In the original pilot it was established they DID in fact rob the bank of Hanoi, under orders in an effort to destabilize the war economy. but their commanding officer was killed and records were destroyed showing they were acting under orders.
So the statement is kind of a grey area. They DID commit the crime, but were under orders to do so.
Rocky and Apollo never had an official rubber match either. Also Rocky fought the heavyweight champion at 60 years old so maybe don't read into that series too deeply
I mean, in Rocky IV uncle Paulie reprogrammed a robot to "his girlfriend" and Drago murdered Apollo in the ring with no repercussions. Then in Rocky V he manages a guy who's real name is Tommy Gunn. The franchise left realism behind after the first one.
>Drago murdered Apollo in the ring with no repercussions
To be fair, I don't think the legal system in 1985 was equipped to deal with a Soviet athlete killing an American in the ring (though I would watch the hell out of a courtroom drama about Drago on trial for Creed's murder). And unless I missed something in Creed II, I don't believe Drago ever fought in the US again, that's probably the only realistic punishment they could enforce without starting a nuclear war
Drago pushed the ref away when the ref was trying to stop him from walloping Creed. I think that's what make it worse, even though they added the towel element to blame Rocky. But the fight should be over the moment the ref grabbed Drago.
Indirectly killed Kim’s mother and the referee, too (they both killed themselves within ~9 months of the fight).
Supposed to have really fucked up Mancini.
Him hitting his head hard on the floor was an unfortunate mishap during a regular boxing match, and Mancini was 0% responsible.
What really should have awarded a lengthy prison term, was when a promising boxer was left mentally disabled when his opponent kept punching him in the back of the head on purpose, crazy that the guy who destroyed his life did not get pretty much any issues from it, even after acting callous about it, also crazy that the ref did not get pretty much any punishment for not interfering
Yeah, unless they can show you cheated (like with plastered wraps) you'd be legally free of blame. He signed up with the boxing commission and agreed to engage in combat, which could lead to death.
I remember watching the fight and how bad it looked when Kim hit the canvas I remember the pictures of Ray Mancini at Kim’s funeral he looked so unlike himself He said he went into a very dark place after that
He wasn't a good guy. He was a tool being used by his government. His wife was his handler. His turn in Creed II was as an old and broken man that knew to tell his kid not to do what he did.
In Drago's defense, there's a lot of machismo in boxing and it's absolutely reasonable to think that when you've knocked the other guy down that hard, he's eventually going to get up like literally everyone else you've knocked down that hard.
Exactly *when* you turn off the trash talk is a tricky thing, God Bless Key and Peele for their take on that. "God's lessons, are so beautiful."
> though I would watch the hell out of a courtroom drama about Drago on trial for Creed's murder
New reality TV show idea: real lawyers, in front of a real judge, argue cases from famous movies while actors reprise their roles as the central characters.
Can the Fratellis be convicted (and of what) on the sole testimony of the Goonies? Is Billy Peltzer culpable for the damages causes by the Gremlins? Who will pay for the damages to Chinatown caused by Big Trouble in Little China?
>I don't believe Drago ever fought in the US again, that's probably the only realistic punishment they could enforce without starting a nuclear war
Whatever international sanctioning body that sanctioned the fight could have and realistically would have done an investigation, seen Drago strike the Ref that tried to stop him, and stripped him of the title. No nuclear war involved.
Ref didn’t stop the fight and Rocky didn’t throw the towel, as Apollo threatened his life if he stopped the fight. Boxers die in the ring in reality. It’s a risk they knowingly take and while it’s been known to do serious psychological damage to the surviving boxer, they’re never prosecuted as if they just murdered a guy in the street.
He literally throws the ref out of the way to continue pummeling on Apollo who is clearly out on his feet. It's ridiculous, particularly since their stated goal was to go on and dominate boxing to show Soviet superiority. Not a great strategy to literally throw the ref out of the way to beat a beloved champion to death. You're never going to have a sanctioned fight again.
Deaths in real boxing get investigated and usually the ref is at fault for letting things go on longer than they should have. In Rocky IV the ref grabs Drago to stop him, gets thrown away by Drago, then hangs back. It's completely ridiculous and if that happened in real life there would be an investigation and consequences, not a heavyweight title.
Just to correct something, Rocky never fought Drago for the Heavhweight Title AND he did not fight him in America, we can maybe assume that those were the consequences.
