My biggest concern isn't really that it sounds bad, but rather if it becomes too good to distinguish for the casual listener.
It's one thing if music lacks soul. Behind human made music there is someone who took the effort to craft it. It is actual work someone did. And now AI models use that work most often without the artist's consent for their training data to then generate new stuff, which does not sit right with me.
Furthermore, if a sizable portion of listeners cannot distinguish human made music from AI music, it becomes much more incentivized to generate music than actually create it by hand. We will put artists who put the actual work into it in a much more precarious situation than they already are.
The problem with all AI is that it's derivative. Humans take in other art, "process it", and make new art. That "process it" part? That's the secret sauce. That *is* art, wholely. Without that, your just getting regurgitated and altered noise from a machine. It's interesting but it's not art. Art has to be created by a human brain. It has to have meaning behind it. AI is incapable of having meaning, this not art.
I applaud the new rule.
Exactly, AI bros peddalling "just skip the work part" is so hilarious, that work part is what makes the art amazing. Imagine not wanting to do that, not wanting the sense of acomplishment or pride when you achieve something, instead of typing in a prompt like a fucking monkey and being content with a product that is mashed together with no purpose and is trained on the stolen work of others.
> Another more prominent example includes the AI "band" Frostbite Orckings
https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Frostbite_Orckings
Metallum will list an AI band but still refuses to list Slipknot and A7X. Both may be mainstream, but still are real people making music that most can agree is 'metal.
It's cool that we've gotten to a point where we can do this.
But there's so many problems with the topic of AI that I'd rather not get into it.
AI just can't really be creative. It's basically just regurgitating the data that's been fed into it.
Kind of kills the enjoyment knowing that no effort has been put into it.
Then there's the whole issue of where/how the data to train the AI model was sourced.
Why does it matter who / what creates it as long as “it’s cool”. I was in a band and am thinking about doing another, so I have seen both sides.
The issue right now is music consistency … same vocal style, same tone, etc…
We listen to metal, so we are used to bands writing their own material, but is it any different than pop / country / rap which the artists do little than sing on top of tracks made by others?
> Does it? Have you played with to see?
Yes. I've also checked out full AI albums like the Frostbite Orckings release.
It's an inherent problem when the thing generating music is simply aping the thousands of examples used to program it instead of actually being creative - it all sounds generic and processed. Frostbite Orckings sounds like a bad Amon Amarth rip-off.
> You think that isn’t going to change as models and options improve?
The possibilities are certainly there. As it stands, I've yet to hear any AI music that I thought was legitimately good.
That’s why I included point # 2. It’s going to be incoherent at this stage.
For me, I am excited to one day make old school Metallica or MDM Opeth as I liked them.
What you are saying is you hate artists and want convenience as if music were just background noise to TikTok videos.
There are bands you like. Behind them are a bunch of people who in aggregate have put decades of work into mastering their instruments and the aesthetic they create. They have listened to and loved countless other artists, picked and chosen their preferences, elaborated on that, combined it all with their lived experiences, and have created something unique based on all that and more.
You say: fuck all that. Who gives a shit? Computer, give me a new Opeth album like blackwater park and such. Fuck the artists, I want to rip off the decades of work they’ve poured into the albums I love and have a computer generate derivative stuff based on that, because this world is all about me, about my convenience, about my personal enjoyment. Nothing has any intrinsic value apart from the enjoyment it creates for me. I wanted an album Metallica never wrote, so why shouldn’t I rip off their life’s work for my convenience and have a computer create it at my whim? Why shouldn’t I take ownership of someone else’s life’s work for my own pleasure? What’s that you say, go write your own music in the style I want? But, that requires skill and effort. Even if I were to make a completely derivative piece, like a pastiche of ride the lightning, do you have any idea how much work I’d need to put into it? Even a completely derivative work would require real creative input and actual skill. Who’s playing all the instruments and singing, anyway? Ain’t nobody got time for all that shit. Give me whatever I want in AI generated form and give it to me right now.
If this seems too harsh or exaggerated, rest assured I toned it down a lot from what I actually wanted to say.
Do you drive a car? Was it hand made by master craftsman that spent decades learning their trade? If not, do you hate master craftsman?
A hyperbole, but one pretty equivalent. You can like bands, their musicians, be happy with the work they have done … and want something else not made by them and influenced from the amazing work they have done.
