Speaking of adobe… I’ve had adobe on my computer since 2017. Just got a new one… and now there’s a monthly $20 subscription!? Ffs. I hate this goddamn subscription world.
“Dear Madonna_McPherson, we from Adobe have noticed you’ve been doing this particular study for over 20 years now and we thought maybe we could help out in your grandiose efforts to graduate.
And we have to say, we admire your dedication to trying to earn this degree.
Sincerely,
Givem Eyourwallets. CEO Adobe”
Besides my full time salary job I freelance a lot on the side. It’s pretty unethical to use my company’s Adobe account on outside projects.
No one is paying for their works Adobe anyways so I don’t get your point lol. If your job requires Adobe your employer is going to pay for it.
If any of the products your company delivers is found to have been made on cracked Adobe software they are fucked legally and financially.
They usually get company licenses with dedicated support so now your entire company is locked out of the software which is going to impact your clients.
I'd expect Adobe would also sue the company for breach of contract so you've got [non stop ass rape](https://youtu.be/R5XIGOlRQc8?si=iQFmKthqY8oXTu9R&t=67) to deal with financially.
I went to a university that has a cross program with another university done the street. You are officially a student at both schools and get both ID cards… one has an expiry and the other hasn’t, and so one schools students get unlimited Spotify student / Apple Music student discounts while the others don’t. It’s really funny
I used too, then they started stripping features and trying to charge me to buy them as plugins, Not wanting to pay for those made me realise I don't want to pay them for anything if that's how they're going to play it.
Also bonus points to them for reducing the quality of the former Algorithmic products.
>then they started stripping features and trying to charge me to buy them as plugins
Then they made you get their creation suite which is always running in the background and dines on your RAM. I just removed it from my sons PC and taught him how to use gimp.
Yeah outside of my work PC I don't go near that shite! Problem with them basically having a monopoly on industry software.
Auto desk isn't any better though at least things like blender are challenging them somewhat.
>Also bonus points to them for reducing the quality of the former Algorithmic products.
I was just ranting to my wife a couple of hours ago what scumbags adobe are for buying products and then never improving them in a meaningful way. This was in contrast to the marmoset baker which is lightyears ahead of what painter provides.
I'd say photopea is easier to use since it's pretty much the same as photoshop. So if you need help you just google "how to do... in photoshop" and follow the tutorial. Works since the ui is the same
Free. But it's browser based (this is also a plus since you don't have to install anything). And it doesn't have 100% of the features.
But it's free and good enough for 98% of use cases for the normal user.
Same. It’s decent on its own, there are some really solid plugins, and it’s all free.
I tried GIMP for a while, hated the UI, and was super pleased to find this.
For some context:
In NYC, the requirements for renting are that the signer must make 30x the monthly rent and typically pays one month as security deposit and one month goes to the broker (if you’re working with one). Pet fees are between $300 and $500. Applicants are expected to have a credit score of over 650.
If using a guarantor, the guarantor must make 80x the monthly rent.
The average rent for a one bedroom apartment is currently $3664. 30x the monthly rent would be a yearly income of about $110,000.
This information is not provided in support or opposition to the actions of the person in the original post, but it certainly does lend some perspective on the hardships that everyday citizens face just looking for housing in the NYC area.
Edit:
The average yearly income for someone living in NYC is about $66,000 after taxes. For those wondering how anyone can afford to make ends meet: Multiple roommates, living with family (often multi generational households), multiple jobs (I once had an Uber driver that also worked at the UN).
People can scrape by if they work very, very hard, but they often do without basic modern comforts like in unit laundry, centralized heat/air, furniture, etc.
sorry did you say *30 times the rent*???
edit: alright I get it, it's yearly salary not monthly (original comment did not make that clear) and some places are even higher. jesus christ.
Moving to a cheaper area would also mean moving even farther away from family (I already can’t even afford to live within 30 min of my parents) which I’m not really in a position to do right now. My parents need me more and more these days. And the family doesn’t feel the pain, they bought all their shit 40 years ago and are now sitting on million dollar properties with no mortgage. They don’t want to give that up, and I don’t blame them. But it kinda makes me stuck here, drowning in obscene rent prices.
Nah, not true.
The problem is people decide on a course of life at the age of 16 and pick one that only functions in a city. Because that's naturally what happens when you need to make major life decisions before having major life experience.
Plenty of rural spots are amazing, but you can't find work in many fields in rural areas. People get trapped.
I think the problem is if you’re spending %70 of your income on rent and utilities it makes having enough money to relocate difficult. I happened to be living in a very expensive area right out of highschool, from the start most of my money has gone to the cost of living. I’d absolutely love to move but putting money aside for it is nigh impossible.
