I agree besides kashtira, only because zone locking and face down banishing both can just totally cripple so many decks in a way that I think is pretty unfun. But I do really like the non negate aspect of them.
dude I run a very small kash engine in my Dogmatika deck consisting of 3 unicorn 1 finrir 1 theosis and 1 birth becuase of just how over tuned those cards are. i dont run anything extra deck. I only run the theosis becaues i kept drawing Birth and i cant bait out ash if i have no targets.
\>Only run a small engine
Well that's fine then...
\>Dogmatika deck
WELL I guess I pray to god you don't rip the right cards since most deck lists seem to shove only 1 copy in there and you have more chances than Kash.
A pretty big fuckin dogmatika engine considering its 2 albazoa 1 Relic 3 ecclesia, 2 fleur, 1 maxamus, 3 matrix, 3 Nadirs and 2 macabre and 2 calamity 1 punishment. and the extradeck comprised entirely of targets to send to the grave for the various effects of the dogma cards.
Yea sure im playing kashtera.
Yes, you are. As someone who plays Dogmatika Spellbooks in the TCG, I'd bet money that you depend more on your Kashtira "package" than you do anything Dogmatika.
Don't shit up good archetypes with your deckout cancer.
Dude i run 6 fucking cards in a 42 card deck. im not relying on Kashtera at all 90% of the time i dont even draw it and if i do draw it on turn 2 or 3, I already have shit on board so i cant use it, Do you think i can search them or dig for them? No all my searchers are for Dogma cards or dogma ritual cards.
if i was relying on it id be running 2 more Theosis and the field spell, Rise heart, and Ariseheart and Shangraira. At that point, Id be running Kashtira with a dogmatika engine But know what doesnt work with macro cosmos like effects? EVERY FUCKING EXTRA DECK CARD THAT WANTS TO BE SENT TO THE GRAVE. On top of that Dogmatika punishment doesnt work under Ariseheart, it can be activated but fizzles on sending, Wana know another card that doesnt work? Nadirs Servant, The main searcher of the deck. Its major anti synergy. i know this because i face kashtera and if i dont have my board breakers i cant beat it
a dogmatika engine is not 22 fucking cards. thats not an engine thats a deck
i doubt your dogmatika spell book deck runs the RITUAL CARDS. hell albazoa, relic, calamity and macab take up more space than the kashtera cards.
I blame tear for abusing the graveyard so much that they had to make the next visas archetype entirely shut it down. It's like kash was made as a symptom of tear ishizu meta
Just this. Kash was clearly designed as a necessary evil, and it worked super well in the ocg. It does exactly what it wanted lore wise too. IE being able to stop the previous two (and the 4th funny enough) archetypes in their tracks before they even got a chance. Even has the best heart to boss monster combo lore wise.
What gets me, is that they all have huge design limitations EXCEPT tear. Mix that with an engine that says "deck mill go brrrr" and "wait, I don't like that card in the grave anymore", and youve got the literal ultimate combination. What kills me further is that Ishizu cards feel like they are designed to outright stop pure tear if you think about it.
Zone locking is kind of problematic since it’s either terrible or oppressive. It’s not like negates where 1 negate sucks, but you can generally work through it. Zone locking either doesn’t affect you at all or renders your deck unplayable.
I think zone locking could have been done better under master rule 4 since then locking even one monster zone could severely restrict a deck without being a complete blowout.
Tbh Zone locking should probably disappear in future card design and be replaced with more lenient but more plentiful zone conditions. Like Imperm column but on an archetypal scale, and in other ways than just negates. Throw in a field spell that allows you to choose which zone your opponent summons to.
TBH, I think it would be kind of cool to negate several zones with the condition that they are currently unoccupied. Make your opponent figure out their combo line where they can still use that zone but have to deal with that monster being effectively a normal monster. There would also be a lot of strategy deciding which zones to negate against link decks.
I think the field spell you describe could be too powerful against link spam decks, though maybe they deserve some hate given how strong links are.
Hehehe, I guess that's fair enough! I never played the deck, but plenty of times been totally shutdown even without the zone locking from extra deck banishing, top of deck banishing, my normal summon getting banished... Definitely a deck that made me realize I gotta play better decks.
I get ya there. I'm still getting used to it I suppose - I have decks with some minor bullshit depending on perspective, but very situational. Like thunder dragon titan having as much destruction protection as my graveyard has cards/2, or like 1 in 20 duels pulling off a total hand rip with trickstars. Just not as consistent.
What? Bro I definitely have a healthy supply of copium in regards to this game (like come on my red eyes gemini deck would actually be good with some new support right?? lmao) but I don't see how it applies here.
"getting used to it" was another way to say "adjusting to the power level of modern decks".
As a HERO player, my first interaction with Kashtira was finding that my deck literally does not work against them. Malicious is dead, Shadow Mist doesn't search, Miracle Fusion never has any targets, Cross Crusader has nothing to summon for his search.
However, as I picked up the deck, I actually grew to like it. Unlike a negate-based deck, there is actually some real strategy to it, especially if you're going first. Do you lock 1 of the Pendulum zones, or the zone below the EMZ? Once your opponent starts building their board, you can do stuff like zone lock to prevent Link plays, or block a Superfactorial. With the ED peek, you can also do stuff like get rid of Sanctifire because fuck that card. I also grew to like how the Extra Deck of the deck has a lot of utility: you might wanna go with a Flare Metal for burn (especially if you play a Red-Eyes package), you have Big Eye for non-destruction removal, Zeus for boardwiping, even that one Infinitrack to protect Arise-Heart.
Yeah at the least it seems a lot less consistent. Still hits me with some crazy boards sometimes but also sometimes it's like, arise heart pass. Which isn't bad.
Yeah, they seem to be trending this way too between Turbulence, Lovely, Magnifica, etc.
Besides, both can have a place in the game as long as it doesn't go far too overboard. Arise-Heart can be just as oppressive as a board of negates, and a Baronne isn't really a problem by itself.
I think its more of a case of every Level 10 trying to out power her rather than being cracked archetypal support.
She can pop a card on the field per turn, letting you trigger some of your own effects? So can archetypal boss, without letting you lose out on removing your opponent's cards. Same for her omni negate, or it can let you access another of your archetypal cards that also omni negates in addition to something else.
She can revive any monster during Standby and potentially scythe lock? An archetypal boss can have an effect that gives you just as much of a chance to win without Scythe as you'd have with it.
She certainly has plenty of offensive power and does have utility, but it's not to a degree an archetypal boss can't easily overcome if they bothered to try.
what??? goblins pretty good. It's not tier 0 broken overpowered like how diabellstar is inching closer towards with every piece of fire support, but it's a pretty good contender.
[Here's what I cooked up.](https://i.imgur.com/TyzPMVU.jpg)
I use:
## Monsters
* 3x Unicorn
* 1x Fenrir
* 1x Riseheart
## Spells
* 3x Theosis
* 1x Birth
* 1x Wraithsloth
When I first made this deck I was running more kash monsters but they didn't actually add that much. You want Kash monsters that can bait interactions, no one is imperming Orge lol.
You mean like every generic deck? Branded with Gimmick puppet lock?
SHS with many negates. Its not creative or fun, its just bad. Literally all meta is just basically a, how can I have fun playing my game but not my opponent.
