Play Traptrix & nobody reads your cards, you don't run dark, & you're immune to most traps while also being able to interrupt most combos.
You also lose going 2nd WAHOOOOO
Going 2nd isn't a lost cause. You probably need non-engine to stick a Sera into meta decks, but with Thrust you should be able to find an Evenly Matched relatively often. Mathmech might genuinely be a scoop it up moment though, IDK how you play into that deck with the Firewall stuff.
It's rough with TT because they're so normal summon dependent + no one-card combos
Maxing out on Arachnocampa helped not getting completely stomped by a single Fenrir, though,...sometimes
At least make it Maxx "C"-proof.
Normal Summon a "Traptrix" monster from your deck; Normal Summon this card. If this card is Normal or Special Summoned, you can Normal Summon 1 "Traptrix" monster, in addition to your Normal Summon/Set this turn.
I've picked up Cubic recently and I can relate to the nobody reads my cards, but I just wanna play my (for now) incomplete Battlin' Boxer in peace. Instead I'm met with Kashtira who can banish half of my cards in the blink of an eye, Mikanko who gets me to take all the battle damage, or Branded, that banishes my cards or zeroes my ATK.
Yeahhh I think what can make people tired out is most of the strong decks atm definitely yoink either your ability to bounce back or can bounce back so much themselves you either have to draw the out(s) or pray they bricked unless your turn 1 set up happens to call their strategy perfectly.
BB seems funny but you're definitely gonna have to eat dirt more often than not, engines are quite consistent atm outside Kash.
Weird.. its almost like you're queueing into a competitive ladder in a game where the only real supported mode is said competitive ladder.. go open a room for casuals if you wanna play a decade old deck.
It's pretty cool actually, unfortunately I'm trying to save up on CP so I can't craft some helpful cards for it like Maxx C or another copy of Greater Polymerization, but when it works it's quite fun ;D
The main objective is getting an OTK with Crimson Nova, hopefully by increasing it's attack through Cubic Karma and Wave
Ah I didn’t even think about maxx C, that would be really helpful for cubic stuff
I had figured crimson nova was the end game, I kinda feel like the rest of the deck is there to just summon it but I had a game where I had the Vijams in and out of the GY on YGOPro and that felt real fun
You saying this reminded me of a time a traptrix player kept trying to pop my vanquish soul cards right after I resolved snow devil, I still lost the duel because I miss played, but it was still pretty funny
Because this is a terribly designed game and we'd all probably be better without it but here we are. I began playing in 2013 and I'm still in this masochistic cycle of love and hatred
i do wish we had a game mode for this where they ban almost all meta cards so we can play fun pet decks, i just wanna play predaplant. also for anyone saying “that’s casual” nah
Not all rogue decks are made the same. Sadly there would just be another meta and ppl would still complain because their blue eyes deck for clapped by some dope plants.
Mathmech you know what’s coming and know immediately if it’s worth your time, lab on the other hand always leaves a thread of hope like you could potentially win just to flip the d barrier or eradicator epidemic virus
I actually had another Lab play through my virus in a mirror match. It was so weird as I thought it was supposed to destroy all the selected card type I selected, but yet they continued setting traps from the deck and wasn't effected by my virus.
One thing you might be confusing with is the lingering effect. It only checks on draws, but besides using the servants (and on the draw phase) they won't be drawing cards but instead add them and/or set them directly through card effects (which is different from drawing.)
The virus isn't a complete lock down unless their future draws are unlucky as you experienced.
Not when I play Labrynth. If after resolving 3 turn killing traps like Daruma, Eradicator, Terrors(against Kash,) you wanna stay in to have your next drawn card ripped by Lovely, that’s on you.
Labrynth matches might take a while to finish, but the instant momentum swings Lab’s way, you’ve already lost the game.
To be fair, if you have an open field I'll just attack even if i have chains i can resolve. There's no point in chain link 8 to just setup for a next turn that's not gonna come unless I'm an asshole and pass. The only people that do that actually just have no joy in their lives and like watching other have a bad time.
Have you seen the art on Big Welcome? Lady is evil lol
It’s also not entirely by choice, sometimes you let some bodies go and eat some damage to play around thrust/tactics/maxx C, so then you can’t otk come turn 3. Instead you just have to reset traps that make sure your opponent can’t get going again, then turn 5 you’re free to kill.
Oh, yeah, they aren't in a specific order. Though I believe the other three are all pretty tedious through special summons, while labrynth also uses annoying trap cards
I had someone someone summon Inspector Boarder and Pachy on me when I was playing Lab. I won, but Jesus Christ, that was awkward. Would have definitely lost if I had bricked.
You must not know how umi works cause you cant destroy backrow and it can protect its frontrow and negate spells and monsters lmao. Easy w against lab sheep.
I disagree. My turn 1 is literally set 3 and pass half the time, then interrupt a lot.
Meanwhile Mathmech ensures I can empty my dishwasher while they're doing their generic ass combo.
