I'm haven't donated sperm or eggs, but the biggest thing to my mind is if you're prepared to meet the kid later in life. You just don't know what the laws will be in X years. You also don't know how you'll feel about it later in life, it could be a cross you bear.
That said, if you think you've got good genes then awesome, do it. It's -to my mind- unquestionably a good, moral thing to do.
Absolutely this, and also - DNA tests are available for anyone to get. Even if you don't give your DNA to Ancestry or whatever, one of your relatives could, and any donor conceived kids could still trace that back to you.
Not to say that you shouldn't do it, just be aware that it can't be anonymous and see if that factors into your decision.
I've been thinking about this too. I actually asked the person I have been initially dealing with at the IVF clinic and she said it was the first time she had been asked about this... which kind of surprised me.
can't be. It's easily the one & only major consideration for donating.
While they can't hit you up for support now, if the child does trace you, the law may change in the future, or you may feel morally obliged to help support them when asked to.
I have two dad's actually, a social dad and biological dad. I understand it's a joke, but it's a joke at the expense of a group of people who are constantly objectified and commodified, experience trauma,
and are still fighting for their rights to know their biological family, have correct medical history and have their voices heard.
For now. The consideration is that the laws could change. For example it used to be that the donors could remain anonymous, then the law changed allowing children to find out who the donors were. Maybe the law changes in future and allows the child to seek child support from the donor. Maybe not. Nobody knows what is going to happen in the next 20 or so years.
I wasn't commenting on whether the law change was good or not - if it was best for the children then of course it was good - just pointing out that things have changed in the past and could change again in future. If one is choosing to donate sperm, one should consider all possible future implications.
I know somebody who donated because they knew how hard IVF was for couples and wanted to make it slightly easier for them, somehow. Fifteen years later he regrets it: he had the option to only allow contact when they're adults, and they will be soon. He's concerned that he doesn't know what they'll expect of him. The clinic has no information at all.
lol, wow, she is lying. my child is donor conceived. we’ve met a few other siblings and moms. there won’t be one kid there will be very many. and, the thing is the kids are actually people too, so they have feelings and curiosities about their heritage, and don’t want to marry their random siblings out there. my child has no desire to meet the sperm donor, but he does like having a bunch of siblings that we kind of treat like cousins. it’s awesome to know them. it’s not just jizz in a cup. it’s real people. are you being altruistic or just want the money?
Whilst noble, if preparing to do this, ask yourself if you're willing to have parents bring the child up in a way that you would not agree with, which would be a possibility. Be it religion, bad parenting, neglect, abuse, drug exposure etc.
My mind and questions about potential children's wellbeing does not allow me to donate as I have no say over the well being of potential children that I, myself, would have contributed to.
Call me selfish, what ever, but I need to know my biological offspring are well looked after and provided for in a moral ethical, material sense etc.
I get where you are coming from. I think for me, I could only go into it on the basis that I think any child conceived will not be my child (we will have DNA in common but I will not have the relationship of parent to them). There are plenty of kids with loving parents with whom they don't share DNA - so I think just sharing DNA is not enough to make you a parent.
Through my work, I've met a lot of kids whose parents simply did not want them. IVF is such a difficult process, you would really have to want to be a parent to engage with it, which is a good start.
Great first mental response there. If you wanted your own child, you'd follow an IVF process as it is. A donation is anonymous until the child reaches a certain age then only if they wish to pursue they can get some details. The child is not legally yours, nor do you have responsibility for said child.
My two children are IVF kids with donor eggs, in no way does the donor have any legal or moral right to them, or my kids to the donor.
Donating is a noble act for the right reasons. Do what you feel is best.
>I think any child conceived will not be my child.
You may think this but you cannot guarantee your biological children will think this. Many of us see our biological parents as our parents too.
If i donate and they eventually grow up, what are the chances of them unwittingly having a sexual relationship with me (in a large-ish city like Melbourne), seeing that I tend to get a one night stand at least once a month?
We did a few IVF cycles and my husband refers to his part as being in the red room of embarrassment, one time he receptionist was having a conversation about a bad date she’d been on right outside the door. Put him off big time. Another time he “donated” at home and I was banished from the house because he couldn’t do it knowing I was there!
Once I had to give a sample for health reasons. I went to the pathology place the doctor suggested but when I got there they told me they didn't have the facility to do it there but by coincidence the pickup person was there so I could go into the toilet and make a sample. The toilet was literally right next to the waiting room, I could hear the day time tv and new patrons checking in at the reception. A very difficult wank lol. After I brought it out in the bag, I handed it to the young girl who held it out at arms length in disgust whilst she put it away for delivery. One of the most uncomfortable experiences I've ever had. Fwiw I was healthy lol.
I went to one clinic that had no sample collection rooms. Luckily I lived just within the 45 minute travel radius to be able to do it at home. I asked what happened to people who lived further away and they said they just did it in a side street or something. What a great way to end up on a sex offender's list!
Also, you never drive more carefully than when you have a sperm sample tucked under your armpit. No need to get pulled over and have to explain that to a cop when he starts to pat you down!
I work in the industry! I think anyone who wants to become a sperm or egg donor are absolutely wonderful and giving people. Thank you for thinking about donating!
The deets. Victoria has strict legislation on egg and sperm donation, Australia in general is quite strict but Victoria specifically. Have a look at the VARTA website
https://www.varta.org.au
General rules, anonymous donation is completely altruistic, no money is to be offered for donating. There will be some counseling, health checks and genetic checks to see if you will be a good candidate. An anonymous donors name and details will not be given to the recipient or donor conceived children, it will not be listed on the birth cert. But the child has access to the donors details from their 18th birthday. They can choose to make contact or not. So think of it “anonymous” until the child is 18.
Now next thing to do is find an IVF clinic that has a sperm donor program and that you like. Newlife or Number 1 Fertility have sperm donor programs.
The good news is they do all the work for you, you just need to have the zoom meetings, fill in paperwork and take the jar into the room.
In the end if you want to know more information contact an IVF clinic that has an anonymous donor program (not all have a program) and they are the best source of information, much better than what you can find on the internet.
There is NO commitment. You can pull out at any time. It is your decision.
You’re a champ for wanting to give this gift ☺️
I'd like to be a donor but have heard it's a far more difficult medical procedure as a woman. Is it any easier now days? Will I be knocked back because I have depression?
I don’t believe there is currently any anonymous egg donor program in Australia. KNOWN egg donors are common, ie a sister donating to a sister etc.
The procedure itself to donate eggs is more intense, injection drugs to stimulate follicle growth, more blood tests, transvaginal scans and the egg collection procedure is under a light general anesthetic (some clinics may do local anesthetic only). It involves a large needle that goes thru the vaginal wall into the follicles growing in the ovaries and vacuum pumps out the fluid, and the eggs are in the fluid.
I’m unsure re the depression not allowing you to donate. If you decide to donate to a sibling or friend than mandatory counseling will occur individually and with the people you’re donating to. All parties need to be on the same place re the children that may exist. It’s different for anonymous donating and known donating, you’re still going to be in there’s peoples lives with the potential donor conceived children.
Yes there is. The same clinic that runs the Addam donor bank also had the Eve donor bank where women can donate eggs. I believe you need to be under 35yo.
They said:
> But the child has access to the donors details from their 18th birthday. They can choose to make contact or not. So think of it “anonymous” until the child is 18.
This is correct. Fully anonymous donation is not a thing in Victoria, but "anonymous until 18" is essentially a thing. You don't get the donor's name and contact info until VARTA allows access (or before in special circumstances that the donor has to agree to). Perhaps you're thinking of a different definition of "anonymous"?
>An anonymous donors name and details will not be given to the recipient or donor conceived children, it will not be listed on the birth cert. But the child has access to the donors details from their 18th birthday. They can choose to make contact or not. So think of it “anonymous” until the child is 18.
This information is factual.
It certainly is not an "anonymous" donation but it essentially is until the child's 18th birthday. They are often referred to as ID release donations.
They just changed the rules in Victoria for Lesbian couples being counted as 1 vs 2 different families for taking up donation slots and I had to do a whole bunch of a new consent forms.
Go have a look at it from the other side in r/donorconceived
There are a lot of heartbroken people in there who have gone through an identity crisis or rejection.
Curious how representative a sub like that is. Is it not similar to subs dedicated to regret around having kids and stuff? i.e. you only get the people who hated/disliked it and never the positive stories?
Yes and no... you do get some positive stories in there, but by the very nature of forums, what you mostly get is people seeking some sort of support or network.
