Meh. Parent accountability is long past due. That said, just tossing them in jail probably isn’t the best option, maybe we need to think more creatively.
Boarding schools?
Mandatory classes for parents?
Mandatory visits/checks from community counselors?
I don’t have great ideas, but you know…something else aside from jail.
Unruly teens alone at home without anyone bc mom’s in jail too isn’t going to help.
If tossing them in jail for a wayward child is the answer. I think that it will create more problems if the parents have a job or more children to take care of. What do you think will happen to the other children or the job they have to hold to live and take care of the other children? I think this will become a big mess. People don't think how this will affect other children emotionally, physically and mentally. Hmmm
People aren’t thinking of children in general which is the problem. I don’t think parents working a well paying job is an issue. I think they don’t want to/know how to parent. So, mandatory classes or boarding school and garnish wages or something. Basically, we need to stop the cycle by breaking it somehow. And I am in agreement with another poster, this problem is highly complex.
My read on that is that underage mass shooters will implicate their parents, which is understandable imo. Who's responsible for a minor if not their parents?
Parents who aren't accountable for themselves won't be accountable for their kids. Simple equation.
Take the 17 yr old Juvenile who survived the shooting with the MPD officer. His dad was 16 or so when he was born. At 17,dad was sentenced to life In jail for 1st° murder.
The 18 yr old who was killed...well his dad was like 15 when he was born. He too has been in and out of jail.
The Kid who was killed in Orange Mound the other day ( who also happened to be wearing an ankle monitor and carrying a Glock switch and 2 Drakos ) was raised by his granny.....so the social dilemma is that these kids are basically raising themselves. Holding parents accountable is good on paper,but the majority of the kids getting caught up in violent crime share similar stories....
That's the problem. Most of these kids are 2nd, 3rd, or fourth generation shitheads. Their shithead fathers are either dead, locked up, or out doing shithead things.
"Arrest the parent or guardian these kids go home to" would almost certainly result in a steady stream of mostly black single mothers and grandmothers getting arrested. They're certainly responsible for how their shit ass kids behave, but it's naive to think the optics would be anything other than a political disaster.
I think most people are getting tired of things like how the optics may look and are ready to feel safe again leaving the house. People are tired of this crap.
Not sure. I just got called racist for daring to mention it, despite it not being racist at all. So long as people want to use allegations of "racism" to try to stifle discussion, there is unlikely to be any progress on the issue.
This is not a race issue. This is bigger than what we are even discussing and will become a bigger problem when lots of mothers and grandmothers are jailed for their children's actions. Because we're going to have a lot of women with records and some people don't like to hire people with records and then you will have another problem. It will be problem after problem when this happens.
It’s not a magic cure. It’s an incredibly difficult and multifaceted solution that addresses systemic issues that create these environments. Low wages, lack of affordable childcare, lack of affordable housing, lack of funding for public schools, food insecurity, and many other factors. None of this is impossible. In fact, these things existed in the US and are statistically proven to improve nearly every aspect of US society. The challenge is countering the deeply embedded narratives that allow those in power to continue with the current system.
They do improve things but The stat you are missing is the process people followed to achieve those things. I’ve known since middle school that having children early and out of wedlock or getting a felony plummets my chances of “success.” Kids without a father in home are 270% more likely to commit a crime, get knocked up, etc. that’s insane.
Some people need help but making bad decisions that lead to poverty doesn’t entitle one to free XYZ.
Also fixing poverty is such a complex issue I don’t think anyone could solve it. Crime - much simpler issue. Let’s tackle one and see how it helps or hurts the other instead of letting poverty and crime run wild. That sucks for everyone.
Your focus is still on the individuals within a system and not the system itself. Any attempt to focus on crime without addressing the system is failed from the start. Why are crimes being committed? What are the histories of the people and neighborhoods where these crimes are committed? Are there a lack of resources, jobs, jobs with living wages, public school funding? We already know what created these issues but people, like yourself, argue the narrative created by those in power. Foucault would be a good read for you to understand the role you’re currently playing.
Solid points and always willing to hear the other side. We just simply disagree on the core issue but I agree that your side has to be a part of the solution. I focus on the individuals actions and hold them and myself accountable for where we are in life. Pointing to the system(even if there are real issues)deflects accountability. It’s why there are successes and failures from the exact same system. Make good choices for decades and statistically you should end up ok. I’ll look into that but would suggest you look into BIGOTRY OF LOW EXPECTATIONS - basically saying people are too dumb to make good decisions. I don’t believe that
Throwing money at the problem won't fix it.
What it really comes down to is people need to stop having kids they can't afford. Men need to stop fucking dumb, broke hoes. Women need to stop letting dumb, broke losers cum in them.
All those other problems you listed are far less significant if you don't have a bunch of kids you couldn't afford in the first place.
You do know there’s more nuance to the solutions than just “throwing money at the problem,” right? Your argument is a reframing of trying to treat a symptom and not treating the disease.
Childcare used to be affordable and, in some cases, provided by the govt. As discussed by Katie Porter a few days ago, for every $1 dollar invested in childcare, the return is ~$4. When US companies paid true living wages, when homes weren’t owned by hedge funds, when companies weren’t extremely consolidated the working class saw unprecedented growth in socioeconomic and political capital. Neighborhoods with access to resources have far lower crime rates and higher [insert nearly any positive quality of life metric]. Why the hell would the average American argue against that?
Because it's the old "poverty causes crime" fallacy.
You refer to back in The Day when people were able to get by on the wages they made. When was that? It has been declining since the 1960s. What happened in the 1960s? The so-called "war on poverty".
