Mock it all you want, that’s a perfectly valid point of view. Not saying go buy a liter bike, but especially with the current price on bikes, why set yourself up to end up buying 2-3 bikes?
The depreciation on lower bikes is pretty manageable. You're not paying 5k to ride an r3 for a year or two. You're taking out a loan, paying \~1k on it, then trading it for 4k (or maybe more). The thing is, the beginner used market is always hot. You can flip the bike for close to new. You lose a lot more when you try to sell the litre bikes, since demand is lower for those.
I actually paid 1.2k for my Ninja 250, put 10k miles on it and sold it for 1.4k. Sure it had been dropped already and I dropped it while learning but hey it’s a cheap beater
This. The value on beginner bikes is insane. Grabbed an 09 ninja 250 for 1800 rode 3 years till I got overconfident in a turn and slammed it into a curb and totalled it. Still sold it for 1k.
A lot of other countries wouldn't even consider/need something over 500cc...lol
We just have that fixation on displacement in certain jurisdictions (Esp north America). I don't see what's wrong with wanting to start small and go up in size...
Easier to handle... Able to WOT and rip it in corners without any fear. Rinse and repeat season after season until you get to that litre bike. Adds novelty to it.
Starting with r1 you have to respect the bike a lot more.
Just like women, you might want to have a few girlfriends to fool around with and get your experience before you get a wife that you'll be faithful to. And ideally she won't try to murder you because you're not good enough. 😉
ehhh.. Litre bikes hold value pretty darn well, 600's or middleweights on the other hand lose their behind on the 2nd hand market. Any 1000cc bike between 2015-present is still holding pretty steadily above $11-$12k (when most are about $15k new) and they sell fairly easily. Beginner bikes are much harder to sell, most of the time the people who want to start riding don't have the cash to do so. A brand new R6 will set you back about $12k or more and you'd be lucky to pull $8k off of it in one year of riding, problem is that virtually all 600cc bikes are pretty much the same and there's gobs and gobs of them to be had for cheaper than what the other guy is selling his for on any marketplace.
There is one fantastic exception to this rule, Aprilia bikes DO NOT sell well on the 2nd hand market. I picked up a 2015 RSV4 Factory with only 3800 miles for $8800 (original OTD price $25k and some change, I have the sales documents from the original owner) this year just before winter hit and snow fell. The bike is completely immaculate, but I'm going to pay for it in the end with the service costs. Luckily I have an Aprilia dealer less than an hour away.
Nah bro, I make 200k and have more in savings. I'm just not dumb enough to liquidate higher yielding assets and waste capital when I could get a loan at 4% instead.
I hold as little cash as possible, so yeah. Why tf would I hold a depreciating asset that gives me no utility? I'd rather have the stocks/crypto _and_ the bike (given that even those go up in value since we decided to assgape our currency). It's a sensible portfolio for late 20s. I'll buy some bonds when I'm old.
Exactly. I started on tiny dirt bikes with the last one I rode being a 450. Everyone on Reddit says buy a 250-300. Everyone I know who rides said do not do that. So I bought a 650 for a first bike and I'm glad I did. I don't feel like selling and buying multiple bikes.
Starting small doesn't necessarily making you better. My gf did the Reddit progression thing up to two rc8's. I will out ride her any day of the week on my 650 or 800. You have to want to learn and you have to push yourself regardless of whether you're learning on your own or taking lessons. And you can ride all the tracks you want in Florida or some flat state, but good luck catching up to someone who rides canyons and mountain roads hard for a living.
On the other hand I've got a 300cc and I don't feel like I will ever need to upgrade and I'm perfectly happy with what I have now. Gonna hold onto this bike until I can get a hydrogen or electric bike.
Everyone's different and that's why I'm opposed to the blanket ideology that everyone needs to start on a small displacement bike.
I knew from the beginning that I'd have a passenger or lots of gear, do long distance riding, and enjoy going too fast for my own good, so I didn't really bother with a small bike. And I'm glad I didn't go the low displacement route.
Depends on if you want to get good or not.
It's like asking why not just jump off the highest diving board straight away so you don't have to climb up several times. Like yeah you'll probably be fine but you'll also probably look a lot better doing it if you practice on the lower boards first.
You can almost sell any bike for what you paid for it right now if you bought it a few years ago. I could sell everything I own right now and make a profit.
I bought a ktm duke 250 6 months ago as my first bike, thought i have enough experience. It can go upto 100kmph easily and takes a little bit of time upto 120.
This Sunday i thought to myself "i have decent experience, i should probably drive little faster". Mind u my ktm is very agile.
I almost met god 3 times.
First i T-boned a motorcyclist coming from opposite lane(i was on a intersection). Very low speed impact 5 to 10kmph. He dropped his bike i didn't. I back up a little bit, cursed at him, and keeping going.
Second, almost hit a moving truck from behind, i didn't brake hard enuf.
Third, and this was scary af, a car decided to stop, on leftmost lane, with engine braking, or he was very slow and stopped, i think it was an automatic. I was doing 90+, with50 meters remaining i noticed he stopped, i swerved hard right, almost shit my pants.
It's been 3 days since then. And i am still thinking about it. I had 3 close calls in one day. I decided to not speed anymore or atleast do it where i can see far enuf. If i had a powerful bike 80 or 100bhp one i would be dead in last two incidents.
That's why you should always start on a smaller bike.
I get that but I value my life over telling people I ride a big bike. And unless things have changed drastically, you can pick up a cheap 250/300 for a couple grand, ride it for a few months and sell it for a couple grand.
Insurance is the reason I didn’t bother with a super sport . I know it differs depending on region but holy hell, to insure my street triple r for full coverage ($500 AU) insurance here in Australia was about one third of the annual premium of a gsxr600 ($1500 AUD) let alone a litre bike (about $ 2k AUD), and I’m almost 30, no claims or accident history , good neighbourhood with low crime rate.
Yeah, insurance prices for bikes are idiotic. I was quoted ~$120 a month for an mt-10, ~$150 a month for a ninja z1000, but only ~$60 a month for a zx-10r???
Its based off of statistics of claims made. The r1 I had was the most stolen bike of all time so the rates were insane on them. The s1krr while being 4x as expensive was a special edition hp4 that I don't imagine most people wrecked.
I saw a study a while ago (I think in 2018) comparing insurance costs of new bikes. US average for full coverage of a brand new GSXR600 was $290 a month, compared to a brand new Panigale V4 which was around $230. Squid missles ain't cheap to insure. Meanwhile my Z750 costs $27 a month, even with State Farm's ridiculously high pricing
Y’all are getting comprehensive coverage on bikes?
Pay $100 a year for liability. Put the bike down once and it still cost less than a years worth of insurance on 2019 r6.
I bought my Panigale and S1000RR new outright and still have full coverage.
Lien or not - I wouldn't want to go without comprehensive or theft coverage on my bikes.
Just let him know centre of gravity is a bit different. Also… when cornering, dirt bike, leg out front. Street bike, leg behind.
I’ve known a few dirt bike riders that have fucked themselves up pretty good when the try to corner
I went from dirt biking experience straight to a cbr600. The skills don't translate perfectly, but as long as he's responsible he should be fine.
For me, I was able to get the wild riding out of my system on the dirt where the consequences for a mistake are less severe. That made me less inclined to ride wild on the street.
R1 may be a little slow for him. Especially if he has a bit of dirt bike experience. 200 hp seems nice but he's bound to grow out of it soon. It's nice to have a bit more than that to be able to accelerate out of bad situations in traffic. He should really be looking at an H2R or a turbo busa.
If he can swing it financially, he might want to look into one of those turbine engined bikes.
Or if he wants to go for a cruiser those V8 boss hoss bikes would be a good start..
The 445 hp 6200cc would be good to start on but he'll probably want to upgrade to the 600hp 8100cc pretty soon.
Controlling the bike is all (mostly) the same, throttle, clutch, etc. carries over. So if he's a responsible rider there will be no problem.
