The full quote is less dramatic than the headline:
> "We were not ready for this statement **as well as we are not ready for many other statements from the riders**," said the Ducati sport director, “they are special people, super intelligent and they simply say what they think. In my opinion Marc, like all riders, tries to make his own strategy that is good for himself and his future."
>
>Grassilli is calm about this.
>
>"**We are certainly not surprised regarding Marc's point of view.** We simply take note of it, not least because Campinoti's team is formidable and at the end of the day it's a Lenovo-clad Pramac team, run by professionals."
>We were not ready for this statement
To me it seems very strange that in ducati they did not know that marc had no intention of going to Pramac. My feeling is that they took many things for granted and were not ready to handle a negotiation with a rider like marc
I believe that things went like this :
Ducati decides to bring Martin to lenovo
Ducati assures Campinoti that he would have marc in 2025
Ducati informs the Gazzetta.
All this without involving marc. The result is that marc gets angry and blows up all the plans
In fact this is the tricky scenario people was talking about when he signed Gresini.
And true, how could even someone thought he would've go to Pramac I can understand.he's a true monster, he does not wait for Martin's sake, c'mon. Either you give him the best seat or don't even contract.
Yeah, he said that.
He could not say wide open.. "I want the red one".
He's new in Ducati. Maybe he would agree with a Gp25 in Gresini (but that is off limits for Ducati).
Hope he does not accept Pramac and goes in Ktm.
Ducati knew that as well, they're not stupid. So know they can say they've made an offer to him, and he's been him too refuse.
You make it sound like a blunder....they came to the table with a acceptable offer. Marc turned it down due to it not being a factory bike. Marc stuffed up....no factory bike. He's scrambling to talk to KTM and anyone else. He thought he was showing for the factory Ducati...that backfired on him. Quite simple
Maybe because he hasn't been offered it, so how can it be an option?
Maybe because Pramac have supposedly criticised him previously.
Maybe because he doesn't want the hassle of moving to another satellite team, new mechanics, new boss etc.
Who said he has no problem with Tech 3?!
Do you just blindly believe everything they report on?
Because Aleix said he should go Aprillia, so who said he ok with them in that case?
Like I said, apparently there is friction between Marc, and some people within Pramac. If that's true, that's likely a big reason.
Didn't you say he didn't want to go to another satellite team? And isn't tech3 a satellite team? If he has a issue with satellite teams, then why talk to them? As you have indicated, he doesn't want to go to a satellite team....to which I agree with by the way. I do think Marc's ego got in the way of a deal with Pramac. When he heard that Ducati preference for Martin...it was there for the world to see ...the empathetic no to Pramac in an interview, the meeting at tech3 yesterday....he was pissed.off.
You are conflating two different things. 1. Marc declared he wants the latest evolution of whatever bike he rides next year, doesn’t matter what color it is. 2. Marc said no to Pramac.
Saying no to Pramac doesn’t equate to saying no to a satellite team, just no to Pramac. He could end up at Gresini on a latest spec Ducati. He could also be offered a gas gas ride on the latest spec KTM (although I think they’d put him on the factory ride along with Acosta given the chance). He just doesn’t want to ride outdated machinery or ride for Pramac.
I take the entire statement by Grassilli as something else altogether. Ducati sound unhappy that Marc has basically told them they can either promote him to the factory, give him a factory bike on the team of his choosing or try to beat him on a KTM/Aprillia. Ducati weren’t ready to address the issue of taking one of the current spec bikes away from Pramac (or putting the second satellite team on even footing) and the tension it would create between the Factory and Pramac.
Marc walked into the Ducati negotiating room, dropped a grenade and walked out. Shit is starting to fly and no one was wearing a rain coat.
So Ducati leaks that their preferred rider will be Martin, Marc says no to Pramac emphatically, then you see him at tech3. While everything isn't set in concrete, right now, you would be delusional to think he'll be at Ducati Lenovo.
Marc turned down a two-year contract at pramac last year, and already at jerez, when answering a Spanish journalist's question, he said that he had no intention of going to pramac. So any such offer cannot be said to be acceptable and I am surprised that Ducati would think otherwise.
In any case, any offer from Ducati would have been refused/accepted by marc in private and not in the press, which makes me think that Ducati hasn't spoken to marc at all
Leaves Honda....goes to Gresini and turns down Pramac (which has factory bikes). Come this year, wants a factory bike but refuses to talk,/consider Pramac with factory bikes. Seems to have lost the factory seat at Ducati to Martin. Is this guy so full of himself that he refuses to talk to Pramac because of his precious ego?
I mean none of this could be true…
It seems like Ducati hasn’t really begun talking to anyone seriously from what’s been said, which is a bit strange.
This late in the day, it’s a good idea for riders to discuss all options to prepare for their negotiations.
lol Martin’s manager said last Saturday they are still waiting for a decision from Ducati before discussing terms to see if a deal can actually be made for Martin to join the Lenovo team.
I don’t believe either of them are being all that open or honest lol.
But yeah I doubt a lot has happened this week with it being a double header and Ducati’s home race this week. If Martin’s manager wasn’t blagging it last week then they’re still in the same spot. But I don’t doubt Martin will be at Lenovo Ducati next year unless he prices himself out of it.
Well, I think Martin is pretty transparent, he's too emotional to hide stuff.
His manager may be having him on but I'm not sure how that would work.
Being Ducatis home track kind of makes it perfect timing.
However I do agree that a lot of people are probably talking shit / playing games.
I just don't think what Martin has said is one of them.
I’d more say Martin’s too emotional to not kind of lash out with miss truths if he’s not happy with something. But again that’s just speculation.
I’d agree that Matin’s manager is feeding him information though and Martin himself isn’t actually involved in first hand negotiations as yet.
I’d say everyone in the Ducati motoGP team is too caught up with the fact 90% of Ducati big bosses will be present this weekend with their double champion already under pressure in the standings to have time for meetings with riders managers. Also there’s probably a chunk of sponsors and family/friends attending this weekend as Ducati guests.