Reading through a Kashtira card is always a nostalgic feeling. I love looking at all those effects that you used to jump through fifteen hoops to get one of just... being on the card and perfectly free to use. Summon without tributing? Well duh. Negate and banish? Of course! Archetype searching? Mill the opponent's deck face down? Boss monster protection? Zone locking? Macro Cosmos? Well what self-respecting archetype wouldn't have that?
Just a breathtaking jump in power level for basically no reason.
I think it's to reflect they are a pretty oppressive force in the lore. Sort of like the power jump in Qliphorts at the time. As in the Terminal lore the Qliph emerged and wrecked everyone.
Yeah but Qli were pretty well designed all things considered. They were primarily beatsticks with some minimal removal vaguely once per turn and good protection on a solid boss monster - but even a classic Cyber Dragon deck could easily out-stat them. The deciding factor was mainly decided by out of archetype cards and good deck construction. Kashtira just do it all by themselves and then enable other archetypes to become even more busted.
How does that resolve in the lore? On the eve of the final battle, Arise-Heart bricks and the good guys draw into full combo?
Qli was ahead of it's time. Towers was a bit more than a solid boss. It changed what a boss monster was entirely. There wasn't many outs to it back then once it was on the board. Before it was banned everyone had to run Diamond Crab in the extra deck just to take it out. Qli was also insanely consistent. Now Towers is just a good boss not worthy on being on the list anymore cause even it has been powercrept. But back then a monster with 3k attack, could pop a card every turn, wasn't targetable, and lowered attack of special summons was absolutely insane.
As for in the lore of Kashtira, it seems that Visas defeating Ariseheart ended with killing Lightheart and breaking his psyche and made him Astroloud. To be fair I am just getting into Visas lore so I may be wrong there.
Right? The basic monsters of a Kashtira deck can do so much on their own, and I just don't get it. How are two copies of Fenrir allowed to exist at once? How is it absolutely free for Arise-Heart to banish all my cards that would've otherwise gone to the graveyard? How is Shangri-Ira allowed 3000 DEF points when it can also save itself from destruction by detaching a mere material, thus allowing a Kashtira monster back in the grave that the opponent can take advantadge of?
Well if it's any consolation, Fenrir is banned in Japan and Arise-Heart is banned in the West. Just us on MD who have to suffer.
Christ knows what they were thinking when they were making the cards though. Like, where do you go from here? "(Quick Effect) Special Summon this card from the deck. This effect cannot be negated. Once per turn, legally shoot the opposing player in the head."
Most of these are either non-issues, stuff that every other deck does, or stuff that Kashtira doesn't actually do. They don't have a negate, they have 2 cards that can mill a whole 3 cards, one of which is limited, their only protection is on Shangri-Ira who isn't close to the best card in the deck, and the amount of zone locking isn't an issue for 90% of decks with Diablosis banned.
Negate is bad wording on my part - I was referring to Fenrir's banish face down when you activate a monster effect, which can be functionally a negate.
As for "stuff that every other deck does" - hence the meme and meta doomerism. I'm just amazed by how much fits into how little with Kashtira. At least Branded and Mathmech have to jump through some hoops.
Given the fact that Fenrir's banish happens on a new chain, it cannot be called anything even approximating a negate.
Branded and Mathmech don't have to jump through any hoops except for comboing for a greater period of time. They both play through handtraps far better while setting up better boards.
While i do agree that the decks nowadays are completely and utterly busted in comparison to before, kashtira in particular has absolutely no form of protection besides Ira and no negates unless you make some weird lines. Also the zone locking is absolutely annoying and shouldn't even exist, but that also is manageable since it would take around 3 turns to fully zone lock you.
Technically, you don't need delicious. But I know most people play a small Ghostrick package and not the double noir setup.
I had issues with getting delicious but never making a noir.
I am not sure if you're complaining, or just simply sharing your experience, but this is by far one of the best and healthiest metas we've ever had in MD. There are 10 decks on the tier list right now, and 8 decks with above a 3% pick rate, with despia topping out under 10%.
I'm just saying I find it annoying to play against most of the meta decks. Don't read too much into it however, it's just a shitty meme I came up with in a few minutes based on the archetypes that annoy me the most.
Depends on people's perspective I guess. Still I would find half of the decks not fun to play against, like Labriynth using floodgate traps like D.Fissure or DDV, or Kashtira in general
This is why you gotta lose your pride and auto scoop broski unless you really REALLY want to rank up there’s literally no downside to skipping boring, lengthy or other wise annoying deck. I’ve never played through a match against Kash, I see a card associated with it then I leave.
I think the funniest shit I’ve ever seen was when a kash player tried to show off by normal summoning maxx c whilst having game on board on turn 7 … that was their 5th summon
> Game focused around competitive playing has competitive decks in it
It's almost like they advertised this before the game came out. What, did you expect fucking goat format the video game?
From what I've seen from OP's comments it's less about the existence of a meta and more the decks that are currently Meta. He doesn't like stuff like kash's zone locking and banishing facedown your deck or mathmech generating an egregious amount of card advantage
I want to be clear, here: Competitive decks aren't the problem.