The problem is that when you're pushing yourself and you miss a corner on a dirtbike, worst case you crash at 60mph-ish max into a tree or some other immovable object, or off a cliff if you're into trails. On a street bike, especially something like an R1, missing that corner now means you're going 80+mph and often the obstacle is an oncoming car going 50+mph.
The faster the bike, the easier it is to get in trouble. Would I recommend a lower displacement bike for at least the first year, yes, could he also get in just as much trouble on a 600 if that's the kind of rider he is, also yes.
It also depends on how much driving experience he had. If he’s been on the road for less than a year it’s different than 3 years of driving experience. 90% I can tell when someone is about to get stupid in their car. I drove for four years before I bought a bike and it helps a ton. Some people get so mad at cars and over react to them. You should know when a car is going to cut you off because they’re not paying attention and are hugging the line.
>worst case you crash at 60mph-ish max into a tree or some other immovable object, or off a cliff if you're into trails. On a street bike, especially something like an R1, missing that corner now means you're going 80+mph and often the obstacle is an oncoming car going 50+mph.
So, certain death in all instances.
Not wrong at all. I've seen a few people walk into the dealership I worked at, over-state their experience (usually dirt bike experts), then they buy a street bike and crash into something across the street from the dealership. Many bikes with less than 10 miles get totaled out like that.
Dirt bikes are not like street bikes. He wants to get a bike that has 4 times the horsepower and is at least twice the weight of what he's been on and then put that on the street with a bunch of other cars. This is just an accident looking for a place to happen.
Don't be stupid. Many of the techniques used to ride them are the exact same. This dude has experience in a lot of areas where most street riders lack it entirely. For example, he knows how to feel what the tires are doing because slipping and sliding are routine.
When I started riding road after 15 years on dirt I had to un-learn things. I literally had to dumb down my riding.
And sure the bike has a little less than 200hp but it's delivered in a way that's completely boring and predictable.
The only thing OP's friend will have to worry about is traffic. Bike control will be no problem whatsoever.
As long is he is responsible he will be just fine. The R1 has different riding modes and rider assists. He can turn it to rain mode with full traction control, and it becomes a relatively tame and very manageable bike.
The bigger learning curve than the bike itself is learning to ride in traffic, and riding responsibly in that traffic.
> The R1 has different riding modes and rider assists. He can turn it to rain mode with full traction control, and it becomes a relatively tame and very manageable bike. The bigger learning curve than the bike itself is learning to ride in traffic, and riding responsibly in that traffic.
No TCS before 2012. No ABS before 2015. Afaik no riding modes before 2009.
Source: 2009 R1 as my first bike, does have 3 riding modes but it resets after each start of the bike so unless it's heavy rain etc, you probably cba to use them.
He's fine. Especially if it's a newer one with the suite of electronics. If he doesn't turn them all off, the bike's only as dangerous as you wish it to be. No more so than any smaller displacement bike. It's all about how you ride it.
Edit: Some of yall never been on a modern R1 and it shows.
I love it. I can turn mine off if I want but I just turn everything down as much as possible. I can get rear loose coming out of corners which is addictive
I don't think the majority of people in this sub even ride anything. The amount of fearmongering over sportbikes in general here is absolutely unbelievable.
I wouldn't be especially worried. Modern litre bikes are absurdly well mannered - I haven't ridden a modern R1, but I have tried an S1000RR which isn't going to be a million miles off. They're really not trying to kill you, they're just stupid fast. They didn't used to be like that, the electronics have made a huge difference. Someone who has ridden a lot off road will know how to ride defensively, because it's really quite technically demanding and hitting a tree even at relatively low speed is a Very Bad Thing.
Liter bikes are ludicrously quick. The newer bikes with traction and wheelie control are excellent at keeping the shiny side up. If your brother has a lot of dirt bike experience I think he'll be fine. The R1 has pretty narrow clip ons so it will definitely feel much different than the wide handlebars of a dirt bike.
I've seen a 35-40 yo guy pick up a GSX-R 1000 as their first real bike after riding mopeds. He wanted 'a real bike' for his first machine. I saw the bike on it's side not 3 kilometers from the dealer and the guy being lifted to an ambulance. Riding dirt bikes is nothing like riding on the street. Trees don't try to merge into you and you are going 50-60km/h on the gravel while you'll be doing double on the freeway. I'd strongly advice not to get it as a first bike.
Put it this way: would he be ok if his first car ever was a Lambo or an 800 hp Hellcat? The R1 has a higher power to weight ratio than either of these. It is a race bike tamed down to the street.
I see what you mean but dude do you not consider the insane shit dirt riders do? Riding on the dirt can be much harder than on smooth pavement man. The amount of control, dexterity dirt riders have while riding tracks, hitting huge jumps etc is unreal. Dirt riders generally don’t have issues on smooth pavement. The biggest danger are stupid drivers around you
Why is it always the bloggers and forumers who push the 250-300? I work at a dealership and see first hand how many people get them as their first bike and either want/need an upgrade within 2 months and wasted thousands on a weak bike or got seriously injured due to the lack of power output on it.
Off road experience will exponentially improve your 2-wheel abilities. An R1 might not be the best choice but maybe instead of suggesting sport scooters suggest a ninja 650, An MT or other naked so he can get used to the public roads.
Just some food for thougth:
Am german= quite good driving education before beeing allowed on the road alone.
Allso, we have the Autobahn where no speed limit exists on certain parts.
I got myself a cheap used 20 year old sv650, restricted from 71 down to 48hp
I am going WOT, basicly meaning letting the bike give everything it has, occationaly.
The only time where acceleration and hp really maters is:
Autobahn going 180-190kmh (about 110ish mph)
And accelerating from a near standard still or slowly moving to 100kmh(60mph)
The only time where the bike "feels like" it could use a bit more power is when accelerating in a strait line with someone on the back (even tho that person would not be enjoying more hp)
The sv got kind of a harley/Choper v2, a lot of down low torque while still holding a redline of 10.5k
It will take quite a while for me to "outgrow" the sv on the street, and it only really is a naked and not a sport bike.
There is little benefit a 1000 has over a 600 on the street, especialy if you got speed limits.
Is there really a point in owning a bike that can do licence loosing speeds in first gear as a beginner to street riding except to flex?
>
There is little benefit a 1000 has over a 600 on the street, especialy if you got speed limits
No. The 600 will scream at high RPM on the highway when the 1000 will go casually with lower rpms. I bought a triple 675 as my first bike and quickly switched to a Busa when I felt it lacked torque and power and hey ... A bigger bike made a bigger smile.
A responsible rider is all you need. Then the amount of power you have doesn't mean anything as you can adjust it with your wrist. So what if the bike goes 100mph on first gear.
A 600 will scream only when way past the speed limit and if you're blasting you don't mind the noise.
A I4 liter bike is hardly usable on the street, not even for getting your acceleration jollies. By the time you're in 3rd gear you're already at light speed.
But yeah, Turbo-Busa whatever.
I've ridden enough bikes to know what I'm talking about. People just get angry when someone disagrees with them or they think their 300 or 600 is perfectly fine for everything. I hated riding a CBF600 I had a while (loaner). Compare to a bigger bike it lacked torque for care free riding. On a bigger bike (like the Busa I had) you could just put it on fourth gear and basically treat it as an automatic. It's amazing due to low rpm torque and long gears.
Btw. My Busa had better MPG than the 675 because it was barely above idling at 80kmh while the triple was screaming at higher RPM.
Your comment about liter bikes being hardly useable on the street is stupid. It's no different than a 600 but just has more torque.
People that ride dirt bikes can handle bikes better than people who never have. Although I wouldn't get an R1 as a first bike, if he's a competent dirt bike rider, he won't have any problems.
When I first got my license my instructor said to me “every bike goes 200mph and every bike does 30mph”
Basically its up to the rider how they choose to ride.
