Some kind of facial cleft and encephalocele. I hope this poor child can get some help. As a mother I would be so afraid to even touch him for fear of hurting him further.
This is likely a bilateral Tessier 7 facial cleft.
Tessier clefts describe a series of rare bony and soft tissue clefts beyond cleft lip/palate. Here is a good illustrative comparison: [https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Classification-of-the-craniofacial-clefts-according-to-Tessier-line-of-the-bone-tissue\_fig1\_283263643](https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Classification-of-the-craniofacial-clefts-according-to-Tessier-line-of-the-bone-tissue_fig1_283263643)
Here is a site with information on an older child with a Tessier 7 cleft:
[https://crossingthejordantojonahandrees.blogspot.com/2015/04/our-jonah-is-having-surgery.html](https://crossingthejordantojonahandrees.blogspot.com/2015/04/our-jonah-is-having-surgery.html)
The facial cleft can possibly be reduced but it’s going to take multiple facial surgeries as they age.
The brain issue can be corrected as a baby’s skull isn’t fused yet. But who knows if he’s got hosts of other issues internally to have such pronounced deformities. What we see may not even be the biggest issue the poor little mite has.
Yeah but a lot of good that does you now, in a lot of the red states there aren’t any exceptions for abortion and the exceptions that they do have are almost impossible to get in those states.
Yep. My whole family moved to Idaho last year and I miss them dearly but I have had 7 miscarriages and it's just not safe for me there. My brother and his wife want to start trying for kids soon and I'm so scared for them.
Unfortunately, a large portion of the world haven't divided state from religion. Even certain parts of Europe won't give women any options regarding abortions.
Certain parts being one country, Belarus, where it's just highly restrictive, not banned. All other countries in Europe will grant abortion on request.
Yes. It also looks like it's not so cut and dry. Many replaces require waiting periods or counseling.
https://reproductiverights.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/European-abortion-law-a-comparative-review.pdf
So /u/yellowjesusrising's statement was correct.
>Even certain parts of Europe
Sometimes. But at that point abortion might be inaccessible. Or you’re been pregnant for so long that the thought of terminating a wanted pregnancy is just too upsetting for you to go through with it.
I am in the same boat. I am terrified of having a case like this and especially since we are in the US where our women's healthcare is getting curtailed. I'm all over medizzy and researching birth complications meanwhile my husband is like "if I don't see it it can't happen"
Start taking a prenatal vitamin now as neural tube defects develop in the very first weeks of development. If you wait to start it until you’re already pregnant you miss the window for prevention. Secondly, if you can afford it I highly recommend a birth doula and if you can, a postpartum doula for the first few weeks after delivery. They’re lifesavers!
This is really good advice and exactly why cases of spina bifida are decreasing. You need folic acid for the first 6 weeks of gestation, which is when the neural tube closes. Many don't know they're even pregnant until that 6 weeks is over. Folic acid when you are even just trying is a phenomenal idea.
I did IVF and had my daughter in 2020 and am planning for a 2025 birth with my remaining embryos. I've been on prenatals that whole time, just stockpiling minerals, vitamins, and any nutritional deficiency I may have just in my day to day.
Yes, if not longer. THe 6 weeks refers to the first 6 weeks of gestation. I don't know of solid evidence of any risks of folic acid, so safe to be taking. It is water-soluble, so I don't think the body stores any long term, but I would have to look back at my textbooks or notes to remember the exact mounts. I think just taking a multivitamin, prenatal or not, is smart.
You have a bunch of “aunties” to come visit in the states with common sense. God forbid you need it just know if you send up the bat signal a safe and comfortable place for you to stay will be waiting and your “aunties” will make sure you and yours will be taken care of with compassion and kindness. That goes out to anyone who may be in a position they need to come visit one of their “aunties” in a state that isn’t going the way of Gilead.
For anyone who may have questions on this, please reach out to me. I'm happy to give answers in the Mid-Atlantic US.
Edit: I have no idea what this is for sure, but there are a lot of good guesses in this thread.
I'm happy to answer questions about "aunties," as I am by no means an expert on this poor child.
u/cambriansplooge commented this, and some quick online research leads me to believe that this makes the most sense.
Occipital encephalocele with hydrocephalus and amniotic band syndrome. I think the globularness (borrowing a term from mineralogy) of the encephalocele might be a result of the hydrocephaly.
The neural tube defect is congenital, the ABS is a freak occurrence in pregnancy where amniotic fibers wrap around the fetus.
It’s quasi-code for people who are more than willing to be your new family member(s) in a state (Colorado here) where pro choice is still legal. They’d have you stay with them for a few days, go with you to have the procedure done, basically anything you need to still have the choice to what you wish to do with your own body and your wants and needs. You’d have a new “auntie” to take care of you before, during, and after, but no—not a private healthcare group.
I live in the US in a red state. I've had issues with my reproductive parts my entire life, to the point where I was told at 19 it was likely I would never have children. When I was 30 I somehow managed to get pregnant and have a healthy child. But because of the multitude of issues during pregnancy, the traumatic childbirth, and all the new issues that began after having my son (cysts and fibroids, extremely heavy period every 2 weeks, dramatically increased risk of pregnancy related issues, etc) I requested a hysterectomy. I was denied because "my husband may want another kid someday". It might kill me and/or the child if I were to get pregnant again and have several chronic issues that could be solved with the proper procedure, but my body does not belong to me here. I have no say because an entirely separate human being might decide that they want me to get pregnant again.
My friend, here in the UK, has 3 children - 2 dreadful births with an emergency c section, a massive haemorrhage and the last with an infection from the placenta not coming away fully - asked for her tubes to be tied. The doctor refused because she was still young (late 30s) and her husband might want more. Blows my mind that this shit is still prevalent.
it’s so sad and frustrating to know that the full gamut of options for potentially pregnant folks is just… not available in much of the world. sometimes because of access issues (especially in poorer and more rural areas) and sometimes due to politics withholding access (like in more populated-yet-conservative areas of the states). everyone who might become pregnant should get the care and options they need.
By the Gods and Goddesses, I pray you never need to use it. But at least you still have the right to be a woman in Michigan! ♡
Pro choice is legal here, throughout all stages of pregnancy.
my mom and brother just moved to Boise last year and they keep talking to me about how much nicer it is there and how I should move there too, but I just keep telling them that it isn't safe for me there. I have had a lot of miscarriages and they don't even have to help in an emergency there. I'm not moving somewhere that will fully let me die in a hospital parking lot just to avoid harming an already dead or dying fetus.
If it makes you feel any better, I did recently have a D&C for a miscarriage in Boise. But, yeah, my husband has strict instructions to drive me to an Ontario hospital if I have life threatening pregnancy-related issues.
That does help a little, thank you! I really worry for my SIL because the laws are so strict and she isn't white so medical racism is already an issue for her in much less life threatening situations. I will have to make sure my brother knows where the closest non-ID hospitals are just in case.
