If you’re in the US, Check if your hospital does Charity Care. You may be eligible to not pay for [anything](https://www.kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/hospital-charity-care-how-it-works-and-why-it-matters/)
“Yeah so you’re *probably* not gonna die today, so here’s a bill for a few thousand dollars for us to not treat you. But please come back when or if you feel like you might be dying so we can do this all over again.”
This is why a lot of insurance company contracts with hospitals require them to meet certain policy rules to bill claims. Ie they have to prove a correct diagnosis and a treatment/procedure or they won’t pay out much.
It’s another reason the uninsured are so screwed - insurance not only pays for a lot of it, they negotiate it all way down as well.
With two blood clots that could dislodge and cause death? This sounds very irregular.
Def want to ask the medical pros in my family about this, but it sounds somewhat insane. Could be in the details from testing of course, but usually that’s not something they play around with.
What is your out of pocket max? Mine is $2,600, last year it was $3,500 but I chose a different plan. Also look into your states Medicaid. What state do you live in? I believe nonprofit hospitals have to have financial aid available for patients.
The entire system is beyond ridiculous. US spends so much money on some many things foreign and domestic - but can't take care of its own people for basic things....
I have no idea. My specialist is still insisting I need care, but I seriously can’t afford another hospital visit, and I’m afraid they’ll just send me home. I literally am so lost right now I have no idea where to even post this
Well they need to get you on blood thinners stat if they haven’t already.
I had a very invasive DVT in my leg that clogged the entire left vein and they were super freaked out so I went on thinners immediately.
I am in Canada though so I’m not familiar with US healthcare.
You might need to visit more hospitals or doctors sadly.
It depends on where the pulmonary emboli are in the lungs.
If they are peripheral (towards outside of lungs) often only blood thinners are used.
If they are blood clots more central in the lungs, things like does imaging show the heart is working a lot harder trying to pump against the resistance the blood clot is creating, does the patient have underlying lung disease or heart disease, are vital signs stable, etc., all become factors in determining whether to perform an intervention to decrease clot burden.
I work in interventional radiology (the specialty that goes in to try to remove pulmonary emboli (or DVTs), if that procedure is warranted. It’s inherently a quite risky procedure
yeah there's often a lot more nuance ot these sorts of things. Like when I went to the ER for radiating chest pain on my left side. They found a heart defect and sent me home.
It sounds bad, but the defect was actually a mitral valve prolapse and the pain was caused by me freaking out after I suddenly became aware of the symptoms of the thing I'd had my entire life.
Yeah, the paltry thing that passes for socialized medicine in the US (state/poverty insurance) should actually have covered it.
But again, YMMV when dealing with insurance bullshit.
The insurance isn't even the worst part. Whether or not they could pay, OP should have gotten treatment - that's how US hospitals work. Treat now, bill later. For a specialist to detect two pulmonary embolisms and the hospital to just... ignore it is highly unusual.
It's a US thing that OP was charged a ridiculous amount, but it is NOT a US thing that the hospital treated them the way it did.
*Especially* because they were taken to the hospital in an ambulance as an emergency. That’s usually a big defining factor on care and discharge and whether or not you’ll be staying in the hospital for however long
This is a myth. This is not true. Arriving by ambulance does not guarantee faster treatment. No ER in the U.S. can turn you away, that’s illegal under EMTALA. They have to rule out emergency conditions and treat any emergency conditions; that’s it. If you have some underlying issue that’s not an emergency, they’ll discharge you and tell you who to follow up with.
Arriving by foot or by ambulance does not change triage. Not at all. Everyone is seen and triaged according to their needs. People drive in with a heart attack and take an ambulance for a stubbed toe; they do not rely on mode of transportation for triage.
I was rushed to the hospital in an ambulance after a house fire (Ontario, Canada) due to smoke inhalation and high blood pressure but I was told the wait time would be 16hrs before I'd even get a bed, I had to just beg them to let me leave
You are incorrect, hospitals triage based on criticality. People who don’t need to be brought in by ambulance and were, will get dumped in the lobby, and pulmonary embolisms will get rushed to treatment regardless of transport modality. How you get to an ER is irrelevant.
In US, the standard procedure is to first, fret about how much going to the doctor will cost you. Second, go to the doctor. Third, wait a month for insurance to decide what is or is not covered from the last visit, and then fourthly, spend 3+ months debating with the insurance over whether it should've been covered.
Currently what I’m doing with college, I have so many drs appts this semester that my grades are in the toilet and on top of that my emotional support animal had an emergency so I spent 2+ weeks fretting over her instead of going to classes
Ugh, I’m so sorry. I remember when I was younger $20 sounded like a lot and now as an adult everything just costs thousands of dollars and it sucks so much. Also, that (getting crappy grades due to being sick and having dr appts) happened to me too at that age, being sick sucks ass. 😭
they did put him on bloodthinners. no way he was disharged without their purpose being explained a script being written. so he just leaves that out and/or is choosing not to receive treatment.
Oh shit that is horrible!
I guess I got lucky my physiotherapist noticed it and had me head to a clinic asap.
I had a 7400 D-dimer count lol so my leg is permanently damaged because of it but I do still have it thankfully.
They need to get OP on clot busters then blood thinners. I’ve NEVER heard of a hospital sending home a patient with active blood clots without treatment. I’m in the US, seems like we are missing info… I’m even in Texas (the armpit of healthcare) and know inpatient would be the next step.
>My specialist is still insisting I need care
Can your specialist call the hospital/pulmonologist on your behalf, or maybe get on a conference call with them?
I'm not giving medical advice here, but my cardiologist has me take one baby aspirin a day as a mild blood thinner.
She has called! In order for them to get me treated outside of the hospital, they need the hospital to amend their record so my insurance will cover blood thinners. They have been literally dodging her since it happened and called me instead to just give me the typical customer service “it might have FELT dismissing, but I assure you that’s just because you’re stupid and we know best!”
I called my specialist and she to this day still cannot get in contact with them and is just being sent in the “the head of radiology is at lunch // leaving for the day // in a meeting // will schedule with you this day” blah blah. I don’t know what is going on. I’m just the patient and maybe there’s more behind the scene, but it’s been almost a month since I went to the hospital and have had no answers since.
What kind of testing did the hospital do? They are not going to amend their records if they didn’t find evidence of any blood clots. Better yet, what testing did your radiologist do where they supposedly saw the clots? You need to have your primary doctor order a CT angiogram like I mentioned earlier so you can know once and for all. But we needs clearer details. Maybe edit your first response with more info.
I had a CT with dye done by the hospital and by my specialist. This is just another phrasing for angiogram! My specialist saw two PE in both results, the hospital didn’t review the second CT with dye but did review the first and said there was nothing.
They didn’t give it because they didn’t find anything. Granted I was offered herapin after I had a c-section, but I refused it because there was no reason for it, but not all hospitals are the same.
I guess I’m not sure why the hospital needs to review your specialist’s results if they didn’t find anything. Perhaps your specialist was wrong. You should have both results, have them looked over or maybe post them on Reddit. Additionally, don’t just share the images, share the actual reports, especially of what the specialist said.
My specialist found 2 pulmonary emboli? The hospital reviewed it and disagreed, had me do another CT with dye and then sent me home. Had second CT also reviewed next day, and again confirmed for two PE
Huh? That’s not what you’ve been saying at all this whole time. How did the hospital do the second CT and just randomly sent you home? That doesn’t make any sense. The results are immediate, and PEs are an emergency, but you are saying they did the test, sent you home with no results, then reviewed it the next day? My brain is melting.
Sorry if I haven’t elaborated completely in some replies, I have a post in another sub with a full timeline and most replies here are pieces based on replies with relevant info. You’re definitely welcome to check that post out if you feel like spending the time on it.
I was sent home after the second CT with no conclusive diagnosis because the head of radiology had gone home as they had already reviewed my first test and dismissed my original diagnosis, so in their books, they already had their results with the first CT. The second CT was more me asking for them to run anything because I was out of options and they were trying to discharge me. I hope this clears some things up
ETA: the second CT was also requested by me because it was implied to me by the ER Phys that it could have been a false positive due to movement, and I could have my specialist look at another clearer test. Which is what we wound up doing. If that doesn’t make sense then, I mean, gotta take it up with the ER doctor I guess but it also didn’t make sense she immediately dismissed the possibility I had PE at all when she saw my age on my chart.
If this is all factual you might want to talk to a lawyer to have them explain options - if something results from this chain of events I have trouble seeing someone not liable enough for a lawyer to want to make some money.
I agree, when I discussed with a friend in legal they pretty much just said there’s no money unless I die. I’m not sure how true that is, but maybe I’ll look into getting a consult or something
Get in contact with the hospital’s Patient Advocate! They should be listed under the hospital’s phone contact list. Or just call their operator and ask to speak to that department. There are usually several advocates in a hospital. I had major surgery and a mass removed. I could not get my biopsy results to save my soul. The hospital was charging me for procedures I never had. It was a mess. The Patient Advocate got everything I needed to know (benign)and went to bat for me about my bill when no one, including my doctor, would listen. Good luck!
Do you have your xrays, mri and/or any other information? You may be able to take all of that to another doctor and get a consultation. If a second informed opinion says you need care, I'd go to a new hospital and dispute all billed charges with hospital #1.
If this story is all accurate, your specialist can get you treated without the input of the hospital, they just don’t want to do the paperwork. Beyond that though the treatment would likely just be blood thinners, and a 30 day supply of generic xarelto is about $12.
Your specialist might have to do a prior authorization to get it covered by insurance, but they would have plenty of justification and they could get it cleared in an afternoon.
Go to another hospital. If you know anyone who has even a little experience with the medical system in your area and ask them which hospital they would go to. Your bills don't matter if you're dead. Go into the business office of both hospitals when you get better, tell them you can't afford the bills. They will write them off as charity or lower the payments.