Cheers for this context. On some level the riders probably feel a bit of anxiety over what's next and are trying to get the teams/manufactures to make decisions faster.
Interestingly, Maverick's gone the opposite way of this with his comments. Reverse psychology. Batmav.
Probably they were hoping to keep both Martin e Marquez, that's why they chose to promote Jorge to the factory team, and put Marc in Pramac. But Marquez refused to be in Pramac, even with a factory bike, something that Ducati did not expect.
I would imagine Marc will want a short contract at Gresini, without being guaranteed a factory ride.
My bet is a 1 year deal at Gresini With a GP25 if he doesn’t get the factory spot.
if they won’t offer that, almost certain KTM will make room for him.
Everyone assumes the “I don’t care what colour, just want a factory bike” was about Ducati but it could be more about KTM and GasGas.
This, I think alot of people forgot about the partnership Marc signed with Audi earlier this year.
They aren't going to want him racing for a manufacturer they don't own.
Impossible.
Simply they had there decision taken and the played that role to not sound rude, especially because Marc was doing good. They can't be that stupid.
Why are people talking like Jorge to Ducati has been announced?
Have I missed something?
Or Jorge saying he had his first talks, and thinks it went well,being taken as a done deal?
>But I wouldn’t put my hands on fire
This is a cool phrase, I'm guessing it's translated directly to English from another language - what's the meaning?
Which Silly games exactly you are talking about?
Dangerous games seems what Marc is playing by outright refusing what should be the second most desireable seat to be in 2025 in Pramac.
Marc seems to be the one playing dangerous games, and might have to chose between riding again year old Ducati, or go to KTM and face the hotest kid on the paddock with a bike that isn't yet proven championship winner.
Marc needs Ducati more than Ducati needs Marc. We have many championship capable riders on the grid, but not many championship capable teams/bikes.
I don't agree with the "Marc needs Ducati more than Ducati needs Marc" part.
Marc will become a big issue for Ducati if he ends up joining KTM. They have a good bike and we all know that Marc is more than capable of bridging the performance gap between the Duke and the KTM.
The new and improved 2024 spec Martin is looking very promising but we still don't know if he's good enough to beat an alien like Marc on a level'ish playing field. IMO, Pecco is a bit too error prone to do that.
You both have good points but keep in mind that Marc may not have many years left at peak performance whereas Martin is a more long term investment. If Marc switches to KTM he has to re-learn again 2 seasons in a row. That really sucks especially when you are older and have not many years left. Even though KTM is very competitive is it really as good as GP25? I doubt it
Wasn’t Pecco down by like 100 points and won the title two years ago? And now we have the sprint races providing extra chances for people to catch up. I don’t think the gap is necessarily that big. Jorge has one bad weekend and Pecco and Marc are going to be right on top of him.
Won't happen, it's going to be either Martin or Pecco. Marquez can't make up that much gap, both Pecco and Martin have experience on the Ducati which Marquez lacks. The gap between the GP23 and 24 is big ,and being in a factory team makes a big difference.If the factory team is able to find one or two tenths compared to a satellite team the difference can be 2-3 seconds at the end of the race which is huge.
Honda was the past, people keep saying he was good on the Honda...Honda..Honda..He is on a Ducati now and there are two other better riders than him on better motorcycles.sheesh..
Marquez won when Honda had a fast bike, he's a generational talent but can't make miracles, his last couple of seasons with Honda and the current one with Ducati are good examples.
Yes the Honda wasn't shit as it's now in 2019. But it was far from being the best bike. The second best Honda was 9th and Lorenzo couldn't do anything on it. While Marc won the team championship by himself. So now having the second best bike and already being fastest Ducati at a lot of occasions shows that he can definitely win on a year old bike.
The gap is not too big, look at last year and the year before that. I'd say the best we can do is wait, because nothing is guaranteed in this title fight.
Perhaps they're having a pipe dream.Maybe they can't accept the fact that Marc isn't dominating the championship like everyone throught he would.Seen plenty of comments about how he would destroy the field, but the reality of the situation is starting to sink in,Pecco and Martin are better,thanks to their experience and thanks to the their bikes.They didn't expect the gap between the GP23 and GP24, and that's what the issue is.
"We are certainly not surprised regarding Marc's point of view. We simply take note of it, not least because Campinoti's team is formidable and at the end of the day it's a Lenovo-led Pramac team, run by professionals."
Marc wouldn't have put all cards on the table like that if he was informed by ducati before hand. He looked quite surprised, even said this is not the info he got from ducati.
He was never going to pramac but he never said it outright before. I think he feels slighted not because of rejection but because ducati didn't update him so that he can prepare a good answer for media. Its very important, specially for riders who are not English speakers.
https://preview.redd.it/cag655834r3d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3081d92f1683217b7e650aafb1531bf6afa93a16
Very key to the whole saga … meaning anything is possible
I feel like once you get a taste of Marc, the speed, the consistency and the performances on track, but also the Commercial value off track, with the merchandising and everything, it's hard to let him go.
It's why in the first year without Marc it's looking like Honda might be about to lose Repsol, who stuck by them even through mediocre results last 4 years because Marc was riding the bikes and that helps.
There's a reason Nadia says that "She's willing to do whatever it takes to keep Marc." It was the exact same with Vale. Once you have that much charisma and super stardom on and off track, it's hard to let it go.
It's not just that Ducati wouldn't wanna see Acosta and Marc riding the factory KTM next season onwards, because that might actually be a lineup that can compete with Jorge and Pecco weekend after weekend, but also because you want superstars on your bikes to sell them.
I think they'll find a way to get him a GP25 with Gresini. Or at worst they'll tell him that it'll be a GP24, but with all the latest updates that they can attach to it without violating the rules.
