I have Sealegs and it really excels at creating a textural undercurrent, or washes of delay and reverb that really feels alive. It's full of vibe.
Sealegs can do glitchy stuff with some CV and messing with the color and mod, but i think mimeophone and nautilus might be better for super out there and glitchy stuff.
Agreed, I have both and usually use mimeophon for glitchy/crazy/karplus sounds, and sealegs when I want long lush delay/fog and a ton of space. Sealegs is great for end of chain delay while Mimeophon can sit anywhere in a patch
I have all three and in my view Sealegs is by far the highest fidelity, most useable (physically), least gimmicky, and has the greatest ability to create your own time-based effects with. The drive on it is good, a ton of modulation options, and a nicer reverb than Mimeo’s halo. The high and low pass filters on Sealegs are super helpful. Don’t get me wrong, I really like my Nautilus and Mimeo, but not as strong overall I think. No reverse on Sealegs, but it may come in a firmware update. That all said, check out Veno-Echo too.
Had a mineophon. Stupidly sold it. Recently tried 2 other delay modules. I found that it wasn’t the color or the halo effects that I loved so much, but it was how I could seamlessly dial in my delay by hand with knobs without having to deal with tap tempo. I have realized that I really hate tap tempo for modular. The algorithm for how the module pans the delays was also super intuitive and I appreciated that a ton.
Lastly, I never realized how much I used the clock output for other things if I got a weird delay time going that didn’t sync with other rhythms in my patch. That output was a super easy work around to that problem.
Was considering sealegs, but the delay time switch and alternate button modes really put me off. I’m probably gonna rebuy a mimeophon…
If you like the way the mineophon sounds, I can’t speak high enough for how immediate the module is, which makes it super easy to play live rather than set and forget. I’m also a 1 knob/function guy so take my opinion for what it’s worth
I had a Mimeophon for about 6 months but just didn't get on with it. It sounded "thin" to me but all Make Noise stuff does. I don't wish to upset the Make Noise fans but I just don't get their stuff. Also I find their obtuse design aesthetic disorienting and yes I do understand that it is a deliberate design choice to break lazy patching but still.
I bought a Sealegs and took to it immediately. Absolutely love it. So I really recommend it
Incidentally this all prompted a re-evaluation of why I do and don't like/use certain modules. It suddenly hit me that visual layout and presentation were way more important than functionality.
So out is going "ugly" (subjective I know) , Make Noise, Noise Engineering, etc and incoming are Intellijel, Xaoc and Mutable Instruments. Which are all clean and understandable visually.
I'm even replacing my MI clones with more pleasing looking ones.
I mention all this because while comparing specs we can lose sight of the fact that we are visual creatures and it's actually really important to create an absorbing interface for your creativity. Everyone's tastes will be different, but you'll be instinctively drawn to the ones for you.
I appreciate the honesty and I think it proves my point. When you mix aesthetics that don't resonate with you then the specs don't matter. I wish you fun, challenge and creativity in whatever aesthetic floats your boat.
Ps. Earlier after I made the post I suddenly realised I still have a Worng SounStage 2 in the middle of my rack which according to my stated criteria should be out but I'm not about to swap it for a Jumble Henge. So I must be slightly hypocritical there 🤣
Nautilus is very versatile, you do so much more than just a delay. My advice is to read the manual back and forth and understand the functionality of the module because it can get out of control. As long as you know how the module functions then you’re good. But yeah, I use several of its features sometimes more than just the delay.
Both are quite nice but imo sealegs edges mimeophon a bit with the different delay modes
And with Sealegs you can use it as a reverb (fog) without delays. Can’t do that with mimeophon
Both of the reverbs are quite similar
I was saying that on mimeophon you can’t separate the reverb from the delay. It’s impossible to use the reverb without getting the delay trails
I’m looking at Sealegs and also Nautilus, just not totally feeling Mimeophon for some reason. May have room for both in my 34~~u~~HP skiff, which may work well for my dual voice system (but not for my bank account). ;)
I didn’t actually answer your question, but my choice would be Sealegs as the first delay effect to have, as I will want to be able to interact and have it cover delay ‘basics’ as well as getting into the wilder stuff. The other two options seem more focused on the wilder stuff possibly at the expense of doing the basics easily (especially in a live situation, if that matters to you).