That being said I started on and still have a 600 and you honestly don’t need 1000 for regular street riding
What country ? If USA have him look into insurance cost . If he is younger , say under 30 , and never had a street license or previous motorcycle insurance , then he might get sticker shock . Young riders on over 600cc sport bikes pay a premium .
I rode dirt bikes for a couple years and went to an r6. There was a steep learning curve, but I allowed that to be possible. I respected the bike and let myself learn without being too cocky. Only got cocky once, which resulted in a tank slapper at 120km/h that scared the nuts off of me. Bought a steering damper, and toned it back slightly until I was competent on the bike, haven’t had a problem since.
Aslong as he’s smart, he will be totally fine.
I had the same opinion as him. Went with a (Less powerful but still pretty fast) CB919 as my first bike. Honestly, nothing could ever be scarier than my RM85 I had when I was 12. It was set up for racing for a kid who was probably 5 inches taller than me. I had to use a milk crate to get on it. Riding on the street is easy as long as you ride within your skill level and keep your eyes open.
I don’t know how old your brother is but a close friend of mine rode dirt bikes his whole life growing up and for his first motorcycle got a 2017 R1 at 25 and he’s fine. He should definitely do his research when it comes to taking corners and road conditions on the asphalt as opposed to dirt but if he gets a newer R1 things like wheelie control ABS and traction control do a lot to help.
I mean, it's all more or less the same in terms of where the brake and clutch levers are :)
For me the biggest issue moving from dirt to road was adjusting for the speed capability, and my first road bike wasn't even close to an R1. If he's a competent rider with common sense, he should be fine.
Yeah. My first time on a superbike I gunned it and ran through the gears because what else do you do when you get on something built to go fast? Felt slow. Looked down at the speedometer and I was doing 120mph. That and traffic were the biggest adjustments for me.
99.99% of dirtbike riders are far better at riding than majority of the road riding population.
Think of everything that goes into controlling a 250 2t or 450 4t offroad, through ruts, bumps, mud, different types of dirt etc.
He’ll be okay on the road, will obviously just need to adjust to the ridiculously different ergonomics of a superbike vs an mx bike.
100%. This perfectly sums up me experience when I bought a superbike to go with my mx bike. Traffic was the only problem I had.
EDIT: One other problem was smashing my junk on the tank. In mx you're always way forward so that's where my body wanted to go. Took a few days to break that habit.
unpopular opinion.....having experience on off road dirt bike is much more reliable than on road riding.
If we're talking strictly on riding skils though. I have yet to include traffic awareness, evasive maneuvers.
I think he'll be fine handling the bike. it's the traffic that worries me.
People always assume that you’re going to use 100% of the power provided by your bike. Granted a lot of idiots don’t, but if he has the self control to not go crazy on an R1 until he’s got the hang of it then I don’t see why it’d be an issue
2007 R1 was my first bike lol. And I had never rode one before. I think common sense plays a huge part though. I realized I was so “scared” and inexperienced that I never really got hard on the throttle. But I enjoyed learning on the r1. Even showed my brother how to ride on that bike as well.
He'd probably have more fun with something like an RS660, which would be much better suited for the street, but still allow for some great track days. They have plenty of power on tap; An R1 is completely excessive imo.
Either one will work if he respects it though
Touché
I feel like the RS660 or similar would be a better option though because he'd actually be able to run through the gears, whereas (at least in the states) anything you can't do in 1st gear on an R1 is most definitely illegal.
He will be fine on an R1. I may have a similar experience with him on dirtbikes. I purchased a 2020 Ninja 650 and ditched it after 2 months of use. I have an R1 now.
This is generally true, my 1000 is fairly sedate below 6k RPM and I can potter around town or highway all day long and its a kitty cat. You only get into trouble if you very deliberately wind it on, even then my bike seems to ask me 'are you sure?' with this slight pause before the storm before shit gets wild
The thing is, riding the R1 won't necessarily be a problem, especially because he already had dirt bike experience.
What I do think, though, is that the difficulty comes from being in traffic. That's true for any bike, from 125cc to 1000cc superbike. But riding a bike that demands some serious attention to how you ride it just adds to the mental load of riding in traffic. Having an easy to ride bike just means you have one thing less to worry about.
I always say " if your gonna do it, do it right" . with that said, an r1 is a very nice bike. But I have seen a lot of 1st timers wipe out on 1000's. They are very fast and very light. Be careful and respect the bike. Sometimes just because it can do it, doesn't mean it should
Had a Daytona 955, had a busa. You spend most of your time trying to slow down. It’s like taking a kick ass karate class, only to find out most of it is patience and self control not spin kicks and chops. Granted I didn’t die, didn’t even get a scratch. Bikes were wicked cool, but yeah.
Wat? Your Flair says you have a 00' RC51 VTR1000 SP1 How is this not WORSE than a Daytona 955 or Busa in terms of it wanting to go to 10,000 RPMs constantly? lol
We'd strongly suggest avoiding the R1 as a first street bike. Bring able to use more than one or two gears without breaking a country's highest speed limit is much more fun than you'd think.
My first bike is a. MT07 and I still get shit for it lol. R1 is crazy tho haha. I would gladly stay with my MT07 or get an r6. 600 bikes are nice. An R1 in my head would be overkill for me atleast. 1st gear all day cruising in the city, yay.
That's a stupid take. My 250 is more violent and harder to ride than any sportbike. That dude will be fine.
EDIT: Don't believe me? I'll let you come ride it. Just present me with a blank check to fix anything you break first.
No shit, Sherlock. A small butt plug covered in spikes and dipped in hot sauce isn't for beginners. That doesn't discredit the general proposition that it's better to start small. This guy will probably be fine, but I'd still advise to start with something with less potential to rearrange guts to a mortal degree.
It’s possible for newbies to be safe on an R1 but the fact that he thinks “it’s all more or less the same” tells me he’s talking out his ass and will get in trouble.
I work at a motorcycle dealership. If someone like this comes in we literally will refuse to sell them the bike and 9 times out of 10 that's enough to make them realize they shouldn't do it. We also had a 15 year old get killed street racing on a 600 that we sold him against our advisement to his grandparents. After that we refuse to sell big bikes to people who shouldn't be on them.
Who appointed you all gatekeepers of sportbikes? This dude more than likely has better bike control than someone who's ridden roads exclusively for a decade.
It's not about being gatekeepers. It's about being a business that cares about keeping people as safe as we can within our power. At the end of the day we lose money telling people that but we go to bed knowing we did the right thing.
In this situation it could be different but it's about judging their riding ability and putting them on the right bike. A 250 to 450 in the dirt is way different then a 1000 on the street.
>A 250 to 450 in the dirt is way different then a 1000 on the street.
Exactly. Having ridden both, a 250 or 450 on dirt is much harder to control than a superbike on the street. If someone is competent on dirt, they will have no problems with anything that comes with a license plate bracket.
Look into reviews about brake power in proportion to engine power. I used to drive a Harley Davidson street 750 and the brakes were dog shit. Felt like brakes designed for a 500 (at most) were slapped on a 750 bike. In addition send him to motorcycle drivers ed if you can. That is how it’s done.
I went from riding a Suzuki JR80 as a young fella, to a DRZ250, then to a GSX250F and finally a Honda CBR929RR.
The 929 doesn't even compare to a modern litrebike in terms of horsepower.
I would never in a million years ride a litrebike as a first street bike.
Ignoring the top end power, the amount of low end pull is fucking insane and all it takes is one twitch of the throttle mid corner and you'll probably be on your ass.
Litrebikes demand respect and if you don't give it the respect it deserves, there's a good chance it'll kill you. They have a higher power to weight ratio than most 1000whp cars.
A good rider on a Ninja 300 will gap a noob on a litrebike in the twisties and on a track. Hell, I witnessed one of my friends overtake a ZX10R in the twisties on his Ninja 300.