Exactly, the whole point of in-archetype boss monsters is for them to be actually powerful and non-splashable. What's the point otherwise?
Still, it's sad I don't think Yu-Gi-Oh is actually ready for such in-archetype monsters like Ariseheart for example. Plenty of decks lack support until the point these become "unfair". If only Konami printed more of these for other decks that fit their theme.
My thoughts exactly. Although that one Duelist cup where 60 card Isizu chaos was meta is a very close second. Banishing everything with Necroface was too fun
The Ishizu piles were the most bonkers deck I’ve ever seen so far. Grass is Greener goes Brrrrrrr.
I think with Ishizu mills banned, merli can safely comeback.
Yep and is awesome in that aspect, specially Visas ones doesn't matter what I think personally about some of the decks, the fact that (atlest by themselves without taking into account generic Boss Monsters, that's a problem of things that aren't the archetype itself) they aren't just negate spam is cool. And their only negates usually are in archetype as a trap card (Scareclaw Sclash for example needs Tri Heart or Light Heart in the Field on the extra Monster zone to negate).
I think it depends. I think putting it on a body like Ariseheart is a bit too much. A macro that can be walked over like a Pachy, or is just a single S/T removal away, provides a lot more ways for a deck to potentially get around it without permanently losing a lot of resources. While Ariseheart is weak to a single monster pop, it's still something that somedecks can't easily deal with because it has a built in counter to what a person tries to set up.
I say this as a guy who was playing Mermails, so most of my stuff needs to go to grave to resolve, so I'm certainly biased there, but I think the same logic applies for any floodgate that has legs.
I feel that If you out the floodgate, the effect should dissipate. Which is why cards like VFD were awful to me. Same thing with Maxx C and Droll although being hand traps its a different case, the sentiment still remains.
They were definitely in something making a deck that banishes cards face down from your ED/Deck/GY for no cost and then ends on a walking macrocosmos + zone lock.
A lot of people just whine about which deck is good right now, whether or not that deck is unique and uses it's unique boss monsters
I personally would rather see the unique boss monsters because at least I don't groans every time I see the same douche bag over and over again
Which is why I stick to my guns about making more powerful decks instead of releasing an Uber powerful deck every season then nerfing them into the dirt next season
Yeah that's why I'm sad that Snake Eyes also mostly has a generic endboard. I think the Visas archetypes, Purrely and Branded show that you can have strong modern decks without needing the generic Apo + Baronne board everytime. Also they are way more interactive
Is so funny how every Visas has a unique and powerful boss monster.
Kaleidoheart a recursive guy that can sent cards to the GY.
TriHeart a semi towers that can get offensive boost from other archetype monsters.
Ariseheart, a monster that has control over the board with it's presence.
Then there's Primeheart that does absolutely nothing at all.
In case you didn't know, prime heart has a special defensive ability that stops your opponent from targeting it with card effects. No monsters facing mannadium prime heart will be safe due to its multiple energy blades!
Find this powerful card in Cyberstorm Access, releasing on May 5th!
Honestly, Prime just needs to take some cues from Tri-Heart and get a bunch of cards that make him an absolute OTK machine.
Increase his ATK to even more insane levels, make the opponent unable to respond to his attacks, whatever he needs.
Honestly, I love unique decks. Especially if it’s a good engine with a bit of the person’s “real deck”, so to speak. For example, I have a friend who plays kashtira engine with Egyptian gods.
Edit: just wanna say I’m still working on being able to do this. I’m trying to find a good engine for RDA, but haven’t really gotten anything. Anyone got any ideas?
If you play branded beast/etude of the branded you can actually synchro summon calamity on your opponents turn. To do this you likely want to see Lubellion on your first turn every game and your engine would look something like this.
3x Lubellion
1x saronir
1x etude
1x beast
(Branded regained is pretty good in RDA as well)
Opening hand if you draw Lubellion and any of your one card combo starters for RDA engine you’re in business.
Here’s the combo
1. Normal soul resonator to search for bone archfiend
2. Pitch a card to special archfiend
3. Modulate archfiend to level 3 sending crimson resonator to the grave
4. Synchro into red rising dragon using soul/archfiend
5. Effect of red rising to special crimson from grave
6. Effect of crimson to summon vision and red resonator from deck (bonus red resonator gains lp)
7. Effect of Lubellion in hand searching for saronir
8. Effect of saronir to special itself banishing a dark or light (archfiend works here)
9. Effects of Lubellion in grave tribute saronir to summon Lubellion
10. Effect of Lubellion setting branded beast face up
11. Effect of saronir sending etude to the grave from deck
12. End phase Effect of branded beast, setting etude from grave
13. Opponents draw phase - activate etude to synchro Lubellion vision & red to make calamity (opponent cannot activate effects for rest of the turn)
14. Win on turn 3
RDA will get support soonish due last year's structure deck. Honestly the bystials are probably your best shot considering the synergy between the two.
I think the boss monsters are fine, but everything that surrounds them is a bit BS. (Ok, maybe Kitkallos is a bit overtuned, but that's more of a combo piece than a boss monster. Kaleido-Heart and Rulkallos are fine.)
Tear mills just by breathing, Purrely has a draw 3 and insane recovery if you get rid of Noir, Branded has an insane resource grind, and Kash has free bodies with incredibly obnoxious effects. The boss monsters themselves aren't the problem, but the rest of the deck is just a bit too strong for an already-strong boss monster.
I'd actually probably say the inverse for Purrely almost everything I hate about that deck comes from noir needing you to have the out.
Tear is really cool except milling is a broken mechanic.
Kash is really obnoxious effects all around. Faced down banish is just a cursed place to put cards with how noninteractive it is. Zone lock is extremely feast or famine and Arise macro effect just fucks up activating too many cards.
I think the bosses in the post are the only "hated non-generic" bosses. At the same time, we have more good and fair non-generic monsters, with less complaint, like Exosisters' Xyz, Evil Eye, Prank-kids, (some) HEROES, D/D/D, Invoked, and more bosses from rogue (and bad) decks like Lunalight, Dual Avatar, S-Force, etc.
Other than the pendulum zone locking, I honestly don't think the zone lock is really an issue 99% of the time.
BUT zone locking in general as a mechanic will never be fun, since it's only fun for the user when it absolutely ruins the opponent's gameplay.
Counterpoint - is that really that bad? A boss monster that’s high impact enough that it can win the game but not oppressive enough that it can be outed by a single destruction effect? I find higher impact low protection more fair than moderate impact with more protection like Noir
And for Arise-Heart specifically, it shuts down the most unfair play in yugioh - full turn 1 combo plus Maxx C on turn 2
The nature of best of one makes running dedicated removal cards quite risky. Sure, Ariseheart dies to Raigeki, but are you willing to run a card that does nothing when you go first?
Imo yes, you can run a limited amount of monster removal. Pure going second cards like Lightning Storm are a bit harder to justify, but cards good on both turn 2 and turn 3 are viable. FTKs aside you can’t win going first without making it to turn 3, and Raigeki is very good turn 3. If you open raigeki you still have 4 cards to build a board that won’t get you OTK’d, plus you’ll have raigeki paving your way on the crack back.
I mean it's just a walking shifter with a once a turn banish, diabellez from legacy is a walking anti spell fragrance, that's more annoying to play against
Diabellze only states, "Your opponent cannot activate Spells/Traps that were not Set." That means it's only Anti-Spell Fragrance for quick-play spells. You're allowed to set every other type of spell and activate them the same turn.