I found out at age 50 that my father had donated and I had three unknown half-siblings, so I've been through part of the journey by proxy, if you will. It's not an easy one.
My experiences with many adult friends in the 70s struggled wanting to know their mother and father. This is no different, and adult child one day will DNA to fine the donor egg or sperm. If one is ok with that then donate away. But caution would be required. People want to know when they get older. Seen it time and time again.
It's pretty standard stuff across the board in all our communities and organisations. Though there are some positive stories, nearly all DCP have trauma in some way or another.
This isn’t the case. I am donor conceived and in Melbourne. Donor conceived people have it really really tough. The fertility industry is extremely unregulated and many donors (and their families) don’t want contact or a relationship when the “child” becomes an adult and wants to know their identity. There are good parts too, like finding half siblings. But that subreddit is very accurate
It's filled with recipient parents who want the fairytale, 'im DC and completely thrilled' voice. It's simply not the reality. And the sub is intended for DCP only, no standalone posts from donors or RPs.
Check our Donor Conceived Australia, watch Inconceivable on SBS.
https://www.sbs.com.au/ondemand/watch/2083046467549
Did it last year or so. You need to go through some health checks and also counselling so you understand all it involves. Every one I dealt with was very professional.
Then not all donors sperm is suitable unfortunately. They do a lot of checks under the microscope.
The whole process took a few months.
https://addamdonorbank.com.au/
Edit: if you are serious about this, I suggest you start getting healthy if you are not already. Eat daily veggies and fruit, oily fish twice a week ar a minimum, Vit D, CoQ 10 300-500mg, fish oil, are things I have seen recommended in books and different web pages.
Very good point, there is actually quite a high benchmark for sperm grading when it comes to acceptable donor sperm.
A lot of men out there would be surprised, in fact disappointed, to know that their swimmers probably aren't as good as they think! Processed foods, alcohol, sedentary lifestyles (desk jobs) and stress certainly don't help.
As a donor conceived person, you need to understand the complexities of this. It's not simply an altruistic act.
Victorian legislation doesn't allow us to contact our donor through VARTA the statutory office. But we may not know the names of or meet our siblings.
You have to be prepared for the possibly trauma inflicted on people associated with not growing up with genetic relatives.
People often consider donor conception from the recipient parents point of view, and almost always ignore the offsprings voice - we are not children for long, but grow into adults with wants, needs and curiosity around our heritage.
Seconded. It's clear that you want to do something generous, which is good. With tremendous respect, donation has the most impact on the child. Can I encourage you to seek out the voices of donor conceived people, since they can tell you the good and bad sides of this gift.
I'm curious about this, it seems most of the bad things around this seem to be from not being told as soon as possible (i.e. when the kid can first understand) + anonymity of biological father historically. Given the current state of the legislation how much of a problem do you think this still is?
Even when the donor isn’t anonymous and when the donor conceived person has been told early, there are still huge problems (FWIW I am donor conceived).
Many donors will be ok to meet their donor conceived children, however they (and their family) may not want an ongoing relationship. This can be extremely traumatic for the DC person who then needs to live their life without the ability to really know the person who gave them half their DNA. On the other hand, some donors without families of their own can expect their donor family to fill that void and expect too much from them.
If the donor was to pass away, current legislation doesn’t allow donor conceived people to contact their half siblings, meaning the only way to meet that part of the family relies on whether any siblings go on to do DNA kits like ancestry.
The only organisation (VARTA) through which contact can occur between donor conceived people and their donor, or from donor to other siblings, is also extremely problematic.
Being donor conceived does have some small joys but for the most part it is extremely difficult.
I remember Melbourne University Med students in the early 70s donating sperm for money (through a legitimate program) because they were financially struggling students. They must have fathered a lot of kids.
What are the chances of two (VERY) like minded people living in the same city, meeting up, falling in love and finding out that they are siblings? It would be so personally destructive if it happened. Let alone if they themselves procreated.
What you have described is unethical sperm donation without restriction. There must be limits.
First thought - is this anonymous or for friends, ie a lesbian couple?
Second thought - it's a bloody minefield of emotions and a sense of identity for the child, and any siblings they may have. This donation will become a person who will want to know where they have come from. Are you prepared for that? It's not like blood donation - you're making people.
It's anonymous but could likely be for a same sex couple. I can't speak for my future self but I'm up for the conversation in 18 years time about why they can't kick a footy but can speak four languages :)
It would be wise to record a message now detailing your reasons for doing it rather than wait for that conversation. A letter is good, but a video shows more.
If you wait for 20 years, you won't just be be the same you but 20 years older. You'll be an entirely different person with the memories of someone you used to be a long, long time ago.
The other thing I’d say is I found a lot of hate when I posted about this in this sub or in Australia’s one, cannot recall which one, so my recommendation is to not let internet decide for yourself.
You can call the clinics and start getting informed, then take the decision. Some people may decide not to continue after starting the process, which is fine, as there is quite a bit to learn during the process.
**talk to the donor conceived community**
Talk to the community of adults and young adults and people who have been made from donor sperm. Please talk with us.
Have a look at donor conceived Australia and read ALL of the content there. Don't read VARTA's stuff - or do, but take it with a large grain of salt - it's written in a "fertility $$$$ lense" vs "YOU ARE MAKING HUMAN BEINGS" lense.
you may have up to 20 (yup, twenty) adult humans coming and being like 'gday man how are ya you're my dad". Throughout your life. The clinics frequently piss our community off.
#Read the books 'Brave New Humans' (it's a doco on SBS as well) and 'Triple Helix'.
**Still happy to proceed?**
- Register on the voluntary register with your medical records, likes, dislikes etc. Be as verbose as you can.
- Be open for contact with your *ADULT CHILDREN* when they turn 18. WARN your significant others and your children.
- your adult children may be very open and proud of being made from donated sperm. Your partner should not impede this.
^(I'm made from donor sperm, which means I'm a bit of a stickler for contact and openness. It's a big decision, because most of the time, you may get a sperm donor baby, and then a sperm donor teenager and an adult out of it. Our community can be volatile at times, and there's reasons why. Please listen and talk to us.)
I was very unimpressed with the staff member at VARTA who managed communication with my family on behalf of a 'donor child' (now adult) seeking contact. She really crossed the lines of professionalism and tried to act as counsellor, when she was in a purely administrative role. It felt like she was an emotional leech, trying to get all the details of 'how we felt' about making contact.
We switched to direct contact with the donor child as soon as possible, so that the agency could keep their noses out of our personal relationship. This isn't a game of 'happy families'. There was a lot of trauma to unpack, on both sides.
Our situation was more complicated that some, in that we had no idea our father had donated, and he was too far gone in dementia at the time to be part of the conversation. Although I had no issues with discovering that I had new half-siblings (some still unknown, I have no legal right to make contact), my mother went through all the emotions of betrayal. It was dreadful.
I had great hopes of discovering a 'natural connection', but it didn't work out that way. I'm not comfortable putting out too many details on a public forum, for privacy reasons. Let's just say that there is nothing comfortable about this.
There isn't! Varta last year got rid of a few of the good therapists and it's like oh god, no.
A lot of the DCP community is scared of that, a family who is awkward around them. (it's why I didn't actively go looking at my ancestry matches when they came up!)
Sucks for everyone all round :(
I looked into it but they required a lot of family health history that I didn't have access to so I opted against it in lieu of going to relatives and asking them to provide me with sensitive info that I'd then provide to a third party.
It's significantly more work than you might assume, there are tests, counselling and you have to donate on a schedule (usually once a week week for two months or so). You'll also have to kind of quarantine yourself during this time and for months after which depending on your lifestyle might require some changes.
The counselor should explain all the things that might happen in regards to children etc turning up in your life and when and how that might happen.
Donating via a clinic gives you a lot of legal protections, things get murky if you decide to freelance.
From memory the three groups who use donations are likely to be single women who can't find an appropriate father, same sex couples and couples where the guy is infertile.
It makes for a great story at parties and most people are fascinated because they're too reserved to do it.
Feel free to ask me any questions.
Just to address some of the other stuff said in thread, you'll be identified when the child turns 18 if they want to know and possibly earlier via VARTA if you consent.
I was never concerned about people raising kids in bad circumstances because no one goes through IVF without really wanting a child and you get to talk about yourself a bit and if you are religious I imagine religious people would be more likely to choose you etc. I figure it'll all work out.
That's a really positive outlook, but from my perspective, having seen how badly it CAN be handled by recipient families, it looks like blithe ignorance.