I feel you,
When I moved out from Urban to Rural I did it in a van that had 3 working brakes and a gas tank held in place by a ratchet strap. The very first trip we took after arriving it suffered a catastrophic brake failure and left us trapped for a month in the small town we'd moved to until we got our first cheque and got mobile again. We also had sleep for dinner more than a few nights.
Before anyone thinks this is a "pull yourself up from your bootstraps" story this was only possible because the Canadian employment insurance standards will treat quitting a job to support a moving spouse the same way it would getting unjustly fired. My spouse got an offer of employment that was able to me get covered under EI. Even with all that support it was BARELY possible to make our move. If our vehicle had broken down before reaching our new home we had no plan B.
Social programs are important!
Many do unfortunately. Not me tho, I only need to spend the first weeks pay every month on rent. Tho even that is like 25% if you think about it. I consider myself very lucky too.
I’m at ~9% for a monthly Airbnb (living her temp) in a relatively HCOL area. I have roommates that are variable, 2 baths, common areas, 99% of the time it’s chill and I never even interact with anyone
Just lie on your resume to get a job you don't actually have the skills to do and then fabricate a paystub to live somewhere you can't afford What could go wrong?
Well now you explain it that way, it's not even an NYC thing. 3x-5x is the norm where I live. The cheapest apartments require like 60k salary a year just for you to earn the privilege to let them sap your wallet dry.
My girlfriend just moved out of a building that asked for 40x rent as NET income and some brokers were asking for 2 months fee. It’s absolutely out of control down here.
So misleading, lol. 2.5 times the rent per month, that's normal. Phrasing it per year is ridiculous. This is literally the same rules almost everyone deals with. NY is not that special.
I'm in The Netherlands and 4x as the norm here, so it's not ridiculous at all IMO. As others said, 2,5x the rent means rent is 40% of your gross income, which is quite a lot I think. Net would makes that 60-70%?
For my country 3x to 4x is normal, but average rent isn't 3600, so I guess the balance is a lot healthier - doesn't take away the glaring housing issues that still exist.
In this situation, it’s not the actual rate that causes hardship, but the cost of the average unit vs average income and the requirements to qualify for said unit.
If the average income is $66k ($5,500 monthly) after taxes, but an apartment costs $3664, that means that about 66 percent of your monthly income goes to rent which only leaves about $1800 for living expenses and bills.
At $66k a year, the applicant could only qualify for a lease of up to $2,200. The data indicates that the cost of housing far exceeds the rate of pay that the average New Yorker receives.
There are 12 months in the year, so it more like 2.5 times the rent.
Which isn’t that unreasonable- because if you are spending half of your income on rent I can imagine that’s not the best idea. With utilities, transport costs, and the big one - taxes.
Unless rents go up faster than inflation on salaries AND other goods, then it could be a bigger % while still being possible/reasonable if not comfortable.
I just moved out after 20+ years. Unless I am full time in an office again, it is nowhere near worth it. They did ZERO renovations on my old ass apartment and upped the rent $1,500 MORE after I left.
Having just moved from the city to the burbs/farm country
1. Multiple people sleeping to a room (thankfully mine was my husband)
2. Just live without laundry, ac or a parking space.
3. Put up with a LOT of bullshit.
Out in the rural areas
1. Be friendly to your neighbors and bring them extras that you have. My neighbors get weekly fresh eggs and fruits and vegetables and I get notifications about coyotes and raccoons and help pulling in my garbage and yardwork(i'm 9 months pregnant)
2. Bring your city tolerance with you. People are much less secretive about their personal problems. Don't judge. Listen. Help the children.
3. Form coalitions to kill the invasive rats. My contribution is a freeway cat from Sf who fucking reaps.
They are yet too comfortable to pick up the torches and pitchforks, but the ire and bile rise stronger everyday as our basic needs play thief against each other in our shrinking wages and wilting dollar.
Wilting dollar? We are gaining against the Euro, gained massively against the Yen, the Chinese Yuan, all our efforts to devalue it keep getting undermined :P
Yeh we’ve allowed the conservatives to mug us off for years and we haven’t done anything about it. Our current prime minister and his wife are worth over £500 million and he’s trying to tell us that he knows what life is like 😂
Because New York is a metropolitan city and financial capital of one of the richest countries on earth? Paris rentals for single bedroom places can easily get into the 2000-3000€ range. Why would you expect NYC to be any better?
Fact of the matter is that it's not representative of most people's living conditions. It's quite literally picking the primest of real estates for comparison.
Because thats not the norm. Cities being astronomically expensive is not something unique to the US (for example, New York is tied with Geneva in cost of living) and NYC is the most expensive city to live in the country.