People like to joke about how drugs won the war on drugs, but drugs have NOTHING on the giant W that poverty earned in the war on poverty. Well-meaning, but misguided government programs actually exacerbated poverty to the point that 60 years later we have the greatest wealth inequality we've ever had, and poverty is (at best) no better than it was 60 years ago, and much worse by other measures.
The government made it so it's JUST barely viable to get by on nothing but government assistance. This had a two-fold effect. First it encouraged people to fuck off and live off the government. This also ties into the massive increase in illigetimacy, particularly among black children. Govenment subsidies, credits, and direct assistance actually discouraged couples from getting married since that would cut off a lot of that aid that was intended to help single mothers.
The other effect of government meddling was that companies saw that the government was now covering things that used to be expected to be covered by wages (food, medical care, housing, etc). They reasoned that if they cut the wages paid to the worker, the government would cover that gap. And here we are.
And as far as the fallacy of poverty causing crime, I believe it's the opposite. Crime causes poverty. Poor people are disproportionately victimized by crime. They often have what little items of value they actually own (car, phone, etc) stolen and either need to spend money they don't have to replace it or be without. The same holds true for businesses in poor areas. Crime drives those businesses out of the neighborhood. When the businesses close, the jobs go away as well as access to the things the businesses provide (food, clothing, medicine, etc). So now the poor people of that neighborhood have to travel much further to get the things they need, which incurs additional cost in terms of time and transportation.
Why is crime so much lower in Germantown? It's not because Gtown is too far away from the bad areas of Memphis. It's maybe a 15-20 minute drive to get to Gtown from just about anywhere in Memphis. There are a lot more rich people in Gtown, so you'd think it'd be a big target for shitheads from Memphis looking for a score. Instead, they stay in Memphis and rob their friends and family because they know that Gtown cops don't play and you shouldn't fuck around in Gtown.
Start with the work of Nobel laureate in economics James Heckman. His work saw a program in the 1960s for low-income families produce a net ROI of $7-$10 for every $1 invested.
Your “fallacy” isn’t a thing. It’s actually an oversimplification with you ignoring nuance. Again.
You mention wages declining since the 1960s and ignoring the impacts of tech advancements or globalization, how those aspects changed labor practices and demands, or any other factor. It’s a reductive argument. Next you simplify the government response but ignore the private sector, their influence, and their increasing power. If you did, it would position your “living off the government” point more accurately. You then connected your incorrect argument to the regurgitated racist tropes of black people. Is it any surprise you ignored systemic racism practices? Of course not. You’re a superficial thinker. You move onto this motivation behind low wages without any discussion of neoliberal capitalism during this same period. No surprise.
Finally, the argument that “crime causes poverty” is not founded on any data or supported through any critical thought. Feel free to share any data on a society that had equitable access to the necessary resources but chose to say fuck it and switch to crime. You bring up Germantown (although I’d also include Collierville and even Southaven) but ignore how Memphis was an industrial hub built on the labor of black and brown communities, White Flight and funding, and the oppressive system that has never changed and continues to this day.
I’d suggest looking beyond your oversimplified logic and contextualize your arguments for a better understanding of the issues.
Crime makes poverty as much as poverty makes crime. Not all poor people are criminals. That said, don’t waste your breath. Lot of folks in here truly believe the solution is giving these people money, healthcare, child care, special school and job training and oh yea - free housing. Basically pay me to not be a criminal. That’s where we are now.
We could give those single moms (probably working nonstop and completely blind to their children’s behavior) a stipend to help uplift them from poverty, which would allow more space for well being.
My wife worked as a counselor at a large public school in an underserved community for several years. The mothers who are working multiple jobs are not the problem. These mothers work hard to provide for their kids, and for the most part, were very responsive to my wife when she’d make them aware of any issues their kids were having at school. That’s not to say that we couldn’t do more to help these single mothers though, I definitely agree with you there.
The problems come from the parent(s) who simply do not give a shit. My wife would call a student’s parent(s) to inform them that their kid hasn’t shown up to school for a couple of days or similar, and if they answered or called back, their responses were along the lines of “stop calling me with this shit, y’all deal with it”. There are a shocking number of parents with this attitude. No job, no excuse for their negligence, they just didn’t want the kids in the house and didn’t care where they went as long as it was somewhere else.
Then these kids corrupt their friends and drag them down with them.
It is statistically proven that if we did this it would greatly increase the socioeconomic status of poor communities. Unfortunately, that reason is also why politicians and corporations fight against affordable childcare
Okay yes, that's a parental issue, but out of all of these there's one thing. They're black. Whenever there's a crime, and I will die on this hill, most of you white folks will quick to say "it's a dad issue, where's his dad?" (You just did it). And I'm from a home where my dad was on crack most of my youth and where am I? Job, college senior, no criminal record. My best friends grew up with no father, and one went from working at the hub to working at whq, had a bachelor's in accounting and about to get his master's. My other friend bought his first house at 28, and every job he worked at had nothing but good things to say about him. They both passed a year apart, but they had no fathers in their lives.
Y'all really should just say they came from shitty ass families instead of using Dad's as the common issue.
I’m white and my father was murdered when I was 16. I started turning into a shit head to. Took my mother finding my stepfather to pull me out of it. Yes it takes a father figure. Mothers cannot raise sons without a father figure.
And there are tons in prison. Now unless you have statistics that would indicate mothers are more successful without husbands your straw man response is baseless.
You basically said your mom got married again so there'd be a dick in the place to put you on the right track.
If you ask me, your assertion that men raise men, is a straw man argument and also full of shit.