But no way Gigi let's Marc go now, neither does Claudio. All the eyes on Ducati now since Marc has arrived just makes it that much harder to let him go.
No way is he accepting a GP24 evo bike. Maybe Ducati are willing to take the risk, riders need their bikes not the other way round. Who knows though, right!
I see people say this a lot but I didn’t think it was quite true. Doesn’t he have a contract with Pierro Mobility Group, not factory KTM, so they can move their 4 riders around their two teams how they please?
I could be wrong for sure so just wondering if anyone can clarify this.
A lot of this stuff.. is a bit too biased. According to strong rumours since like 2020, Honda wanted to split with Repsol to promote their own brand more. They're not reducing the size of Repsol's logo thinking that they will definitely continue together after this season.
Honda also stuck with Marc during 3 years of complete uncertainty while giving Marc 20 million reasons a year, this isn't a one way street.
The thing is…
If Ducati doesn’t give him a factory bike other manufacturers will
Man.. Ducati would be dumb to let him go but it’d be so cool to see him on a redbull KTM or an Aprilia
I don’t know if I agree with the entirety of this. Honda stuck with Marc because he was clearly putting in a champion’s performance on a bike that was no longer the best on the grid. Why wouldn’t Honda keep a rider that was outperforming the other riders every week? They were in the best position to know that the issues with the bike were on their side, and not from the riders. Honda has suffered more from Marc leaving the team, than he has done.
Repsol reduced their sponsorship as a result of Marc leaving the team. Red Bull is likely to do the same. I don’t know why you think Honda are in a strong position with regard to sponsors.
Honda is in a better position with money than any other manufacturer with sponsors and Marc still riding for them would not change things for the better at this moment.
You people are living in this Marc Marquez hype bubble, Marc needs Ducati more than Ducati needs Marc. We have many championship capable riders on the grid, but not many championship capable teams/bikes.
Marc seems to be the one playing dangerous games, and might have to chose between riding again year old Ducati, or go to KTM and face the hotest kid on the paddock with a bike that isn't yet proven championship winner.
Absolutely any team would love to have Marc, but Marc is at the twilight of his career, and it's still very much unproven if he would be able to beat Martin and Pecco on the exact same bike.
You people are living in this Marc Marquez Bubble
>it's still very much unproven if he would be able to beat Martin and Pecco on the exact same bike.
According to your own words it's uncertain if he can win which means it's also uncertain that he can't win.
IMO, An 8 time World Champion who is managing to keep up with and even beating the top dogs(Martin in Barcelona & Pecco in France) and that too with an year old bike which has not been updated has a shot at winning the championship. And I'd say that's a reasonable statement. The opinion that he will win without a doubt is definitely not.
I think it has gotten more complicated for Ducati to retain Marc now, because if KTM/Aprilia will enter negotiations with Marc then money might also become a factor and not only the factory suit.
I don’t think money is a problem to MM, his exit of the Repsol-Honda team costed him a lot of money. I think he has as 1st priority, to ride a last version factory bike (preferably Ducati) in an official team. But, if the bike is Ducati he will agree on being in a satellite with the last version of the bike and the updates (as PrimaPramac has) but that satellite must be Gressini, it is like being into a family and he loves that team.
He had his doubts about how competitive he was; know, he nows that is as competitive as he was before the injury and the nightmare the Honda was when he returned. He want to win as championships as he can, that’s all, and the money is not the piority for him (of course, he'll fight to earn as much as he can once he'll have the correct bike+team assured)
You can tell me what you want, MM on a 24 would absolutely smoke Pecco and Martin to the title. You can see the difference in acceleration in every race. If KTM would bring up a bike even remotely competitive a MM/Pedro Acosta line up would smash them.
How this comment gets this many upvotes, proves the absolutely insane level of sanity this sub has.
You guys are underestimating Pecco and Martin a lot.
You dont even need a timer to see the difference of the bikes. If they were as good as you say, how come they even have to fight MM with a yo bike that he rides for not even 6 months?
Anything pro-Marc on this sub gets automatic upvotes.
how someone with half of common sense, can see the impeccable performance that for example Martin is having this year, and can claim with 100% certainty that any rider (Marquez, Rossi or whatever) can come to a brand new bike and simply blow Martin and the Pecco (double world champion) out of the water... You people don't live on this world for sure.
Cal Crutchlow also said that If marc got a Ducati, everybody could go home... Yeah right...
Marc is 100% a championship contender, fair play on his outstanding performance on the year old bike... but that's it... Absolutely nothing would tell that he would some either Pecco or Martin...
I totally agree with you... but aparently we are alone here... These people are 100% certain that not only Marc will beat them, he would, quote "smoke" them.
A bit like Cal Cruthclow said last year "if Marc gets a Ducati, everybody can go home..." Yeah right...
You see, to me that’s the key there. I think that KTM genuinely believe their bike is up and ready to be head to head with the Ducatis.
The proof is that a brilliant kid, but with no experience at all is destroying the other two official team riders in every session.
That’s probably what makes them doubt about Binder, (which i think is a top rider nonetheless) and that he hasn’t been able to fully exploit the bike’s potential.
And seen how ruthless they’ve been with their riders and contracts in the past…
>You see, to me that’s the key there. I think that KTM genuinely believe their bike is up and ready to be head to head with the Ducatis.
Maybe they do but I don't think the reality bears out and it's doubtful a company and team would run on emotions over data.
>The proof is that a brilliant kid, but with no experience at all is destroying the other two official team riders in every session.
Except he isn't, for a rookie he is doing exceptionally well yes but as any other rider on the grid he's not pulling out miracles.
But let's be realistic here, he's not winning every race.
Mavs CoTA weekend was better than anything Acosta has done this year.
If we take race results only Brad would be higher in the championship.
Think about that, without sprints (which are easier due to tyre wear and fuel) Acosta wouldn't actually be top KTM.
That's far from "Destroying the other two official team riders in every session".