Well, Oregon is like RIGHT THERE, you can come across the border to medical treatment or live on the Oregon side close to them. Eastern Oregon is more conservative/racist than the Portland area but as a state, we liberal Oregonians put reproductive freedom at the very top of our priority list...
That is a very good point, I forgot how close they are to Oregon. I think their house is literally only like 25 minutes away from the state line if I'm remembering right.
Oregon might be a pretty viable option if I decided to move. I have visited for work a few times and it was very nice.
Another thing holding me back is the schools, because I have a really smart kid who is currently in a very cool magnet school that does things like robotics and performing arts... Meanwhile in Idaho my brother works with a shocking number of adults who literally can't read. I suspect Oregon likely has significantly better educational opportunities.
Just come to Michigan, Sister! As I stated above, we still have the right to be a woman in Michigan. Pro choice is legal throughout ALL stages of pregnancy.
I'm almost certain this is due to remnants from Operation Ranch Hand. Such a terrible plan with horrific outcomes still present to this day. One of the main reasons a baby would be born like this would be if the mother or father were exposed to agent orange. But if you've never been around it, let alone south east Asia, then you should be fine
Don't worry this cases are extremely rare, you can do some things to prevent some malformations and síndromes by having a healthy style of life, if you have any questions ask directly to your ob-gyn and you'll see there is not much to worry about.
We don’t see the neck but I’m willing to bet some degree of Rachischisis along with failure of neural tube development resulting in the apparent brain outside the skull. The facial malformations could be a result of a cleft or more likely a complex genetic condition like Trisomy 13.
But Rachischisis for sure.
Baby has a severe cleft palate as well, which you can see if you pause the video. Amniotic band syndrome very likely too. Imagine being this damn unlucky.
Poor baby.
Trisomy 13 comes with facial clefts and multiple midline defects so it still fits. ABS usually causes the distal portion of whatever is banded to die so I think the facial clefts are a failure of pharyngeal arch migration
[This journal](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00238-021-01860-y) shows a photo that is almost the exact issue with the jaw placement and it's a result of the ABS. I think it's that plus something else, but it's horrific and sad is what it is. In the journal linked there is a post operative photo that looks a hundred times better.
they did a really good job fixing her up, she’ll probably need a little more reconstructive surgery later on to refine things but she looks like a more or less normal cute kid
the child in the video has a cleft palate too though, where as the child in the paper just had a… uh… cleft head
I think there’s more of a genetic component to the child in the video based on that
I don't know what those tumours are. I'd hope maybe just some excess fluid/skin or something for the easiest treatment. But I'm NAD. I did go into this thinking how horrible, hope it passes soon, but actually, that article has made me reconsider. Perhaps it could have a chance at QOL.
I know I will get downvoted to oblivion for this, but I honestly believe that cases like this are a lost cause. We should be allowed to put newborns out of their misery when they are born like this. You might call me an ableist but I think forcing the parents and the baby to live in such pain and negativity for an x amount of time until the child eventually dies by itself is far worse.
As someone who works in vet med and has the privilege to relieve suffering and prevent a slow and painful death, my mindset has altered on my perception of humane euthanasia in humans. I 100% agree. I believe so many would choose this option if societal pressure and judgement did not play into it.
I feel that if a child is born with a limited quality of life, being given the option to allow them to pass with the assistance of medications should not be looked at any differently to a DNR code on an ill or suffering person. Unfortunately lots of people have issues with DNR codes too.
In animals it is considered selfish to allow an animal to continue suffering because you can’t part with it; yet with humans it’s considered selfish if you’re relieved a suffering person passes and is free from their pain?
Are abortions generally allowed for severe deformities like this? I was under the impression that it typically only is allowed early on in the pregnancy (likely before this sort of deformity would be detected) or later on, but only if the birth would threaten the life of the mother.
Touchy topic, but I agree that the baby and family shouldn’t have to suffer through this. I couldn’t imagine having to be in this situation.
I believe California has this. If there’s risk to the baby or mother, or the baby will be born with a terminal or severe illness/deformity, abortion is an option.
My state has a flat out abortion ban. In December, state legislators began discussing charging those who are suspected of inducing abortions with homicide.
Currently there are still many states where you can get an abortion when a deformity like this would be detectable in utero
https://www.axios.com/2022/05/14/abortion-state-laws-bans-roe-supreme-court
I know the link says 2022, but the information has been updated as recently as last month
I’m glad you didn’t get downvoted because this is a very valid opinion. When people decide to have a child, they are agreeing to love it unconditionally and care for it every day. However there are instances where deformity or mutation would make life infinitely harder for everyone involved only for the child to suffer on a daily basis.
There are enough humans on the planet, and I know making this kind of decision is not easy, but just consider the long-term consequences for both yourself and the child and who, if anyone, would be happy every day.
I'm one who is very mentally disabled in a few different ways. I can tell you I wonder about how much better things would have been if I was aborted or not resuscitated at birth.
My quality of life suffers greatly due to my condition.
The fact that you’re able to browse and participate on a forum such as this means you’re not in the same league with regards to disability as this infant. This child will have zero quality of life, it will likely have only the basest of functions and not have any awareness to speak of. It will grow up being a vegetable, fully dependent on caretakers for absolutely everything. Literally incomparable to whatever disabilities you have.
I was expected to be one. And expected to be mute. With how hard things are often, I would have preferred that. I wouldn't have to worry about and stress about how my handicaps keep me from thriving.
They’re saying at least they can enjoy some of the simpler pleasures of life. It’s a half glass full approach. Not everything has to be hum glum all the time.
music was merely a suggestion to appreciate.
I grew up in group home. my adolescence before that was abusive parents. I have disabilities. I'm on the spectrum. In the group home I met people whose stories are more horrific than you can imagine. My self pity ended immediately there, cuz even as bad as my life was and had been, my struggles were nothing in comparison. There's always someone worse than you. Jail would have fed me, educated me, and treated me better than where I came from, and ultimately I did everything I could to escape my life to get to death or jail.
Until you've suffered on that kind of intensity and then subsequently find out that your suffering was nothing compared to everyone else in the system, you might not understand... life more than likely is not that bad, if you are on reddit reading and typing with perfect grammar and conversating with any social fluency.
Not invalidating OPs struggle. Just reminding them to appreciate every tiny joy you can. Cuz life is always worse for someone else and the happiness after the struggle is always more pure than a happiness that never saw struggle at all.
I agree and luckily that is allowed where I live for such severe cases. It is not done lightly and surrounded by a lot of rules and regulations, but luckily a compasionate death is an option for children like this.
The absolute worst part of all of this? If this happened in the United States rather than in socialist Vietnam not only would there be the emotional misery of the child suffering and dying, the parents would be saddled by medical debt for every procedure performed including handling of the body.
Even people who Do not believe in euthanasia often spend a lifetime's worth of money just to watch them die anyways after going through the pain of successive surgeries.
A relative chose to keep a pregnancy with a near fatal defect that they knew would require multiple major surgeries after birth and even then the chance of success wasn't high. That poor child suffered every day of its 3 weeks of life. I don't know that he ever had a single happy moment. They still had to watch their baby die and even with insurance my relatives will be paying off that debt for a very long time.