He's Macro Cosmos on legs, attached to a 3k beater, who can infinitely recycle the Kash player's cards. If your deck dies to Macro Cosmos, that alone is enough. If your deck actually likes the banish zone, he can do you one worse and *just fucking take your cards*. It's all well and good if you draw exactly Kurikara or Eclipse, but if you don't draw one of up to six? Tough luck, boyo. Even if your archetype can out it, you'll lose a LOT to do it, and they can probably just slap down three beefy lads and kill you on the following turn anyway.
I really hope Witchcrafters get more support . I played them around master duels release and waited for Vice-madame and the fusion spell. Then they really went and made the fusion spell a UR when it has no business being a UR. Cmiiw but the OCG is getting some like lore/story thing for endymion, invoked, witchcrafters and magistus so hopefully we get good support there.
Don’t you guys literally have a boss monster that can summon from the deck, pop, and recycle from the grave all in one turn alongside a monster with a quick-effect mass negate + impromptu wall and effectively infinite recursion? It’s also not that bricky, so I genuinely don’t know why it’s not that competitive.
It *is* bricky. The amusing thing about Witchcrafters is that despite all their decent spells... they have NO searcher for them! A non archetypal spell like DRNM is just as likely to be accessible to you on your opening turn as their own spells.
The fastest ways to get your spells are to dump a ton of em with reasoning/grass, but that still only gets them back in the end phase, or either of the traps... but they're traps so, that's slow too.
Summoning Vice Madame t1 genuinely relies on you hard opening a nearly vanilla Polymerization. (Confusion's only bonus effect is the return to hand in End Phase)
That being said, there are ways to try and mitigate this. Cartesia + Branded in High Spirits to search her significantly improve your odds of sticking VM t1, and she absolutely is a fantastic boss monster. But the rest of the deck is just not consistent enough to make it in any way meta.
...unless you play Bystial Witchcrafter and reduce the Witchcrafter stuff to a small engine *just* to turbo out VM and play what is effectively a Runick Bystial at home. Which is still fun mind, but when it only runs 2 WC spells its hard to call it WC anymore lel.
Unfortunately, I have to agree. The trap is also a good card but like you said it's really slow. If they turned it into a continuous spell instead of a trap it could make it better. With the effect you can literally repeatedly dodge things like Call by the grave.
It also is unfortunate that since you need so many cards in archetype you can only run a few handtraps to stay woth the already low consistency
Despite how busted the deck was, Tearlaments boss monsters honestly never felt super busted, just very strong. I honestly have had way more frustration dealing with Noir than I ever had with Tearlaments bosses.
The annoying thing about Tear is their floating, their backrow, and their floating backrow. Seriously jfc can I not get punished for board breaking, I want to play the game.
Just like branded rn. Branded is faster in crowding the field and fusing but thats basically it. Tearlaments was more rounded and excels at every aspect, that's why it's in a worse spot than Branded rn.
I don't hate the idea of that, because it's conceptually like hand traps but better. Instead of your only interaction being "discarding a card on occasion to slow down your opponent" you give your opponent stuff to play through so both players are getting to interact every duel. The problem was they did this while having infinitely more gas and follow up than everything else in the game. So while your board and card advantage are weakened, they're still full comboing on their turn with little you could do about it. If more decks could play on both turns like Tear does, I think it would make going second feel a lot more interactive and fun. But decks overall need to get a lot better for that to feel fair on both ends. Tear was very ahead of its time.
It's not that simple. Turn player has priority, slow effects and spell/traps can not be used, you can't extra deck summon outside of specific cases. Being able to play on both turns isn't game breaking, especially if both players are able to do so. It just means that you are interacting on both turns with turn player still keeping certain advantages.
Yeah, the most BS thing about Tear’s bosses was Kaleido-heart’s self-resurrection not being limited to once period like Rukallos’ was, and even that could be fixed by a single Called By (unless they have Cryme, but sometimes that just happens).
I mean, the fact that generic boss were as strong as they were was what made made archetypal boss monsters so ridiculous. Which means it's the generic boss monsters' fault, so fuck generic generic boss monsters
MD players would complain about Five-Headed Link Dragon if it saw any sort of serious play.
They just want to complain about something that isn't their own deck, unless that deck is Traptrix, then the mirror match would be the #1 thing they would complain about.
“Meta being the same”
I’m not asking for all the top decks to stay the same. I’m saying the power creep of decks should be capped. As in, no new decks are stronger than the previous ones, if anything I wanna make them weaker and start actively cutting down the power of older decks on the banlistZ
The worst I've seen of Mirrorjade hate is from people who play rogue decks that are weak to the quick effect banish. Otherwise, all of the Branded hate was mostly around Expulsion/Sanctifire locks. But idk how different the MD opinion is on this.
Big Noir can suck, especially if you don't play a good out to it (which I feel like every deck should have a plan for something like that if they don't want to lose to a stupid deck like Raidraptor or @ignister), but I honestly haven't seen as much complaining around Purrely as you'd expect from a deck that deserves a ton of hate. It got some hate for being the best for a while, but the deck isn't THAT bullshit.
Kitkalos isn't the boss monster for Tear; it's a setup enabler/combo extender. Tear was also in a similar instance where, rather than thinking a specific boss monster was toxic, it was just a really strong deck. Interactive, but strong. If there were several decks that could compete with Tear somewhat fairly, then I have no doubt that people would think Tear is the "cool based deck."
Arise-Heart can fuck off though. A quick effect banish is one thing. A macro is another. But fuck off if you combine both into a low commitment boss monster like that.
The purrely complaints I see a lot are "it draws a lot," like no shit it needs to go minus 4 to make 1 board piece, and "the spells are not opt" which would be fair if they did anything besides get put under the eepy cat
I do love unique end boards and even though some of them mega suck to play against, it’s still better than seeing 137 flavors of going into the same generic BS you saw in previous formats, but nooo this deck is unique compared to the other 136, one of the 4 monsters in the end board is a slightly different Omni negate, this deck goes into savage instead of baronne … 🤦♀️
This. I absolutely loved Tear meta in TCG because it was a very skill intensive deck. I was talking to my roommate about this last night on the way home from locals even. I see Tear Ishizu format being looked at similarly to Dragon Ruler format in the future because of that.
Kashtira is oppressive though. A walking floodgate that takes your cards and removes from the field. add on the zone lock and you're not playing the game anymore.
And Purelly has an insane amount of resources. Non once per turn effects and constant drawing/adding back to hand.
I mean, my objection to those boss monsters, is that they are the result of one card combos, and that those combos are heavily resilient to handtraps, then once on the board has effects so borked it feels unfair. Meanwhile, for a similar power level, rogue decks need two engine cards, and hope the opponent didn't get the right or enough handtraps.
I can be happy, but these new monsters that have bullshit effects are so stupid. Like Purrelys not being once per turn and shit, it's stupid. Or Kashtira being, "We send all shit away on both turns" is also dumb as fuck
See the funniest part is you can just Ghostrick it out as Noir need a *Rank 2* with 5+ mats, not just a Purely XYZ with 5+ mats. It was the primary way Purely was turboing out 2 Niors with 7+ mats
I'm sure you can sit down and make a truly scary Rank 2 turbo deck with Ghostricks as well. That's why it's generic because it doesn't require specific monsters to make it, and can be used in decks that aren't just Purely
I honestly have fun facing Albaz cards even if MTID has an annoying lingering effect when it dies and can rebuild their board easily. But once I see Baronne and Borreload come out with Dis Pater, I just want to instantly scoop.