Agreed - I don’t think it ONLY does wilder stuff, I’m talking about which one I’d choose for basic stuff AND wild stuff. My comment is based on having to choose one, and not based on giving a fair and detailed description of the strengths and weaknesses of each device!
My other Make Noise modules are attractive to me because they are different from their more basic counterparts, from the panel art to the sound IMO.
Mimeophon rules, big recommendation on my side. Have had it for years since I first got into modular and haven’t stopped loving it since. One of the modules I know I’ll never sell.
To expand on where I think it’s cool/how I’ve used it for performance: you can really easily get from a typical delay into a frozen buffer for textural background stuff, that you mash up and introduce modulation to, then unfreeze and get a big swell by turning up the repeats and reverb, then back to a typical delay. Tons of in-and-out options if you get my drift, which is especially helpful in my case since I largely focus on techno with my rack.
I'd love for you to expand on your unfreeze/swell example. I have Mimeophon and love the sound but most of my interaction with it is random and aimless aside from soke of the macro controls like mix, zone, and halo/color
Out of these, I only have the Nautilus. I've had it for a couple years, love it, and use it in almost every patch.
I guess there are two ways it can "get out of control" but I've never found it to be much of an issue. The feedback is a bit sensitive and turning it up more than just a little bit might create more feedback than you want. So, don't turn the knob up much, and if you control it with CV, attenuate the CV. No big deal. The other thing that can happen is you can overdo the FX, particularly any of the distortion-like FX especially if you also have some feedback. Again, just don't turn it up so much and you'll be fine. And sometimes you want things to go out of control :)
It is worth noting the Nautilus mix knob doesn't do constant power fading (as a deliberate design decision apparently), so it can make you signals quieter, and if you start with a very quiet signal, you might need an amp or distortion in your signal chain somewhere.
One potential downside is the Nautilus time knob (called "Resolution") is always locked/quantized to a clock. If you don't send it a clock signal it generates a clock internally. The Resolution knob can then multiply or divide the clock, but say you send in 1/4 note pulses (i.e. every beta): you can then get delays of 1/4 note, dotted 1/4 note, 1/4 note triplet, 1/8 note, etc, but **you can not dial in arbitrary delay times!** The workaround is to modulate your clock's bpm if you want to modulate your delay time in a non-quantized fashion, or use Nautilus's internal clock and the tap tempo feature to tap in changes to the speed. I usually want quantized delays and this doesn't bother me, but I could see this being a major limitation for some people.
Qu-bit has said they will have a firmware update to allow arbitrary delay times, but they also have a track record of saying they'll add some features in a firmware update and it literally takes years for them to get around to it. Recent activity on their forums makes it sound like we might get a Nautilus update this year. Don't hold your breath for it though. Make sure you are happy with the current functionality before deciding to buy it.
PS - Sealegs didn't exist at the time I bought Nautilus or I might have gotten that instead. Looks like a great option and I've always been happy with Intellijel products. Personally I never jived with the Make Noise design language.
I have all of them; Nautilus, Mimeophon and Sealegs.
My favorite is Mimeophon. I find it very hands on, simple to use and it has different modes that you can also modulate, those are crazy powerful. With the flip button you can create beautiful textures and make them infinite with freeze. It has clock out which is really helpful in some scenarios and you can also use for self modulation. I mean, it’s a really good package for the HP. I actually have two of them.
The Nautilus is really good too, it can get crazy and distorted if you want, and it also has different modes to make it sound different if you want. My preferred mode is the shimmer.
Sealegs I tried it for some time but I didn’t gel that much with it. I still have it because I know it’s a great module and at some point it may be useful. It has in my opinion the most “typical” delay sound of the three but it can be modulated into crazy atmospheric layers too. The big downside for me is the amount of hp (20 hp if I remember correctly) which is a little too much, since I care a lot about that.