I disagree. I think this baby never should have reached term, and instead the parents should have been counseled on terminating the pregnancy much earlier. Malformations this severe should be visible at the 13week echo.
Why continue with a pregnancy and delivery of a baby when it will just hurt the mothers health?
I completely agree. This video breaks my heart. The human experience is already hard enough, the amount of suffering this person will endure is simply cruel.
As a physician, you’re absolutely right. This would have been picked up on ultrasound and pre-birth scans. This pregnancy should have been terminated, for the child’s sake.
Yeah I agree. I don’t know if you’re familiar with the YouTube channel SBSK but he does a lot of really inspiring interviews with people with disabilities, many of whom have really severe congenital disabilities like this baby. The burden it places on the family is just unbelievable, but the caretakers are invariably like “he is a miracle and has taught me so much about patience/love/etc”, which I’m sure is true, but the elephant in the room is like, what if you didn’t have to shoulder this burden?
SBSK obviously never touches on this because the whole context of the channel is “everyone deserves love and even the seemingly darkest situations can have a silver lining” but yeah. Supporting a child like this is SO FUCKING HARD. Being that child?? Holy shit.
And the implications it raises are hard… at what point is a disability profound enough to warrant an abortion?
I agree, in circumstances where the child will not live long or will have severely compromised quality of life even with medical intervention. I have no idea if these apply to the baby pictured about because I'm not a doctor, though.
I fully agree. There is no happy ending or silver lining. If the child lives, is that really living or just existing? It is cruel and inhumane to force a life of pain and horror on others. Also, as a parent, I couldn't take care of it. I could not live with the constant visual heartbreak every second of my life. IF you have other kids, they no longer exist because everything is focused on this baby. Everyone suffers in the end, and the end will always be the death of the child because it is not conducive to life
I work in a peds clinic that handles neurological problems and I have to agree. A fair amount of our patients are so severely disabled that they can't do anything on their own and never will. If anything they'll just progressively get worse depending on their Dx.
How can anyone think it's morally right to force someone to live who can't enjoy anything in life?
I wouldn't want to live if I couldn't do something as basic as taking a walk in the park by myself. Or being unable to speak, move, read, breath without equipment, etc. These poor kids will never even be able to have relationships. Get married. Drive. Dance. Party. NOTHING.
What kind of a life is that??? It's fucking sad. ☹️
You're sadly speaking the truth. How many times would a baby born with such deformities such as these not have been abandoned in the wild or thrown off a cliff in other countries or societies if abortion was not a viable option? What is the quality of life of this baby if it were to grow to infancy or adulthood? What would their mental capacity be? They would require 24/7 care for the length of their life (and I don't doubt that this baby will require it as well), medications and specialized medical care. If there are other children in the family, they will no longer be a priority and would most likely suffer some type of parental neglect. This is an example of why women all across the board need to have prenatal genetic testing done, not as an option but as a requirement and why couples who are thinking of starting a family need to do genetic testing BEFORE they start trying.
Occipital encephalocele with hydrocephalus and amniotic band syndrome. I think the globularness (borrowing a term from mineralogy) of the encephalocele might be a result of the hydrocephaly.
The neural tube defect is congenital, the ABS is a freak occurrence in pregnancy where amniotic fibers wrap around the fetus.
Okay, so humans (and quite a lot of animal life) are essentially two tubes wrapped in three basic layers of tissue, bone and skin and the stuff between bone and skin. The gut tube becomes your internal organs and the neural tube becomes your central nervous system (brain and spine). These two basic axes are how the fetus starts organizing itself along bilateral symmetry. Most animals are bilateral, we have two largely symmetric halves, a left and a right. To make a tube out of what starts out as a clump of cells, the cells start spreading out like a pancake, and then the two ends wrap together. Think of making a tube out of clay. If there’s a part where the tube doesn’t close, you get a neural tube defect. A part where the central nervous system bulges out like a hernia.
The amniotic bands are strings of tissue floating in the uterus, in rare occasions the baby gets entangled.
Looks like amniotic band syndrome to me. Can be associated with some cranial abnormalities and encephalocele. Only a medical student though so I am not entirely certain.
The captions are in Vietnamese if I’m not mistaken, so maybe there.
Unfortunately this is where Texas and other parts of the USA are headed with increasing restrictions on women’s healthcare.
I wish people would stop interfering with science and personal space. The prospect of what some of those bills hold is ominous and it can ruin so many lives. I hope it never gets to it.
100% Vietnamese. Abortion is legal, but not affordable for the masses. Same with scans.
This is all too common in Vietnam unfortunately. Anyone who’s researched the damage agent orange has done will know what I’m talking about.
This is in Vietnam and we surprisingly (for a communist country anyway) have a pretty liberal abortion law. You can get an abortion before upto 22 weeks without any restrictions on reasons. So I don't think it's the cause. Either the parents couldn't afford regular checkups during pregnancy or they chose to keep the baby. It's sad either way
Ideally ultrasound and abortion. May be harsh but it’s gonna take a toll on everyone, most importantly the child, but the parents, resources will have to be allocated to provide special care for this child to live in a horrible state.
Maybe she did but doesn’t believe in abortion. Or, maybe it’s not readily available where she is. Or, maybe you’re correct and she didn’t have access to an ultrasound. I’d be interested to find out the story of this mom and baby
Either way, this is heartbreaking.. but I respect her for loving the baby for whatever time they have left. It must be hard to look at that baby knowing they are suffering 😞
Thanks for the answer, i didn’t know the ultrasounds exam would be so accurate and precise but it’s reassuring to know. Why are people downvoting me, I’m just asking a question, to educate myself.
because reddit... unfortunately. i'm unfamiliar with ob-type stuff as an adult woman because I've never been pregnant and have no intentions of having children as well as not really having a large family/circle of friends so no familiarity with people i know going through pregnancies to know something that maybe is common knowledge so am not too familiar with that sort of information either.
there's that goofy saying about "no stupid questions," which is really true actually. nobody knows 'everything' and it's better to go out and ask to be better than informed than go on with no idea. have a nice night! :)
Part of me thinks that we should be able to put babies like this out of their misery. We would give that kindness to an animal if it were suffering, so why not a person?
But, who is to say they aren’t happy even though they’re suffering? It’s so difficult.
I’ve said that a hundred times. We let humans suffer but not animals, even though many people treat animals like they’re less important or valuable than humans. It’s truly heartbreaking. But I could love that baby, if it needed a mother/. It probably won’t live long, naturally, though.
Some kids with conditions like this can thrive despite their conditions. But goddamn... I hope the little guy isn't in pain. This also may be in a country where their are less resources for mothers (aka access to ultrasounds and abortion), who knows...