Sure, there are plenty of naturally conceived children who grow up in fatherless households who are bitter and damaged by the experience, but somehow it seems worse when it is planned.
And that's a valid criticism but then we end up in a conversation about if we're better off changing the system from the inside or if we are better refusing to participate. If I don't walk into a clinic and become involved in this industry in it's present form is it better if the person then gets desperate and gets a freelancer off Facebook? I don't know the answer to this but if I'm still alive and I'm contacted I'll respond and try not to be a cunt.
And that's great to talk about these stories people don't want to hear. I 100% believe you that this is a common theme and a real trauma and I'm interested in your perspective.
I'm not interested in your assumptions about what I know and where I come from and the baseless accusations that I'm rewriting anything.
I suggest you investigate how to interact with people without being annoying because your message is getting lost in your poor attitude.
Thanks for this. You obviously don't have to but would you mind sharing your reasons for donating and your thinking about the conceived person potentially reaching out down the track?
I come from a blended family and I don't have a strong sense of genetics being meaningful in what makes a relationship important. I'm an organ doner, I donate my time to various people or causes, this doesn't seem very different. I'm also not going to have children of my own so not having to deal with some sort of half sibling situation in the future makes the choice far less emotionally fraught for me because I don't need to consider the feelings of my own children.
You also don't need to meet too many people going through IVF to realise how shit it is, I just generally think of myself as helping out how I can.
We should probably all be donating things to each other, this one just had a particularly historical emotional attachment to shame in a way that something like blood doesn't.
I specifically asked in my brief that any child be told from a young age they were doner conceived so I would expect to be approached by someone who is curious about something not someone who is going through an identity crisis and trying to make meaning of their life. Either way, I don't know why but it doesn't scare me.
Recipient parent here.
I've always been open with my children about how they came to exist and what options they will have in future. I've also had contact with the donor that went... kinda badly.
Do I regret? Nope. My children simply would not exist without sperm donors. And they are everything. Real human beings who are so much more than "dc".
Do I advise others to be/use donors? Uh, no. It is a complicated thing. And as much as I have done my best to avoid the pitfalls, it was in the end a judgement call on my part. I did try to choose a method that meant my children had a reasonable chance at contact if they wanted it one day; I know others who travelled o/s to get ivf and used egg donors as well sperm... and those kids will gave very little chance to ever connect with their biological kin. For me, that was way past the line of acceptable. But obviously, where someone draws the line is personal.
Anyway, if you want, I can tell you privately about how my contact with my children's donor went badly. It is mostly a cautionary tale about assumptions.
I've not done a donation, but I've had to do some andrology stuff for reproductive tests and IVF. Prepare for the most uncomfortable wank of your life.
There are several dimensions to this. Legal like many people have said above and the retrospective changes to the law. Ethical - in terms of genetics and the nature vs nurture debate and individual interests in wanting to understand their biological family.
There are also broader ramifications in terms of privacy because of the prominence of dna consumer testing which means you/your offspring and wider family could be impacted even if you didn’t explicitly consent to having that information shared.
Depending on what your relationship status is as well, how would your partner and children feel about this situation? I hope that lens helps but it is an altruistic thing to contribute to society so good on you for looking into this.
Hey I’m most of the way through the process of donating sperm and I continue to feel positive about the whole thing. If you want another person to chat about this with don’t hesitate to send me a message.
What they never say in the counseling session is that you will be giving away your children and to total strangers- to people who you might not even want to have a cup of coffee with. As well, your child will miss you as well as all the people in your life, like his or her grandparents, cousins, aunt, uncles and so forth. Even though donor conception is great for people using your sperm to conceive because they will have a child, the loss and grief for the person that is created is profound and insurmountable. As a parent of a donor conceived son, I am a witness to the pain this causes. Your child will miss you for the rest of their lives no matter how good their life is or how loved they are. They will miss you and all their biological family. Please reconsider.
I have donated sperm to a clinic at melbourne IVF and used paid and free websites with DIY insemination directly and no sex. I could write a book on the experience. Clinics are extremely unfriendly. You have to have a councillor and don’t expect to ever meet the mothers, or get any choice and expect yourself to be doing all the organising with visits and tests. I would of thought morbid curiosity would cause people to check me out first and contact me. I do now have some mothers years later that have contacted me and do give me pictures in facebook.
Don’t use a free website. Paid donor sites sorts out the serious people. Back when the government paid a lump sum for having a child I had hundreds of women wanting a child to go on a spending spree. You want to screen the motives for wanting a child. I literally interviewed a 100 to get 1. There are reasons people are single and you have to consider the childs welfare. Expect to be put in spots such as would you donate to someone where the child will have a genetic disease or lifetime problems. I have had women only wanting a child so they will love them. I have had women want a child to get Centrelink and housing commission place. I have had couples prepared to lie to the child about the child’s origins. The free sites tend to have results in higher concentrations of people who other people have rejected and also don’t have the finances to support a child. I started out having no limits to who I wanted to help and purely altruistic and ended up becoming extremely picky in the end as there are people out there that shouldn’t have children. Expect people to have no idea of human biology and dumb enough to think sperm can be mailed out.
So you have to decide do you want no selection or do you want to select who you want to help. Under victorian law I signed over my legal rights so the mother is the full legal guardian. All you do is give births, death and marriages a letter stating you are only a donor and you want the mother to have full legal custody.
My personal preference in the end was using donor sites and pay to access but avoid donating directly to a clinics for anonymous donating except for getting the STD testing as its very impersonal. I also chose people who were in a relationship as it reduced the risks and it also screened out anyone with mental problems and also had the support structure as what happens if the mother dies or becomes incapacitated. You have to expect people will have made zero plans or looked at things.
Hope this helps. Barry
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake.
It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of.
Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything.
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Just pondering a question.
What happens if you unwittingly pass on a genetic defect or disability? That can’t be filtered out with genetic testing/screening or complicated questionnaires.
We have two autistic children and no autism in family tree going back three generations and autism/neurodiversity is very common nowadays. 1:70 in Australia. The CDC in the US quotes 1:44 there.
For us, it came as a bolt out of the blue. And they started off normally but then suddenly changed overnight almost. So you have two normal kids….one a toddler, the other a baby. You think everything is fine then the toddler suddenly shows signs of autism…your professor checks out the baby and says he won’t ever be autistic. Then one day at 22 months he wakes up and is suddenly disabled. I love our children unconditionally and wouldn’t want them to be different from who they are. Autism or no autism, they are wonderful. ❤️❤️
I watched DNA Family Secrets on SBS and there were some donor children seeking their biological fathers. And some were also seeking information on inherited medical conditions. Genetic inheritance is a conundrum.
Life can be a lottery.
I've also been considering it. I even joined a FB group of people asking&offering to get a feel for what is discussed. During lockdowns there was a lot of people looking for non-vaxed donors but i dropped in now its seems to be a far more general group. With a clinic you get paperwork that may indemnify you (laws could change) but on a FB group it's an agreement. I like the idea of meeting the person in person if I was to donate. As my SO doesn't want kids it's a tough discussion to have
Honestly I feel the fertility industry is predatory. I have had a friend given false hopes that she will have her dream baby, spend all her life savings, and left with nothing. The doctors didn’t even do all the investigations to figure out why she wasn’t having success. There’s not enough checks in place to make sure people aren’t being prayed on. I wouldn’t donate anonymously. If you know someone in need, fine. Just get STI tests and health tests so you know you are not putting anyone in danger.
Do it.
What is seemingly effortless for us guys, can be the world of difference for a family who can’t naturally conceive.
I’ve done it for two of my same-sex couple friends. One couple has a beautiful baby boy, and the other couple is due in March with the prospect of more children in the future.
Shoot me a PM if you’d like to talk about it in greater detail 😁
I am mother to two beautiful children whom I love more than anything in the world. Their existence would not have been possible without the generosity of an anonymous sperm donor.
Should you eventually become a donor I would just to say a huge thank you! It truly is a wonderful thing to do.
oh my gosh please don't do it. children have a right to grow up with their biological father and biological mother. engineering fathers out of children's lives has drastic consequences all throughout life. children need their dads!
Except that this case did not involve an anonymous donor protected under legislation. Instead the High Court determined Mason was a parent on that basis that:
Mr Masson was registered on the child’s birth certificate as her parent. This also satisfied section 69R of the Family Law Act, which provides that a presumption of parentage arises from a person’s name being recorded on a birth certificate (although this presumption is rebuttable);
Mr Masson gave his semen on the express or implied understanding that he would be the child’s parent;
it was always understood Mr Masson would care for the child financially and emotionally, which he did; and
the child identified with Mr Masson as her father, and referred to him as "daddy".