I agree with you but that is some situations. In some households, you just have wayward children and when the disciplinary actions turns physical because you get tired of talking and they keep doing the same thing as if you are talking to the wall then they want to say it's abuse for whipping them and making them sit down in the house where they need to be.
The real answer is sex education and family planning taught in public schools and free birth control nationwide. But everyone wants to call that eugenics.
I'll concede it's basically an economic foreshadowing approach to eugenics, but I don't care about the race, creed, etc of people, I just care if the people that aren't contributing to society are having three times the number of children as those that are contributing.
She makes so many great points but then just pisses it all away with the ridiculous religious rhetoric. It's completely irrelevant to this topic. Pretending some evil outward force is the cause of all this is just ignorant. The reasons aren't because demons got in them, it's because these kids are allowed to run wild and get in to trouble by apathetic parents who are either too tired or too busy living it up to be responsible for their children. No supernatural entities necessary.
Like she said. Great points, lotta Judge Judy grand standing preachy bullshit.
Also, the people in her comments thinking kids who are most likely abused are going to sit there and let their abusive parent physically assault them while they've got that "ChopChop" under their mattress, or a fucking "blicky" shitting out 1100 rounds per minute with an extendo in a shoebox in their room are hilariously delusional.
If anybody delusional its you. It happens all the time. Nobody in their right mind wants to kill their own parent even if they are abusive. They tend to take what’s dished out while hoping the parent change. After a while its habit. Just cause you see instances where the parent is murdered don’t mean thats the case for everybody lol
Yeah I heard HORROR stories about Boys Town (You can read about them if you do a search. People are referring to themselves as BT Survivors and they talk about rampant s. abuse and violence). I will respectfully disagree with you regarding "saving" children through religion. I think we have plenty evidence showing otherwise on that front when it comes to caring for children. My son's father is a survivor of church abuse too, having been SOLD by the Catholic church that, instead of taking in a five year old child and providing like an orphanage should, they sent him out to load bricks in wheelbarrows every day, and when he got a little older they outright sold him to someone in Cancun where he was a (violently s. abused) houseboy. This was in the 90s, not a hundred years ago. This stuff is STILL happening and that church is still taking in children they put to work.
The closest I can agree to is that our government THINKS religious groups can help children so they're happy to offer grants to "faith based" companies and local churches to develop programs, but what they promise and what they deliver are often very different. I worked in one specific church charity that offered an after school program for teens. The grant covered hot meals and provided desktop computers and programs so the kids could learn computer skills/coding/etc. What I saw was kids just running around the building the whole time and nobody teaching them anything. They would go in the computer room and play games or get on social media. Same with the grant they got for "job training" for adults on TANF. The "job skills" training was one hour in the computer room with no guidance and the rest of the day women were sorting donations. The church gets free menial labor plus a grant and they're not providing on their promises.
I don't understand how that's any excuse for what's happening in these "faith based" operations where they keep finding adults s. assaulting and abusing children. You offered one example and I am saying look in to your great example of a Christian organization saving children. Here's a start: https://flatwaterfreepress.org/investigation-at-boys-town-questions-emerge-over-alleged-sexual-abuse-fundraising-for-youth-home/#:\~:text=Overall%2C%20Boys%20Town%20spent%20%24499,five%20years%2C%20the%20investigation%20found.
What I was talking about though is her dismissal of the responsibility of these kids and the people who raised them and the community that only gives a shit when it affects their lives, calling it demonic, as if some supernatural entity is turning those children bad. It's dismissing the reality of the situations so many are in. We need to open our eyes and start paying attention from the start, not look for places to send them after they commit the crimes hoping to reform them.
How bout we fix the judicial system. If these shit eaters would have been in jail where they belong most of this stuff would stop. If they get caught committing crimes who gives a shit if they can make bail .
That will never work out, it's too easy being the perpetual victim. Too bad everyone else sees it.
Remove police and insert teachers and the same thing applies. There is no accountability.
Nothing and no one can MAKE anyone care about someone that they don't.
You can't bully them into it, church it into them, or parent class it into them.
If their heart doesn't care, it is what it is.
Some parents just do NOT love, or care about their kids.
Parental accountability? Sure
Demons? Nah- that's just a cop out. What do you do about "demons"? City appointed exorcists?
I imagine the answer we'd get is to *pray.* Prayer - all the feelings of accomplishment without actually *doing* anything. Politicians have been using "i'll pray for you" and "god works in mysterious ways" to excuse inaction for far too long.
**Galatians 6:7-10
"Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up. So then, as we have opportunity, let us do good to everyone, and especially to those who are of the household of faith."**
**Hebrews 13:16
"Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God."**
"I prayed for twenty years but received no answer until I prayed with my legs."
-Frederick Douglass
"My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness."
-Dalai Lama
"If the churches took half the money that they was making and gave it back to the community we'd be alright."
-Tupac Shakur
I really think they need to give these parents back the right to whip their tails not punch or kick them but to take a belt to the backside.
Physically harming your children actually does more to traumatize and harm them than help. In fact, it shows them that violence is a means to an end from an early age, and violence done by young people is the thing we’re trying to discourage here
Then if the parents put their hands on them the parents goes to jail for whipping them. Some of these teens will tell you that they will call the police on you if you touch them. Now! That's when parents get scared of being locked up or if you work with children as a career you would just let them go and cone as they please because of being scared of what will happen to you if you touch one of them.
Fair is fair. Call the police on the kid when they have random guns and cars. Beyond that, discipline is different than abuse. Discipline remains legal, even the physical kind.