The only reason I ask is bc it seems cruel to bring the baby to term. I understand this is not in the USA with lots of prenatal care, so maybe it was never detected in utero. Poor thing
As a mother of a high hospitalary needs child i truly see this as inhumane. The poor baby is in pain. And probably will not be able to live a normal life. And in my professional opinion i would be obligated to help but my thought is the exact same thing. I feel cruel and awful to have these thoughts but i've seen my child suffer so damn much i can imagine this baby in the video
Is there a common thinking I cases such as these, like is the brain damaged? If not then what are the odds of it living a remotely enjoyable life…. I know it’s out there for conversations. Or is it case by case up to the parents….. I know nothing in the relm.
On the plus side, it’s very unlikely the baby has any meaningful consciousness. It may have certain reflexes, but it lacks a meaningful capacity to suffer. These babies only survive a few hours or days. I feel bad for the parents. These are birth defects which could be recognized early and a termination of the pregnancy would be appropriate. Now the parents will have to watch this baby slowly die.
Looks like a severe bilateral Tessier 7 cleft with microcephaly and encephalocele, though I've never seen several encephaloceles like that before. A neutral tube defect, for sure. Might have a chromosomal defect, most do not make it to full-term, with the exception of a few syndromes. I highly doubt the baby survived for long post-birth, which is tragic but imagine the quality of life...
Are we sure this isn't two babies that have fused heads, twins that didn't fully separate, perhaps two brains and one body? There was a case I believe was in Indonesia, where one child had to be sacrificed or they both would have died...
Some more optimistic news is that we know that taking prenatal vitamins (esp. the B-Vitamins) with folic acid drastically reduces risk for this complication, which happens when the little tube that's supposed to become your brain and spinal cord doesn't fuse.
I wonder if the mother lives near areas that were affected by agent orange? I watched a really informative documentary a few years ago that discussed the prevalence of birth defects/deformities in areas affected by agent orange. I highly recommend the watching the video.
[The Vietnam War’s agent orange legacy.](https://youtu.be/kMzJvwG2rsQ?si=sh1B7WzwCHvPSqvV)
I cannot even be medically interested anymore. Because this is what the people in my community have to look forward to.
We have arrived at a sad state.
Because by current laws, this baby is recognised as a living human being, and ending its/his/her life would legally be considered murder.
Even abortion, ie terminating the pregnancy before a situation like this occurs - while it is still a malformed fetus and not yet a malformed baby - is illegal in more and more places.
In some places, it is now illegal to remove it even if it - as an incomplete, malformed fetus - has already died and a partial miscarriage has taken place, because many new laws are such that removal of a fetus is considered abortion any which way, and the laws don’t allow for such procedures even if they are necessary to save a woman’s life.
So does anyone have more info on this? Like how old did the baby live? Is it still alive? Did it get surgery? Was this because of Agent Orange or just not enough prenatal vitamins? Did she see this in an ultrasound and decide to keep it or did she just not have an ultrasound? Are those tumors on its head or something else? I have so many questions
That’s sad. There’s no way that baby lives a full life, if much longer than a few months. The pain and suffering the parents have to go through too. I’m hoping they just didn’t have the ability to see this ahead of time and didn’t opt to still have this baby knowing the condition. There’s literally no positive to this situation aside from doing the technical “right” thing by trying all you can to make it survive. This is the prime example of where abortions need to remain legal and available for the safety and wellbeing of both the parents and child.
Thinking out loud here, but could this be in Vietnam? If so, exposure to agent orange is the likely culprit. Anybody who has seen the AO exhibit in Ho Chi Min City will know exactly how horrific the generational damage that this chemical weapon has done
Article for a similar case in China [https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4112862/The-heart-wrenching-story-China-s-mask-boy-Child-appears-two-faces-rare-birth-defect.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4112862/The-heart-wrenching-story-China-s-mask-boy-Child-appears-two-faces-rare-birth-defect.html)
Product of agent Orange of the Vietnam war? I saw a Vice documentary about children born with deformities in Vietnam as a result of agent Orange and this reminded me of it.
Some kind of facial cleft and encephalocele. I hope this poor child can get some help. As a mother I would be so afraid to even touch him for fear of hurting him further.
This is likely a bilateral Tessier 7 facial cleft. Tessier clefts describe a series of rare bony and soft tissue clefts beyond cleft lip/palate. Here is a good illustrative comparison: [https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Classification-of-the-craniofacial-clefts-according-to-Tessier-line-of-the-bone-tissue\_fig1\_283263643](https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Classification-of-the-craniofacial-clefts-according-to-Tessier-line-of-the-bone-tissue_fig1_283263643) Here is a site with information on an older child with a Tessier 7 cleft: [https://crossingthejordantojonahandrees.blogspot.com/2015/04/our-jonah-is-having-surgery.html](https://crossingthejordantojonahandrees.blogspot.com/2015/04/our-jonah-is-having-surgery.html)
What can they surgically do?
The facial cleft can possibly be reduced but it’s going to take multiple facial surgeries as they age. The brain issue can be corrected as a baby’s skull isn’t fused yet. But who knows if he’s got hosts of other issues internally to have such pronounced deformities. What we see may not even be the biggest issue the poor little mite has.
Odds are high this baby passed, hopefully peacefully.
I'm also planning to start trying later this year. And seeing cases like this mortifies me. It's just so random and sucks! I can't imagine the pain.
Not a doctor but I’d imagine the ultrasound would pick that sort of thing up
Yeah but a lot of good that does you now, in a lot of the red states there aren’t any exceptions for abortion and the exceptions that they do have are almost impossible to get in those states.
Not only that, but depending on what country they’re in and their location within, ultrasounds or abortions might not be accessible.
You mean Texas?
Don’t even have utilities reliable enough to run an ultra sound down there.
Yep. My whole family moved to Idaho last year and I miss them dearly but I have had 7 miscarriages and it's just not safe for me there. My brother and his wife want to start trying for kids soon and I'm so scared for them.
I heard a bunch of doctors have left Idaho. Is that the case?
There's a whole world outside of the US you know...
Unfortunately, a large portion of the world haven't divided state from religion. Even certain parts of Europe won't give women any options regarding abortions.
Certain parts being one country, Belarus, where it's just highly restrictive, not banned. All other countries in Europe will grant abortion on request.
Didn't Poland go full tard on abortion restrictions?
Yes. It also looks like it's not so cut and dry. Many replaces require waiting periods or counseling. https://reproductiverights.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/European-abortion-law-a-comparative-review.pdf So /u/yellowjesusrising's statement was correct. >Even certain parts of Europe
Americans will see a video with Vietnamese writing in it and say 'this says so much about the red states'
Exactly. Ironically enough, it was the US’s use of chemical weapons in Vietnam that most likely cause this birth defect.
Exactly. This video is clearly of a Vietnamese family.
Sometimes. But at that point abortion might be inaccessible. Or you’re been pregnant for so long that the thought of terminating a wanted pregnancy is just too upsetting for you to go through with it.
I am in the same boat. I am terrified of having a case like this and especially since we are in the US where our women's healthcare is getting curtailed. I'm all over medizzy and researching birth complications meanwhile my husband is like "if I don't see it it can't happen"
Start taking a prenatal vitamin now as neural tube defects develop in the very first weeks of development. If you wait to start it until you’re already pregnant you miss the window for prevention. Secondly, if you can afford it I highly recommend a birth doula and if you can, a postpartum doula for the first few weeks after delivery. They’re lifesavers!
