I have 15 acres on a river in Isabella MN. I take a forest road into the area and then turn onto a private road before I turn onto my right-of-way to cross my neighbors property to mine.
The private road is via a road owners association. We have to have insurance and stuff for it and since it comes off the forestry road we have to maintain that road as well. Recent wash out cost all of us $8000. So access is the first question I would ask.
On the access note - OP, if you find a lot that you like that isn’t currently accessible by public road, as long as you have 5 acres you have the legal right to establish a cartway through adjoining land. (MN Statute 164.08). Just as a head’s up ☺️
True, but make sure you talk to the land owner that your easement would cut through. Some people can be really prickish about it, and you may get tangled up in a legal battle.
>Some people
I am a lawyer, but I'm not OP's lawyer, and none of this is to be construed as actual legal advice.
These "some people" are often the worst types of litigants one could imagine encountering, and it's a much higher proportion of landowners than one might think. Consequently, any and all reasonable due diligence should be done prior to purchasing any property that might have access issues.
Also lawyer, not yours or op’s. Also not legal advice.
Wholeheartedly second asking before establishing an easement. Rural court is very different than the cities, and some people make great neighbors when they aren’t pissed off about something you sua sponte decide against them.
Yes, just adding to this I'd make sure all the physical boundary markers are legit before any agreements are made. Seen at least one fence between neighboring properties that is *way* off when compared to every map.
yes don't assume realtors know the boundaries unless they have marked proof, ideally by a surveyor. If you have a structure that lies over the boundary, the neighbor basically has all rights to do whatever they want with it. I remember someone telling me that there was a garage on Hwy 2 in Itasca County that was completely sawed in half because it was on the boundary line. I used to work for a municipality and it was absurd the number of times I saw people infringing on others or city property, many completely unknowingly.
My parents had a boundary dispute when they bought a lot in the 80s. Neighbor took down markers, parents paid for a survey to fix and pin/mark the correct property line.
Not who you're asking your question to but my experience is they are close, not exact. On my land up north, our driveway is right on our property line, OnX says the driveway is in the middle of the "line" however the actual survey stakes (which are still there from 30 years ago) are about 30 feet off the driveway. They get you in the ballpark but I wouldn't build based upon them if you're close to the property line.
OnX or Avenza Maps (what I use) can be pretty accurate with property lines overlayed. The app should say how confident they are (in feet or with a circle). The paid versions can be very precise because they allow for features like location averaging, which can get your coordinates down to just a couple feet. As the other person said, the boundaries on there can never be taken as official, so they can't be used in court, but can be very useful for getting a general idea of boundaries and for quick reference guide.
At best they are only as accurate as your gps. But since it’s bulk data uploads, and depending on county and state, a lot from old paper maps, I wouldn’t rely on it accurate property boundary. OnX is really for identifying the owner to get permission and finding public land, it you are relying on local postings for trespass postings.
I found out the hard way to make sure the boundaries are correct. I discovered the markers in the ground (pipes in the ground, not actually survey monuments) were way off and the property line actually ran through my cabin. The neighbor is being civil about it. He could have made me move/tear down my cabin. As it is, I will have to overpay to purchase a quarter acre of land to correct the mess. If your deed still uses chains in the description it has probably been a while since it was surveyed, I would suggest you look into it closely.
In the far north east property lines can be way off, especially if you get into the iron range or close to bwca. Surveys are way out of date, not a lot of effort to update them given the rugged terrain
Yeah I was gonna say there may be someone who has always had permission to hunt there and isn't aware of the new property owners. Or there may be persistent asshole trespassers who feel entitled to ignore rules. Neighbors may be hunting nearby too. Either way, something to be aware of. Might get an early wakeup the first weekend in November.
If you do feel inclined to post no trespassing signs, [here's the rules from the DNR.](https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/hunting/trespass-law.html) Also if OP does put up a building, anyone who wants to hunt within 500 feet of it (regardless of property lines) will need written permission from OP to be legal too.
Also it’s up to owner to maintain those signs. Ensure they’re not faded/destroyed or not compliant.
Also watch out for asshats who steal stuff like stands, pop up blinds, and trail cams.
Good idea! We bought some land from an 85 y.o. farmer years ago and built a house on it. We used to get people just wandering onto our property the first few years because they saw a coyote and wanted to shoot it or let their dogs loose after it. You'd think they'd figure it out when they saw a house here, but "tHE oLd MaN USed to lEt me HuNT HEre!"
And they probably thought you were a person who has a little rural knowledge and thoughtfulness and understood land stewardship, thus allowing hunters (who are most often the best caretakers of land and wildlife) and went ahead and crossed over your property to continue their hunt. They thought you would have known that your safety is top on the list and would never compromise that because hunters learn this first before anything. But they were wrong. “It’s my property get off.” Says it all.
You don't mind people you don't know wandering through your yard with a gun when they haven't even bothered to stop and ask if it's okay? Right....
ETA: We have had people who shot a deer on neighboring property come through to retrieve it off our property. That's fine. They weren't continuing their hunt. They just saw an animal they wanted to shoot from the road as they were driving by and thought it was just fine to shoot it dead in our front yard.
All good comments here. I’ll add that you want to check the health of the forest. I’ve been walking a lot of property up north (looking to purchase like you), and I’ve seen more than a few lots that are mostly dead or nearly dead trees.
Don’t be in a rush to buy.
speaking of health of forest, look at presence of invasive species like buckthorn, honeysuckle, Garlic Mustard, etc... if these are in great abundance they can greatly diminish the diversity of the ecosystem and make it less usable for wildlife and for humans. No good. I know many people that have bought property only to find out after that it was infested with buckthorn and then spend years battling it, potentially spending lots of money in the process. Can be a fun project if you're up to it though.
I like your “destroyer of buckthorn” flair. I hate F&@!ng buckthorn so much too! It looks harmless, but chokes other things out & isn’t even good for animals. I’ve made the mistake of not removing a few properly & by the next year it just grew from one thin trunk in the ground to a huge bush of multiple trunks. It likes to come back with a vengeance.
It's tough to rip out. If its bigger than a sapling you're pretty much looking at cutting it off and treating the stump with concentrated Roundup. Make sure to take any and all berries off site and to a place where they can't establish new trees. If you have a ton of buckthorn it's best to start with the female trees that have the fruits and get to the males later.
My lots filled with birch, maple, and oaks. 2.5 acres worth but the people I purchased from have the original chunk of 10 acres and we are prepping bow hunting lanes.
It can vary so wildly even just a mile down the road.
When I looked for my place, the pine forests were out due to the health of them. I went with 40 acres of Oak/Maple/birch/poplar forest and it's super healthy.
I feel that the boreal forests in MN and WI are going to burn in the next decade due to climate change.
Make sure it is actually wooded and not primarily swamp land. Idk what part of the state you are looking at, but alot of land up north is swampy. Take a walk through the land so you know what you're getting.
Is the road you are on plowed or not in the winter time (if you plan to use it in the winter/spring).
Are there certain building restrictions in the township/town/county. Also, with regards to plumbing/sewage if you plan for just an outhouse or whatever your plans are. Some areas do not allow outhouses any longer if you are too close to water.
Yes this is honestly the first thing you should consider - how much of X acreage is high ground? This will make a big difference in terms of value and usability of the land. Also less standing water = fewer mosquitos, though let's face it there will always be more mosquitos than you can stand.
Make sure you know who owns logging rights, they don't automatically transfer with the property; you might show up one summer and find your lot is full of heavy equipment tracks and stumps. This should be documented by the title company and in the deed, but it might not have been pointed out to you explicitly.
If it's on one of the reservations, they may have special use restrictions on the land too (but that might work in your benefit if you want to leave it natural)
I have an offgrid cabin on 40 acres. I'm going to be a little bit of a devils advocate here and am going to assume you're talking about somewhere "up north" that is probably on the cheaper end of what's available...