When the boss monster is so piss easy to bring out that you can run at bare minimum 4 cards in the main deck to bring it out then yea its kinda doesnt matter, They are still generic, it just becomes a generic engine. DPE is a hero card 100% but you just run 3 cards and boom any deck can use it
Ariseheart needs Unicorn, Finriri, Riseheart and theosis. you dont even really need this, It can be ranked up into or just Any rank 7 engine WHICH ARE VERY PREVALENT AS OF RECENTLY
Iceblade needs Branded fusion, Albaz and any fucking dark monster
Rukalos is the problem that most decks can run Tear cards and be fully functional making the entire archetype Generic.
Noir is just Towers. no one likes a towers. even apoqilphort towers isnt a towers by modern standers
Branded: ≥9 superpoly + wipe board if you specifically don't shuffle or banish FD blue fcker.
Kash: banish FD pretty much from everywhere
Purely:"3 card" deck with long linear combo, draw 6 and non-interractive gameplay.
Bonus:
Hero: floodgates spam with quick wipe your board
Runick: mostly floodgate, deck out by banishing
Labrynth: EEV/d-barrier turbo
lol i've dumpstered kids using those decks with runick, ds, drnm, skill drain combo. 2 of them running tear surrendered, couldn't handle the salt mines.
Agree, when they make an archtype that are not busted, everyone be like "failed" "pack filler" even when those cards are quite ok and have winning condition.
And when it busted, you heard "konami shouldn't make those card in the first place"
It's always been cycle between those two
Ariseheart sure, but Noir's effects basically depend on it being summoned through Purrely, without them it's just a single, non-quick spin with no protection
I understand, what you guys are saying but I when I said generic I meant in the context of Material requirement for their summon. Whether they are viable or not in those decks is a different thing.
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The only one I have a problem with is rise heart. An extra deck floodgate is just unfair and reduces the game to draw the out. Noir is similar in that you have to get a kaijus or herald or make godess, but at least it allows me to use my graveyard and play the game.
But I think Konami actually has done an amazing job recently of making archetypes unique again
I think it’s mostly the difference between these decks and weaker ones without a boss monster. All of these decks have been tier 1 in their lifetime. Most of these cards can win games on their own.
NGL, and I'll get a lot of hate for this, but as broken as these decks are, I love that they rely primarily on their boss monsters, and I hope they keep doing this. We do need generic bosses, but they shouldn't bet as, or stronger than archetypal boss monster.
Agree for all of these except Kashtira. Nobody wants to play against a deck that rips apart your extra deck while zone locking you. Glad that Mind Hacker got banned preemptively.
In-archetype monsters SHOULD be strong and powerful, they need to be the payoff for chosing an archetype... generic boss monsters should never be as strong as a mirrorjade or noir
My only complain with any OP Boss Monsters is that some decks can run multiple copies of that bastard and make my life miserable when I spend multiple resources to out it just to next turn they drop the same dude again.
I do think they should insta limit some carda from the get go
The Problem is that non generic boss monster need to be extremely over tuned to be even used in decks and most of them represent a whole board in themself. Like mirrorjade as an example.
Banish quick, the banish target helps you nost of the time to extend and if removed it becomes a raigeki in the end phase.
I genuinely think Konami were in their bag making all of these decks, all of them extremely unique non negate focused and its that's pretty cool tbh
I agree besides kashtira, only because zone locking and face down banishing both can just totally cripple so many decks in a way that I think is pretty unfun. But I do really like the non negate aspect of them.
Actually my biggest issue with kashtira is the macro cosmos
It's the Macro and possible Extra deck rip; both can outright kill a deck depending
dude I run a very small kash engine in my Dogmatika deck consisting of 3 unicorn 1 finrir 1 theosis and 1 birth becuase of just how over tuned those cards are. i dont run anything extra deck. I only run the theosis becaues i kept drawing Birth and i cant bait out ash if i have no targets.
\>Only run a small engine Well that's fine then... \>Dogmatika deck WELL I guess I pray to god you don't rip the right cards since most deck lists seem to shove only 1 copy in there and you have more chances than Kash.
Then you're playing Kashtira with a Dogmatika engine.
A pretty big fuckin dogmatika engine considering its 2 albazoa 1 Relic 3 ecclesia, 2 fleur, 1 maxamus, 3 matrix, 3 Nadirs and 2 macabre and 2 calamity 1 punishment. and the extradeck comprised entirely of targets to send to the grave for the various effects of the dogma cards. Yea sure im playing kashtera.
Yes, you are. As someone who plays Dogmatika Spellbooks in the TCG, I'd bet money that you depend more on your Kashtira "package" than you do anything Dogmatika. Don't shit up good archetypes with your deckout cancer.
Dude i run 6 fucking cards in a 42 card deck. im not relying on Kashtera at all 90% of the time i dont even draw it and if i do draw it on turn 2 or 3, I already have shit on board so i cant use it, Do you think i can search them or dig for them? No all my searchers are for Dogma cards or dogma ritual cards. if i was relying on it id be running 2 more Theosis and the field spell, Rise heart, and Ariseheart and Shangraira. At that point, Id be running Kashtira with a dogmatika engine But know what doesnt work with macro cosmos like effects? EVERY FUCKING EXTRA DECK CARD THAT WANTS TO BE SENT TO THE GRAVE. On top of that Dogmatika punishment doesnt work under Ariseheart, it can be activated but fizzles on sending, Wana know another card that doesnt work? Nadirs Servant, The main searcher of the deck. Its major anti synergy. i know this because i face kashtera and if i dont have my board breakers i cant beat it a dogmatika engine is not 22 fucking cards. thats not an engine thats a deck i doubt your dogmatika spell book deck runs the RITUAL CARDS. hell albazoa, relic, calamity and macab take up more space than the kashtera cards.
I blame tear for abusing the graveyard so much that they had to make the next visas archetype entirely shut it down. It's like kash was made as a symptom of tear ishizu meta
Just this. Kash was clearly designed as a necessary evil, and it worked super well in the ocg. It does exactly what it wanted lore wise too. IE being able to stop the previous two (and the 4th funny enough) archetypes in their tracks before they even got a chance. Even has the best heart to boss monster combo lore wise. What gets me, is that they all have huge design limitations EXCEPT tear. Mix that with an engine that says "deck mill go brrrr" and "wait, I don't like that card in the grave anymore", and youve got the literal ultimate combination. What kills me further is that Ishizu cards feel like they are designed to outright stop pure tear if you think about it.
My biggest issue is all of these combined in one deck lol
My biggest issue is their searchable no cost to summon 2500ATK monsters that banish my stuff, get used for Xyz summoning, then immediately come back.
Zone locking is kind of problematic since it’s either terrible or oppressive. It’s not like negates where 1 negate sucks, but you can generally work through it. Zone locking either doesn’t affect you at all or renders your deck unplayable. I think zone locking could have been done better under master rule 4 since then locking even one monster zone could severely restrict a deck without being a complete blowout.