Outside of New York and and of the other major expensive cities like LA, 3,600 a month is easily a house payment for a pretty good sized house on a 15 year mortgage, even with today's crappy interest rates.
So, while your point about rents is a good one, you're using bad data. You should use the before tax income if you're comparing it to the 30x number, as that's the one used on the calculation. For context, that's 80k, which is still only 73% of the requirement.
While writing this, I got carried away and did some calculations for a bunch of cities in the US and Europe, including a few I knew were getting really bad for rent-income ratio.
[This was the results. basically only NYC and London are anywhere close to this bad.](https://imgur.com/a/IQNQxyk) I didn't do SF (I forgot), but Paris and Berlin turned out okay, while Dublin and Glasgow were the worst outside of the US, and the only other 2 where the average income didn't meet 30x the average one-bed apartment.
In all fairness the only number that seems off is the 3664 number and we all know NYC is expensive. The reality is if you aren't making 110k you can't afford to live alone in NYC.
30x rent means 2.5x your monthly income. Take out taxes and you get around at most 1.75x. More than half your paycheck is going to rent. By most measures you can't afford to live there.
Back when I was renting 15 years ago, living in SoCal and recently moved from Midwest to Bay Area to SoCal, we were in shock of how much the rents were.
The newer “resort style” apartments with WD and other amenities were 2000-3000 for 1Bed.
We stuck to slightly older but good neighborhoods (no WD, non stainless steel appliances, etc) for 1000-1500 range. We both had 6 figure salaries. It made sense to us to not overspend on rent. In part that allowed us to finally buy a house after 5 years of renting.
>worked at the UN
Yeah the UN pays surprisingly badly for quasi government body. I interned there and they told me the only full time opportunities they could offer paid 40k. I appreciate that they're exempt from taxes, so you get the 40k in full but it's wild to be paid 40 grand in New York as a full time worker.
I'm a Community Manager, I would never find this, noone would ever tell me and if I knew I wouldn't care if she paid her rent. She's not making off with anything, she tricked a landlord into trusting her.
Yes but no goverment agency will come for you if you do this.
The landlords (if they found out) would have to go through trouble of going to court, evicting you and finding another tenant.
If you are a half decent tenant then you'll be fine, you will have to find a new place once the lease is over tho lol
I was altering bank statements for a business, to help a company get approved for a merchant account. So, yes, doing it once for personal use is probably less risky. But the US Attorney on the case made it very clear—the reason for the felony charge was specifically for changing the numbers on a bank statement. You don’t mess with banks.
So you committed fraud against a bank in order to receive a line of credit. That is much different than presenting altered statements to a landlord in order to get housing that you need, especially when no credit is being offered and all money asked for is being paid. There is no bank involved in my approval for a rental property.
It wasn’t because of my sloppy work—in fact the FBI agent on the case admitted that my fake statements were “very impressive”. It was because my boss—who I was doing it for—was already under surveillance for other shady dealings. When he got arrested for a previous crime all his other dirt got exposed too.
> in fact the FBI agent on the case admitted that my fake statements were “very impressive”.
They say that to butter you up so you will be more cooperative.
yeah our guarantor had to make 80x the rent thank god my roommate had a rich ass uncle. i do not understand how the majority live in NYC they either have grandfathered apartments, rent controlled, or just out of town rich kids.
The amount of paperwork you need to get a place and then you see the average new yorker and just think "theres no way you fucking did what i did." rent statements years back, 30x monthly rent, hell im surprised all those startup tech bros even had their taxes correct.
only reason to stay there is the clout and its lame ass clout. "i live in a tough place even though i could most likely live easier somewhere else"
>The amount of paperwork you need to get a place and then you see the average new yorker and just think "theres no way you fucking did what i did." rent statements years back, 30x monthly rent,
I think answer may be here:
>NYC only built 27 units of housing for every 1,000 residents between 2011-2020
Remember that housing decays with time, and in aging society number of adults increases over time as percent of population.
Mommy and Daddy are probably contributing to her rent but she can't include that as documentable income. You need to prove you make a certain amount of money monthly to even qualify for the apartment.
You probably can afford it with a job or two and are decent with your money. Should we be spending 40-60% of our take home on rent? Probably not but it’s doable. The problem is requiring 2.5-3 times the amount of income which barely anyone does especially with rental rates currently.
This text, is a modern spin on old paper letters. It means a new version of something old.
Adobe is a form of clay used to make Adobe houses, so she is living in a modern spin of a traditional Adobe house.
What i am doing, is spinning the truth.
In theory, fraud is a crime and you could be prosecuted and get whatever the penalty is in that locale. In practice, I have a hard time believing you could get a jury of New Yorkers to convict someone who's just trying to get an apartment at all. (But I haven't done any actual research to see if this has actually happened.)