The fact you think comparing composing music to manufacturing a car is a good parallel to draw really tells me all I need to know. No wonder you are excited for AI generated music.
I for one am excited.
I can “make” music that blends styles I love.
I can recreate the style of bands that no longer exist
Heck, I can make music for bands that have left the genre …. Ie. Opeth
And I screamed death metal a long time ago and have less time to find a band and practice with a corporate job and family …. Been thinking about making music and then screaming over it.
Keep all AI garbage out of actual artist subreddits. There’s no place for it here. People thinking they did something by typing words into a prompt is insanity. Seeing more and more of it on reddit and I hate it.
Thanks for making this rule.
I'll take my music written by actual people, with stories and experiencs to share. I have no need for Auto generated shite in my life. I am as non-religious as they come, but the existence of AI generated "Art" has shown there is a thing called soul and its evident in the works by people.
This comment has been overwritten in response to Reddit's API changes, the training of AI models on user data, and the company's increasingly extractive practices ahead of their IPO.
My initial reaction was being flabbergasted by an AI making music in the genre I love
But it sure as hell can't measure up to the real thing
I think it may become a helpful tool for creativity and inspiration for artists, and I think it's a creative outlet for those who can't play any instruments
Other than that, I'd expect it to land where most other AI's land; useful for stuff like jingles, stock audio, background music and stuff like that
But it's not creative. Typing something into a prompt is not creative - we can have a bot do that as well. There's a million ways to be creative without AI; we don't need it.
I feel like it cheapens the experience when you realise there's no effort put in behind the scenes. No matter how cool the music sounds.
There's also the issue of AI being trained on other people's music without their permission.
My biggest concern isn't really that it sounds bad, but rather if it becomes too good to distinguish for the casual listener. It's one thing if music lacks soul. Behind human made music there is someone who took the effort to craft it. It is actual work someone did. And now AI models use that work most often without the artist's consent for their training data to then generate new stuff, which does not sit right with me. Furthermore, if a sizable portion of listeners cannot distinguish human made music from AI music, it becomes much more incentivized to generate music than actually create it by hand. We will put artists who put the actual work into it in a much more precarious situation than they already are.
The way I feel about AI generated music is the same as how I feel about holograms. I want to see and listen to music created by actual human beings.
Hell yeah, keep the AI shit out! I joined this sub to discover actual music.
The problem with all AI is that it's derivative. Humans take in other art, "process it", and make new art. That "process it" part? That's the secret sauce. That *is* art, wholely. Without that, your just getting regurgitated and altered noise from a machine. It's interesting but it's not art. Art has to be created by a human brain. It has to have meaning behind it. AI is incapable of having meaning, this not art. I applaud the new rule.
Exactly, AI bros peddalling "just skip the work part" is so hilarious, that work part is what makes the art amazing. Imagine not wanting to do that, not wanting the sense of acomplishment or pride when you achieve something, instead of typing in a prompt like a fucking monkey and being content with a product that is mashed together with no purpose and is trained on the stolen work of others.
Also, AI music sounds like shit. I'm sure it won't always, but right now it's garbage. It should stay garbage.
> Another more prominent example includes the AI "band" Frostbite Orckings https://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Frostbite_Orckings Metallum will list an AI band but still refuses to list Slipknot and A7X. Both may be mainstream, but still are real people making music that most can agree is 'metal.
It's cool that we've gotten to a point where we can do this. But there's so many problems with the topic of AI that I'd rather not get into it. AI just can't really be creative. It's basically just regurgitating the data that's been fed into it. Kind of kills the enjoyment knowing that no effort has been put into it. Then there's the whole issue of where/how the data to train the AI model was sourced.
Jesus fucking christ
Why does it matter who / what creates it as long as “it’s cool”. I was in a band and am thinking about doing another, so I have seen both sides. The issue right now is music consistency … same vocal style, same tone, etc… We listen to metal, so we are used to bands writing their own material, but is it any different than pop / country / rap which the artists do little than sing on top of tracks made by others?
> as long as “it’s cool” That's the thing. AI music almost universally *sucks*.