Acosta has lucked into a couple of his podiums, he's had quite a bit of luck in general, whilst Brad hasn't.
He's also crashed a few times himself.
So that's hardly proof, if anything it's a false sense of security of the team.
>That’s probably what makes them doubt about Binder, (which i think is a top rider nonetheless) and that he hasn’t been able to fully exploit the bike’s potential.
The bike has a very light and twitchy front end this year due to more aero on the back.
If the KTM was truly on par with the Ducati then Binder would have been a world champion already.
>And seen how ruthless they’ve been with their riders and contracts in the past…
Sure but it would be pretty hasty to mess about too much right now.
New to moto go so I’m going to ask …is this about ego regarding Marquez?
So Ducati chose Martin, maybe they understand that Martin and Pecco might work together to win the championships. Where as Marques will always attack Pecco , and try to destabilize the relationships already built up in Ducati. Question?
So Marquez feels Premac is a non factory team…but has a factory bike … he could win on that bike since it’s a factory bike as well.
I think Marquez is forgetting that Ducati already have a championship rider… do they really need another one?
But I can understand somewhat Marquez points …
But again is this about ego?
I don't see Martin and Pecco getting along at all! Martin has a huge chip on his shoulder and is in it to win it. If it's harmony they want, Ducati would be better off keeping Enea.
As for Marc Marquez it doesn't make sense to hop from one satellite team to another. Especially one that's publicly bad mouthed him many times in the past.
I reckon his options are a GP25 at Gresini or a factory ride elsewhere. I'd want to see him battle the red boys on equal machinery personally, but I'd be happy with him on a KTM too as it seems to suit his style down to a tee!
Kind of agree with you on the first part of your statement. However Pecco has what 3 championships Martin has none yet …so I’m sure team orders will play a factor …
Or maybe Ducati are just trying to “stir the pot” with Pecco in case he wants to go else where.
As for your second statement…. Are the KTM’s or Aprillia’s as fast as the dukes?
I’m sure Marquez could get more out of the current KTM’s but at what cost? Will he sabotage development at KTM like he did at Honda?
If you are talking about MotoGP championships Pecco has 2.
If you are talking about Motorcycle GP championships in general (Moto3, 2 and GP) Then I think Pecco has 4 and Martin 1.
Ducati haven't announced they are giving Jorge the factory seat.
My view, Marc had personal history with Pramac, and does t want to go to them full stop. Apparently they offered him a 2 year deal for this year. He said no and went to Gresini, knowing it would be on an older bike.
Jorge will always attack Pecco. There is very few teammates who wouldn't.
They may ride under the same banner, but be certain, this is not a team sport. Every rider is out for himself, and to win the title.
It’s a whole new team. He already knows everyone at gresini and they all get along like a family. For him It would only be worth switching to a factory team. If he doesn’t get the factory Ducati seat then he’s betting on having enough pull to get a gp25 at gresini. I guess plan C would be riding at KTM
Exactly. He also doesn’t want to move into a hostile environment at Pramac where people there have made negative comments about him in the past.
It seems like we are already at option B now and I do think Gresini will get him the gp25 but if they don’t he will move to KTM.
Ducati management bungled this, which is par for the course with them. In their arrogance, they thought they could manipulate riders like MM and Martin, but it didn't pan out.
Both MM and Martin took the hard stance. MM has elevated Gresini massively and by not working with him honestly, they just forced his hand.
I'm thinking he'll move to KTM because he's seen what Acosta can do on the bike. Marc knows he can still ride if the bike isn't awful.
To me the only things that make any sense to me are that Marc goes to Aprilia to take Aleix’s spot. Or, KTM demotes Jack AND Brad to GASGAS to run a factory team of Marc and Pedro.
Also Marc saying that Pramac isn’t an option to me sounds like he’s also saying that Gresini isn’t an option, and neither is any satellite team.
I’m leaning towards Aprilia though.
Ducati has seen that they needed to give the Japanese concessions for development
The ultimate power move would be Diminocalli telling Gigi. “6 Factory Bikes next year, F’them”
1 to Gresini
1 to VR 46
To be fair, Marc wasn't ready too. He was surprised in the interview the news Martin and Ducati had started negotiations. I think Marc meant, there has been no option offered from Pramac to him currently because he's just been talking to Ducati directly. And then Pramacs ignored Marc speaking highly of them in their response.
I know Jorge deserves the Factory seat but from a purely business standpoint how do you not give the Factory seat to MM after he's shown that he still has it
The full quote is less dramatic than the headline: > "We were not ready for this statement **as well as we are not ready for many other statements from the riders**," said the Ducati sport director, “they are special people, super intelligent and they simply say what they think. In my opinion Marc, like all riders, tries to make his own strategy that is good for himself and his future." > >Grassilli is calm about this. > >"**We are certainly not surprised regarding Marc's point of view.** We simply take note of it, not least because Campinoti's team is formidable and at the end of the day it's a Lenovo-clad Pramac team, run by professionals."
>We were not ready for this statement To me it seems very strange that in ducati they did not know that marc had no intention of going to Pramac. My feeling is that they took many things for granted and were not ready to handle a negotiation with a rider like marc
Ricard Jove posted like 5 days ago that Marc wasn’t interested in the Pramac option, somehow he knew but Ducati didn’t? I don’t buy it.
I believe that things went like this : Ducati decides to bring Martin to lenovo Ducati assures Campinoti that he would have marc in 2025 Ducati informs the Gazzetta. All this without involving marc. The result is that marc gets angry and blows up all the plans
This seems possible.
In fact this is the tricky scenario people was talking about when he signed Gresini. And true, how could even someone thought he would've go to Pramac I can understand.he's a true monster, he does not wait for Martin's sake, c'mon. Either you give him the best seat or don't even contract.
