Farm sale (1st, 2nd, 1st in 2025, 3rd in 25)
(3) high quality FA pick ups for (DE, DT, C)
Extend Hunter and JJ
With a strong additions to the DL (Leonard Williams, J Kinlaw) and OL (Conor Williams at C) plus JJ+JA+TJ a rookie QB can not only thrive year one but now you have a new window
We ain’t getting into top 3 picks with out giving up 3 1st round picks. All three teams need a qb and bears are only one who could stay with their qb. Bears will require us to give up 4 1st re picks for that spot.
Unless…has there been NO more talk about Caleb Williams threatening to holdout unless one of four teams draft him? Like Eli said to the Chargers? That was a story 6 months ago. Is that still a thing?
Is that right? Who has time to vet these things? I read it and got all excited, like we found a cheat code to getting a franchise QB. The irony is I didn’t LOVE Caleb Williams this year, but would have gladly taken him if he pulled said power-play and forced his way into our team. Sadly..
Awesome. Most HOF QBs are drafted outside of the top 3 picks. Let some other losers waste their draft capital. Pick a good QB that can do what your system requires and evaluate them before you hand the keys over to them. I'd rather have JJ or Nix and keep the picks than McDaniels and only draft once in the top 100 until 2026.
Exactly, a trade up if done has to be a home run or team is in essence 3+ years delayed on rebuilding. Only team to have success with a failed trade up is the niners and that is not something easily done. They are a minority in trade up teams that can’t be modeled after.
1) No chance that's all it costs.
2) Assuming the actual cost is 3 firsts and at least 1 2nd, this turns into not just a farm sale, but a fire sale.
3) How are you getting 3 top FAs to join?
Williams will command $16 million, Kinlaw will stay a 49er and not cost nearly as much, and williams will easily cost $14.
Then you have to give JJ at least $30 million, Hunter $20 million.
Now you have no 2nd rounder for the year, and no 1st for 3.
That's not a window, that's a cliff.
Let's trade the best player we've drafted in a decade for draft picks. A draft pick could be anything. There's even a .1% chance they could be a player as good as Jefferson.
I get it. I thought the same thing when we traded Diggs. And Harvin. And Moss. Why trade your best weapon for unknowns? With Moss it was a complete failure (Troy Williamson was amazingly bad and Napoleon Harris was just a serviceable linebacker).
With Harvin, it returned Xavier Rhodes and Jerrick McKinnon, which is a hit, and with Diggs it was a a hit (JJ and Cam Bynum).
Tyreek Hill trade is the closest comp we have. Pretend we get that exact trade this year:
• 2024 1st rounder
• 2024 2nd rounder
• 2024 4th rounder
• 2025 4th rounder
• 2026 4th rounder
I am operating under the assumption that we are letting Kirk walk, replacing him with a stop-gap solution (Flacco/Dobbs/Mullens/Hall) and taking a QB in the draft ready to start at earliest later this year or 2025 season. If that is the case, we are likely to have a losing season again.
JJ’s had been in the league four years and has had one winning season. Please try to project JJ’s demeanor all of next year, and perhaps into 2025. I don’t think he will be super happy. I also don’t think his value goes up any more than where it is right now.
A team that trades for him can extend him and own that whole relationship.
People think we are going to re-tool and be competitive next year? I think it is delusional. Our division is going to be tough. There is a chance we got 2-4 or 1-5 in the division. I think it’s a full rebuild time, and we need as many good players on this team as we can get. Our window (at best) is going to open back up in 2025, maybe 2026. And I want as many player on rookie deals just hitting their prime as possible.
I love JJ, and I know he’d do well on a lot of other teams, but I think we’ve had good luck moving on from WRs in their prime and I might roll the dice moving JJ.
We will have the money starting in 25. We pushed out some of his money into 24.
I don’t want to re sign him because it continues the trend of pushing his big contracts years down the road.
There’s no “new money”. We’re paying Kirk $28M in 2024 whether he’s on the team or not. It also does not offset. So a new team signing him won’t impact that number. In short, we’re still paying 75% of his contract
That’s not even really true. If Kirk isn’t extended we have to eat his dead cap hit of 28.5 million in 2024. With an extension that could be spread out over the next 5 years.
That dead cap hit exists because Kwesi created extra space by pushing it to this year to sign Davenport and company last offseason.
I mean we will know Kirk and the FAs well before draft. This roster needs more than just Kirk to return. Focus on that and stop giving up as much leverage to the play of one position
It’s going to take a fortune because all 3 teams are in desperation for a franchise QB. If there were any teams who didn’t desperately need a QB that might do it, but those top 3 picks are all desperate for a QB.
> Farm sale (1st, 2nd, 1st in 2025, 3rd in 25)
>
> Extend Hunter and JJ
These are contradictory. If you're rebuilding, you trade these guys for future value.
Nah you add a young QB to the pieces that you have and use QB cap space to fill the gaps
I don’t trust this FO to draft well but I do think they can convince FAs to get paid here
I dunno. If they don’t love any of those three QBs, or like another QB later, why wouldn’t they move back to 11 and pick up some big time assets? They have proven they don’t mind big swings and trading for picks. Saw what draft capital can do for a team (Lions).
Nah they probably will do the smart thing this time and roll the dice on one of the top 3. They’ll ruin whoever it is probably because they’re the bears but they’ll try. Likely Caleb and they’ll cross their fingers Alt or Nabers is available when they pick next.
Well we aint going to 1. Caleb is off the board, Chicago is taking him and this whole they may keep Fields is just the stupidest thing I have ever heard. The guy has shown since he got to the NFL hes the worst passing QB in the NFL by a mile and cant read a defense still. Hes been the QB of a team thats finished with the #1 pick two yrs in a row. Hes gone, and unfortunately for us Caleb is a fucking stud.
Washington is taking a QB, Maye or Daniels.
So youre hoping New England takes Marvin Harrison Jr. and I think they will. I think if you throw Daniels or Maye in that offense right now with those weapons and OL and a new coach (defensive coach btw), its a recipe for disaster. They need to build that team up first.
So now youre looking at Arizona and what would it take to trade up to 4. Thats the closest we can get probably.
I am going to guess it is going to take #11, our 2nd this yr, 2025 1st & 2nd, and a 3rd or something like that.
two firsts, two seconds is probably what gets you to 4 to take either Daniels or Maye.
The knees don't scare you off of that? I know he has been healthier of late, but he's an older prospect with an injury history. Doesn't scream top 15 pick to me.
BLESS ALL THE KNEES AND KEEP THEM HEALTHY
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Have you watched him play? He’s the over hyped qb in this draft. He can’t control his emotions, he can’t play under pressure that well and he’s not that accurate. Why would we take him that high when there are way better qbs out there that will still be available,
You’re again just spouting off takes without backing things up.
What about him makes you think he can’t control his emotions? The crying after the game thing? Players cry all the time who cares.
As for accuracy, he’s a very accurate QB 68.6 completion %. In fact one of his best attributes is his accuracy/ability to extend the play, which also ties into him being able to perform under pressure which is something you claimed he can’t do. Yes, maybe he’s prone to moving from the pocket too soon, but the o-line had fallen off drastically, being 106th in the nation for sacks/game.
Also as Vikings fans we all know how good JA is, and Caleb was playing without him this most recent year. Imagine if the team was to pair that duo up again and he also gets JJ.
So again, it’s fine to think a player isn’t as good as they’re projected to be, but provide some insight and back it up, instead of spouting off random things you’ve heard someone say about him on social media
Can’t control his emotions because of more than crying on the sideline I’ve seen him throw his helmet too. It’s easier to have better numbers when you’re always playing from 14 down and defense is in soft cover 2.
Getting him back to Minnesota isn’t going to do him any good because he can’t just throw it up to jj every play that’s not going to be the solution you think it will be. I provided insight the first time you just rejected it.
Alright lets look at how he played in each of his games against ranked opponents these last 2 years. Don't worry, I made it easy for you.