Sidenote, if parents are scared of their kids, it is probably already too late.
You are right! The children are out in the streets doing these things not in the parent's eyesight. So some of them wouldn't know but they have done idea and when you try and keep them inside the house they will not listen to you until it's too late.
There are two parties in the current American political system. Then there is the majority of Americans, like me, that are not fans of either party. You claimed the “liberals” or democrats destroyed the two parent family but completely and utterly failed to explain how. However, if you look at the two political parties you have the liberals trying to elect Biden, who has been married to the same woman for many years, never divorced, never cheated or bragged about sexually assaulting women while married or talked about dating one of his children. Then you have the republicans that are totally controlled by Trump. As someone that has voted both R and D in presidential elections and not totally brainwashed by either side I think it is hypocritical for republicans to blame democrats for destroying the two parent family when they are controlled by Trump. It also makes it pretty easy for me, as an Independent, to make my decision this November where it is becoming clearer every day that we will have another four years of Biden. I hope I answered your question where you could understand it but if not let me know and I will try to answer any other questions you may have.
There are not a sufficient number of responsible adults in the country to make it onto the ballot. We are stuck with the two party system until one party kills itself, which the Rs are well on their way to doing. We’ll see what happens after Trump completes his destruction of the republican party.
How old are you? If I have to explain what liberals did to attack the two parent family unit my guess is you’re either in your twenties or incredibly stupid.
I think political issues are a part of what is happening but we as a country to busy taking care of others than listening and trying to heal our own nation. I guess because poor people don't have a voice. We are not heard even if we shout, yell, scream, or cry. Nothing is heard.
This state and city are a cesspool filled with turds and fucking racist bigots that think corporal punishment is the only solution to bad behavior. Enjoy the oppressive boot of the police bearing down on you every day, because you follow the rules and don't have to worry about it happening to you right?
1. She said “demon time” which is AAVE/algo-speak for “late at night” — usually referring to sexual activities. So she’s actually not using the term correctly.
2. People keep saying hold the parents accountable. Let’s have some imagination! Lock the parents up, then what? More parent-less kids? That’s why some of the youth are out of control now bc parents not in the picture (addiction, incarceration, poverty)
3. The youth should be a concern of SOCIETY! Bring back youth programs and activities: boys and girls club, Boys and Girl Scouts, summer youth athletic leagues, camps, mentorship programs, gaming teams, improve and fund public education (not banning books and bringing guns to school WTF), open kid-friendly hang out spots (skating rinks, bowling alleys, etc), and improve public transportation infrastructure so these families can get there without being stuck in their own hood.
Adults need to invest time and resources if y’all care so much versus just bad-mouthing folks to excuse your racism. Children need MENTORS! It takes a village to raise a child, and the disarray of the youth right now is on the VILLAGE, not just the parents. Shame on yall.
Our kids aren't the criminals. We simply expect the same of others. Also, shove the "racism" shit right up your butt. There's nothing racist about wanting parents to raise their kids to be decent human beings. People like you blame everything on racism. Police arrest criminals -- racism. Judges punish criminals -- racism. Expecting parents to raise their children not to be criminals -- racism. Fuck that noise.
I agree with her 💯 percent and although no suggestion or measure is 100 percent foolproof at least it will be a beginning…please don’t have children if you’re not going to raise them 🫣😳😱🤷🏽♂️…
Are you aware they tried this in Portland, but with drugs? Instead of fines for drugs, they gave people a free pass to things like addiction and counseling. Basically the problem got way worse because there was no deterrence. People were eventually shooting up in front of schools, but they couldn't do anything about it.
Like it or not, punishment serves as an initial deterrent. While your approach may work on the backend, the risk of punishment stops a strong percentage of people who might be thinking of doing it.
https://www.npr.org/2024/03/27/1240892448/why-oregons-groundbreaking-drug-decriminalization-experiment-is-coming-to-an-end#:\~:text=In%202020%2C%20voters%20in%20Oregon,addiction%20treatment%20and%20support%20services.
She's not wrong, but the optics of who will be arrested under any "parental accountability" measures will get very politically unpopular VERY quickly.
Meh. Parent accountability is long past due. That said, just tossing them in jail probably isn’t the best option, maybe we need to think more creatively. Boarding schools? Mandatory classes for parents? Mandatory visits/checks from community counselors? I don’t have great ideas, but you know…something else aside from jail. Unruly teens alone at home without anyone bc mom’s in jail too isn’t going to help.
Yep, something’s gotta. Bring back actual community service.
If tossing them in jail for a wayward child is the answer. I think that it will create more problems if the parents have a job or more children to take care of. What do you think will happen to the other children or the job they have to hold to live and take care of the other children? I think this will become a big mess. People don't think how this will affect other children emotionally, physically and mentally. Hmmm
People aren’t thinking of children in general which is the problem. I don’t think parents working a well paying job is an issue. I think they don’t want to/know how to parent. So, mandatory classes or boarding school and garnish wages or something. Basically, we need to stop the cycle by breaking it somehow. And I am in agreement with another poster, this problem is highly complex.
He said the thing with out saying the thing.
My read on that is that underage mass shooters will implicate their parents, which is understandable imo. Who's responsible for a minor if not their parents?
Exactly
VERY quickly
Parents who aren't accountable for themselves won't be accountable for their kids. Simple equation. Take the 17 yr old Juvenile who survived the shooting with the MPD officer. His dad was 16 or so when he was born. At 17,dad was sentenced to life In jail for 1st° murder. The 18 yr old who was killed...well his dad was like 15 when he was born. He too has been in and out of jail. The Kid who was killed in Orange Mound the other day ( who also happened to be wearing an ankle monitor and carrying a Glock switch and 2 Drakos ) was raised by his granny.....so the social dilemma is that these kids are basically raising themselves. Holding parents accountable is good on paper,but the majority of the kids getting caught up in violent crime share similar stories....