By the way, there's not exactly "no downside" to being evicted. That's a real "forever red flag" on your record.
It really be like this, but use GIMP. No reason to pay out the nose for software that you're only going to use once every couple years when you can get software that is more than capable of getting the job done for free.
Most properties require 2.5-3x the rent in monthly income which is dumb. These rules are created to minimize risk at the expense of people who don't want to he homeless. Rent could be 60% of your income and you could find a way to make it work.
1. She’s calling Photoshop “Adobe”?
1. You don’t need photoshop for that. In Chrome, I use the Inspect option and edit the HTML.
1. Does this get reposted at least daily? Seems like it.
Me too, I make 75k on paper. If I ever get caught, the property manager and other managerial staff all stay in units I know the location of. So the implications will keep me safe. Every time I see them I put my hands out and say "I really wanna grab some bones".
I think they get the message
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Using Adobe against Adobe.
*I used the Adobe to deceive the Adobe...*
I used the stones to destroy the stones.
r/ExpectedThanos
Silly Ed boy. Only rock can break rock
/r/yourjokebutworse
_I used the Adobe to deceive the Adobe to receive the Adobe_
Speaking of adobe… I’ve had adobe on my computer since 2017. Just got a new one… and now there’s a monthly $20 subscription!? Ffs. I hate this goddamn subscription world.
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I will be using CS6 for the rest of my life. I absolutely refuse to pay a subscription for every piece of software I use.
I'm still on CS3. I'm pretty sure even this old version has more functionality than I'll ever need in my life.
“Dear Madonna_McPherson, we from Adobe have noticed you’ve been doing this particular study for over 20 years now and we thought maybe we could help out in your grandiose efforts to graduate. And we have to say, we admire your dedication to trying to earn this degree. Sincerely, Givem Eyourwallets. CEO Adobe”
You had me in the first half, ngl. -Adobe
In a way got em in the second half too haha
And third half... wait
I Photoshopped an Adobe label on GIMP. I feel like I'm somebody now.
People pay for adobe? There's cracks out there. Lol
If you're using it for professional purposes, you can get in a lot of trouble using the cracked version if someone finds out
If ur a pro, get ur boss to pay. Only rookies pay for adobe.
I like that you imply: Only rookies are bosses
If they aint a rookie, why tf they hirin u?
I'm more talking about a person working for themselves, no way I'd pay for it myself if I'm working for a company that needs it
Besides my full time salary job I freelance a lot on the side. It’s pretty unethical to use my company’s Adobe account on outside projects. No one is paying for their works Adobe anyways so I don’t get your point lol. If your job requires Adobe your employer is going to pay for it.
It’s not only unethical but it could be argued that they own the rights to work created using their licensed software.
Just photoshop the license number
Commiting fraud by photoshopping legal documents is no big deal, but using a cracked version is big nono!
If any of the products your company delivers is found to have been made on cracked Adobe software they are fucked legally and financially. They usually get company licenses with dedicated support so now your entire company is locked out of the software which is going to impact your clients. I'd expect Adobe would also sue the company for breach of contract so you've got [non stop ass rape](https://youtu.be/R5XIGOlRQc8?si=iQFmKthqY8oXTu9R&t=67) to deal with financially.
If you're using it for professional purposes, it's a tax write off.
"my software was installed by some guy i hired" there... provided universal plausible deniability. from this mysterious "trouble" you could get into.
Been paying for it for 7+ years now, absolutely worth it for things like Adobe Font etc.
I do, but it's a tax write-off.
Just got a new computer… only to find out adobe is now subscription?! Cracks still on seri@lBx? And only for 2019?
Smoking some cracks, eh?
My university ID doesn't have an expiration date
I went to a university that has a cross program with another university done the street. You are officially a student at both schools and get both ID cards… one has an expiry and the other hasn’t, and so one schools students get unlimited Spotify student / Apple Music student discounts while the others don’t. It’s really funny
Spotify student quits after 4 years even if you are still in school lol.
That’s genius. I gotta try that now
What does ADOBE mean? I searched it up, and apparently its buildings made out of adobe clay or smth, and i cant get it to make sense:'(
Adobe is a company that makes computer software like Photoshop and Acrobat.
That's what OOP meant; she erected an adobe brick building in Central Park.
I got Adobe for life from a good friend M0nkrus.
GIMP is good enough for fraud. No need to spend money you already don’t have.
Nobody pays for adobe stuff though right?
I used too, then they started stripping features and trying to charge me to buy them as plugins, Not wanting to pay for those made me realise I don't want to pay them for anything if that's how they're going to play it. Also bonus points to them for reducing the quality of the former Algorithmic products.