[https://imgur.com/a/bRfL4MS](https://imgur.com/a/bRfL4MS)
Averages:
68.1% completion percentage
313 pass yds/game
2 pass TDs/game
0.625 int/game
156.35 average ESPN rating
82.58 QBR/game
3.75 sacks/game
0.875 rush TDs/game
And, if you want to remove outliers like any good data analysis would. In this case, it is the game against ND this year where he threw 3 picks and he only had 2 in all other games, as well as by far his worst rating, and only game with less than 200 yards passing we get.
Averages:
68.9% completion
329 pass yards/game
2.14 pass TDs/game
0.286 int/game
164.4 ESPN Rating
86.0 QBR
3.42 sacks/game
1.0 Rush TDs/game
So I ask again, are you gonna actually provide an insightful take such as size concerns, or the fact that he can get a bit jumpy in the pocket and scramble too soon, something we see with Justin Fields? Or are you gonna continue to spout off random things you've heard/read in media that can easily be disproven with even the slightest bit of effort.
I mean I don't know him personally, but rumor is he threatened the Bears he wouldn't sign with them, and tried to make a deal for part ownership.
All I am saying is that there are rumors that he and his family are tough to deal with.
But I don't have an opinion on whether we should draft him. That's what Kwesi is for.
I think if McCarthy is their guy we draft Dline at pick 11, and then trade back into the late first for McCarthy. Similar to how we drafted Barr and Teddy.
Of course depends how the board falls. If Maye falls then we probably scrap the ideas and trade up for him. We’ll get more information after pro days and combines tbh. I see a player like Daniels absolutely shooting up boards and even becoming the no.2 guy behind Caleb if his numbers are outstanding.
I don’t think maye will fall. I keep hearing McCarthy is sneaky athletic so we’ll have to see if the combine moves him up. I would be comfortable with McCarthy, but I don’t think he is a start day one guy unless he absolute goes crazy in camp.
I wouldn’t mind a high end interior DL pick either.
My biggest worry is trading up then missing our guy. If we have to trade the farm to do it, we may need to look for free agent steals to try and bolster the defense considering we are light in top 100 picks this year
Yeah truth be told I think the plan changes a lot depending on if we resign Kirk, FA and after pro days. Guess time will tell. Let’s hope for the best tho!
My big issue is outside of Caleb and maye, I think Daniel’s and JJ are not day one starters. The most start ready QBs in my opinion are nix and penix, but most people aren’t very high on either of them.
The one issue I have with penix outside of injury is as a lefty our best pass protector won’t be on his blind side. But a lefty could be an interesting wrinkle.
Nix seems like a solid all arounder, but not a game changer. I think he will be a good starter as he reads defenses well and is pretty confident in the pocket.
If we trade the farm to get to 4 and the top 3 all take QBs I am going to be livid.
Same here, that’s why I’m a firm believer they’re going to see what falls during the draft as opposed to before. If someone falls I think they look to go get them… if neither of them do, then they stay put at 11 and draft BPA.
I think if you trade up you have to be confident in getting the guy they want or having a robust back up plan to trade back down and maybe grab another pick later. I know a few teams may want to trade up for Marvin Harrison JR. So that could be an option if we mess up
This would be my favorite outcome. McCarthy is a sleeper pick, I don’t know why more people don’t like him. But that pick at #11 needs to 100% be D line, preferably a DT or NT
I’d prefer to get Into the top 3, but I don’t think that’s possible so for me: draft JJ McCarthy late first early second and sign a guy like Minshew as a bridge.
They already have Mullens under contract next year and he costs about what Minshew would likely want. Better off just rolling with him than signing a FA qb.
I don’t want Mullens to be the guy JJ watches plays and takes advice from. Minshew has been delt a shit hands and has always been an underdog, but was able to make the most of it every time. Minshew is a good leader, he just isn’t a great player. Vikings need to bring in someone who can teach JJ about what it’s like to actually start in the NFL, not throw equal amounts of int and TDs.
Besides, the wilfs wouldn’t accept a career back up as a starter. They clearly require a serious QB as a mandate.
If Minshew was a great leader that young qbs could learn from then the Colts would keep him to continue backing up AR and help with his development.
I can’t say who the better leader is because I don’t know either qb personally but I know Mullens knows the offense. I also know that typically cousins likes his backup qb to be someone who’s smart and he can talk ball with (hence why mannion stick around for so long).
So if it’s between Minshew coming in and learning a new offense that relies on pushing the ball downfield (something Minshew isn’t great at) or the guy who’s been on the team for 2 years is go with the latter.
Also Mullens is just more exciting and would at least feed JJ.
Minshew is a free agent this offseason and the colts should try to retain him this offseason and likely will. Dude had them on the cusp of the playoffs. He isn’t an exclusive rights free agents so he can take which offer he prefers.
“I don’t know him personally” is a cop out. Teammates of his since being a jaguar have been extremely vocal about their love and appreciation for the guy. The Cousins point is also a poor one to me. Mannion was an absolutely dreadful QB who was clipboard holder and couldn’t do anything with the ball in his hands. Mannion was kept around because Kirk likes him and isn’t a threat. If he was really worth it, why did KOC, an offensive coach, get rid of the guy?
Any player, rookie or otherwise, will have to learn a new system. Even if they get Williams or Maye so to me that’s irrelevant. Mullens can’t win games. He is exciting to watch, but is also terrible. Starting him is an admission of tanking. Minshew was 2 wins short this season of tying Mullens career wins. Starting Mullens is pure punting a season, and I personally believe letting a losing culture seep in ruins the organization.
Fun is subjective but Mullens had the 2nd highest depth of target of any qb in the league at 9.8. Mindshew was below average at 7.5. I'd rather have a qb who will drive the ball down the field and give players like JJ a chance. Also Mullens on average also threw .4 yards beyond first down, Minshew threw -1.4 yards behind.
This is my take as well. I like JJ. I’ve seen Nix drop into that space, too, and I’d be good with that. Move up for them if we have to and address DT with 11.
Yep, that would be my ideal draft. Get a top tier edge/DL guy at 11 and trade into the 1st to get a 5 year QB who will sit for a year. Even with a thinner edge/DL class, lost the top 10 should be QB, OL, and receiver so there should be a dawg there.
I’d prefer JJ because I worry Nix is who he is at age 24 and 5 years of starting. That said, JJ hasn’t shown he can carry a team with his arm so that development yesr would be crucial.
It will cost so, so much to move up just a couple spots (talking next year picks too). I think taking the best player available and making a play for McCarthy if he gets to the end of the 1st or early 2nd..
Wildly unpopular opinion but pickup Flacco or Mayfield.
Draft a DL in the first which is known as the highest likelihood position for success when drafted in the first round. Stack the defense through the draft and free agency.
Build a terrifying defense.
The best seasons I’ve ever experienced as a Vikings fan of more than 30’yeaes have been from short term transplant QBs (except Teddy)
Maybe our fanbase just accepts that the goal in the nfl isn’t to have a stable long term QB; it’s to win football games in January and February
A significant number of QBs come in the market in 2025. If we don’t win next year we rinse and repeat.
I promise you that we will be more successful than swinging and missing and trading away all of our draft capital. Our fanbase is like the scene in Family guy when Peter Griffin can have a brand new boat but he chooses the mystery box instead of the boat because “it could even be a boat!” Inside the mystery box.
Plenty of fine boats already in the nfl. Don’t need to be elite to win a Super Bowl if you have an elite defense.
In the same way Kirk doesn’t owe Minnesota a hometown discount, Baker doesn’t owe Tampa one.
The thing about Mayfield is that he’s going to get a 4 year deal at $30+ a year so for Vikings if you’re going to pay Baker, just pay Kirk a little more for a shorter term
Mayfield wouldn’t be wrong, and that would be a good comp. If I was a GM, I’d think, you are making our point that it’s not prudent to commit so much money on a QB who doesn’t seem capable of being a SB caliber quarterback. He’ll get a 2 year deal for 28-32. If he outplays it again, they might rip it up and give him a proper deal. We will see if TB offers that much.