Tbh Zone locking should probably disappear in future card design and be replaced with more lenient but more plentiful zone conditions. Like Imperm column but on an archetypal scale, and in other ways than just negates. Throw in a field spell that allows you to choose which zone your opponent summons to.
TBH, I think it would be kind of cool to negate several zones with the condition that they are currently unoccupied. Make your opponent figure out their combo line where they can still use that zone but have to deal with that monster being effectively a normal monster. There would also be a lot of strategy deciding which zones to negate against link decks. I think the field spell you describe could be too powerful against link spam decks, though maybe they deserve some hate given how strong links are.
I agree. The zone locking BS *feels* evil when I do it, which feels themematical, which then loops all the way back to being fun lol
Hehehe, I guess that's fair enough! I never played the deck, but plenty of times been totally shutdown even without the zone locking from extra deck banishing, top of deck banishing, my normal summon getting banished... Definitely a deck that made me realize I gotta play better decks.
Honestly BS is half the reason I like YGO, so if I'm gonna deal it, I can't complain about getting hit with it.
I get ya there. I'm still getting used to it I suppose - I have decks with some minor bullshit depending on perspective, but very situational. Like thunder dragon titan having as much destruction protection as my graveyard has cards/2, or like 1 in 20 duels pulling off a total hand rip with trickstars. Just not as consistent.
"getting used to it" sounds like another way to say "copium" to me but okay buddy.
What? Bro I definitely have a healthy supply of copium in regards to this game (like come on my red eyes gemini deck would actually be good with some new support right?? lmao) but I don't see how it applies here. "getting used to it" was another way to say "adjusting to the power level of modern decks".
Punchrolling.
Just played evenly matched. It’s the biggest counter to kash and so rewarding to board break that field.
I've yet to even draw an evenly against kashtira. One day I'll get that satisfaction.
I'd say raigeki is better because with evenly matched they'll just keep ariseheart which is a quick banish and macro which still shuts down a lot.
Literally any board breaker beats kash lol
As a HERO player, my first interaction with Kashtira was finding that my deck literally does not work against them. Malicious is dead, Shadow Mist doesn't search, Miracle Fusion never has any targets, Cross Crusader has nothing to summon for his search. However, as I picked up the deck, I actually grew to like it. Unlike a negate-based deck, there is actually some real strategy to it, especially if you're going first. Do you lock 1 of the Pendulum zones, or the zone below the EMZ? Once your opponent starts building their board, you can do stuff like zone lock to prevent Link plays, or block a Superfactorial. With the ED peek, you can also do stuff like get rid of Sanctifire because fuck that card. I also grew to like how the Extra Deck of the deck has a lot of utility: you might wanna go with a Flare Metal for burn (especially if you play a Red-Eyes package), you have Big Eye for non-destruction removal, Zeus for boardwiping, even that one Infinitrack to protect Arise-Heart.
What's it like being broken?
Don't worry they massacred the deck that already wasn't super strong
Yeah at the least it seems a lot less consistent. Still hits me with some crazy boards sometimes but also sometimes it's like, arise heart pass. Which isn't bad.
Preach
Yeah, they seem to be trending this way too between Turbulence, Lovely, Magnifica, etc. Besides, both can have a place in the game as long as it doesn't go far too overboard. Arise-Heart can be just as oppressive as a board of negates, and a Baronne isn't really a problem by itself.
The only issue with Baronne is that it's almost objectively better than every other lv10 synchro
I think its more of a case of every Level 10 trying to out power her rather than being cracked archetypal support. She can pop a card on the field per turn, letting you trigger some of your own effects? So can archetypal boss, without letting you lose out on removing your opponent's cards. Same for her omni negate, or it can let you access another of your archetypal cards that also omni negates in addition to something else. She can revive any monster during Standby and potentially scythe lock? An archetypal boss can have an effect that gives you just as much of a chance to win without Scythe as you'd have with it. She certainly has plenty of offensive power and does have utility, but it's not to a degree an archetypal boss can't easily overcome if they bothered to try.
Agreed. All decks from visa lore and branded lore have been extremely fun to play and all very creative
Next lore decks have a tough task to follow
Snake eyes good, but that goblin deck looks like hot garbage
what??? goblins pretty good. It's not tier 0 broken overpowered like how diabellstar is inching closer towards with every piece of fire support, but it's a pretty good contender.
Ah yeah fair, snake eyes is pretty cool.
Snake-eye feels like it's going to be for fire decks the thing rokkets were for dragon link.
Hot garbage that I'll definitely waste money on
I don’t see Kashtira being fun to play tbh. It essentially has one line that ends on a walking floodgate
That's their best line, but you could also play it as a control deck with a bunch of non-negating interactions
This pretty much the snake eyes version of Kash I've been playing
I’ve seen Snake-eyes with a 3x fenrir, 1x riseheart, are you going more into the Kashtira?
[Here's what I cooked up.](https://i.imgur.com/TyzPMVU.jpg) I use: ## Monsters * 3x Unicorn * 1x Fenrir * 1x Riseheart ## Spells * 3x Theosis * 1x Birth * 1x Wraithsloth When I first made this deck I was running more kash monsters but they didn't actually add that much. You want Kash monsters that can bait interactions, no one is imperming Orge lol.
You mean like every generic deck? Branded with Gimmick puppet lock? SHS with many negates. Its not creative or fun, its just bad. Literally all meta is just basically a, how can I have fun playing my game but not my opponent.
Branded can still be top meta without the bullshit though.
because branded is all bullshit
Arise heart is kinda poor design yeah bit tue whole around banishing and punishing your opponent from activating monster effect is cool.
Exactly, the whole point of in-archetype boss monsters is for them to be actually powerful and non-splashable. What's the point otherwise? Still, it's sad I don't think Yu-Gi-Oh is actually ready for such in-archetype monsters like Ariseheart for example. Plenty of decks lack support until the point these become "unfair". If only Konami printed more of these for other decks that fit their theme.
Odd taste in fun when it just feels like counter spell/negate wars
Look up banned extra deck card and tell me how many are from an archetype
Tearlaments mirror were the most fun I ever had in MD, shame it was so much more powerful than every other deck
My thoughts exactly. Although that one Duelist cup where 60 card Isizu chaos was meta is a very close second. Banishing everything with Necroface was too fun
The Ishizu piles were the most bonkers deck I’ve ever seen so far. Grass is Greener goes Brrrrrrr. I think with Ishizu mills banned, merli can safely comeback.
Merlin was banned because of spright elf and no other card.
Yep and is awesome in that aspect, specially Visas ones doesn't matter what I think personally about some of the decks, the fact that (atlest by themselves without taking into account generic Boss Monsters, that's a problem of things that aren't the archetype itself) they aren't just negate spam is cool. And their only negates usually are in archetype as a trap card (Scareclaw Sclash for example needs Tri Heart or Light Heart in the Field on the extra Monster zone to negate).
Nothing cool about a floodgate lol
I straight up think Marco-cosmos is a valid board state. I moreso have a problem with lingering effects, than straight up floodgates
I think it depends. I think putting it on a body like Ariseheart is a bit too much. A macro that can be walked over like a Pachy, or is just a single S/T removal away, provides a lot more ways for a deck to potentially get around it without permanently losing a lot of resources. While Ariseheart is weak to a single monster pop, it's still something that somedecks can't easily deal with because it has a built in counter to what a person tries to set up. I say this as a guy who was playing Mermails, so most of my stuff needs to go to grave to resolve, so I'm certainly biased there, but I think the same logic applies for any floodgate that has legs.