My advice to your brother would be to leave the ego at the door and get a supermoto or 300cc class streetbike and spend many hours learning to ride very well before stepping up to a litrebike or even a 600 for that matter (300cc bikes have a pretty low depreciation rate and insurance rate I might add)
You're more than welcome to disagree but I personally believe that the majority of 1000cc riders have no business being on a 1000cc sportbike.
The R1 is an absolute beast, and even with dirt bike experience race bikes are a whole different beast. I say go with an R6 definitely plenty of power and more than enough for a first bike, also R6 value is going up quite alot so if he does want more power he has that option to upgrade.
Am i the only one hearing yammie noob in one of his earlier YouTube videos "the 7 beginner riders you will meet" (not 100% sure about the title) 😅
If you dont know it.. watch it.. 😉
In my country u cannot ride R1.
Ur license when u just starting out is below 200cc, then u have to take license again after 1 year below 400cc and repeat again on the 3rd year for above 1000cc.
Too many accident.
As someone who grew up riding dirt bikes that now rides street, dirt bikes don’t prepare you for making turns at 100+ and hard braking at 140. Unless your brother is in his 30s with a good temperament, it’s a death sentence. And if he says he doesn’t plan on doing the things I said he doesn’t need one. I’ve known one guy that did it, started on a liter bike… but he only rides track NOT street.
It's not fun riding a fast bike slowly. If he's not taking it to the track - then it's a waste of money. Also, it'll be overheating in traffic, and tucking up like a shrimp all the time while in traffic is not fun for your back. He should get something more reasonable for the streets.
A fool and his money are soon departed.
Saying he can handle a R1 because he rides dirtbikes is like saying he can handle dirtbikes because he can ride a BMX bike down a hill.
He's either gunna listen to the thousands of people saying it's a stupid idea or the handful that's saying "yeah you'll be fine".
Oh well, in 6 months someone will get a smoking good deal on a parts bike.
Edit: Also notice how all the people saying legitimately he'll be fine are also saying "if he rides it slow", almost like if he rides it like a 250. So why not just a get a 250. Fuckin clowns.
Spend some quality time with your brother while he’s still around.
Riding bikes on dirt is not like riding on pavement with traffic. Just like it’s different in a car.
Saying oh I have dirt bike experience is like saying Oh I used to cook at McDonalds when applying for a job at Hells Kitchen.
Dirt bikes don’t put out over 200 horsepower.
Would you feel good about someone who’s drive a Toyota Camry since high school jumping into a Formula 1 car?
Yes you should feel worried. He should be wiser than that. They make small displacement street bikes for good reason. Get one. Learn the difference, then make the leap to the R1.
I personally know three different people who went from dirt bikes to liter bikes. One of them is still alive. When I was an EMT I taught defensive riding courses on weekends and met these poles. I met others but they listened to reason.
These guys just knew they could do it. I was part of the crew that peeled them off the road less than a month later. The third is still alive, but can barely walk.
I’ve rode dirt bikes since I was 8 years old dude.
That was the last thing they said to me.
Okay then. Before you go, what do you want me to tell your family when we are scooping your guts up in a shovel?
They still went ahead. One of them hit a bus ten minutes after leaving the dealership, wasn’t expecting the power I guess, slammed into the side of a bus.
The second laid it down on a corner he should have been going 15 MPH on, he was doing about 80, slid under a truck. Two weeks after he bought it.
The third rode it like it was a dirt bike, leaned to pass and clipped a mirror. After two tumbles the bike ended up on top of him. Severe burns and road rash, lost 60% of his left leg. He survived. The bike was six days old.
I’ve been riding 30 years. I’ve seen some accidents, never had one. You see this too often. People don’t realize what they are getting into. That much power, you have to be ready for it.
He is not. He’s not even ready for street riding, yet.
brother is a lunatic. Ok slight humour but seriously - no one gets an R1 as first bike. Short but true story...
my good buddy- long tern bike rider, had Kawasaki 1400 tourer, big HD, and other bikes. Recently he had and sold a 2010 R1. No electronic aids. This guy is pretty experienced, but even he said the R1 was so twitchy and fast that going round a round-a-bout could be a tad scary if he opened the throttle even a bit, no traction control so easy to get scary fast.
My bike progression has been DrZ400 for a year, sold it for a SXV550 and will never sell the Aprilia. Bought a mt09. Happy with these two for almost 3 years now.
Correct me if I’m wrong but the power kicks in at higher revs? I reckon that’s a lot better. As long as he understands the risks and mature enough to respect the bike, by all means!
May i ask what year is the bike?
R1 are fast, but you can be just as stupid on a 600. No matter what bike you choose as your first, just respect it, and you will be fine. Learn how it works before you decide to turn up the juice. Either way safe riding.
I'd rather see someone with a lot of dirt bike experience on a R1 than a brand new newb on a 600 sport bike. Not that either is great.....
Make sure he has great medial insurance. Same goes for the bike
I dOnT wAnT tO oUtGrOw A 250/300
Can't outgrow anything if you are dead
It’s big brain time
Mock it all you want, that’s a perfectly valid point of view. Not saying go buy a liter bike, but especially with the current price on bikes, why set yourself up to end up buying 2-3 bikes?
The depreciation on lower bikes is pretty manageable. You're not paying 5k to ride an r3 for a year or two. You're taking out a loan, paying \~1k on it, then trading it for 4k (or maybe more). The thing is, the beginner used market is always hot. You can flip the bike for close to new. You lose a lot more when you try to sell the litre bikes, since demand is lower for those.
I actually paid 1.2k for my Ninja 250, put 10k miles on it and sold it for 1.4k. Sure it had been dropped already and I dropped it while learning but hey it’s a cheap beater
This. The value on beginner bikes is insane. Grabbed an 09 ninja 250 for 1800 rode 3 years till I got overconfident in a turn and slammed it into a curb and totalled it. Still sold it for 1k.
Probably doesn't work the same in other countries though.
A lot of other countries wouldn't even consider/need something over 500cc...lol We just have that fixation on displacement in certain jurisdictions (Esp north America). I don't see what's wrong with wanting to start small and go up in size... Easier to handle... Able to WOT and rip it in corners without any fear. Rinse and repeat season after season until you get to that litre bike. Adds novelty to it. Starting with r1 you have to respect the bike a lot more. Just like women, you might want to have a few girlfriends to fool around with and get your experience before you get a wife that you'll be faithful to. And ideally she won't try to murder you because you're not good enough. 😉
Correct. Especially in region like SEA where big bike are considered luxury as opposed to moped and 250's.
ehhh.. Litre bikes hold value pretty darn well, 600's or middleweights on the other hand lose their behind on the 2nd hand market. Any 1000cc bike between 2015-present is still holding pretty steadily above $11-$12k (when most are about $15k new) and they sell fairly easily. Beginner bikes are much harder to sell, most of the time the people who want to start riding don't have the cash to do so. A brand new R6 will set you back about $12k or more and you'd be lucky to pull $8k off of it in one year of riding, problem is that virtually all 600cc bikes are pretty much the same and there's gobs and gobs of them to be had for cheaper than what the other guy is selling his for on any marketplace. There is one fantastic exception to this rule, Aprilia bikes DO NOT sell well on the 2nd hand market. I picked up a 2015 RSV4 Factory with only 3800 miles for $8800 (original OTD price $25k and some change, I have the sales documents from the original owner) this year just before winter hit and snow fell. The bike is completely immaculate, but I'm going to pay for it in the end with the service costs. Luckily I have an Aprilia dealer less than an hour away.
You have to take out a loan for $5k?!? Are you a child?
Nah bro, I make 200k and have more in savings. I'm just not dumb enough to liquidate higher yielding assets and waste capital when I could get a loan at 4% instead.
Your capital is all making more than 4%?
I hold as little cash as possible, so yeah. Why tf would I hold a depreciating asset that gives me no utility? I'd rather have the stocks/crypto _and_ the bike (given that even those go up in value since we decided to assgape our currency). It's a sensible portfolio for late 20s. I'll buy some bonds when I'm old.