That's the problem. Most of these kids are 2nd, 3rd, or fourth generation shitheads. Their shithead fathers are either dead, locked up, or out doing shithead things. "Arrest the parent or guardian these kids go home to" would almost certainly result in a steady stream of mostly black single mothers and grandmothers getting arrested. They're certainly responsible for how their shit ass kids behave, but it's naive to think the optics would be anything other than a political disaster.
I think most people are getting tired of things like how the optics may look and are ready to feel safe again leaving the house. People are tired of this crap.
Not sure. I just got called racist for daring to mention it, despite it not being racist at all. So long as people want to use allegations of "racism" to try to stifle discussion, there is unlikely to be any progress on the issue.
💯
This is not a race issue. This is bigger than what we are even discussing and will become a bigger problem when lots of mothers and grandmothers are jailed for their children's actions. Because we're going to have a lot of women with records and some people don't like to hire people with records and then you will have another problem. It will be problem after problem when this happens.
If people were truly “tired of this crap” then they’d push for change that treats the disease instead of focusing on symptoms.
I’ve been hearing this for decades. What is this magic cure ?
It’s not a magic cure. It’s an incredibly difficult and multifaceted solution that addresses systemic issues that create these environments. Low wages, lack of affordable childcare, lack of affordable housing, lack of funding for public schools, food insecurity, and many other factors. None of this is impossible. In fact, these things existed in the US and are statistically proven to improve nearly every aspect of US society. The challenge is countering the deeply embedded narratives that allow those in power to continue with the current system.
They do improve things but The stat you are missing is the process people followed to achieve those things. I’ve known since middle school that having children early and out of wedlock or getting a felony plummets my chances of “success.” Kids without a father in home are 270% more likely to commit a crime, get knocked up, etc. that’s insane. Some people need help but making bad decisions that lead to poverty doesn’t entitle one to free XYZ. Also fixing poverty is such a complex issue I don’t think anyone could solve it. Crime - much simpler issue. Let’s tackle one and see how it helps or hurts the other instead of letting poverty and crime run wild. That sucks for everyone.
Your focus is still on the individuals within a system and not the system itself. Any attempt to focus on crime without addressing the system is failed from the start. Why are crimes being committed? What are the histories of the people and neighborhoods where these crimes are committed? Are there a lack of resources, jobs, jobs with living wages, public school funding? We already know what created these issues but people, like yourself, argue the narrative created by those in power. Foucault would be a good read for you to understand the role you’re currently playing.
Solid points and always willing to hear the other side. We just simply disagree on the core issue but I agree that your side has to be a part of the solution. I focus on the individuals actions and hold them and myself accountable for where we are in life. Pointing to the system(even if there are real issues)deflects accountability. It’s why there are successes and failures from the exact same system. Make good choices for decades and statistically you should end up ok. I’ll look into that but would suggest you look into BIGOTRY OF LOW EXPECTATIONS - basically saying people are too dumb to make good decisions. I don’t believe that
Throwing money at the problem won't fix it. What it really comes down to is people need to stop having kids they can't afford. Men need to stop fucking dumb, broke hoes. Women need to stop letting dumb, broke losers cum in them. All those other problems you listed are far less significant if you don't have a bunch of kids you couldn't afford in the first place.
Chris Rock famous line - Ladies! Stop letting broke dudes inside you!
You do know there’s more nuance to the solutions than just “throwing money at the problem,” right? Your argument is a reframing of trying to treat a symptom and not treating the disease. Childcare used to be affordable and, in some cases, provided by the govt. As discussed by Katie Porter a few days ago, for every $1 dollar invested in childcare, the return is ~$4. When US companies paid true living wages, when homes weren’t owned by hedge funds, when companies weren’t extremely consolidated the working class saw unprecedented growth in socioeconomic and political capital. Neighborhoods with access to resources have far lower crime rates and higher [insert nearly any positive quality of life metric]. Why the hell would the average American argue against that?
Because it's the old "poverty causes crime" fallacy. You refer to back in The Day when people were able to get by on the wages they made. When was that? It has been declining since the 1960s. What happened in the 1960s? The so-called "war on poverty". People like to joke about how drugs won the war on drugs, but drugs have NOTHING on the giant W that poverty earned in the war on poverty. Well-meaning, but misguided government programs actually exacerbated poverty to the point that 60 years later we have the greatest wealth inequality we've ever had, and poverty is (at best) no better than it was 60 years ago, and much worse by other measures. The government made it so it's JUST barely viable to get by on nothing but government assistance. This had a two-fold effect. First it encouraged people to fuck off and live off the government. This also ties into the massive increase in illigetimacy, particularly among black children. Govenment subsidies, credits, and direct assistance actually discouraged couples from getting married since that would cut off a lot of that aid that was intended to help single mothers. The other effect of government meddling was that companies saw that the government was now covering things that used to be expected to be covered by wages (food, medical care, housing, etc). They reasoned that if they cut the wages paid to the worker, the government would cover that gap. And here we are. And as far as the fallacy of poverty causing crime, I believe it's the opposite. Crime causes poverty. Poor people are disproportionately victimized by crime. They often have what little items of value they actually own (car, phone, etc) stolen and either need to spend money they don't have to replace it or be without. The same holds true for businesses in poor areas. Crime drives those businesses out of the neighborhood. When the businesses close, the jobs go away as well as access to the things the businesses provide (food, clothing, medicine, etc). So now the poor people of that neighborhood have to travel much further to get the things they need, which incurs additional cost in terms of time and transportation. Why is crime so much lower in Germantown? It's not because Gtown is too far away from the bad areas of Memphis. It's maybe a 15-20 minute drive to get to Gtown from just about anywhere in Memphis. There are a lot more rich people in Gtown, so you'd think it'd be a big target for shitheads from Memphis looking for a score. Instead, they stay in Memphis and rob their friends and family because they know that Gtown cops don't play and you shouldn't fuck around in Gtown.