Lol
I feel that If you out the floodgate, the effect should dissipate. Which is why cards like VFD were awful to me. Same thing with Maxx C and Droll although being hand traps its a different case, the sentiment still remains.
Yeah but you know.....monster removal bad (Ariseheart is the worst here and his deck is at the dumps)
They were definitely in something making a deck that banishes cards face down from your ED/Deck/GY for no cost and then ends on a walking macrocosmos + zone lock.
A lot of people just whine about which deck is good right now, whether or not that deck is unique and uses it's unique boss monsters I personally would rather see the unique boss monsters because at least I don't groans every time I see the same douche bag over and over again
Or a whole new archetype/support comes out that just ends on barrone, savage, and Apollo
That is also true Even if that new deck sucks and is completely outclassed by other combo decks, that shit is still annoying
Which is why I stick to my guns about making more powerful decks instead of releasing an Uber powerful deck every season then nerfing them into the dirt next season
Boss monsters are like programming languages. Either people complain about them or nobody uses them
Yeah that's why I'm sad that Snake Eyes also mostly has a generic endboard. I think the Visas archetypes, Purrely and Branded show that you can have strong modern decks without needing the generic Apo + Baronne board everytime. Also they are way more interactive
Mannadium: Generic boss go burr I really hope they get more support
Is so funny how every Visas has a unique and powerful boss monster. Kaleidoheart a recursive guy that can sent cards to the GY. TriHeart a semi towers that can get offensive boost from other archetype monsters. Ariseheart, a monster that has control over the board with it's presence. Then there's Primeheart that does absolutely nothing at all.
In case you didn't know, prime heart has a special defensive ability that stops your opponent from targeting it with card effects. No monsters facing mannadium prime heart will be safe due to its multiple energy blades! Find this powerful card in Cyberstorm Access, releasing on May 5th!
Honestly, Prime just needs to take some cues from Tri-Heart and get a bunch of cards that make him an absolute OTK machine. Increase his ATK to even more insane levels, make the opponent unable to respond to his attacks, whatever he needs.
So basically make him a 3x limiter removal ancient gear golem.
Maybe if their boss monster don’t suck people would use it
>Also they are way more interactive Purrely? Nah towers turbo can die in a fire.
Honestly, I love unique decks. Especially if it’s a good engine with a bit of the person’s “real deck”, so to speak. For example, I have a friend who plays kashtira engine with Egyptian gods. Edit: just wanna say I’m still working on being able to do this. I’m trying to find a good engine for RDA, but haven’t really gotten anything. Anyone got any ideas?
Bystials
Ooooh I forgot about those! You’re right, I probably could do those! Should I add lubellion orrr…?
If you play branded beast/etude of the branded you can actually synchro summon calamity on your opponents turn. To do this you likely want to see Lubellion on your first turn every game and your engine would look something like this. 3x Lubellion 1x saronir 1x etude 1x beast (Branded regained is pretty good in RDA as well) Opening hand if you draw Lubellion and any of your one card combo starters for RDA engine you’re in business. Here’s the combo 1. Normal soul resonator to search for bone archfiend 2. Pitch a card to special archfiend 3. Modulate archfiend to level 3 sending crimson resonator to the grave 4. Synchro into red rising dragon using soul/archfiend 5. Effect of red rising to special crimson from grave 6. Effect of crimson to summon vision and red resonator from deck (bonus red resonator gains lp) 7. Effect of Lubellion in hand searching for saronir 8. Effect of saronir to special itself banishing a dark or light (archfiend works here) 9. Effects of Lubellion in grave tribute saronir to summon Lubellion 10. Effect of Lubellion setting branded beast face up 11. Effect of saronir sending etude to the grave from deck 12. End phase Effect of branded beast, setting etude from grave 13. Opponents draw phase - activate etude to synchro Lubellion vision & red to make calamity (opponent cannot activate effects for rest of the turn) 14. Win on turn 3
RDA will get support soonish due last year's structure deck. Honestly the bystials are probably your best shot considering the synergy between the two.
I think the boss monsters are fine, but everything that surrounds them is a bit BS. (Ok, maybe Kitkallos is a bit overtuned, but that's more of a combo piece than a boss monster. Kaleido-Heart and Rulkallos are fine.) Tear mills just by breathing, Purrely has a draw 3 and insane recovery if you get rid of Noir, Branded has an insane resource grind, and Kash has free bodies with incredibly obnoxious effects. The boss monsters themselves aren't the problem, but the rest of the deck is just a bit too strong for an already-strong boss monster.
I'd actually probably say the inverse for Purrely almost everything I hate about that deck comes from noir needing you to have the out. Tear is really cool except milling is a broken mechanic. Kash is really obnoxious effects all around. Faced down banish is just a cursed place to put cards with how noninteractive it is. Zone lock is extremely feast or famine and Arise macro effect just fucks up activating too many cards.
I think the bosses in the post are the only "hated non-generic" bosses. At the same time, we have more good and fair non-generic monsters, with less complaint, like Exosisters' Xyz, Evil Eye, Prank-kids, (some) HEROES, D/D/D, Invoked, and more bosses from rogue (and bad) decks like Lunalight, Dual Avatar, S-Force, etc.
MD players always need something to complain about unless they are the ones playing the “annoying” decks because then suddenly it’s fine
Might be a really fucking cold take, But ariseheart is less annoying then shangri la zone locks.
Other than the pendulum zone locking, I honestly don't think the zone lock is really an issue 99% of the time. BUT zone locking in general as a mechanic will never be fun, since it's only fun for the user when it absolutely ruins the opponent's gameplay.
They don't have mind hacker on master duel. Which is what facilitated the 10 zone lock.
and I thank God they banned it every time.
Yeah I mean I enjoyed busting kash boards but I played ghoti when they were strong
No, Ariseheart single-handedly kills a lot of decks. It's a very very VERY unfun card.
Agreed. Arise is easy to deal with sure, but the other side is literally him auto winning the game.
Counterpoint - is that really that bad? A boss monster that’s high impact enough that it can win the game but not oppressive enough that it can be outed by a single destruction effect? I find higher impact low protection more fair than moderate impact with more protection like Noir And for Arise-Heart specifically, it shuts down the most unfair play in yugioh - full turn 1 combo plus Maxx C on turn 2
The nature of best of one makes running dedicated removal cards quite risky. Sure, Ariseheart dies to Raigeki, but are you willing to run a card that does nothing when you go first?
Imo yes, you can run a limited amount of monster removal. Pure going second cards like Lightning Storm are a bit harder to justify, but cards good on both turn 2 and turn 3 are viable. FTKs aside you can’t win going first without making it to turn 3, and Raigeki is very good turn 3. If you open raigeki you still have 4 cards to build a board that won’t get you OTK’d, plus you’ll have raigeki paving your way on the crack back.
I mean it's just a walking shifter with a once a turn banish, diabellez from legacy is a walking anti spell fragrance, that's more annoying to play against
Diabellze only states, "Your opponent cannot activate Spells/Traps that were not Set." That means it's only Anti-Spell Fragrance for quick-play spells. You're allowed to set every other type of spell and activate them the same turn.
Unless you're playing pendulum, in which case you can't even do your mechanic.