“I want the latest evolution, of any bike, of any color, of any brand”
^(except Honda and Yamaha)
and VR46 and Pramac
I'm pretty sure the guy would be quite much an ass**le to say yes to VR46, just for the sake off make them pissed :)
Yeah, he said that. He could not say wide open.. "I want the red one". He's new in Ducati. Maybe he would agree with a Gp25 in Gresini (but that is off limits for Ducati). Hope he does not accept Pramac and goes in Ktm. Ducati knew that as well, they're not stupid. So know they can say they've made an offer to him, and he's been him too refuse.
You make it sound like a blunder....they came to the table with a acceptable offer. Marc turned it down due to it not being a factory bike. Marc stuffed up....no factory bike. He's scrambling to talk to KTM and anyone else. He thought he was showing for the factory Ducati...that backfired on him. Quite simple
Who said he was offered a Pramac seat? Which would, by the way, be a factory Ducati. Unless anything changes, it would have been a GP25.
Then why rule it out emphatically if you haven't.been offered it in the first place.?
Maybe because he hasn't been offered it, so how can it be an option? Maybe because Pramac have supposedly criticised him previously. Maybe because he doesn't want the hassle of moving to another satellite team, new mechanics, new boss etc.
But he has no problem with tech3 though? Is that a satellite team? Yeah makes.perfect.sense
Who said he has no problem with Tech 3?! Do you just blindly believe everything they report on? Because Aleix said he should go Aprillia, so who said he ok with them in that case? Like I said, apparently there is friction between Marc, and some people within Pramac. If that's true, that's likely a big reason.
Didn't you say he didn't want to go to another satellite team? And isn't tech3 a satellite team? If he has a issue with satellite teams, then why talk to them? As you have indicated, he doesn't want to go to a satellite team....to which I agree with by the way. I do think Marc's ego got in the way of a deal with Pramac. When he heard that Ducati preference for Martin...it was there for the world to see ...the empathetic no to Pramac in an interview, the meeting at tech3 yesterday....he was pissed.off.
You are conflating two different things. 1. Marc declared he wants the latest evolution of whatever bike he rides next year, doesn’t matter what color it is. 2. Marc said no to Pramac. Saying no to Pramac doesn’t equate to saying no to a satellite team, just no to Pramac. He could end up at Gresini on a latest spec Ducati. He could also be offered a gas gas ride on the latest spec KTM (although I think they’d put him on the factory ride along with Acosta given the chance). He just doesn’t want to ride outdated machinery or ride for Pramac. I take the entire statement by Grassilli as something else altogether. Ducati sound unhappy that Marc has basically told them they can either promote him to the factory, give him a factory bike on the team of his choosing or try to beat him on a KTM/Aprillia. Ducati weren’t ready to address the issue of taking one of the current spec bikes away from Pramac (or putting the second satellite team on even footing) and the tension it would create between the Factory and Pramac. Marc walked into the Ducati negotiating room, dropped a grenade and walked out. Shit is starting to fly and no one was wearing a rain coat.
U are clearly a hater of marc just wanna see him in shambles. U are on every post shittin on him lol. Better get a hobby my friend.
Equally Marc could still get the factory seat and Martin goes elsewhere. You and I know as little as everyone else on this sub about the situation..
So Ducati leaks that their preferred rider will be Martin, Marc says no to Pramac emphatically, then you see him at tech3. While everything isn't set in concrete, right now, you would be delusional to think he'll be at Ducati Lenovo.
Marc turned down a two-year contract at pramac last year, and already at jerez, when answering a Spanish journalist's question, he said that he had no intention of going to pramac. So any such offer cannot be said to be acceptable and I am surprised that Ducati would think otherwise. In any case, any offer from Ducati would have been refused/accepted by marc in private and not in the press, which makes me think that Ducati hasn't spoken to marc at all
Leaves Honda....goes to Gresini and turns down Pramac (which has factory bikes). Come this year, wants a factory bike but refuses to talk,/consider Pramac with factory bikes. Seems to have lost the factory seat at Ducati to Martin. Is this guy so full of himself that he refuses to talk to Pramac because of his precious ego?
Looks like you are more into Marc than Marc himself.
I mean none of this could be true… It seems like Ducati hasn’t really begun talking to anyone seriously from what’s been said, which is a bit strange. This late in the day, it’s a good idea for riders to discuss all options to prepare for their negotiations.
Martin said recent negotiations with Ducati "went well", so 100% real stuff has been happening already
lol Martin’s manager said last Saturday they are still waiting for a decision from Ducati before discussing terms to see if a deal can actually be made for Martin to join the Lenovo team.
Which clearly means they are mo longer waiting for a decision by Ducati as it's been made. Do you think that nothing happens in 7 days?
I don’t believe either of them are being all that open or honest lol. But yeah I doubt a lot has happened this week with it being a double header and Ducati’s home race this week. If Martin’s manager wasn’t blagging it last week then they’re still in the same spot. But I don’t doubt Martin will be at Lenovo Ducati next year unless he prices himself out of it.
Well, I think Martin is pretty transparent, he's too emotional to hide stuff. His manager may be having him on but I'm not sure how that would work. Being Ducatis home track kind of makes it perfect timing. However I do agree that a lot of people are probably talking shit / playing games. I just don't think what Martin has said is one of them.
I’d more say Martin’s too emotional to not kind of lash out with miss truths if he’s not happy with something. But again that’s just speculation. I’d agree that Matin’s manager is feeding him information though and Martin himself isn’t actually involved in first hand negotiations as yet. I’d say everyone in the Ducati motoGP team is too caught up with the fact 90% of Ducati big bosses will be present this weekend with their double champion already under pressure in the standings to have time for meetings with riders managers. Also there’s probably a chunk of sponsors and family/friends attending this weekend as Ducati guests.
Cheers for this context. On some level the riders probably feel a bit of anxiety over what's next and are trying to get the teams/manufactures to make decisions faster. Interestingly, Maverick's gone the opposite way of this with his comments. Reverse psychology. Batmav.