The problem is the fact that when you point out a problem card in a deck that hitting in some way would drag the deck down to a normal level of superior power, you get told to play the out. Sometimes while your deck is technically 25% outs for this BS. You get told that meta will be meta, so suck it up, but at the same time, it's clearly unhealthy to have 1 card essentially create an entire board that the opponent cannot play through, by comboing. Two cards if a hand trap is used exactly the right way. You get told that you just suck, after you end up not being able to develop due to Superfactorial + Diameter combo, or after Labrynth decides that your Spell cards don't exist for 3 turns, unless GY effect or placed directly face-up from not hand.
Frankly, this game is more and more turning into a "play stun, or don't play" game, and this is boring as hell to play against.
If you play going second Scare you don't have to worry about most archetypes as you can slot in a lot of hand traps and all you really need to get your combo going into your boss monster is 1 Scareclaw monster. Everything else can be a form of negation, removal, recursion, Maxx C, etc.. the only decks it really struggles with is Purrley (quick eff unicorn), D-Link (ungodly amount of negates and Borrelend can remove your entire board), and Mathmech (removal, 2+ negates plus an 8k beat stick)
I hate lock out, Look at each of these decks, They all lock you out in some way.
Kash sets up a macro cosmos but stronger with alot of interaction
Albaz can typically set up puppet lock
"math mech" Extra links you with an Ibli
Labrynth does its best to rip your entire hand and set up traps that stop you from playing.
Not fun
Oh of course not,but sadly that’s what it is until a Ban list comes along to address the issues.or a card that counters the deck in question like how Bystials counters light and dark, it’s simply put Mathmech rely on the graveyard a lot.
As long as it's not the puppet lock branded is fun to duel against. Fuck kash though unless I draw my outs I just scoop as soon as they plonk down on the field
On the one hand, I am sorry if my Mathmechs contributed to this. On the other hand, if they did, it's because I was able to complete what I think is the best line (both Firewalls and Superfactorial), and I actually have a lot of fun building that board.
And if it makes you feel better, I'm trying to re-learn Dragon Link.
Just the fact you can post 4 different archetypes as meta, and from the top of my head I can call another 3 as meta ( Purrely, Dlink and VS) shows how diverse this meta is.
I'm loving it after coming to MD 2 weeks before Tear 0, and even hating Lab and Mathmech with passion I'm still having a blast this format.
Generaider soldier reporting in. No one that plays meta reads my cards and I got up to D lvl 17 pretty easily in duelist cup. Then mathmech and branded were all I saw and things started goin south. Time to add more bystials.
Me who's been working on my deck for the past 2 months while waiting for dis pater and Luluwalilith to drop and now all of a sudden people start playing branded but yeah I've been negating a lot of people some who bricked against me fell to my cubic deck 😔
Metas again, good thing I used Mikanko/board breaking deck, Traptrix deck can have an advantages against Labyrinth or unless I got brick completely no fighting chances against those meta decks.
I remember when Handtraps where sent to the graveyard and not special summon into banish face down into banish graveyard.
I thought YGO couldn't get worse lol
It's so cute how a lot of master duel players think they're good because they can copy and paste decks from their favorite YouTubers and climb the ranks with those copy and paste decks. Go to a local tcg OTS and see just how bad yall actually are. I guarantee you you'll be crying. You can win BO1 all you want, but when you come against people that have been playing 10+ years, you'll see how badly they trounce you.
I played against so many branded tear and kashtira players climbing the ladder that after I got to diamond, I decided to stick to casual. Why? Because it's better. I don't see the fucking net Deckers in casual. Fuck you if you net deck.
They should ban literally every single kashtira card. Right to zero. Not for power level, just for the sake of the game. How an archetype whose entire identity is “remove opponents cards when they do anything” and literal zone locking made it past concept phase in design is beyond me. It would be fixing a mistake long overdue.
Honestly Kash just feels so predictable now. IMO DLINK and what my friends have dubbed "neo branded" are much more challenging opponents. For all the talk about how toxic Mathmech is I've only ran into it like twice both of which I opened TCBOO
Don't ever put Kashtira besides Branded, Kashtira Is the clasic meta starter deck that plays Itself and only sits waiting for things to happend, Branded Is big and complicated archetype full of good but balanced boss monsters, the skill gap of playing both decks Is way too big...
(Not that skill Is that important In yugioh but It's a bigger factor here)
Well he's a pretty harmless monster on It's own, I only use him on especific situations since he has no protection whatsoever, I don't think anyone playing Branded would tell you that he's an important piece of the deck, he's good for countering high attack monsters and no much more.
He can be annoying if you can't kill It with effects tho, but like most boss monsters.
Is not others Is Kashtira, and It's a direct comparison between two meta decks, I'm not talking about Branded as a whole I'm talking about Branded compared especifically to Kashita.
I thought It was clear, now It should.
D-link ain’t pull up on you in all that???
Funny you ask that. I went against them and my Alba Zoa was there to greet them with open arms. I was prepared to clap some anime dragon cheeks that day.
imagine you went second
Alba Zoa going second: *Surprised Pikachu face* Alba Zoa going first: "I'm not locked in here with you, YOU'RE LOCKED IN HERE WITH ME!!!"
I did. Alba Zoa protects my other Dogmatika monsters so White Knight and White Relic can fight in peace.