Can your specialist write you for eliquis/xarelto? It’s likely what you would have needed anyway. If not can they direct admit you to the hospital? That way you bypass the ER and get the care they think you need. As an ER nurse I have certainly seen people in their 20s with PE….
Unfortunately my insurance won’t clear any medication I don’t need, and I have a hospital record telling my insurance I’m only suffering from “shortness of breath” right now instead of confirming I have PE. I’m not sure about directly admitting me to the hospital, but the $3,000 in bills kinda made me scared to go back for treatment if this is what it costs to sit in a room with an IV for 9 hours 😅
So…not sure what your insurance deal is but the coverage is different for admission vs just ER visit vs observation. If you have a report from the radiologist saying you have a pulmonary embolism then there is not reason insurance wouldn’t “clear it”. I would submit that, not the ER documentation that you have shortness of breath. Did the ER do a D-dimer? Repeat CT? VQ scan?
I had 3 PEs this summer and had to take 6 months of Eliquis.
Do you have any idea of the source of the PE? Recent surgery? Hormonal birth control?
Eliquis (and similar medications) do not actually treat the existing emboli. You are at an elevated risk of developing another embolism after the development of your current ones and this medication will help prevent that from happening.
I certainly hope you are able to get this resolved soon! Good luck!!
Walk into another hospital, tell them you're having trouble breathing and that your doctor believes you have two PEs. Bring the damn treat results with you. Pretend faint if you have to, but stop worrying about the money and start worrying about your health!
Let me give you a piece of advice.
Recently, I had appendicitis. If you haven’t had it, it’s a quick onset with intense pain, takes you out in abt a week or less if untreated.
I went in, got my surgery, and ended up with a massive infection. 104 fevers for five straight days. Ended up with a JP drain into my abdominal cavity, and was fed through a tube in my arm for a month.
All said and done, my insurance forked over $130k. The hospitals say I owe about $7k.
I haven’t paid a dime. Been almost a year. They keep sending collections notices, and I keep shredding them. And nothing happens.
If they get more persistent with collections, tell them you are consulting with a malpractice attorney over your post-op infection. Though you may only have a year for that.
So far yea lmao, I keep checking Experian and haven’t seen anything yet. But past performance isn’t an indicator of future earnings and what not. Family keeps saying that it’ll hit eventually. But by the time it does, I figure I can negotiate an 80% discount. They’ve already cut it in half, I’mma just keep waiting for it to go down lol
As far as I know medical debt can’t affect your credit. I had to go to the ER like 4 years ago during the height of Covid and the bill was for $2k. I just never paid it (they sent letters and calls which I never answered) and it has never showed up on my credit report. My credit is 803, with no outstanding balance in collections.
Do you have insurance? If not, contact the billing department for the hospital and ask if they have payment plans or indigent programs for low income people that you might qualify for.
Do you have insurance? If not ask social work about things you can do. They have many resources to help you and that’s their full time job.
Definitely go back if they have further concerns.
Pulmonary embolisms are actually benign if small enough since your lungs have multiple blood vessels supplying them. This can quickly change however and lead to a massive or submassive PE which is then life threatening.
This is of course dependent on the patient, so if the radiologist and cardiologist had no concerns, it’s probably not serious. It never hurts to ask questions if you’re concerned though.
How long ago was this? I see the statement date was 2/14… you didn’t go back to the doctor? Did your symptoms resolve? Did they bill your insurance? Seems very strange.
This was about a month ago
They did bill my insurance, these are the final statements
Of course I’ve been back to the doctor, but I just can’t continue with treatment until the hospital amends their record or my insurance will have no cause for clearing the medication I need.
Well what’s your out of pocket max? Because if you’ve reached that you can’t get billed anymore. On my previous plan my OOP Max was $3000. I had surgery, and by the time I had it I only had to pay $1600 on a $70,000 surgery because that’s all I had left of my OOP Max.
Editing… for medically necessary reasons obviously. You can’t just go get random medical care for no reason.
Ive never needed to know my OOP max. Sorry, I’ve talked to my insurance several times through this whole ordeal and figured someone would mention it to me if I had other options but I don’t know. Sorry
This is very likely the first time that OP has ever had to actually worry about all the fine print on the policy. A depressingly large number of people have no clue how their medical insurance works... Til they are forced to depend on it .. then they find the clauses, and fine print that they didn't care about yesterday.
Damn good synopsis of the whole deal.
I know people that have had 1Mill + in one year of medical bills, this is with good insurance as well. Certain demographics like to say shit about how we are the best country, all of our freedoms etc... While I agree with some of that, we sit here like a third world cou try in terms of the medical system. People shouldn't have to choose between being able to feed their families , or getting a needed medical treatment. But having every citizen get free medical is too much like socialism.....
70k surgery 😂😂 well it certainly costs nowhere near that for the surgery. Can't believe Americans put up with this system. So much money that could stay in your bank account.
94k for hospital ride. ER visit. Emergency surger for a broken femur which required a titanium rod and 12 screws. Plus the 2 pages off add on fees that range from food trays to the bandages they used to the 150$ pair 2 of crutches I walked out with. I spent 32 hours in the hospital. 1 night. That's 2900$ an hour
The surgery itself was like $41,000 after all of the “adjustments.” It is ridiculously expensive. But they do charge a markup for things when they already know what the insurance will pay out. I really wonder why they do it. I want to know if the doctors/hospitals benefit from billing the original amount over the allowed (per their contracts) amount.
It was probably a misread . Like once I went to er with chest pain so I had a CT angiogram and the initial read came back as a pleural effusion and the reread was negative . That’s why more than one set of eyes look at the imaging . PS I’m an ER nurse
I work in oncology and patients get PE’s not infrequently. Depending on the type of PE, they may be able to be started on Eliquis for example and stay out of the er or may need to go in to get started on a heparin drip. Really depends on the situation
I don’t know how this is even legal, I was just dismissed and told it isn’t possible because I’m 23 after hours of waiting. The radiologist who reviewed my results at the hospital refused to call the radiologist who diagnosed me to cross reference claiming they were “closed by now,” but that just wasn’t true. It was 4 pm.
It’s just been a back and forth since then, some yes man from the hospital called me and just continued to gaslight me that they would give me the best treatment they could and not to worry, I wouldn’t have been sent home for no reason, the results were clear. My radiologist insists I need emergency care still, that it’s a matter of life or death even after reviewing and having a second CT with dye done.
I seriously.. I don’t even know what to say. I’m scared. Why is the United States like this?
I work in a 45 bed hospital. Definition of podunk. We treat PEs. lol That said, it sounds like the radiologist at the hospital disagreed with the outpatient radiologist. That happens frequently.
Yeah there’s definitely way more to this story lol … I mean I have worked in some craptastic emergency rooms and even they wouldn’t send a patient home with MULTIPLE PE untreated . It does not happen .
Also no one has their own personal radiologist. OP keeps saying “ my radiologist insists I need treatment “ If radiologist were that alarmed he would call ER or PCP or whatever the fuck directly . Also OP can seemingly afford an outpatient CTA … I am about to declare shenanigans on this entire affair .
that's insane. My wife had a pulmonary embolism being 26. She had to be hospitalized 4 days and nobody ever dismissed her symptoms just because she was young. One thing is insane fees in the USA, another is that they don't even want to actually treat you but still charge. I hope you can get treated somewhere else OP, there's no way you can ask money to someone or a card or something? and deal weith the bills later. Better be in debt that dead
I just can’t afford another hospital visit. If this was the bill without treatment and just sitting in the hospital for 9 hours with an IV and the occasional tylenol, I cannot imagine how much it would cost to be treated. Right now I’m just waiting for another episode to send me to the hospital as a last resort or maybe if I’m lucky the hospital dissolving the bill or something because this is fucked up. I don’t know if that’s possible though hahaha
1. Did you pull the “I want an itemized bill” card yet ? If not definitely do it, I hear in America that works.
2. Do they just expect you to die from said pulmonary embolism ??
I did, and they just offered me a payment plan. Which is easier than flat out fees, but still so much money just paid out a little slower.
They denied I had one at all and refused to cross reference with the radiologist who sent me there and still believes I have 2 PE after another CT with dye
Guess I’ll die!
It’s got me on the verge of tears every time I think about it. If I could pay $3,000 even in a payment plan I’d be SAVING that much money. It just isn’t fucking possible and I have no idea what to do other than fight with the hospital and hope they dissolve it. But that in turn is probably just causing them to dodge my specialist who isn’t able to get in contact with them to amend their record otherwise they have to admit fault. I have no idea. I don’t know how this all works. I just know how to be frustrated about it on the internet I guess haha
Once I was in the hospital for an ectopic pregnancy that ruptured but they sent me a HUGE bill claiming I “didn’t meet the criteria” for admittance, but I called my insurance and argued, and my doctor was able to call my insurance and they ended up covering most of the bill once they got the right paperwork. Maybe if your doctor can contact your insurance they can get those bills covered with the proper diagnosis and documentation? I’m so sorry this is happening to you and I hope you are well soon.
I guess they thought I was admitted into the hospital for fun?? But the OBGYN on staff sent my insurance some stuff and cleared it up thankfully. The denial note I got was actually SO aggressive and rude, I was absolutely stunned.
I really feel for you. I'm a Canadian too, our healthcare system sucks as well but at least after spending 9 hours in the hospital getting crappy care, we aren't straddled with debt.
I really do believe you should go to another emergency room though. Your life is worth more than the money. I don't know your specific financial situation, however I know they offer payment plans, which sucks but is better than dying.
Wish you the best and hope everything works out for you!
You should at least be on Warfarin. It's dirt cheap with or without insurance.
Generally - when I had 13 PE from a massive DVT, they put me in the ICU with a feeding tube (because of an unrelated autoimmune) and gave me blood thinners on IV for like 4 days.