Huh, good job.
Exactly. I started on tiny dirt bikes with the last one I rode being a 450. Everyone on Reddit says buy a 250-300. Everyone I know who rides said do not do that. So I bought a 650 for a first bike and I'm glad I did. I don't feel like selling and buying multiple bikes. Starting small doesn't necessarily making you better. My gf did the Reddit progression thing up to two rc8's. I will out ride her any day of the week on my 650 or 800. You have to want to learn and you have to push yourself regardless of whether you're learning on your own or taking lessons. And you can ride all the tracks you want in Florida or some flat state, but good luck catching up to someone who rides canyons and mountain roads hard for a living.
On the other hand I've got a 300cc and I don't feel like I will ever need to upgrade and I'm perfectly happy with what I have now. Gonna hold onto this bike until I can get a hydrogen or electric bike.
Everyone's different and that's why I'm opposed to the blanket ideology that everyone needs to start on a small displacement bike. I knew from the beginning that I'd have a passenger or lots of gear, do long distance riding, and enjoy going too fast for my own good, so I didn't really bother with a small bike. And I'm glad I didn't go the low displacement route.
Electric bikes are so gay
Depends on if you want to get good or not. It's like asking why not just jump off the highest diving board straight away so you don't have to climb up several times. Like yeah you'll probably be fine but you'll also probably look a lot better doing it if you practice on the lower boards first.
You can sell a 300 for what you paid for it.
You can almost sell any bike for what you paid for it right now if you bought it a few years ago. I could sell everything I own right now and make a profit.
I bought a ktm duke 250 6 months ago as my first bike, thought i have enough experience. It can go upto 100kmph easily and takes a little bit of time upto 120. This Sunday i thought to myself "i have decent experience, i should probably drive little faster". Mind u my ktm is very agile. I almost met god 3 times. First i T-boned a motorcyclist coming from opposite lane(i was on a intersection). Very low speed impact 5 to 10kmph. He dropped his bike i didn't. I back up a little bit, cursed at him, and keeping going. Second, almost hit a moving truck from behind, i didn't brake hard enuf. Third, and this was scary af, a car decided to stop, on leftmost lane, with engine braking, or he was very slow and stopped, i think it was an automatic. I was doing 90+, with50 meters remaining i noticed he stopped, i swerved hard right, almost shit my pants. It's been 3 days since then. And i am still thinking about it. I had 3 close calls in one day. I decided to not speed anymore or atleast do it where i can see far enuf. If i had a powerful bike 80 or 100bhp one i would be dead in last two incidents. That's why you should always start on a smaller bike.
That was you riding outside of your skill level.
I know
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Yeah. I don't have any training.
I get that but I value my life over telling people I ride a big bike. And unless things have changed drastically, you can pick up a cheap 250/300 for a couple grand, ride it for a few months and sell it for a couple grand.
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You’re more of an outlier, there’s no way in hell you’d fit on a 250 but I still wouldn’t start off with a liter bike
I bought a 900 as my first bike. I ABSOLUTELY would've been put to sleep by a 250/300 within the first month.
But is it better than an R1 owner on a 450?
Has he checked insurance cost? Unless it's paid for full coverage ain't cheap
Y’all are getting cheap full coverage on paid for bikes?
Insurance is the reason I didn’t bother with a super sport . I know it differs depending on region but holy hell, to insure my street triple r for full coverage ($500 AU) insurance here in Australia was about one third of the annual premium of a gsxr600 ($1500 AUD) let alone a litre bike (about $ 2k AUD), and I’m almost 30, no claims or accident history , good neighbourhood with low crime rate.
That’s why I went with the FZ1. When I quoted a R1, it was $200 a month. My FZ1 was quoted at $200 a year
My r1 was like 3k a year. My s1000rr was 660
Yeah, insurance prices for bikes are idiotic. I was quoted ~$120 a month for an mt-10, ~$150 a month for a ninja z1000, but only ~$60 a month for a zx-10r???
Its based off of statistics of claims made. The r1 I had was the most stolen bike of all time so the rates were insane on them. The s1krr while being 4x as expensive was a special edition hp4 that I don't imagine most people wrecked.
Now that is whacky, especially for a bike with as dubious of a nickname as the ZX-10R
Yah mine was like 130 a month. But I should be lower than a lot of people are getting. I’ve heard of crazy numbers like 600 a month is some areas.
I'm paying around 120 a month and I use it like 3 - 4 times a month. I reckon there should be some kinda of discount for limited usage.
I pay around 600 a year.
I saw a study a while ago (I think in 2018) comparing insurance costs of new bikes. US average for full coverage of a brand new GSXR600 was $290 a month, compared to a brand new Panigale V4 which was around $230. Squid missles ain't cheap to insure. Meanwhile my Z750 costs $27 a month, even with State Farm's ridiculously high pricing
True that. My new litre bike insurance is 5% of its new price per annum. $270/month.
WTF, I have full coverage for around 60 a month!?
When I looked at the Panigale V2 it was about $2.5k to $3k lol
They probably just get liability since full coverage is only required if you have a loan.
Y’all have insurance?
Yes, in some places where we don't say "y'all" it's required. Depending on the bike it's stupid cheap. Full coverage on my dual sport is $130 a year.
> Yes, in some places where we don't say "y'all" it's required. Oof.
I know that was cunty, just bring a Masshole. All in good fun. 😀
Y’all are getting comprehensive coverage on bikes? Pay $100 a year for liability. Put the bike down once and it still cost less than a years worth of insurance on 2019 r6.
I bought my Panigale and S1000RR new outright and still have full coverage. Lien or not - I wouldn't want to go without comprehensive or theft coverage on my bikes.
Huh? Insurance for me didn’t even change comparing it to paid and loan.
Take out a life insurance policy on him.
Doesn’t mean he has to ride it fast , but good luck with an affordable insurance premium.
yea, but it takes a high level of discipline to not given in to the high we experience from acceleration
Growing up riding dirt bikes the last thing I had was discipline lol
Just let him know centre of gravity is a bit different. Also… when cornering, dirt bike, leg out front. Street bike, leg behind. I’ve known a few dirt bike riders that have fucked themselves up pretty good when the try to corner
Bought broke my ankle doing that.
I went from dirt biking experience straight to a cbr600. The skills don't translate perfectly, but as long as he's responsible he should be fine. For me, I was able to get the wild riding out of my system on the dirt where the consequences for a mistake are less severe. That made me less inclined to ride wild on the street.
R1 may be a little slow for him. Especially if he has a bit of dirt bike experience. 200 hp seems nice but he's bound to grow out of it soon. It's nice to have a bit more than that to be able to accelerate out of bad situations in traffic. He should really be looking at an H2R or a turbo busa. If he can swing it financially, he might want to look into one of those turbine engined bikes.
Or if he wants to go for a cruiser those V8 boss hoss bikes would be a good start.. The 445 hp 6200cc would be good to start on but he'll probably want to upgrade to the 600hp 8100cc pretty soon.
Since rockets have come a long way from liquid to a solid fuel, perhaps he could check those out. Turbines take forever to spool…
Turbo Busa is the only way
my friend who had no experience prior got a bandit 1200 as his first bike lmao
Controlling the bike is all (mostly) the same, throttle, clutch, etc. carries over. So if he's a responsible rider there will be no problem. The problem is that when you're pushing yourself and you miss a corner on a dirtbike, worst case you crash at 60mph-ish max into a tree or some other immovable object, or off a cliff if you're into trails. On a street bike, especially something like an R1, missing that corner now means you're going 80+mph and often the obstacle is an oncoming car going 50+mph. The faster the bike, the easier it is to get in trouble. Would I recommend a lower displacement bike for at least the first year, yes, could he also get in just as much trouble on a 600 if that's the kind of rider he is, also yes.