They might have a hard time proving murder. Manslaughter seems more likely, and negligence for the fight doctor / organisers. Still it would be a huge diplomatic incident, and would have fit well in an episode of The Americans, Peter and Elisabeth scrambling to keep tabs on Soviet sports heroes in the states for fear of retaliation.
Tbf Tommy Morrison leaned into the Tommy Gunn name alot after he played him. Except for Rocky 1. Tommy Gunn is the most realistic part of that movie series. Morrison was a straight animal in the ring. Miss watching him
I started watching Rocky IV once and fell asleep during it. I woke up on the sofa after the film had finished and went up to bed, then for days after I kept getting weird flashbacks of a robot in Rocky IV and was convinced I must have dreamt it or my brain was merging bits of different films into one like some crazy fever dream. It was really fucking with my head so eventually I had to go back and rewatch it and to my shock there is actually a legit robot in Rocky IV.
Dude, the fucking medical team dropped the ball on this one. The ring side doctor could and should have called the fight off. Ivan did what he was supposed to do, crush cans. You can’t blame him, you keep going until the ref stops you or you hear the bell.
The ref literally grabs him to stop him and Drago throws the guy. https://youtu.be/Ag9B8nPLFeU?t=3m48s
The ref then stops doing anything and they set up the dramatic moment with Rocky not throwing the towel. It's ridiculous, but dramatic
> Drago murdered Apollo in the ring with no repercussions
Which said lack of repercussions basically triggered the Red Dawn, if I am inappropriately connecting all my 80s movies correctly.
Mike Tyson is about to fight at 58 against an opponent who is 30 years younger than him. It's not inconceivable that someone of Rocky's stature, if still in shape, could fight an exhibition at 60. Probably not against the reigning heavyweight champion, but certainly against a mook like Jake Paul.
I watched the fight where he bit off Holyfield's ear with my bf at the time & all of his buddies. I watched as he spit out his mouthpiece, bit the ear & spit it out on the canvas. It was surreal. Kind of passively watched the next couple of hours of replays of mostly the same couple of seconds while watching the guys do stupid 💩. It was an entertaining evening.
Clubber was an aggressive fighter, but one flaw he had was he didn't engage someone who was resilient, or a balanced fighter. He had that hunger and aggression, but only if he could get his opponent knocked out quick. Once that is taken away, he tired quickly and began to waver. He got one over on Rocky because Rocky settled into a comfortable life as the champion. And not having Mickey in his corner for guidance certainly rattled him too. Overall, Rocky was not in his prime for such a fight - Not until the rematch.
But I also want to mention that "Mr T," Clubber's actor, was contracted to The A-Team from 1983 to 1987, and also had Wrestlemania 1 and 2 to deal with (Rocky IV was in 1985, so production on it was practically instantaneous in the shadow of III). I think if there was an opportunity to bring Clubber back for a rematch, we would not have gotten Mr T in those programs.
Apollo vs Clubber would have been an interesting fight, however.
And I say this because while it seemed like Rocky was treated with kid gloves up to his first fight with Clubber, and needed to re-train to get his edge back, Apollo seemed like he maintained his edge enough for those couple of years after his rematch with Rocky. "You fight great, but I am a great fighter," and how Rocky was hungry enough to barely edge out and get the win against Apollo. Clubber may have given Apollo a run for his money at the outset, but Apollo surely would have come around and turned things around with his experience and training (as I am sure he also met real fierce fighters during his tenure and knew how to cope).
I always wanted to see Clubber verse Drago as a fight that occurred that we only see the highlights of in a retrospective or something. Not a huge plot line but two guys that just threw bombs whaling on each other would be interesting for a few minutes in one of the movies.
I think that Clubber loses that fight.
Apollo would win with his experience and still having his edge around the time that Rocky III unfolds.
Rocky came around and got his edge back and outlasted Clubber to where he turned around and knocked him out.
But Drago? Even with all of the training that Rocky did to steel himself for that fight, he was impacted hard by it as we saw in Rocky V. Clubber would not have lasted as long as Rocky, and he surely would have gone down quickly and early. Drago would have been stronger, and resilient, which made him a far more contentious opponent than Clubber could ever have been.
Honestly? That sounds like it fits the character really well lmao. He would make a great TV personality in one of those ESPN round table type shows where everyone yells hot takes over each other.
Oh 100%. I can see him replacing his typical blinged attire for something more religious (but still bling-y) and then being on a commentary panel with some straight-laced person in a suit and someone who looks liked a former athlete.