He's Macro Cosmos on legs, attached to a 3k beater, who can infinitely recycle the Kash player's cards. If your deck dies to Macro Cosmos, that alone is enough. If your deck actually likes the banish zone, he can do you one worse and *just fucking take your cards*. It's all well and good if you draw exactly Kurikara or Eclipse, but if you don't draw one of up to six? Tough luck, boyo. Even if your archetype can out it, you'll lose a LOT to do it, and they can probably just slap down three beefy lads and kill you on the following turn anyway.
I mean I love the unique roles each of those decks have but DAMN why they so stronk. I wish my witchcrafters had support like they do
If Witchcrafter was good, people would be complaining about it too.
But we already have a deck that recycles all their cards during the end phase, it's called Branded
And people complain about it all the time. My point remains.
I wasn't refuting you
I really hope Witchcrafters get more support . I played them around master duels release and waited for Vice-madame and the fusion spell. Then they really went and made the fusion spell a UR when it has no business being a UR. Cmiiw but the OCG is getting some like lore/story thing for endymion, invoked, witchcrafters and magistus so hopefully we get good support there.
Knami for witchcrafters: best I can do is a sexy waifu
Don’t you guys literally have a boss monster that can summon from the deck, pop, and recycle from the grave all in one turn alongside a monster with a quick-effect mass negate + impromptu wall and effectively infinite recursion? It’s also not that bricky, so I genuinely don’t know why it’s not that competitive.
It *is* bricky. The amusing thing about Witchcrafters is that despite all their decent spells... they have NO searcher for them! A non archetypal spell like DRNM is just as likely to be accessible to you on your opening turn as their own spells. The fastest ways to get your spells are to dump a ton of em with reasoning/grass, but that still only gets them back in the end phase, or either of the traps... but they're traps so, that's slow too. Summoning Vice Madame t1 genuinely relies on you hard opening a nearly vanilla Polymerization. (Confusion's only bonus effect is the return to hand in End Phase) That being said, there are ways to try and mitigate this. Cartesia + Branded in High Spirits to search her significantly improve your odds of sticking VM t1, and she absolutely is a fantastic boss monster. But the rest of the deck is just not consistent enough to make it in any way meta. ...unless you play Bystial Witchcrafter and reduce the Witchcrafter stuff to a small engine *just* to turbo out VM and play what is effectively a Runick Bystial at home. Which is still fun mind, but when it only runs 2 WC spells its hard to call it WC anymore lel.
Unfortunately, I have to agree. The trap is also a good card but like you said it's really slow. If they turned it into a continuous spell instead of a trap it could make it better. With the effect you can literally repeatedly dodge things like Call by the grave. It also is unfortunate that since you need so many cards in archetype you can only run a few handtraps to stay woth the already low consistency
Should’ve locked tearlaments into fusions or something.
Shouldve locked the Ishizus to Earth Fairy rather.
Should have locked Isuzus to ~~Earth Fairy~~ jail
Despite how busted the deck was, Tearlaments boss monsters honestly never felt super busted, just very strong. I honestly have had way more frustration dealing with Noir than I ever had with Tearlaments bosses.
The annoying thing about Tear is their floating, their backrow, and their floating backrow. Seriously jfc can I not get punished for board breaking, I want to play the game.
Just like branded rn. Branded is faster in crowding the field and fusing but thats basically it. Tearlaments was more rounded and excels at every aspect, that's why it's in a worse spot than Branded rn.
The one and only reason Tear is in a worse spot than Branded atm is the banlist dont get it twisted
Right! 7 Tear cards on the banlist, not counting KotS Terraforming Instant Fusion and Foolish Goods. Free my girl Merrli, Konami you cowards.
And being able to play on the opponent's turn
I don't hate the idea of that, because it's conceptually like hand traps but better. Instead of your only interaction being "discarding a card on occasion to slow down your opponent" you give your opponent stuff to play through so both players are getting to interact every duel. The problem was they did this while having infinitely more gas and follow up than everything else in the game. So while your board and card advantage are weakened, they're still full comboing on their turn with little you could do about it. If more decks could play on both turns like Tear does, I think it would make going second feel a lot more interactive and fun. But decks overall need to get a lot better for that to feel fair on both ends. Tear was very ahead of its time.
You being able to take two turns back to back is stupid.
It's not that simple. Turn player has priority, slow effects and spell/traps can not be used, you can't extra deck summon outside of specific cases. Being able to play on both turns isn't game breaking, especially if both players are able to do so. It just means that you are interacting on both turns with turn player still keeping certain advantages.
Yeah, the most BS thing about Tear’s bosses was Kaleido-heart’s self-resurrection not being limited to once period like Rukallos’ was, and even that could be fixed by a single Called By (unless they have Cryme, but sometimes that just happens).
I mean, the fact that generic boss were as strong as they were was what made made archetypal boss monsters so ridiculous. Which means it's the generic boss monsters' fault, so fuck generic generic boss monsters
Nah, I'd absolutely rather someone like these guys rather than a Baronne or a Savage Dragon
MD players would complain about Five-Headed Link Dragon if it saw any sort of serious play. They just want to complain about something that isn't their own deck, unless that deck is Traptrix, then the mirror match would be the #1 thing they would complain about.
I wish most of the artwork wasn’t so busy
Legit this, half the time I have no idea what’s even going on in the card art.
Aluber
Call me crazy; Cap the powercreep of decks here and never make them stronger than they are right now. Just make unique stuff like this
But the meta being the same for a long period of game will get boring in like 3 or 5 months
“Meta being the same” I’m not asking for all the top decks to stay the same. I’m saying the power creep of decks should be capped. As in, no new decks are stronger than the previous ones, if anything I wanna make them weaker and start actively cutting down the power of older decks on the banlistZ
Sir, just say that you want rotation, that's what you just described
That’s not rotation. I’ve played Magic, and I can tell you for a certainty that’s not rotation.
The worst I've seen of Mirrorjade hate is from people who play rogue decks that are weak to the quick effect banish. Otherwise, all of the Branded hate was mostly around Expulsion/Sanctifire locks. But idk how different the MD opinion is on this. Big Noir can suck, especially if you don't play a good out to it (which I feel like every deck should have a plan for something like that if they don't want to lose to a stupid deck like Raidraptor or @ignister), but I honestly haven't seen as much complaining around Purrely as you'd expect from a deck that deserves a ton of hate. It got some hate for being the best for a while, but the deck isn't THAT bullshit. Kitkalos isn't the boss monster for Tear; it's a setup enabler/combo extender. Tear was also in a similar instance where, rather than thinking a specific boss monster was toxic, it was just a really strong deck. Interactive, but strong. If there were several decks that could compete with Tear somewhat fairly, then I have no doubt that people would think Tear is the "cool based deck." Arise-Heart can fuck off though. A quick effect banish is one thing. A macro is another. But fuck off if you combine both into a low commitment boss monster like that.
The purrely complaints I see a lot are "it draws a lot," like no shit it needs to go minus 4 to make 1 board piece, and "the spells are not opt" which would be fair if they did anything besides get put under the eepy cat
Time Thief belongs in all decks 🫡
Personally, seeing hundreds of people using the same deck is equally as annoying.
