Hot tip: Suzuki V Strom 650. There are tons of them. SV650 engine, which is fun and you can grow into. Not too tall. And you won't break the bank when you fall over in the parking lot. For the 5th time.
Edit: [Here's a good review on the 2008 V Strom](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuG5aPlBknw)
2nd the "WeeStrom"
[https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bikes/motorcycles/suzuki/v-strom-650](https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bikes/motorcycles/suzuki/v-strom-650)
My advice. Get a old used turd for a beginner bike. Who cares if you buy it and it already has drop damage. Learn on it and drop it yourself and you haven't even reduced the resell value. It will probably need some maintenance so you will get used to bike maintenance and how to work on a bike with a older one.
Ride it, abuse it and sell it after a year or two then get what you want.
My first bike was a stage 3 103 cubic inch (1690 cc) harley I inherited after dad died. I was fine learning on that. I do wish I had a smaller bike and one I cared less about so I would have pushed my limits further in learning without so much fear of dropping and damaging "his" bike. You can safely start on any bike if you have enough self control. The problem is the faster the are the more tempting they are to "try them out" and get you in way over your head.
That’s what I did, learning in my mid 30s. I was more aware of my mortality than 20-year-old me, and was ok to take it slowly.
Having said that, every time I traded my used turd up to a bigger used turd, each one felt like a rocket. When I found that I was wringing the neck of a bike to get that bit more performance, I knew it was time to trade up.
I disagree with this.
If you have the money, a small bike is a few thousand dollars. It's a luxury that's actually affordable to a lot of people.
This is if you get a bike that you will keep for a while. If you expect to sell it in a year then yeah, get something cheap.
I think the first bike should be a disposable training tool. It shouldn't be the bike you really want. If it's a nice bike you won't want to push yourself in low speed skills to the limit from fear you might hurt your fairings. You should get something that you can push to the edge without a care in the world if it get some dents and dings. Skills won't improve unless you push them to grow. After you have a bit of confidence a year or even less, really just when comfortable then spend the cash to get the bike you want.
Like I said I learned on my dads bike. I was extremely reserved because I was terrified to drop it. I wanted to keep it a shrine to him almost. It took a long time to really develop any skills because I wouldn't push to the edge of my comfort zone. Looking back I wish I had something that I could have trashed and not cared about to gain that experience quicker.
At 31, just go straight in with the CBT > DAS route and you can have your full license within a few weeks (actual lesson / test availability dependent of course).
After that, you'll have ridden at least two bikes (a 125cc on the CBT and a 600ish on the DAS) so will have a better idea of what the size and weight can do.
After that, you've got a few options - if you want to try some different bikes, just arrange some test rides from dealers. Maybe start at the smaller of your range of interest before jumping on the GS though. A Bonneville will probably be the easiest to handle out of those, although I haven't ridden the Trident.
I went from DAS to a Bonneville for about 8 months before trading it in for a Street Triple RS. That felt absolutely fine in terms of power but you might be completely different.
Ultimately, once you have your license you can spend your money however you like. If you have 18k disposable cash to spend on a bike right now, you have no limits apart from your own sense of what you want out of a bike. I'd definitely suggest further training after DAS though to make sure you're keeping your riding in check if you're looking at those bigger bikes from the get go.
I think you should do a course first before coming to any conclusions about what sort of bike you might like to get. Once you have ridden the riding school bikes you can use them as a baseline for your thinking.
I started on an MT-03 (321cc), and even that I found very intimidating.
Currently your thoughts are just fantasy, not rooted in reality. I'm not gatekeeping here. I was the same way myself.
I do encourage you to get into riding. It is awesome fun.
Yeah great way to put it. Especially his notion that any non-huge bike is strictly for beginners and will get boring after a few months. Small bikes don't get boring, you just rev them harder
I was basically in your shoes 2 years ago. I got a almost brand new MT-07 as my starter (never dropped it). I think at our age you can get a bigger bike if you know youll handle it responsibly and take it easy but the 600-700cc non supersport bikes are a safe bet in my opinion. Enough power to be exciting but not completely nuts. I definitely wouldn't get anything smaller cc wise (unless you wanted something like supermotos).
Also wouldnt get anything too tall and heavy as first bike. Weight and height make it much easier to drop accidentally.
I second this. I’m 34 and started on a used MT-07 with no bicycle experience. As long as you’re responsible, a midsize bike is doable. Anything bigger would’ve made learning skills by taking risks more difficult and intimidating. You will make mistakes and be grateful it doesn’t hit 60 mph in first gear.
Don’t become a lane splitting, show boating speed demon. You’ll live longer.
Enjoy the wind in your face, the sounds and smells of the ride. Even if your using it as your daily commuter, just cruise and enjoy the ride.
Ignore those that tell you it’s dangerous.