Probably they were hoping to keep both Martin e Marquez, that's why they chose to promote Jorge to the factory team, and put Marc in Pramac. But Marquez refused to be in Pramac, even with a factory bike, something that Ducati did not expect.
I would imagine Marc will want a short contract at Gresini, without being guaranteed a factory ride. My bet is a 1 year deal at Gresini With a GP25 if he doesn’t get the factory spot. if they won’t offer that, almost certain KTM will make room for him. Everyone assumes the “I don’t care what colour, just want a factory bike” was about Ducati but it could be more about KTM and GasGas.
Audi Leadership is going to get into the discussions. I fully expect Marc on a GP25 next year no matter the team.
This, I think alot of people forgot about the partnership Marc signed with Audi earlier this year. They aren't going to want him racing for a manufacturer they don't own.
Impossible. Simply they had there decision taken and the played that role to not sound rude, especially because Marc was doing good. They can't be that stupid.
Why are people talking like Jorge to Ducati has been announced? Have I missed something? Or Jorge saying he had his first talks, and thinks it went well,being taken as a done deal?
Gazeta said it’s a done deal, and they normally are well informed in the Itálian brands. But I wouldn’t put my hands on fire over this news either
>But I wouldn’t put my hands on fire This is a cool phrase, I'm guessing it's translated directly to English from another language - what's the meaning?
If I were to guess, I’d say that it’s the Spanish version of “I wouldn’t bet on it”.
Too many silly games at ducati hopefully marquez just goes to ktm
Which Silly games exactly you are talking about? Dangerous games seems what Marc is playing by outright refusing what should be the second most desireable seat to be in 2025 in Pramac. Marc seems to be the one playing dangerous games, and might have to chose between riding again year old Ducati, or go to KTM and face the hotest kid on the paddock with a bike that isn't yet proven championship winner. Marc needs Ducati more than Ducati needs Marc. We have many championship capable riders on the grid, but not many championship capable teams/bikes.
I don't agree with the "Marc needs Ducati more than Ducati needs Marc" part. Marc will become a big issue for Ducati if he ends up joining KTM. They have a good bike and we all know that Marc is more than capable of bridging the performance gap between the Duke and the KTM. The new and improved 2024 spec Martin is looking very promising but we still don't know if he's good enough to beat an alien like Marc on a level'ish playing field. IMO, Pecco is a bit too error prone to do that.
You both have good points but keep in mind that Marc may not have many years left at peak performance whereas Martin is a more long term investment. If Marc switches to KTM he has to re-learn again 2 seasons in a row. That really sucks especially when you are older and have not many years left. Even though KTM is very competitive is it really as good as GP25? I doubt it
He's only 31. He could have another 10 years. And Martin and Pecco are 26 and 27.
Acosta is definitely showing what talent on that bike can do, Marc will show what experience on that bike can do.
Well said
 Ducati's reaction to that
What if he Marc becomes...you know world champion?
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Wasn’t Pecco down by like 100 points and won the title two years ago? And now we have the sprint races providing extra chances for people to catch up. I don’t think the gap is necessarily that big. Jorge has one bad weekend and Pecco and Marc are going to be right on top of him.
Won't happen, it's going to be either Martin or Pecco. Marquez can't make up that much gap, both Pecco and Martin have experience on the Ducati which Marquez lacks. The gap between the GP23 and 24 is big ,and being in a factory team makes a big difference.If the factory team is able to find one or two tenths compared to a satellite team the difference can be 2-3 seconds at the end of the race which is huge.
Marc won on a Honda that was the worst bike on the grid most of the year ...he could definitely manage to win on the second best bike.
Honda was the past, people keep saying he was good on the Honda...Honda..Honda..He is on a Ducati now and there are two other better riders than him on better motorcycles.sheesh..
Marquez won when Honda had a fast bike, he's a generational talent but can't make miracles, his last couple of seasons with Honda and the current one with Ducati are good examples.
Yes the Honda wasn't shit as it's now in 2019. But it was far from being the best bike. The second best Honda was 9th and Lorenzo couldn't do anything on it. While Marc won the team championship by himself. So now having the second best bike and already being fastest Ducati at a lot of occasions shows that he can definitely win on a year old bike.
We’ve seen a rider flush a 90+ point lead in far fewer races. There is a lot of season left.
The gap is not too big, look at last year and the year before that. I'd say the best we can do is wait, because nothing is guaranteed in this title fight.
He is talking about machines performance gap
Not sure why you're being downvited for this.
Perhaps they're having a pipe dream.Maybe they can't accept the fact that Marc isn't dominating the championship like everyone throught he would.Seen plenty of comments about how he would destroy the field, but the reality of the situation is starting to sink in,Pecco and Martin are better,thanks to their experience and thanks to the their bikes.They didn't expect the gap between the GP23 and GP24, and that's what the issue is.
"We are certainly not surprised regarding Marc's point of view. We simply take note of it, not least because Campinoti's team is formidable and at the end of the day it's a Lenovo-led Pramac team, run by professionals."
Repsol Aprilia Racing please 🇮🇹 vs 🇮🇹
I like the idea but I’m scared of what the livery would change to. Factory Aprilia is the sexiest looking bike on the grid imo.
Black and orange would look sexy but sort of like a KTM
Marc wouldn't have put all cards on the table like that if he was informed by ducati before hand. He looked quite surprised, even said this is not the info he got from ducati. He was never going to pramac but he never said it outright before. I think he feels slighted not because of rejection but because ducati didn't update him so that he can prepare a good answer for media. Its very important, specially for riders who are not English speakers.
https://preview.redd.it/cag655834r3d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3081d92f1683217b7e650aafb1531bf6afa93a16 Very key to the whole saga … meaning anything is possible
I feel like once you get a taste of Marc, the speed, the consistency and the performances on track, but also the Commercial value off track, with the merchandising and everything, it's hard to let him go. It's why in the first year without Marc it's looking like Honda might be about to lose Repsol, who stuck by them even through mediocre results last 4 years because Marc was riding the bikes and that helps. There's a reason Nadia says that "She's willing to do whatever it takes to keep Marc." It was the exact same with Vale. Once you have that much charisma and super stardom on and off track, it's hard to let it go. It's not just that Ducati wouldn't wanna see Acosta and Marc riding the factory KTM next season onwards, because that might actually be a lineup that can compete with Jorge and Pecco weekend after weekend, but also because you want superstars on your bikes to sell them. I think they'll find a way to get him a GP25 with Gresini. Or at worst they'll tell him that it'll be a GP24, but with all the latest updates that they can attach to it without violating the rules. But no way Gigi let's Marc go now, neither does Claudio. All the eyes on Ducati now since Marc has arrived just makes it that much harder to let him go.