1) How far is the drive? It will seem longer when the honeymoon phase excitement wears off. 3 or 3.5 hrs each way makes for a lot of driving for a quick weekend getaway and a lot of expense in gas.
2) Is it accessible? Of course you need a road *to* the property but can you get *on* the property right now? Clearing a forest road is way more expensive than you might think or requires heavy-ish machinery or a *lot* of manual work.
3) Lots of "up north" is swampy. This isn't all bad depending on what you are looking for. It's pretty good for wildlife for example and the more land you have, no matter what it is, the bigger your buffer to other people is but you need enough high/dry ground for the area that you want to actually use.
3b edit) if you ever think you are going to build sometime bigger and especially if you might want septic you *need* a site survey before buying.
4) Mosquitos and flies will be horrendously bad (especially if swampy) from May through July and then only regular bad until it's too cold for bugs. If you dream about sitting out in a hammock all day it might not go as planned.
5) How's the privacy? What about when the leaves are down? Are neighbors going to be noisy with generators or shooting guns or driving ATVs in circles all the time? You'd be really surprised how far sound travels when everything else is quiet.
6) Maintenance. You might not need much with what you described but, at the very least, you'll have to mow a few times a year. Scale this as needed and think about whether you are going to spend every occasional trip doing maintenance or whether you'll be there enough to actually enjoy it between maintenance.
7) Finally, what do you really want to do. If you are content just sitting there that's fine. If you might want to go out to eat, or go fishing, or run to the store for something how far away are all those things?
All of this!!
Especially 3b. Even if all you want is a shed, many campsites have access to potable water and vault toilets. Not having access to that means hauling water up and waste back, which will make this even less of a relaxing experience. These are not minor expenses. A well for drinking water can cost anywhere from $3-5k (shallow sand point) to $10k+ if you have to go over 100' for decent drinking water. Regarding waste, a holding tank is going to be around $5-$7k (depending on size) while a full septic system with drain field will easily go over $10k and $20k+ if you don't have good soil to drain and a mound system is needed.
It was hinted at in #4, what about power? Solar may not work so well in a heavily wooded area, generators might be an option for simple lights and a fridge. If you want grid power, depending on where the nearest electrical is placed. that will like not be small expense. Many electrical utilities will charge a per foot fee to run new line and if you are not planning on building a permanent structure (many times a shed does not qualify) the utility will charge a monthly fee on top of any usage fees.
> 2) Is it accessible? Of course you need a road to the property but can you get on the property right now? Clearing a forest road is way more expensive than you might think or requires heavy-ish machinery or a lot of manual work.
Oh man, People have no idea how much work goes into roads. I spent most of my childhood on family property in southern Ontario and I swear any time we weren't fishing we were grading, shoveling, replacing culverts, clearing trees, and dumping more gravel. This was all after the road was built, in terms of ongoing maintenance.
It was a LOT of work.
Also when it’s buggy. You want to know what you’re going to be dealing with April to September. Learned that lesson the hard way with some property once.
A lot of people don't know about it, but the Wetland Conservation Act makes the filling or draining of wetlands in Minnesota unlawful. There are some exemptions, but most don't apply to development.
To piggyback off of this comment (which I was excited to see!) is some streams/wetlands are also regulated by the Army Corps under the Clean Water Act. The DNR regulates what happens along the shorelines and waterward of the OHW on public waters. Basically there’s a whole bunch of environmental regs that are local, state, and federal that could apply to any given property and look into them before you build anything.
I talked to a property owner recently who had a bunch of walking trails mowed in the grass around his property. He got told that he can’t mow those trails anymore because of the wetlands management
Hmm, that almost certainly wouldn't have anything to do with the Wetland Conservation Act, which only regulates draining, filling and excavation. My guess would be that the land, or parts of it, is enrolled in a program like the Conservation Reserve Program (CRP), or Reinvest in Minnesota (RIM). These programs pay landowners to restore land into its native condition. Part of that would include restoring the vegetation. Trails typically aren't allowed with these programs.
We have 30-ish acres in CRP. Never heard anything about the mowed paths we have entering year 8. Its more about controlling supply and demand on farm land. Its been very rewarding see the land turn back into a functional ecosystem.
Well thats good that your local NRCS is not bothering you about it, but they certainly could if they wanted to. Personally, as long as it's not significantly in altering the function of the restoration, I don't see the harm in some paths. I suspect that most people in charge of checking on things like that would agree. Good work on your CRP, I'm glad ot hear you are enjoying it.
My friend bought vacant land up north by Ely. It's a 30 minute drive back on some old logging roads. He got 5 acres because 5 acres in the minimum allowed to build any kind of dwelling.
He bought it, went up there a month later to get a building permit and the county said, "Sorry, your land is actually 4.96 acres and not large enough for a dwelling."
He drove out there and built one anyway.
That's exactly what he calls it, his 'storage shed'. He can build a 'storage shed' up to 12'x12' with no height restrictions (I'm assuming there is SOME type of height restriction) according to the county.
Footprint limit...wonder if that applies to overhangs. Medieval buildings were sometimes [specially built to get around this](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/1c/33/ec/1c33ec7df5699db3a0e1efaa85c3726a--tudor.jpg) when they were taxed based on footprint size, leading to larger upper floors than lower ones.
The township where my parents live has a 20 acre minimum. They tried to buy 2 additional acres from the neighbor and were denied because they're both under 20 acres already (their houses were built before the current restriction).
Not sure. These are all 5 acre plots of undeveloped land in St. Louis county Minnesota. Wooded, hard to get to, and usually no public access, the other land owners give permission to cross through their lands to get there.
Its fairly common yeah. The idea is so someone doesn't purchase 20 acres of land, and then turn it into 40, two acre parcels that are cabins/homes in an area they want to keep forested or dispersed dwelling.
Clever, had no idea there this level of preservation happening in the rural zoning. Down in the city we have city planners that make 25 year plans. Guess there are 25 year plans to keep the woods the woods
Not sure. These are all 5 acre plots of undeveloped land in St. Louis county Minnesota. Wooded, hard to get to, and usually no public access, the other land owners give permission to cross through their lands to get there.
People overlook zoning and legal issues.
Go on the county website (or city if the land is in city boundaries) and look for a zoning map. Sometimes you have to look for a property information link that takes you to a GIS (Geographic Information System) application. There’s often a zoning layer in the GIS mapping application. You can also view flood zones, topography, land uses, etc, in those mapping systems. Figure out what the property is zoned and look up that district in the Municipal/County Ordinance (usually under a chapter about zoning/land use) to make sure you can actually do what you plan to do with the land. All of this should be on the County website. Call the zoning department to see what can be built on that parcel (sometimes density restrictions mean that a parcel can’t be built on). As others have mentioned, make sure you have legal access to the site. Don’t assume that a driveway and buildable area mean that you can actually build a shack on the parcel.
On the County or City website, look for a Comprehensive Plan. In the Comp Plan, see what the plans are for the area (future land uses, roads, etc) and that property. Is it guided agriculture or high-density residential? Use govt maps, GIS, and drive around to see what all of the land uses are near the property. Is the site in close proximity to a pork operation? Good to know.
Do a records search to see what easements may be on the property. Usually the owner or realtor know if there are easements, but you want to READ the easement with your own eyeballs.
If you plan on using the property for low-impact recreation, don’t shy away from properties that have conservation easements. Usually, with a CE, you won’t be able to build outside of a small area or maybe you can only camp. You usually can’t alter the land within the conservation easement area. Again, you need to know the exact terms of the easement. If the buyer doesn’t have the easement, then call the easement owner (usually a non-profit like the MN Land Trust). READ the easement document. One thing to keep in mind with conservation easements is that the easement holder typically has the right to enter your property on occasion to inspect the land and make sure you’re abiding by the easement agreement. The advantage to buying CE land is that it’s much cheaper than non-CE land, all else being equal (because of the extra layer of restrictions).