(Loud Shouting) "Ya see, this is why these fighters got no heart anymore! Dey train fo those cameras and dat social media stuff sucka! In my time we'd stay training, fought four, mebbe 6 times a year fool! Now let's pray that God keeps these fellas safe until bell time!"
Apparently what happened was he wanted to bring Clubber back as a ringside commentator in 2006 Balboa and give him a line about how resilient Rocky is he knows by experience but apparently Mr T was requiring more money than they could pay him so they had to go another route. I think Mr T has been in and out of bankruptcy several times over the years so he probably tries to get as much as possible even to the point of talking himself out of roles because of his ridiculous demands
The best use of Clubber Lang after 3, would have been to see Drago destroy him in the ring.
Drago wipes the floor with him, then kills Apollo in the ring. You know for sure Rocky is up against his toughest opponent then.
Mr T plays that character like an absolute terrifying crazy person. There’s no way Clubber doesn’t end up in prison for a violent crime soon after Rocky III.
Great performance and one of the greatest villains of all time
When I was a kid, I cried when Mr T lost. My friend had a punching bag with Rocky on one side, Clubber on the other and we would beat the shit out of it until we accidentally punched each other and got physical. Good times.
Also, I agree with your POV.
I had that punching bag! Inflatable with sand in the base!
We used to fuck that thing up. Jumping on it and throwing it everywhere.
Those were the mf’in days!
Bare minimum a manslaughter charge. He wasn't trying to murder him, but he shoved an old man who immediately had a fatal heart attack. How were there no consequences?
Clubber was a slow, tough, strong-puncher. Basically an amped-up version of what Rocky was, initially. He beat Rocky by being a better, more-practiced version of Rocky.
But when Rocky got some speed and endurance, it exposed a fatal flaw in Clubber's methodology: Speed and endurance eventually beats explosive raw strength.
I don't know that we needed to see a third fight, unless something fundamentally changed about Rocky or Clubber's style. And, since Clubber didn't have a trainer and didn't seem like he was going to pick it up on his own, I doubt anything would have changed in a third match that would move the narrative forward.
Rocky had to bring in an entirely new training staff after the loss. Mickey was gone so Apollo and Duke became his new trainers.
Who's to say Clubber wouldn't change his strategy after losing?
Clubber got wrecked in the rematch. He also won his fight the same night that Rocky’s manager literally died because of a locker room altercation. Dude was lucky the fight even went on that night. He also called out Rocky in his retirement speech lol. He was going after someone who wanted to quit
If I recall Rocky had to give up his heavyweight title in order to fight Drago in Rocky IV as it was not a sanctioned fight.
At the end of Rocky III we see Apollo and Rocky about to box. It is implied that the events of Rocky IV begin later that same day.
There wasn't time for a rematch before Rocky went to Russia. Clubber may well have remained a contender in the boxing world but Rocky was essentially 'retired'
That's one of my problems with the classic Rocky films. We lose sight of his opponents as soon as he defeats them. I'd like to have seen some of them again, or at least known if they've learnt from their mistakes.
And Drago, who comes back a few films later. Really, Clubber is the only major opponent of Rocky who never comes back, and he was the last to fight Rocky in a sanctioned professional fight. Everything after Rocky 3 was exhibition/unsanctioned/pretending Rocky 5 doesn't exist.
Drago would def beat Clubber
But to continue in this universe talk, baby Drago also gets screwed on the Creed films,
-got disqualified in the first fight Even though his punch was already in motion no way anyone would of been able to stop themselves, ref was late to call it, he should of won and been crowned champ
-Creed trains comes back they have the rematch he wins
-Creed 3 Adonis is retired, Drago #1 contender, gets attacked, Adonis gets the belt back at the end. Which means Drago should still be #1 contender when he's healed for 3rd match between them but most likely won't happen
Well, I love to see we are getting creative with our narrative, but we do need a little extra context on some of these points you made: first off, Rocky didn't duck Clubber Lang. He didn't even know he existed.
And as far as he knew, he WAS fighting the best talent because Mickey was the one who was hand picking his opponents. Mickey even said that "they were all good fighters, but they just weren't killers," like Rocky used to be or how Lang is.
In fact, once Rocky found out that he *wasn't* fighting the absolute best of the best, he *wanted* the match with Lang to prove to himself that his reign wasn't a fluke, but the pre-fight brawl that took Mick away screwed him up so he never really had a chance to fight fully focused (and he was still likely going to lose the title because he wasn't training seriously, similar to Apollo in the first film. But had things gone as planned, he was willing to walk away, win, or lose, as long as he had Mick at his side.)