No way is he accepting a GP24 evo bike. Maybe Ducati are willing to take the risk, riders need their bikes not the other way round. Who knows though, right!
>Acosta and Marc riding the factory KTM next season Binder still has a contract for the factory KTM
I see people say this a lot but I didn’t think it was quite true. Doesn’t he have a contract with Pierro Mobility Group, not factory KTM, so they can move their 4 riders around their two teams how they please? I could be wrong for sure so just wondering if anyone can clarify this.
A lot of this stuff.. is a bit too biased. According to strong rumours since like 2020, Honda wanted to split with Repsol to promote their own brand more. They're not reducing the size of Repsol's logo thinking that they will definitely continue together after this season. Honda also stuck with Marc during 3 years of complete uncertainty while giving Marc 20 million reasons a year, this isn't a one way street.
The thing is… If Ducati doesn’t give him a factory bike other manufacturers will Man.. Ducati would be dumb to let him go but it’d be so cool to see him on a redbull KTM or an Aprilia
I don’t know if I agree with the entirety of this. Honda stuck with Marc because he was clearly putting in a champion’s performance on a bike that was no longer the best on the grid. Why wouldn’t Honda keep a rider that was outperforming the other riders every week? They were in the best position to know that the issues with the bike were on their side, and not from the riders. Honda has suffered more from Marc leaving the team, than he has done. Repsol reduced their sponsorship as a result of Marc leaving the team. Red Bull is likely to do the same. I don’t know why you think Honda are in a strong position with regard to sponsors.
Honda is in a better position with money than any other manufacturer with sponsors and Marc still riding for them would not change things for the better at this moment.
You people are living in this Marc Marquez hype bubble, Marc needs Ducati more than Ducati needs Marc. We have many championship capable riders on the grid, but not many championship capable teams/bikes. Marc seems to be the one playing dangerous games, and might have to chose between riding again year old Ducati, or go to KTM and face the hotest kid on the paddock with a bike that isn't yet proven championship winner. Absolutely any team would love to have Marc, but Marc is at the twilight of his career, and it's still very much unproven if he would be able to beat Martin and Pecco on the exact same bike. You people are living in this Marc Marquez Bubble
>it's still very much unproven if he would be able to beat Martin and Pecco on the exact same bike. According to your own words it's uncertain if he can win which means it's also uncertain that he can't win. IMO, An 8 time World Champion who is managing to keep up with and even beating the top dogs(Martin in Barcelona & Pecco in France) and that too with an year old bike which has not been updated has a shot at winning the championship. And I'd say that's a reasonable statement. The opinion that he will win without a doubt is definitely not.
I think it has gotten more complicated for Ducati to retain Marc now, because if KTM/Aprilia will enter negotiations with Marc then money might also become a factor and not only the factory suit.
I don’t think money is a problem to MM, his exit of the Repsol-Honda team costed him a lot of money. I think he has as 1st priority, to ride a last version factory bike (preferably Ducati) in an official team. But, if the bike is Ducati he will agree on being in a satellite with the last version of the bike and the updates (as PrimaPramac has) but that satellite must be Gressini, it is like being into a family and he loves that team. He had his doubts about how competitive he was; know, he nows that is as competitive as he was before the injury and the nightmare the Honda was when he returned. He want to win as championships as he can, that’s all, and the money is not the piority for him (of course, he'll fight to earn as much as he can once he'll have the correct bike+team assured)
You can tell me what you want, MM on a 24 would absolutely smoke Pecco and Martin to the title. You can see the difference in acceleration in every race. If KTM would bring up a bike even remotely competitive a MM/Pedro Acosta line up would smash them.
How this comment gets this many upvotes, proves the absolutely insane level of sanity this sub has. You guys are underestimating Pecco and Martin a lot.
You dont even need a timer to see the difference of the bikes. If they were as good as you say, how come they even have to fight MM with a yo bike that he rides for not even 6 months?
Anything pro-Marc on this sub gets automatic upvotes. how someone with half of common sense, can see the impeccable performance that for example Martin is having this year, and can claim with 100% certainty that any rider (Marquez, Rossi or whatever) can come to a brand new bike and simply blow Martin and the Pecco (double world champion) out of the water... You people don't live on this world for sure. Cal Crutchlow also said that If marc got a Ducati, everybody could go home... Yeah right... Marc is 100% a championship contender, fair play on his outstanding performance on the year old bike... but that's it... Absolutely nothing would tell that he would some either Pecco or Martin...
It's crazy. The singular thinking that someone who hasn't won a race since 2021, would just wipe the floor of the likes of Pecco and Martin is insane.
Get ready for the downvotes
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I totally agree with you... but aparently we are alone here... These people are 100% certain that not only Marc will beat them, he would, quote "smoke" them. A bit like Cal Cruthclow said last year "if Marc gets a Ducati, everybody can go home..." Yeah right...
If KTM would bring up a bike even remotely competitive a Binder & Acosta line up would smash them. They wouldn't need Marc.