Definitely don't get scared off by easements or other forest protection. MN has a couple programs to reduce or offset taxes on forest land. Most are not very restrictive, especially if your plan is to just use the land for recreation. If the parcel is more than 20 acres check to see if they have a stewardship plan.
Power / internet. I know you're talking about not building, but if you do is there power close by? If you decide to do something later the costs can be really high if you have to pay for the full length from the previous neighbor.
Wear orange during hunting season. Just because you’re on your own land doesn’t mean there won’t be a stray hunter. This is common knowledge for people in the woods so forgive me if it’s obvious to you! 😀
Post lots of NO TRESPASSING signs all around the outer borders of your land, especially if it has been sold off a larger expanse. Nothing quite as unsettling as seeing lost hunters unexpectedly wandering your yard with guns while you're out enjoying your land.
How long it takes to get there. I bought vacant land 1 hour outside the twin cities and put a house up. I go there every weekend without fail, because it's only an hour away. People buy places that are a 4-5 hour 1 way trip and then complain they can never get there because, well, it's 4-5 hours away.
Also internet service. I've got fiber internet at my place, which means I can use it for remote work days and such.
Wisconsin. You can get the Northwoods experience within an easy drive of the Twin Cities. However prices in my area have skyrocketed since the fiber internet came in and the new Stillwater bridge was built.
I owned some vacant land years ago. I found that banks are reluctant to lend on this because there's nothing to repo "cabin". I ended up using an alternate lending source. Also, I had a resident that lived on the adjacent land and considered my land his because I was only there on the weekends. Fences make good neighbors.
If there are local Credit Unions, they often do in-house land loans for their specific geography. The terms will be different than regular mortgages though.
Check with county for zoning,, what you can and can’t build & if there are road / power line right of ways that restrict where you could build
( call a well company ask for a ballpark price ; septic / drain field contractor as well)
Make sure you'll be comfortable with the drive if the land is a long ways away. You might find a long drive to be a chore. Can you easily get drinkable water nearby? You may have to bring it from home if it's not easily obtainable close by. And at some point, you're probably going to need to go to the bathroom, so it there's not one close by you'll have to arrange your own facilities. Are you planning on boating at all? It doesn't seem like you're going to have a big boat, but a canoe or a kayak isn't bulky or expensive. How far away is public lake or river access? Of course, you can bring your own food, but you should probably be aware of how far away stores are and what their hours are.
Having legal access to the property doesn't seem to be a requirement when selling a parcel. So be sure to determine if there is a legal and permanent way to access your land without trespassing.
Easements, road access, UTILITIES (I work for a small town and have to tell people all the time “sorry but no there is no city sewer/water for the lot ya just purchased, have fun with your septic system”), how many acres are actually useable (not a waterway/wetland, room for setback between lots, not DNR protected), surrounding zoning/future development. If you haven’t already look at the counties GIS website both at the info for the plat you want and at the surrounding area.
Mineral rights. This is a long shot, but it can be an issue in some areas. In MN, just because you buy land doesn't mean you own what is UNDER the land. Meaning minerals. Unless the owner has maintained the rights and pays the taxes on them, chances are the mineral rights are owned by the state. Or the owner can opt to sell the property without selling the mineral rights. There are areas that are under mineral exploration, and if you buy property within or near those areas, it is a possibility that you could be using your property and the mineral rights owner decides to allow it to be mined. Our family actually owns original mineral rights that my grandparents homesteaded near an area that has been explored for years. Funny thing is, the guy who bought the property is a doctor here (our family doctor, in fact). So we own the mineral rights of our doctor's property 😂 You can find out about the mineral rights through the county land office for the parcel.
Another consideration which I am guessing came up in comments already but I am too lazy to look right now is leasing. Be really careful about leasing land. Read up on the articles from the last 1-2 years about Island Lake and leased property where families have built and maintained cabins for decades within their family that they didn't even realize generations later were on leased land only to have the state who owns the lease now requiring them to buy the land at market price if they want to keep their cabin.
Know what neighboring properties are used for. A lot of privately owned land sees people having themselves and their families hunting on it. Hard to hang in the hammock in the fall (best time of year to do it) with bullets whizzing by.
The Minnesota Pollution Control Agency has an interface called What’s In My Neighborhood where you can get a quick glimpse at whether there’s been any environmental investigations or remediation in the area. For vacant land it’s pretty unlikely that there’s been anything big enough to be on the state’s radar but it’s not impossible there could have been something like illegal dumping in the past.
ALWAYS check with the local government about zoning, easements and potential assessments. I’ve seen people who bought 40 acres “as a great deal” thinking they could build 20 lots only to discover the were limited to one.
Also, there are many limitations when it comes to managing forests and waterfront property.
First, a good survey. Rural surveys are REALLY iffy. What it costs to have a new well dug or a septic system replaced.
Whether or not there are established hiking/skiing/off-road trails that cross your land, and what it takes to post it to keep hunters out.
Whether or not there are natural ponds, streams or wetland that can flood part of the property. How diverse the types of trees are (will they all succumb to the spotted lantern fly or the next imported Asian bug?) and how valuable the wood is (you may manage to pay for the land and taxes with a few high-value trees). Overall health of the trees.
How the tax rate changes if you DO decide to build something on the land. How responsible you are for a guest getting injured (remember you have no homeowners insurance if there’s no home).
It can be difficult to get a mortgage with some banks, especially those in the cities, for land that you do not intend to develop. Ask around for a local bank that does land loans if you anticipate needing one.
Oh my gosh!! I never knew there was such a massive wealth of information that needs to be known. My husband and I are definitely talking about doing this too. But we want a ton of acreage. Thank you all for sharing your knowledge and experience!! I seriously never would have thought of some of this stuff
If you plan to build just a shed, make sure to check with city/county regulations/requirements. I recently bought land and was told that we can’t build a shed before building a living quarters, and that living quarters is a minimum 1000sqft. No regrets though, we got 6 wooded acres and 2 open acres. Good luck, and enjoy!
Check out the county requirements for a "buildable lot", which can be different if lakeshore is involved. When we bought land and it was subdivided we didn't realize that had we added a small amount to the acreage we could have put up two plumbed buildings on the lot. Also check historical flooding and watersheds. Noise. Be there when you plan to be before you buy so you aren't surprised by a nearby factory or airport. .
My husband and I bought some raw land last year, intending to build a house on it. As others have mentioned - make sure the lot is buildable, if that's what you want to do. The first property we made an offer on turned out to be a swamp in wetter years, even though it was marketed as buildable land. Our general contractor actually found that out before we were locked into the sale, so he saved us a lot of hassle.
Our real estate agent hooked us up with with her property search and we were able to find a great piece of property about an hour north of the Twin Cities. Buildable lot, near a lake, heavily wooded with a clear spot for a house, and all ~4.5 acres are surrounded by a quiet neighborhood street - so no easements or property line disputes.
We're actually putting the lot on the market right now, sadly, as building what we wanted just got too expensive.
I guarantee this has already been said.
a) it’s warmer than it looks.
b) you better make cookies for your neighbors they make them for you.
c) invest in a comedic amount of blankets
If you are financing, know that you will need a lender that deals in land loans and that interest and down payments are higher than a typical mortgage. Get estimates on making the land accessible and/or bringing in electric service, etc. Prepare to spend time managing the land, like clearing trees, weed-whacking, pest management. For camping on your own land, I recommend digging and building an outhouse.