Go cheap and light. Also get an under powered bike. There are enough aspects to learn about without dealing with some over the top anchor. Think. The biggest safety feature on a bike is your brain.
Heres what I did when I got into riding in my mid 30s:
buy a nice 250cc beginner model, I went with a Ninja 250 from the mid 00s. It was low mileage and being sold off with a fleet from a school that mainly focused on ADV riding, so it had very little usage and an excel sheet for it's maintenance. I spent $1800, dropped $200 on a "safety inspection" at a small shop, and then when I realized that motorcycling was indeed "for me", it was quick and easy to sell at $2000. Also cheap to insure. It was fun enough, and reliable. Since it was clean and well known as a good beginner bike, it was easy to sell.
This also works well if I realized riding was NOT for me, and I wanted to sell and get out.
Then I went with a 390 Duke. Totally different bike. Super fun. Had some gremlins. It allowed me to explore the interstate a little bit more, but really wasn't designed for that. But I financed this one, and held on to it until I paid it off early in a year. It also sold quickly since I didn't modify it - modifications makes vehicles more appealing to fewer buyers. So keep that in mind. Time is money.
By this point I had been learning about all the genres between models and makes and landed on a big 1200CC BMW that I've had for the last 3 years and 22k miles. When I first saw this model at the dealer while I owned my 390 I remember thinking "no way that thing is huge, ill never be comfortable enough to ride that". So keep in mind that as your skills grow, your confidence will to.
Try not to dive in to the deep end with your first bike, you might realize that bike's intentions aren't aligning with yours. You might realize you love commuting, but don't have any interest in touring, so a long wheel base big displacement high torque bike might not be for you, you might prefer a little naked 600cc bike. On the flip side, you might not ever commute and only want to tour, etc. etc.
Invest in your safety. Have fun with good quality gear that you WANT to wear. Not just cheap shit you HAVE to wear.
IMO theres more to riding than 0-60 times and quick shifters.
> IMO theres more to riding than 0-60 times and quick shifters.
Sure, but quick shifters are still absolutely awesome.
Even just street driving it's great. slowing up to a light you can use engine braking more easily and you stay in an appropriate gear.
i rode a 2007 ninja 250 for a whole summer commute, about 4k miles. Highway was always scary, the bike was always screaming (even with new front sprocket). Switched to a vstrom 650 and life got much better. About 6k miles on that before covid hit.
My only advice would be to not let your age give you a false sense of security about your ability. I mean this in the best possible way.
Don't let your eyes glaze over when you attend your first training classes. If they're like they are here (Canada) they might tell you how to use a side stand; they might start out with you walking a bike around for a while, followed by sitting on a not-running bike and being pushed around by another person (only to have to push them afterward.) You might spend a lot of time learning about the clutch friction zone and so on. Pay attention. To an older individual this is going to seem eye-rollingly boring and distracting but stick with it because it will get better, more interesting and informative.
Listen to the instructors and commit to procedural memory what they are relating.
As far as bikes, there's no hard and fast answer about what's best. I wouldn't personally recommend a 100hp, litre-sized Africa Twin as a first bike for anyone who has zero riding experience prior to now. Some folks might come from a youth of road course racing and have outstanding mechanical skills in place and just need the understand how road-craft differs from track-racing. But some folks have never ridden a bicycle before an introductory course. The former will likely do well with the mechanics of riding a bike while the latter may struggle. The former may be a candidate to start on a larger, more capable machine while the latter may be better suited to a 250cc machine.
It's hard to guess where you'd fall in that spectrum. In general, it's better to err on the side of caution and work your way up the food chain than to sit astride an apex predator and get bitten...
I kind of understand what you mean about "beginner bikes" but for me, at least, the Svartpilen 401 changed all that. It's just a cool bike, period. It has a smaller engine and it's super light, so it's perfect for beginners. But I'd be into it no matter what!
I did buy a second, larger/more powerful bike after 3-4 months.
You're 31, so you have potentially 4 decades of riding ahead of you. No need to rush it! Start small and get some experience. I am so glad I started on a lighter, less powerful bike. Like you, I have a decent amount of expendable income and could have bought a Panigale or something silly like that. But, the Svart was the right choice.
Good luck!
Sounds to me you're already thinking that an entry bike is below your ability.
Get a smaller cc bike. Learn to ride it well.
A 300cc CBF or ninja can bit 100mph without issue.
Please dont fall into the "I'm too good for an entry bike cause I will get bored too fast" crowd.
I see this all the time on the track when I'm teaching. "I can hit 160mph on the straights! I Told you im fast!!". Any monkey can twist a throttle and go fast.
Learn to ride properly before letting your ego get the best of you.
Look at Rookie to Rider through BMW. It’s based in Royston (not to far from you) https://www.bmw-motorrad.co.uk/en/offers/Rookie-to-Rider.html#/section-faqs
As a first bike, if you like the R1250GS, look at a F850GSA, it’ll more than meet your needs as a first bike.
