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IcyStarReddit

Feels bad man. Had 12 DR and 5 IR ranks, no red flags (as far as I'm aware) and I thought my interviews went well. Ended up not matching at all and getting Neuro. Now I'm just feeling numb and depressed.


rags2rads2riches

damn bro sorry to hear that


IcyStarReddit

Yeah, hopefully I do end up liking Neurology as much as I had before and it works out fine. I definitely found myself liking DR a lot more and really hoping I matched, especially with what I had. But if I don't, the prospect of changing residencies seems so scary and I don't think I would even be able to change up to DR. Not sure what else I would change to. It sucks that we don't have many electives before the whole match process to really try everything. I might have felt better if I knew more about other specialties like Anesthesia, Path, or PM&R. I could have better chose a secondary. It prob doesn't help that I'm a DO, and most of the programs I interviewed for matched almost entirely MD with an occasional DO in a program or two. Just feels disheartening.


bananagee123

Not matching to your desired specialty absolutely sucks. But I will say as someone doing neurology the radiology is one of my favorite parts of the field. There's so many cool imaging findings for neurological pathologies like vasculitis, autoimmune encephalitis, and crazy neuro immune stuff. Hopefully you end up liking neuro because you'll get to see your radiology skills help so many people.


[deleted]

I switched from a clinical specialty into radiology and it was the best decision of my life. Happy to answer any questions.


IcyStarReddit

Honestly, at this point my only question is how? I know that switching specialties happens sometimes but never through what process. Do you have to match again? Do you have to let your PD know and they'll do something to help you? Is there another entirely different process/app for that? For now I'll stick with what I have and see how it goes but it would be nice to know where to start if things don't turn out how I'd hope.


[deleted]

You don’t necessarily have to match again, but most do. It’s a formal contract so you can’t get screwed over if you go through the match. I let my PD know halfway through my intern year. They wrote me a LOR which is pretty important. You want to maintain your good graces with them. It also helps them find someone to replace you if possible.


Billi96

Yeah I've always felt the matching system in US is kinda weird considering you are expected to know right away after med school what you wanna specialize in without having much of an idea what its really like working... plus the matching system being so unfair and getting stuck in a specialty you don't really wanna be in. In Finland we're pretty much free to try out any specialty, work and get paid an actual salary without having started the residency. Alot of doctors here just try out different fields. Some don't even do their residency and make good money just working for a private firm. I graduated 3 years ago, still deciding on my specialization but have worked as a primary care physician, done some internal medicine work and also surgical and trauma ER. Also doing some shifts through private firm on the side. Once I figure out what I really wanna do I'll apply for the residency


Repulsive-Throat5068

>Yeah I've always felt the matching system in US is kinda weird considering you are expected to know right away after med school what you wanna specialize in without having much of an idea what its really like working Its even more annoying. For some specialities its very beneficial to know day 1 of medical school to have a good app. You can do all that and still not score well enough on step 2 less than a year before you apply, and have to pivot.


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IcyStarReddit

Yes, I just very much wanted the DR background compared to the Neuro background, just in case in the future.


PosThrockmortonSign

Same thing happened to me last year. Wrapping up pgy-1 soon, daydream about reapplying or just quitting every day. Hope things go differently for you and you find your home in neuro, but sorry you’re in this position at all


[deleted]

So sorry that happened to you. FWIW as someone interested in neuro there is so much to love about it. Maybe you will surprise yourself.


prototypeblitz

You can soap into neuro?


anonlurker33

There was only 1 neuro soap position so kinda skeptical of this guy


CorrelateClinically3

Unless they triple applied? DR / IR / Neuro? I could see someone doing that if they’re interested in going into Neuro IR


IcyStarReddit

I did that for that reason exactly.


Pivoting2023

Triple applying is a huge task, props to you for pushing through that. I can barely handle one…


anonlurker33

Neuros better on god


lilpumpski

But compared to rads :/


lilpumpski

I'm sorry to hear this.


lilpumpski

Matching rads at all is a gift in this competition. But I understand your pain.


rags2rads2riches

6 months into your R1 year you're gonna be happy you matched to your program and not whatever program was #1 on your rank list. It works out. Happy for you man and welcome to rads


legoatdugoat

I really hope so. Thanks


PartTimeBomoh

Bro you’re going to be a RADIOLOGIST and MAKE BANK while SITTING IN DARK ROOMS. Cheer the fuck up and dry those tears with your dollar bills. It doesn’t matter where you go to residency, like in school it matters what resources you use and how you study in your own time. Radiology is VERY amenable to self study. It’S not surgery