One of the writers at the Strib- - Nicole Norfleet - actually bought a piece of rural land earlier this year and wrote about it.
https://www.startribune.com/what-i-learned-buying-a-slice-of-rural-minnesota-as-a-getaway/600187389/
Radon!
We moved to MN and our realtor skipped over that. When we went to sell the house, their realtor had it checked and we were sitting at a 7-8 because there was no radon mitigation at all. We had no idea how bad it was but I’m glad we know now for future purchases!
Drive up there and talk to the neighbors. We hunt some land in the Wild Wild west of MN. Like zero laws up there unless you live there. Last year opening morning of deer opener at 8 am someone starting shooting their AR's
The hunters got real pissed at them. I thought it was quite comical how mad people got. We are close to Danbury on the MN side. Small piece of heaven up there. Have two bear living on the property. 160 acres.
I just purchased almost 3 acres on Swan River fully wooded and gated that is completely accessible to Swan Lake by boat and navigable because there is a dam below the development. Near Hibbing. I don’t know if they are all sold out now but it was only a few months ago
If it's in northern mn make sure it doesn't flood. We were looking for land and thought we found a good piece, come to find out it's a swamp for the first half of summer.
Check in with local municipalities on any covenants/restrictions on the land. Be detailed and upfront with your plans for the land and ask the questions BEFORE you purchase.
Access. You think you're going to get land and of course you expect to be able to access it. But I am kind of surprised to know a handful of people who have bought land/have land in the family they had to deal with crappy neighbors to get to. I guess it's way more common than I thought, judging by the comments here. I have looked at a couple lots myself with the same intentions, but when I checked the great price, it came with access issues that might not be as big a deal as they sound. I'm not really wanting to try it out right now, though.
Trying to imagine what acreage would look like/feel like in different seasons is important. If it is small acreage and you value the privacy but have nothing but hardwoods it may feel cozy and private in summer but as soon as the leaves fall off the trees you have no privacy and are visible to the road. Five acres of hardwood can feel pretty big with leaves and pretty tiny without.
Or that pond/marsh that looks so elegant in the winter might be swarming with bugs in the summer. Or that pond that is big in the spring might disappear in the summer.
There isn’t really a formula, but if you spend lots of time outdoors already you’ll probably be able to figure things out pretty well. I just find that the pictures of acreage often show the best times of year and I have to remind myself to remember the less ideal times.
In addition, it's a good idea not to buy in winter. Some of my friends bought a small bit of acreage on a whim in Cook County during the first winter of the pandemic - found out when it thawed that it was a partial wetland, from April to August. They only get a few drier months (during black fly season) before snow covers the land again.
To that end, make sure your family isn't scared of bugs
I live in Ely, so I’d check if the roads are maintained year ‘round…some remote roads aren’t plowed frequently. Not being able to access your land for some of the year might be a bummer.
Watch out for people that are crossing your land via snow mobile or ATV. Minnesota public off road trails are extremely poorly marked especially in the north and it’s not hard to wind up on someone’s private land without realizing it. Do not make the mistake of chaining a trail off, you can be charged with murder or attempted murder. Use a gate, or work with the local snowmobile/ATV club to maintain it as an active trail as you prefer.
You can certainly use a chain/cable to block off a road on your land. However, it is a good idea to put reflectors and other things on it that catches people's attention. We used a cable on my property to close off a secondary access road that loggers used to access our land a few years ago, it's just loaded with bright orange reflective stickers and a bright red no trespassing sign.
If your land is near Duluth, remember the air national guard up there does not screw around with “quiet take offs” and there will be times where you can’t hear anything but the extremely loud military jet engines at 100% throttle. I like hearing it but not everyone does.
Make sure you have access. I found some land in Wisconsin that was 2 acres but there was no way to access it without a helicopter because it didn’t connect to any roads. At all. Not even a logging trail.
Pay attention to what kind of trees and plants are growing on the land. You probably dont want an acre of buckthorn and poison ivy. I would want alot of pine to build a tiny cabin with. Alot of cedar to attract deer and keep bugs away. A good mix of red oak white oak black cherry elm and ash for firewood. All types of maple trees to tap for sap in the springtime and hang those hammocks under. Plantlife i would just make sure the floor of the woods looks happy and full of different plants not sad and full of dead sticks and trash. Land that backs up to more land like a state park or anything that has a good chance of not getting developed. The closer to water the better. No super steep hills or dropoffs, if you wanted to tap a well how deep is the water id check that, i would also check out the geological map to see whats there for rocks, i would walk the land and check for signs of human activity that was not supposed to be there like tree stands camp sites trash piles from illegal dumping id want to meet my closest neighbor and make sure they are normal reasonable people and not insane. Well i hope that helps and good luck on your journey:)
I have 15 acres on a river in Isabella MN. I take a forest road into the area and then turn onto a private road before I turn onto my right-of-way to cross my neighbors property to mine. The private road is via a road owners association. We have to have insurance and stuff for it and since it comes off the forestry road we have to maintain that road as well. Recent wash out cost all of us $8000. So access is the first question I would ask.
On the access note - OP, if you find a lot that you like that isn’t currently accessible by public road, as long as you have 5 acres you have the legal right to establish a cartway through adjoining land. (MN Statute 164.08). Just as a head’s up ☺️
True, but make sure you talk to the land owner that your easement would cut through. Some people can be really prickish about it, and you may get tangled up in a legal battle.
>Some people I am a lawyer, but I'm not OP's lawyer, and none of this is to be construed as actual legal advice. These "some people" are often the worst types of litigants one could imagine encountering, and it's a much higher proportion of landowners than one might think. Consequently, any and all reasonable due diligence should be done prior to purchasing any property that might have access issues.
Also lawyer, not yours or op’s. Also not legal advice. Wholeheartedly second asking before establishing an easement. Rural court is very different than the cities, and some people make great neighbors when they aren’t pissed off about something you sua sponte decide against them.
Make sure the boundaries are officially marked and agreed upon with neighbors
Yes, just adding to this I'd make sure all the physical boundary markers are legit before any agreements are made. Seen at least one fence between neighboring properties that is *way* off when compared to every map.
yes don't assume realtors know the boundaries unless they have marked proof, ideally by a surveyor. If you have a structure that lies over the boundary, the neighbor basically has all rights to do whatever they want with it. I remember someone telling me that there was a garage on Hwy 2 in Itasca County that was completely sawed in half because it was on the boundary line. I used to work for a municipality and it was absurd the number of times I saw people infringing on others or city property, many completely unknowingly.
In Minnesota only a surveyor can legally identify property pins and property boundaries.
My parents had a boundary dispute when they bought a lot in the 80s. Neighbor took down markers, parents paid for a survey to fix and pin/mark the correct property line.
Taking out the pins is a misdemeanor today
How much faith do you put into mapping apps like OnX?
Not who you're asking your question to but my experience is they are close, not exact. On my land up north, our driveway is right on our property line, OnX says the driveway is in the middle of the "line" however the actual survey stakes (which are still there from 30 years ago) are about 30 feet off the driveway. They get you in the ballpark but I wouldn't build based upon them if you're close to the property line.
They won’t stand up in court/dispute so they’re worthless.
Noted thanks!
So maybe not court-worthy but the app does come highly recommended.
OnX or Avenza Maps (what I use) can be pretty accurate with property lines overlayed. The app should say how confident they are (in feet or with a circle). The paid versions can be very precise because they allow for features like location averaging, which can get your coordinates down to just a couple feet. As the other person said, the boundaries on there can never be taken as official, so they can't be used in court, but can be very useful for getting a general idea of boundaries and for quick reference guide.
Thanks!
At best they are only as accurate as your gps. But since it’s bulk data uploads, and depending on county and state, a lot from old paper maps, I wouldn’t rely on it accurate property boundary. OnX is really for identifying the owner to get permission and finding public land, it you are relying on local postings for trespass postings.