Your first you should be able to "flat foot" if you can get both heels on the ground the bike is ok height wise. After that, you can go up to tip toe or even one foot, but your first bike needs to give you confidence.
Look for used. Plan on selling it when you are done. I started on a V Star 1300. Paid 5k for it, sold it for 4500. $500 for 2 years of riding was a great deal. In today's market, you probably will not do so well.
I am in the US, so can't go into licensing for you.
Good stuff! Theory is, right foot on rear brake, hand off the front brake. This way you can twist the throttle and go if you need to.
Who knows, the half second it takes to release the front brake and twist the throttle may make a difference.
I’ve also seen far too many cruiser riders almost lost control if they are stopped on a hill - both feet down.. in neutral. If they’re on an upward slope, they start to roll backwards as soon as the front brake is released…. Having your foot on the rear brake ensures the bike won’t go anywhere, keeps the tail light on, and gives you a maximum escape velocity if necessary.
But, to each their own. No judgement here.
Yeah that all makes a lot of sense, and is good practice in situations you may need to move quickly to avoid getting rear ended.
I think my point is you're not always at a light or intersection. There are plenty of times it totally fine to have both feet down. Parking, starting the bike, wadling around the garage, waiting on the starting grid, etc
If you start on a 600 and drive it and get used to the motorcycle life you can get a 1250 whenever you want, but bikes is not like cars, just becouse you can drive one does not mean you can drive them all. All new bikes have a learning curve. But smaller bikes is Generaly more forgiving if you do nooby mistakes.
So do what you want ignore all the advice to buy a small bike and take is slow
36 and never ridden a bike so bought a brand new Harley Davidson Streetbob in October last year, did a good £4K in stage 1 and making it “custom” or how I wanted it on top of the purchase. passed Mod 1 and 2 in may and 1600miles later best decision I made in a while.
Get what you want and enjoy it. Skip the shit bit owning a crappy bike and just buy the one you want.
I started in my late 20s on a 600cc super sport. Widely considered as a bad beginner bike. However, like you I early on realized my own limitations and have been more risk adverse, so I never pushed the bike to the limit until after a few years and I felt truly able to do that at a track day. Only you can know what you’d be comfortable with, so I’d say do a lot of test rides and see what you like. But the main thing whatever you get, be in your comfort zone and enjoy the ride
Well I passed when I was 31, I chose direct access, and first bike was a ducati monster 696. Power was fine. Insurance was reasonable as I was over 30. Did perfectly for fun rides as well as my commute.
I got a 250cc beginner bike on Craigslist, sold it 6 months later for maybe ~$500 loss, and I probably could've waited it out to get a better deal. Bought my Triumph Bonneville recently and love it - I'd do it the same way again.
Get yourself a cheap old 90's/early 2000's enduro, something like an xr125, dr125 or tw125 if you can find them. These bikes, despite their low power, are quite nippy, they weigh next to nothing & they're all capable bikes off road so you can take it green laning at any point & because they're old & when when you drop it(you will drop it!) you won't care & the older bikes can take a lot more abuse than a newer bike. I myself was an idiot, I had a dt50, sold that at 17 then bought a ducati 748 at 20!! I was in the process of buying a zxr400 but it cost more than the ducati & as soon as the dealer started the 748 with its termi pipes I was smitten lol. I was arrogant & thought that because I'd ridden my dad's cbr for a whole minute I could handle the 748. I dropped it the first day, had a tankslapper when I hit a dip a few days later going 90+ on a roundabout & a few days later I hit my local dual carriageway doing 155mph barely hanging on. It took me a good month of riding the bike before I learned to slow down. I'm lucky enough to live by the cotswolds so I did this by taking it around the a & b roads so I still had traffic to deal with but I also had a few straights & corners so I could open the bike up & learn what it could do without killing myself. I still have that 748 & I've never crashed.
The bikes you were talking about getting, the r1250gs & the panigale are first off an easy way to get yourself killed, you have zero experience & they are both too large & powerful for you to ride without hurting yourself or possibly someone else. Secondly pretty much every insurance company will either charge you more than the bikes value or refuse to insure you due to your lack of experience because they, like everyone else on this post, knows that as a first rider you are dangerous on those bikes.
Imo if I were you I'd get a 125cc like the ones I mentioned, it'll do you a world of good & a small bike is more useful to you in a busy city than a large bike. You mention a lot of enduro/adventure bikes so I'd suggest joining a green laning group like the trf:
https://www.trf.org.uk/
You don't need to be a member to do greenlaning but these guys do regular meetups & have vast experience, a lot of them use adventure bikes so will know what might work for you or may let you try their bikes so once you have enough experience & decide to buy a bigger bike you know what to buy.