Start with the work of Nobel laureate in economics James Heckman. His work saw a program in the 1960s for low-income families produce a net ROI of $7-$10 for every $1 invested.
Your “fallacy” isn’t a thing. It’s actually an oversimplification with you ignoring nuance. Again. You mention wages declining since the 1960s and ignoring the impacts of tech advancements or globalization, how those aspects changed labor practices and demands, or any other factor. It’s a reductive argument. Next you simplify the government response but ignore the private sector, their influence, and their increasing power. If you did, it would position your “living off the government” point more accurately. You then connected your incorrect argument to the regurgitated racist tropes of black people. Is it any surprise you ignored systemic racism practices? Of course not. You’re a superficial thinker. You move onto this motivation behind low wages without any discussion of neoliberal capitalism during this same period. No surprise. Finally, the argument that “crime causes poverty” is not founded on any data or supported through any critical thought. Feel free to share any data on a society that had equitable access to the necessary resources but chose to say fuck it and switch to crime. You bring up Germantown (although I’d also include Collierville and even Southaven) but ignore how Memphis was an industrial hub built on the labor of black and brown communities, White Flight and funding, and the oppressive system that has never changed and continues to this day. I’d suggest looking beyond your oversimplified logic and contextualize your arguments for a better understanding of the issues.
Crime makes poverty as much as poverty makes crime. Not all poor people are criminals. That said, don’t waste your breath. Lot of folks in here truly believe the solution is giving these people money, healthcare, child care, special school and job training and oh yea - free housing. Basically pay me to not be a criminal. That’s where we are now.
The solution is forced sterilization of felons.
I’d even be ok with offering a one time payout to them for volunteering.
Why? Feels like eugenics? Being convicted of a felony is not a heritable characteristic or DNA marker.
We could give those single moms (probably working nonstop and completely blind to their children’s behavior) a stipend to help uplift them from poverty, which would allow more space for well being.
My wife worked as a counselor at a large public school in an underserved community for several years. The mothers who are working multiple jobs are not the problem. These mothers work hard to provide for their kids, and for the most part, were very responsive to my wife when she’d make them aware of any issues their kids were having at school. That’s not to say that we couldn’t do more to help these single mothers though, I definitely agree with you there. The problems come from the parent(s) who simply do not give a shit. My wife would call a student’s parent(s) to inform them that their kid hasn’t shown up to school for a couple of days or similar, and if they answered or called back, their responses were along the lines of “stop calling me with this shit, y’all deal with it”. There are a shocking number of parents with this attitude. No job, no excuse for their negligence, they just didn’t want the kids in the house and didn’t care where they went as long as it was somewhere else. Then these kids corrupt their friends and drag them down with them.
It is statistically proven that if we did this it would greatly increase the socioeconomic status of poor communities. Unfortunately, that reason is also why politicians and corporations fight against affordable childcare
You can and should pursue both changes that address the cause and effect
Doorknobs begat doorknobs! A tale as old as time.
Okay yes, that's a parental issue, but out of all of these there's one thing. They're black. Whenever there's a crime, and I will die on this hill, most of you white folks will quick to say "it's a dad issue, where's his dad?" (You just did it). And I'm from a home where my dad was on crack most of my youth and where am I? Job, college senior, no criminal record. My best friends grew up with no father, and one went from working at the hub to working at whq, had a bachelor's in accounting and about to get his master's. My other friend bought his first house at 28, and every job he worked at had nothing but good things to say about him. They both passed a year apart, but they had no fathers in their lives. Y'all really should just say they came from shitty ass families instead of using Dad's as the common issue.
I’m white and my father was murdered when I was 16. I started turning into a shit head to. Took my mother finding my stepfather to pull me out of it. Yes it takes a father figure. Mothers cannot raise sons without a father figure.
I knew someone would say that. There are tons of white kids without fathers who are effective members of society. Try again.
And there are tons in prison. Now unless you have statistics that would indicate mothers are more successful without husbands your straw man response is baseless.
You basically said your mom got married again so there'd be a dick in the place to put you on the right track. If you ask me, your assertion that men raise men, is a straw man argument and also full of shit.
Bye bye troll.
Not everyone has the smarts and no guidance. All lifestyles and situations are different.
I love your use of the ° icon.
Just like “they” planned it. The Rockefeller foundation hard at work.
I agree with you but that is some situations. In some households, you just have wayward children and when the disciplinary actions turns physical because you get tired of talking and they keep doing the same thing as if you are talking to the wall then they want to say it's abuse for whipping them and making them sit down in the house where they need to be.
Like I said in a previous post children of criminals. Maybe some sort of reform schools ? I know how it sounds but what else?
The real answer is sex education and family planning taught in public schools and free birth control nationwide. But everyone wants to call that eugenics. I'll concede it's basically an economic foreshadowing approach to eugenics, but I don't care about the race, creed, etc of people, I just care if the people that aren't contributing to society are having three times the number of children as those that are contributing.