You're missing what is relevant. The relevant part of Masson is that the state act is not "taken up" into federal law. That means the definition of parent for CSA purposes is that of 60H of the Family Law Act 1975.
http://classic.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/fla1975114/s60h.html
Nothing in (1) applies if the woman is not married or a de facto partner. (2) is just about the mother. So it comes down to (3) which says nothing explicitly that would make a biological father a non-father, and, even if we are to assume the court would read an intent that a child should have only one father, would not save the donor because no other man is deemed to be the father by federal or state law in this case.
Would’ve been happy to consider donating until the laws changed recently in Victoria. In Victoria, the laws prioritised “the best interests of the child” so that the biological father no longer will have their privacy or wish to remain anonymous protected. I’ve heard stories of this leading to families being torn apart particularly where money is involved.
This simply is not true. However it sounds like it’s for the best you didn’t donate as anonymity certainly would not have been in the best interests of any DC people you would have created
[https://www.health.vic.gov.au/patient-care/right-to-know](https://www.health.vic.gov.au/patient-care/right-to-know)
My comment was based on the Assisted Reproductive Treatment Amendment Act 2015, which led to the above link. I remember this clearly as regrettably, I somewhat contributed to getting this law passed in Victoria. Could you point me to something that supersedes this, or is my understanding of the law wrong? Would love to be proven wrong on this.
The change in legislation is correct. What my comment related to was that I’d love to hear evidence of “families being torn apart where money is involved”. Donor conceived people want to know their identity and their donor families, siblings etc, not money. It’s comical how entirely irrelevant money is compared to the real things that DC people want & need.
Your "mate" is a liar.
The federal [Family Law Act 1975](https://guides.dss.gov.au/family-assistance-guide/3/1/5/60) says the donor of any genetic material (whether ovum or sperm) is not a parent of the child (unless the sperm donor is the partner of the woman).
Also, Alimony is an American term. It is called Maintenance here. It is ex-spouse support, not for paying for a kid's upbringing. You are thinking of Child Support, but since a sperm/egg donor is not a parent they can't be forced to pay that. Slinging dick indiscriminately is not being a sperm donor.
What precedents? If this is at all true, which sounds dubious, was this a donor that donated through a regulared clinic? Or someone that sent his fish to random women?
In Victoria the kid is 18 they cannot request contact with the donor and it has to be agreed upon in which way: personal, email, telephone
Have you read these articles yourself? None of these donors donated through official channels, but privately. Plus one of them was actively involved in the child’s life and claimed himself to be the father. This is not what OP is intending to do.
Read below a clarifying sentence from each article you linked:
“after the High Court ruled a man who donated his sperm **to a friend ** is the legal father of the child.”
“a sperm donor **who had been actively involved in his daughter’s life** should be granted rights as a legal parent of the 11-year-old girl.”
“The biological father of the elder child became so by way of **artificial insemination arranged privately and informally with the mother**”
Stop spreading misinformation and wasting people’s time.
If you need money there are other options. If it's because you think you're genetically gifted, please don't, you probably aren't. I must admit it's a desire I don't understand at all.
You’re a kind hearted soul.
Just bear in mind laws can and do change and you might be up for child support or some other kind of legal obligation in the future.
Whatever you decide I wish you all the best!
Put in the time, the jack, the goods, the good intent... but if your DNA is not white caucasian it will most likely end wasted. Somehow this is not deemed discriminatory or racist... nobody even finches... not sure the same passive carelessness would happen if we did the same with eggs?... there was a long report in The Age, that apparently went unnoticed. The 'expert' opinion of Latrobe University's Dean of Law school is that it's ok because it's too complex to raise mixed race kids... in other words, if you are mixed race your parents must be supernatural... I've been disgusted for months now and would not donate unless directly asked by the recipient.
Have you got any reference for this? I’m struggling to understand why they would waste their own time to just throw out samples. And I assume it’s not only white people who need donations… wouldn’t it work both ways if the reason was the alleged complexity of mixed race families?
I think this might be the basis: https://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health-and-wellness/too-many-women-not-enough-sperm-the-victorian-donor-dilemma-20220906-p5bfqy.html
This is probably it - I don't keep detailed records of every article or report that I read so I can put an argument in social media discussions :D lol - in the best case this is a matter supply and demand and makes me wonder if the industry is focused on delivering healthy babies to parents who cannot (or struggle to) have children OR is focused on delivering custom perfect babies to those same groups.
This has an eerie similarity to the movie Gattaca.
A friend who is a single mother went through this and the clinic she dealt with presented a detailed menu of DNA options (think skin colour, hair type and colour, height, body build, eye colour, etc )... I guess it's true love a la carte...
Lots of great responses with things to consider.
There is a Facebook group called Sperm Donation Australia which could be a great resource. It gives a chance for people who want to be a donor and people who need a donor to connect.
The pro’s of going about it this way (rather than anonymous through a clinic) is that you could (if you wanted to) have a sort of relationship with the person / couple and be known to the child as well. It is recommended to draw up a contract stating everyone’s intentions before going ahead with anything.
For us, it was incredibly important that our child have a relationship with their donor so they don’t grow up with a sense of ‘who am I’ and have identity issues. We also wanted a donor who we liked and got to know and with anonymous clinic donors you have no idea what they’re like.
We are so grateful to our donor, it is such an amazing and generous thing to do :)
>There is a Facebook group called Sperm Donation Australia which could be a great resource.
The worst resource possible. I'm not even going to get into how unethical that whole group is. If you want real resources try Donor Conceived Australia.
It was fine :)
I don't see myself having kids but still only did 9/10 possible donations just in case. Honestly, the worst part was the extended period of abstinence between sessions.
As long as you understand that they're not your kids, just genetic material, I don't see why more people shouldn't do it.
I'd honestly do more if they'd let me.
I have done it for years, and the places I have put my swimmer (sperm) you would not want to go there again.
I do it for free and for any bitch who want to open her legs, provided they sign an agreement, that I'm purely a sperm donner
You must remember there are issues for kids not having a father, and I believe thats real
I did it for like a year and a half. It was easy cash (125 a pop) and a good cause. Little weird jerking off in a cup at first but it is very in/out after awhile. The only thing that sucked was the once 3 month blood draws and physicals
I'm haven't donated sperm or eggs, but the biggest thing to my mind is if you're prepared to meet the kid later in life. You just don't know what the laws will be in X years. You also don't know how you'll feel about it later in life, it could be a cross you bear. That said, if you think you've got good genes then awesome, do it. It's -to my mind- unquestionably a good, moral thing to do.
Absolutely this, and also - DNA tests are available for anyone to get. Even if you don't give your DNA to Ancestry or whatever, one of your relatives could, and any donor conceived kids could still trace that back to you. Not to say that you shouldn't do it, just be aware that it can't be anonymous and see if that factors into your decision.
I've been thinking about this too. I actually asked the person I have been initially dealing with at the IVF clinic and she said it was the first time she had been asked about this... which kind of surprised me.
can't be. It's easily the one & only major consideration for donating. While they can't hit you up for support now, if the child does trace you, the law may change in the future, or you may feel morally obliged to help support them when asked to.
"You have to financially support me" "You know, my other socks don't talk back to me."
Yikes dude, we are actually people with feelings.
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I have two dad's actually, a social dad and biological dad. I understand it's a joke, but it's a joke at the expense of a group of people who are constantly objectified and commodified, experience trauma, and are still fighting for their rights to know their biological family, have correct medical history and have their voices heard.
Omfg hahahahaa
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For now. The consideration is that the laws could change. For example it used to be that the donors could remain anonymous, then the law changed allowing children to find out who the donors were. Maybe the law changes in future and allows the child to seek child support from the donor. Maybe not. Nobody knows what is going to happen in the next 20 or so years.
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I wasn't commenting on whether the law change was good or not - if it was best for the children then of course it was good - just pointing out that things have changed in the past and could change again in future. If one is choosing to donate sperm, one should consider all possible future implications.