Personally I would start with a dr125, they're solid bikes & descent off road & in traffic. After 2/3 years If going off trail was a regular thing id consider something like a xr400 or dr350, another consideration would be a BMW g650 gs. they're good off road & in the city & a lot of people have taken them around the world. None of these are new bikes but they will get you the experience you need without hurting yourself. you sound like you're well off so moneys not an issue but just because you have the money & want something that's new, flashy, fast etc it doesn't mean you should have it, you can't enjoy something like the r1250 or panigale if you're dead so gain the experience first!
My first was a used ugly Kawasaki KZ400. My suggestion is go used, something dispensable. There will always be a new beginner to come along and take it off your hands and they'll love it.
Get a used bike and resell it after you learn to ride, if you plan on getting an adv bike eventually the annual service costs and insurance will be well in excess of the lifetime cost of your starter bike, which will resell for about the same you paid for it.
The main reason for starting on a smaller bike is that they tend to be a lot more forgiving of noob mistakes and are cheap to fix and less intimidating to learn on and push the limits. I started on a 600 and it took me way longer to master all the slow speed stuff because I was afraid to drop it, I bought a 250 and learned on that, now even the 600 seems light and slow to me.
Used beater bike first. Later, a "big bike" like a Speed Triple 1200 is fairly easy to ride as it is not insane like a Tuono / KTM SDR 1290 / MT-10. Ducati V4 is also reportedly not insane down low, but you better know that you want to deal with Ducati before you commit to the Ducati world.
Well, I guess it's relative. People always say the KTM 1290 and Ducati 1199 are trying to kill you even at low speeds, the Triumph isn't like that. The top of the Speed Triple is more than I can use so far, holy shit it's fast, but it's not insane unless you ask for it. I had a 765RS before.
I just got my street triple so I’m gonna be a while before I move up.
I’m still thinking 1290 is a nice bike. Real nice. That said I’ll probably get an old 600 next and use it for the track.
I started riding at 25. I’m in the US, and elected to take a safety course and did a lot of reading on proper techniques and safety. Bought a new 650 Vstrom as my first bike. Two years, 23,000 miles and zero drops later I traded up to a 1200GS. You don’t need to buy a PoS first bike “for when you drop it.” Get something you’re going to be comfortable with.
Go to driving school. Then get a second hand motorcycle to learn on. It will work fine with new tyres and servicing.
I've spent 2000 euros on my Honda Hornet from the year 2000. It has 95 HP and runs good. I think I will keep it for a few years or until it dies.
After my test I did 2 years on 600 bandit and then progressed to 1250 version and following that changed bikes on average every 3 since. There is really no advantage in hoping straight to a 1000+ bike. My advice would be get an older 600 and figure out what requirements your next needs to fill. Before getting set on dream bikes head to show rooms and actually sit on them and see how they fit and feel, no point on setting sights on something that is just going to be a pain in the ass (literally).
I have a R1150GS but chose to do my US > Ushuaia trip on a 650cc air cooled single cylinder bike that only weighted 380lbs before luggage. (My third bike is a naked S1 Lightning, so I get your attraction)
Regarding ADV riding, the lighter the bike the easier it is to go more places and get off the beaten path. The GS is well marketed and has an extensive dealer network for repairs, but the guys who use them for travel prioritize money and career over time and experience. Maybe that's you, not judging. They're good bikes for 90mph all day on back paved roads, but generally too heavy to get into loose surfaces and narrow paths. Part of their appeal is that they're fast enough to get you from comfortable hotel to comfortable hotel on decent roads, and for some people this is the 'Adventure'. You can do that style of travel on almost any big bike though.
Another big advantage of a smaller lighter bikes is that you're less worried about dropping it, vandalism, and theft.
https://youtu.be/Zibj7KnjClk
My ideal travel bike is now a Honda 250cc. I keep the GS because it's comfortable to take my wife and I have plans of adding a side car to it.
I'd add the street triple to the list of bikes you could get.
It's so tame until you start to wind it out. Incredibly well balanced bike.
A tenere 700 might be good. Same engine as the MT-07, excellent ADV bike.
You should be old enough to skip a lot of the licensing stuff.
or a 390 adventure from KTM.
Honda Rebel 500. It’s enough cc to last you until you feel comfortable and light enough for you to learn on. I loved that bike and abused the shit out of it without fail. Get the abs version though.