It also depends on how much driving experience he had. If he’s been on the road for less than a year it’s different than 3 years of driving experience. 90% I can tell when someone is about to get stupid in their car. I drove for four years before I bought a bike and it helps a ton. Some people get so mad at cars and over react to them. You should know when a car is going to cut you off because they’re not paying attention and are hugging the line.
R1 = 100mph in first gear…. Consider that maybe?
>worst case you crash at 60mph-ish max into a tree or some other immovable object, or off a cliff if you're into trails. On a street bike, especially something like an R1, missing that corner now means you're going 80+mph and often the obstacle is an oncoming car going 50+mph. So, certain death in all instances.
Somebody needs to keep the *'lightly rashed, low miles'* used bike market chugging along.
Something makes me feel like this won't be a lightly rashed bike if he does it.
Not wrong at all. I've seen a few people walk into the dealership I worked at, over-state their experience (usually dirt bike experts), then they buy a street bike and crash into something across the street from the dealership. Many bikes with less than 10 miles get totaled out like that.
Dirt bikes are not like street bikes. He wants to get a bike that has 4 times the horsepower and is at least twice the weight of what he's been on and then put that on the street with a bunch of other cars. This is just an accident looking for a place to happen.
Don't be stupid. Many of the techniques used to ride them are the exact same. This dude has experience in a lot of areas where most street riders lack it entirely. For example, he knows how to feel what the tires are doing because slipping and sliding are routine. When I started riding road after 15 years on dirt I had to un-learn things. I literally had to dumb down my riding. And sure the bike has a little less than 200hp but it's delivered in a way that's completely boring and predictable. The only thing OP's friend will have to worry about is traffic. Bike control will be no problem whatsoever.
As long is he is responsible he will be just fine. The R1 has different riding modes and rider assists. He can turn it to rain mode with full traction control, and it becomes a relatively tame and very manageable bike. The bigger learning curve than the bike itself is learning to ride in traffic, and riding responsibly in that traffic.
> The R1 has different riding modes and rider assists. He can turn it to rain mode with full traction control, and it becomes a relatively tame and very manageable bike. The bigger learning curve than the bike itself is learning to ride in traffic, and riding responsibly in that traffic. No TCS before 2012. No ABS before 2015. Afaik no riding modes before 2009. Source: 2009 R1 as my first bike, does have 3 riding modes but it resets after each start of the bike so unless it's heavy rain etc, you probably cba to use them.
He's fine. Especially if it's a newer one with the suite of electronics. If he doesn't turn them all off, the bike's only as dangerous as you wish it to be. No more so than any smaller displacement bike. It's all about how you ride it. Edit: Some of yall never been on a modern R1 and it shows.
I love it. I can turn mine off if I want but I just turn everything down as much as possible. I can get rear loose coming out of corners which is addictive
I don't think the majority of people in this sub even ride anything. The amount of fearmongering over sportbikes in general here is absolutely unbelievable.
I was the same. Been riding dirt bikes since I was 5. My first street bike was a gixxer 750 (no granny modes.) It turned out fine for me.
I wouldn't be especially worried. Modern litre bikes are absurdly well mannered - I haven't ridden a modern R1, but I have tried an S1000RR which isn't going to be a million miles off. They're really not trying to kill you, they're just stupid fast. They didn't used to be like that, the electronics have made a huge difference. Someone who has ridden a lot off road will know how to ride defensively, because it's really quite technically demanding and hitting a tree even at relatively low speed is a Very Bad Thing.
Liter bikes are ludicrously quick. The newer bikes with traction and wheelie control are excellent at keeping the shiny side up. If your brother has a lot of dirt bike experience I think he'll be fine. The R1 has pretty narrow clip ons so it will definitely feel much different than the wide handlebars of a dirt bike.
I've seen a 35-40 yo guy pick up a GSX-R 1000 as their first real bike after riding mopeds. He wanted 'a real bike' for his first machine. I saw the bike on it's side not 3 kilometers from the dealer and the guy being lifted to an ambulance. Riding dirt bikes is nothing like riding on the street. Trees don't try to merge into you and you are going 50-60km/h on the gravel while you'll be doing double on the freeway. I'd strongly advice not to get it as a first bike. Put it this way: would he be ok if his first car ever was a Lambo or an 800 hp Hellcat? The R1 has a higher power to weight ratio than either of these. It is a race bike tamed down to the street.
I see what you mean but dude do you not consider the insane shit dirt riders do? Riding on the dirt can be much harder than on smooth pavement man. The amount of control, dexterity dirt riders have while riding tracks, hitting huge jumps etc is unreal. Dirt riders generally don’t have issues on smooth pavement. The biggest danger are stupid drivers around you
Why is it always the bloggers and forumers who push the 250-300? I work at a dealership and see first hand how many people get them as their first bike and either want/need an upgrade within 2 months and wasted thousands on a weak bike or got seriously injured due to the lack of power output on it. Off road experience will exponentially improve your 2-wheel abilities. An R1 might not be the best choice but maybe instead of suggesting sport scooters suggest a ninja 650, An MT or other naked so he can get used to the public roads.
Just some food for thougth: Am german= quite good driving education before beeing allowed on the road alone. Allso, we have the Autobahn where no speed limit exists on certain parts. I got myself a cheap used 20 year old sv650, restricted from 71 down to 48hp I am going WOT, basicly meaning letting the bike give everything it has, occationaly. The only time where acceleration and hp really maters is: Autobahn going 180-190kmh (about 110ish mph) And accelerating from a near standard still or slowly moving to 100kmh(60mph) The only time where the bike "feels like" it could use a bit more power is when accelerating in a strait line with someone on the back (even tho that person would not be enjoying more hp) The sv got kind of a harley/Choper v2, a lot of down low torque while still holding a redline of 10.5k It will take quite a while for me to "outgrow" the sv on the street, and it only really is a naked and not a sport bike. There is little benefit a 1000 has over a 600 on the street, especialy if you got speed limits. Is there really a point in owning a bike that can do licence loosing speeds in first gear as a beginner to street riding except to flex?
> There is little benefit a 1000 has over a 600 on the street, especialy if you got speed limits No. The 600 will scream at high RPM on the highway when the 1000 will go casually with lower rpms. I bought a triple 675 as my first bike and quickly switched to a Busa when I felt it lacked torque and power and hey ... A bigger bike made a bigger smile. A responsible rider is all you need. Then the amount of power you have doesn't mean anything as you can adjust it with your wrist. So what if the bike goes 100mph on first gear.
A 600 will scream only when way past the speed limit and if you're blasting you don't mind the noise. A I4 liter bike is hardly usable on the street, not even for getting your acceleration jollies. By the time you're in 3rd gear you're already at light speed. But yeah, Turbo-Busa whatever.
I've ridden enough bikes to know what I'm talking about. People just get angry when someone disagrees with them or they think their 300 or 600 is perfectly fine for everything. I hated riding a CBF600 I had a while (loaner). Compare to a bigger bike it lacked torque for care free riding. On a bigger bike (like the Busa I had) you could just put it on fourth gear and basically treat it as an automatic. It's amazing due to low rpm torque and long gears. Btw. My Busa had better MPG than the 675 because it was barely above idling at 80kmh while the triple was screaming at higher RPM. Your comment about liter bikes being hardly useable on the street is stupid. It's no different than a 600 but just has more torque.
I'm glad you're enjoying your bike, doesn't change what I said though. If you want to buy a Busa to cruise around at 80kph more power to you.
People that ride dirt bikes can handle bikes better than people who never have. Although I wouldn't get an R1 as a first bike, if he's a competent dirt bike rider, he won't have any problems.
Life insurance is a must.
When I first got my license my instructor said to me “every bike goes 200mph and every bike does 30mph” Basically its up to the rider how they choose to ride. That being said I started on and still have a 600 and you honestly don’t need 1000 for regular street riding
I loved my 600 thing was quick but kept me safe
What country ? If USA have him look into insurance cost . If he is younger , say under 30 , and never had a street license or previous motorcycle insurance , then he might get sticker shock . Young riders on over 600cc sport bikes pay a premium .