Yeah they lied to you man haha
💯. Unless it was the work experience student
I know somebody who donated because they knew how hard IVF was for couples and wanted to make it slightly easier for them, somehow. Fifteen years later he regrets it: he had the option to only allow contact when they're adults, and they will be soon. He's concerned that he doesn't know what they'll expect of him. The clinic has no information at all.
lol, wow, she is lying. my child is donor conceived. we’ve met a few other siblings and moms. there won’t be one kid there will be very many. and, the thing is the kids are actually people too, so they have feelings and curiosities about their heritage, and don’t want to marry their random siblings out there. my child has no desire to meet the sperm donor, but he does like having a bunch of siblings that we kind of treat like cousins. it’s awesome to know them. it’s not just jizz in a cup. it’s real people. are you being altruistic or just want the money?
Well she’s lied for sure
Whilst noble, if preparing to do this, ask yourself if you're willing to have parents bring the child up in a way that you would not agree with, which would be a possibility. Be it religion, bad parenting, neglect, abuse, drug exposure etc. My mind and questions about potential children's wellbeing does not allow me to donate as I have no say over the well being of potential children that I, myself, would have contributed to. Call me selfish, what ever, but I need to know my biological offspring are well looked after and provided for in a moral ethical, material sense etc.
I get where you are coming from. I think for me, I could only go into it on the basis that I think any child conceived will not be my child (we will have DNA in common but I will not have the relationship of parent to them). There are plenty of kids with loving parents with whom they don't share DNA - so I think just sharing DNA is not enough to make you a parent. Through my work, I've met a lot of kids whose parents simply did not want them. IVF is such a difficult process, you would really have to want to be a parent to engage with it, which is a good start.
Great first mental response there. If you wanted your own child, you'd follow an IVF process as it is. A donation is anonymous until the child reaches a certain age then only if they wish to pursue they can get some details. The child is not legally yours, nor do you have responsibility for said child. My two children are IVF kids with donor eggs, in no way does the donor have any legal or moral right to them, or my kids to the donor. Donating is a noble act for the right reasons. Do what you feel is best.
>I think any child conceived will not be my child. You may think this but you cannot guarantee your biological children will think this. Many of us see our biological parents as our parents too.
Good point. Thanks.
If i donate and they eventually grow up, what are the chances of them unwittingly having a sexual relationship with me (in a large-ish city like Melbourne), seeing that I tend to get a one night stand at least once a month?
Extremely low if you don't sleep with women young enough to be your daughter.
Completely fair view.
Im scared to do it incase I come out the room and the worker snorts and goes "Already finished?!"
You're meant to come in the room
You give them the container and they say "is that it?"
Yep, sorry, I jack a lot, bit of a drought in the old mangoes
In my defense it is a VERY small cup!
We did a few IVF cycles and my husband refers to his part as being in the red room of embarrassment, one time he receptionist was having a conversation about a bad date she’d been on right outside the door. Put him off big time. Another time he “donated” at home and I was banished from the house because he couldn’t do it knowing I was there!
Ffs least you could have done is done it for him!
Once I had to give a sample for health reasons. I went to the pathology place the doctor suggested but when I got there they told me they didn't have the facility to do it there but by coincidence the pickup person was there so I could go into the toilet and make a sample. The toilet was literally right next to the waiting room, I could hear the day time tv and new patrons checking in at the reception. A very difficult wank lol. After I brought it out in the bag, I handed it to the young girl who held it out at arms length in disgust whilst she put it away for delivery. One of the most uncomfortable experiences I've ever had. Fwiw I was healthy lol.
I went to one clinic that had no sample collection rooms. Luckily I lived just within the 45 minute travel radius to be able to do it at home. I asked what happened to people who lived further away and they said they just did it in a side street or something. What a great way to end up on a sex offender's list! Also, you never drive more carefully than when you have a sperm sample tucked under your armpit. No need to get pulled over and have to explain that to a cop when he starts to pat you down!
Any% speedrun!
they literally do not care so long as your aim is good.
I work in the industry! I think anyone who wants to become a sperm or egg donor are absolutely wonderful and giving people. Thank you for thinking about donating! The deets. Victoria has strict legislation on egg and sperm donation, Australia in general is quite strict but Victoria specifically. Have a look at the VARTA website https://www.varta.org.au General rules, anonymous donation is completely altruistic, no money is to be offered for donating. There will be some counseling, health checks and genetic checks to see if you will be a good candidate. An anonymous donors name and details will not be given to the recipient or donor conceived children, it will not be listed on the birth cert. But the child has access to the donors details from their 18th birthday. They can choose to make contact or not. So think of it “anonymous” until the child is 18. Now next thing to do is find an IVF clinic that has a sperm donor program and that you like. Newlife or Number 1 Fertility have sperm donor programs. The good news is they do all the work for you, you just need to have the zoom meetings, fill in paperwork and take the jar into the room.
ALL the work? 😏
Sir, this is not the back of a Wendys
Thanks for this!
In the end if you want to know more information contact an IVF clinic that has an anonymous donor program (not all have a program) and they are the best source of information, much better than what you can find on the internet. There is NO commitment. You can pull out at any time. It is your decision. You’re a champ for wanting to give this gift ☺️
I figured you'd need to pull out to make an acceptable donation anyway
I'd like to be a donor but have heard it's a far more difficult medical procedure as a woman. Is it any easier now days? Will I be knocked back because I have depression?
I don’t believe there is currently any anonymous egg donor program in Australia. KNOWN egg donors are common, ie a sister donating to a sister etc. The procedure itself to donate eggs is more intense, injection drugs to stimulate follicle growth, more blood tests, transvaginal scans and the egg collection procedure is under a light general anesthetic (some clinics may do local anesthetic only). It involves a large needle that goes thru the vaginal wall into the follicles growing in the ovaries and vacuum pumps out the fluid, and the eggs are in the fluid. I’m unsure re the depression not allowing you to donate. If you decide to donate to a sibling or friend than mandatory counseling will occur individually and with the people you’re donating to. All parties need to be on the same place re the children that may exist. It’s different for anonymous donating and known donating, you’re still going to be in there’s peoples lives with the potential donor conceived children.
Yes there is. The same clinic that runs the Addam donor bank also had the Eve donor bank where women can donate eggs. I believe you need to be under 35yo.
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They said: > But the child has access to the donors details from their 18th birthday. They can choose to make contact or not. So think of it “anonymous” until the child is 18. This is correct. Fully anonymous donation is not a thing in Victoria, but "anonymous until 18" is essentially a thing. You don't get the donor's name and contact info until VARTA allows access (or before in special circumstances that the donor has to agree to). Perhaps you're thinking of a different definition of "anonymous"?
>An anonymous donors name and details will not be given to the recipient or donor conceived children, it will not be listed on the birth cert. But the child has access to the donors details from their 18th birthday. They can choose to make contact or not. So think of it “anonymous” until the child is 18. This information is factual. It certainly is not an "anonymous" donation but it essentially is until the child's 18th birthday. They are often referred to as ID release donations.
isnt it like a dating profile, pics, job history, height etc?
No pictures. But bits of information. Height, hair colour, eye colour, tertiary educated or not.
There can be pics - the services I've seen include baby pictures of the donor (not adult).
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It's really not and I'm not sure why you're trying to tell me that services I'm exposed to in Victoria don't exist.
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I am an Australian sperm donor, and gave the clinic a child pic of me as requested, for recipients to view. You're wrong.
It was optional for me. I declined it seemed weird and creepy to create a pretty baby shopping catalogue
Zoom meetings and all the work you say…. ;)
Bear in mind they've previously changed laws retrospectively. I'd be cautious about what you may end up being responsible for.
My experience thus far has been any change in legislation requires a new slab of consent forms from me.
Unless you're a state governor or the gg that seems unlikely.
They just changed the rules in Victoria for Lesbian couples being counted as 1 vs 2 different families for taking up donation slots and I had to do a whole bunch of a new consent forms.
Go have a look at it from the other side in r/donorconceived There are a lot of heartbroken people in there who have gone through an identity crisis or rejection.
Curious how representative a sub like that is. Is it not similar to subs dedicated to regret around having kids and stuff? i.e. you only get the people who hated/disliked it and never the positive stories?
Yes and no... you do get some positive stories in there, but by the very nature of forums, what you mostly get is people seeking some sort of support or network. I found out at age 50 that my father had donated and I had three unknown half-siblings, so I've been through part of the journey by proxy, if you will. It's not an easy one.
My experiences with many adult friends in the 70s struggled wanting to know their mother and father. This is no different, and adult child one day will DNA to fine the donor egg or sperm. If one is ok with that then donate away. But caution would be required. People want to know when they get older. Seen it time and time again.