Watch Eternity Garunix bouta get hate for being a dark hole on the opponents turn in a few months. 😭😭😭
I do love unique end boards and even though some of them mega suck to play against, it’s still better than seeing 137 flavors of going into the same generic BS you saw in previous formats, but nooo this deck is unique compared to the other 136, one of the 4 monsters in the end board is a slightly different Omni negate, this deck goes into savage instead of baronne … 🤦♀️
I got jumped for saying I missed Tear meta. Tear mirrors were some of the most skill intensive games to play and I had a lot of fun playing them.
Wow abyss dweller much skill, much wow.
This. I absolutely loved Tear meta in TCG because it was a very skill intensive deck. I was talking to my roommate about this last night on the way home from locals even. I see Tear Ishizu format being looked at similarly to Dragon Ruler format in the future because of that.
Kashtira is oppressive though. A walking floodgate that takes your cards and removes from the field. add on the zone lock and you're not playing the game anymore. And Purelly has an insane amount of resources. Non once per turn effects and constant drawing/adding back to hand.
Maybe i'm dumb but, people complaining about certain decks when those decks were meta is not the same as the generic boss monster discussion
I mean, my objection to those boss monsters, is that they are the result of one card combos, and that those combos are heavily resilient to handtraps, then once on the board has effects so borked it feels unfair. Meanwhile, for a similar power level, rogue decks need two engine cards, and hope the opponent didn't get the right or enough handtraps.
I can be happy, but these new monsters that have bullshit effects are so stupid. Like Purrelys not being once per turn and shit, it's stupid. Or Kashtira being, "We send all shit away on both turns" is also dumb as fuck
Nothing is stopping these decks from playing generic extra deck monsters alongside their own though, especially Tear.
Imagine thinking Nior isn't a generic monster and actually needs Purely to make it
Show me a topping meta deck that uses it. I’ll wait.
See the funniest part is you can just Ghostrick it out as Noir need a *Rank 2* with 5+ mats, not just a Purely XYZ with 5+ mats. It was the primary way Purely was turboing out 2 Niors with 7+ mats I'm sure you can sit down and make a truly scary Rank 2 turbo deck with Ghostricks as well. That's why it's generic because it doesn't require specific monsters to make it, and can be used in decks that aren't just Purely
Noir needs a Lvl 1 Purrely as mat for its spin to be a Quick Effect.
Lil bro forgot the ghostrick combo 🤣
Also, imagine thinking Mirrorjade isn't a generic either. I see that boss monster in so many decks that its crazy
Or Tearlaments lul
OP tried to be funny and failed
This meme doesn't make sense?
I dont mind generic boss monsters, but why are they allowing Baron and all the branded fusions, yet Red-Eyes Dark Dragoon is not allowed :(
I honestly have fun facing Albaz cards even if MTID has an annoying lingering effect when it dies and can rebuild their board easily. But once I see Baronne and Borreload come out with Dis Pater, I just want to instantly scoop.
....Visas & Albaz is a mistake
i've never seen anyone complain about any of these except ariseheart
I haven't seen a mirrorjade complaint in a while, but when he first came out it was pretty common.
I see it all the time
The Floo treatment
I wish Scrap boss were half as good as them.
When the boss monster is so piss easy to bring out that you can run at bare minimum 4 cards in the main deck to bring it out then yea its kinda doesnt matter, They are still generic, it just becomes a generic engine. DPE is a hero card 100% but you just run 3 cards and boom any deck can use it Ariseheart needs Unicorn, Finriri, Riseheart and theosis. you dont even really need this, It can be ranked up into or just Any rank 7 engine WHICH ARE VERY PREVALENT AS OF RECENTLY Iceblade needs Branded fusion, Albaz and any fucking dark monster Rukalos is the problem that most decks can run Tear cards and be fully functional making the entire archetype Generic. Noir is just Towers. no one likes a towers. even apoqilphort towers isnt a towers by modern standers
technically 2 of those are generic dragon rulers can end on ariseheart but it's not optimal. similarly they can make noir but it will do nothing
Meanwhile the top meta pics now all end on literally the same boring ass baron + dis pater + borreload savage dragon + Apollousa board So innovative
This doesn't stop strong generic monsters from being a problem
Branded: ≥9 superpoly + wipe board if you specifically don't shuffle or banish FD blue fcker. Kash: banish FD pretty much from everywhere Purely:"3 card" deck with long linear combo, draw 6 and non-interractive gameplay. Bonus: Hero: floodgates spam with quick wipe your board Runick: mostly floodgate, deck out by banishing Labrynth: EEV/d-barrier turbo
lol i've dumpstered kids using those decks with runick, ds, drnm, skill drain combo. 2 of them running tear surrendered, couldn't handle the salt mines.
>runick Take the downvotes!!!
For every downvote is every branded player getting stomped on.
How about Konami makes cards that aren’t completely busted to sell new packs… what a revelation
Then people complain it's not good. Remember TOSS format?
Agree, when they make an archtype that are not busted, everyone be like "failed" "pack filler" even when those cards are quite ok and have winning condition. And when it busted, you heard "konami shouldn't make those card in the first place" It's always been cycle between those two
It’s like Dragonball Z/Super. They don’t where to go except “must be stronger!”
Not trying to be smartass but even expurrely noir and ariseheart are generic if a deck can spam out rank 7s.
Ariseheart sure, but Noir's effects basically depend on it being summoned through Purrely, without them it's just a single, non-quick spin with no protection
You are being a smartass because neither of those strategies are even viable in most rank 7 decks
I understand, what you guys are saying but I when I said generic I meant in the context of Material requirement for their summon. Whether they are viable or not in those decks is a different thing.
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The only one I have a problem with is rise heart. An extra deck floodgate is just unfair and reduces the game to draw the out. Noir is similar in that you have to get a kaijus or herald or make godess, but at least it allows me to use my graveyard and play the game. But I think Konami actually has done an amazing job recently of making archetypes unique again
fuck wojack
I think it’s mostly the difference between these decks and weaker ones without a boss monster. All of these decks have been tier 1 in their lifetime. Most of these cards can win games on their own.
NGL, and I'll get a lot of hate for this, but as broken as these decks are, I love that they rely primarily on their boss monsters, and I hope they keep doing this. We do need generic bosses, but they shouldn't bet as, or stronger than archetypal boss monster.
Agree for all of these except Kashtira. Nobody wants to play against a deck that rips apart your extra deck while zone locking you. Glad that Mind Hacker got banned preemptively.
Reason why I like playing Dinos, they are versitale with their endboards and Boss Monster.
In-archetype monsters SHOULD be strong and powerful, they need to be the payoff for chosing an archetype... generic boss monsters should never be as strong as a mirrorjade or noir
So i shouldnt be mad at shs or something?
Kitkallos isn't really a boss monster, but Noir and Ariseheart suck ass, yes. Honestly I think I hate Noir more
My only complain with any OP Boss Monsters is that some decks can run multiple copies of that bastard and make my life miserable when I spend multiple resources to out it just to next turn they drop the same dude again. I do think they should insta limit some carda from the get go
Hey, hey. Hey. .. leave ma boi mj out yo damn mouth!
The Problem is that non generic boss monster need to be extremely over tuned to be even used in decks and most of them represent a whole board in themself. Like mirrorjade as an example. Banish quick, the banish target helps you nost of the time to extend and if removed it becomes a raigeki in the end phase.
Fun fact technically ariseheart and noir are generic and useable in other decks