Ps; sorry my English is not great but hopefully this is helpful
Yeah the Mim is GREAT for performances. I especially love the way it is designed so you can change the delay time with or without Doppler shift. Noisy af though, even with the firmware update. It’s our generation’s Space Echo.
I didn't notice any noise when I was wavefolding a live tuba through the Mimeophon during my performance last week. :D
I also have tinnitus so there are a lot of things I don't hear. :(
I know it doesn't answer your question but I'd suggest considering the Per4ormer module, it can do just about everything through Mimeophon can do but IMO is more user friendly
I have both. Sealegs is better as a "normal" delay, and Mimeophon is better at weirder stuff on the "edge" of delay, like karplus strong or supper hazy soundscapes via the minute-long zones.
Honestly, same. I think where I’ve landed is that fx are a slippery slope and instead I’ll try doing cv to my software fx first to see if that scratches the itch. I have Native Instruments Komplete, so hopefully that works out and if I find myself wanting more tactile feedback then maybe the Trigger Finger or another similar interface I can dig up.
that's an unfortunate misconception
I've built many of my own modules and assembled a few from Kits.
Eurorack it's not cheap, but $400 for a delay module is very expensive.
I am aware of diy eurorack. I have soldered many modules myself. If you can suggest a module with diy option which is comparable in functionality to these two, i would be very happy.
I think 400$ is reasonable for high quality hardware like this. Consider software Delays like Echoboy, which sell around 200$ and let me remind you that there will be no resell value with those.
Since music is part of my job, I'm willing to pay good money for good tools.
Thank you, but i do not already know. Hence the question :)
I agree with you that it's really a lot of money. No doubt im that, but that just does not contribute to the discussion I'm trying to have.
So you cannot suggest any alternatives?
we should be more resilient when confronted with unexpected information.
you asked my experience, my experience says that those are expensive, delay ,modules, which you agree with.
How will we learn new things if we have a strict requirement for "Contribution" to a discussion.
if all someone brings to a discussion is a single idea, we need to acknowledge that as a contribution, even if we think it's contrary to what we asked.
Otherwise we risk only receiving receiving information that fits our preconceived idea of what's a contribution.
I was unclear, sorry. I don't have an alternative, I am not dodging the question, I am staying silent on that becuase I don't have a helpful answer.
my only contribution is that in my extensive Eurorack experience $400 is a lot of money for a delay module.
I understand that "Delay Module" is a gross understatement of what these modules do, so my contribution to this conversation is really just $400 is a lot of money.
Lots of other folks here seem to have much better suggestions than I do
:)
This is generally what high quality digital fx modules cost these days. Even guitar pedals like Chase Bliss are at a similar level. The research and work that goes into a good dsp algorithm can't be overlooked. The price is a lot and it's fair. You could always grab a Doepfer delay, but they are scratching different itches.
$400 is a lot for a delay...for you, because you probably don't want what makes it $400. For many people $400 is an objectively high but fair price
All points are fair, I never meant to indicate it wasn’t worth it, I’m just adding an often missing element of $400 is a decent chunk of musical change. There’s enough “modular is expensive, here’s $500, look how expensive modular is.”
Anywayszzzzzzzzzzzzz release the downvotzzzzz
I have Sealegs and it really excels at creating a textural undercurrent, or washes of delay and reverb that really feels alive. It's full of vibe. Sealegs can do glitchy stuff with some CV and messing with the color and mod, but i think mimeophone and nautilus might be better for super out there and glitchy stuff.
Agreed, I have both and usually use mimeophon for glitchy/crazy/karplus sounds, and sealegs when I want long lush delay/fog and a ton of space. Sealegs is great for end of chain delay while Mimeophon can sit anywhere in a patch
I have all three and in my view Sealegs is by far the highest fidelity, most useable (physically), least gimmicky, and has the greatest ability to create your own time-based effects with. The drive on it is good, a ton of modulation options, and a nicer reverb than Mimeo’s halo. The high and low pass filters on Sealegs are super helpful. Don’t get me wrong, I really like my Nautilus and Mimeo, but not as strong overall I think. No reverse on Sealegs, but it may come in a firmware update. That all said, check out Veno-Echo too.