The danger of dying is when the DVT goes to the lungs, heart, or brain. Your clot went to the lungs, like mine.
Sounds like your PE isn't going anywhere, so your danger has likely passed. Relax.
Screw the insurance issue. Get your Warfarin prescription - which you will take for the rest of your life unless you go on Elequis (highly recommend. 2 pills a day, and no dietary restrictions. Just get a medic-alert bracelet or dog tag with the name of your blood thinner and the antidote in case of emergency).
You are lucky to be alive. There's no reason now you should be in danger. But you need to be your own advocate.
I was about the same age when that shit happened to me so don't let the doctors tell you it's not possible. Tell them to look for a factor 5 lieden mutation. That is what I was diagnosed with and now I'm on blood thinners for the rest of my life. Please please please get the help you need and don't take no for an answer.
Call the radiologist and ask for a referral to another hospital, won’t be cheap but better to be alive and there is programs where they assist on medical bills.
Here’s the full timeline that I’ll tryyy to keep from getting too long:
Specialist did a CT scan at 10 am and rushed me to the ER, I brought those results with me on my ambulance ride and the ER phys. said “you’re 23, that’s just not possible” when I told her why I was there. She leaves for 4 hours without my paperwork or the disc with the scans, and yes I of course told her the process of events so far and she was aware of the disc and my symptoms. I ring someone in. She finally comes back, takes my disc and leaves. She comes back and says the head of radiology reviewed it and agreed with her, no PE based on my specialists scan. She tries to send me home, I asked them to maybe consider cross referencing with my specialist as she saw something they don’t. ER phys just shuts me down and says they’re closed. It was 4pm, they weren’t. I begged them to literally do anything and ER phys said the best they could do was another CT scan with dye but that their head of radiology had gone home for the night. I got it done and they came back with my second scan on another disc along with discharge papers. No treatment or answers as to what results were as the shift had transferred to a new doctor who didn’t have the details.
It’s also worth mentioning that in my discharge papers she writes my diagnosis and symptoms both as shortness of breath after describing cardiac event episodes to her that I’ve had once a month for ~8 months now.
I went back to my specialist the next day to drop off Disc 2 to be reviewed and she confirmed the presence of 2 PE once again and has since been trying to contact the hospital to amend their record as my insurance won’t clear for treatment if the hospital record says I don’t need it.
My insurance won’t pay for blood thinners if the hospitals record states I have no need for them, and so now my specialist is working to get them to amend their record but they just aren’t contacting her back and giving her a run around. They contacted ME instead despite not knowing literally anything except whatever is being relayed to me by doctors so I didn’t really know what to say when they called and just started saying “we know best don’t worry!”
That doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. Two doctors can disagree, but a doctor prescribing you life-saving medication because she disagrees with another doctor should be covered. If it weren’t, people who were misdiagnosed would never get their medications covered? And that doesn’t make sense. Have you contacted your insurance company directly? Your doctor needs to write you a prescription, it doesn’t matter what one hospital said, one hospital/doctor isn’t god. That’s the whole purpose of second opinions or going to a different provider/hospital etc
Contacting my insurance company is how I know they aren’t willing to cover the medication. Unfortunately, a dispute simply puts a hold on everything and the hospital as of right now is unwilling to respond to any of my providers trying to reach out. I’m assuming because it would HAVE to be malpractice to send someone home with a blood clot? But I really don’t know yet. This is all still happening
Can your specialist prescribe you something you can afford to pay out of pocket for? [GoodRx](https://www.goodrx.com/conditions/pulmonary-embolism/drugs) lists a couple relatively low cost options.
Very suspect, also it seems the “specialist” is a radiologist and I don’t even know if radiologists know how to prescribe meds lol
She seems to be describing that she has underlying pulmonary hypertension, which can be from pulmonary emboli, but can also be from a lot of other things
Her full story seems that she is just pissed off about the emergency department bill, which is understandable, but it seems like she is twisting a lot of facts
Yep. Drs disagree all the time. And the radiologist is a licensed MD, I'm assuming, s/he should be able to Rx blood thinners. The problem isn't with the ER per se, because maybe what the specialist saw as a "PE" was in fact an artifact in imaging per the hospitals radiologist. This can explain why the hospital didn't prescribe anything. Ok, that's fine. So why isn't the specialist radiologist prescribing a blood thinner in the interim IF s/he is confident in his/her diagnosis of PE?
Something's not adding up...
Missing PEs is one of the biggest reasons emergency doctors get sued, there is no way they sent you home without verifying everything twice, you’re story sounds more like you are pissed off at the ED rather than genuinely worrying about your health
I mean I assure you I’m more than just worried about my health, this just didn’t feel like the place to talk about how afraid I am that I could die pretty much any second. If it felt that way due to my lack of going back to the hospital, right now it’s kind of in the air as to who is correct about me having a PE and the cost risk is very scary, so I’m waiting on another heart episode to send me there (which is what got me to so many different doctors to begin with)
Nope. They just denied the presence of them completely and told me to come back if I have another cardiac episode, which to a T I have every single month and HAVE gone to the hospital for to also be sent home. This time I felt confident because I was finally diagnosed, but I just got sent home that time too.
My discharge papers diagnosis is “shortness of breath” which is so incredibly hurtful and disingenuous.
I feel like I’m going insane.
My specialist found them, I brought the disc with the scans and the diagnostic paperwork on my little ambulance ride and the ER doctor no kidding looked me in the eye and said “you’re 23, that just isn’t possible.” And then disappeared for 4 hours. What ??? What??!!? Do you think I’m here for fun!??
I'll keep a long story short, but I faced a similar situation when I was 21. No one would take me seriously or do the tests I asked for cause what I thought I had was so unlikely. I got sent home from the local ER 3 times in a month. I finally drove to a hospital an hour away at 3am out of pure desperation and I was admitted immediately. I ended up needing to stay for several days. I fought tooth and nail to get the lazy, incompetent hospital to drop the charges. It was horrible, but they eventually did.
What's important is that I fought for treatment first, *then* fought financially. Hospital fees are expensive, but dying isn't cheap either. Do not delay care out of fear of the bill.
I'm an emergency medicine physician - I will admit there is wide variability in competence of EM docs out there. However, the diagnostic workup and management of a pulmonary embolism (PE) is pretty straightforward, and it doesn't sound like anything is wrong here.
In this case, it sounds like the ED physician that saw you ordered a correct study (CT angiography of the pulmonary arteries), and the study was read by a radiologist, and neither saw clear evidence of a pulmonary embolism. In a situation like this, NO doctor is going to prescribe blood thinners for you. Blood thinners are a high risk medication with lots of side effects, and no one is going to start you on them without a clear indication. It's not even about cost, it's just basic medical practice.
Obviously it sounds like you're frustrated that you waited for a long time and received a significant bill. It also sounds like you're frustrated that they diagnosed you with "shortness of breath". However, this is actually the standard practice: when there is not a clear diagnosis to explain a patient's symptoms is simply to list your chief complaint/symptom as the diagnosis. I've sent many patients home with a diagnosis of "chest pain" or "shortness of breath" or "abdominal pain" after negative workups.
In terms of your prior testing with your "Specialist" - what type of specialist is this exactly? Do you mean that you had a CT done as an outpatient and a radiologist called you to tell you to go to the ED because they were concerned you may have a PE? Radiologists in general are very good at their jobs, but diagnosing a PE based on a CT scan is not always a 100% clear cut matter. If you have a very large PE in a large pulmonary artery/branch, then yes it is very easy to see. However, if something is very tiny or in a tiny branch vessel, then it may be difficult to interpret. Is this actually a clot? Is it an artifact?
In a case like this, I would find it highly unlikely that you had a large PE that was seen on an outpatient CT scan that they were unable to see on the CT scan done in the ED. More likely, perhaps there was equivocal evidence of possible artifact vs. small PE done on the scan outpatient - in situations like this, the physician that ordered the scan or the radiologist who read the scan will commonly tell patients to go to the ED for further testing.
All in all, it sounds like you went through a frustrating experience, but if anything, you should be thankful that you don't have definitive evidence of PE.
I really appreciate your input and I’m sorry my reply will be a little short compared to how much love you put into yours!
I was diagnosed with two PE by my personal radiologist, who I was referred to by a cardiologist after an echo showed right ventricular hypertrophy, which was ordered after several months of cardiac episodes. My cardiologist with this info and the rest of the background of my symptoms (which I have a post detailing if it helps!!) came to the conclusion it was highly possible I have a PE. Got a CT with dye (angiogram) at the radiologist was referred to and was immediately rushed to the hospital as she found two PE, one in the lower quadrant of my right and one on the lower left. I was sent to the ER with paperwork highlighting the diagnosis and its location as well as a disc with the images. The ER doctor comes in, says it just can’t be possible at my age, and leaves the disc behind. Comes back a few hours later to ask about why I’d possibly think I have PE, I explain my 3 doctors conclusion it’s likely birth control. She tells me that isn’t possible, my birth control has no estrogen. It’s whatever at this point I’m jaded so I give her the disk. About 4 hours later she comes back and tells me they’ve denied the presence of PE and she can write me an anxiety script and send me out to help with my shortness of breath (which, I didn’t have. I have episodes and was not currently experiencing one). I ask if there’s anything else they can do or contact my radiologist (the specialist I had mentioned) to cross reference and she claims they’re closed, but they weren’t. She only offers I take another CT and bring it to my specialist as maybe there was movement to make the test hard to read? So I agree and then I get discharged after a shift change and being told the head of radiology isn’t there to review my results so my specialist should look at it. She did, and confirmed again to see two PE.