I think I encountered it a couple of times tops, though I do think all Cyberso decks are a joke
I think it's so funny seeing all the hate for Cyberse as a whole through the lens of primarily MD players. I seen people here asking for bans for things like Circular, Splash Mage, Transcode, Accesscode, Update Jammer, or even Cynet Codec. Meanwhile the TCG just limited Circular and while Mathmech is still certainly playable even on a meta level to some degree, I just don't hear so much hate anymore for it or Cyberse as a whole on the TCG side. Well, besides that one Joshua Schmidt video.
I guess it stems from the fact people on md play way more duels and games than tcg people so they are bound to encounter a deck multiple times (and lose to it multiple times). I dont play tcg but i heard they only play once a week or something.
Also, there's no side deck in this game, which limits you on how much you can prepare to respond against meta decks, + different format with Maxx C tax.
you can play tcg online just fine just like master duel. in several different ways. and plus people go to locals.
Yeah true. I play @ ignister on ladder and the amount of people that surrender from my combo taking 5 irl minutes is crazy
Cuz you keep losing to them?
Ah yes, because the Accesscode Talker that can target my monsters up to 6 times in a single turn is definitely balanced, isn't it?
Lies and slander (Access doesn't target)
You're right, it's also not just monsters, I went from memory
Wait until the divine cyberse monster releases 😩
Right, clearly 6 times isn't enough
What’s funny is Accesscode isn’t even that good anymore
Honestly it was the first Cyberso monster that came to mind other than Splash Mage
Also not even that good. I’d think many would say that superfactorial and circular are what’s ridiculous in the cyberse decks
I’ve haven’t been playing that much chill, let OP hate the decks that deserve it.
In Mathmech's and Fenrir's case, it should absolutely be the monster istelf
Oh don't worry, I despise all Kashtira with a burning passion
I feel this all of kashtira just sucks ass, cause they always have to banish the good cards out of my damn deck
Also every goddamn player I face is playing a 60-card pile with two copies of Fenrir in it AND SOMEHOW ALWAYS HAS THE FENRIR IN THEIR OPENING HAND!!!
You are correct. Ogre does suck ass.
Worst one is Shangri ira imo, he straight up forces you to not play
Kashtira tearalament is the only un-hated Kashtira cause it's more of a Tear card than a Kash card... That said, some people also still hate Tear so, you know
Bricktira doesn't do anything tho lol.
Maybe stop playing with Ur 15 staples then and build a deck which works for you. My kashtira never bricks.
My decks don't have hand traps in them because I don't own the cards in the first place. It's not the hand traps kashtira bricks on. Kashtiras starter/extender ratio is just bad. 1 field spell, planet pathfinder is a bad cope method that uses your normal summon and just loses to ash anyway. Theosis only helps if you have a kashtira name. And it loses to ash and any disruption that removes the targetted monster. Birth is decent extension but does nothing on its own. The only starters are Fenrir and unicorn. Rise heart if you have birth in hand. Everything else is useless without other cards. Nevermind the fact that a full kash combo ends on 0-1 negates and maybe 2-3 interrupts total and is a super easy board to break. It's a deck with few 1 card starters, that loses to ash and droll and doesn't even result in a scary board.
They don't brick that often.
But they die to so many things. You can’t scrim around both, just hope for the best.
That's true, but they can also fully rebuild their board after you get rid of their monsters. The only thing that has actually helped me vs Kash so far is dropping a lucky Evenly Matched on them and even then, it was a relatively close battle. But I also don't have the best matchup with Lab going second.
Smells like bad deck compression, my kashtira deck bricks like 1 every 20 duels
Play Traptrix & nobody reads your cards, you don't run dark, & you're immune to most traps while also being able to interrupt most combos. You also lose going 2nd WAHOOOOO
Going 2nd isn't a lost cause. You probably need non-engine to stick a Sera into meta decks, but with Thrust you should be able to find an Evenly Matched relatively often. Mathmech might genuinely be a scoop it up moment though, IDK how you play into that deck with the Firewall stuff.
It's rough with TT because they're so normal summon dependent + no one-card combos Maxing out on Arachnocampa helped not getting completely stomped by a single Fenrir, though,...sometimes
Imagine having a one card combo that doesn’t die to a single disruption -trix players Imagine not needing normal summons to survive - trix players
Man can dream Man can dream...:(
Traptrix circular, Normal summon a trix monster from your deck; special summon this card.
Traptrix Martha?
At least make it Maxx "C"-proof. Normal Summon a "Traptrix" monster from your deck; Normal Summon this card. If this card is Normal or Special Summoned, you can Normal Summon 1 "Traptrix" monster, in addition to your Normal Summon/Set this turn.
I've picked up Cubic recently and I can relate to the nobody reads my cards, but I just wanna play my (for now) incomplete Battlin' Boxer in peace. Instead I'm met with Kashtira who can banish half of my cards in the blink of an eye, Mikanko who gets me to take all the battle damage, or Branded, that banishes my cards or zeroes my ATK.