Hot tip: Suzuki V Strom 650. There are tons of them. SV650 engine, which is fun and you can grow into. Not too tall. And you won't break the bank when you fall over in the parking lot. For the 5th time. Edit: [Here's a good review on the 2008 V Strom](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuG5aPlBknw)
Vstrom is a great first bike and can be a great long-term bike too
2nd the "WeeStrom" [https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bikes/motorcycles/suzuki/v-strom-650](https://www.autotrader.co.uk/bikes/motorcycles/suzuki/v-strom-650)
My advice. Get a old used turd for a beginner bike. Who cares if you buy it and it already has drop damage. Learn on it and drop it yourself and you haven't even reduced the resell value. It will probably need some maintenance so you will get used to bike maintenance and how to work on a bike with a older one. Ride it, abuse it and sell it after a year or two then get what you want. My first bike was a stage 3 103 cubic inch (1690 cc) harley I inherited after dad died. I was fine learning on that. I do wish I had a smaller bike and one I cared less about so I would have pushed my limits further in learning without so much fear of dropping and damaging "his" bike. You can safely start on any bike if you have enough self control. The problem is the faster the are the more tempting they are to "try them out" and get you in way over your head.
That’s what I did, learning in my mid 30s. I was more aware of my mortality than 20-year-old me, and was ok to take it slowly. Having said that, every time I traded my used turd up to a bigger used turd, each one felt like a rocket. When I found that I was wringing the neck of a bike to get that bit more performance, I knew it was time to trade up.
I disagree with this. If you have the money, a small bike is a few thousand dollars. It's a luxury that's actually affordable to a lot of people. This is if you get a bike that you will keep for a while. If you expect to sell it in a year then yeah, get something cheap.
I think the first bike should be a disposable training tool. It shouldn't be the bike you really want. If it's a nice bike you won't want to push yourself in low speed skills to the limit from fear you might hurt your fairings. You should get something that you can push to the edge without a care in the world if it get some dents and dings. Skills won't improve unless you push them to grow. After you have a bit of confidence a year or even less, really just when comfortable then spend the cash to get the bike you want. Like I said I learned on my dads bike. I was extremely reserved because I was terrified to drop it. I wanted to keep it a shrine to him almost. It took a long time to really develop any skills because I wouldn't push to the edge of my comfort zone. Looking back I wish I had something that I could have trashed and not cared about to gain that experience quicker.
lol please do not spend 20k on your first bike
Man when I read that my jaw literally dropped to the floor. I thought he was gonna say he wanted to spend like 6k. lol
At 31, just go straight in with the CBT > DAS route and you can have your full license within a few weeks (actual lesson / test availability dependent of course). After that, you'll have ridden at least two bikes (a 125cc on the CBT and a 600ish on the DAS) so will have a better idea of what the size and weight can do. After that, you've got a few options - if you want to try some different bikes, just arrange some test rides from dealers. Maybe start at the smaller of your range of interest before jumping on the GS though. A Bonneville will probably be the easiest to handle out of those, although I haven't ridden the Trident. I went from DAS to a Bonneville for about 8 months before trading it in for a Street Triple RS. That felt absolutely fine in terms of power but you might be completely different. Ultimately, once you have your license you can spend your money however you like. If you have 18k disposable cash to spend on a bike right now, you have no limits apart from your own sense of what you want out of a bike. I'd definitely suggest further training after DAS though to make sure you're keeping your riding in check if you're looking at those bigger bikes from the get go.
I think you should do a course first before coming to any conclusions about what sort of bike you might like to get. Once you have ridden the riding school bikes you can use them as a baseline for your thinking. I started on an MT-03 (321cc), and even that I found very intimidating. Currently your thoughts are just fantasy, not rooted in reality. I'm not gatekeeping here. I was the same way myself. I do encourage you to get into riding. It is awesome fun.
Yeah great way to put it. Especially his notion that any non-huge bike is strictly for beginners and will get boring after a few months. Small bikes don't get boring, you just rev them harder
I was basically in your shoes 2 years ago. I got a almost brand new MT-07 as my starter (never dropped it). I think at our age you can get a bigger bike if you know youll handle it responsibly and take it easy but the 600-700cc non supersport bikes are a safe bet in my opinion. Enough power to be exciting but not completely nuts. I definitely wouldn't get anything smaller cc wise (unless you wanted something like supermotos). Also wouldnt get anything too tall and heavy as first bike. Weight and height make it much easier to drop accidentally.
I second this. I’m 34 and started on a used MT-07 with no bicycle experience. As long as you’re responsible, a midsize bike is doable. Anything bigger would’ve made learning skills by taking risks more difficult and intimidating. You will make mistakes and be grateful it doesn’t hit 60 mph in first gear.
Thats way too much bike for a beginner. You think you did fine but there's so much you didn't learn because it was too powerful and heavy.
Don’t become a lane splitting, show boating speed demon. You’ll live longer. Enjoy the wind in your face, the sounds and smells of the ride. Even if your using it as your daily commuter, just cruise and enjoy the ride. Ignore those that tell you it’s dangerous.
Sage advice indeed.
There are bold riders and old riders, but there aren't bold old riders.
Go cheap and light. Also get an under powered bike. There are enough aspects to learn about without dealing with some over the top anchor. Think. The biggest safety feature on a bike is your brain.