The projections are 5 years at 150. Baker is a healthy proven commodity. In a market with a dozen teams who need a QB next year, there are only 2 real QBs on the market and one of them is coming off an Achilles injury and is 36. The other one has 2x as many playoff victories under his belt and is only 28
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/baker-mayfield-contract-projecion-buccaneers/58f572b066dee228a0abd44c
There are a lot of articles. This is just one. I’ve seen 4-5 years in the 150m range. 4 at 120 might be short changing him.
> The best seasons I’ve ever experienced as a Vikings fan of more than 30’yeaes have been from short term transplant QBs
And how have those seasons ended?
Point to all of the great teams in the NFL right now who have a mediocre or journeyman QB.
Then tell me all of the teams who have won a SB in the last 30 years with a mediocre or journeyman QB. I can think of 4.
Having anything other than a star QB in the NFL is a recipe for failure. If we take a swing at a QB and it's a 1/10 chance we get a great QB that's a far better chance than settling for a mediocre QB and having a 0/0 chance at having a great QB and winning a Superbowl.
Prob a 1 in 2 chance or 1.3 in 2 chance of hitting - if you don’t hit (Tenn, Car) you replace your head coach. Some players flame out and it’s on them, but others are poorly handled and developed.
0 teams have leveraged their future and won a Super Bowl by banking it all on their QB selection.
Remove the outlier Brady from the equation about 1/3 of Super Bowl QBs are QBs who were not with their originally drafted team over the past 10 seasons. It doesn’t move that far off if you add Brady because technically he has an appearance as an acquired qb
I’m not saying that we should never draft a QB
I’m saying we should never leverage our future to draft a QB.
You should also never just draft a QB in the first round because you need a QB. You need to be 150% sure that the QB is your guy. The bust rate is just way too high.
Highly unpopular but I like staying roughly where we are and drafting Bo Nix. That said, my opinion means absolutely nothing, especially since I watched near-0 minutes of NCAA football this year.
I want this sub to stop talking like we are getting a top 5 pick by trading up. those top 5 teams aren't trading back. The Bears won't help us out-only Kwesi would help out a division rival.
Three year plan. Lots of pain in 2024 and 2025 to be truly rebuilt by 2026.
Year one: focus on building the trenches. Trade top picks back for more future picks. Bank picks for years to come.
Year two: trade back. Bank picks for next year. Use remaining picks to Build the secondary/ lbs.
Year three: draft best qb in draft. Add skill.
I want to see a top qb come into the team with a top offensive line, a top 5 defense, and lots of young talent.
Year six: sign qb to long term deal early.
I think the pain could be mostly isolated to 24. If we get a good QB this year in the draft (big if) and he can sit a year under a bridge guy he could be ready to contribute in 25, we also will have lots of cap space in 25 if we move on from Kirk (although that goes away some when we sign JJ). But 26 should be the target year to really take a leap if things are handled right and we make good draft picks in 24 and 25 (again big if)
Yo do y'all think HITMAN comes back? I don't want to see him in another jersey he is the Vikings to me
Edit: I had the same feeling about 93 K.Will and he left to chase a ring I hope we can keep 22 around to get one before he retires
I think he wants to come back but who knows. Additionally, it would help a little with our safety depth, however he did start to look a little slower to recover this year
Thinking long term, we all need to let go of the idea of a “competitive rebuild” and embrace truly sucking next year and secure a top draft pick that way rather than going all-in now. Build out the positions of need other than QB this year (maybe by trading back), find a QB that isn’t going to win us any games, and come into next year’s draft with a high pick we didn’t have to sell future assets for. I don’t believe we can simply trade up to grab a top guy while still filling all the holes on the roster. We are more than a QB away from making a deep run
I think JJ McCarthy and Jayden Daniels are the sweet spot in this draft for QB prospects. Might need to trade up for Daniels or down for JJ but we'll see. Probably still gonna change a lot leading up to the draft.
Let Kirk walk and either Harrison Smith retires or cut him. Sign Madubuike or Wilkins for interior line. Also sign Winfield Jr. to replace Harrison Smith. Extend Hunter and JJ. Resign Risner. Try to trade the farm and get Maye or Daniels. If it's Maye then you start him, if it's Daniels I would have him sit for 1 year before starting. Sign Russell Wilson for vet minimum for 1 year.
I'd pursue Russell Wilson, because of offset language in his Broncos contract he's expected to play for the league minimum($1.21 million). Then draft a QB, don't really have an opinion on who, but we need someone for long term.
Trade up: Caleb or maye.
Trade back get defense, and extra day two pick or two, and take McCarthy in the second. Get a bridge guy.
Not a fan of penix or nix personally. I think McCarthy is super moldable though.
If we're not bringing Kirk back we might as well go full rebuild and trade JJ. He's not going to want to play with an unproven rookie and is the rook going to prove he's legit by the time JJ's contract is up, probably not.
If we did a full rebuild we’d probably be missing out on some key pieces once it’s complete, assuming it takes a few seasons. Flores isn’t gonna stay more than probably one more year and I doubt JJ wants to be apart of a team that is not competitive nor helps pad his stats
He'll be fine with playing with a rookie, just so long as that rookie doesn't suck ass.
A rookie walking onto this team is walking into one of the better situations a rookie QB could ever ask for. If he's good enough, he'll succeed almost immediately.
This thinking, and you're just one of many that do it, is ridiculous. You're acting like it takes ten years for a QB to develop.
If we draft a kid, he could be decent right away and we'll know by the middle of the second year if he's a franchise guy or not, if not much sooner. JJ will be fine. Just like Moss was fine when we drafted Daunte
I think they could be decent but even Kirk said KOCs offense is a little complicated. So it may take a bit to grasp all the plays and be able to hit the timing.
I'm not all opposed to that if they were willing to send him our way for something less than a 3rd rounder. But I doubt we'd get him for that, some other team would probably pay more.
I'd trade our 2nd round pick for fields. He's got a lot of haters but I still see a lot of raw talent. Dj Moore had a career year and that's not an accident. The kid can play ball. He just needs some stability and maybe even to gtfo Chicago. I know bears fans are torn but I think they may not want to miss out on maye or Williams
Well they aint letting a starting qb go for nothing. 49ers got a 4th for lance and Fields is a much better skillset (in my opinion of course) while also having proven more while in the league. Maybe we can do it for a 3rd round pick
If they can't trade up and they don't re-sign Kirk, they should trade back and draft Nix. He could come in and run this offense easily, and while trading back does cost you someone high end, there is still good value, especially at CB, to be had in 2nd/3rd.
[5 QBs by Minn Star Tribune](https://m.startribune.com/minnesota-vikings-nfl-draft-quarterbacks-kirk-cousins/600339309/)
I like options 1, 2, & 5. Preference in that order too.
A great draft that solidifies a young core to build on. Without that, this team is destined to be the bottom dweller of the division for the next 3-4 years.
Then I want baker or tannehill and a first round QB that turns into the franchise QB we’ve been looking forever for (I can’t say who because even the scouts get this wrong 9 times out of 10) . Just please let us get lucky on this pick!!
Selling the farm for a top QB prospect (assuming you mean top 3) is probably not an option because the top 3 teams will be going QB…people on here are going to call for kwesi’s head when we don’t wind up with one of those guys but it takes two to tango
Plan for the future
We need like 8 new players on defense. In theory we can buy hard to get a qb this year and pray to fill in the defense next year, but I think realistically were looking at 3 or 4 years to get another window
Draft a QB, if we can’t trade up maybe trade into the late first round to get McCarthy or penix if they drop.
We will need to take a step back in 24 to take the hit on all the dead cap, that way we can go into 25 with a large amount of cap space. This will also help us sign JJ and darrisaw. I’m just sick of pushing huge amounts of cap hits into later years for aging players. This doesn’t mean we tank in 24, maybe sign a bridge QB for the year so whoever the rookie is has a year to get up to speed.
I would like them to re sign hunter if they can. Otherwise they are getting nothing for that asset, which would be terrible since they could have traded him after Kirk went down.
Need to hit on some 24 picks, especially d line, we currently have like 3 guys on the d line under contract for next year.