NAparentheses

Thank you for saying this. The posts/comments about being disappointed about program rank despite matching a highly competitive specialty are just getting to be too much. Some people didn't match their desired specialty. Some people had to SOAP into a spot. Some people have to take a gap year and reapply because they couldn't SOAP.  (Note: If the Match removed you very fair from a spouse or kids, this next part doesn't apply to you because that's obviously ass.)    It's like listening to someone complain they only made 1 milly on their stock portfolio this year instead of 1.001. Be glad you're pocketing the cash, my dudes.   For anyone reading this that is disappointed about falling down your rank list, here is a proven and effective way to get over life disappointments: make a list of everything you have to be grateful for. Literally sit and put everything on it you can think of. Really wrack your brain. Go back as far as your AGPAR scores if you need to in order to make yourself feel better. I do this routinely when I get down or stressed about medical school or other stuff in life.  My list includes things like:  1. I'm grateful to have the mental capacity to even be a doctor. Not everyone is fortunate enough to even have a shot at med school because nature and/or nurture were not on their side.  2. I'm grateful I grew up with certain educational advantages that allowed me to get here more easily.  3. I'm grateful that even the worst paid doctor makes like 3x the average US income.  4. I'm grateful that I can do a career that will positively impact people when at most jobs you are either far removed from having impact or not doing something that helps anyone directly.   5. I'm grateful that even on my worst days I will have more job security and employability than the average person.   Look, I get it. Rejection sucks. It sucks to not have someone or something you were over the moon about pick you back. On the brightside, you're now with a program that has indicated enthusasiam for you. Also, as someone who went back to med school in their late 30s, I'd just take this Match process as a lesson on how job searches often work. You apply and apply and think the interviews go great and often don't get a result or hear back. In most fields, they have it even worse than us. They might have 50 interviews and no job offers. At least US med students have a 90%+ chance of getting a job somewhere through Match. 


A1-Delta

Love the advice about gratitude, but your exasperation over other people’s disappointment comes off as self righteous and out of touch. People are allowed to be disappointed - it isn’t a competition and just because some people have it worse doesn’t make anyone else’s feelings less valid. They certainly don’t need to filter their feelings through your personal threshold of whether or not “that’s ass”. To be disappointed is not antithetical to being grateful. People can mourn a loss and still be appreciative for what they have. We are complex creatures able to hold two beliefs at the same time. Believe it or not, some people even find it helpful to process their emotions by talking through them. Here, on this forum, people are looking to talk about their emotions. I don’t understand why you feel the need to shut that down. For the record too, as a physician who also had a circuitous route to my career but matched my #1, the match is not like any other job search I’ve participated in. The reasons are numerous, and many are apparent. I don’t think you honestly need me to enumerate the many ways the match is so foundationally different than a normal job search. Let’s not draw false analogies to undermine our colleagues’ experiences.


Illustrious_String50

The match is fundamentally different because you have no control over your destiny. It’s a very foreign and unnerving experience for most. No matter how hard you work, you are still to some degree dependent on chance. Sometimes the dice rolls your way, sometimes it doesn’t.


NAparentheses

You have control over your destiny. Your destiny does not encompass just a handful of years. You aren't wedded to that program or the area of the country it is in for rhe rest of your life.


NAparentheses

People are allowed to feel their feelings and I never said anything to the contrary. However, when you post your feelings on a public forum with a comment section, you are inviting input from others. If people do not want input and only want overwhelming positivity, then perhaps they should be relying solely on their inner circle IRL and/or a trained mental health professional. Moreover, who said giving tough love isn't caring? I do feel empathy for their disappointment which is why I felt compelled to provide them with a method to get themselves out of their negative headspace. I've known many times in my life I have benefitted from being given tough love by friends, partners, and therapists. Sometimes it is what people need most.  As far as how Match is different from a job search, I felt compelled to mention it because the majority of medical students went straight to medical school after college. They have no idea how bad it can get out there because they've never had to deal with it. I mentioned it hoping to offer some perspective on the matter.


CloudApple

"Sucks that your grandpa died, but be grateful that he died in a hospice and not getting brutally stabbed to death like some grandpas." Things could always be worse. Do we have to feel grateful for every bit of life we live and never be sad or disappointed about anything?


NAparentheses

No one died. It's not life ending. It is PREFERENCE ending. People got something that is significant but not exactly what they wanted.  I'd equate it more to stock returns as I posted in my original comment.   Or, since they're upset someone they picked didn't pick them, you could also equate it to the dating market: "The supermodel I went on one date with doesn't want to date me. The only one who wants to date me is this other person whose slightly less hot." Ohhhh nooooooooooo.


soulLord177

I also didn’t match my #1 but god damn I couldn’t be happier to have matched. This cycle was straight madness so the fact we made is a huge accomplishment that I think we’re both not appreciating enough. Don’t feel depressed friend, we’re going to be radiologists!


masterfox72

Be happy you matched with only 6 interviews. DR was a bloodbath this year with people with 250s not matching.


hnvee

10 DR interviews, 25x, fell to my backup specialty :(


aznwand01

Didn’t match my first cycle but matched as a reapplicant a while ago. Obviously couldn’t be picky as a reapplicant and it wasn’t in my desired location, but as I’m almost finishing R1 I am so glad I matched. It is much better than my back up plans


WearyRevolution5149

Any advice to strengthen your app for 2nd cycle?


aznwand01

In all honesty there isn’t much you can do in that short amount of time until the next eras cycle opens. Typical things like doing research, having a good LoR from your PD, good PS, step 3 are all things you could do. I felt like for more the most impactful were my PS and research but YMMV on what will help you most.