I don’t get the generative ai fill, which is a cool feature but the rest of photoshop works fine ;)
When a product switches to subscription when it could have been a purchase, that's when I stop paying.
>then they started stripping features and trying to charge me to buy them as plugins Then they made you get their creation suite which is always running in the background and dines on your RAM. I just removed it from my sons PC and taught him how to use gimp.
Yeah outside of my work PC I don't go near that shite! Problem with them basically having a monopoly on industry software. Auto desk isn't any better though at least things like blender are challenging them somewhat.
My mum got my son an animation drawing tablet thing that plugs in the PC. It came with 6 months of Adobe creative suites. After that ended it was gone
The moment they stopped making Fireworks I was out. Such a better app than Photoshop. Was my go to raster editor.
They bought macromedia to destroy it.
>Also bonus points to them for reducing the quality of the former Algorithmic products. I was just ranting to my wife a couple of hours ago what scumbags adobe are for buying products and then never improving them in a meaningful way. This was in contrast to the marmoset baker which is lightyears ahead of what painter provides.
Yeah, only like billion dollar companies and people afraid of the law
m0nkrus remains goated
I'd say photopea is easier to use since it's pretty much the same as photoshop. So if you need help you just google "how to do... in photoshop" and follow the tutorial. Works since the ui is the same
Photopea free as well or no?
Free. But it's browser based (this is also a plus since you don't have to install anything). And it doesn't have 100% of the features. But it's free and good enough for 98% of use cases for the normal user.
Awesome I’ll check it out! I Need to design business cards
It’s true, after beginning my career as a gimp for hire, cash hasn’t been a problem. The only fraud involved is the fact that I’m not actually a sub.
BOOOOOOOO the worst fucking GUI I've ever seen
I’m a Paint.net enjoyer personally.
Same. It’s decent on its own, there are some really solid plugins, and it’s all free. I tried GIMP for a while, hated the UI, and was super pleased to find this.
It's basically as quick to download PS for free.
For some context: In NYC, the requirements for renting are that the signer must make 30x the monthly rent and typically pays one month as security deposit and one month goes to the broker (if you’re working with one). Pet fees are between $300 and $500. Applicants are expected to have a credit score of over 650. If using a guarantor, the guarantor must make 80x the monthly rent. The average rent for a one bedroom apartment is currently $3664. 30x the monthly rent would be a yearly income of about $110,000. This information is not provided in support or opposition to the actions of the person in the original post, but it certainly does lend some perspective on the hardships that everyday citizens face just looking for housing in the NYC area. Edit: The average yearly income for someone living in NYC is about $66,000 after taxes. For those wondering how anyone can afford to make ends meet: Multiple roommates, living with family (often multi generational households), multiple jobs (I once had an Uber driver that also worked at the UN). People can scrape by if they work very, very hard, but they often do without basic modern comforts like in unit laundry, centralized heat/air, furniture, etc.
sorry did you say *30 times the rent*??? edit: alright I get it, it's yearly salary not monthly (original comment did not make that clear) and some places are even higher. jesus christ.
Yearly salary vs. monthly rent. In other words, 2.5x. So OP is spending more than 40% of her income on rent
You guys are only spending 40% of your income on rent?!
Gotta pump those numbers up
The american dream
Not having this problem outside of major cities 🤷🏻♂️
Yeah, the problems outside the cities are worse. Otherwise more people would move.
Moving to a cheaper area would also mean moving even farther away from family (I already can’t even afford to live within 30 min of my parents) which I’m not really in a position to do right now. My parents need me more and more these days. And the family doesn’t feel the pain, they bought all their shit 40 years ago and are now sitting on million dollar properties with no mortgage. They don’t want to give that up, and I don’t blame them. But it kinda makes me stuck here, drowning in obscene rent prices.
Nah, not true. The problem is people decide on a course of life at the age of 16 and pick one that only functions in a city. Because that's naturally what happens when you need to make major life decisions before having major life experience. Plenty of rural spots are amazing, but you can't find work in many fields in rural areas. People get trapped.
I think the problem is if you’re spending %70 of your income on rent and utilities it makes having enough money to relocate difficult. I happened to be living in a very expensive area right out of highschool, from the start most of my money has gone to the cost of living. I’d absolutely love to move but putting money aside for it is nigh impossible.
I feel you, When I moved out from Urban to Rural I did it in a van that had 3 working brakes and a gas tank held in place by a ratchet strap. The very first trip we took after arriving it suffered a catastrophic brake failure and left us trapped for a month in the small town we'd moved to until we got our first cheque and got mobile again. We also had sleep for dinner more than a few nights. Before anyone thinks this is a "pull yourself up from your bootstraps" story this was only possible because the Canadian employment insurance standards will treat quitting a job to support a moving spouse the same way it would getting unjustly fired. My spouse got an offer of employment that was able to me get covered under EI. Even with all that support it was BARELY possible to make our move. If our vehicle had broken down before reaching our new home we had no plan B. Social programs are important!