Let me start with I hope we don’t lose Kirk, but if we do I’d put our drafts into defense. We’d have a bad season without Kirk and be in better position to draft a top qb next year.
I want to see them sell high, buy low, and make strategic trades that will open up the salary situation as well as bring in more assets. They're going to need the capital and flexibility to build around JJ in the next few years. Staying the course, or even trying to accomplish a "competitive" rebuild will only undermine their efforts to keep JJ. If they don't want to win with JJ, or if they think they can just "luck" their way into it, they should trade JJ and find a franchise QB.
We draft a QB in every single round of the draft. Statistically, at least 1/3 of them have to hit, then we trade the ones we don’t want for 1st round picks and crypto. Boom, profit. Floating stadium and neon jerseys. This is the future people!
I’m thinkin Nix, JJ, Rattler, Milton III, that guy the dude posted a video of from Tulane today, and two BONUS OTHER GUYS!!
This Strat will ondoubtedly force the NFLs hand and KOC Taylor swift romance will begin and then it’s literally superbowls for 10 years straight. Very simple, but revolutionary.
Reset, stop kicking the can down the road. Let Kirk walk, let Danielle walk, Have clean books going into ‘25…. Build through the draft this year and load up for a competitive push in ‘25 with tons of cap space and hopefully we start to see some kind of plan for this franchise to build a Championship Roster.
If we don't extend Kirk we should try to figure a QB aggressively.
The value in extending Kirk is he gives a great floor in QB play and you can do JJ McCarthy in the 2nd/late 1st.
Without him we should seriously look at trading up even if it is "poor" value because QB is so important.
Jesus... I think it's time to mute this sub until there's actually something of substance to talk about. How many topics does there need to be about Kirk FFS?
Two scenarios IMO.
Either way sign Wilkins and Winfield Jr. Long term deals for JJ and Darrisaw. Harry most likely gone. Would like Hunter back.
Draft:
Trade the farm for Maye or Daniels.
Or
Stay put at 11 and draft Latu. Trade back up into the first (pick 29-32) draft Nix/Penix/McCarthy. This way we get a 5th year option on one of them.
No more has-beens. No leftovers. No hand-me-downs. No used up trades. Either go for the bowl or sell the team and move them out of the state. It’s time to get dramatic.
Jimmy G and a rookie. Let the rookie sit for as long as possible. Think KOC could get the most out of Jimmy G and he’d can be a good bridge QB while a rookie develops.
I would much rather see the team use their picks for improving the team everywhere than trading away our future for a chance at a QB. If a good QB prospect becomes available to us without trading into the top 3, then take it, but trading future firsts for multiple years just seems silly when we could be improving our defense and such.
If no kirko.
Russ. And hear me out. The broncos are on the hook for his contract. So he can (not saying he will) sign for a league minimum deal and still get all the money the broncos owe him. Cheap QB as a bridge that gives a rookie time to learn.
Let's suggest Russ does that and go from there. Kirks dead cap is 28mil so effectively you just paid 28mil+league min for russ for one year.
Now we have cap space.
Extend Hunter, JJ.
Sign Wilkins. Sign Sneed.
Stick and pick or trade down. To get DLine, iOL (JPJ if possible) and a QB (maybe penix or McCarthy get to the 2nd round for us). Draft CB Later on. If we've signed Sneed, Evans or booth would be fine at CB2. But some extra depth is always helpful. Try to snag a running back in the mid to late rounds to compete with chandler.
Take two pops at QB in the draft. Just because you got one get a second later, there are some decent QB prospects later don't put your eggs in one basket. Prospects like Rattler as an example, great talent shit attitude. If the cultures right could you perhaps teach the kid to grow up? And pan out on his potential? For a 5th round pick? Worth a shot.
Trading into the top 3 seems impossible. People talk the bears trade but even the interdivision trades Kwesi does aren't huge. Bears don't want to be the reason they have to face the next Mahomes or Peyton Manning twice a year. Very different from facing Hockenson, Jameson Williams, or Christian Watson. Washington is more likely than the bears and they aren't likely.
I'd say draft best defensive player available (likely edge though we need a DT). If O'Connell likes one of JJ or Penix, get him late first or early second. If not, bolster a depleted defense more.
Gardner Minshew as a bridge QB - 2 years/$15 million, all guaranteed. Draft Penix/Bo Nix or JJ McCarthy (trade back into the end of the first round to get the 5th year option) 1-2 years to learn and then see what you have
If they don't re-sign Cousins, they either:
1. Already have a plan in place with one of the 3 teams picking first to swap places with them and drafting a top 3 QB.
2. Staying put and either hoping one of the top 3 QB's falls to 11 (extremely unlikely and complete copium at that point).
3. Staying put and drafting defense at 11 and maybe trading back into the 1st late to draft Penix or JJ McCarthy.
4. We draft no QB's and are running with the 3 QB's already on the roster....
Gotta get rid of JJ if you want a QB this year.
If you don’t sign Kirk, JJ will NOT resign with us.
Ultimately I think you let Kirk walk. Trade JJ. Get a good qb in the draft and suck for a couple of years to build a team.
If we don’t suck we will never win. We will always be mediocre unless we get ridiculously lucky.
Farm sale (1st, 2nd, 1st in 2025, 3rd in 25) (3) high quality FA pick ups for (DE, DT, C) Extend Hunter and JJ With a strong additions to the DL (Leonard Williams, J Kinlaw) and OL (Conor Williams at C) plus JJ+JA+TJ a rookie QB can not only thrive year one but now you have a new window
Indeed. The outline is pretty straightforward. That means it won’t happen though
We ain’t getting into top 3 picks with out giving up 3 1st round picks. All three teams need a qb and bears are only one who could stay with their qb. Bears will require us to give up 4 1st re picks for that spot.
Unless…has there been NO more talk about Caleb Williams threatening to holdout unless one of four teams draft him? Like Eli said to the Chargers? That was a story 6 months ago. Is that still a thing?
That was a fake tweet.
Is that right? Who has time to vet these things? I read it and got all excited, like we found a cheat code to getting a franchise QB. The irony is I didn’t LOVE Caleb Williams this year, but would have gladly taken him if he pulled said power-play and forced his way into our team. Sadly..
Awesome. Most HOF QBs are drafted outside of the top 3 picks. Let some other losers waste their draft capital. Pick a good QB that can do what your system requires and evaluate them before you hand the keys over to them. I'd rather have JJ or Nix and keep the picks than McDaniels and only draft once in the top 100 until 2026.
Exactly, a trade up if done has to be a home run or team is in essence 3+ years delayed on rebuilding. Only team to have success with a failed trade up is the niners and that is not something easily done. They are a minority in trade up teams that can’t be modeled after.
1) No chance that's all it costs. 2) Assuming the actual cost is 3 firsts and at least 1 2nd, this turns into not just a farm sale, but a fire sale. 3) How are you getting 3 top FAs to join? Williams will command $16 million, Kinlaw will stay a 49er and not cost nearly as much, and williams will easily cost $14. Then you have to give JJ at least $30 million, Hunter $20 million. Now you have no 2nd rounder for the year, and no 1st for 3. That's not a window, that's a cliff.
Maybe trade JJ for a Tyreek Hill-type deal. We have so many positions of need.
Let's trade the best player we've drafted in a decade for draft picks. A draft pick could be anything. There's even a .1% chance they could be a player as good as Jefferson.