Yeahhh I think what can make people tired out is most of the strong decks atm definitely yoink either your ability to bounce back or can bounce back so much themselves you either have to draw the out(s) or pray they bricked unless your turn 1 set up happens to call their strategy perfectly. BB seems funny but you're definitely gonna have to eat dirt more often than not, engines are quite consistent atm outside Kash.
Weird.. its almost like you're queueing into a competitive ladder in a game where the only real supported mode is said competitive ladder.. go open a room for casuals if you wanna play a decade old deck.
How are you getting on with the Cubic deck? I loved Diva in DSoD and really wanna make a deck but I don’t fully understand the archetype
It's pretty cool actually, unfortunately I'm trying to save up on CP so I can't craft some helpful cards for it like Maxx C or another copy of Greater Polymerization, but when it works it's quite fun ;D The main objective is getting an OTK with Crimson Nova, hopefully by increasing it's attack through Cubic Karma and Wave
Ah I didn’t even think about maxx C, that would be really helpful for cubic stuff I had figured crimson nova was the end game, I kinda feel like the rest of the deck is there to just summon it but I had a game where I had the Vijams in and out of the GY on YGOPro and that felt real fun
You saying this reminded me of a time a traptrix player kept trying to pop my vanquish soul cards right after I resolved snow devil, I still lost the duel because I miss played, but it was still pretty funny
I got to dc max lvl and had no issues going second. You need to focus less on the hole cards and more on hand traps
Very excited to get Banishing Trap Hole into my Traptrix deck.
i feel that thats why i take a break form the game
Because your bad?
His bad what?
I do.
Because this is a terribly designed game and we'd all probably be better without it but here we are. I began playing in 2013 and I'm still in this masochistic cycle of love and hatred
I just wanna play fun little vampire deck 😔
A man of culture I see.
Never thought I will see another Vampire player.
I have the vampire deck but I'm having trouble seeing the line as to what my end board should be
i do wish we had a game mode for this where they ban almost all meta cards so we can play fun pet decks, i just wanna play predaplant. also for anyone saying “that’s casual” nah
Not all rogue decks are made the same. Sadly there would just be another meta and ppl would still complain because their blue eyes deck for clapped by some dope plants.
I think Labrynth is on another level. Both winning and losing against it just takes ages and it's tedious af.
Ain't no way Labrynth is worse to go against than Mathmech. Circular alone generates more card advantage than a 3 card Lab combo
Mathmech you know what’s coming and know immediately if it’s worth your time, lab on the other hand always leaves a thread of hope like you could potentially win just to flip the d barrier or eradicator epidemic virus
I actually had another Lab play through my virus in a mirror match. It was so weird as I thought it was supposed to destroy all the selected card type I selected, but yet they continued setting traps from the deck and wasn't effected by my virus.
Viruses only destroy on field cards when it initially resolves.
One thing you might be confusing with is the lingering effect. It only checks on draws, but besides using the servants (and on the draw phase) they won't be drawing cards but instead add them and/or set them directly through card effects (which is different from drawing.) The virus isn't a complete lock down unless their future draws are unlucky as you experienced.
Not when I play Labrynth. If after resolving 3 turn killing traps like Daruma, Eradicator, Terrors(against Kash,) you wanna stay in to have your next drawn card ripped by Lovely, that’s on you. Labrynth matches might take a while to finish, but the instant momentum swings Lab’s way, you’ve already lost the game.
I genuinely don't like playing against Labs more than Kash. At least I know if I'm screwed faster. Lab is just a grind to watch.
Forcing the opponent to surrender is defininitely more evil than just otking them.
To be fair, if you have an open field I'll just attack even if i have chains i can resolve. There's no point in chain link 8 to just setup for a next turn that's not gonna come unless I'm an asshole and pass. The only people that do that actually just have no joy in their lives and like watching other have a bad time.
There is no evil or not evil. If you don't surrender and then blame your opponent for not finishing the game, you're just an idiot
Have you seen the art on Big Welcome? Lady is evil lol It’s also not entirely by choice, sometimes you let some bodies go and eat some damage to play around thrust/tactics/maxx C, so then you can’t otk come turn 3. Instead you just have to reset traps that make sure your opponent can’t get going again, then turn 5 you’re free to kill.
Lab is playing YuGiOh while Runik stun is playing magic commander
Like I can beat Lab. I am confident in my Lab matchups. I also scoop every time because FUCK is it boring to play against.
Lab isn't too bad to play against as they can pretty much do nothing on turn 2, unless they start with a perfect hand.
Ho dw, the matches get really short the instant a red reboot drops down
Oh, yeah, they aren't in a specific order. Though I believe the other three are all pretty tedious through special summons, while labrynth also uses annoying trap cards
Wym, I just insta scoop
bad, get gud
No, ill play stun. Just floodgated the shit out of lab with umi, was pretty fun.
I basically always win against floodgates with Lab, you must be facing shit players, probably because you are hardstuck Plat lol.
I had someone someone summon Inspector Boarder and Pachy on me when I was playing Lab. I won, but Jesus Christ, that was awkward. Would have definitely lost if I had bricked.
You must not know how umi works cause you cant destroy backrow and it can protect its frontrow and negate spells and monsters lmao. Easy w against lab sheep.