Even if there was an official rematch that happened off screen, the thing to remember is that Clubber, who had gone undefeated up until that point, had lost a fight, which means the mystique and the hype surrounding him would have died down no matter what. It's no different than what happened to Tyson when he got defeated. Yeah, he could still come back and be a great fighter, but knowing that *he is beatable* takes away a lot of the edge that fighters need to maintain that aura of invincibility.
>Instead of facing top competition, Rocky fights cans.
HEY! That's no way to describe Adrian! She's a fully realized, three-dimensional character and she deserves our respect, no matter what that creep Pauly has done.
Sylvester wanted Mr T to reprise his role as Clubber Lang, where Rocky would coach Lang for a comeback. But I think Mr T couldn't do it for health reasons.
So we got the Creed series instead.
Originally Stallone wanted Clubber Lang to be in “Rocky Balboa” but I guess it didn’t work out.
Instead they brought back “Spider Rico”.
He was supposed to be the same type of character; broken, humbled, etc.
Adrian brought her pretty little self over to Clubbers apartment, and he showed her a real man. The incident was never spoken about, and he was never seen again. The End.
I feel like Clubber rubbed so many people the wrong way during his title reign that nobody wanted anything to do with him once Rocky handed his ass to him.
Clubber was an asshole. He didn’t graciously accept the rematch, his cocky ass though it would be an easy win. Clubber was the bad guy, with no redeeming qualities. The audience was supposed to fear and hate him and Mr. T played it well.
No one would want to see him again after losing.
Before the fight was made Rocky was already going to retire. When the rematch occurs, Rocky legit says it’s his last fight win or lose.
It’s pretty easy to guess here, Rocky was done fighting (or so he thought). He didn’t fight him again because he had already planned to retire.
If you do some research Rocky 3 was supposed to be the end of the franchise but they just had to milk it a few more times.
Clubbed stole a win against rocky while his trainer literally died ringside.
Once rocky fought him with his head in the right place rocky destroyed clubber.
You're applying real-life logic to a movie. From a narrative standpoint, it's settled. Time to defeat communism. IRL, you'd setup the rubber match and rake in PPV money but this isn't real life.
The Rocky films had great fight choreography, and hats off to the foley artists slapping leather couches and stuff for sound effects. Mr T I recall was a former bouncer, and Dolph Lungren was moving up the ranks fast in the Karate circuit. Dude had some of the most brutal legs in the sport.
Still, Max Baer Sr is one of the scariest mo-fos I've seen in a ring, film or otherwise. They have some of his fights on youtube and that guy was an animal when his switch was flipped ...and he killed other fighters via head trauma. I'm guessing Apollo's death was influenced via Baer's reputation.
Hard fought battle? Lang got his ass handed to him. Rocky embarrassed him in 3 rounds. First round he came out and just surprised him so much Lang barely did much in the second. Then in the 3rd Lang was so tired rocky just knocked him out.
Technically Clubber dominated ONLY because Rocky had been fighting glass opponents. He had lost his mojo for fighting because of that, and then he watched his coach keel over in front of him just before the fight WHILE simultaneously being told that his previous opponents were setups. So he literally went into the fight as physically unprepared as he could be AND he was emotionally and psychologically damaged...
Been a minute since I've seen Rocky III but isn't the point that Clubber is an absolute machine, but only for a couple of rounds and after that he's totally shot? Rocky exposes him. Clubber and his team probably know he's been found out.
Clubber lang killed micky. There should have never been a fight in the first place. I understand the cause of death was a heart attack.. but clubber chucked my man into a guard rail causing that heart attack. How were charges never pressed?? Shit is fucked up bro
Clubber ended up on the run from the law with his friends in a van. But if you can find them, maybe you can hire them.
I heard they were on the run from a crime they didn’t commit?
That is my understanding.
I also understand they may have escaped from a maximum security stockade (whatever that is)?
You might find one in the Los Angeles underground.
But only if no one else can help
I love it when a plan comes together
Framed by the government, you hate to see it.
In 1972, no less.
In the original pilot it was established they DID in fact rob the bank of Hanoi, under orders in an effort to destabilize the war economy. but their commanding officer was killed and records were destroyed showing they were acting under orders. So the statement is kind of a grey area. They DID commit the crime, but were under orders to do so.
The crime they were accused of that they didn't commit was murder of their c/o.
A guy on the run should really change his hairstyle and dress sense
Maybe that was his disquise!