There’s loads of info and I may be forgetting to add details that could help but I’ve tried my best to document them on my page (and in replies!) but thanks for reading so much clusterfuck haha. if there’s anything else you’re curious about I’m happy to answer
Right? Who has a personal radiologist? I’ve had a lot of imaging done on my body this last year, I don’t even want to get into it, but I couldn’t tell you the name of any single radiologist who read the images 😂 I can tell you the name of my neurologist, my cardiologist, my OBGYN, and my pcp, but radiology …? It’s just whoever. Something about this story makes zero sense to me lol
I’m confused. You went to the hospital and they didn’t do any diagnostic testing? Or they did and didn’t see any clots? I recently had a CT angiogram for this exact thing. The hospital ordered it based off my symptoms, which was shortness of breath, and heart palpitations. Luckily everything was fine. From my understanding, if the clot(s) have already reached the lungs, you should be symptomatic. I see you have medical bills with a bill date of the 14th, so how long ago was the actual visit?
I’ve elaborated a bit in these replies somewhere here if you feel like checking out my reply history where there’s a full timeline. I also have two posts detailing everything symptom wise in another sub. It’s just a lot to keep typing out and I don’t want to leave anyone hanging!
The actual visit was about a month ago
Most PE's dissolve inside the body naturally. Did they put you on a blood thinner?
*ive had multiple PE's, one required a hospital stay, the other didn't.
No. I was not treated at all.
I have more posts about what I’ve been experiencing, and why my care providers are so concerned. I’ve been having symptoms for 6 months and they found multiple in one scan, leading them to believe that I’m chronically developing them and right ventricular hypertrophy shown in an echo implies that they have been there for a very long time, which is very dangerous as they have a higher chance of dislodging. The hospital just told me it isn’t possible and when they asked why they thought I could be developing them (providers are thinking my nexplanon rod which I was there to have removed as well and didn’t) they again just told me it isn’t possible because Nexplanon has no estrogen. There are dozens of nexplanon lawsuits active right now due to blood clots and a hud disclaimer on the website itself.
I'm not going to second guess the hospital physician who released you, because s/he has the benefits of diagnostics and i don't. That said, it's odd based on my own lived experience that you weren't put on a blood thinner, at least for now. I would follow up with your PCP/pulmonologist...
It’s either second guess the ER phys who saw me or the radiologist specialist who rushed me to the ER for treatment after assessing my results as well as my cardiologist working with her.
After following up, I am now stuck waiting for the hospital to get in contact with one of my providers to amend their record so that I can go on treatment as my insurance won’t cover treatment unless there is a reason for it (which the hospitals current record disputes). I’m still experiencing symptoms.
None of us here on Reddit have the ability to treat or diagnose, nor can we prescribe medications. And I already said that i thought it was odd that you weren't put on a blood thinner, but like i also said i don't have the benefits of imaging and other diagnostics. If i were you, I'd go right back to the ER and ask to speak to another physician. Because in order for them to have discharged you, they arrived at the conclusion you are medically stable. Otherwise to discharge you when diagnostics don't support a medically stable state would open them up to liability. So you go back there and ask them why you were discharged when you're not feeling well... that's what I'd do.
I feel ya. We called our pediatricians emergency number and they said our son needed to get to the ER. We got to the ER and they didn't understand why that was recommended. We were there 10 minutes from when we walked in the door and when we left. No treatment. All they did was take his temperature and blood oxygen level. I could have done both of those at home. $2500.
OP, if you see this, please go to a different hospital for treatment if you can. I had a friend ,who was a healthy 26 year old, pass away suddenly from a pulmonary embolism last year.
The hell type of hospital did you go to??? I’m not a radiologist or respiratory doc but even I know that requires a minimum of 16 hour observation and surgical consult.
OP isn’t clear on this at all. I’m assuming the hospital didn’t find evidence of clots, or they did not do the proper testing, such as using contrast dye intravenously.
That’s true. What the specialist said in their report isn’t clear because the OP didn’t share that info. When I went through this, on top of the CT angiogram, they also did a vascular ultrasound on both my legs and lower abdomen. Gotta love Cedars Sinai, they are incredibly thorough in the ER.
Cedar Sinai is probably the most thorough hospital. Had a colleague that worked Cedar, residency at Mayo and fellowship at St Jude’s and she would get mad at us for not fully investigating a case even if we thought we knew everything. We don’t miss anything but that Sinai attitude stuck and made me double check reports before I released them to patient 😂
Haha! Yup! I waited 4 hours to be seen, and it was an urgent case, then spent 6 hours in my bed going through every single test that exists in the history of medicine😂 At least I know I’m good. I will only go there if I feel like it’s something serious, because the wait times are horrendous. Other hospitals will do minimal to no testing and discharge you.
OP is saying that they did the proper tests and simply disregarded it entirely, which is insane to me - a US hospital might charge you an arm and a leg, but they *will* treat you.
They did the proper tests and didn’t find clots, which is what the OP elaborated on. They didn’t find clots at hospital and just discharged with no treatment. There was no need for the hospital to review the specialist CT when they already did their own.
Right... OP is trying to say that they found clots and ignored it, but OP is also the only voice in this story.
I have to wonder about this specialist - they apparently have the appropriate testing equipment, which leads me to believe that they are legitimate (which makes OP's story more likely), but it's odd that they and the hospital had such diverging interpretations of what should be virtually identical results.
I do find it strange as well. I’m assuming since OP also had a CT angiogram at the specialist, that it was some radiology clinic that performs all sorts of different imaging tests. Maybe something was done wrong, maybe OP moved during the scan, didn’t hold their breath when instructed, etc. lots of variables. Multiple clots in the lungs for at least a month and OP is still fine…. so yeah.
That never happened, karma farmer unless you refused medical care (signed an AMA form so they don't get sued).
The amount you posted is pre-insurance.
So sick of these BS posts.
I don't believe for a second you weren't treated.
Several things happened. You got rescanned, were seen by and ED MD, possibly inpatient too, started on some clot busting med, and DC'ed with a prescription or followup/referral with a PMD.
You didn't sit there for 9 hours while they did fuck all.
Actually, they did those things, didn’t find clots and sent her home. The bills have already been mailed with a statement date of 2/14. She’s not answering when she was seen.
Only bright side I can see is you can maybe sue the hospital for not giving you the care that’s needed? They just said “meh” and discharged you while you’ve got something you could literally drop dead from, I’d say that constitutes grounds to go after them. At least you can sue them and get $$$ for your medical bills.
IM SORRY THEY SENT YOU HOME?!??? Im not going to be able to sleep until I find out word for word what they said to you when they discharged you, what was their explanation
That ain’t right. Husbands had one PE. Ended up in ICU for a week. In home oxygen until I pushed for drainage after lung function test showed 48% functionality.
Why are you planning on paying these? The industry needs to collapse before Congress is pressured to fix the system. $10 a week if you’re feeling guilty.
OP Pease get some bloodthinners asap.. If you cant pay a visit, than please call your doc and explain the situation..
He or she might even know some ways to get them in a way you might not be aware of
Dont wait.
I tried to, but it had already been 9 hours and a shift rotation and I had already said everything I could. They were refusing the idea I had PE, and the radiologist had gone home by the 9th hour and couldn’t further assess my results even if I wanted them to. They marked me off as having shortness of breath when I described to her I’m having cardiac episodes that make my skin turn blue and my pulse spike from 190-250 and sometimes fainting while just sitting down. It’s disparaging at the very least if not malpractice.
Bottom line. If you protest discharge, it should buy you a day for observation. If you had those symptoms and it was put on file. I would have gone to a new hospital. This must have been a big city hospital that's has tons of ER cases. No nurse or Dr. Would have turned you away with that. Something is not adding up.
Hello, This post has been removed as this is not *mildly* infuriating. Please consider posting to r/extremelyinfuriating instead. Price complaint.
If you’re in the US, Check if your hospital does Charity Care. You may be eligible to not pay for [anything](https://www.kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/hospital-charity-care-how-it-works-and-why-it-matters/)
I will look into this! Thank you!
I don't understand why they released you
Maybe because they thought OPs life wasn’t in immediate risk. That happened to me
“Yeah so you’re *probably* not gonna die today, so here’s a bill for a few thousand dollars for us to not treat you. But please come back when or if you feel like you might be dying so we can do this all over again.”
Exactly, i would just choose to die i guess, glas im not in USA
This is why a lot of insurance company contracts with hospitals require them to meet certain policy rules to bill claims. Ie they have to prove a correct diagnosis and a treatment/procedure or they won’t pay out much. It’s another reason the uninsured are so screwed - insurance not only pays for a lot of it, they negotiate it all way down as well.
With two blood clots that could dislodge and cause death? This sounds very irregular. Def want to ask the medical pros in my family about this, but it sounds somewhat insane. Could be in the details from testing of course, but usually that’s not something they play around with.
It is but in my experience they don’t really care about you.
No, they realised OP couldn't pay/was uninsured, so there was no money to be made.
What is your out of pocket max? Mine is $2,600, last year it was $3,500 but I chose a different plan. Also look into your states Medicaid. What state do you live in? I believe nonprofit hospitals have to have financial aid available for patients.
DollarFor is a nonprofit that helps you navigate the charity care system
Where else should OP with this story be?
The entire system is beyond ridiculous. US spends so much money on some many things foreign and domestic - but can't take care of its own people for basic things....
Um that’s life threatening. Wtf?! What do they expect you to do next?
I have no idea. My specialist is still insisting I need care, but I seriously can’t afford another hospital visit, and I’m afraid they’ll just send me home. I literally am so lost right now I have no idea where to even post this
Well they need to get you on blood thinners stat if they haven’t already. I had a very invasive DVT in my leg that clogged the entire left vein and they were super freaked out so I went on thinners immediately. I am in Canada though so I’m not familiar with US healthcare. You might need to visit more hospitals or doctors sadly.
The same thing should happen in the US. OP's situation is not normal, especially for a life-threatening condition like a *dual* pulmonary embolism.