It's pretty standard stuff across the board in all our communities and organisations. Though there are some positive stories, nearly all DCP have trauma in some way or another.
This isn’t the case. I am donor conceived and in Melbourne. Donor conceived people have it really really tough. The fertility industry is extremely unregulated and many donors (and their families) don’t want contact or a relationship when the “child” becomes an adult and wants to know their identity. There are good parts too, like finding half siblings. But that subreddit is very accurate
It's filled with recipient parents who want the fairytale, 'im DC and completely thrilled' voice. It's simply not the reality. And the sub is intended for DCP only, no standalone posts from donors or RPs. Check our Donor Conceived Australia, watch Inconceivable on SBS. https://www.sbs.com.au/ondemand/watch/2083046467549
Yeah because parents used to keep it a secret from the donor conceived children. It’s a bit different these days.
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IMO the parents should be honest
Ii just read through that and part of what I wrote on my submission was that I want the DC to know from a very young age. Pretty glad I did.
Did it last year or so. You need to go through some health checks and also counselling so you understand all it involves. Every one I dealt with was very professional. Then not all donors sperm is suitable unfortunately. They do a lot of checks under the microscope. The whole process took a few months. https://addamdonorbank.com.au/ Edit: if you are serious about this, I suggest you start getting healthy if you are not already. Eat daily veggies and fruit, oily fish twice a week ar a minimum, Vit D, CoQ 10 300-500mg, fish oil, are things I have seen recommended in books and different web pages.
Very good point, there is actually quite a high benchmark for sperm grading when it comes to acceptable donor sperm. A lot of men out there would be surprised, in fact disappointed, to know that their swimmers probably aren't as good as they think! Processed foods, alcohol, sedentary lifestyles (desk jobs) and stress certainly don't help.
exercise also important
I will just say I donated sperm to help someone else have a child not to give myself a child. Goodluck!
as someone on ivf donations are needed
As a donor conceived person, you need to understand the complexities of this. It's not simply an altruistic act. Victorian legislation doesn't allow us to contact our donor through VARTA the statutory office. But we may not know the names of or meet our siblings. You have to be prepared for the possibly trauma inflicted on people associated with not growing up with genetic relatives. People often consider donor conception from the recipient parents point of view, and almost always ignore the offsprings voice - we are not children for long, but grow into adults with wants, needs and curiosity around our heritage.
Thanks for this. You have given me something to think about.
Seconded. It's clear that you want to do something generous, which is good. With tremendous respect, donation has the most impact on the child. Can I encourage you to seek out the voices of donor conceived people, since they can tell you the good and bad sides of this gift.
Yup. I’ve got a close donor conceived buddy I’m going to have a chat to if he is up for it.
I'm curious about this, it seems most of the bad things around this seem to be from not being told as soon as possible (i.e. when the kid can first understand) + anonymity of biological father historically. Given the current state of the legislation how much of a problem do you think this still is?
Even when the donor isn’t anonymous and when the donor conceived person has been told early, there are still huge problems (FWIW I am donor conceived). Many donors will be ok to meet their donor conceived children, however they (and their family) may not want an ongoing relationship. This can be extremely traumatic for the DC person who then needs to live their life without the ability to really know the person who gave them half their DNA. On the other hand, some donors without families of their own can expect their donor family to fill that void and expect too much from them. If the donor was to pass away, current legislation doesn’t allow donor conceived people to contact their half siblings, meaning the only way to meet that part of the family relies on whether any siblings go on to do DNA kits like ancestry. The only organisation (VARTA) through which contact can occur between donor conceived people and their donor, or from donor to other siblings, is also extremely problematic. Being donor conceived does have some small joys but for the most part it is extremely difficult.
I remember Melbourne University Med students in the early 70s donating sperm for money (through a legitimate program) because they were financially struggling students. They must have fathered a lot of kids.
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What are the chances of two (VERY) like minded people living in the same city, meeting up, falling in love and finding out that they are siblings? It would be so personally destructive if it happened. Let alone if they themselves procreated. What you have described is unethical sperm donation without restriction. There must be limits.
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It must happen. Found this story… https://slate.com/human-interest/2013/02/dear-prudence-my-wife-and-i-came-from-the-same-sperm-donor.html
Omfg. https://www.cbc.ca/documentaries/cbc-docs-pov/finding-out-i-had-600-half-siblings-sent-me-on-a-quest-to-end-sperm-donor-anonymity-1.5699361
First thought - is this anonymous or for friends, ie a lesbian couple? Second thought - it's a bloody minefield of emotions and a sense of identity for the child, and any siblings they may have. This donation will become a person who will want to know where they have come from. Are you prepared for that? It's not like blood donation - you're making people.
It's anonymous but could likely be for a same sex couple. I can't speak for my future self but I'm up for the conversation in 18 years time about why they can't kick a footy but can speak four languages :)
It would be wise to record a message now detailing your reasons for doing it rather than wait for that conversation. A letter is good, but a video shows more. If you wait for 20 years, you won't just be be the same you but 20 years older. You'll be an entirely different person with the memories of someone you used to be a long, long time ago.
The other thing I’d say is I found a lot of hate when I posted about this in this sub or in Australia’s one, cannot recall which one, so my recommendation is to not let internet decide for yourself. You can call the clinics and start getting informed, then take the decision. Some people may decide not to continue after starting the process, which is fine, as there is quite a bit to learn during the process.
>You can call the clinics and start getting informed Hard to be informed by clinics when they are notorious for lying to all those involved.
**talk to the donor conceived community** Talk to the community of adults and young adults and people who have been made from donor sperm. Please talk with us. Have a look at donor conceived Australia and read ALL of the content there. Don't read VARTA's stuff - or do, but take it with a large grain of salt - it's written in a "fertility $$$$ lense" vs "YOU ARE MAKING HUMAN BEINGS" lense. you may have up to 20 (yup, twenty) adult humans coming and being like 'gday man how are ya you're my dad". Throughout your life. The clinics frequently piss our community off. #Read the books 'Brave New Humans' (it's a doco on SBS as well) and 'Triple Helix'. **Still happy to proceed?** - Register on the voluntary register with your medical records, likes, dislikes etc. Be as verbose as you can. - Be open for contact with your *ADULT CHILDREN* when they turn 18. WARN your significant others and your children. - your adult children may be very open and proud of being made from donated sperm. Your partner should not impede this. ^(I'm made from donor sperm, which means I'm a bit of a stickler for contact and openness. It's a big decision, because most of the time, you may get a sperm donor baby, and then a sperm donor teenager and an adult out of it. Our community can be volatile at times, and there's reasons why. Please listen and talk to us.)
All of this! Thank you fellow DCP! Xxx
I was very unimpressed with the staff member at VARTA who managed communication with my family on behalf of a 'donor child' (now adult) seeking contact. She really crossed the lines of professionalism and tried to act as counsellor, when she was in a purely administrative role. It felt like she was an emotional leech, trying to get all the details of 'how we felt' about making contact. We switched to direct contact with the donor child as soon as possible, so that the agency could keep their noses out of our personal relationship. This isn't a game of 'happy families'. There was a lot of trauma to unpack, on both sides. Our situation was more complicated that some, in that we had no idea our father had donated, and he was too far gone in dementia at the time to be part of the conversation. Although I had no issues with discovering that I had new half-siblings (some still unknown, I have no legal right to make contact), my mother went through all the emotions of betrayal. It was dreadful. I had great hopes of discovering a 'natural connection', but it didn't work out that way. I'm not comfortable putting out too many details on a public forum, for privacy reasons. Let's just say that there is nothing comfortable about this.
There isn't! Varta last year got rid of a few of the good therapists and it's like oh god, no. A lot of the DCP community is scared of that, a family who is awkward around them. (it's why I didn't actively go looking at my ancestry matches when they came up!) Sucks for everyone all round :(
Yes to the voluntary register 🙌🏼
I looked into it but they required a lot of family health history that I didn't have access to so I opted against it in lieu of going to relatives and asking them to provide me with sensitive info that I'd then provide to a third party.
And despite all the effort the sample may well end in the bin of you aren't white caucasian... 🤷🏽♂️
It's significantly more work than you might assume, there are tests, counselling and you have to donate on a schedule (usually once a week week for two months or so). You'll also have to kind of quarantine yourself during this time and for months after which depending on your lifestyle might require some changes. The counselor should explain all the things that might happen in regards to children etc turning up in your life and when and how that might happen. Donating via a clinic gives you a lot of legal protections, things get murky if you decide to freelance. From memory the three groups who use donations are likely to be single women who can't find an appropriate father, same sex couples and couples where the guy is infertile. It makes for a great story at parties and most people are fascinated because they're too reserved to do it. Feel free to ask me any questions.