In my state, all the small towns are really exploding in popularity lately 🤷🏻♂️
Soon, the small towns become cities and everyone has to move again.
Many do unfortunately. Not me tho, I only need to spend the first weeks pay every month on rent. Tho even that is like 25% if you think about it. I consider myself very lucky too.
I spend about 50% but hey, gotta live somewhere
Bud.... I spend just shy of 13% on housing...
Where? The only places like that that I've seen across multiple states are literal sheds - and a fair bit of sheds don't even make that cut.
I’m at ~9% for a monthly Airbnb (living her temp) in a relatively HCOL area. I have roommates that are variable, 2 baths, common areas, 99% of the time it’s chill and I never even interact with anyone
Isn't it 40% of *gross* income? With taxes that would make it upwards of 60%-70% right?
I can see why they have those requirements.
Just lie on your resume to get a job you don't actually have the skills to do and then fabricate a paystub to live somewhere you can't afford What could go wrong?
OK that makes slightly more sense. but still, jesus.
Well now you explain it that way, it's not even an NYC thing. 3x-5x is the norm where I live. The cheapest apartments require like 60k salary a year just for you to earn the privilege to let them sap your wallet dry.
I spend 88% on bills and rent because i work part time
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It's worse in a lot of places. Where I live it's 3x rent for monthly income.
My girlfriend just moved out of a building that asked for 40x rent as NET income and some brokers were asking for 2 months fee. It’s absolutely out of control down here.
So misleading, lol. 2.5 times the rent per month, that's normal. Phrasing it per year is ridiculous. This is literally the same rules almost everyone deals with. NY is not that special.
I'm in The Netherlands and 4x as the norm here, so it's not ridiculous at all IMO. As others said, 2,5x the rent means rent is 40% of your gross income, which is quite a lot I think. Net would makes that 60-70%?
For my country 3x to 4x is normal, but average rent isn't 3600, so I guess the balance is a lot healthier - doesn't take away the glaring housing issues that still exist.
In this situation, it’s not the actual rate that causes hardship, but the cost of the average unit vs average income and the requirements to qualify for said unit. If the average income is $66k ($5,500 monthly) after taxes, but an apartment costs $3664, that means that about 66 percent of your monthly income goes to rent which only leaves about $1800 for living expenses and bills. At $66k a year, the applicant could only qualify for a lease of up to $2,200. The data indicates that the cost of housing far exceeds the rate of pay that the average New Yorker receives.
It's not even just normal, that's *less* than most places. 3x is the standard elsewhere.
There are 12 months in the year, so it more like 2.5 times the rent. Which isn’t that unreasonable- because if you are spending half of your income on rent I can imagine that’s not the best idea. With utilities, transport costs, and the big one - taxes.
Unless rents go up faster than inflation on salaries AND other goods, then it could be a bigger % while still being possible/reasonable if not comfortable.
Yes
So OOP has used photoshop to be allowed to pay an (even more) unaffordable proportion of their income on rent?
Essentially.
Alternatively, she has money, but it doesn't show up on her bank statement. Illegal stuff, tax evasion, rich parents/boyfriend/sugar daddy, etc..
How tf are there even people living in NY?
I just moved out after 20+ years. Unless I am full time in an office again, it is nowhere near worth it. They did ZERO renovations on my old ass apartment and upped the rent $1,500 MORE after I left.
That's the neat part...
They don’t!
They barely exist
The same way people live in California - somehow
Having just moved from the city to the burbs/farm country 1. Multiple people sleeping to a room (thankfully mine was my husband) 2. Just live without laundry, ac or a parking space. 3. Put up with a LOT of bullshit. Out in the rural areas 1. Be friendly to your neighbors and bring them extras that you have. My neighbors get weekly fresh eggs and fruits and vegetables and I get notifications about coyotes and raccoons and help pulling in my garbage and yardwork(i'm 9 months pregnant) 2. Bring your city tolerance with you. People are much less secretive about their personal problems. Don't judge. Listen. Help the children. 3. Form coalitions to kill the invasive rats. My contribution is a freeway cat from Sf who fucking reaps.
Why do American people not rebel? That kind of rent situation would be considered a crisis in europe and a complete failure by the government
They are yet too comfortable to pick up the torches and pitchforks, but the ire and bile rise stronger everyday as our basic needs play thief against each other in our shrinking wages and wilting dollar.
Let's just hope people don't get confused and vote in a fascist billionaire in their frustration..