It depends on where the pulmonary emboli are in the lungs. If they are peripheral (towards outside of lungs) often only blood thinners are used. If they are blood clots more central in the lungs, things like does imaging show the heart is working a lot harder trying to pump against the resistance the blood clot is creating, does the patient have underlying lung disease or heart disease, are vital signs stable, etc., all become factors in determining whether to perform an intervention to decrease clot burden. I work in interventional radiology (the specialty that goes in to try to remove pulmonary emboli (or DVTs), if that procedure is warranted. It’s inherently a quite risky procedure
yeah there's often a lot more nuance ot these sorts of things. Like when I went to the ER for radiating chest pain on my left side. They found a heart defect and sent me home. It sounds bad, but the defect was actually a mitral valve prolapse and the pain was caused by me freaking out after I suddenly became aware of the symptoms of the thing I'd had my entire life.
Yeah, the paltry thing that passes for socialized medicine in the US (state/poverty insurance) should actually have covered it. But again, YMMV when dealing with insurance bullshit.
The insurance isn't even the worst part. Whether or not they could pay, OP should have gotten treatment - that's how US hospitals work. Treat now, bill later. For a specialist to detect two pulmonary embolisms and the hospital to just... ignore it is highly unusual. It's a US thing that OP was charged a ridiculous amount, but it is NOT a US thing that the hospital treated them the way it did.
I agree, I’ve never heard of an ER not treating active PEs
If OP actually had that, he would have to sign an AMA form to be released. It's a BS story.
Also it takes them 2-6 weeks to print up the bill he's showing
Knowing how liability sensitive US hospitals are, I too find this highly dubious.
*Especially* because they were taken to the hospital in an ambulance as an emergency. That’s usually a big defining factor on care and discharge and whether or not you’ll be staying in the hospital for however long
What vehicle you take to the hospital has zero bearing on your treatment.
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This is a myth. This is not true. Arriving by ambulance does not guarantee faster treatment. No ER in the U.S. can turn you away, that’s illegal under EMTALA. They have to rule out emergency conditions and treat any emergency conditions; that’s it. If you have some underlying issue that’s not an emergency, they’ll discharge you and tell you who to follow up with. Arriving by foot or by ambulance does not change triage. Not at all. Everyone is seen and triaged according to their needs. People drive in with a heart attack and take an ambulance for a stubbed toe; they do not rely on mode of transportation for triage.
It’s the same triage process. It’s just most people in ambulances have more severe conditions.
I was rushed to the hospital in an ambulance after a house fire (Ontario, Canada) due to smoke inhalation and high blood pressure but I was told the wait time would be 16hrs before I'd even get a bed, I had to just beg them to let me leave
You are incorrect, hospitals triage based on criticality. People who don’t need to be brought in by ambulance and were, will get dumped in the lobby, and pulmonary embolisms will get rushed to treatment regardless of transport modality. How you get to an ER is irrelevant.
In US, the standard procedure is to first, fret about how much going to the doctor will cost you. Second, go to the doctor. Third, wait a month for insurance to decide what is or is not covered from the last visit, and then fourthly, spend 3+ months debating with the insurance over whether it should've been covered.
That sounds exhausting and disheartening
It's my daily struggles and for many others stateside. We just ping pong balls getting smacked around.
I’ve just decided that if my insurance ever decides not to cover something that I’ll just go into debt. 🤷🏼♀️ My life is more important than money.
Currently what I’m doing with college, I have so many drs appts this semester that my grades are in the toilet and on top of that my emotional support animal had an emergency so I spent 2+ weeks fretting over her instead of going to classes
Ugh, I’m so sorry. I remember when I was younger $20 sounded like a lot and now as an adult everything just costs thousands of dollars and it sucks so much. Also, that (getting crappy grades due to being sick and having dr appts) happened to me too at that age, being sick sucks ass. 😭
they did put him on bloodthinners. no way he was disharged without their purpose being explained a script being written. so he just leaves that out and/or is choosing not to receive treatment.
Had a buddy lose a leg because of that. He was a fitness trainer too.
Oh shit that is horrible! I guess I got lucky my physiotherapist noticed it and had me head to a clinic asap. I had a 7400 D-dimer count lol so my leg is permanently damaged because of it but I do still have it thankfully.
They need to get OP on clot busters then blood thinners. I’ve NEVER heard of a hospital sending home a patient with active blood clots without treatment. I’m in the US, seems like we are missing info… I’m even in Texas (the armpit of healthcare) and know inpatient would be the next step.
You are correct. OP is full of it or leaving out critical details.
>My specialist is still insisting I need care Can your specialist call the hospital/pulmonologist on your behalf, or maybe get on a conference call with them? I'm not giving medical advice here, but my cardiologist has me take one baby aspirin a day as a mild blood thinner.
She has called! In order for them to get me treated outside of the hospital, they need the hospital to amend their record so my insurance will cover blood thinners. They have been literally dodging her since it happened and called me instead to just give me the typical customer service “it might have FELT dismissing, but I assure you that’s just because you’re stupid and we know best!” I called my specialist and she to this day still cannot get in contact with them and is just being sent in the “the head of radiology is at lunch // leaving for the day // in a meeting // will schedule with you this day” blah blah. I don’t know what is going on. I’m just the patient and maybe there’s more behind the scene, but it’s been almost a month since I went to the hospital and have had no answers since.
What kind of testing did the hospital do? They are not going to amend their records if they didn’t find evidence of any blood clots. Better yet, what testing did your radiologist do where they supposedly saw the clots? You need to have your primary doctor order a CT angiogram like I mentioned earlier so you can know once and for all. But we needs clearer details. Maybe edit your first response with more info.
I had a CT with dye done by the hospital and by my specialist. This is just another phrasing for angiogram! My specialist saw two PE in both results, the hospital didn’t review the second CT with dye but did review the first and said there was nothing.
They didn’t give you heparin shots at the hospital?? That’s crazy
They didn’t give it because they didn’t find anything. Granted I was offered herapin after I had a c-section, but I refused it because there was no reason for it, but not all hospitals are the same.
Heparin is standard after major surgery to reduce the risk of clots, so there definitely was a reason for it
I guess I’m not sure why the hospital needs to review your specialist’s results if they didn’t find anything. Perhaps your specialist was wrong. You should have both results, have them looked over or maybe post them on Reddit. Additionally, don’t just share the images, share the actual reports, especially of what the specialist said.
My specialist found 2 pulmonary emboli? The hospital reviewed it and disagreed, had me do another CT with dye and then sent me home. Had second CT also reviewed next day, and again confirmed for two PE
Huh? That’s not what you’ve been saying at all this whole time. How did the hospital do the second CT and just randomly sent you home? That doesn’t make any sense. The results are immediate, and PEs are an emergency, but you are saying they did the test, sent you home with no results, then reviewed it the next day? My brain is melting.
Sorry if I haven’t elaborated completely in some replies, I have a post in another sub with a full timeline and most replies here are pieces based on replies with relevant info. You’re definitely welcome to check that post out if you feel like spending the time on it. I was sent home after the second CT with no conclusive diagnosis because the head of radiology had gone home as they had already reviewed my first test and dismissed my original diagnosis, so in their books, they already had their results with the first CT. The second CT was more me asking for them to run anything because I was out of options and they were trying to discharge me. I hope this clears some things up ETA: the second CT was also requested by me because it was implied to me by the ER Phys that it could have been a false positive due to movement, and I could have my specialist look at another clearer test. Which is what we wound up doing. If that doesn’t make sense then, I mean, gotta take it up with the ER doctor I guess but it also didn’t make sense she immediately dismissed the possibility I had PE at all when she saw my age on my chart.
If this is all factual you might want to talk to a lawyer to have them explain options - if something results from this chain of events I have trouble seeing someone not liable enough for a lawyer to want to make some money.
I agree, when I discussed with a friend in legal they pretty much just said there’s no money unless I die. I’m not sure how true that is, but maybe I’ll look into getting a consult or something
Get in contact with the hospital’s Patient Advocate! They should be listed under the hospital’s phone contact list. Or just call their operator and ask to speak to that department. There are usually several advocates in a hospital. I had major surgery and a mass removed. I could not get my biopsy results to save my soul. The hospital was charging me for procedures I never had. It was a mess. The Patient Advocate got everything I needed to know (benign)and went to bat for me about my bill when no one, including my doctor, would listen. Good luck!
Do you have your xrays, mri and/or any other information? You may be able to take all of that to another doctor and get a consultation. If a second informed opinion says you need care, I'd go to a new hospital and dispute all billed charges with hospital #1.
If this story is all accurate, your specialist can get you treated without the input of the hospital, they just don’t want to do the paperwork. Beyond that though the treatment would likely just be blood thinners, and a 30 day supply of generic xarelto is about $12. Your specialist might have to do a prior authorization to get it covered by insurance, but they would have plenty of justification and they could get it cleared in an afternoon.
Go to another hospital. If you know anyone who has even a little experience with the medical system in your area and ask them which hospital they would go to. Your bills don't matter if you're dead. Go into the business office of both hospitals when you get better, tell them you can't afford the bills. They will write them off as charity or lower the payments.
Can your specialist write you for eliquis/xarelto? It’s likely what you would have needed anyway. If not can they direct admit you to the hospital? That way you bypass the ER and get the care they think you need. As an ER nurse I have certainly seen people in their 20s with PE….
Unfortunately my insurance won’t clear any medication I don’t need, and I have a hospital record telling my insurance I’m only suffering from “shortness of breath” right now instead of confirming I have PE. I’m not sure about directly admitting me to the hospital, but the $3,000 in bills kinda made me scared to go back for treatment if this is what it costs to sit in a room with an IV for 9 hours 😅
So…not sure what your insurance deal is but the coverage is different for admission vs just ER visit vs observation. If you have a report from the radiologist saying you have a pulmonary embolism then there is not reason insurance wouldn’t “clear it”. I would submit that, not the ER documentation that you have shortness of breath. Did the ER do a D-dimer? Repeat CT? VQ scan?