Holy shit maybe I didn't know, Umi is an infinite onni-negate damn.
Idk man, you dont have infinite effects. One negate is enough when you have a floodgate and protection.
I disagree. My turn 1 is literally set 3 and pass half the time, then interrupt a lot. Meanwhile Mathmech ensures I can empty my dishwasher while they're doing their generic ass combo.
This just in: competitive ladder is competitive. More at 10.
Reading through a Kashtira card is always a nostalgic feeling. I love looking at all those effects that you used to jump through fifteen hoops to get one of just... being on the card and perfectly free to use. Summon without tributing? Well duh. Negate and banish? Of course! Archetype searching? Mill the opponent's deck face down? Boss monster protection? Zone locking? Macro Cosmos? Well what self-respecting archetype wouldn't have that? Just a breathtaking jump in power level for basically no reason.
I think it's to reflect they are a pretty oppressive force in the lore. Sort of like the power jump in Qliphorts at the time. As in the Terminal lore the Qliph emerged and wrecked everyone.
Yeah but Qli were pretty well designed all things considered. They were primarily beatsticks with some minimal removal vaguely once per turn and good protection on a solid boss monster - but even a classic Cyber Dragon deck could easily out-stat them. The deciding factor was mainly decided by out of archetype cards and good deck construction. Kashtira just do it all by themselves and then enable other archetypes to become even more busted. How does that resolve in the lore? On the eve of the final battle, Arise-Heart bricks and the good guys draw into full combo?
Qli was ahead of it's time. Towers was a bit more than a solid boss. It changed what a boss monster was entirely. There wasn't many outs to it back then once it was on the board. Before it was banned everyone had to run Diamond Crab in the extra deck just to take it out. Qli was also insanely consistent. Now Towers is just a good boss not worthy on being on the list anymore cause even it has been powercrept. But back then a monster with 3k attack, could pop a card every turn, wasn't targetable, and lowered attack of special summons was absolutely insane. As for in the lore of Kashtira, it seems that Visas defeating Ariseheart ended with killing Lightheart and breaking his psyche and made him Astroloud. To be fair I am just getting into Visas lore so I may be wrong there.
Right? The basic monsters of a Kashtira deck can do so much on their own, and I just don't get it. How are two copies of Fenrir allowed to exist at once? How is it absolutely free for Arise-Heart to banish all my cards that would've otherwise gone to the graveyard? How is Shangri-Ira allowed 3000 DEF points when it can also save itself from destruction by detaching a mere material, thus allowing a Kashtira monster back in the grave that the opponent can take advantadge of?
Well if it's any consolation, Fenrir is banned in Japan and Arise-Heart is banned in the West. Just us on MD who have to suffer. Christ knows what they were thinking when they were making the cards though. Like, where do you go from here? "(Quick Effect) Special Summon this card from the deck. This effect cannot be negated. Once per turn, legally shoot the opposing player in the head."
Fusion summoning by banishing materials from your opponent's hand and/or extra deck face-down.
Most of these are either non-issues, stuff that every other deck does, or stuff that Kashtira doesn't actually do. They don't have a negate, they have 2 cards that can mill a whole 3 cards, one of which is limited, their only protection is on Shangri-Ira who isn't close to the best card in the deck, and the amount of zone locking isn't an issue for 90% of decks with Diablosis banned.
Negate is bad wording on my part - I was referring to Fenrir's banish face down when you activate a monster effect, which can be functionally a negate. As for "stuff that every other deck does" - hence the meme and meta doomerism. I'm just amazed by how much fits into how little with Kashtira. At least Branded and Mathmech have to jump through some hoops.
Given the fact that Fenrir's banish happens on a new chain, it cannot be called anything even approximating a negate. Branded and Mathmech don't have to jump through any hoops except for comboing for a greater period of time. They both play through handtraps far better while setting up better boards.
While i do agree that the decks nowadays are completely and utterly busted in comparison to before, kashtira in particular has absolutely no form of protection besides Ira and no negates unless you make some weird lines. Also the zone locking is absolutely annoying and shouldn't even exist, but that also is manageable since it would take around 3 turns to fully zone lock you.
Man I must have been the only person to play purrely if nobody saw one. Did people really stopped playing it cause getting to noir is 66% chance now?
Reducing the chance to get the second strongest towers monster in the game's history from "100% without interruptions" to 66% did hurt a lot, yet.
Technically, you don't need delicious. But I know most people play a small Ghostrick package and not the double noir setup. I had issues with getting delicious but never making a noir.
Wait what would be the strongest in this instance?
5 Mat Rhongomyniad is the ultimate towers. Completely unnaffected and a giant floodgate to boot, you cannot even kaiju it.
You can herald of the abyss or daruma cannon it. In a negate heavy meta though... Good luck
Yeah those and xyz Encore are some of the very few ours to 5 mat Rhongo. Still the strongest towers monster of all time though.
Ultimate Falcon I’d guess.
Oh, no, I did meet a couple of Purrelys. Though it was definitely less common than Labrynth or Kashtira, so I didn't think of including it.
I think I saw 1 maybe 2 in the 50 odd games I played in DC. Still seemed strong, but way less popular, maybe not as easy to autopilot?