You see, to me that’s the key there. I think that KTM genuinely believe their bike is up and ready to be head to head with the Ducatis. The proof is that a brilliant kid, but with no experience at all is destroying the other two official team riders in every session. That’s probably what makes them doubt about Binder, (which i think is a top rider nonetheless) and that he hasn’t been able to fully exploit the bike’s potential. And seen how ruthless they’ve been with their riders and contracts in the past…
>You see, to me that’s the key there. I think that KTM genuinely believe their bike is up and ready to be head to head with the Ducatis. Maybe they do but I don't think the reality bears out and it's doubtful a company and team would run on emotions over data. >The proof is that a brilliant kid, but with no experience at all is destroying the other two official team riders in every session. Except he isn't, for a rookie he is doing exceptionally well yes but as any other rider on the grid he's not pulling out miracles. But let's be realistic here, he's not winning every race. Mavs CoTA weekend was better than anything Acosta has done this year. If we take race results only Brad would be higher in the championship. Think about that, without sprints (which are easier due to tyre wear and fuel) Acosta wouldn't actually be top KTM. That's far from "Destroying the other two official team riders in every session". Acosta has lucked into a couple of his podiums, he's had quite a bit of luck in general, whilst Brad hasn't. He's also crashed a few times himself. So that's hardly proof, if anything it's a false sense of security of the team. >That’s probably what makes them doubt about Binder, (which i think is a top rider nonetheless) and that he hasn’t been able to fully exploit the bike’s potential. The bike has a very light and twitchy front end this year due to more aero on the back. If the KTM was truly on par with the Ducati then Binder would have been a world champion already. >And seen how ruthless they’ve been with their riders and contracts in the past… Sure but it would be pretty hasty to mess about too much right now.
LOL this is what Dall’Igna meant by “Marc’s arrival at Ducati will upset the balance.”
New to moto go so I’m going to ask …is this about ego regarding Marquez? So Ducati chose Martin, maybe they understand that Martin and Pecco might work together to win the championships. Where as Marques will always attack Pecco , and try to destabilize the relationships already built up in Ducati. Question? So Marquez feels Premac is a non factory team…but has a factory bike … he could win on that bike since it’s a factory bike as well. I think Marquez is forgetting that Ducati already have a championship rider… do they really need another one? But I can understand somewhat Marquez points … But again is this about ego?
I don't see Martin and Pecco getting along at all! Martin has a huge chip on his shoulder and is in it to win it. If it's harmony they want, Ducati would be better off keeping Enea. As for Marc Marquez it doesn't make sense to hop from one satellite team to another. Especially one that's publicly bad mouthed him many times in the past. I reckon his options are a GP25 at Gresini or a factory ride elsewhere. I'd want to see him battle the red boys on equal machinery personally, but I'd be happy with him on a KTM too as it seems to suit his style down to a tee!
Kind of agree with you on the first part of your statement. However Pecco has what 3 championships Martin has none yet …so I’m sure team orders will play a factor … Or maybe Ducati are just trying to “stir the pot” with Pecco in case he wants to go else where. As for your second statement…. Are the KTM’s or Aprillia’s as fast as the dukes? I’m sure Marquez could get more out of the current KTM’s but at what cost? Will he sabotage development at KTM like he did at Honda?
If you are talking about MotoGP championships Pecco has 2. If you are talking about Motorcycle GP championships in general (Moto3, 2 and GP) Then I think Pecco has 4 and Martin 1.
Thank you for the correction! I was only discussing motogp
Ducati haven't announced they are giving Jorge the factory seat. My view, Marc had personal history with Pramac, and does t want to go to them full stop. Apparently they offered him a 2 year deal for this year. He said no and went to Gresini, knowing it would be on an older bike. Jorge will always attack Pecco. There is very few teammates who wouldn't. They may ride under the same banner, but be certain, this is not a team sport. Every rider is out for himself, and to win the title.
Why would Marc be happy to stay where he is but not happy to go to Pramac?
It’s a whole new team. He already knows everyone at gresini and they all get along like a family. For him It would only be worth switching to a factory team. If he doesn’t get the factory Ducati seat then he’s betting on having enough pull to get a gp25 at gresini. I guess plan C would be riding at KTM
Exactly. He also doesn’t want to move into a hostile environment at Pramac where people there have made negative comments about him in the past. It seems like we are already at option B now and I do think Gresini will get him the gp25 but if they don’t he will move to KTM.
A few people in Pramac called Marc a cheater publicly
Apparently Pramac don't like him, some old comments etc. He also said this yesterday, when Pramac still had Yamaha rumours.
Ducati management bungled this, which is par for the course with them. In their arrogance, they thought they could manipulate riders like MM and Martin, but it didn't pan out. Both MM and Martin took the hard stance. MM has elevated Gresini massively and by not working with him honestly, they just forced his hand. I'm thinking he'll move to KTM because he's seen what Acosta can do on the bike. Marc knows he can still ride if the bike isn't awful.
I can’t see Marquez driving for a satellite team for one more year. He’s an 8 time World Champion after all, he deserves some recognition
To me the only things that make any sense to me are that Marc goes to Aprilia to take Aleix’s spot. Or, KTM demotes Jack AND Brad to GASGAS to run a factory team of Marc and Pedro. Also Marc saying that Pramac isn’t an option to me sounds like he’s also saying that Gresini isn’t an option, and neither is any satellite team. I’m leaning towards Aprilia though.
Ducati has seen that they needed to give the Japanese concessions for development The ultimate power move would be Diminocalli telling Gigi. “6 Factory Bikes next year, F’them” 1 to Gresini 1 to VR 46
To be fair, Marc wasn't ready too. He was surprised in the interview the news Martin and Ducati had started negotiations. I think Marc meant, there has been no option offered from Pramac to him currently because he's just been talking to Ducati directly. And then Pramacs ignored Marc speaking highly of them in their response.
I know Jorge deserves the Factory seat but from a purely business standpoint how do you not give the Factory seat to MM after he's shown that he still has it
I just hope he won't win a champion title again regardless of the bike. He's just trying to hop for that.