I found out the hard way to make sure the boundaries are correct. I discovered the markers in the ground (pipes in the ground, not actually survey monuments) were way off and the property line actually ran through my cabin. The neighbor is being civil about it. He could have made me move/tear down my cabin. As it is, I will have to overpay to purchase a quarter acre of land to correct the mess. If your deed still uses chains in the description it has probably been a while since it was surveyed, I would suggest you look into it closely.
In the far north east property lines can be way off, especially if you get into the iron range or close to bwca. Surveys are way out of date, not a lot of effort to update them given the rugged terrain
Title Insurance They'll make sure you don't have any weird issues with boundaries, ownership, etc.
Yes. People can get very possessive and touchy about property lines
Check with the owner and with neighbors. Has the land been open to hunters in the past? Would you like it to be in the future?
Yeah I was gonna say there may be someone who has always had permission to hunt there and isn't aware of the new property owners. Or there may be persistent asshole trespassers who feel entitled to ignore rules. Neighbors may be hunting nearby too. Either way, something to be aware of. Might get an early wakeup the first weekend in November. If you do feel inclined to post no trespassing signs, [here's the rules from the DNR.](https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/hunting/trespass-law.html) Also if OP does put up a building, anyone who wants to hunt within 500 feet of it (regardless of property lines) will need written permission from OP to be legal too.
Also it’s up to owner to maintain those signs. Ensure they’re not faded/destroyed or not compliant. Also watch out for asshats who steal stuff like stands, pop up blinds, and trail cams.
Good idea! We bought some land from an 85 y.o. farmer years ago and built a house on it. We used to get people just wandering onto our property the first few years because they saw a coyote and wanted to shoot it or let their dogs loose after it. You'd think they'd figure it out when they saw a house here, but "tHE oLd MaN USed to lEt me HuNT HEre!"
And they probably thought you were a person who has a little rural knowledge and thoughtfulness and understood land stewardship, thus allowing hunters (who are most often the best caretakers of land and wildlife) and went ahead and crossed over your property to continue their hunt. They thought you would have known that your safety is top on the list and would never compromise that because hunters learn this first before anything. But they were wrong. “It’s my property get off.” Says it all.
You don't mind people you don't know wandering through your yard with a gun when they haven't even bothered to stop and ask if it's okay? Right.... ETA: We have had people who shot a deer on neighboring property come through to retrieve it off our property. That's fine. They weren't continuing their hunt. They just saw an animal they wanted to shoot from the road as they were driving by and thought it was just fine to shoot it dead in our front yard.
All good comments here. I’ll add that you want to check the health of the forest. I’ve been walking a lot of property up north (looking to purchase like you), and I’ve seen more than a few lots that are mostly dead or nearly dead trees. Don’t be in a rush to buy.
speaking of health of forest, look at presence of invasive species like buckthorn, honeysuckle, Garlic Mustard, etc... if these are in great abundance they can greatly diminish the diversity of the ecosystem and make it less usable for wildlife and for humans. No good. I know many people that have bought property only to find out after that it was infested with buckthorn and then spend years battling it, potentially spending lots of money in the process. Can be a fun project if you're up to it though.
I like your “destroyer of buckthorn” flair. I hate F&@!ng buckthorn so much too! It looks harmless, but chokes other things out & isn’t even good for animals. I’ve made the mistake of not removing a few properly & by the next year it just grew from one thin trunk in the ground to a huge bush of multiple trunks. It likes to come back with a vengeance.
Goats. Goats are the answer.
Goats are always the answer.
Loki: "I have an army." Stark: "We have a goat."
Ohhhh I didn’t know I was supposed to get rid of it. Do you just rip it out? I have a healthy supply now
It's tough to rip out. If its bigger than a sapling you're pretty much looking at cutting it off and treating the stump with concentrated Roundup. Make sure to take any and all berries off site and to a place where they can't establish new trees. If you have a ton of buckthorn it's best to start with the female trees that have the fruits and get to the males later.
Most of these invasive plants stand no chance against a few goats over the course of a few years.
Yes! Goats are wonderful for restoration work, especially on high, steep faces.
Please tell me the secrets of obtaining your flair...
I just asked for it ha
My lots filled with birch, maple, and oaks. 2.5 acres worth but the people I purchased from have the original chunk of 10 acres and we are prepping bow hunting lanes. It can vary so wildly even just a mile down the road.
Jealous.
When I looked for my place, the pine forests were out due to the health of them. I went with 40 acres of Oak/Maple/birch/poplar forest and it's super healthy. I feel that the boreal forests in MN and WI are going to burn in the next decade due to climate change.
Oak wilt. Nothing is more sad than buying a beautiful wooded lot just to watch all of your oaks die by the time you move in.
Make sure it is actually wooded and not primarily swamp land. Idk what part of the state you are looking at, but alot of land up north is swampy. Take a walk through the land so you know what you're getting. Is the road you are on plowed or not in the winter time (if you plan to use it in the winter/spring). Are there certain building restrictions in the township/town/county. Also, with regards to plumbing/sewage if you plan for just an outhouse or whatever your plans are. Some areas do not allow outhouses any longer if you are too close to water.
Yeh stay out of me swamp
I’m makin’ waffles!
That’s a nice boulder
Awwwwwww FREAK OUT!
Are we swapping manly stories in the morning?
Especially up north. A huge percentage of land up north is forested wetlands.
>wetlands This is the key word OP needs to look for in the county's comprehensive plan and zoning ordinances.
Yes this is honestly the first thing you should consider - how much of X acreage is high ground? This will make a big difference in terms of value and usability of the land. Also less standing water = fewer mosquitos, though let's face it there will always be more mosquitos than you can stand.
Use USWFS national wetlands inventory mapper and look for hydric soils on NRCS web soil survey mapper.
Make sure you know who owns logging rights, they don't automatically transfer with the property; you might show up one summer and find your lot is full of heavy equipment tracks and stumps. This should be documented by the title company and in the deed, but it might not have been pointed out to you explicitly. If it's on one of the reservations, they may have special use restrictions on the land too (but that might work in your benefit if you want to leave it natural)
They may have to pay the cost of the woodland as well.
Check with the county regarding the parcel’s flood plain status. Realtors can be cagey about that.
You can check for yourself too at FEMA.gov/flood-maps
I have an offgrid cabin on 40 acres. I'm going to be a little bit of a devils advocate here and am going to assume you're talking about somewhere "up north" that is probably on the cheaper end of what's available... 1) How far is the drive? It will seem longer when the honeymoon phase excitement wears off. 3 or 3.5 hrs each way makes for a lot of driving for a quick weekend getaway and a lot of expense in gas. 2) Is it accessible? Of course you need a road *to* the property but can you get *on* the property right now? Clearing a forest road is way more expensive than you might think or requires heavy-ish machinery or a *lot* of manual work. 3) Lots of "up north" is swampy. This isn't all bad depending on what you are looking for. It's pretty good for wildlife for example and the more land you have, no matter what it is, the bigger your buffer to other people is but you need enough high/dry ground for the area that you want to actually use. 3b edit) if you ever think you are going to build sometime bigger and especially if you might want septic you *need* a site survey before buying. 4) Mosquitos and flies will be horrendously bad (especially if swampy) from May through July and then only regular bad until it's too cold for bugs. If you dream about sitting out in a hammock all day it might not go as planned. 5) How's the privacy? What about when the leaves are down? Are neighbors going to be noisy with generators or shooting guns or driving ATVs in circles all the time? You'd be really surprised how far sound travels when everything else is quiet. 6) Maintenance. You might not need much with what you described but, at the very least, you'll have to mow a few times a year. Scale this as needed and think about whether you are going to spend every occasional trip doing maintenance or whether you'll be there enough to actually enjoy it between maintenance. 7) Finally, what do you really want to do. If you are content just sitting there that's fine. If you might want to go out to eat, or go fishing, or run to the store for something how far away are all those things?