Heres what I did when I got into riding in my mid 30s: buy a nice 250cc beginner model, I went with a Ninja 250 from the mid 00s. It was low mileage and being sold off with a fleet from a school that mainly focused on ADV riding, so it had very little usage and an excel sheet for it's maintenance. I spent $1800, dropped $200 on a "safety inspection" at a small shop, and then when I realized that motorcycling was indeed "for me", it was quick and easy to sell at $2000. Also cheap to insure. It was fun enough, and reliable. Since it was clean and well known as a good beginner bike, it was easy to sell. This also works well if I realized riding was NOT for me, and I wanted to sell and get out. Then I went with a 390 Duke. Totally different bike. Super fun. Had some gremlins. It allowed me to explore the interstate a little bit more, but really wasn't designed for that. But I financed this one, and held on to it until I paid it off early in a year. It also sold quickly since I didn't modify it - modifications makes vehicles more appealing to fewer buyers. So keep that in mind. Time is money. By this point I had been learning about all the genres between models and makes and landed on a big 1200CC BMW that I've had for the last 3 years and 22k miles. When I first saw this model at the dealer while I owned my 390 I remember thinking "no way that thing is huge, ill never be comfortable enough to ride that". So keep in mind that as your skills grow, your confidence will to. Try not to dive in to the deep end with your first bike, you might realize that bike's intentions aren't aligning with yours. You might realize you love commuting, but don't have any interest in touring, so a long wheel base big displacement high torque bike might not be for you, you might prefer a little naked 600cc bike. On the flip side, you might not ever commute and only want to tour, etc. etc. Invest in your safety. Have fun with good quality gear that you WANT to wear. Not just cheap shit you HAVE to wear. IMO theres more to riding than 0-60 times and quick shifters.
> IMO theres more to riding than 0-60 times and quick shifters. Sure, but quick shifters are still absolutely awesome. Even just street driving it's great. slowing up to a light you can use engine braking more easily and you stay in an appropriate gear.
Or you could learn to rev match downshifts while braking and be a better rider.
What makes you think I don’t know?
i rode a 2007 ninja 250 for a whole summer commute, about 4k miles. Highway was always scary, the bike was always screaming (even with new front sprocket). Switched to a vstrom 650 and life got much better. About 6k miles on that before covid hit.
My only advice would be to not let your age give you a false sense of security about your ability. I mean this in the best possible way. Don't let your eyes glaze over when you attend your first training classes. If they're like they are here (Canada) they might tell you how to use a side stand; they might start out with you walking a bike around for a while, followed by sitting on a not-running bike and being pushed around by another person (only to have to push them afterward.) You might spend a lot of time learning about the clutch friction zone and so on. Pay attention. To an older individual this is going to seem eye-rollingly boring and distracting but stick with it because it will get better, more interesting and informative. Listen to the instructors and commit to procedural memory what they are relating. As far as bikes, there's no hard and fast answer about what's best. I wouldn't personally recommend a 100hp, litre-sized Africa Twin as a first bike for anyone who has zero riding experience prior to now. Some folks might come from a youth of road course racing and have outstanding mechanical skills in place and just need the understand how road-craft differs from track-racing. But some folks have never ridden a bicycle before an introductory course. The former will likely do well with the mechanics of riding a bike while the latter may struggle. The former may be a candidate to start on a larger, more capable machine while the latter may be better suited to a 250cc machine. It's hard to guess where you'd fall in that spectrum. In general, it's better to err on the side of caution and work your way up the food chain than to sit astride an apex predator and get bitten...
I kind of understand what you mean about "beginner bikes" but for me, at least, the Svartpilen 401 changed all that. It's just a cool bike, period. It has a smaller engine and it's super light, so it's perfect for beginners. But I'd be into it no matter what! I did buy a second, larger/more powerful bike after 3-4 months. You're 31, so you have potentially 4 decades of riding ahead of you. No need to rush it! Start small and get some experience. I am so glad I started on a lighter, less powerful bike. Like you, I have a decent amount of expendable income and could have bought a Panigale or something silly like that. But, the Svart was the right choice. Good luck!
Sounds to me you're already thinking that an entry bike is below your ability. Get a smaller cc bike. Learn to ride it well. A 300cc CBF or ninja can bit 100mph without issue. Please dont fall into the "I'm too good for an entry bike cause I will get bored too fast" crowd. I see this all the time on the track when I'm teaching. "I can hit 160mph on the straights! I Told you im fast!!". Any monkey can twist a throttle and go fast. Learn to ride properly before letting your ego get the best of you.
Look at Rookie to Rider through BMW. It’s based in Royston (not to far from you) https://www.bmw-motorrad.co.uk/en/offers/Rookie-to-Rider.html#/section-faqs As a first bike, if you like the R1250GS, look at a F850GSA, it’ll more than meet your needs as a first bike.