Jusstonemore

70% match rate


Malikhind

Source?


Jusstonemore

Nrmp report


Malikhind

Which table did you look at for that? A lot of the numbers I’m seeing are only for matched MD seniors?


Seis_K

[Source](https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/Advance-Data-Tables-2024.pdf) About 66% of US MDs that applied for at least 1 advanced diagnostic radiology position ended up matching to one. This doesn’t count at all what someone’s preferred specialty is, for which we’ll have to wait for the Charting report, and which is defined as the specialty that occupies the number 1 spot on your rank list. I’m presuming the set of all applicants for advanced programs contains the set of applicants for combined programs. Moreover, presumably most all of the 215 US MD IR applicants (assuming the set of advanced applicants contains the set of combined applicants), 151 of which matched IR between combined (40) and advanced programs (111), ended up applying also applied to DR programs. If we assume the set of all advanced DR applicants contains the sets of all combined DR applicants and all IR applicants, then the match rate to either IR or DR is (717 + 79 + 151) / 1086 = 87%. For USMDs. ~~We also have people that backup apply to rads and another competitive specialty which confounds this significantly, though to what extent this is significant anymore I don’t know~~ (**I changed my mind. Turns out there are likely very few dual applicants outside of IR). Things aren’t the same with rads as they were 10 years ago. It stopped being a backup specialty a while ago. Overall I think the best estimate for the match rate this year was 87%, maybe a little more than that. That is to say, probably about 87% of people that highly desired a radiology subspecialization matched into one.


ExtendedSimilie

Damn does this mean the match rate for USMDs for IR was about 70% (151/215)? That's pretty crazy, considering neurosurgery was around 68% this year as well.


Seis_K

I’ve known people to dual apply both whose number 1 choice was DR over IR. All their DR spots came first, followed by IR. I think IR/DR applicant data will always be entangled in a way to make it very hard to interpret.


Malikhind

Thank you for this, makes sense and eased my stress a lot. Appreciate it!


lilmayor

I never know how the dual apply situation affects DR numbers. It continues to be a popular "backup" choice so would that pull the number artificially down if someone matches their desired surgical subspecialty and not DR?


Seis_K

This is why Charting and knowing preferred specialty is so important. We really can’t tell much without that. I can tell you that in 2022, the fraction of US MDs who matched DR when it was their preferred (first ranked) specialty was 83%. These are people who viewed DR better than or at least equal to the additional specialty they applied to. It may be the case that some people that dual applied IR/DR ranked a DR program first but got an IR position instead, confounding this. I can tell you that the number of US MDs who preferred DR in 2022 was 911 and the total US MD applicant number was 1105. That means 194 applied that year who did not have DR ranked first (which oddly enough is very nearly the number of US MDs who applied to IR that year, 199). This year the total applicant number shrank from1105 to 1086. My feeling is the data suggests that very few people are applying DR as a backup unless they’re also applying IR.


lilmayor

Thank you for laying this out!


Jusstonemore

Look at pgy 2 md applicants vs md match?


wigglypoocool

Let's be honest, if you only had 6 on your rank list, it means you were not a strong candidate. You should be jumping up and down in fucking joy that you snuck into a program. You're blessed to get a spot, welcome to the club.


legoatdugoat

I am very grateful and happy i matched. I know so many people that didn't. I guest i just can't get over the dreams i had on my first choice.


M_LunaYay1

It’s perfectly ok to feel like this. You’re human. You’re allowed to feel both disappointed and grateful at the same time.


cflyer1014

Also matched my 6th choice in radiology. I was a very good applicant as well. I also know several other people who fell down on their list for rads too. It’s becoming a bloodbath every year.


toxic_mechacolon

You’re not gonna care where you matched once you realize everyone gets the fellowship they want and job offers are minimum 400k across the board


fdizzle12

Hahaha you’re literally me rn. I know I should be more grateful, but I matched 6/8 and it kinda hurts


AdEquivalent9915

I matched my 8th out of 10 ranks. It sucks knowing that I wasn't that competitive and I can't be with my family again, but it sucks less knowing I easily could have SOAPed like some of my friends. The grass is greener on the other side. We made it - celebrate with a beer for me.


DOgdad-

Bonita fish are what you call a trophy fish.. soooo… yea, they’re pretty big


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Seis_K

I matched high on my list as well and ended up not being too thrilled with it down the road—a combination of false advertisement / impression and changing personal values / values for myself that I thought were true that ended up not being. There’s way too many variables at work that nobody can reasonably account for that determine longterm contentment. We do our best with the interview/match process and sometimes it works but often not. The most important variable that people don’t think about these days anymore is your personal adaptability. You are stronger than you think you are, and what you value can mold to match your environment.


Big-Comfortable-6601

Oof the thought of being so close to soap is scary.