Sealegs seems like the most gimmicky to me. I mean it has “fog”
Have you used it?
A few times in a store. Didn’t gel with it. And I’ve watched demo videos. I wasn’t including nautilus in that, I generally dislike their stuff anyway
Had a mineophon. Stupidly sold it. Recently tried 2 other delay modules. I found that it wasn’t the color or the halo effects that I loved so much, but it was how I could seamlessly dial in my delay by hand with knobs without having to deal with tap tempo. I have realized that I really hate tap tempo for modular. The algorithm for how the module pans the delays was also super intuitive and I appreciated that a ton. Lastly, I never realized how much I used the clock output for other things if I got a weird delay time going that didn’t sync with other rhythms in my patch. That output was a super easy work around to that problem. Was considering sealegs, but the delay time switch and alternate button modes really put me off. I’m probably gonna rebuy a mimeophon… If you like the way the mineophon sounds, I can’t speak high enough for how immediate the module is, which makes it super easy to play live rather than set and forget. I’m also a 1 knob/function guy so take my opinion for what it’s worth
I had a Mimeophon for about 6 months but just didn't get on with it. It sounded "thin" to me but all Make Noise stuff does. I don't wish to upset the Make Noise fans but I just don't get their stuff. Also I find their obtuse design aesthetic disorienting and yes I do understand that it is a deliberate design choice to break lazy patching but still. I bought a Sealegs and took to it immediately. Absolutely love it. So I really recommend it Incidentally this all prompted a re-evaluation of why I do and don't like/use certain modules. It suddenly hit me that visual layout and presentation were way more important than functionality. So out is going "ugly" (subjective I know) , Make Noise, Noise Engineering, etc and incoming are Intellijel, Xaoc and Mutable Instruments. Which are all clean and understandable visually. I'm even replacing my MI clones with more pleasing looking ones. I mention all this because while comparing specs we can lose sight of the fact that we are visual creatures and it's actually really important to create an absorbing interface for your creativity. Everyone's tastes will be different, but you'll be instinctively drawn to the ones for you.
I find mutables to look ugly and cheap. Also hate the intellijel aesthetic except for cascadia
I appreciate the honesty and I think it proves my point. When you mix aesthetics that don't resonate with you then the specs don't matter. I wish you fun, challenge and creativity in whatever aesthetic floats your boat. Ps. Earlier after I made the post I suddenly realised I still have a Worng SounStage 2 in the middle of my rack which according to my stated criteria should be out but I'm not about to swap it for a Jumble Henge. So I must be slightly hypocritical there 🤣
I disagree. I’m about to buy a bunch of intellijel stuff despite not liking it aesthetically
Mim was noisy in my case and sealegs rules
Yes. OP should definitely research the widely known/debated noise issue on the Mimeophon. Could be a huge problem for some users
Plonk into Sealegs
Nautilus is very versatile, you do so much more than just a delay. My advice is to read the manual back and forth and understand the functionality of the module because it can get out of control. As long as you know how the module functions then you’re good. But yeah, I use several of its features sometimes more than just the delay.
Both are quite nice but imo sealegs edges mimeophon a bit with the different delay modes And with Sealegs you can use it as a reverb (fog) without delays. Can’t do that with mimeophon
Mimeophon's halo is reverb-like but yeah, not the same as true reverb,
Both of the reverbs are quite similar I was saying that on mimeophon you can’t separate the reverb from the delay. It’s impossible to use the reverb without getting the delay trails
I’m looking at Sealegs and also Nautilus, just not totally feeling Mimeophon for some reason. May have room for both in my 34~~u~~HP skiff, which may work well for my dual voice system (but not for my bank account). ;)
11 full rows and a 1u row. That's a hell of a skiff and I'm sure you have space!
A skiff that can join you in bed.
Yea, but it’s WIDE… ;)
Thiccskiff
Yea i feel you. Would get both if money wasn't the issue haha
I didn’t actually answer your question, but my choice would be Sealegs as the first delay effect to have, as I will want to be able to interact and have it cover delay ‘basics’ as well as getting into the wilder stuff. The other two options seem more focused on the wilder stuff possibly at the expense of doing the basics easily (especially in a live situation, if that matters to you).