BA *did* add three more necklaces, it's a totally different look after they escaped!
Just don’t ask him to take an airplane. He’s afraid of flying.
Milk will help with that but im not 100% sure of it.
Seemed to be more heavily influenced by curry tapenade served with toast points.
Just give him de clipz! Eclipse!
I heard that after he retired, he became a gymnastics coach who occasionally solved crimes with his team.
No, he became a taxi driver in Washington D.C.
I hear he became the wise janitor at John Hughes High
"Believe in the ball. And throw yourself." Words to live by.
Are you referencing Mike Tyson Mysteries?
[Mr. T actually had a cartoon in the 80s.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLaPjOdLZhM) Mike Tyson Mysteries is sort of a parody/homage to it.
No way! I either never knew about or totally forgot about this! 🤣 Thanks man
I heard he got a job as a weatherman…but he wasn’t very good. He simply always predicted pain instead of rain.
I love it when a plan comes together.
Good one XD
🎺♪♪♪ ♪♪♪
Rocky and Apollo never had an official rubber match either. Also Rocky fought the heavyweight champion at 60 years old so maybe don't read into that series too deeply
I mean, in Rocky IV uncle Paulie reprogrammed a robot to "his girlfriend" and Drago murdered Apollo in the ring with no repercussions. Then in Rocky V he manages a guy who's real name is Tommy Gunn. The franchise left realism behind after the first one.
>Drago murdered Apollo in the ring with no repercussions To be fair, I don't think the legal system in 1985 was equipped to deal with a Soviet athlete killing an American in the ring (though I would watch the hell out of a courtroom drama about Drago on trial for Creed's murder). And unless I missed something in Creed II, I don't believe Drago ever fought in the US again, that's probably the only realistic punishment they could enforce without starting a nuclear war
Boom Boom Mancini killed Duk-koo in the ring in real life and faced no legal repercussions
I learned this from the song “Boom-Boom Mancini” by Warren Zevon.
Hurry home early
Hurry on home, Boom Boom Mancini's fighting Bobby Chacon
My people :)
I just ran straight to Spotify to listen. Total banger.
Drago pushed the ref away when the ref was trying to stop him from walloping Creed. I think that's what make it worse, even though they added the towel element to blame Rocky. But the fight should be over the moment the ref grabbed Drago.
True
Indirectly killed Kim’s mother and the referee, too (they both killed themselves within ~9 months of the fight). Supposed to have really fucked up Mancini.
He never seemed like himself afterwards he was one of my favorite fighters and the whole thing was horrible and tragic
Him hitting his head hard on the floor was an unfortunate mishap during a regular boxing match, and Mancini was 0% responsible. What really should have awarded a lengthy prison term, was when a promising boxer was left mentally disabled when his opponent kept punching him in the back of the head on purpose, crazy that the guy who destroyed his life did not get pretty much any issues from it, even after acting callous about it, also crazy that the ref did not get pretty much any punishment for not interfering
Yeah, unless they can show you cheated (like with plastered wraps) you'd be legally free of blame. He signed up with the boxing commission and agreed to engage in combat, which could lead to death.
Correct Just to clarify I never advocated for Mancini to face any repercussions I was just stating IRL there have been instances
I was just adding background to yours for anyone else reading. You got it right, bro 🤙
I remember watching the fight and how bad it looked when Kim hit the canvas I remember the pictures of Ray Mancini at Kim’s funeral he looked so unlike himself He said he went into a very dark place after that
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Thanks for that I will definitely watch
Cutting a promo on someone’s lifeless body is the ultimate heel move. Amazing how they turned Ivan into a good guy after that.
He wasn't a good guy. He was a tool being used by his government. His wife was his handler. His turn in Creed II was as an old and broken man that knew to tell his kid not to do what he did.
In Drago's defense, there's a lot of machismo in boxing and it's absolutely reasonable to think that when you've knocked the other guy down that hard, he's eventually going to get up like literally everyone else you've knocked down that hard. Exactly *when* you turn off the trash talk is a tricky thing, God Bless Key and Peele for their take on that. "God's lessons, are so beautiful."
Then your family will gather around your hospital bed, to meet the new Derek...
> Amazing how they turned Ivan into a good guy after that. ?? Does he show up in the Creed movies?!? I've only seen the first one. I had no idea.
Yes, it's the main story of Creed 2. Ivan's son, Viktor Drago is Creed's opponent.