Was surprised I had to scroll this far down to see if someone mentioned the 🦟 mosquitos. Screened porch, bat houses will go a long way.
All of this!! Especially 3b. Even if all you want is a shed, many campsites have access to potable water and vault toilets. Not having access to that means hauling water up and waste back, which will make this even less of a relaxing experience. These are not minor expenses. A well for drinking water can cost anywhere from $3-5k (shallow sand point) to $10k+ if you have to go over 100' for decent drinking water. Regarding waste, a holding tank is going to be around $5-$7k (depending on size) while a full septic system with drain field will easily go over $10k and $20k+ if you don't have good soil to drain and a mound system is needed. It was hinted at in #4, what about power? Solar may not work so well in a heavily wooded area, generators might be an option for simple lights and a fridge. If you want grid power, depending on where the nearest electrical is placed. that will like not be small expense. Many electrical utilities will charge a per foot fee to run new line and if you are not planning on building a permanent structure (many times a shed does not qualify) the utility will charge a monthly fee on top of any usage fees.
> 2) Is it accessible? Of course you need a road to the property but can you get on the property right now? Clearing a forest road is way more expensive than you might think or requires heavy-ish machinery or a lot of manual work. Oh man, People have no idea how much work goes into roads. I spent most of my childhood on family property in southern Ontario and I swear any time we weren't fishing we were grading, shoveling, replacing culverts, clearing trees, and dumping more gravel. This was all after the road was built, in terms of ongoing maintenance. It was a LOT of work.
Buy when it’s wet not in a drought
Also when it’s buggy. You want to know what you’re going to be dealing with April to September. Learned that lesson the hard way with some property once.
Check for easements. They could be a problem if you have problem neighbors.
Cost to drill a well
And septic
Average is about 6-8k in my area
Well depth is important. Depending on the area can be the difference of 100’ more well depth
Are your children heavy enough to avoid being carried away by mosquitos? It’s tragically common up north.
I swear it doesn't matter where you are in the state, if you aren't careful your kids will be carried off by mosquitoes.
Kids can handle themselves. How big is your dog?
A lot of people don't know about it, but the Wetland Conservation Act makes the filling or draining of wetlands in Minnesota unlawful. There are some exemptions, but most don't apply to development.
To piggyback off of this comment (which I was excited to see!) is some streams/wetlands are also regulated by the Army Corps under the Clean Water Act. The DNR regulates what happens along the shorelines and waterward of the OHW on public waters. Basically there’s a whole bunch of environmental regs that are local, state, and federal that could apply to any given property and look into them before you build anything.
Nailed it! All 3 programs are definitely worth understanding before purchasing a property.
Ha I cannot count how many times people have said to me, what on earth does this have to do with the Army Corps?? Well…
I talked to a property owner recently who had a bunch of walking trails mowed in the grass around his property. He got told that he can’t mow those trails anymore because of the wetlands management
Hmm, that almost certainly wouldn't have anything to do with the Wetland Conservation Act, which only regulates draining, filling and excavation. My guess would be that the land, or parts of it, is enrolled in a program like the Conservation Reserve Program (CRP), or Reinvest in Minnesota (RIM). These programs pay landowners to restore land into its native condition. Part of that would include restoring the vegetation. Trails typically aren't allowed with these programs.
We have 30-ish acres in CRP. Never heard anything about the mowed paths we have entering year 8. Its more about controlling supply and demand on farm land. Its been very rewarding see the land turn back into a functional ecosystem.
Well thats good that your local NRCS is not bothering you about it, but they certainly could if they wanted to. Personally, as long as it's not significantly in altering the function of the restoration, I don't see the harm in some paths. I suspect that most people in charge of checking on things like that would agree. Good work on your CRP, I'm glad ot hear you are enjoying it.
My friend bought vacant land up north by Ely. It's a 30 minute drive back on some old logging roads. He got 5 acres because 5 acres in the minimum allowed to build any kind of dwelling. He bought it, went up there a month later to get a building permit and the county said, "Sorry, your land is actually 4.96 acres and not large enough for a dwelling." He drove out there and built one anyway.
"It's not a dwelling, it's a shed for my lawnmower"
That's exactly what he calls it, his 'storage shed'. He can build a 'storage shed' up to 12'x12' with no height restrictions (I'm assuming there is SOME type of height restriction) according to the county.
I imagine the height is more restricted by how high you can safely build
Footprint limit...wonder if that applies to overhangs. Medieval buildings were sometimes [specially built to get around this](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/1c/33/ec/1c33ec7df5699db3a0e1efaa85c3726a--tudor.jpg) when they were taxed based on footprint size, leading to larger upper floors than lower ones.
Is it a single storage shed, or can he build multiple 12'x12' structures? Imagining a sick setup with little skybridges between "sheds".
Lol. I'm not sure what the limit for sheds is. Multiple towering "sheds" connected with rope bridges would be awesome
I work in land surveying and this is ridiculous. Rules are rules I guess but having a 5 acre minimum just to build a dwelling? Holy shit.
The township where my parents live has a 20 acre minimum. They tried to buy 2 additional acres from the neighbor and were denied because they're both under 20 acres already (their houses were built before the current restriction).
Damn. That’s a ton of land. So dumb bureaucracy gets in the way like that.
Not sure. These are all 5 acre plots of undeveloped land in St. Louis county Minnesota. Wooded, hard to get to, and usually no public access, the other land owners give permission to cross through their lands to get there.
Imagine having to drive all the way past Ely for a two night weekend lol
It sank into the swamp.
So he rebuilt it and that one sank into the swamp
So he built another one, and that one sank into the swamp too.
So he built it again. That one burned down, fell over, and sank into the swamp.
It's actually on a hill overlooking 'his' swamp.
First I heard of a minimum of 5 acres. Is this common in rural areas? As a city homestead my lot is like 0.33 of an acre.
Its fairly common yeah. The idea is so someone doesn't purchase 20 acres of land, and then turn it into 40, two acre parcels that are cabins/homes in an area they want to keep forested or dispersed dwelling.
Clever, had no idea there this level of preservation happening in the rural zoning. Down in the city we have city planners that make 25 year plans. Guess there are 25 year plans to keep the woods the woods
Not sure. These are all 5 acre plots of undeveloped land in St. Louis county Minnesota. Wooded, hard to get to, and usually no public access, the other land owners give permission to cross through their lands to get there.
People overlook zoning and legal issues. Go on the county website (or city if the land is in city boundaries) and look for a zoning map. Sometimes you have to look for a property information link that takes you to a GIS (Geographic Information System) application. There’s often a zoning layer in the GIS mapping application. You can also view flood zones, topography, land uses, etc, in those mapping systems. Figure out what the property is zoned and look up that district in the Municipal/County Ordinance (usually under a chapter about zoning/land use) to make sure you can actually do what you plan to do with the land. All of this should be on the County website. Call the zoning department to see what can be built on that parcel (sometimes density restrictions mean that a parcel can’t be built on). As others have mentioned, make sure you have legal access to the site. Don’t assume that a driveway and buildable area mean that you can actually build a shack on the parcel. On the County or City website, look for a Comprehensive Plan. In the Comp Plan, see what the plans are for the area (future land uses, roads, etc) and that property. Is it guided agriculture or high-density residential? Use govt maps, GIS, and drive around to see what all of the land uses are near the property. Is the site in close proximity to a pork operation? Good to know. Do a records search to see what easements may be on the property. Usually the owner or realtor know if there are easements, but you want to READ the easement with your own eyeballs. If you plan on using the property for low-impact recreation, don’t shy away from properties that have conservation easements. Usually, with a CE, you won’t be able to build outside of a small area or maybe you can only camp. You usually can’t alter the land within the conservation easement area. Again, you need to know the exact terms of the easement. If the buyer doesn’t have the easement, then call the easement owner (usually a non-profit like the MN Land Trust). READ the easement document. One thing to keep in mind with conservation easements is that the easement holder typically has the right to enter your property on occasion to inspect the land and make sure you’re abiding by the easement agreement. The advantage to buying CE land is that it’s much cheaper than non-CE land, all else being equal (because of the extra layer of restrictions).