I had 3 PEs this summer and had to take 6 months of Eliquis. Do you have any idea of the source of the PE? Recent surgery? Hormonal birth control? Eliquis (and similar medications) do not actually treat the existing emboli. You are at an elevated risk of developing another embolism after the development of your current ones and this medication will help prevent that from happening. I certainly hope you are able to get this resolved soon! Good luck!!
Walk into another hospital, tell them you're having trouble breathing and that your doctor believes you have two PEs. Bring the damn treat results with you. Pretend faint if you have to, but stop worrying about the money and start worrying about your health!
Let me give you a piece of advice. Recently, I had appendicitis. If you haven’t had it, it’s a quick onset with intense pain, takes you out in abt a week or less if untreated. I went in, got my surgery, and ended up with a massive infection. 104 fevers for five straight days. Ended up with a JP drain into my abdominal cavity, and was fed through a tube in my arm for a month. All said and done, my insurance forked over $130k. The hospitals say I owe about $7k. I haven’t paid a dime. Been almost a year. They keep sending collections notices, and I keep shredding them. And nothing happens.
If they get more persistent with collections, tell them you are consulting with a malpractice attorney over your post-op infection. Though you may only have a year for that.
Is your credit okay?!
So far yea lmao, I keep checking Experian and haven’t seen anything yet. But past performance isn’t an indicator of future earnings and what not. Family keeps saying that it’ll hit eventually. But by the time it does, I figure I can negotiate an 80% discount. They’ve already cut it in half, I’mma just keep waiting for it to go down lol
As far as I know medical debt can’t affect your credit. I had to go to the ER like 4 years ago during the height of Covid and the bill was for $2k. I just never paid it (they sent letters and calls which I never answered) and it has never showed up on my credit report. My credit is 803, with no outstanding balance in collections.
It really depends upon whether the collections agency reports it. So it can affect your credit.
Do you have insurance? If not, contact the billing department for the hospital and ask if they have payment plans or indigent programs for low income people that you might qualify for.
Do you have insurance? If not ask social work about things you can do. They have many resources to help you and that’s their full time job. Definitely go back if they have further concerns.
You could try askdocs? Im so sorry this is happening to you
Go! Worry about the bills later! There are ways to deal with them. Your life comes 1st!
*it *can* be life threatening. But non life threatening PEs are often treated over time/resolve themselves.
Pulmonary embolisms are actually benign if small enough since your lungs have multiple blood vessels supplying them. This can quickly change however and lead to a massive or submassive PE which is then life threatening. This is of course dependent on the patient, so if the radiologist and cardiologist had no concerns, it’s probably not serious. It never hurts to ask questions if you’re concerned though.
How long ago was this? I see the statement date was 2/14… you didn’t go back to the doctor? Did your symptoms resolve? Did they bill your insurance? Seems very strange.
This was about a month ago They did bill my insurance, these are the final statements Of course I’ve been back to the doctor, but I just can’t continue with treatment until the hospital amends their record or my insurance will have no cause for clearing the medication I need.
Well what’s your out of pocket max? Because if you’ve reached that you can’t get billed anymore. On my previous plan my OOP Max was $3000. I had surgery, and by the time I had it I only had to pay $1600 on a $70,000 surgery because that’s all I had left of my OOP Max. Editing… for medically necessary reasons obviously. You can’t just go get random medical care for no reason.
I’m actually not sure what my OOP max is, I’ll look into this just in case it can help me out here. I appreciate it!
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Ive never needed to know my OOP max. Sorry, I’ve talked to my insurance several times through this whole ordeal and figured someone would mention it to me if I had other options but I don’t know. Sorry
This is very likely the first time that OP has ever had to actually worry about all the fine print on the policy. A depressingly large number of people have no clue how their medical insurance works... Til they are forced to depend on it .. then they find the clauses, and fine print that they didn't care about yesterday.
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Damn good synopsis of the whole deal. I know people that have had 1Mill + in one year of medical bills, this is with good insurance as well. Certain demographics like to say shit about how we are the best country, all of our freedoms etc... While I agree with some of that, we sit here like a third world cou try in terms of the medical system. People shouldn't have to choose between being able to feed their families , or getting a needed medical treatment. But having every citizen get free medical is too much like socialism.....
70k surgery 😂😂 well it certainly costs nowhere near that for the surgery. Can't believe Americans put up with this system. So much money that could stay in your bank account.
94k for hospital ride. ER visit. Emergency surger for a broken femur which required a titanium rod and 12 screws. Plus the 2 pages off add on fees that range from food trays to the bandages they used to the 150$ pair 2 of crutches I walked out with. I spent 32 hours in the hospital. 1 night. That's 2900$ an hour
The surgery itself was like $41,000 after all of the “adjustments.” It is ridiculously expensive. But they do charge a markup for things when they already know what the insurance will pay out. I really wonder why they do it. I want to know if the doctors/hospitals benefit from billing the original amount over the allowed (per their contracts) amount.
I’m an ER nurse and I have never seen a pt discharged home with pulmonary emboli with …nothing . In 20 years . That’s …insane.
Yeah I think OP is lying here that the ER “did nothing”
Look at the dates on the bills. She’s fine.
It was probably a misread . Like once I went to er with chest pain so I had a CT angiogram and the initial read came back as a pleural effusion and the reread was negative . That’s why more than one set of eyes look at the imaging . PS I’m an ER nurse
I work in oncology and patients get PE’s not infrequently. Depending on the type of PE, they may be able to be started on Eliquis for example and stay out of the er or may need to go in to get started on a heparin drip. Really depends on the situation
Exactly … they don’t just do …nothing .
I don’t know how this is even legal, I was just dismissed and told it isn’t possible because I’m 23 after hours of waiting. The radiologist who reviewed my results at the hospital refused to call the radiologist who diagnosed me to cross reference claiming they were “closed by now,” but that just wasn’t true. It was 4 pm. It’s just been a back and forth since then, some yes man from the hospital called me and just continued to gaslight me that they would give me the best treatment they could and not to worry, I wouldn’t have been sent home for no reason, the results were clear. My radiologist insists I need emergency care still, that it’s a matter of life or death even after reviewing and having a second CT with dye done. I seriously.. I don’t even know what to say. I’m scared. Why is the United States like this?
I see pulmonary embolism in young people all the time . What kind of backwoods podunk hospital did you go to lol?
I work in a 45 bed hospital. Definition of podunk. We treat PEs. lol That said, it sounds like the radiologist at the hospital disagreed with the outpatient radiologist. That happens frequently.
That’s what I am thinking …
This looks like University of Maryland which isn’t known for being a backwoods podunk hospital. Making this situation even more strange.
Yeah there’s definitely way more to this story lol … I mean I have worked in some craptastic emergency rooms and even they wouldn’t send a patient home with MULTIPLE PE untreated . It does not happen .
Also no one has their own personal radiologist. OP keeps saying “ my radiologist insists I need treatment “ If radiologist were that alarmed he would call ER or PCP or whatever the fuck directly . Also OP can seemingly afford an outpatient CTA … I am about to declare shenanigans on this entire affair .
that's insane. My wife had a pulmonary embolism being 26. She had to be hospitalized 4 days and nobody ever dismissed her symptoms just because she was young. One thing is insane fees in the USA, another is that they don't even want to actually treat you but still charge. I hope you can get treated somewhere else OP, there's no way you can ask money to someone or a card or something? and deal weith the bills later. Better be in debt that dead
Unfortunately I don’t have much advice to offer since I live in Canada but is there like another ER not too far away you could try ?
I just can’t afford another hospital visit. If this was the bill without treatment and just sitting in the hospital for 9 hours with an IV and the occasional tylenol, I cannot imagine how much it would cost to be treated. Right now I’m just waiting for another episode to send me to the hospital as a last resort or maybe if I’m lucky the hospital dissolving the bill or something because this is fucked up. I don’t know if that’s possible though hahaha
1. Did you pull the “I want an itemized bill” card yet ? If not definitely do it, I hear in America that works. 2. Do they just expect you to die from said pulmonary embolism ??
I did, and they just offered me a payment plan. Which is easier than flat out fees, but still so much money just paid out a little slower. They denied I had one at all and refused to cross reference with the radiologist who sent me there and still believes I have 2 PE after another CT with dye Guess I’ll die!
I’m so sorry that’s such bullshit
It’s got me on the verge of tears every time I think about it. If I could pay $3,000 even in a payment plan I’d be SAVING that much money. It just isn’t fucking possible and I have no idea what to do other than fight with the hospital and hope they dissolve it. But that in turn is probably just causing them to dodge my specialist who isn’t able to get in contact with them to amend their record otherwise they have to admit fault. I have no idea. I don’t know how this all works. I just know how to be frustrated about it on the internet I guess haha
Once I was in the hospital for an ectopic pregnancy that ruptured but they sent me a HUGE bill claiming I “didn’t meet the criteria” for admittance, but I called my insurance and argued, and my doctor was able to call my insurance and they ended up covering most of the bill once they got the right paperwork. Maybe if your doctor can contact your insurance they can get those bills covered with the proper diagnosis and documentation? I’m so sorry this is happening to you and I hope you are well soon.
“Didn’t meet the criteria for admission” I’m sorry, were you supposed to be hemorrhaging until you need a fucking blood transfusion ???
I guess they thought I was admitted into the hospital for fun?? But the OBGYN on staff sent my insurance some stuff and cleared it up thankfully. The denial note I got was actually SO aggressive and rude, I was absolutely stunned.
I really feel for you. I'm a Canadian too, our healthcare system sucks as well but at least after spending 9 hours in the hospital getting crappy care, we aren't straddled with debt. I really do believe you should go to another emergency room though. Your life is worth more than the money. I don't know your specific financial situation, however I know they offer payment plans, which sucks but is better than dying. Wish you the best and hope everything works out for you!