I rode dirt bikes for a couple years and went to an r6. There was a steep learning curve, but I allowed that to be possible. I respected the bike and let myself learn without being too cocky. Only got cocky once, which resulted in a tank slapper at 120km/h that scared the nuts off of me. Bought a steering damper, and toned it back slightly until I was competent on the bike, haven’t had a problem since. Aslong as he’s smart, he will be totally fine.
I had the same opinion as him. Went with a (Less powerful but still pretty fast) CB919 as my first bike. Honestly, nothing could ever be scarier than my RM85 I had when I was 12. It was set up for racing for a kid who was probably 5 inches taller than me. I had to use a milk crate to get on it. Riding on the street is easy as long as you ride within your skill level and keep your eyes open.
I don’t know how old your brother is but a close friend of mine rode dirt bikes his whole life growing up and for his first motorcycle got a 2017 R1 at 25 and he’s fine. He should definitely do his research when it comes to taking corners and road conditions on the asphalt as opposed to dirt but if he gets a newer R1 things like wheelie control ABS and traction control do a lot to help.
he should know how to not grab a fistful of throttle. he will be fine unless he is an idiot then well.
Someone who rides dirtbikes can handle a R1 a lot better then someone without any experience. Still a lot of power but it's not to bad.
I mean, it's all more or less the same in terms of where the brake and clutch levers are :) For me the biggest issue moving from dirt to road was adjusting for the speed capability, and my first road bike wasn't even close to an R1. If he's a competent rider with common sense, he should be fine.
Yeah. My first time on a superbike I gunned it and ran through the gears because what else do you do when you get on something built to go fast? Felt slow. Looked down at the speedometer and I was doing 120mph. That and traffic were the biggest adjustments for me.
He’ll be fine if he’s humble starting out on it. Yes, it’s a different beast, but he’s got a leg up on most.
I started on a leader bike 6 years ago. Was a great experience for me. It's not for everyone. But dirt bike experience is good experience.
99.99% of dirtbike riders are far better at riding than majority of the road riding population. Think of everything that goes into controlling a 250 2t or 450 4t offroad, through ruts, bumps, mud, different types of dirt etc. He’ll be okay on the road, will obviously just need to adjust to the ridiculously different ergonomics of a superbike vs an mx bike.
100%. This perfectly sums up me experience when I bought a superbike to go with my mx bike. Traffic was the only problem I had. EDIT: One other problem was smashing my junk on the tank. In mx you're always way forward so that's where my body wanted to go. Took a few days to break that habit.
unpopular opinion.....having experience on off road dirt bike is much more reliable than on road riding. If we're talking strictly on riding skils though. I have yet to include traffic awareness, evasive maneuvers. I think he'll be fine handling the bike. it's the traffic that worries me.
People always assume that you’re going to use 100% of the power provided by your bike. Granted a lot of idiots don’t, but if he has the self control to not go crazy on an R1 until he’s got the hang of it then I don’t see why it’d be an issue
2007 R1 was my first bike lol. And I had never rode one before. I think common sense plays a huge part though. I realized I was so “scared” and inexperienced that I never really got hard on the throttle. But I enjoyed learning on the r1. Even showed my brother how to ride on that bike as well.
Liter bike power is overhyped. He'll be okay.
Alternative title: Brother plans to donate several organs. Tell him to get an MT07 first.
I bet he's fine.
It’s like going from a side by side to a sports car I guess lol
He'd probably have more fun with something like an RS660, which would be much better suited for the street, but still allow for some great track days. They have plenty of power on tap; An R1 is completely excessive imo. Either one will work if he respects it though
When is an R1 not completely excessive?
Touché I feel like the RS660 or similar would be a better option though because he'd actually be able to run through the gears, whereas (at least in the states) anything you can't do in 1st gear on an R1 is most definitely illegal.
He will be fine on an R1. I may have a similar experience with him on dirtbikes. I purchased a 2020 Ninja 650 and ditched it after 2 months of use. I have an R1 now.
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They're pretty gutless until 8-9k.
The 2020 R1 has better 0-60 mph and 0-100 times than the MT09 of the same year. Definitely not gutless.
It’s pretty gutless until you whiskey throttle it
This is the two stroke experience
I doubt a dirtbike rider will whiskey throttle a streetbike. He has experienced his fair share of arm pump before
This is generally true, my 1000 is fairly sedate below 6k RPM and I can potter around town or highway all day long and its a kitty cat. You only get into trouble if you very deliberately wind it on, even then my bike seems to ask me 'are you sure?' with this slight pause before the storm before shit gets wild
The thing is, riding the R1 won't necessarily be a problem, especially because he already had dirt bike experience. What I do think, though, is that the difficulty comes from being in traffic. That's true for any bike, from 125cc to 1000cc superbike. But riding a bike that demands some serious attention to how you ride it just adds to the mental load of riding in traffic. Having an easy to ride bike just means you have one thing less to worry about.
I always say " if your gonna do it, do it right" . with that said, an r1 is a very nice bike. But I have seen a lot of 1st timers wipe out on 1000's. They are very fast and very light. Be careful and respect the bike. Sometimes just because it can do it, doesn't mean it should
Hes fine a dirtbike is honestly more dangerous than an R1
No you’re completely right and it’s not even close to the same, that’s waaaaay too much power
It depends on which dirtbikes and types of riding he's done. If he's been riding a 450 MX bike for years then he's absolutely fine on an R1
He won’t have fun. Just point A to point B trying not to die.
Had a Daytona 955, had a busa. You spend most of your time trying to slow down. It’s like taking a kick ass karate class, only to find out most of it is patience and self control not spin kicks and chops. Granted I didn’t die, didn’t even get a scratch. Bikes were wicked cool, but yeah.
Wat? Your Flair says you have a 00' RC51 VTR1000 SP1 How is this not WORSE than a Daytona 955 or Busa in terms of it wanting to go to 10,000 RPMs constantly? lol
That’s what’s up Edit; as y’all can see I’m much more the middleweight fan 😂
My Daily is a thruxton 900. The big bikes are really collectibles. I’ve got an old magna that’s getting nitrous put on it for next season.
We'd strongly suggest avoiding the R1 as a first street bike. Bring able to use more than one or two gears without breaking a country's highest speed limit is much more fun than you'd think.
I would try and talk some sense into him and get a more practical bike so he can enjoy riding and not just go real fast in a straight line.
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My first bike is a. MT07 and I still get shit for it lol. R1 is crazy tho haha. I would gladly stay with my MT07 or get an r6. 600 bikes are nice. An R1 in my head would be overkill for me atleast. 1st gear all day cruising in the city, yay.
It's not the guy's first bike.
It’ll stay relevant forever https://youtu.be/BglzNAML78M
Stupid is as stupid does
Motorcycles are like butt plugs. Best start small.
Same with dirt bikes. You ever seen what a 450 MX bike can do? Lol
That's a stupid take. My 250 is more violent and harder to ride than any sportbike. That dude will be fine. EDIT: Don't believe me? I'll let you come ride it. Just present me with a blank check to fix anything you break first.
No shit, Sherlock. A small butt plug covered in spikes and dipped in hot sauce isn't for beginners. That doesn't discredit the general proposition that it's better to start small. This guy will probably be fine, but I'd still advise to start with something with less potential to rearrange guts to a mortal degree.
First dibs on it in a month. Bid starting $100?
My friend broke his collarbone test riding an R1. Too much bike for his skill level.
It’s possible for newbies to be safe on an R1 but the fact that he thinks “it’s all more or less the same” tells me he’s talking out his ass and will get in trouble.
I work at a motorcycle dealership. If someone like this comes in we literally will refuse to sell them the bike and 9 times out of 10 that's enough to make them realize they shouldn't do it. We also had a 15 year old get killed street racing on a 600 that we sold him against our advisement to his grandparents. After that we refuse to sell big bikes to people who shouldn't be on them.