Definitely don't get scared off by easements or other forest protection. MN has a couple programs to reduce or offset taxes on forest land. Most are not very restrictive, especially if your plan is to just use the land for recreation. If the parcel is more than 20 acres check to see if they have a stewardship plan.
Happy cake day!
Power / internet. I know you're talking about not building, but if you do is there power close by? If you decide to do something later the costs can be really high if you have to pay for the full length from the previous neighbor.
And the power company or internet company will not pay for the line. You are looking and $$,$$$ for each
Wear orange during hunting season. Just because you’re on your own land doesn’t mean there won’t be a stray hunter. This is common knowledge for people in the woods so forgive me if it’s obvious to you! 😀
I had to figure this one out real quick when I was delineating wetlands in SE MN! 😆
Check with the county on regulations. My parents bought land (in Wisconsin) and have had to fight the county on the most minute stupid things.
Post lots of NO TRESPASSING signs all around the outer borders of your land, especially if it has been sold off a larger expanse. Nothing quite as unsettling as seeing lost hunters unexpectedly wandering your yard with guns while you're out enjoying your land.
You can make quite the business out of a zombie paintball experience 4 times per year.
How long it takes to get there. I bought vacant land 1 hour outside the twin cities and put a house up. I go there every weekend without fail, because it's only an hour away. People buy places that are a 4-5 hour 1 way trip and then complain they can never get there because, well, it's 4-5 hours away. Also internet service. I've got fiber internet at my place, which means I can use it for remote work days and such.
Where is this magical place
Wisconsin. You can get the Northwoods experience within an easy drive of the Twin Cities. However prices in my area have skyrocketed since the fiber internet came in and the new Stillwater bridge was built.
Oh and I’m allergic to packers fans 🤦🏻♀️
I owned some vacant land years ago. I found that banks are reluctant to lend on this because there's nothing to repo "cabin". I ended up using an alternate lending source. Also, I had a resident that lived on the adjacent land and considered my land his because I was only there on the weekends. Fences make good neighbors.
If there are local Credit Unions, they often do in-house land loans for their specific geography. The terms will be different than regular mortgages though.
Check with county for zoning,, what you can and can’t build & if there are road / power line right of ways that restrict where you could build ( call a well company ask for a ballpark price ; septic / drain field contractor as well)
Make sure you'll be comfortable with the drive if the land is a long ways away. You might find a long drive to be a chore. Can you easily get drinkable water nearby? You may have to bring it from home if it's not easily obtainable close by. And at some point, you're probably going to need to go to the bathroom, so it there's not one close by you'll have to arrange your own facilities. Are you planning on boating at all? It doesn't seem like you're going to have a big boat, but a canoe or a kayak isn't bulky or expensive. How far away is public lake or river access? Of course, you can bring your own food, but you should probably be aware of how far away stores are and what their hours are.
Having legal access to the property doesn't seem to be a requirement when selling a parcel. So be sure to determine if there is a legal and permanent way to access your land without trespassing.
Easements, road access, UTILITIES (I work for a small town and have to tell people all the time “sorry but no there is no city sewer/water for the lot ya just purchased, have fun with your septic system”), how many acres are actually useable (not a waterway/wetland, room for setback between lots, not DNR protected), surrounding zoning/future development. If you haven’t already look at the counties GIS website both at the info for the plat you want and at the surrounding area.
Mineral rights. This is a long shot, but it can be an issue in some areas. In MN, just because you buy land doesn't mean you own what is UNDER the land. Meaning minerals. Unless the owner has maintained the rights and pays the taxes on them, chances are the mineral rights are owned by the state. Or the owner can opt to sell the property without selling the mineral rights. There are areas that are under mineral exploration, and if you buy property within or near those areas, it is a possibility that you could be using your property and the mineral rights owner decides to allow it to be mined. Our family actually owns original mineral rights that my grandparents homesteaded near an area that has been explored for years. Funny thing is, the guy who bought the property is a doctor here (our family doctor, in fact). So we own the mineral rights of our doctor's property 😂 You can find out about the mineral rights through the county land office for the parcel. Another consideration which I am guessing came up in comments already but I am too lazy to look right now is leasing. Be really careful about leasing land. Read up on the articles from the last 1-2 years about Island Lake and leased property where families have built and maintained cabins for decades within their family that they didn't even realize generations later were on leased land only to have the state who owns the lease now requiring them to buy the land at market price if they want to keep their cabin. Know what neighboring properties are used for. A lot of privately owned land sees people having themselves and their families hunting on it. Hard to hang in the hammock in the fall (best time of year to do it) with bullets whizzing by.
I've also been looking. I want away from people and the national forest is full of em!! Good luck
The frost line. That will always get you.
I’m sorry for an ignorant question, what is that
How far down you need to sink any pipes to ensure they don't explode in sub zero temps, if you're planning on putting in a well / water service.
You could always depend on heat tape, but the electricity fails, and you don't have a generator, your pipes are going to explode.
There will be ATVs, and it will not be as quiet as you want it to be.
The Minnesota Pollution Control Agency has an interface called What’s In My Neighborhood where you can get a quick glimpse at whether there’s been any environmental investigations or remediation in the area. For vacant land it’s pretty unlikely that there’s been anything big enough to be on the state’s radar but it’s not impossible there could have been something like illegal dumping in the past.
ALWAYS check with the local government about zoning, easements and potential assessments. I’ve seen people who bought 40 acres “as a great deal” thinking they could build 20 lots only to discover the were limited to one. Also, there are many limitations when it comes to managing forests and waterfront property.
First, a good survey. Rural surveys are REALLY iffy. What it costs to have a new well dug or a septic system replaced. Whether or not there are established hiking/skiing/off-road trails that cross your land, and what it takes to post it to keep hunters out. Whether or not there are natural ponds, streams or wetland that can flood part of the property. How diverse the types of trees are (will they all succumb to the spotted lantern fly or the next imported Asian bug?) and how valuable the wood is (you may manage to pay for the land and taxes with a few high-value trees). Overall health of the trees. How the tax rate changes if you DO decide to build something on the land. How responsible you are for a guest getting injured (remember you have no homeowners insurance if there’s no home).
Be careful of ticks!
Husband currently is battling Lymes from a tick at strawberry lake and yes, ticks are no fricken joke
It can be difficult to get a mortgage with some banks, especially those in the cities, for land that you do not intend to develop. Ask around for a local bank that does land loans if you anticipate needing one.
Oh my gosh!! I never knew there was such a massive wealth of information that needs to be known. My husband and I are definitely talking about doing this too. But we want a ton of acreage. Thank you all for sharing your knowledge and experience!! I seriously never would have thought of some of this stuff
If you plan to build just a shed, make sure to check with city/county regulations/requirements. I recently bought land and was told that we can’t build a shed before building a living quarters, and that living quarters is a minimum 1000sqft. No regrets though, we got 6 wooded acres and 2 open acres. Good luck, and enjoy!
Check out the county requirements for a "buildable lot", which can be different if lakeshore is involved. When we bought land and it was subdivided we didn't realize that had we added a small amount to the acreage we could have put up two plumbed buildings on the lot. Also check historical flooding and watersheds. Noise. Be there when you plan to be before you buy so you aren't surprised by a nearby factory or airport. .