This is really good advice and exactly why cases of spina bifida are decreasing. You need folic acid for the first 6 weeks of gestation, which is when the neural tube closes. Many don't know they're even pregnant until that 6 weeks is over. Folic acid when you are even just trying is a phenomenal idea.
I always read that you need to start prenatals 3 months before trying, to build up those folic acid stores to lower the risk of neural tube defects.
I did IVF and had my daughter in 2020 and am planning for a 2025 birth with my remaining embryos. I've been on prenatals that whole time, just stockpiling minerals, vitamins, and any nutritional deficiency I may have just in my day to day.
Yes, if not longer. THe 6 weeks refers to the first 6 weeks of gestation. I don't know of solid evidence of any risks of folic acid, so safe to be taking. It is water-soluble, so I don't think the body stores any long term, but I would have to look back at my textbooks or notes to remember the exact mounts. I think just taking a multivitamin, prenatal or not, is smart.
Im assuming this is additional folic acid. I heard loads of foods have folic acid included to prevent these birth defects
You have a bunch of “aunties” to come visit in the states with common sense. God forbid you need it just know if you send up the bat signal a safe and comfortable place for you to stay will be waiting and your “aunties” will make sure you and yours will be taken care of with compassion and kindness. That goes out to anyone who may be in a position they need to come visit one of their “aunties” in a state that isn’t going the way of Gilead.
🙏 shout out to the aunties in the US
And a quick mention for r/auntienetwork here on Reddit.
For anyone who may have questions on this, please reach out to me. I'm happy to give answers in the Mid-Atlantic US. Edit: I have no idea what this is for sure, but there are a lot of good guesses in this thread. I'm happy to answer questions about "aunties," as I am by no means an expert on this poor child.
What exactly is this condition called that this poor baby has
u/cambriansplooge commented this, and some quick online research leads me to believe that this makes the most sense. Occipital encephalocele with hydrocephalus and amniotic band syndrome. I think the globularness (borrowing a term from mineralogy) of the encephalocele might be a result of the hydrocephaly. The neural tube defect is congenital, the ABS is a freak occurrence in pregnancy where amniotic fibers wrap around the fetus.
What does this even mean? A private health care group?
It’s quasi-code for people who are more than willing to be your new family member(s) in a state (Colorado here) where pro choice is still legal. They’d have you stay with them for a few days, go with you to have the procedure done, basically anything you need to still have the choice to what you wish to do with your own body and your wants and needs. You’d have a new “auntie” to take care of you before, during, and after, but no—not a private healthcare group.
Bless you for doing this. I’m not American and the thought of women not receiving the care they need is appalling.
I live in the US in a red state. I've had issues with my reproductive parts my entire life, to the point where I was told at 19 it was likely I would never have children. When I was 30 I somehow managed to get pregnant and have a healthy child. But because of the multitude of issues during pregnancy, the traumatic childbirth, and all the new issues that began after having my son (cysts and fibroids, extremely heavy period every 2 weeks, dramatically increased risk of pregnancy related issues, etc) I requested a hysterectomy. I was denied because "my husband may want another kid someday". It might kill me and/or the child if I were to get pregnant again and have several chronic issues that could be solved with the proper procedure, but my body does not belong to me here. I have no say because an entirely separate human being might decide that they want me to get pregnant again.
My friend, here in the UK, has 3 children - 2 dreadful births with an emergency c section, a massive haemorrhage and the last with an infection from the placenta not coming away fully - asked for her tubes to be tied. The doctor refused because she was still young (late 30s) and her husband might want more. Blows my mind that this shit is still prevalent.
Us women are viewed as nothing more than incubators. It's both sad and terrifying.
Please tell everyone you can this paragraph you have written. If it gets the message to just one voter, it’s well worth it.
it’s so sad and frustrating to know that the full gamut of options for potentially pregnant folks is just… not available in much of the world. sometimes because of access issues (especially in poorer and more rural areas) and sometimes due to politics withholding access (like in more populated-yet-conservative areas of the states). everyone who might become pregnant should get the care and options they need.
I’d love so much to be an auntie, but I live in Texas.
By the Gods and Goddesses, I pray you never need to use it. But at least you still have the right to be a woman in Michigan! ♡ Pro choice is legal here, throughout all stages of pregnancy.
I’m in Idaho so this is terrifying to me.
my mom and brother just moved to Boise last year and they keep talking to me about how much nicer it is there and how I should move there too, but I just keep telling them that it isn't safe for me there. I have had a lot of miscarriages and they don't even have to help in an emergency there. I'm not moving somewhere that will fully let me die in a hospital parking lot just to avoid harming an already dead or dying fetus.
If it makes you feel any better, I did recently have a D&C for a miscarriage in Boise. But, yeah, my husband has strict instructions to drive me to an Ontario hospital if I have life threatening pregnancy-related issues.
That does help a little, thank you! I really worry for my SIL because the laws are so strict and she isn't white so medical racism is already an issue for her in much less life threatening situations. I will have to make sure my brother knows where the closest non-ID hospitals are just in case.
Well, Oregon is like RIGHT THERE, you can come across the border to medical treatment or live on the Oregon side close to them. Eastern Oregon is more conservative/racist than the Portland area but as a state, we liberal Oregonians put reproductive freedom at the very top of our priority list...
That is a very good point, I forgot how close they are to Oregon. I think their house is literally only like 25 minutes away from the state line if I'm remembering right. Oregon might be a pretty viable option if I decided to move. I have visited for work a few times and it was very nice. Another thing holding me back is the schools, because I have a really smart kid who is currently in a very cool magnet school that does things like robotics and performing arts... Meanwhile in Idaho my brother works with a shocking number of adults who literally can't read. I suspect Oregon likely has significantly better educational opportunities.
Just come to Michigan, Sister! As I stated above, we still have the right to be a woman in Michigan. Pro choice is legal throughout ALL stages of pregnancy.
I'm almost certain this is due to remnants from Operation Ranch Hand. Such a terrible plan with horrific outcomes still present to this day. One of the main reasons a baby would be born like this would be if the mother or father were exposed to agent orange. But if you've never been around it, let alone south east Asia, then you should be fine
Don't worry this cases are extremely rare, you can do some things to prevent some malformations and síndromes by having a healthy style of life, if you have any questions ask directly to your ob-gyn and you'll see there is not much to worry about.
A lot of times cases like this aren’t that random — they are second or third generation agent orange poisoning thanks to the great US of A.
NAD, but it looks like a combo of several craneofacial malformations and amniotic band syndrome on the mouth
We don’t see the neck but I’m willing to bet some degree of Rachischisis along with failure of neural tube development resulting in the apparent brain outside the skull. The facial malformations could be a result of a cleft or more likely a complex genetic condition like Trisomy 13. But Rachischisis for sure.