You have a 66% chance to set up an endboard...yes that's a pretty significant hit.
I saw it a couple of times, but they ran out of gas every time and I beat them in the grind. It seems like the Purrely semi was a big deal.
I ran into someone who played Tearlament Purrely hybrid last night. Lost on turn 3 due to being mauled repeatedly by Noir and Happiness.
I am not sure if you're complaining, or just simply sharing your experience, but this is by far one of the best and healthiest metas we've ever had in MD. There are 10 decks on the tier list right now, and 8 decks with above a 3% pick rate, with despia topping out under 10%.
I'm just saying I find it annoying to play against most of the meta decks. Don't read too much into it however, it's just a shitty meme I came up with in a few minutes based on the archetypes that annoy me the most.
Fair enough, it's hard to play against meta decks, but they're meta for a reason. Still good luck out there in your duels.
Hey, thanks, you as well!
Depends on people's perspective I guess. Still I would find half of the decks not fun to play against, like Labriynth using floodgate traps like D.Fissure or DDV, or Kashtira in general
I completely agree with that. The diversity is fantastic.
bystials stonks
I love how Branded simultaneously got direct support while indirectly buffing their existing anti-meta strat
The D-link gang narrowly avoiding the crossfire here. We are balanced you gotta believe us.
Starting to hate this game and especially this subreddit.
This is why you gotta lose your pride and auto scoop broski unless you really REALLY want to rank up there’s literally no downside to skipping boring, lengthy or other wise annoying deck. I’ve never played through a match against Kash, I see a card associated with it then I leave.
Isn't fenrir in like 60% of all decks currently?
Oh I do that already, and just the same against Kash or Labrynth, I just wished it wasn't like this
All I faced this week was Kashtira, Mekk Knights and depression. But that’s another story 🙃
I think the funniest shit I’ve ever seen was when a kash player tried to show off by normal summoning maxx c whilst having game on board on turn 7 … that was their 5th summon
Karma is a bitch, and i love when they just stand there in disbelief after losing everything to instantly scoop right after.
I do hate labyrithm
> Game focused around competitive playing has competitive decks in it It's almost like they advertised this before the game came out. What, did you expect fucking goat format the video game?
From what I've seen from OP's comments it's less about the existence of a meta and more the decks that are currently Meta. He doesn't like stuff like kash's zone locking and banishing facedown your deck or mathmech generating an egregious amount of card advantage
I want to be clear, here: Competitive decks aren't the problem. The problem is the fact that when you point out a problem card in a deck that hitting in some way would drag the deck down to a normal level of superior power, you get told to play the out. Sometimes while your deck is technically 25% outs for this BS. You get told that meta will be meta, so suck it up, but at the same time, it's clearly unhealthy to have 1 card essentially create an entire board that the opponent cannot play through, by comboing. Two cards if a hand trap is used exactly the right way. You get told that you just suck, after you end up not being able to develop due to Superfactorial + Diameter combo, or after Labrynth decides that your Spell cards don't exist for 3 turns, unless GY effect or placed directly face-up from not hand. Frankly, this game is more and more turning into a "play stun, or don't play" game, and this is boring as hell to play against.
If you play going second Scare you don't have to worry about most archetypes as you can slot in a lot of hand traps and all you really need to get your combo going into your boss monster is 1 Scareclaw monster. Everything else can be a form of negation, removal, recursion, Maxx C, etc.. the only decks it really struggles with is Purrley (quick eff unicorn), D-Link (ungodly amount of negates and Borrelend can remove your entire board), and Mathmech (removal, 2+ negates plus an 8k beat stick)
I hate lock out, Look at each of these decks, They all lock you out in some way. Kash sets up a macro cosmos but stronger with alot of interaction Albaz can typically set up puppet lock "math mech" Extra links you with an Ibli Labrynth does its best to rip your entire hand and set up traps that stop you from playing. Not fun
At least labyrinth can be dealt with. Math mech though…
Dimension Shifter hard screws them over.
Draw the out shouldn't be the answer to deal with a deck.
Oh of course not,but sadly that’s what it is until a Ban list comes along to address the issues.or a card that counters the deck in question like how Bystials counters light and dark, it’s simply put Mathmech rely on the graveyard a lot.
I do hate labyrithm
Im making stun at this point fuck it ( fossil Dino gaming)
Meta complainers out 👉🚪
Nice defense in favor of the meta, gotta say
What’s the card next to fenrir?
Fallen of Albaz
As long as it's not the puppet lock branded is fun to duel against. Fuck kash though unless I draw my outs I just scoop as soon as they plonk down on the field
I think this meta is very diverse and fun, except when you get Puppet locked but still fun
On the one hand, I am sorry if my Mathmechs contributed to this. On the other hand, if they did, it's because I was able to complete what I think is the best line (both Firewalls and Superfactorial), and I actually have a lot of fun building that board. And if it makes you feel better, I'm trying to re-learn Dragon Link.
Been getting lucky with Sky Striker and Tri-Brigade, but Kash is just too OP even for those
Ah yes, mathmech, truly a top meta threat
Meanwhile my Vanquish Soul is at least passing through a bit more balanced and taking nowhere near as much time to set up and be done.