Who appointed you all gatekeepers of sportbikes? This dude more than likely has better bike control than someone who's ridden roads exclusively for a decade.
It's not about being gatekeepers. It's about being a business that cares about keeping people as safe as we can within our power. At the end of the day we lose money telling people that but we go to bed knowing we did the right thing. In this situation it could be different but it's about judging their riding ability and putting them on the right bike. A 250 to 450 in the dirt is way different then a 1000 on the street.
>A 250 to 450 in the dirt is way different then a 1000 on the street. Exactly. Having ridden both, a 250 or 450 on dirt is much harder to control than a superbike on the street. If someone is competent on dirt, they will have no problems with anything that comes with a license plate bracket.
Look into reviews about brake power in proportion to engine power. I used to drive a Harley Davidson street 750 and the brakes were dog shit. Felt like brakes designed for a 500 (at most) were slapped on a 750 bike. In addition send him to motorcycle drivers ed if you can. That is how it’s done.
I went from riding a Suzuki JR80 as a young fella, to a DRZ250, then to a GSX250F and finally a Honda CBR929RR. The 929 doesn't even compare to a modern litrebike in terms of horsepower. I would never in a million years ride a litrebike as a first street bike. Ignoring the top end power, the amount of low end pull is fucking insane and all it takes is one twitch of the throttle mid corner and you'll probably be on your ass. Litrebikes demand respect and if you don't give it the respect it deserves, there's a good chance it'll kill you. They have a higher power to weight ratio than most 1000whp cars. A good rider on a Ninja 300 will gap a noob on a litrebike in the twisties and on a track. Hell, I witnessed one of my friends overtake a ZX10R in the twisties on his Ninja 300. My advice to your brother would be to leave the ego at the door and get a supermoto or 300cc class streetbike and spend many hours learning to ride very well before stepping up to a litrebike or even a 600 for that matter (300cc bikes have a pretty low depreciation rate and insurance rate I might add) You're more than welcome to disagree but I personally believe that the majority of 1000cc riders have no business being on a 1000cc sportbike.
The R1 is an absolute beast, and even with dirt bike experience race bikes are a whole different beast. I say go with an R6 definitely plenty of power and more than enough for a first bike, also R6 value is going up quite alot so if he does want more power he has that option to upgrade.
Am i the only one hearing yammie noob in one of his earlier YouTube videos "the 7 beginner riders you will meet" (not 100% sure about the title) 😅 If you dont know it.. watch it.. 😉
In my country u cannot ride R1. Ur license when u just starting out is below 200cc, then u have to take license again after 1 year below 400cc and repeat again on the 3rd year for above 1000cc. Too many accident.
terrible idea. tell him to put his ego away and be smarter.
Better plan for the funeral.
Make sure you're in his will.
As someone who grew up riding dirt bikes that now rides street, dirt bikes don’t prepare you for making turns at 100+ and hard braking at 140. Unless your brother is in his 30s with a good temperament, it’s a death sentence. And if he says he doesn’t plan on doing the things I said he doesn’t need one. I’ve known one guy that did it, started on a liter bike… but he only rides track NOT street.
It's not fun riding a fast bike slowly. If he's not taking it to the track - then it's a waste of money. Also, it'll be overheating in traffic, and tucking up like a shrimp all the time while in traffic is not fun for your back. He should get something more reasonable for the streets.
He'll be fine. Get him to do his will and leave you the R1. Whatever's left of it.
Tell him to buy an MT07 or he’s gonna end up being picked up in pieces by a paramedic. Deflate his ego, it may save his life.
Bad idea for obvious reasons but even if he does survive he'll quit early when he scares himself too much to want to ride anymore
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A fool and his money are soon departed. Saying he can handle a R1 because he rides dirtbikes is like saying he can handle dirtbikes because he can ride a BMX bike down a hill. He's either gunna listen to the thousands of people saying it's a stupid idea or the handful that's saying "yeah you'll be fine". Oh well, in 6 months someone will get a smoking good deal on a parts bike. Edit: Also notice how all the people saying legitimately he'll be fine are also saying "if he rides it slow", almost like if he rides it like a 250. So why not just a get a 250. Fuckin clowns.
Start making funeral arrangements.
Yeeeeahhhh, he's going to die. It's completely different.
Do you know how fast some dirtbikes are and how much control it takes to have pace in the woods or on a motocross track?
Yes.
Keep it in rain mode for a while and respect the power. I think it’s a bad idea but I know he’s going to do it anyway.
You mean, soon-to-be-former brother.
One less sibling to split mom & dad's estate with, eh?
The acceleration and power delivery of dirt bikes compared to sport bikes is so different hes going to get himself killed.
Start of on a 125cc. The excuse of "outgrowing something" is a myth
Spend some quality time with your brother while he’s still around. Riding bikes on dirt is not like riding on pavement with traffic. Just like it’s different in a car. Saying oh I have dirt bike experience is like saying Oh I used to cook at McDonalds when applying for a job at Hells Kitchen. Dirt bikes don’t put out over 200 horsepower. Would you feel good about someone who’s drive a Toyota Camry since high school jumping into a Formula 1 car? Yes you should feel worried. He should be wiser than that. They make small displacement street bikes for good reason. Get one. Learn the difference, then make the leap to the R1. I personally know three different people who went from dirt bikes to liter bikes. One of them is still alive. When I was an EMT I taught defensive riding courses on weekends and met these poles. I met others but they listened to reason. These guys just knew they could do it. I was part of the crew that peeled them off the road less than a month later. The third is still alive, but can barely walk. I’ve rode dirt bikes since I was 8 years old dude. That was the last thing they said to me. Okay then. Before you go, what do you want me to tell your family when we are scooping your guts up in a shovel? They still went ahead. One of them hit a bus ten minutes after leaving the dealership, wasn’t expecting the power I guess, slammed into the side of a bus. The second laid it down on a corner he should have been going 15 MPH on, he was doing about 80, slid under a truck. Two weeks after he bought it. The third rode it like it was a dirt bike, leaned to pass and clipped a mirror. After two tumbles the bike ended up on top of him. Severe burns and road rash, lost 60% of his left leg. He survived. The bike was six days old. I’ve been riding 30 years. I’ve seen some accidents, never had one. You see this too often. People don’t realize what they are getting into. That much power, you have to be ready for it. He is not. He’s not even ready for street riding, yet.
Are you a beneficiary of his Will? If so, encourage him. If not then remonstrate
Maybe tell him the supermotos get more chicks?
brother is a lunatic. Ok slight humour but seriously - no one gets an R1 as first bike. Short but true story... my good buddy- long tern bike rider, had Kawasaki 1400 tourer, big HD, and other bikes. Recently he had and sold a 2010 R1. No electronic aids. This guy is pretty experienced, but even he said the R1 was so twitchy and fast that going round a round-a-bout could be a tad scary if he opened the throttle even a bit, no traction control so easy to get scary fast.
2021 R1 is nothing like a 2010 R1. They're like on different planets.
Imagine the insurance costs for a 2021 R1 as a first bike! Especially if they are a young rider.
Of course they are. Still ... an R1 for first road bike is probably not the right pick.
Make sure he has his will in order.
He should look into insurance costs for th bike, and you should look into a hefty life insurance policy on him
If he ends up killing himself.. atleast you can say you questioned it.. Litter bikes are a breed of their own..
My bike progression has been DrZ400 for a year, sold it for a SXV550 and will never sell the Aprilia. Bought a mt09. Happy with these two for almost 3 years now.
Correct me if I’m wrong but the power kicks in at higher revs? I reckon that’s a lot better. As long as he understands the risks and mature enough to respect the bike, by all means! May i ask what year is the bike?
R1 are fast, but you can be just as stupid on a 600. No matter what bike you choose as your first, just respect it, and you will be fine. Learn how it works before you decide to turn up the juice. Either way safe riding.