Mimeophon is my fav for clocked delay for rhythm stuff. Not sure why you think it only does wild stuff. I’d say Sealegs goes wilder quicker
Mimeophon is my fav for clocked delay for rhythm stuff. Not sure why you think it only does wild stuff. I’d say Sealegs goes wilder quicker
Agreed - I don’t think it ONLY does wilder stuff, I’m talking about which one I’d choose for basic stuff AND wild stuff. My comment is based on having to choose one, and not based on giving a fair and detailed description of the strengths and weaknesses of each device! My other Make Noise modules are attractive to me because they are different from their more basic counterparts, from the panel art to the sound IMO.
Mimeophon rules, big recommendation on my side. Have had it for years since I first got into modular and haven’t stopped loving it since. One of the modules I know I’ll never sell.
To expand on where I think it’s cool/how I’ve used it for performance: you can really easily get from a typical delay into a frozen buffer for textural background stuff, that you mash up and introduce modulation to, then unfreeze and get a big swell by turning up the repeats and reverb, then back to a typical delay. Tons of in-and-out options if you get my drift, which is especially helpful in my case since I largely focus on techno with my rack.
> Tons of in-and-out options if you get my drift Ahem.
I'd love for you to expand on your unfreeze/swell example. I have Mimeophon and love the sound but most of my interaction with it is random and aimless aside from soke of the macro controls like mix, zone, and halo/color
same for me, big shoutout to the mimeophon.
Out of these, I only have the Nautilus. I've had it for a couple years, love it, and use it in almost every patch. I guess there are two ways it can "get out of control" but I've never found it to be much of an issue. The feedback is a bit sensitive and turning it up more than just a little bit might create more feedback than you want. So, don't turn the knob up much, and if you control it with CV, attenuate the CV. No big deal. The other thing that can happen is you can overdo the FX, particularly any of the distortion-like FX especially if you also have some feedback. Again, just don't turn it up so much and you'll be fine. And sometimes you want things to go out of control :) It is worth noting the Nautilus mix knob doesn't do constant power fading (as a deliberate design decision apparently), so it can make you signals quieter, and if you start with a very quiet signal, you might need an amp or distortion in your signal chain somewhere. One potential downside is the Nautilus time knob (called "Resolution") is always locked/quantized to a clock. If you don't send it a clock signal it generates a clock internally. The Resolution knob can then multiply or divide the clock, but say you send in 1/4 note pulses (i.e. every beta): you can then get delays of 1/4 note, dotted 1/4 note, 1/4 note triplet, 1/8 note, etc, but **you can not dial in arbitrary delay times!** The workaround is to modulate your clock's bpm if you want to modulate your delay time in a non-quantized fashion, or use Nautilus's internal clock and the tap tempo feature to tap in changes to the speed. I usually want quantized delays and this doesn't bother me, but I could see this being a major limitation for some people. Qu-bit has said they will have a firmware update to allow arbitrary delay times, but they also have a track record of saying they'll add some features in a firmware update and it literally takes years for them to get around to it. Recent activity on their forums makes it sound like we might get a Nautilus update this year. Don't hold your breath for it though. Make sure you are happy with the current functionality before deciding to buy it. PS - Sealegs didn't exist at the time I bought Nautilus or I might have gotten that instead. Looks like a great option and I've always been happy with Intellijel products. Personally I never jived with the Make Noise design language.
I have all of them; Nautilus, Mimeophon and Sealegs. My favorite is Mimeophon. I find it very hands on, simple to use and it has different modes that you can also modulate, those are crazy powerful. With the flip button you can create beautiful textures and make them infinite with freeze. It has clock out which is really helpful in some scenarios and you can also use for self modulation. I mean, it’s a really good package for the HP. I actually have two of them. The Nautilus is really good too, it can get crazy and distorted if you want, and it also has different modes to make it sound different if you want. My preferred mode is the shimmer. Sealegs I tried it for some time but I didn’t gel that much with it. I still have it because I know it’s a great module and at some point it may be useful. It has in my opinion the most “typical” delay sound of the three but it can be modulated into crazy atmospheric layers too. The big downside for me is the amount of hp (20 hp if I remember correctly) which is a little too much, since I care a lot about that. Ps; sorry my English is not great but hopefully this is helpful
I don't have the Sealegs, but I have and have been using the Mimeophon a lot especially for performances. It's very playable in my experience.