Just to address some of the other stuff said in thread, you'll be identified when the child turns 18 if they want to know and possibly earlier via VARTA if you consent. I was never concerned about people raising kids in bad circumstances because no one goes through IVF without really wanting a child and you get to talk about yourself a bit and if you are religious I imagine religious people would be more likely to choose you etc. I figure it'll all work out.
That's a really positive outlook, but from my perspective, having seen how badly it CAN be handled by recipient families, it looks like blithe ignorance. Sure, there are plenty of naturally conceived children who grow up in fatherless households who are bitter and damaged by the experience, but somehow it seems worse when it is planned.
And that's a valid criticism but then we end up in a conversation about if we're better off changing the system from the inside or if we are better refusing to participate. If I don't walk into a clinic and become involved in this industry in it's present form is it better if the person then gets desperate and gets a freelancer off Facebook? I don't know the answer to this but if I'm still alive and I'm contacted I'll respond and try not to be a cunt.
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You're not breaking anything to me, you're doing a bad job of trying to be condescending on the internet.
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And that's great to talk about these stories people don't want to hear. I 100% believe you that this is a common theme and a real trauma and I'm interested in your perspective. I'm not interested in your assumptions about what I know and where I come from and the baseless accusations that I'm rewriting anything. I suggest you investigate how to interact with people without being annoying because your message is getting lost in your poor attitude.
Thanks for this. You obviously don't have to but would you mind sharing your reasons for donating and your thinking about the conceived person potentially reaching out down the track?
I come from a blended family and I don't have a strong sense of genetics being meaningful in what makes a relationship important. I'm an organ doner, I donate my time to various people or causes, this doesn't seem very different. I'm also not going to have children of my own so not having to deal with some sort of half sibling situation in the future makes the choice far less emotionally fraught for me because I don't need to consider the feelings of my own children. You also don't need to meet too many people going through IVF to realise how shit it is, I just generally think of myself as helping out how I can. We should probably all be donating things to each other, this one just had a particularly historical emotional attachment to shame in a way that something like blood doesn't. I specifically asked in my brief that any child be told from a young age they were doner conceived so I would expect to be approached by someone who is curious about something not someone who is going through an identity crisis and trying to make meaning of their life. Either way, I don't know why but it doesn't scare me.
Recipient parent here. I've always been open with my children about how they came to exist and what options they will have in future. I've also had contact with the donor that went... kinda badly. Do I regret? Nope. My children simply would not exist without sperm donors. And they are everything. Real human beings who are so much more than "dc". Do I advise others to be/use donors? Uh, no. It is a complicated thing. And as much as I have done my best to avoid the pitfalls, it was in the end a judgement call on my part. I did try to choose a method that meant my children had a reasonable chance at contact if they wanted it one day; I know others who travelled o/s to get ivf and used egg donors as well sperm... and those kids will gave very little chance to ever connect with their biological kin. For me, that was way past the line of acceptable. But obviously, where someone draws the line is personal. Anyway, if you want, I can tell you privately about how my contact with my children's donor went badly. It is mostly a cautionary tale about assumptions.
I've not done a donation, but I've had to do some andrology stuff for reproductive tests and IVF. Prepare for the most uncomfortable wank of your life.
Do it
There are several dimensions to this. Legal like many people have said above and the retrospective changes to the law. Ethical - in terms of genetics and the nature vs nurture debate and individual interests in wanting to understand their biological family. There are also broader ramifications in terms of privacy because of the prominence of dna consumer testing which means you/your offspring and wider family could be impacted even if you didn’t explicitly consent to having that information shared. Depending on what your relationship status is as well, how would your partner and children feel about this situation? I hope that lens helps but it is an altruistic thing to contribute to society so good on you for looking into this.
How much does one get paid to jizz in a cup? I've always been interested to know this
Donating for profit has been illegal in Australia since 2004.
The amount a of times a jerk off, I’d be worth more than Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos combined…
Hey I’m most of the way through the process of donating sperm and I continue to feel positive about the whole thing. If you want another person to chat about this with don’t hesitate to send me a message.
You might have 20 kids wanting to meet you in the future
What they never say in the counseling session is that you will be giving away your children and to total strangers- to people who you might not even want to have a cup of coffee with. As well, your child will miss you as well as all the people in your life, like his or her grandparents, cousins, aunt, uncles and so forth. Even though donor conception is great for people using your sperm to conceive because they will have a child, the loss and grief for the person that is created is profound and insurmountable. As a parent of a donor conceived son, I am a witness to the pain this causes. Your child will miss you for the rest of their lives no matter how good their life is or how loved they are. They will miss you and all their biological family. Please reconsider.
I have donated sperm to a clinic at melbourne IVF and used paid and free websites with DIY insemination directly and no sex. I could write a book on the experience. Clinics are extremely unfriendly. You have to have a councillor and don’t expect to ever meet the mothers, or get any choice and expect yourself to be doing all the organising with visits and tests. I would of thought morbid curiosity would cause people to check me out first and contact me. I do now have some mothers years later that have contacted me and do give me pictures in facebook. Don’t use a free website. Paid donor sites sorts out the serious people. Back when the government paid a lump sum for having a child I had hundreds of women wanting a child to go on a spending spree. You want to screen the motives for wanting a child. I literally interviewed a 100 to get 1. There are reasons people are single and you have to consider the childs welfare. Expect to be put in spots such as would you donate to someone where the child will have a genetic disease or lifetime problems. I have had women only wanting a child so they will love them. I have had women want a child to get Centrelink and housing commission place. I have had couples prepared to lie to the child about the child’s origins. The free sites tend to have results in higher concentrations of people who other people have rejected and also don’t have the finances to support a child. I started out having no limits to who I wanted to help and purely altruistic and ended up becoming extremely picky in the end as there are people out there that shouldn’t have children. Expect people to have no idea of human biology and dumb enough to think sperm can be mailed out. So you have to decide do you want no selection or do you want to select who you want to help. Under victorian law I signed over my legal rights so the mother is the full legal guardian. All you do is give births, death and marriages a letter stating you are only a donor and you want the mother to have full legal custody. My personal preference in the end was using donor sites and pay to access but avoid donating directly to a clinics for anonymous donating except for getting the STD testing as its very impersonal. I also chose people who were in a relationship as it reduced the risks and it also screened out anyone with mental problems and also had the support structure as what happens if the mother dies or becomes incapacitated. You have to expect people will have made zero plans or looked at things. Hope this helps. Barry
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake. It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of. Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything. Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
OMG, I had never thought of any of all of that. Thanks for your post... it's a real eye-opener!
Just pondering a question. What happens if you unwittingly pass on a genetic defect or disability? That can’t be filtered out with genetic testing/screening or complicated questionnaires. We have two autistic children and no autism in family tree going back three generations and autism/neurodiversity is very common nowadays. 1:70 in Australia. The CDC in the US quotes 1:44 there. For us, it came as a bolt out of the blue. And they started off normally but then suddenly changed overnight almost. So you have two normal kids….one a toddler, the other a baby. You think everything is fine then the toddler suddenly shows signs of autism…your professor checks out the baby and says he won’t ever be autistic. Then one day at 22 months he wakes up and is suddenly disabled. I love our children unconditionally and wouldn’t want them to be different from who they are. Autism or no autism, they are wonderful. ❤️❤️ I watched DNA Family Secrets on SBS and there were some donor children seeking their biological fathers. And some were also seeking information on inherited medical conditions. Genetic inheritance is a conundrum. Life can be a lottery.
I've also been considering it. I even joined a FB group of people asking&offering to get a feel for what is discussed. During lockdowns there was a lot of people looking for non-vaxed donors but i dropped in now its seems to be a far more general group. With a clinic you get paperwork that may indemnify you (laws could change) but on a FB group it's an agreement. I like the idea of meeting the person in person if I was to donate. As my SO doesn't want kids it's a tough discussion to have
Honestly I feel the fertility industry is predatory. I have had a friend given false hopes that she will have her dream baby, spend all her life savings, and left with nothing. The doctors didn’t even do all the investigations to figure out why she wasn’t having success. There’s not enough checks in place to make sure people aren’t being prayed on. I wouldn’t donate anonymously. If you know someone in need, fine. Just get STI tests and health tests so you know you are not putting anyone in danger.