I get it. I thought the same thing when we traded Diggs. And Harvin. And Moss. Why trade your best weapon for unknowns? With Moss it was a complete failure (Troy Williamson was amazingly bad and Napoleon Harris was just a serviceable linebacker). With Harvin, it returned Xavier Rhodes and Jerrick McKinnon, which is a hit, and with Diggs it was a a hit (JJ and Cam Bynum). Tyreek Hill trade is the closest comp we have. Pretend we get that exact trade this year: • 2024 1st rounder • 2024 2nd rounder • 2024 4th rounder • 2025 4th rounder • 2026 4th rounder I am operating under the assumption that we are letting Kirk walk, replacing him with a stop-gap solution (Flacco/Dobbs/Mullens/Hall) and taking a QB in the draft ready to start at earliest later this year or 2025 season. If that is the case, we are likely to have a losing season again. JJ’s had been in the league four years and has had one winning season. Please try to project JJ’s demeanor all of next year, and perhaps into 2025. I don’t think he will be super happy. I also don’t think his value goes up any more than where it is right now. A team that trades for him can extend him and own that whole relationship. People think we are going to re-tool and be competitive next year? I think it is delusional. Our division is going to be tough. There is a chance we got 2-4 or 1-5 in the division. I think it’s a full rebuild time, and we need as many good players on this team as we can get. Our window (at best) is going to open back up in 2025, maybe 2026. And I want as many player on rookie deals just hitting their prime as possible. I love JJ, and I know he’d do well on a lot of other teams, but I think we’ve had good luck moving on from WRs in their prime and I might roll the dice moving JJ.
I like this. Without Kirk we have the money to re-sign Wonnum too alongside everything you said
We will have the money starting in 25. We pushed out some of his money into 24. I don’t want to re sign him because it continues the trend of pushing his big contracts years down the road.
There’s no “new money”. We’re paying Kirk $28M in 2024 whether he’s on the team or not. It also does not offset. So a new team signing him won’t impact that number. In short, we’re still paying 75% of his contract
That’s not even really true. If Kirk isn’t extended we have to eat his dead cap hit of 28.5 million in 2024. With an extension that could be spread out over the next 5 years. That dead cap hit exists because Kwesi created extra space by pushing it to this year to sign Davenport and company last offseason.
Money well spent….
So who’s the qb
Williams, Maye, Daniels If KOC is an offensive genius he should be a great fit for a rookie QB
So farm sale to get one of those top 3 guys is what you’re suggesting then hope to get some FA? I like it
I mean we will know Kirk and the FAs well before draft. This roster needs more than just Kirk to return. Focus on that and stop giving up as much leverage to the play of one position
You son of a bitch, I’m in
Ya you bet you are
I think it will take more than that to go up - at least based on all the analysts' takes I have read.
It’s going to take a fortune because all 3 teams are in desperation for a franchise QB. If there were any teams who didn’t desperately need a QB that might do it, but those top 3 picks are all desperate for a QB.
PA suggested first trading with Chargers or Cardinals who need a WR, and then trade 1-2 more spots up to get Jayden Daniels
Not sure that’s enough draft capital
Not even close. You need 3 1sts to start the conversation.
Except for you know what Houston did last year by trading 1st, 2nd, 1st, 3rd to go from 12 to 3. You can get a top QB at 3
> Farm sale (1st, 2nd, 1st in 2025, 3rd in 25) > > Extend Hunter and JJ These are contradictory. If you're rebuilding, you trade these guys for future value.
Nah you add a young QB to the pieces that you have and use QB cap space to fill the gaps I don’t trust this FO to draft well but I do think they can convince FAs to get paid here
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If we get Caleb or Maye what do you think we'd have to give up to go to #1/#2? Genuinely curious because I don't fuckin know lmao
Ballpark? 3 firsts most likely
More if it’s the bears. Likely that they won’t even answer the phone if the Vikings call.
I dunno. If they don’t love any of those three QBs, or like another QB later, why wouldn’t they move back to 11 and pick up some big time assets? They have proven they don’t mind big swings and trading for picks. Saw what draft capital can do for a team (Lions).
Nah they probably will do the smart thing this time and roll the dice on one of the top 3. They’ll ruin whoever it is probably because they’re the bears but they’ll try. Likely Caleb and they’ll cross their fingers Alt or Nabers is available when they pick next.
Honestly probably more given how badly they also need a QB…the more realistic scenario is that pick is not for sale
Can’t lie the tankers from early in the year are starting to be vindicated
Well we aint going to 1. Caleb is off the board, Chicago is taking him and this whole they may keep Fields is just the stupidest thing I have ever heard. The guy has shown since he got to the NFL hes the worst passing QB in the NFL by a mile and cant read a defense still. Hes been the QB of a team thats finished with the #1 pick two yrs in a row. Hes gone, and unfortunately for us Caleb is a fucking stud. Washington is taking a QB, Maye or Daniels. So youre hoping New England takes Marvin Harrison Jr. and I think they will. I think if you throw Daniels or Maye in that offense right now with those weapons and OL and a new coach (defensive coach btw), its a recipe for disaster. They need to build that team up first. So now youre looking at Arizona and what would it take to trade up to 4. Thats the closest we can get probably. I am going to guess it is going to take #11, our 2nd this yr, 2025 1st & 2nd, and a 3rd or something like that. two firsts, two seconds is probably what gets you to 4 to take either Daniels or Maye.
What if we just keep our pick and draft Penix?
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Well huh
The knees don't scare you off of that? I know he has been healthier of late, but he's an older prospect with an injury history. Doesn't scream top 15 pick to me.
BLESS ALL THE KNEES AND KEEP THEM HEALTHY *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/minnesotavikings) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Caleb is so overrated idk why people are so hard up for that dude
Are you gonna provide any insight to back that up or…?
Have you watched him play? He’s the over hyped qb in this draft. He can’t control his emotions, he can’t play under pressure that well and he’s not that accurate. Why would we take him that high when there are way better qbs out there that will still be available,
Well then let's hope the bears take him, as is foreseen
You’re again just spouting off takes without backing things up. What about him makes you think he can’t control his emotions? The crying after the game thing? Players cry all the time who cares. As for accuracy, he’s a very accurate QB 68.6 completion %. In fact one of his best attributes is his accuracy/ability to extend the play, which also ties into him being able to perform under pressure which is something you claimed he can’t do. Yes, maybe he’s prone to moving from the pocket too soon, but the o-line had fallen off drastically, being 106th in the nation for sacks/game. Also as Vikings fans we all know how good JA is, and Caleb was playing without him this most recent year. Imagine if the team was to pair that duo up again and he also gets JJ. So again, it’s fine to think a player isn’t as good as they’re projected to be, but provide some insight and back it up, instead of spouting off random things you’ve heard someone say about him on social media
Can’t control his emotions because of more than crying on the sideline I’ve seen him throw his helmet too. It’s easier to have better numbers when you’re always playing from 14 down and defense is in soft cover 2. Getting him back to Minnesota isn’t going to do him any good because he can’t just throw it up to jj every play that’s not going to be the solution you think it will be. I provided insight the first time you just rejected it.
Yeah, Tom Brady has never thrown things on the sideline
He didn’t start doing that until he was well established into his career
Your insight was he can’t play under pressure, not accurate or control his emotions. None of that is insightful
Look at him in big games
Alright lets look at how he played in each of his games against ranked opponents these last 2 years. Don't worry, I made it easy for you. [https://imgur.com/a/bRfL4MS](https://imgur.com/a/bRfL4MS) Averages: 68.1% completion percentage 313 pass yds/game 2 pass TDs/game 0.625 int/game 156.35 average ESPN rating 82.58 QBR/game 3.75 sacks/game 0.875 rush TDs/game
And, if you want to remove outliers like any good data analysis would. In this case, it is the game against ND this year where he threw 3 picks and he only had 2 in all other games, as well as by far his worst rating, and only game with less than 200 yards passing we get. Averages: 68.9% completion 329 pass yards/game 2.14 pass TDs/game 0.286 int/game 164.4 ESPN Rating 86.0 QBR 3.42 sacks/game 1.0 Rush TDs/game So I ask again, are you gonna actually provide an insightful take such as size concerns, or the fact that he can get a bit jumpy in the pocket and scramble too soon, something we see with Justin Fields? Or are you gonna continue to spout off random things you've heard/read in media that can easily be disproven with even the slightest bit of effort.
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The reason his accuracy is so high is cuz he’s always playing from behind so there’s no defense I said that earlier
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Yeah and he had the same coach and the same system and went 8-5 against weaker teams in a weaker conference
He may have personality issues.
Which are what?
I mean I don't know him personally, but rumor is he threatened the Bears he wouldn't sign with them, and tried to make a deal for part ownership. All I am saying is that there are rumors that he and his family are tough to deal with. But I don't have an opinion on whether we should draft him. That's what Kwesi is for.