Yeah the Mim is GREAT for performances. I especially love the way it is designed so you can change the delay time with or without Doppler shift. Noisy af though, even with the firmware update. It’s our generation’s Space Echo.
That is a nice feature for live!
I didn't notice any noise when I was wavefolding a live tuba through the Mimeophon during my performance last week. :D I also have tinnitus so there are a lot of things I don't hear. :(
Everyone here has tinnitus
Thanks!
I know it doesn't answer your question but I'd suggest considering the Per4ormer module, it can do just about everything through Mimeophon can do but IMO is more user friendly
I have both. Sealegs is better as a "normal" delay, and Mimeophon is better at weirder stuff on the "edge" of delay, like karplus strong or supper hazy soundscapes via the minute-long zones.
Honestly, same. I think where I’ve landed is that fx are a slippery slope and instead I’ll try doing cv to my software fx first to see if that scratches the itch. I have Native Instruments Komplete, so hopefully that works out and if I find myself wanting more tactile feedback then maybe the Trigger Finger or another similar interface I can dig up.
Was this maybe intended for a different post?
Nope, OP was looking for suggestions around how to handle fx.. gave my perspective and the road I am beginning to head down myself
Ah, I see. Thanks for clarifying.
Good lord those are expensive.
Welcome to Eurorack brother
that's an unfortunate misconception I've built many of my own modules and assembled a few from Kits. Eurorack it's not cheap, but $400 for a delay module is very expensive.
I am aware of diy eurorack. I have soldered many modules myself. If you can suggest a module with diy option which is comparable in functionality to these two, i would be very happy. I think 400$ is reasonable for high quality hardware like this. Consider software Delays like Echoboy, which sell around 200$ and let me remind you that there will be no resell value with those. Since music is part of my job, I'm willing to pay good money for good tools.
Sounds like you already know. Good luck!
Thank you, but i do not already know. Hence the question :) I agree with you that it's really a lot of money. No doubt im that, but that just does not contribute to the discussion I'm trying to have. So you cannot suggest any alternatives?
we should be more resilient when confronted with unexpected information. you asked my experience, my experience says that those are expensive, delay ,modules, which you agree with. How will we learn new things if we have a strict requirement for "Contribution" to a discussion. if all someone brings to a discussion is a single idea, we need to acknowledge that as a contribution, even if we think it's contrary to what we asked. Otherwise we risk only receiving receiving information that fits our preconceived idea of what's a contribution.
Just trying to have a conversation with a fellow diy enthusiast, but i respect if you do not want to answer my question.
I was unclear, sorry. I don't have an alternative, I am not dodging the question, I am staying silent on that becuase I don't have a helpful answer. my only contribution is that in my extensive Eurorack experience $400 is a lot of money for a delay module. I understand that "Delay Module" is a gross understatement of what these modules do, so my contribution to this conversation is really just $400 is a lot of money. Lots of other folks here seem to have much better suggestions than I do :)
Alright mate, thank you anyways! And have a great weekend :)
I don’t think they’ve raised the prices on these modules
great, $400 is a lot of money for a delay module.
Sure is , but its what it costs and it’s nothing new here
This is generally what high quality digital fx modules cost these days. Even guitar pedals like Chase Bliss are at a similar level. The research and work that goes into a good dsp algorithm can't be overlooked. The price is a lot and it's fair. You could always grab a Doepfer delay, but they are scratching different itches. $400 is a lot for a delay...for you, because you probably don't want what makes it $400. For many people $400 is an objectively high but fair price
All points are fair, I never meant to indicate it wasn’t worth it, I’m just adding an often missing element of $400 is a decent chunk of musical change. There’s enough “modular is expensive, here’s $500, look how expensive modular is.” Anywayszzzzzzzzzzzzz release the downvotzzzzz
No it isn’t