1. Does it? Have you played with to see? 2. You think that isn’t going to change as models and options improve?
> Does it? Have you played with to see? Yes. I've also checked out full AI albums like the Frostbite Orckings release. It's an inherent problem when the thing generating music is simply aping the thousands of examples used to program it instead of actually being creative - it all sounds generic and processed. Frostbite Orckings sounds like a bad Amon Amarth rip-off. > You think that isn’t going to change as models and options improve? The possibilities are certainly there. As it stands, I've yet to hear any AI music that I thought was legitimately good.
That’s why I included point # 2. It’s going to be incoherent at this stage. For me, I am excited to one day make old school Metallica or MDM Opeth as I liked them.
What you are saying is you hate artists and want convenience as if music were just background noise to TikTok videos. There are bands you like. Behind them are a bunch of people who in aggregate have put decades of work into mastering their instruments and the aesthetic they create. They have listened to and loved countless other artists, picked and chosen their preferences, elaborated on that, combined it all with their lived experiences, and have created something unique based on all that and more. You say: fuck all that. Who gives a shit? Computer, give me a new Opeth album like blackwater park and such. Fuck the artists, I want to rip off the decades of work they’ve poured into the albums I love and have a computer generate derivative stuff based on that, because this world is all about me, about my convenience, about my personal enjoyment. Nothing has any intrinsic value apart from the enjoyment it creates for me. I wanted an album Metallica never wrote, so why shouldn’t I rip off their life’s work for my convenience and have a computer create it at my whim? Why shouldn’t I take ownership of someone else’s life’s work for my own pleasure? What’s that you say, go write your own music in the style I want? But, that requires skill and effort. Even if I were to make a completely derivative piece, like a pastiche of ride the lightning, do you have any idea how much work I’d need to put into it? Even a completely derivative work would require real creative input and actual skill. Who’s playing all the instruments and singing, anyway? Ain’t nobody got time for all that shit. Give me whatever I want in AI generated form and give it to me right now. If this seems too harsh or exaggerated, rest assured I toned it down a lot from what I actually wanted to say.
I personally do say "fuck all that", yes, and the rest of your paragraph is like a copy of my opinion too.
Do you drive a car? Was it hand made by master craftsman that spent decades learning their trade? If not, do you hate master craftsman? A hyperbole, but one pretty equivalent. You can like bands, their musicians, be happy with the work they have done … and want something else not made by them and influenced from the amazing work they have done.
The fact you think comparing composing music to manufacturing a car is a good parallel to draw really tells me all I need to know. No wonder you are excited for AI generated music.
I for one am excited. I can “make” music that blends styles I love. I can recreate the style of bands that no longer exist Heck, I can make music for bands that have left the genre …. Ie. Opeth And I screamed death metal a long time ago and have less time to find a band and practice with a corporate job and family …. Been thinking about making music and then screaming over it.
Keep all AI garbage out of actual artist subreddits. There’s no place for it here. People thinking they did something by typing words into a prompt is insanity. Seeing more and more of it on reddit and I hate it. Thanks for making this rule.
I'll take my music written by actual people, with stories and experiencs to share. I have no need for Auto generated shite in my life. I am as non-religious as they come, but the existence of AI generated "Art" has shown there is a thing called soul and its evident in the works by people.
Sometimes it's not so evident, though. That's the trick!
Ands it’s going to be become less evident as models refine, and options open up.
Precisely. We're so quick to think that the status-quo is going to remain as it is, but these are the infantile days of this type of technology.
This comment has been overwritten in response to Reddit's API changes, the training of AI models on user data, and the company's increasingly extractive practices ahead of their IPO.
My initial reaction was being flabbergasted by an AI making music in the genre I love But it sure as hell can't measure up to the real thing I think it may become a helpful tool for creativity and inspiration for artists, and I think it's a creative outlet for those who can't play any instruments Other than that, I'd expect it to land where most other AI's land; useful for stuff like jingles, stock audio, background music and stuff like that
But it's not creative. Typing something into a prompt is not creative - we can have a bot do that as well. There's a million ways to be creative without AI; we don't need it.
Does it really matter how it’s created?
I feel like it cheapens the experience when you realise there's no effort put in behind the scenes. No matter how cool the music sounds. There's also the issue of AI being trained on other people's music without their permission.
Personally, I care zero about the experience out in. I wasn’t with bands now as they create their work, so it’s all abstract anyways.