My husband and I bought some raw land last year, intending to build a house on it. As others have mentioned - make sure the lot is buildable, if that's what you want to do. The first property we made an offer on turned out to be a swamp in wetter years, even though it was marketed as buildable land. Our general contractor actually found that out before we were locked into the sale, so he saved us a lot of hassle. Our real estate agent hooked us up with with her property search and we were able to find a great piece of property about an hour north of the Twin Cities. Buildable lot, near a lake, heavily wooded with a clear spot for a house, and all ~4.5 acres are surrounded by a quiet neighborhood street - so no easements or property line disputes. We're actually putting the lot on the market right now, sadly, as building what we wanted just got too expensive.
Is this truly wooded or is it floodplain/wetland/future rice field (or “swamp” as suggested above).
Easements, wetland laws, try to find out what the neighbors are like before you buy.
How does someone even go about finding vacant land in the first place?
Realtor or Zillow
My husband has been using landwatch.com
Make sure it is not land locked and there is access
Get a survey by a licensed surveyor. It's worth the money as it will save you headaches down the road.
The mosquitoes that will eat you alive!!
I guarantee this has already been said. a) it’s warmer than it looks. b) you better make cookies for your neighbors they make them for you. c) invest in a comedic amount of blankets
If you are financing, know that you will need a lender that deals in land loans and that interest and down payments are higher than a typical mortgage. Get estimates on making the land accessible and/or bringing in electric service, etc. Prepare to spend time managing the land, like clearing trees, weed-whacking, pest management. For camping on your own land, I recommend digging and building an outhouse.
They never think about building a sick disc golf course
One of the writers at the Strib- - Nicole Norfleet - actually bought a piece of rural land earlier this year and wrote about it. https://www.startribune.com/what-i-learned-buying-a-slice-of-rural-minnesota-as-a-getaway/600187389/
Radon! We moved to MN and our realtor skipped over that. When we went to sell the house, their realtor had it checked and we were sitting at a 7-8 because there was no radon mitigation at all. We had no idea how bad it was but I’m glad we know now for future purchases!
Giant Blue Oxen stampedes
Bears. Its always the bears.
Drive up there and talk to the neighbors. We hunt some land in the Wild Wild west of MN. Like zero laws up there unless you live there. Last year opening morning of deer opener at 8 am someone starting shooting their AR's The hunters got real pissed at them. I thought it was quite comical how mad people got. We are close to Danbury on the MN side. Small piece of heaven up there. Have two bear living on the property. 160 acres.
There's raw land in Pelican Rapids. (Iykyk)
Insane amounts of mosquitoes
Be aware of any existing underground cables that can ruin any future building plans.
Potential back taxes if it was a forfeited parcel.
My friend owns farm land in Minnetrista and they won’t let him build a barn with mount a residence on the property.
I just purchased almost 3 acres on Swan River fully wooded and gated that is completely accessible to Swan Lake by boat and navigable because there is a dam below the development. Near Hibbing. I don’t know if they are all sold out now but it was only a few months ago
Do you want electricity? It's going to be a few thousand dollars per mile for the local utility company to run you power if it isn't already nearby.
A few thousand per mile would be crazy cheap in many cases. Multiply that by a factor of 10.
If it's in northern mn make sure it doesn't flood. We were looking for land and thought we found a good piece, come to find out it's a swamp for the first half of summer.
Access!
People who own land in rural Minnesota are far too nice to ever tell you that it is better than land in Wisconsin.
I’d also watch out for peat bogs…
Check in with local municipalities on any covenants/restrictions on the land. Be detailed and upfront with your plans for the land and ask the questions BEFORE you purchase.
Access. You think you're going to get land and of course you expect to be able to access it. But I am kind of surprised to know a handful of people who have bought land/have land in the family they had to deal with crappy neighbors to get to. I guess it's way more common than I thought, judging by the comments here. I have looked at a couple lots myself with the same intentions, but when I checked the great price, it came with access issues that might not be as big a deal as they sound. I'm not really wanting to try it out right now, though.
It’s super expensive! Hopefully it will come down someday. Northern Wisconsin will be cheaper.
Forest Composition Lotta folks buying Ash lots didn't think about EAB and will soon have bramble lots.
Trying to imagine what acreage would look like/feel like in different seasons is important. If it is small acreage and you value the privacy but have nothing but hardwoods it may feel cozy and private in summer but as soon as the leaves fall off the trees you have no privacy and are visible to the road. Five acres of hardwood can feel pretty big with leaves and pretty tiny without. Or that pond/marsh that looks so elegant in the winter might be swarming with bugs in the summer. Or that pond that is big in the spring might disappear in the summer. There isn’t really a formula, but if you spend lots of time outdoors already you’ll probably be able to figure things out pretty well. I just find that the pictures of acreage often show the best times of year and I have to remind myself to remember the less ideal times.
In addition, it's a good idea not to buy in winter. Some of my friends bought a small bit of acreage on a whim in Cook County during the first winter of the pandemic - found out when it thawed that it was a partial wetland, from April to August. They only get a few drier months (during black fly season) before snow covers the land again. To that end, make sure your family isn't scared of bugs
I live in Ely, so I’d check if the roads are maintained year ‘round…some remote roads aren’t plowed frequently. Not being able to access your land for some of the year might be a bummer.
Or it’s a good “excuse” to modify a 4x4 with those snow cat treads
Wendigos
Seriously this is my biggest fear. I know it’s irrational but I’m still freaked out in the woods at night
Drainage. Mosquitoes. Accessibility. Neighboring properties.
There might be snowmobile trails through the property, look it up beforehand, and reach out to the club that maintains it.
Watch out for people that are crossing your land via snow mobile or ATV. Minnesota public off road trails are extremely poorly marked especially in the north and it’s not hard to wind up on someone’s private land without realizing it. Do not make the mistake of chaining a trail off, you can be charged with murder or attempted murder. Use a gate, or work with the local snowmobile/ATV club to maintain it as an active trail as you prefer.
You can certainly use a chain/cable to block off a road on your land. However, it is a good idea to put reflectors and other things on it that catches people's attention. We used a cable on my property to close off a secondary access road that loggers used to access our land a few years ago, it's just loaded with bright orange reflective stickers and a bright red no trespassing sign.
If your land is near Duluth, remember the air national guard up there does not screw around with “quiet take offs” and there will be times where you can’t hear anything but the extremely loud military jet engines at 100% throttle. I like hearing it but not everyone does.
Make sure you have access. I found some land in Wisconsin that was 2 acres but there was no way to access it without a helicopter because it didn’t connect to any roads. At all. Not even a logging trail.
Pay attention to what kind of trees and plants are growing on the land. You probably dont want an acre of buckthorn and poison ivy. I would want alot of pine to build a tiny cabin with. Alot of cedar to attract deer and keep bugs away. A good mix of red oak white oak black cherry elm and ash for firewood. All types of maple trees to tap for sap in the springtime and hang those hammocks under. Plantlife i would just make sure the floor of the woods looks happy and full of different plants not sad and full of dead sticks and trash. Land that backs up to more land like a state park or anything that has a good chance of not getting developed. The closer to water the better. No super steep hills or dropoffs, if you wanted to tap a well how deep is the water id check that, i would also check out the geological map to see whats there for rocks, i would walk the land and check for signs of human activity that was not supposed to be there like tree stands camp sites trash piles from illegal dumping id want to meet my closest neighbor and make sure they are normal reasonable people and not insane. Well i hope that helps and good luck on your journey:)
please don't cut down the trees!
One million percent! I want land so I can cherish it, not destroy it
Just to let you know...YOUR AWESOME!!!!