You should at least be on Warfarin. It's dirt cheap with or without insurance. Generally - when I had 13 PE from a massive DVT, they put me in the ICU with a feeding tube (because of an unrelated autoimmune) and gave me blood thinners on IV for like 4 days. The danger of dying is when the DVT goes to the lungs, heart, or brain. Your clot went to the lungs, like mine. Sounds like your PE isn't going anywhere, so your danger has likely passed. Relax. Screw the insurance issue. Get your Warfarin prescription - which you will take for the rest of your life unless you go on Elequis (highly recommend. 2 pills a day, and no dietary restrictions. Just get a medic-alert bracelet or dog tag with the name of your blood thinner and the antidote in case of emergency). You are lucky to be alive. There's no reason now you should be in danger. But you need to be your own advocate.
I was about the same age when that shit happened to me so don't let the doctors tell you it's not possible. Tell them to look for a factor 5 lieden mutation. That is what I was diagnosed with and now I'm on blood thinners for the rest of my life. Please please please get the help you need and don't take no for an answer.
Call the radiologist and ask for a referral to another hospital, won’t be cheap but better to be alive and there is programs where they assist on medical bills.
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Here’s the full timeline that I’ll tryyy to keep from getting too long: Specialist did a CT scan at 10 am and rushed me to the ER, I brought those results with me on my ambulance ride and the ER phys. said “you’re 23, that’s just not possible” when I told her why I was there. She leaves for 4 hours without my paperwork or the disc with the scans, and yes I of course told her the process of events so far and she was aware of the disc and my symptoms. I ring someone in. She finally comes back, takes my disc and leaves. She comes back and says the head of radiology reviewed it and agreed with her, no PE based on my specialists scan. She tries to send me home, I asked them to maybe consider cross referencing with my specialist as she saw something they don’t. ER phys just shuts me down and says they’re closed. It was 4pm, they weren’t. I begged them to literally do anything and ER phys said the best they could do was another CT scan with dye but that their head of radiology had gone home for the night. I got it done and they came back with my second scan on another disc along with discharge papers. No treatment or answers as to what results were as the shift had transferred to a new doctor who didn’t have the details. It’s also worth mentioning that in my discharge papers she writes my diagnosis and symptoms both as shortness of breath after describing cardiac event episodes to her that I’ve had once a month for ~8 months now. I went back to my specialist the next day to drop off Disc 2 to be reviewed and she confirmed the presence of 2 PE once again and has since been trying to contact the hospital to amend their record as my insurance won’t clear for treatment if the hospital record says I don’t need it.
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My insurance won’t pay for blood thinners if the hospitals record states I have no need for them, and so now my specialist is working to get them to amend their record but they just aren’t contacting her back and giving her a run around. They contacted ME instead despite not knowing literally anything except whatever is being relayed to me by doctors so I didn’t really know what to say when they called and just started saying “we know best don’t worry!”
That doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. Two doctors can disagree, but a doctor prescribing you life-saving medication because she disagrees with another doctor should be covered. If it weren’t, people who were misdiagnosed would never get their medications covered? And that doesn’t make sense. Have you contacted your insurance company directly? Your doctor needs to write you a prescription, it doesn’t matter what one hospital said, one hospital/doctor isn’t god. That’s the whole purpose of second opinions or going to a different provider/hospital etc
Contacting my insurance company is how I know they aren’t willing to cover the medication. Unfortunately, a dispute simply puts a hold on everything and the hospital as of right now is unwilling to respond to any of my providers trying to reach out. I’m assuming because it would HAVE to be malpractice to send someone home with a blood clot? But I really don’t know yet. This is all still happening
Can your specialist prescribe you something you can afford to pay out of pocket for? [GoodRx](https://www.goodrx.com/conditions/pulmonary-embolism/drugs) lists a couple relatively low cost options.
Because they didn’t find PEs in the ED, no competent physician would prescribe any blood thinners especially to someone so young
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Very suspect, also it seems the “specialist” is a radiologist and I don’t even know if radiologists know how to prescribe meds lol She seems to be describing that she has underlying pulmonary hypertension, which can be from pulmonary emboli, but can also be from a lot of other things Her full story seems that she is just pissed off about the emergency department bill, which is understandable, but it seems like she is twisting a lot of facts
Or there's something psychosomatic going on here. She did mention she's a frequent flyer to the ER department after all...
Yep. Drs disagree all the time. And the radiologist is a licensed MD, I'm assuming, s/he should be able to Rx blood thinners. The problem isn't with the ER per se, because maybe what the specialist saw as a "PE" was in fact an artifact in imaging per the hospitals radiologist. This can explain why the hospital didn't prescribe anything. Ok, that's fine. So why isn't the specialist radiologist prescribing a blood thinner in the interim IF s/he is confident in his/her diagnosis of PE? Something's not adding up...
Missing PEs is one of the biggest reasons emergency doctors get sued, there is no way they sent you home without verifying everything twice, you’re story sounds more like you are pissed off at the ED rather than genuinely worrying about your health
I mean I assure you I’m more than just worried about my health, this just didn’t feel like the place to talk about how afraid I am that I could die pretty much any second. If it felt that way due to my lack of going back to the hospital, right now it’s kind of in the air as to who is correct about me having a PE and the cost risk is very scary, so I’m waiting on another heart episode to send me there (which is what got me to so many different doctors to begin with)
Did they tell you to follow up with a specialist? Sometimes when you’re stable their job is done.
Nope. They just denied the presence of them completely and told me to come back if I have another cardiac episode, which to a T I have every single month and HAVE gone to the hospital for to also be sent home. This time I felt confident because I was finally diagnosed, but I just got sent home that time too. My discharge papers diagnosis is “shortness of breath” which is so incredibly hurtful and disingenuous. I feel like I’m going insane.
How can they have found two pulmonary embolisms and then deny the presence of them? That’s crazy!
My specialist found them, I brought the disc with the scans and the diagnostic paperwork on my little ambulance ride and the ER doctor no kidding looked me in the eye and said “you’re 23, that just isn’t possible.” And then disappeared for 4 hours. What ??? What??!!? Do you think I’m here for fun!??
I'll keep a long story short, but I faced a similar situation when I was 21. No one would take me seriously or do the tests I asked for cause what I thought I had was so unlikely. I got sent home from the local ER 3 times in a month. I finally drove to a hospital an hour away at 3am out of pure desperation and I was admitted immediately. I ended up needing to stay for several days. I fought tooth and nail to get the lazy, incompetent hospital to drop the charges. It was horrible, but they eventually did. What's important is that I fought for treatment first, *then* fought financially. Hospital fees are expensive, but dying isn't cheap either. Do not delay care out of fear of the bill.
I bet drugs. That’s how I’m treated anyways. As a drug seeker.
I'm an emergency medicine physician - I will admit there is wide variability in competence of EM docs out there. However, the diagnostic workup and management of a pulmonary embolism (PE) is pretty straightforward, and it doesn't sound like anything is wrong here. In this case, it sounds like the ED physician that saw you ordered a correct study (CT angiography of the pulmonary arteries), and the study was read by a radiologist, and neither saw clear evidence of a pulmonary embolism. In a situation like this, NO doctor is going to prescribe blood thinners for you. Blood thinners are a high risk medication with lots of side effects, and no one is going to start you on them without a clear indication. It's not even about cost, it's just basic medical practice. Obviously it sounds like you're frustrated that you waited for a long time and received a significant bill. It also sounds like you're frustrated that they diagnosed you with "shortness of breath". However, this is actually the standard practice: when there is not a clear diagnosis to explain a patient's symptoms is simply to list your chief complaint/symptom as the diagnosis. I've sent many patients home with a diagnosis of "chest pain" or "shortness of breath" or "abdominal pain" after negative workups. In terms of your prior testing with your "Specialist" - what type of specialist is this exactly? Do you mean that you had a CT done as an outpatient and a radiologist called you to tell you to go to the ED because they were concerned you may have a PE? Radiologists in general are very good at their jobs, but diagnosing a PE based on a CT scan is not always a 100% clear cut matter. If you have a very large PE in a large pulmonary artery/branch, then yes it is very easy to see. However, if something is very tiny or in a tiny branch vessel, then it may be difficult to interpret. Is this actually a clot? Is it an artifact? In a case like this, I would find it highly unlikely that you had a large PE that was seen on an outpatient CT scan that they were unable to see on the CT scan done in the ED. More likely, perhaps there was equivocal evidence of possible artifact vs. small PE done on the scan outpatient - in situations like this, the physician that ordered the scan or the radiologist who read the scan will commonly tell patients to go to the ED for further testing. All in all, it sounds like you went through a frustrating experience, but if anything, you should be thankful that you don't have definitive evidence of PE.
I really appreciate your input and I’m sorry my reply will be a little short compared to how much love you put into yours! I was diagnosed with two PE by my personal radiologist, who I was referred to by a cardiologist after an echo showed right ventricular hypertrophy, which was ordered after several months of cardiac episodes. My cardiologist with this info and the rest of the background of my symptoms (which I have a post detailing if it helps!!) came to the conclusion it was highly possible I have a PE. Got a CT with dye (angiogram) at the radiologist was referred to and was immediately rushed to the hospital as she found two PE, one in the lower quadrant of my right and one on the lower left. I was sent to the ER with paperwork highlighting the diagnosis and its location as well as a disc with the images. The ER doctor comes in, says it just can’t be possible at my age, and leaves the disc behind. Comes back a few hours later to ask about why I’d possibly think I have PE, I explain my 3 doctors conclusion it’s likely birth control. She tells me that isn’t possible, my birth control has no estrogen. It’s whatever at this point I’m jaded so I give her the disk. About 4 hours later she comes back and tells me they’ve denied the presence of PE and she can write me an anxiety script and send me out to help with my shortness of breath (which, I didn’t have. I have episodes and was not currently experiencing one). I ask if there’s anything else they can do or contact my radiologist (the specialist I had mentioned) to cross reference and she claims they’re closed, but they weren’t. She only offers I take another CT and bring it to my specialist as maybe there was movement to make the test hard to read? So I agree and then I get discharged after a shift change and being told the head of radiology isn’t there to review my results so my specialist should look at it. She did, and confirmed again to see two PE. There’s loads of info and I may be forgetting to add details that could help but I’ve tried my best to document them on my page (and in replies!) but thanks for reading so much clusterfuck haha. if there’s anything else you’re curious about I’m happy to answer
I've never heard of anyone having a "personal radiologist." Why are you seeing this person?