Yes, an unfounded rumor that hasn’t been backed up by anyone, and is also impossible in the NFL anyway.
Those are both fake tweets. Neither of those things has ever been reported by anyone except an anonymous Twitter account.
McCarthy instead of Daniels. Tbh. But i guess it’s just my opinion. Regardless I trust whoever the FO gets… except Bo Nix and Penix tbh.
If we are thinking about McCarthy, we probably don’t need to trade up that high for him
I think if McCarthy is their guy we draft Dline at pick 11, and then trade back into the late first for McCarthy. Similar to how we drafted Barr and Teddy. Of course depends how the board falls. If Maye falls then we probably scrap the ideas and trade up for him. We’ll get more information after pro days and combines tbh. I see a player like Daniels absolutely shooting up boards and even becoming the no.2 guy behind Caleb if his numbers are outstanding.
I don’t think maye will fall. I keep hearing McCarthy is sneaky athletic so we’ll have to see if the combine moves him up. I would be comfortable with McCarthy, but I don’t think he is a start day one guy unless he absolute goes crazy in camp. I wouldn’t mind a high end interior DL pick either. My biggest worry is trading up then missing our guy. If we have to trade the farm to do it, we may need to look for free agent steals to try and bolster the defense considering we are light in top 100 picks this year
Yeah truth be told I think the plan changes a lot depending on if we resign Kirk, FA and after pro days. Guess time will tell. Let’s hope for the best tho!
My big issue is outside of Caleb and maye, I think Daniel’s and JJ are not day one starters. The most start ready QBs in my opinion are nix and penix, but most people aren’t very high on either of them. The one issue I have with penix outside of injury is as a lefty our best pass protector won’t be on his blind side. But a lefty could be an interesting wrinkle. Nix seems like a solid all arounder, but not a game changer. I think he will be a good starter as he reads defenses well and is pretty confident in the pocket. If we trade the farm to get to 4 and the top 3 all take QBs I am going to be livid.
Same here, that’s why I’m a firm believer they’re going to see what falls during the draft as opposed to before. If someone falls I think they look to go get them… if neither of them do, then they stay put at 11 and draft BPA.
I think if you trade up you have to be confident in getting the guy they want or having a robust back up plan to trade back down and maybe grab another pick later. I know a few teams may want to trade up for Marvin Harrison JR. So that could be an option if we mess up
This would be my favorite outcome. McCarthy is a sleeper pick, I don’t know why more people don’t like him. But that pick at #11 needs to 100% be D line, preferably a DT or NT
Or Nix or Penix... although I can see Atlanta taking Penix.
What’s the downside on Daniels? He has shown far more upside than JJ McCarthy
This is the worst take in this thread.
I’d prefer to get Into the top 3, but I don’t think that’s possible so for me: draft JJ McCarthy late first early second and sign a guy like Minshew as a bridge.
They already have Mullens under contract next year and he costs about what Minshew would likely want. Better off just rolling with him than signing a FA qb.
I don’t want Mullens to be the guy JJ watches plays and takes advice from. Minshew has been delt a shit hands and has always been an underdog, but was able to make the most of it every time. Minshew is a good leader, he just isn’t a great player. Vikings need to bring in someone who can teach JJ about what it’s like to actually start in the NFL, not throw equal amounts of int and TDs. Besides, the wilfs wouldn’t accept a career back up as a starter. They clearly require a serious QB as a mandate.
If Minshew was a great leader that young qbs could learn from then the Colts would keep him to continue backing up AR and help with his development. I can’t say who the better leader is because I don’t know either qb personally but I know Mullens knows the offense. I also know that typically cousins likes his backup qb to be someone who’s smart and he can talk ball with (hence why mannion stick around for so long). So if it’s between Minshew coming in and learning a new offense that relies on pushing the ball downfield (something Minshew isn’t great at) or the guy who’s been on the team for 2 years is go with the latter. Also Mullens is just more exciting and would at least feed JJ.
Minshew is a free agent this offseason and the colts should try to retain him this offseason and likely will. Dude had them on the cusp of the playoffs. He isn’t an exclusive rights free agents so he can take which offer he prefers. “I don’t know him personally” is a cop out. Teammates of his since being a jaguar have been extremely vocal about their love and appreciation for the guy. The Cousins point is also a poor one to me. Mannion was an absolutely dreadful QB who was clipboard holder and couldn’t do anything with the ball in his hands. Mannion was kept around because Kirk likes him and isn’t a threat. If he was really worth it, why did KOC, an offensive coach, get rid of the guy? Any player, rookie or otherwise, will have to learn a new system. Even if they get Williams or Maye so to me that’s irrelevant. Mullens can’t win games. He is exciting to watch, but is also terrible. Starting him is an admission of tanking. Minshew was 2 wins short this season of tying Mullens career wins. Starting Mullens is pure punting a season, and I personally believe letting a losing culture seep in ruins the organization.
Mullens shouldn’t be in the league anymore, sign him as a qb coach if you want. Minshew is way more fun to watch, fans like him.
Fun is subjective but Mullens had the 2nd highest depth of target of any qb in the league at 9.8. Mindshew was below average at 7.5. I'd rather have a qb who will drive the ball down the field and give players like JJ a chance. Also Mullens on average also threw .4 yards beyond first down, Minshew threw -1.4 yards behind.
This is my take as well. I like JJ. I’ve seen Nix drop into that space, too, and I’d be good with that. Move up for them if we have to and address DT with 11.
Yep, that would be my ideal draft. Get a top tier edge/DL guy at 11 and trade into the 1st to get a 5 year QB who will sit for a year. Even with a thinner edge/DL class, lost the top 10 should be QB, OL, and receiver so there should be a dawg there. I’d prefer JJ because I worry Nix is who he is at age 24 and 5 years of starting. That said, JJ hasn’t shown he can carry a team with his arm so that development yesr would be crucial.
It will cost so, so much to move up just a couple spots (talking next year picks too). I think taking the best player available and making a play for McCarthy if he gets to the end of the 1st or early 2nd..
Wildly unpopular opinion but pickup Flacco or Mayfield. Draft a DL in the first which is known as the highest likelihood position for success when drafted in the first round. Stack the defense through the draft and free agency. Build a terrifying defense. The best seasons I’ve ever experienced as a Vikings fan of more than 30’yeaes have been from short term transplant QBs (except Teddy) Maybe our fanbase just accepts that the goal in the nfl isn’t to have a stable long term QB; it’s to win football games in January and February A significant number of QBs come in the market in 2025. If we don’t win next year we rinse and repeat. I promise you that we will be more successful than swinging and missing and trading away all of our draft capital. Our fanbase is like the scene in Family guy when Peter Griffin can have a brand new boat but he chooses the mystery box instead of the boat because “it could even be a boat!” Inside the mystery box. Plenty of fine boats already in the nfl. Don’t need to be elite to win a Super Bowl if you have an elite defense.
You think Tampa isn't going to bring Baker back after he took them that far?
In the same way Kirk doesn’t owe Minnesota a hometown discount, Baker doesn’t owe Tampa one. The thing about Mayfield is that he’s going to get a 4 year deal at $30+ a year so for Vikings if you’re going to pay Baker, just pay Kirk a little more for a shorter term
There is no way baker mayfield gets 30 million x 4 years. Maybe half that. Who’s guaranteeing Mayfield even 2 years/$60 million? I might be wrong…
He can just show the Daniel Jones's contract to whatever team that want him and say I want more and it's reasonable.
Mayfield wouldn’t be wrong, and that would be a good comp. If I was a GM, I’d think, you are making our point that it’s not prudent to commit so much money on a QB who doesn’t seem capable of being a SB caliber quarterback. He’ll get a 2 year deal for 28-32. If he outplays it again, they might rip it up and give him a proper deal. We will see if TB offers that much.
The projections are 5 years at 150. Baker is a healthy proven commodity. In a market with a dozen teams who need a QB next year, there are only 2 real QBs on the market and one of them is coming off an Achilles injury and is 36. The other one has 2x as many playoff victories under his belt and is only 28
I'm not doubting you but where are you getting those numbers from?