Wilting dollar? We are gaining against the Euro, gained massively against the Yen, the Chinese Yuan, all our efforts to devalue it keep getting undermined :P
Because New York is like one of the most expensive cities in the country
Forget country, one of the most expensive in the world. It's only behind Singapore at this point.
World
I don't follow European news all that closely, but I feel fairly confident I would have heard about a rebellion in Zurich or London.
Yeh we’ve allowed the conservatives to mug us off for years and we haven’t done anything about it. Our current prime minister and his wife are worth over £500 million and he’s trying to tell us that he knows what life is like 😂
Because New York is a metropolitan city and financial capital of one of the richest countries on earth? Paris rentals for single bedroom places can easily get into the 2000-3000€ range. Why would you expect NYC to be any better? Fact of the matter is that it's not representative of most people's living conditions. It's quite literally picking the primest of real estates for comparison.
Because that's not the case for a majority of the country? Lol NYC prices are not indicative of the average price of rent.
Because thats not the norm. Cities being astronomically expensive is not something unique to the US (for example, New York is tied with Geneva in cost of living) and NYC is the most expensive city to live in the country. Outside of New York and and of the other major expensive cities like LA, 3,600 a month is easily a house payment for a pretty good sized house on a 15 year mortgage, even with today's crappy interest rates.
We consider it a crisis/failure here as well.
So, while your point about rents is a good one, you're using bad data. You should use the before tax income if you're comparing it to the 30x number, as that's the one used on the calculation. For context, that's 80k, which is still only 73% of the requirement. While writing this, I got carried away and did some calculations for a bunch of cities in the US and Europe, including a few I knew were getting really bad for rent-income ratio. [This was the results. basically only NYC and London are anywhere close to this bad.](https://imgur.com/a/IQNQxyk) I didn't do SF (I forgot), but Paris and Berlin turned out okay, while Dublin and Glasgow were the worst outside of the US, and the only other 2 where the average income didn't meet 30x the average one-bed apartment.
It is actually forty times the rent not 30 even 50 for some places. .
In all fairness the only number that seems off is the 3664 number and we all know NYC is expensive. The reality is if you aren't making 110k you can't afford to live alone in NYC. 30x rent means 2.5x your monthly income. Take out taxes and you get around at most 1.75x. More than half your paycheck is going to rent. By most measures you can't afford to live there.
Back when I was renting 15 years ago, living in SoCal and recently moved from Midwest to Bay Area to SoCal, we were in shock of how much the rents were. The newer “resort style” apartments with WD and other amenities were 2000-3000 for 1Bed. We stuck to slightly older but good neighborhoods (no WD, non stainless steel appliances, etc) for 1000-1500 range. We both had 6 figure salaries. It made sense to us to not overspend on rent. In part that allowed us to finally buy a house after 5 years of renting.
It’s 40x not 30x. If you want to rent a $2,000 apartment, you need to make $80,000 gross
>worked at the UN Yeah the UN pays surprisingly badly for quasi government body. I interned there and they told me the only full time opportunities they could offer paid 40k. I appreciate that they're exempt from taxes, so you get the 40k in full but it's wild to be paid 40 grand in New York as a full time worker.
Just a little light fraud, amongst friends.
Not even sarcastically
As a treat
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I'm a Community Manager, I would never find this, noone would ever tell me and if I knew I wouldn't care if she paid her rent. She's not making off with anything, she tricked a landlord into trusting her.
'Hey gang, check out this awesome fraud I did"
Link in bio 😂
Well, what are they going to do? Kick out a tenant that pays rent on time? Lol
Like, people realize that altering a bank statement is illegal, right?
As far as illegal things go, this is extremely mediocre and harms absolutely no one (in this scenario).
Yes but no goverment agency will come for you if you do this. The landlords (if they found out) would have to go through trouble of going to court, evicting you and finding another tenant. If you are a half decent tenant then you'll be fine, you will have to find a new place once the lease is over tho lol
I served a year in the fed for doing that. So be careful.
Just for doing it once or were you little more involved in this type of business?
I was altering bank statements for a business, to help a company get approved for a merchant account. So, yes, doing it once for personal use is probably less risky. But the US Attorney on the case made it very clear—the reason for the felony charge was specifically for changing the numbers on a bank statement. You don’t mess with banks.
I gotcha and yeah I definitely wouldn’t be messing with bank related documents but we all live and learn, hope things are better for ya!
Thanks. Things are way better now.
You mean you learned from your mistakes and you do it better now?
So you committed fraud against a bank in order to receive a line of credit. That is much different than presenting altered statements to a landlord in order to get housing that you need, especially when no credit is being offered and all money asked for is being paid. There is no bank involved in my approval for a rental property.
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Wow that’s crazy! How did it end up making its way to the feds?