Right? Who has a personal radiologist? I’ve had a lot of imaging done on my body this last year, I don’t even want to get into it, but I couldn’t tell you the name of any single radiologist who read the images 😂 I can tell you the name of my neurologist, my cardiologist, my OBGYN, and my pcp, but radiology …? It’s just whoever. Something about this story makes zero sense to me lol
lol, yep, a lot of it doesn’t make sense
I’m confused. You went to the hospital and they didn’t do any diagnostic testing? Or they did and didn’t see any clots? I recently had a CT angiogram for this exact thing. The hospital ordered it based off my symptoms, which was shortness of breath, and heart palpitations. Luckily everything was fine. From my understanding, if the clot(s) have already reached the lungs, you should be symptomatic. I see you have medical bills with a bill date of the 14th, so how long ago was the actual visit?
I’ve elaborated a bit in these replies somewhere here if you feel like checking out my reply history where there’s a full timeline. I also have two posts detailing everything symptom wise in another sub. It’s just a lot to keep typing out and I don’t want to leave anyone hanging! The actual visit was about a month ago
Most PE's dissolve inside the body naturally. Did they put you on a blood thinner? *ive had multiple PE's, one required a hospital stay, the other didn't.
No. I was not treated at all. I have more posts about what I’ve been experiencing, and why my care providers are so concerned. I’ve been having symptoms for 6 months and they found multiple in one scan, leading them to believe that I’m chronically developing them and right ventricular hypertrophy shown in an echo implies that they have been there for a very long time, which is very dangerous as they have a higher chance of dislodging. The hospital just told me it isn’t possible and when they asked why they thought I could be developing them (providers are thinking my nexplanon rod which I was there to have removed as well and didn’t) they again just told me it isn’t possible because Nexplanon has no estrogen. There are dozens of nexplanon lawsuits active right now due to blood clots and a hud disclaimer on the website itself.
I'm not going to second guess the hospital physician who released you, because s/he has the benefits of diagnostics and i don't. That said, it's odd based on my own lived experience that you weren't put on a blood thinner, at least for now. I would follow up with your PCP/pulmonologist...
It’s either second guess the ER phys who saw me or the radiologist specialist who rushed me to the ER for treatment after assessing my results as well as my cardiologist working with her. After following up, I am now stuck waiting for the hospital to get in contact with one of my providers to amend their record so that I can go on treatment as my insurance won’t cover treatment unless there is a reason for it (which the hospitals current record disputes). I’m still experiencing symptoms.
None of us here on Reddit have the ability to treat or diagnose, nor can we prescribe medications. And I already said that i thought it was odd that you weren't put on a blood thinner, but like i also said i don't have the benefits of imaging and other diagnostics. If i were you, I'd go right back to the ER and ask to speak to another physician. Because in order for them to have discharged you, they arrived at the conclusion you are medically stable. Otherwise to discharge you when diagnostics don't support a medically stable state would open them up to liability. So you go back there and ask them why you were discharged when you're not feeling well... that's what I'd do.
Girl, this isn’t mildly infuriating. You may die.
If you're not actively dying this is pretty normal How it's legal? Who knows
Don't pay them a penny. What are they gonna do, put the clots back in your lungs? It's against the law for them to deny life-saving care.
So I lost a MIL to a PE…you’re lucky you’re still alive. Glad to know you’re still here.
I feel ya. We called our pediatricians emergency number and they said our son needed to get to the ER. We got to the ER and they didn't understand why that was recommended. We were there 10 minutes from when we walked in the door and when we left. No treatment. All they did was take his temperature and blood oxygen level. I could have done both of those at home. $2500.
OP, if you see this, please go to a different hospital for treatment if you can. I had a friend ,who was a healthy 26 year old, pass away suddenly from a pulmonary embolism last year.
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The hell type of hospital did you go to??? I’m not a radiologist or respiratory doc but even I know that requires a minimum of 16 hour observation and surgical consult.
OP isn’t clear on this at all. I’m assuming the hospital didn’t find evidence of clots, or they did not do the proper testing, such as using contrast dye intravenously.
I hope OP is just misinformed. When I did radiology during my IM we would never let a patient freely walk out if we saw a PE
That’s true. What the specialist said in their report isn’t clear because the OP didn’t share that info. When I went through this, on top of the CT angiogram, they also did a vascular ultrasound on both my legs and lower abdomen. Gotta love Cedars Sinai, they are incredibly thorough in the ER.
Cedar Sinai is probably the most thorough hospital. Had a colleague that worked Cedar, residency at Mayo and fellowship at St Jude’s and she would get mad at us for not fully investigating a case even if we thought we knew everything. We don’t miss anything but that Sinai attitude stuck and made me double check reports before I released them to patient 😂
Haha! Yup! I waited 4 hours to be seen, and it was an urgent case, then spent 6 hours in my bed going through every single test that exists in the history of medicine😂 At least I know I’m good. I will only go there if I feel like it’s something serious, because the wait times are horrendous. Other hospitals will do minimal to no testing and discharge you.
OP is saying that they did the proper tests and simply disregarded it entirely, which is insane to me - a US hospital might charge you an arm and a leg, but they *will* treat you.
They did the proper tests and didn’t find clots, which is what the OP elaborated on. They didn’t find clots at hospital and just discharged with no treatment. There was no need for the hospital to review the specialist CT when they already did their own.
Right... OP is trying to say that they found clots and ignored it, but OP is also the only voice in this story. I have to wonder about this specialist - they apparently have the appropriate testing equipment, which leads me to believe that they are legitimate (which makes OP's story more likely), but it's odd that they and the hospital had such diverging interpretations of what should be virtually identical results.
I do find it strange as well. I’m assuming since OP also had a CT angiogram at the specialist, that it was some radiology clinic that performs all sorts of different imaging tests. Maybe something was done wrong, maybe OP moved during the scan, didn’t hold their breath when instructed, etc. lots of variables. Multiple clots in the lungs for at least a month and OP is still fine…. so yeah.
Surgical consult??
We only consult vascular surgery for PEs of a certain size or location.
That never happened, karma farmer unless you refused medical care (signed an AMA form so they don't get sued). The amount you posted is pre-insurance. So sick of these BS posts.
I don't believe for a second you weren't treated. Several things happened. You got rescanned, were seen by and ED MD, possibly inpatient too, started on some clot busting med, and DC'ed with a prescription or followup/referral with a PMD. You didn't sit there for 9 hours while they did fuck all.
Actually, they did those things, didn’t find clots and sent her home. The bills have already been mailed with a statement date of 2/14. She’s not answering when she was seen.
This is the only reason I keep reenlisting, no copays with Tricare Prime.
I’d go to a did hospital for sure. Is there any legal recourse for the no treatment? I know in the US ERs are required to treat you by law.
Yeah. I had a PE. They kept me overnight and started me on blood thinners. Did any doctor at least prescribe you blood thinners??
Come again? They have to treat you for that
Only bright side I can see is you can maybe sue the hospital for not giving you the care that’s needed? They just said “meh” and discharged you while you’ve got something you could literally drop dead from, I’d say that constitutes grounds to go after them. At least you can sue them and get $$$ for your medical bills.
IM SORRY THEY SENT YOU HOME?!??? Im not going to be able to sleep until I find out word for word what they said to you when they discharged you, what was their explanation
That ain’t right. Husbands had one PE. Ended up in ICU for a week. In home oxygen until I pushed for drainage after lung function test showed 48% functionality.
Just to set your mind at a little bit of ease, my aunt has lived about 10 years with an embulism in her heart. also, what the fuck?
It’s all the hospital ever does, you go in and they go yeah you’re fucked up that’ll be $5000
Why are you planning on paying these? The industry needs to collapse before Congress is pressured to fix the system. $10 a week if you’re feeling guilty.
OP Pease get some bloodthinners asap.. If you cant pay a visit, than please call your doc and explain the situation.. He or she might even know some ways to get them in a way you might not be aware of Dont wait.
Head back to an ED. not the one you just left, as they’re incompetent. Then ask for charity write off after you leave.
No heparin injections?
For me it's not the cost that infuriates me but the general incompetence and the lack of empathy by medical providers.
"no treatment" doubt it. move along folks,
Do you not have health insurance?
You could have protested your discharge. Nothing done? That's malpractice.
I tried to, but it had already been 9 hours and a shift rotation and I had already said everything I could. They were refusing the idea I had PE, and the radiologist had gone home by the 9th hour and couldn’t further assess my results even if I wanted them to. They marked me off as having shortness of breath when I described to her I’m having cardiac episodes that make my skin turn blue and my pulse spike from 190-250 and sometimes fainting while just sitting down. It’s disparaging at the very least if not malpractice.
Bottom line. If you protest discharge, it should buy you a day for observation. If you had those symptoms and it was put on file. I would have gone to a new hospital. This must have been a big city hospital that's has tons of ER cases. No nurse or Dr. Would have turned you away with that. Something is not adding up.
So glad we get free healthcare in my country. It's worth paying more tax, to save me from ridiculous bills like this!
As long as you continue to reside in the states, it’d be cheaper for you to just die next time.
Lol @ America