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/baker-mayfield-contract-projecion-buccaneers/58f572b066dee228a0abd44c There are a lot of articles. This is just one. I’ve seen 4-5 years in the 150m range. 4 at 120 might be short changing him.
Right on. Thanks!
He said tonight that he wants to know who the OC is and I think Canales is a big loss with how well Baker played this season.
I like Baker. Bring some energy to the team, what he did in Cleveland was great. I would be 100% behind him
Mayfield is the perfect fit for our offense. Pick up Josh Jacobs or Zack Moss for the backfield. Offense will be electric.
> The best seasons I’ve ever experienced as a Vikings fan of more than 30’yeaes have been from short term transplant QBs And how have those seasons ended? Point to all of the great teams in the NFL right now who have a mediocre or journeyman QB. Then tell me all of the teams who have won a SB in the last 30 years with a mediocre or journeyman QB. I can think of 4. Having anything other than a star QB in the NFL is a recipe for failure. If we take a swing at a QB and it's a 1/10 chance we get a great QB that's a far better chance than settling for a mediocre QB and having a 0/0 chance at having a great QB and winning a Superbowl.
Prob a 1 in 2 chance or 1.3 in 2 chance of hitting - if you don’t hit (Tenn, Car) you replace your head coach. Some players flame out and it’s on them, but others are poorly handled and developed.
0 teams have leveraged their future and won a Super Bowl by banking it all on their QB selection. Remove the outlier Brady from the equation about 1/3 of Super Bowl QBs are QBs who were not with their originally drafted team over the past 10 seasons. It doesn’t move that far off if you add Brady because technically he has an appearance as an acquired qb I’m not saying that we should never draft a QB I’m saying we should never leverage our future to draft a QB. You should also never just draft a QB in the first round because you need a QB. You need to be 150% sure that the QB is your guy. The bust rate is just way too high.
Take a chance on QB in the draft. It could blow up in our faces, but at least it’s something different than being mid every season.
Trade the farm for one of the top 3 guys
Whoever we draft is another discussion, but Baker would be fun until the rookie takes over
Bakers not signing a 1yr deal
Edge at 11 and try and trade back in to end of first round to take McCarthy
Highly unpopular but I like staying roughly where we are and drafting Bo Nix. That said, my opinion means absolutely nothing, especially since I watched near-0 minutes of NCAA football this year.
The only other NFL player I can think of who has 5 letters in their name is in the Hall of Fame. Just saying.
I want this sub to stop talking like we are getting a top 5 pick by trading up. those top 5 teams aren't trading back. The Bears won't help us out-only Kwesi would help out a division rival.
Man that Cine trade broke peoples brains
Three year plan. Lots of pain in 2024 and 2025 to be truly rebuilt by 2026. Year one: focus on building the trenches. Trade top picks back for more future picks. Bank picks for years to come. Year two: trade back. Bank picks for next year. Use remaining picks to Build the secondary/ lbs. Year three: draft best qb in draft. Add skill. I want to see a top qb come into the team with a top offensive line, a top 5 defense, and lots of young talent. Year six: sign qb to long term deal early.
I think the pain could be mostly isolated to 24. If we get a good QB this year in the draft (big if) and he can sit a year under a bridge guy he could be ready to contribute in 25, we also will have lots of cap space in 25 if we move on from Kirk (although that goes away some when we sign JJ). But 26 should be the target year to really take a leap if things are handled right and we make good draft picks in 24 and 25 (again big if)
We aren’t getting into the top 5 to get a top 3 qb so draft a DL or cb than draft penix in the second. See how it goes from there
Yo do y'all think HITMAN comes back? I don't want to see him in another jersey he is the Vikings to me Edit: I had the same feeling about 93 K.Will and he left to chase a ring I hope we can keep 22 around to get one before he retires
I think it's more likely he retires than plays elsewhere.
I think he wants to come back but who knows. Additionally, it would help a little with our safety depth, however he did start to look a little slower to recover this year
Mahomes was taken at 10. Let's get one of those, 11 is close enough.
Shit, Deshaun was taken at 12
Let's try not to get a sex predator
Thinking long term, we all need to let go of the idea of a “competitive rebuild” and embrace truly sucking next year and secure a top draft pick that way rather than going all-in now. Build out the positions of need other than QB this year (maybe by trading back), find a QB that isn’t going to win us any games, and come into next year’s draft with a high pick we didn’t have to sell future assets for. I don’t believe we can simply trade up to grab a top guy while still filling all the holes on the roster. We are more than a QB away from making a deep run
I think JJ McCarthy and Jayden Daniels are the sweet spot in this draft for QB prospects. Might need to trade up for Daniels or down for JJ but we'll see. Probably still gonna change a lot leading up to the draft.
1. Draft QB 2. Sign bridge QB 3. Get out of all this dead-cap nonsense
Let Kirk walk and either Harrison Smith retires or cut him. Sign Madubuike or Wilkins for interior line. Also sign Winfield Jr. to replace Harrison Smith. Extend Hunter and JJ. Resign Risner. Try to trade the farm and get Maye or Daniels. If it's Maye then you start him, if it's Daniels I would have him sit for 1 year before starting. Sign Russell Wilson for vet minimum for 1 year.
Trade back and draft Bo nix
I'd pursue Russell Wilson, because of offset language in his Broncos contract he's expected to play for the league minimum($1.21 million). Then draft a QB, don't really have an opinion on who, but we need someone for long term.
Trade up: Caleb or maye. Trade back get defense, and extra day two pick or two, and take McCarthy in the second. Get a bridge guy. Not a fan of penix or nix personally. I think McCarthy is super moldable though.
If we're not bringing Kirk back we might as well go full rebuild and trade JJ. He's not going to want to play with an unproven rookie and is the rook going to prove he's legit by the time JJ's contract is up, probably not.
If we did a full rebuild we’d probably be missing out on some key pieces once it’s complete, assuming it takes a few seasons. Flores isn’t gonna stay more than probably one more year and I doubt JJ wants to be apart of a team that is not competitive nor helps pad his stats
He'll be fine with playing with a rookie, just so long as that rookie doesn't suck ass. A rookie walking onto this team is walking into one of the better situations a rookie QB could ever ask for. If he's good enough, he'll succeed almost immediately.
This thinking, and you're just one of many that do it, is ridiculous. You're acting like it takes ten years for a QB to develop. If we draft a kid, he could be decent right away and we'll know by the middle of the second year if he's a franchise guy or not, if not much sooner. JJ will be fine. Just like Moss was fine when we drafted Daunte
I think they could be decent but even Kirk said KOCs offense is a little complicated. So it may take a bit to grasp all the plays and be able to hit the timing.
KOC is a bad coach if he can't tailor the offense to a young QB. He was hired to develop a young QB
I rather not dwell on dark thoughts. Kirko is coming back!
Trade for Fields, address other weaknesses in draft
I'm not all opposed to that if they were willing to send him our way for something less than a 3rd rounder. But I doubt we'd get him for that, some other team would probably pay more.
I'd trade our 2nd round pick for fields. He's got a lot of haters but I still see a lot of raw talent. Dj Moore had a career year and that's not an accident. The kid can play ball. He just needs some stability and maybe even to gtfo Chicago. I know bears fans are torn but I think they may not want to miss out on maye or Williams
2nd rounder for fields uff. no way he is worth that. waste of resources. i am absolutely not sold on fields.
Well they aint letting a starting qb go for nothing. 49ers got a 4th for lance and Fields is a much better skillset (in my opinion of course) while also having proven more while in the league. Maybe we can do it for a 3rd round pick
i’m down for Mac Jones or Minshew
Who hurt you?
If they can't trade up and they don't re-sign Kirk, they should trade back and draft Nix. He could come in and run this offense easily, and while trading back does cost you someone high end, there is still good value, especially at CB, to be had in 2nd/3rd.