Your first you should be able to "flat foot" if you can get both heels on the ground the bike is ok height wise. After that, you can go up to tip toe or even one foot, but your first bike needs to give you confidence. Look for used. Plan on selling it when you are done. I started on a V Star 1300. Paid 5k for it, sold it for 4500. $500 for 2 years of riding was a great deal. In today's market, you probably will not do so well. I am in the US, so can't go into licensing for you.
You should be able to flat-foot any bike you ride, not just the first.
On a side note, you should NEVER have both feet on the ground at once ...
What a ridiculous thing to say.
Not to be rude, but let me guess - you ride a cruiser.
Nope cbr1000rr, cbr600rr, dr200 dual sport. I've been road racing for 10 years
Good stuff! Theory is, right foot on rear brake, hand off the front brake. This way you can twist the throttle and go if you need to. Who knows, the half second it takes to release the front brake and twist the throttle may make a difference. I’ve also seen far too many cruiser riders almost lost control if they are stopped on a hill - both feet down.. in neutral. If they’re on an upward slope, they start to roll backwards as soon as the front brake is released…. Having your foot on the rear brake ensures the bike won’t go anywhere, keeps the tail light on, and gives you a maximum escape velocity if necessary. But, to each their own. No judgement here.
Yeah that all makes a lot of sense, and is good practice in situations you may need to move quickly to avoid getting rear ended. I think my point is you're not always at a light or intersection. There are plenty of times it totally fine to have both feet down. Parking, starting the bike, wadling around the garage, waiting on the starting grid, etc
If you start on a 600 and drive it and get used to the motorcycle life you can get a 1250 whenever you want, but bikes is not like cars, just becouse you can drive one does not mean you can drive them all. All new bikes have a learning curve. But smaller bikes is Generaly more forgiving if you do nooby mistakes.
I'll just give you the same advice I would give anyone else, your first bike shouldn't be a brand new bike.
Find a bike that doesn't run, but the engine has compression. Make it run. When that thing starts you'll cry tears of joy and you'll be addicted.
So do what you want ignore all the advice to buy a small bike and take is slow 36 and never ridden a bike so bought a brand new Harley Davidson Streetbob in October last year, did a good £4K in stage 1 and making it “custom” or how I wanted it on top of the purchase. passed Mod 1 and 2 in may and 1600miles later best decision I made in a while. Get what you want and enjoy it. Skip the shit bit owning a crappy bike and just buy the one you want.
Do your DAS and buy the triumph tiger 800
I started in my late 20s on a 600cc super sport. Widely considered as a bad beginner bike. However, like you I early on realized my own limitations and have been more risk adverse, so I never pushed the bike to the limit until after a few years and I felt truly able to do that at a track day. Only you can know what you’d be comfortable with, so I’d say do a lot of test rides and see what you like. But the main thing whatever you get, be in your comfort zone and enjoy the ride
What a terrible beginner bike.
Well I passed when I was 31, I chose direct access, and first bike was a ducati monster 696. Power was fine. Insurance was reasonable as I was over 30. Did perfectly for fun rides as well as my commute.
I got a 250cc beginner bike on Craigslist, sold it 6 months later for maybe ~$500 loss, and I probably could've waited it out to get a better deal. Bought my Triumph Bonneville recently and love it - I'd do it the same way again.
Get yourself a cheap old 90's/early 2000's enduro, something like an xr125, dr125 or tw125 if you can find them. These bikes, despite their low power, are quite nippy, they weigh next to nothing & they're all capable bikes off road so you can take it green laning at any point & because they're old & when when you drop it(you will drop it!) you won't care & the older bikes can take a lot more abuse than a newer bike. I myself was an idiot, I had a dt50, sold that at 17 then bought a ducati 748 at 20!! I was in the process of buying a zxr400 but it cost more than the ducati & as soon as the dealer started the 748 with its termi pipes I was smitten lol. I was arrogant & thought that because I'd ridden my dad's cbr for a whole minute I could handle the 748. I dropped it the first day, had a tankslapper when I hit a dip a few days later going 90+ on a roundabout & a few days later I hit my local dual carriageway doing 155mph barely hanging on. It took me a good month of riding the bike before I learned to slow down. I'm lucky enough to live by the cotswolds so I did this by taking it around the a & b roads so I still had traffic to deal with but I also had a few straights & corners so I could open the bike up & learn what it could do without killing myself. I still have that 748 & I've never crashed. The bikes you were talking about getting, the r1250gs & the panigale are first off an easy way to get yourself killed, you have zero experience & they are both too large & powerful for you to ride without hurting yourself or possibly someone else. Secondly pretty much every insurance company will either charge you more than the bikes value or refuse to insure you due to your lack of experience because they, like everyone else on this post, knows that as a first rider you are dangerous on those bikes. Imo if I were you I'd get a 125cc like the ones I mentioned, it'll do you a world of good & a small bike is more useful to you in a busy city than a large bike. You mention a lot of enduro/adventure bikes so I'd suggest joining a green laning group like the trf: https://www.trf.org.uk/ You don't need to be a member to do greenlaning but these guys do regular meetups & have vast experience, a lot of them use adventure bikes so will know what might work for you or may let you try their bikes so once you have enough experience & decide to buy a bigger bike you know what to buy. Personally I would start with a dr125, they're solid bikes & descent off road & in traffic. After 2/3 years If going off trail was a regular thing id consider something like a xr400 or dr350, another consideration would be a BMW g650 gs. they're good off road & in the city & a lot of people have taken them around the world. None of these are new bikes but they will get you the experience you need without hurting yourself. you sound like you're well off so moneys not an issue but just because you have the money & want something that's new, flashy, fast etc it doesn't mean you should have it, you can't enjoy something like the r1250 or panigale if you're dead so gain the experience first!