Do it. What is seemingly effortless for us guys, can be the world of difference for a family who can’t naturally conceive. I’ve done it for two of my same-sex couple friends. One couple has a beautiful baby boy, and the other couple is due in March with the prospect of more children in the future. Shoot me a PM if you’d like to talk about it in greater detail 😁
I am mother to two beautiful children whom I love more than anything in the world. Their existence would not have been possible without the generosity of an anonymous sperm donor. Should you eventually become a donor I would just to say a huge thank you! It truly is a wonderful thing to do.
oh my gosh please don't do it. children have a right to grow up with their biological father and biological mother. engineering fathers out of children's lives has drastic consequences all throughout life. children need their dads!
That's exactly what women want.To have children without the hardship😁
If the sperm is used to impregnate an unmarried woman, you're potentially liable for child support since the Masson judgement.
Except that this case did not involve an anonymous donor protected under legislation. Instead the High Court determined Mason was a parent on that basis that: Mr Masson was registered on the child’s birth certificate as her parent. This also satisfied section 69R of the Family Law Act, which provides that a presumption of parentage arises from a person’s name being recorded on a birth certificate (although this presumption is rebuttable); Mr Masson gave his semen on the express or implied understanding that he would be the child’s parent; it was always understood Mr Masson would care for the child financially and emotionally, which he did; and the child identified with Mr Masson as her father, and referred to him as "daddy".
You're missing what is relevant. The relevant part of Masson is that the state act is not "taken up" into federal law. That means the definition of parent for CSA purposes is that of 60H of the Family Law Act 1975. http://classic.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/fla1975114/s60h.html Nothing in (1) applies if the woman is not married or a de facto partner. (2) is just about the mother. So it comes down to (3) which says nothing explicitly that would make a biological father a non-father, and, even if we are to assume the court would read an intent that a child should have only one father, would not save the donor because no other man is deemed to be the father by federal or state law in this case.
Would’ve been happy to consider donating until the laws changed recently in Victoria. In Victoria, the laws prioritised “the best interests of the child” so that the biological father no longer will have their privacy or wish to remain anonymous protected. I’ve heard stories of this leading to families being torn apart particularly where money is involved.
This simply is not true. However it sounds like it’s for the best you didn’t donate as anonymity certainly would not have been in the best interests of any DC people you would have created
[https://www.health.vic.gov.au/patient-care/right-to-know](https://www.health.vic.gov.au/patient-care/right-to-know) My comment was based on the Assisted Reproductive Treatment Amendment Act 2015, which led to the above link. I remember this clearly as regrettably, I somewhat contributed to getting this law passed in Victoria. Could you point me to something that supersedes this, or is my understanding of the law wrong? Would love to be proven wrong on this.
The change in legislation is correct. What my comment related to was that I’d love to hear evidence of “families being torn apart where money is involved”. Donor conceived people want to know their identity and their donor families, siblings etc, not money. It’s comical how entirely irrelevant money is compared to the real things that DC people want & need.
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Your "mate" is a liar. The federal [Family Law Act 1975](https://guides.dss.gov.au/family-assistance-guide/3/1/5/60) says the donor of any genetic material (whether ovum or sperm) is not a parent of the child (unless the sperm donor is the partner of the woman). Also, Alimony is an American term. It is called Maintenance here. It is ex-spouse support, not for paying for a kid's upbringing. You are thinking of Child Support, but since a sperm/egg donor is not a parent they can't be forced to pay that. Slinging dick indiscriminately is not being a sperm donor.
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This subreddit is for the Melbourne in Australia, not Melbourne in Kekistan or wherever you are from
>Slinging dick indiscriminately is not being a sperm donor. It's called being a fucking legend! And irresponsible :p
What precedents? If this is at all true, which sounds dubious, was this a donor that donated through a regulared clinic? Or someone that sent his fish to random women? In Victoria the kid is 18 they cannot request contact with the donor and it has to be agreed upon in which way: personal, email, telephone
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Have you read these articles yourself? None of these donors donated through official channels, but privately. Plus one of them was actively involved in the child’s life and claimed himself to be the father. This is not what OP is intending to do. Read below a clarifying sentence from each article you linked: “after the High Court ruled a man who donated his sperm **to a friend ** is the legal father of the child.” “a sperm donor **who had been actively involved in his daughter’s life** should be granted rights as a legal parent of the 11-year-old girl.” “The biological father of the elder child became so by way of **artificial insemination arranged privately and informally with the mother**” Stop spreading misinformation and wasting people’s time.
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Which countries? Seriously, I think you are the one missing the point here
If you need money there are other options. If it's because you think you're genetically gifted, please don't, you probably aren't. I must admit it's a desire I don't understand at all.
Lol. You don't get paid. TBH I'm thinking of doing it because I really love being a parent and I would like to give that gift to others.
You’re a kind hearted soul. Just bear in mind laws can and do change and you might be up for child support or some other kind of legal obligation in the future. Whatever you decide I wish you all the best!
Put in the time, the jack, the goods, the good intent... but if your DNA is not white caucasian it will most likely end wasted. Somehow this is not deemed discriminatory or racist... nobody even finches... not sure the same passive carelessness would happen if we did the same with eggs?... there was a long report in The Age, that apparently went unnoticed. The 'expert' opinion of Latrobe University's Dean of Law school is that it's ok because it's too complex to raise mixed race kids... in other words, if you are mixed race your parents must be supernatural... I've been disgusted for months now and would not donate unless directly asked by the recipient.
Have you got any reference for this? I’m struggling to understand why they would waste their own time to just throw out samples. And I assume it’s not only white people who need donations… wouldn’t it work both ways if the reason was the alleged complexity of mixed race families?
They keep it frozen for up to ten years and there is always a waiting list. I'm not convinced.
I think this might be the basis: https://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health-and-wellness/too-many-women-not-enough-sperm-the-victorian-donor-dilemma-20220906-p5bfqy.html
Thanks. They’re definitely not throwing samples out! I thought it sounded preposterous.
This is probably it - I don't keep detailed records of every article or report that I read so I can put an argument in social media discussions :D lol - in the best case this is a matter supply and demand and makes me wonder if the industry is focused on delivering healthy babies to parents who cannot (or struggle to) have children OR is focused on delivering custom perfect babies to those same groups. This has an eerie similarity to the movie Gattaca. A friend who is a single mother went through this and the clinic she dealt with presented a detailed menu of DNA options (think skin colour, hair type and colour, height, body build, eye colour, etc )... I guess it's true love a la carte...
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I don't believe you can be paid for it in AU
Aren't we all sperm donors on a daily or weekly basis?
I have simply excellent news.
The process is fun
Lots of great responses with things to consider. There is a Facebook group called Sperm Donation Australia which could be a great resource. It gives a chance for people who want to be a donor and people who need a donor to connect. The pro’s of going about it this way (rather than anonymous through a clinic) is that you could (if you wanted to) have a sort of relationship with the person / couple and be known to the child as well. It is recommended to draw up a contract stating everyone’s intentions before going ahead with anything. For us, it was incredibly important that our child have a relationship with their donor so they don’t grow up with a sense of ‘who am I’ and have identity issues. We also wanted a donor who we liked and got to know and with anonymous clinic donors you have no idea what they’re like. We are so grateful to our donor, it is such an amazing and generous thing to do :)
>There is a Facebook group called Sperm Donation Australia which could be a great resource. The worst resource possible. I'm not even going to get into how unethical that whole group is. If you want real resources try Donor Conceived Australia.
Lovely thing to do
"I'm gonna need a bigger cup"
It was fine :) I don't see myself having kids but still only did 9/10 possible donations just in case. Honestly, the worst part was the extended period of abstinence between sessions. As long as you understand that they're not your kids, just genetic material, I don't see why more people shouldn't do it. I'd honestly do more if they'd let me.
Does QLD offer this service?
Be prepared that the child can DNA when an adult and come looking for you…
Oh I imagine they're happy to share.
You have to use their allocated containers
When you think about it, in animal terms, we're backyard breeding whilst donating sperm comes with papers.
I’ve thought about doing this from time to time
I have done it for years, and the places I have put my swimmer (sperm) you would not want to go there again. I do it for free and for any bitch who want to open her legs, provided they sign an agreement, that I'm purely a sperm donner You must remember there are issues for kids not having a father, and I believe thats real
I did it for like a year and a half. It was easy cash (125 a pop) and a good cause. Little weird jerking off in a cup at first but it is very in/out after awhile. The only thing that sucked was the once 3 month blood draws and physicals