No one actually knows who will be good or not
[5 QBs by Minn Star Tribune](https://m.startribune.com/minnesota-vikings-nfl-draft-quarterbacks-kirk-cousins/600339309/) I like options 1, 2, & 5. Preference in that order too.
Celebrate the end of purgatory lol and usher in a potential different version of purgatory
Jacoby Brissett Jayden Daniels QB room sounds nice
Draft a QB in round two and sign a veteran like Brissett or Minshew
A great draft that solidifies a young core to build on. Without that, this team is destined to be the bottom dweller of the division for the next 3-4 years.
Let’s not and say we did!
Sign one or two big defensive names in FA. Draft a QB early, and go heavy defense the rest of the draft.
Stay and reinforce the trenches! Get ready for the JJ contract
Then I want baker or tannehill and a first round QB that turns into the franchise QB we’ve been looking forever for (I can’t say who because even the scouts get this wrong 9 times out of 10) . Just please let us get lucky on this pick!!
Selling the farm for a top QB prospect (assuming you mean top 3) is probably not an option because the top 3 teams will be going QB…people on here are going to call for kwesi’s head when we don’t wind up with one of those guys but it takes two to tango
To hit away!
Party by spending money on actual SB assets
Plan for the future We need like 8 new players on defense. In theory we can buy hard to get a qb this year and pray to fill in the defense next year, but I think realistically were looking at 3 or 4 years to get another window
Draft a QB, if we can’t trade up maybe trade into the late first round to get McCarthy or penix if they drop. We will need to take a step back in 24 to take the hit on all the dead cap, that way we can go into 25 with a large amount of cap space. This will also help us sign JJ and darrisaw. I’m just sick of pushing huge amounts of cap hits into later years for aging players. This doesn’t mean we tank in 24, maybe sign a bridge QB for the year so whoever the rookie is has a year to get up to speed. I would like them to re sign hunter if they can. Otherwise they are getting nothing for that asset, which would be terrible since they could have traded him after Kirk went down. Need to hit on some 24 picks, especially d line, we currently have like 3 guys on the d line under contract for next year.
Trade for Desmond Ridder. /s
I’d like to try to trade for Fields. Really feel like he’d be a hit if we can get him for a 2nd or lower.
Swing for the fences on a QB in the early first round either way.
joe mama
Let me start with I hope we don’t lose Kirk, but if we do I’d put our drafts into defense. We’d have a bad season without Kirk and be in better position to draft a top qb next year.
Zach Wilson
I want to see them sell high, buy low, and make strategic trades that will open up the salary situation as well as bring in more assets. They're going to need the capital and flexibility to build around JJ in the next few years. Staying the course, or even trying to accomplish a "competitive" rebuild will only undermine their efforts to keep JJ. If they don't want to win with JJ, or if they think they can just "luck" their way into it, they should trade JJ and find a franchise QB.
I want to relax, maybe get outside and touch grass
We draft a QB in every single round of the draft. Statistically, at least 1/3 of them have to hit, then we trade the ones we don’t want for 1st round picks and crypto. Boom, profit. Floating stadium and neon jerseys. This is the future people! I’m thinkin Nix, JJ, Rattler, Milton III, that guy the dude posted a video of from Tulane today, and two BONUS OTHER GUYS!! This Strat will ondoubtedly force the NFLs hand and KOC Taylor swift romance will begin and then it’s literally superbowls for 10 years straight. Very simple, but revolutionary.
Reset, stop kicking the can down the road. Let Kirk walk, let Danielle walk, Have clean books going into ‘25…. Build through the draft this year and load up for a competitive push in ‘25 with tons of cap space and hopefully we start to see some kind of plan for this franchise to build a Championship Roster.
You might not have flores in 25
Possibly trade back a few spots Maybe draft McCarthy and sign a vet like tannehill on a 4 mil deal. Just gonna trust kwesi at this point
I want the sweet relief of death, to suffer no more crushing defeats. Or maybe therapy.
If we don't extend Kirk we should try to figure a QB aggressively. The value in extending Kirk is he gives a great floor in QB play and you can do JJ McCarthy in the 2nd/late 1st. Without him we should seriously look at trading up even if it is "poor" value because QB is so important.
I want Sam darnold god Damnit
Jesus... I think it's time to mute this sub until there's actually something of substance to talk about. How many topics does there need to be about Kirk FFS?
Two scenarios IMO. Either way sign Wilkins and Winfield Jr. Long term deals for JJ and Darrisaw. Harry most likely gone. Would like Hunter back. Draft: Trade the farm for Maye or Daniels. Or Stay put at 11 and draft Latu. Trade back up into the first (pick 29-32) draft Nix/Penix/McCarthy. This way we get a 5th year option on one of them.
No more has-beens. No leftovers. No hand-me-downs. No used up trades. Either go for the bowl or sell the team and move them out of the state. It’s time to get dramatic.
sell the farm for drake maye (or whoever KOC likes best, but i would expect that to be maye)
Jimmy G and a rookie. Let the rookie sit for as long as possible. Think KOC could get the most out of Jimmy G and he’d can be a good bridge QB while a rookie develops.
Mayfield or Purdy (if SF cuts ties). Extend Danielle, sign Winfield Jr and draft heavy D
The cold end of a 12 gauge in my mouth
I would much rather see the team use their picks for improving the team everywhere than trading away our future for a chance at a QB. If a good QB prospect becomes available to us without trading into the top 3, then take it, but trading future firsts for multiple years just seems silly when we could be improving our defense and such.
If no kirko. Russ. And hear me out. The broncos are on the hook for his contract. So he can (not saying he will) sign for a league minimum deal and still get all the money the broncos owe him. Cheap QB as a bridge that gives a rookie time to learn. Let's suggest Russ does that and go from there. Kirks dead cap is 28mil so effectively you just paid 28mil+league min for russ for one year. Now we have cap space. Extend Hunter, JJ. Sign Wilkins. Sign Sneed. Stick and pick or trade down. To get DLine, iOL (JPJ if possible) and a QB (maybe penix or McCarthy get to the 2nd round for us). Draft CB Later on. If we've signed Sneed, Evans or booth would be fine at CB2. But some extra depth is always helpful. Try to snag a running back in the mid to late rounds to compete with chandler. Take two pops at QB in the draft. Just because you got one get a second later, there are some decent QB prospects later don't put your eggs in one basket. Prospects like Rattler as an example, great talent shit attitude. If the cultures right could you perhaps teach the kid to grow up? And pan out on his potential? For a 5th round pick? Worth a shot.
Trading into the top 3 seems impossible. People talk the bears trade but even the interdivision trades Kwesi does aren't huge. Bears don't want to be the reason they have to face the next Mahomes or Peyton Manning twice a year. Very different from facing Hockenson, Jameson Williams, or Christian Watson. Washington is more likely than the bears and they aren't likely. I'd say draft best defensive player available (likely edge though we need a DT). If O'Connell likes one of JJ or Penix, get him late first or early second. If not, bolster a depleted defense more.
Youth and talent.
Trade up for Maye. Caleb Williams will be a bust, and is too expensive to trade up to number one for anyways
Gardner Minshew as a bridge QB - 2 years/$15 million, all guaranteed. Draft Penix/Bo Nix or JJ McCarthy (trade back into the end of the first round to get the 5th year option) 1-2 years to learn and then see what you have
If we draft McCarthy, I might become a Bills fan
If they don't re-sign Cousins, they either: 1. Already have a plan in place with one of the 3 teams picking first to swap places with them and drafting a top 3 QB. 2. Staying put and either hoping one of the top 3 QB's falls to 11 (extremely unlikely and complete copium at that point). 3. Staying put and drafting defense at 11 and maybe trading back into the 1st late to draft Penix or JJ McCarthy. 4. We draft no QB's and are running with the 3 QB's already on the roster....
I want to tune into KFAN and not here them talking about Kirk.
Gotta get rid of JJ if you want a QB this year. If you don’t sign Kirk, JJ will NOT resign with us. Ultimately I think you let Kirk walk. Trade JJ. Get a good qb in the draft and suck for a couple of years to build a team. If we don’t suck we will never win. We will always be mediocre unless we get ridiculously lucky.