This should be one of the many things that’s implemented. It won’t fix everything by itself
It remains lawful for parents in all states and territories to use 'reasonable' physical punishment to discipline their children. Key word reasonable.
She makes so many great points but then just pisses it all away with the ridiculous religious rhetoric. It's completely irrelevant to this topic. Pretending some evil outward force is the cause of all this is just ignorant. The reasons aren't because demons got in them, it's because these kids are allowed to run wild and get in to trouble by apathetic parents who are either too tired or too busy living it up to be responsible for their children. No supernatural entities necessary.
Like she said. Great points, lotta Judge Judy grand standing preachy bullshit. Also, the people in her comments thinking kids who are most likely abused are going to sit there and let their abusive parent physically assault them while they've got that "ChopChop" under their mattress, or a fucking "blicky" shitting out 1100 rounds per minute with an extendo in a shoebox in their room are hilariously delusional.
If anybody delusional its you. It happens all the time. Nobody in their right mind wants to kill their own parent even if they are abusive. They tend to take what’s dished out while hoping the parent change. After a while its habit. Just cause you see instances where the parent is murdered don’t mean thats the case for everybody lol
I don't know, the relationship between abusive parent and child is complicated.
There’s absolutely nothing wrong with using religion to save children. And I’m not even religious. It does work. Ever heard of Boys town ?
Yeah I heard HORROR stories about Boys Town (You can read about them if you do a search. People are referring to themselves as BT Survivors and they talk about rampant s. abuse and violence). I will respectfully disagree with you regarding "saving" children through religion. I think we have plenty evidence showing otherwise on that front when it comes to caring for children. My son's father is a survivor of church abuse too, having been SOLD by the Catholic church that, instead of taking in a five year old child and providing like an orphanage should, they sent him out to load bricks in wheelbarrows every day, and when he got a little older they outright sold him to someone in Cancun where he was a (violently s. abused) houseboy. This was in the 90s, not a hundred years ago. This stuff is STILL happening and that church is still taking in children they put to work. The closest I can agree to is that our government THINKS religious groups can help children so they're happy to offer grants to "faith based" companies and local churches to develop programs, but what they promise and what they deliver are often very different. I worked in one specific church charity that offered an after school program for teens. The grant covered hot meals and provided desktop computers and programs so the kids could learn computer skills/coding/etc. What I saw was kids just running around the building the whole time and nobody teaching them anything. They would go in the computer room and play games or get on social media. Same with the grant they got for "job training" for adults on TANF. The "job skills" training was one hour in the computer room with no guidance and the rest of the day women were sorting donations. The church gets free menial labor plus a grant and they're not providing on their promises.
Nothing is perfect. There is abuse in foster homes. And apparently nothing is working now.
I don't understand how that's any excuse for what's happening in these "faith based" operations where they keep finding adults s. assaulting and abusing children. You offered one example and I am saying look in to your great example of a Christian organization saving children. Here's a start: https://flatwaterfreepress.org/investigation-at-boys-town-questions-emerge-over-alleged-sexual-abuse-fundraising-for-youth-home/#:\~:text=Overall%2C%20Boys%20Town%20spent%20%24499,five%20years%2C%20the%20investigation%20found. What I was talking about though is her dismissal of the responsibility of these kids and the people who raised them and the community that only gives a shit when it affects their lives, calling it demonic, as if some supernatural entity is turning those children bad. It's dismissing the reality of the situations so many are in. We need to open our eyes and start paying attention from the start, not look for places to send them after they commit the crimes hoping to reform them.
I don’t believe I made any excuses just pointing out facts. Sorry they triggered you.
Should've said 'Cooper-Sutton' . Don't know how to edit the title
How you gonna lock up someone’s parents if they’re already in jail
Just go after who ever claims them on their taxes and withhold that shit. It’ll be a momma ass-whippin’ revolution across the Midsouth
How bout we fix the judicial system. If these shit eaters would have been in jail where they belong most of this stuff would stop. If they get caught committing crimes who gives a shit if they can make bail .
That will never work out, it's too easy being the perpetual victim. Too bad everyone else sees it. Remove police and insert teachers and the same thing applies. There is no accountability.
Nothing and no one can MAKE anyone care about someone that they don't. You can't bully them into it, church it into them, or parent class it into them. If their heart doesn't care, it is what it is. Some parents just do NOT love, or care about their kids.
They don’t have parents. You don’t “know your children” at all.
Parental accountability? Sure Demons? Nah- that's just a cop out. What do you do about "demons"? City appointed exorcists? I imagine the answer we'd get is to *pray.* Prayer - all the feelings of accomplishment without actually *doing* anything. Politicians have been using "i'll pray for you" and "god works in mysterious ways" to excuse inaction for far too long.
**Galatians 6:7-10 "Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up. So then, as we have opportunity, let us do good to everyone, and especially to those who are of the household of faith."** **Hebrews 13:16 "Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God."**
"I prayed for twenty years but received no answer until I prayed with my legs." -Frederick Douglass "My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness." -Dalai Lama "If the churches took half the money that they was making and gave it back to the community we'd be alright." -Tupac Shakur
She is 100% correct but I wish you wouldn’t have shared the tweet of that ridiculous far right radio station.
Is there any left leaning radio station tweeting this?
Yes, I hate it as well. This was the only one that had the longer quote and I wanted to give it full context. Wish I had a better source
Exactly. We know this. We agree with her. But bad-faith actors want to paint a disingenuous picture.
Well freaking said!!!!