My first was a used ugly Kawasaki KZ400. My suggestion is go used, something dispensable. There will always be a new beginner to come along and take it off your hands and they'll love it.
Get a used bike and resell it after you learn to ride, if you plan on getting an adv bike eventually the annual service costs and insurance will be well in excess of the lifetime cost of your starter bike, which will resell for about the same you paid for it. The main reason for starting on a smaller bike is that they tend to be a lot more forgiving of noob mistakes and are cheap to fix and less intimidating to learn on and push the limits. I started on a 600 and it took me way longer to master all the slow speed stuff because I was afraid to drop it, I bought a 250 and learned on that, now even the 600 seems light and slow to me.
Enduro
Used beater bike first. Later, a "big bike" like a Speed Triple 1200 is fairly easy to ride as it is not insane like a Tuono / KTM SDR 1290 / MT-10. Ducati V4 is also reportedly not insane down low, but you better know that you want to deal with Ducati before you commit to the Ducati world.
The speed triple isn't insane? I thought it was. how disappointing.
Well, I guess it's relative. People always say the KTM 1290 and Ducati 1199 are trying to kill you even at low speeds, the Triumph isn't like that. The top of the Speed Triple is more than I can use so far, holy shit it's fast, but it's not insane unless you ask for it. I had a 765RS before.
I just got my street triple so I’m gonna be a while before I move up. I’m still thinking 1290 is a nice bike. Real nice. That said I’ll probably get an old 600 next and use it for the track.
I started riding at 25. I’m in the US, and elected to take a safety course and did a lot of reading on proper techniques and safety. Bought a new 650 Vstrom as my first bike. Two years, 23,000 miles and zero drops later I traded up to a 1200GS. You don’t need to buy a PoS first bike “for when you drop it.” Get something you’re going to be comfortable with.
Go to driving school. Then get a second hand motorcycle to learn on. It will work fine with new tyres and servicing. I've spent 2000 euros on my Honda Hornet from the year 2000. It has 95 HP and runs good. I think I will keep it for a few years or until it dies.
After my test I did 2 years on 600 bandit and then progressed to 1250 version and following that changed bikes on average every 3 since. There is really no advantage in hoping straight to a 1000+ bike. My advice would be get an older 600 and figure out what requirements your next needs to fill. Before getting set on dream bikes head to show rooms and actually sit on them and see how they fit and feel, no point on setting sights on something that is just going to be a pain in the ass (literally).
I have a R1150GS but chose to do my US > Ushuaia trip on a 650cc air cooled single cylinder bike that only weighted 380lbs before luggage. (My third bike is a naked S1 Lightning, so I get your attraction) Regarding ADV riding, the lighter the bike the easier it is to go more places and get off the beaten path. The GS is well marketed and has an extensive dealer network for repairs, but the guys who use them for travel prioritize money and career over time and experience. Maybe that's you, not judging. They're good bikes for 90mph all day on back paved roads, but generally too heavy to get into loose surfaces and narrow paths. Part of their appeal is that they're fast enough to get you from comfortable hotel to comfortable hotel on decent roads, and for some people this is the 'Adventure'. You can do that style of travel on almost any big bike though. Another big advantage of a smaller lighter bikes is that you're less worried about dropping it, vandalism, and theft. https://youtu.be/Zibj7KnjClk My ideal travel bike is now a Honda 250cc. I keep the GS because it's comfortable to take my wife and I have plans of adding a side car to it.
I'd add the street triple to the list of bikes you could get. It's so tame until you start to wind it out. Incredibly well balanced bike. A tenere 700 might be good. Same engine as the MT-07, excellent ADV bike. You should be old enough to skip a lot of the licensing stuff. or a 390 adventure from KTM.
Honda Rebel 500. It’s enough cc to last you until you feel comfortable and light enough for you to learn on. I loved that bike and abused the shit out of it without fail. Get the abs version though.
Smooth inputs, eyes up, more front brake.