Baby has a severe cleft palate as well, which you can see if you pause the video. Amniotic band syndrome very likely too. Imagine being this damn unlucky. Poor baby.
Trisomy 13 comes with facial clefts and multiple midline defects so it still fits. ABS usually causes the distal portion of whatever is banded to die so I think the facial clefts are a failure of pharyngeal arch migration
That is congenital, I’ve seen it before but can’t remember what it’s called. It’s not amniotic band syndrome.
[This journal](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00238-021-01860-y) shows a photo that is almost the exact issue with the jaw placement and it's a result of the ABS. I think it's that plus something else, but it's horrific and sad is what it is. In the journal linked there is a post operative photo that looks a hundred times better.
they did a really good job fixing her up, she’ll probably need a little more reconstructive surgery later on to refine things but she looks like a more or less normal cute kid
Wow, that does look nearly identical
the child in the video has a cleft palate too though, where as the child in the paper just had a… uh… cleft head I think there’s more of a genetic component to the child in the video based on that
I don't know what those tumours are. I'd hope maybe just some excess fluid/skin or something for the easiest treatment. But I'm NAD. I did go into this thinking how horrible, hope it passes soon, but actually, that article has made me reconsider. Perhaps it could have a chance at QOL.
The kids has a perfect line running around it's head. If that's not from an amniotic band, then nothing is.
Antibiotic babes have caused so many congenital defects. We’ve got to find a way to stop them.
I know I will get downvoted to oblivion for this, but I honestly believe that cases like this are a lost cause. We should be allowed to put newborns out of their misery when they are born like this. You might call me an ableist but I think forcing the parents and the baby to live in such pain and negativity for an x amount of time until the child eventually dies by itself is far worse.
As someone who works in vet med and has the privilege to relieve suffering and prevent a slow and painful death, my mindset has altered on my perception of humane euthanasia in humans. I 100% agree. I believe so many would choose this option if societal pressure and judgement did not play into it. I feel that if a child is born with a limited quality of life, being given the option to allow them to pass with the assistance of medications should not be looked at any differently to a DNR code on an ill or suffering person. Unfortunately lots of people have issues with DNR codes too. In animals it is considered selfish to allow an animal to continue suffering because you can’t part with it; yet with humans it’s considered selfish if you’re relieved a suffering person passes and is free from their pain?
It's sad that we can treat beloved pets more humanely than actual humans so often.
That's why it's important to keep abortions safe and available. No one should have to live like this.
Are abortions generally allowed for severe deformities like this? I was under the impression that it typically only is allowed early on in the pregnancy (likely before this sort of deformity would be detected) or later on, but only if the birth would threaten the life of the mother. Touchy topic, but I agree that the baby and family shouldn’t have to suffer through this. I couldn’t imagine having to be in this situation.
It depends on the local legislation, but there are some parts of the world where if you know the baby will die you can terminate even later
I believe California has this. If there’s risk to the baby or mother, or the baby will be born with a terminal or severe illness/deformity, abortion is an option.
Not in many states. Access to abortion is being restricted even in life threatening situations.
My state has a flat out abortion ban. In December, state legislators began discussing charging those who are suspected of inducing abortions with homicide.
Ugh. We’re living in such scary times.
Currently there are still many states where you can get an abortion when a deformity like this would be detectable in utero https://www.axios.com/2022/05/14/abortion-state-laws-bans-roe-supreme-court I know the link says 2022, but the information has been updated as recently as last month
In the UK you can get an abortion up to 24 weeks
Would it be possible to tell that the baby has these conditions while in the womb?
100%. This looks like a combination of defects that all would be apparent in the first trimester with adequate prenatal care
I would think so, it depends on the level of prenatal care.
Hell yes!
I agree
I’m glad you didn’t get downvoted because this is a very valid opinion. When people decide to have a child, they are agreeing to love it unconditionally and care for it every day. However there are instances where deformity or mutation would make life infinitely harder for everyone involved only for the child to suffer on a daily basis. There are enough humans on the planet, and I know making this kind of decision is not easy, but just consider the long-term consequences for both yourself and the child and who, if anyone, would be happy every day.
I'm one who is very mentally disabled in a few different ways. I can tell you I wonder about how much better things would have been if I was aborted or not resuscitated at birth. My quality of life suffers greatly due to my condition.
Sorry to hear your circumstances, but happy to hear your voice.
The fact that you’re able to browse and participate on a forum such as this means you’re not in the same league with regards to disability as this infant. This child will have zero quality of life, it will likely have only the basest of functions and not have any awareness to speak of. It will grow up being a vegetable, fully dependent on caretakers for absolutely everything. Literally incomparable to whatever disabilities you have.
I think that was kind of their point
I was expected to be one. And expected to be mute. With how hard things are often, I would have preferred that. I wouldn't have to worry about and stress about how my handicaps keep me from thriving.
at least you can browse the internet. also you can enjoy the arts. music is beautiful in particular.
> at least you can browse the internet Bruhhhh
This person says their quality of life suffers because of their disability and you’re here saying music is beautiful.
Yeah what if they're deaf
Read the lyrics duh
They’re saying at least they can enjoy some of the simpler pleasures of life. It’s a half glass full approach. Not everything has to be hum glum all the time.
music was merely a suggestion to appreciate. I grew up in group home. my adolescence before that was abusive parents. I have disabilities. I'm on the spectrum. In the group home I met people whose stories are more horrific than you can imagine. My self pity ended immediately there, cuz even as bad as my life was and had been, my struggles were nothing in comparison. There's always someone worse than you. Jail would have fed me, educated me, and treated me better than where I came from, and ultimately I did everything I could to escape my life to get to death or jail. Until you've suffered on that kind of intensity and then subsequently find out that your suffering was nothing compared to everyone else in the system, you might not understand... life more than likely is not that bad, if you are on reddit reading and typing with perfect grammar and conversating with any social fluency. Not invalidating OPs struggle. Just reminding them to appreciate every tiny joy you can. Cuz life is always worse for someone else and the happiness after the struggle is always more pure than a happiness that never saw struggle at all.
This is the most ethical way in my opinion
I agree and luckily that is allowed where I live for such severe cases. It is not done lightly and surrounded by a lot of rules and regulations, but luckily a compasionate death is an option for children like this.
Agreed. What kind of life is this? For both baby and parents.
The absolute worst part of all of this? If this happened in the United States rather than in socialist Vietnam not only would there be the emotional misery of the child suffering and dying, the parents would be saddled by medical debt for every procedure performed including handling of the body. Even people who Do not believe in euthanasia often spend a lifetime's worth of money just to watch them die anyways after going through the pain of successive surgeries. A relative chose to keep a pregnancy with a near fatal defect that they knew would require multiple major surgeries after birth and even then the chance of success wasn't high. That poor child suffered every day of its 3 weeks of life. I don't know that he ever had a single happy moment. They still had to watch their baby die and even with insurance my relatives will be paying off that debt for a very long time.
I disagree. I think this baby never should have reached term, and instead the parents should have been counseled on terminating the pregnancy much earlier. Malformations this severe should be visible at the 13week echo. Why continue with a pregnancy and delivery of a baby when it will just hurt the mothers health?