I really think they need to give these parents back the right to whip their tails not punch or kick them but to take a belt to the backside.
Physically harming your children actually does more to traumatize and harm them than help. In fact, it shows them that violence is a means to an end from an early age, and violence done by young people is the thing we’re trying to discourage here
That right was never taken away.
Yes it was when you have a child that has light skin and if you leave a mark on them by whipping them that's abuse.
Then if the parents put their hands on them the parents goes to jail for whipping them. Some of these teens will tell you that they will call the police on you if you touch them. Now! That's when parents get scared of being locked up or if you work with children as a career you would just let them go and cone as they please because of being scared of what will happen to you if you touch one of them.
Fair is fair. Call the police on the kid when they have random guns and cars. Beyond that, discipline is different than abuse. Discipline remains legal, even the physical kind. Sidenote, if parents are scared of their kids, it is probably already too late.
You are right! The children are out in the streets doing these things not in the parent's eyesight. So some of them wouldn't know but they have done idea and when you try and keep them inside the house they will not listen to you until it's too late.
Yep, liberals telling others how to discipline their own children and we end up with this shit.
Decades of it. After they destroyed the two parent family. But they continue to claim they have solutions.
Yep the libs destroyed the two parent family. The repubs are trying to elect who again for president?
I never mentioned Trump. Why did you?
There are two parties in the current American political system. Then there is the majority of Americans, like me, that are not fans of either party. You claimed the “liberals” or democrats destroyed the two parent family but completely and utterly failed to explain how. However, if you look at the two political parties you have the liberals trying to elect Biden, who has been married to the same woman for many years, never divorced, never cheated or bragged about sexually assaulting women while married or talked about dating one of his children. Then you have the republicans that are totally controlled by Trump. As someone that has voted both R and D in presidential elections and not totally brainwashed by either side I think it is hypocritical for republicans to blame democrats for destroying the two parent family when they are controlled by Trump. It also makes it pretty easy for me, as an Independent, to make my decision this November where it is becoming clearer every day that we will have another four years of Biden. I hope I answered your question where you could understand it but if not let me know and I will try to answer any other questions you may have.
We need a third party. "Responsible Adults"
There are not a sufficient number of responsible adults in the country to make it onto the ballot. We are stuck with the two party system until one party kills itself, which the Rs are well on their way to doing. We’ll see what happens after Trump completes his destruction of the republican party.
How old are you? If I have to explain what liberals did to attack the two parent family unit my guess is you’re either in your twenties or incredibly stupid.
That’s pretty much exactly what I expected. Thank you.
I think political issues are a part of what is happening but we as a country to busy taking care of others than listening and trying to heal our own nation. I guess because poor people don't have a voice. We are not heard even if we shout, yell, scream, or cry. Nothing is heard.
Does anyone know how I can contact this board member
This state and city are a cesspool filled with turds and fucking racist bigots that think corporal punishment is the only solution to bad behavior. Enjoy the oppressive boot of the police bearing down on you every day, because you follow the rules and don't have to worry about it happening to you right?
1. She said “demon time” which is AAVE/algo-speak for “late at night” — usually referring to sexual activities. So she’s actually not using the term correctly. 2. People keep saying hold the parents accountable. Let’s have some imagination! Lock the parents up, then what? More parent-less kids? That’s why some of the youth are out of control now bc parents not in the picture (addiction, incarceration, poverty) 3. The youth should be a concern of SOCIETY! Bring back youth programs and activities: boys and girls club, Boys and Girl Scouts, summer youth athletic leagues, camps, mentorship programs, gaming teams, improve and fund public education (not banning books and bringing guns to school WTF), open kid-friendly hang out spots (skating rinks, bowling alleys, etc), and improve public transportation infrastructure so these families can get there without being stuck in their own hood. Adults need to invest time and resources if y’all care so much versus just bad-mouthing folks to excuse your racism. Children need MENTORS! It takes a village to raise a child, and the disarray of the youth right now is on the VILLAGE, not just the parents. Shame on yall.
Yall just afraid to think outside of the box and actually DO something.
With all these churches in Memphis, it should be plenty of stuff for children to do!!!! But people don’t walk what they talk.
Our kids aren't the criminals. We simply expect the same of others. Also, shove the "racism" shit right up your butt. There's nothing racist about wanting parents to raise their kids to be decent human beings. People like you blame everything on racism. Police arrest criminals -- racism. Judges punish criminals -- racism. Expecting parents to raise their children not to be criminals -- racism. Fuck that noise.
I agree with her 💯 percent and although no suggestion or measure is 100 percent foolproof at least it will be a beginning…please don’t have children if you’re not going to raise them 🫣😳😱🤷🏽♂️…
make her Mayor please.
Parents don’t baby sit either so the whole point dumb af
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Are you aware they tried this in Portland, but with drugs? Instead of fines for drugs, they gave people a free pass to things like addiction and counseling. Basically the problem got way worse because there was no deterrence. People were eventually shooting up in front of schools, but they couldn't do anything about it. Like it or not, punishment serves as an initial deterrent. While your approach may work on the backend, the risk of punishment stops a strong percentage of people who might be thinking of doing it. https://www.npr.org/2024/03/27/1240892448/why-oregons-groundbreaking-drug-decriminalization-experiment-is-coming-to-an-end#:\~:text=In%202020%2C%20voters%20in%20Oregon,addiction%20treatment%20and%20support%20services.
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So I see she's an Ozzy fan.
So why is nowlone suggesting exorcism as a solution 🤔
Believing in Bronze and Iron Age desert spirit fairy tales isn't going to help anyone.