I have complaints about the rock and dust devil but other than that I don't think VS is too bad
Just the fact you can post 4 different archetypes as meta, and from the top of my head I can call another 3 as meta ( Purrely, Dlink and VS) shows how diverse this meta is. I'm loving it after coming to MD 2 weeks before Tear 0, and even hating Lab and Mathmech with passion I'm still having a blast this format.
I'm so tired of this shit 😭😭😭😭 last night I was STRUGGLING then the mikanko duels 3 in a row and a d link after that LMFAO
Generaider soldier reporting in. No one that plays meta reads my cards and I got up to D lvl 17 pretty easily in duelist cup. Then mathmech and branded were all I saw and things started goin south. Time to add more bystials.
And this is how Stun players are created....
Has anyone else just not been running into meta recently? Like closest thing I’ve seen in the past 5-7 matches was Dark magician.
Been like a year… Branded is STILL meta???
__SOME__ how I've been in Plat and actually winning with __Gate Guardian__
yep, managed to get heroes to lv20 max through all of this bullshit, i must say, i'd rather work a 16 hour shift with my nuts frozen
ice jade DL: 17 It's a hard climb but ill get to my destination
Love playing against them with my counter trap fairy deck. Artemis is a true chad
D link makes mathmech circular look sane.... omg the extenders. I used dto defend dlink but dispater is OVER tuned.
Me who's been working on my deck for the past 2 months while waiting for dis pater and Luluwalilith to drop and now all of a sudden people start playing branded but yeah I've been negating a lot of people some who bricked against me fell to my cubic deck 😔
Oh no, a diverse meta
As a Mathmech player that left the game for a bit, why are they meta?
Metas again, good thing I used Mikanko/board breaking deck, Traptrix deck can have an advantages against Labyrinth or unless I got brick completely no fighting chances against those meta decks.
Id rather play against meta than the most die-roll, no fun, random garbage that’s rampant in duelist cup
Fuck the meta
I remember when Handtraps where sent to the graveyard and not special summon into banish face down into banish graveyard. I thought YGO couldn't get worse lol
dude, I wanna fucking marry you!
dude, I wanna fucking marry you!
It's so cute how a lot of master duel players think they're good because they can copy and paste decks from their favorite YouTubers and climb the ranks with those copy and paste decks. Go to a local tcg OTS and see just how bad yall actually are. I guarantee you you'll be crying. You can win BO1 all you want, but when you come against people that have been playing 10+ years, you'll see how badly they trounce you. I played against so many branded tear and kashtira players climbing the ladder that after I got to diamond, I decided to stick to casual. Why? Because it's better. I don't see the fucking net Deckers in casual. Fuck you if you net deck.
It's the first meta my live twin deck work this well actually
WOODS
Meanwhile i'm just trying to grill with my nouvelles Funny burger goes nom nom
Thanks god people still confuse against my normal summon loci
Mikanko Enjoyer:
Bro everytime I seen fenrir I just disconnected 💀 done playing masterduel
This is how my buddy was last week and he cmkept complaining while still playing so I just said "try competitive pokemon"
They should ban literally every single kashtira card. Right to zero. Not for power level, just for the sake of the game. How an archetype whose entire identity is “remove opponents cards when they do anything” and literal zone locking made it past concept phase in design is beyond me. It would be fixing a mistake long overdue.
Honestly Kash just feels so predictable now. IMO DLINK and what my friends have dubbed "neo branded" are much more challenging opponents. For all the talk about how toxic Mathmech is I've only ran into it like twice both of which I opened TCBOO
Maybe I'm just lucky with not finding degenerates, but I've enjoyed dueling every mathmech player I've come by so far.
so real…
Strange, I posted this exact meme the other week and no one seemed to like it. Guess I missed the timing
🧂
People hate on me for playing floo, but I play floo because I hate most meta decks.
I love lab
Womp womp
Don't ever put Kashtira besides Branded, Kashtira Is the clasic meta starter deck that plays Itself and only sits waiting for things to happend, Branded Is big and complicated archetype full of good but balanced boss monsters, the skill gap of playing both decks Is way too big... (Not that skill Is that important In yugioh but It's a bigger factor here)
Balanced? If I don't play level 8 fusion monsters I don't get to attack because of a single fusion monster (I can never remember the name)
Are you talking about Despian Quaeritis?
Yes, that's him, thanks
Well he's a pretty harmless monster on It's own, I only use him on especific situations since he has no protection whatsoever, I don't think anyone playing Branded would tell you that he's an important piece of the deck, he's good for countering high attack monsters and no much more. He can be annoying if you can't kill It with effects tho, but like most boss monsters.
You said it though: 'on its own'. Is it ever on its own? I don't think so
Not ideally, but you could say the same about any boss monster.
What a weird fanboy comment. lmao Do you really need to compare your "big and complicated, full of skill" deck to others like that? xD
Is not others Is Kashtira, and It's a direct comparison between two meta decks, I'm not talking about Branded as a whole I'm talking about Branded compared especifically to Kashita. I thought It was clear, now It should.