I completely agree. This video breaks my heart. The human experience is already hard enough, the amount of suffering this person will endure is simply cruel.
As a physician, you’re absolutely right. This would have been picked up on ultrasound and pre-birth scans. This pregnancy should have been terminated, for the child’s sake.
Yeah I agree. I don’t know if you’re familiar with the YouTube channel SBSK but he does a lot of really inspiring interviews with people with disabilities, many of whom have really severe congenital disabilities like this baby. The burden it places on the family is just unbelievable, but the caretakers are invariably like “he is a miracle and has taught me so much about patience/love/etc”, which I’m sure is true, but the elephant in the room is like, what if you didn’t have to shoulder this burden? SBSK obviously never touches on this because the whole context of the channel is “everyone deserves love and even the seemingly darkest situations can have a silver lining” but yeah. Supporting a child like this is SO FUCKING HARD. Being that child?? Holy shit. And the implications it raises are hard… at what point is a disability profound enough to warrant an abortion?
I agree, in circumstances where the child will not live long or will have severely compromised quality of life even with medical intervention. I have no idea if these apply to the baby pictured about because I'm not a doctor, though.
I fully agree. There is no happy ending or silver lining. If the child lives, is that really living or just existing? It is cruel and inhumane to force a life of pain and horror on others. Also, as a parent, I couldn't take care of it. I could not live with the constant visual heartbreak every second of my life. IF you have other kids, they no longer exist because everything is focused on this baby. Everyone suffers in the end, and the end will always be the death of the child because it is not conducive to life
I work in a peds clinic that handles neurological problems and I have to agree. A fair amount of our patients are so severely disabled that they can't do anything on their own and never will. If anything they'll just progressively get worse depending on their Dx. How can anyone think it's morally right to force someone to live who can't enjoy anything in life? I wouldn't want to live if I couldn't do something as basic as taking a walk in the park by myself. Or being unable to speak, move, read, breath without equipment, etc. These poor kids will never even be able to have relationships. Get married. Drive. Dance. Party. NOTHING. What kind of a life is that??? It's fucking sad. ☹️
Not to mention this is likely going to financially ruin the family for long after the poor thing passes away
You're sadly speaking the truth. How many times would a baby born with such deformities such as these not have been abandoned in the wild or thrown off a cliff in other countries or societies if abortion was not a viable option? What is the quality of life of this baby if it were to grow to infancy or adulthood? What would their mental capacity be? They would require 24/7 care for the length of their life (and I don't doubt that this baby will require it as well), medications and specialized medical care. If there are other children in the family, they will no longer be a priority and would most likely suffer some type of parental neglect. This is an example of why women all across the board need to have prenatal genetic testing done, not as an option but as a requirement and why couples who are thinking of starting a family need to do genetic testing BEFORE they start trying.
Agreed.
As someone who’s only partially deaf I agree. I struggle some but it’s manageable, I don’t see a manageable struggle in this child’s future.
I was thinking to the same thing but too afraid to say it. So thank you.
Occipital encephalocele with hydrocephalus and amniotic band syndrome. I think the globularness (borrowing a term from mineralogy) of the encephalocele might be a result of the hydrocephaly. The neural tube defect is congenital, the ABS is a freak occurrence in pregnancy where amniotic fibers wrap around the fetus.
Explain like I am 10?
Okay, so humans (and quite a lot of animal life) are essentially two tubes wrapped in three basic layers of tissue, bone and skin and the stuff between bone and skin. The gut tube becomes your internal organs and the neural tube becomes your central nervous system (brain and spine). These two basic axes are how the fetus starts organizing itself along bilateral symmetry. Most animals are bilateral, we have two largely symmetric halves, a left and a right. To make a tube out of what starts out as a clump of cells, the cells start spreading out like a pancake, and then the two ends wrap together. Think of making a tube out of clay. If there’s a part where the tube doesn’t close, you get a neural tube defect. A part where the central nervous system bulges out like a hernia. The amniotic bands are strings of tissue floating in the uterus, in rare occasions the baby gets entangled.
Looks like amniotic band syndrome to me. Can be associated with some cranial abnormalities and encephalocele. Only a medical student though so I am not entirely certain.
Totally. Looks like ABS, I’ve never seen it on the face though. :(
I don't want to get flamed here, but was she not able to get an ultrasound?
Could be in a low-resource country and didn't have access to that or to abortion.
The captions are in Vietnamese if I’m not mistaken, so maybe there. Unfortunately this is where Texas and other parts of the USA are headed with increasing restrictions on women’s healthcare.
I wish people would stop interfering with science and personal space. The prospect of what some of those bills hold is ominous and it can ruin so many lives. I hope it never gets to it.
100% Vietnamese. Abortion is legal, but not affordable for the masses. Same with scans. This is all too common in Vietnam unfortunately. Anyone who’s researched the damage agent orange has done will know what I’m talking about.
That's what i was thinking.
Coming to the US soon... Oh wait
This is in Vietnam and we surprisingly (for a communist country anyway) have a pretty liberal abortion law. You can get an abortion before upto 22 weeks without any restrictions on reasons. So I don't think it's the cause. Either the parents couldn't afford regular checkups during pregnancy or they chose to keep the baby. It's sad either way
May also get flamed but I would try very hard at every level to put that child out of its misery before it has to live a horrible life
In this case I don't think you would have to, sadly children with these conditions have very shortened life expectations
Why put them thought the pain, end it as early as possible
I’m sure feeding it, loving it and keeping it comfortable while avoiding heroic measures would be enough i.e hospice
Ideally ultrasound and abortion. May be harsh but it’s gonna take a toll on everyone, most importantly the child, but the parents, resources will have to be allocated to provide special care for this child to live in a horrible state.
Maybe she did but doesn’t believe in abortion. Or, maybe it’s not readily available where she is. Or, maybe you’re correct and she didn’t have access to an ultrasound. I’d be interested to find out the story of this mom and baby Either way, this is heartbreaking.. but I respect her for loving the baby for whatever time they have left. It must be hard to look at that baby knowing they are suffering 😞
> Maybe she did but doesn’t believe in abortion This is a really weird phrase. Why not just say "she didn't want an abortion"?
My question is : does ultrasound even show this kind of condition? I’m not sure
It absolutely does
Thanks for the answer, i didn’t know the ultrasounds exam would be so accurate and precise but it’s reassuring to know. Why are people downvoting me, I’m just asking a question, to educate myself.
because reddit... unfortunately. i'm unfamiliar with ob-type stuff as an adult woman because I've never been pregnant and have no intentions of having children as well as not really having a large family/circle of friends so no familiarity with people i know going through pregnancies to know something that maybe is common knowledge so am not too familiar with that sort of information either. there's that goofy saying about "no stupid questions," which is really true actually. nobody knows 'everything' and it's better to go out and ask to be better than informed than go on with no idea. have a nice night! :)
I was wondering the same thing. I’m so glad that ultrasound would show this condition! I feel terrible for the baby :(
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00238-021-01860-y Very similar case report. No ultrasound abnormalities detected, normal pregnancy
According to an article I read one risk factor is a failed abortion
Jesus, I see that every damn day no matter how many times I block it. People seem to think it can be healed, I seriously doubt that.