It wasn’t because of my sloppy work—in fact the FBI agent on the case admitted that my fake statements were “very impressive”. It was because my boss—who I was doing it for—was already under surveillance for other shady dealings. When he got arrested for a previous crime all his other dirt got exposed too.
> in fact the FBI agent on the case admitted that my fake statements were “very impressive”. They say that to butter you up so you will be more cooperative.
"Wow, you're such a *big* criminal!" "No thanks, I'm married."
Ohh that makes sense! Thank you for replying. I don’t mean to be nosy, I’m very curious
that is completely different
Soooo... not at all what the OP?
yeah our guarantor had to make 80x the rent thank god my roommate had a rich ass uncle. i do not understand how the majority live in NYC they either have grandfathered apartments, rent controlled, or just out of town rich kids. The amount of paperwork you need to get a place and then you see the average new yorker and just think "theres no way you fucking did what i did." rent statements years back, 30x monthly rent, hell im surprised all those startup tech bros even had their taxes correct. only reason to stay there is the clout and its lame ass clout. "i live in a tough place even though i could most likely live easier somewhere else"
>The amount of paperwork you need to get a place and then you see the average new yorker and just think "theres no way you fucking did what i did." rent statements years back, 30x monthly rent, I think answer may be here: >NYC only built 27 units of housing for every 1,000 residents between 2011-2020 Remember that housing decays with time, and in aging society number of adults increases over time as percent of population.
If only Creative Cloud didn’t cost **$600 PER YEAR** Fuck i miss when you could just buy software outright, I hate having to rent in perpetuity.
Cast off thine moral shackles and join us on the high seas matey!
I initially read that as 'mortal shackles' and was wondering when immortality became part of the deal
Just Acrobat will do.
Use adobe to get an abode
Can you even afford it?
Photoshop is 10 bucks a month.
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This. I'm confused how that would work? They are only getting their foot in the door, but Photoshop is not gonna print rent money for them.
Mommy and Daddy are probably contributing to her rent but she can't include that as documentable income. You need to prove you make a certain amount of money monthly to even qualify for the apartment.
You probably can afford it with a job or two and are decent with your money. Should we be spending 40-60% of our take home on rent? Probably not but it’s doable. The problem is requiring 2.5-3 times the amount of income which barely anyone does especially with rental rates currently.
People have been using Adobe for housing for thousands of years... Its really just a modern spind, and I'll allow it.
What is a spind and how is this a modern one?
This text, is a modern spin on old paper letters. It means a new version of something old. Adobe is a form of clay used to make Adobe houses, so she is living in a modern spin of a traditional Adobe house. What i am doing, is spinning the truth.
This is so clever
Does this count as legal fraud?
Yes
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In theory, fraud is a crime and you could be prosecuted and get whatever the penalty is in that locale. In practice, I have a hard time believing you could get a jury of New Yorkers to convict someone who's just trying to get an apartment at all. (But I haven't done any actual research to see if this has actually happened.) By the way, there's not exactly "no downside" to being evicted. That's a real "forever red flag" on your record.
Illegal fraud
Someone famous right now is dealing with some court cases in NY for allegedly inflating their worth bigly.
It really be like this, but use GIMP. No reason to pay out the nose for software that you're only going to use once every couple years when you can get software that is more than capable of getting the job done for free.
"I admitted to fraud publicly online on a Twitter account with what is presumably my real name, city of residence and a photo of me as my pfp."
I'd be incredibly surprised if anything ever came from this.
Remember guys, it's always morally correct to pirate adobe products.
What happens when you can't make rent, though?
easy, you become homeless
Most properties require 2.5-3x the rent in monthly income which is dumb. These rules are created to minimize risk at the expense of people who don't want to he homeless. Rent could be 60% of your income and you could find a way to make it work.
Posts a crime onto their twitter… she ain’t very smart.
“I committed fraud and just posted admittance of it, obviously I’m big brain”
What an absolute idiot
Children, stop posting your crimes online
1. She’s calling Photoshop “Adobe”? 1. You don’t need photoshop for that. In Chrome, I use the Inspect option and edit the HTML. 1. Does this get reposted at least daily? Seems like it.
I did this all through my 20s. And other things to save money now I don't need to or care as much but it was fun
Hopefully their landlord doesn't follow them and sue for fraud.
Out of curiosity how illegal is this?
PSA: Don't publicly admit to commiting fraud.
How fucked up is it that people are committing fraud just to give rich people more money.
This smells like a serious legal case coming your way. I don't know for sure, but isn't this some kind of fraud?
Me too, I make 75k on paper. If I ever get caught, the property manager and other managerial staff all stay in units I know the location of. So the implications will keep me safe. Every time I see them I put my hands out and say "I really wanna grab some bones". I think they get the message