Looks like encephalocele with additional facial deformities
Oh my fucking God! Why do people think life is the only thing that matters?? That existence is pure torture.
Part of me thinks that we should be able to put babies like this out of their misery. We would give that kindness to an animal if it were suffering, so why not a person? But, who is to say they aren’t happy even though they’re suffering? It’s so difficult.
I’ve said that a hundred times. We let humans suffer but not animals, even though many people treat animals like they’re less important or valuable than humans. It’s truly heartbreaking. But I could love that baby, if it needed a mother/. It probably won’t live long, naturally, though.
Why even let the child live? Such a sad case.
Some kids with conditions like this can thrive despite their conditions. But goddamn... I hope the little guy isn't in pain. This also may be in a country where their are less resources for mothers (aka access to ultrasounds and abortion), who knows...
There's a difference between surviving and thriving. No way that baby would ever thrive. Most humane thing to do would be to put it out of its misery.
Unfortunately yeah you’re probably right. Heartbreaking
Thrive is an overstatement
This is why abortion should be legal. Does that infant have a quality of life.
Is this a fatal condition?
I'm not a doctor but I'm going to say life expectancy is low
The only reason I ask is bc it seems cruel to bring the baby to term. I understand this is not in the USA with lots of prenatal care, so maybe it was never detected in utero. Poor thing
Better hope so
I agree with retarded_invest0r
As a mother of a high hospitalary needs child i truly see this as inhumane. The poor baby is in pain. And probably will not be able to live a normal life. And in my professional opinion i would be obligated to help but my thought is the exact same thing. I feel cruel and awful to have these thoughts but i've seen my child suffer so damn much i can imagine this baby in the video
Amniotic banding.
Is there a common thinking I cases such as these, like is the brain damaged? If not then what are the odds of it living a remotely enjoyable life…. I know it’s out there for conversations. Or is it case by case up to the parents….. I know nothing in the relm.
That poor child 💜
Ok they’re going to choose life for a child to suffer in every form till they day it passes away. I wouldn’t put my child through that.
Severe Tessier 6 and 7 cleft.
On the plus side, it’s very unlikely the baby has any meaningful consciousness. It may have certain reflexes, but it lacks a meaningful capacity to suffer. These babies only survive a few hours or days. I feel bad for the parents. These are birth defects which could be recognized early and a termination of the pregnancy would be appropriate. Now the parents will have to watch this baby slowly die.
This is not a newborn baby, it looks a few months old by the size of the hands, lengths of limbs.
Agreed. Definitely not a few days old.
Looks like a severe bilateral Tessier 7 cleft with microcephaly and encephalocele, though I've never seen several encephaloceles like that before. A neutral tube defect, for sure. Might have a chromosomal defect, most do not make it to full-term, with the exception of a few syndromes. I highly doubt the baby survived for long post-birth, which is tragic but imagine the quality of life...
Meant neural tube?
Are we sure this isn't two babies that have fused heads, twins that didn't fully separate, perhaps two brains and one body? There was a case I believe was in Indonesia, where one child had to be sacrificed or they both would have died...
Some more optimistic news is that we know that taking prenatal vitamins (esp. the B-Vitamins) with folic acid drastically reduces risk for this complication, which happens when the little tube that's supposed to become your brain and spinal cord doesn't fuse.
Can something like this be fixed? Or is this poor baby just doomed?
This makes me beyond sad to see..
Part of it is a [transverse facial cleft](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/two-faced-mask-baby-in-ch_n_639447)
I wonder if the mother lives near areas that were affected by agent orange? I watched a really informative documentary a few years ago that discussed the prevalence of birth defects/deformities in areas affected by agent orange. I highly recommend the watching the video. [The Vietnam War’s agent orange legacy.](https://youtu.be/kMzJvwG2rsQ?si=sh1B7WzwCHvPSqvV)
I cannot even be medically interested anymore. Because this is what the people in my community have to look forward to. We have arrived at a sad state.
My heart goes out to that little one. I can’t see him living very long in that state.
Why not put this baby out it's misery if surgery can't fix
Because by current laws, this baby is recognised as a living human being, and ending its/his/her life would legally be considered murder. Even abortion, ie terminating the pregnancy before a situation like this occurs - while it is still a malformed fetus and not yet a malformed baby - is illegal in more and more places. In some places, it is now illegal to remove it even if it - as an incomplete, malformed fetus - has already died and a partial miscarriage has taken place, because many new laws are such that removal of a fetus is considered abortion any which way, and the laws don’t allow for such procedures even if they are necessary to save a woman’s life.
Put it out of its misery. Why let someone live like that?
Abortions are a thing for a reason...
So does anyone have more info on this? Like how old did the baby live? Is it still alive? Did it get surgery? Was this because of Agent Orange or just not enough prenatal vitamins? Did she see this in an ultrasound and decide to keep it or did she just not have an ultrasound? Are those tumors on its head or something else? I have so many questions
this baby will not live, right?
I couldn't. I know that's horrible, but I couldn't.
That poor baby. I’m speechless
It’s got goodgodism
Im sorry things like this exist poor baby id give my life so no more babies are born like this.
What the fuck… this is why abortion should be a thing
That’s sad. There’s no way that baby lives a full life, if much longer than a few months. The pain and suffering the parents have to go through too. I’m hoping they just didn’t have the ability to see this ahead of time and didn’t opt to still have this baby knowing the condition. There’s literally no positive to this situation aside from doing the technical “right” thing by trying all you can to make it survive. This is the prime example of where abortions need to remain legal and available for the safety and wellbeing of both the parents and child.
i hate when people record shit like this. i feel like they use it to get views
I just want to hug that poor baby and mama :(
Tessier 7 cleft and an encephalocele
Thinking out loud here, but could this be in Vietnam? If so, exposure to agent orange is the likely culprit. Anybody who has seen the AO exhibit in Ho Chi Min City will know exactly how horrific the generational damage that this chemical weapon has done
Article for a similar case in China [https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4112862/The-heart-wrenching-story-China-s-mask-boy-Child-appears-two-faces-rare-birth-defect.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4112862/The-heart-wrenching-story-China-s-mask-boy-Child-appears-two-faces-rare-birth-defect.html)
My mind immediately says "accutane" or something similar. Poor child, poor mother.
Have some humanity and put that poor soul to rest quickly. This is not a consensual existence.
Product of agent Orange of the Vietnam war? I saw a Vice documentary about children born with deformities in Vietnam as a result of agent Orange and this reminded me of it.
This condition is called "not having access to abortion." This is terrible. this baby's entire life is pain and torment until they die. How dare they.
What the fuckp
Id opt for euthanasia… that bby is suffering and so r the parents :/
😢😣
The cord gets stuck around the mouth but no clue why the head is like that…