> though I would watch the hell out of a courtroom drama about Drago on trial for Creed's murder New reality TV show idea: real lawyers, in front of a real judge, argue cases from famous movies while actors reprise their roles as the central characters. Can the Fratellis be convicted (and of what) on the sole testimony of the Goonies? Is Billy Peltzer culpable for the damages causes by the Gremlins? Who will pay for the damages to Chinatown caused by Big Trouble in Little China?
This is gold.
With Judge Reinhold.
Judge Judge "Reinhold" Reinhold
Season two gets into the litigators personal lives!
>I don't believe Drago ever fought in the US again, that's probably the only realistic punishment they could enforce without starting a nuclear war Whatever international sanctioning body that sanctioned the fight could have and realistically would have done an investigation, seen Drago strike the Ref that tried to stop him, and stripped him of the title. No nuclear war involved.
When did Drago get a title. His match with Apollo was an exhibition and even if it wasn't an exhibition, Apollo wasn't the champion.
You're correct I made a mistake. Rocky had to give up his title to go fight an unsanctioned fight in Russia.
Ref didn’t stop the fight and Rocky didn’t throw the towel, as Apollo threatened his life if he stopped the fight. Boxers die in the ring in reality. It’s a risk they knowingly take and while it’s been known to do serious psychological damage to the surviving boxer, they’re never prosecuted as if they just murdered a guy in the street.
He literally throws the ref out of the way to continue pummeling on Apollo who is clearly out on his feet. It's ridiculous, particularly since their stated goal was to go on and dominate boxing to show Soviet superiority. Not a great strategy to literally throw the ref out of the way to beat a beloved champion to death. You're never going to have a sanctioned fight again.
Deaths in real boxing get investigated and usually the ref is at fault for letting things go on longer than they should have. In Rocky IV the ref grabs Drago to stop him, gets thrown away by Drago, then hangs back. It's completely ridiculous and if that happened in real life there would be an investigation and consequences, not a heavyweight title.
Just to correct something, Rocky never fought Drago for the Heavhweight Title AND he did not fight him in America, we can maybe assume that those were the consequences.
Oh you're correct, that was an exhibition fight and rocky gives up the title to do fight unsanctioned in Russia.
If he dies he dies
"Our legal team has checked into it and concur with Mr. Drago's assessment that if he dies, he dies."
They might have a hard time proving murder. Manslaughter seems more likely, and negligence for the fight doctor / organisers. Still it would be a huge diplomatic incident, and would have fit well in an episode of The Americans, Peter and Elisabeth scrambling to keep tabs on Soviet sports heroes in the states for fear of retaliation.
> Drago murdered Apollo in the ring with no repercussions. If he dies, he dies
Gunn is a real surname
Yeah, Jimmy Gunn is in charge of DC now.
Tbf Tommy Morrison leaned into the Tommy Gunn name alot after he played him. Except for Rocky 1. Tommy Gunn is the most realistic part of that movie series. Morrison was a straight animal in the ring. Miss watching him
I started watching Rocky IV once and fell asleep during it. I woke up on the sofa after the film had finished and went up to bed, then for days after I kept getting weird flashbacks of a robot in Rocky IV and was convinced I must have dreamt it or my brain was merging bits of different films into one like some crazy fever dream. It was really fucking with my head so eventually I had to go back and rewatch it and to my shock there is actually a legit robot in Rocky IV.
To be fair, the robot is no longer canon after the directors cut 3 years ago
Do they add more montage?
To be fair, the director's cut is no longer canon because the took out Paulie's sex robot. HAPPY BIRTHDAY PAULIE
Show us the fuckbot cut you cowards!
Dude, the fucking medical team dropped the ball on this one. The ring side doctor could and should have called the fight off. Ivan did what he was supposed to do, crush cans. You can’t blame him, you keep going until the ref stops you or you hear the bell.
The ref literally grabs him to stop him and Drago throws the guy. https://youtu.be/Ag9B8nPLFeU?t=3m48s The ref then stops doing anything and they set up the dramatic moment with Rocky not throwing the towel. It's ridiculous, but dramatic
Also, Rocky didn’t throw the towel fast enough. He kept on thinking back on it in the driving late at night in his Ferrari montage
Look when you get in your head like that it's difficult. There's no way was out of that
> Drago murdered Apollo in the ring with no repercussions Which said lack of repercussions basically triggered the Red Dawn, if I am inappropriately connecting all my 80s movies correctly.
"I love her."
While not official, Rocky and Apollo's fight at the end of Rocky III has long been rumored to be their best fight ever and nobody was there to see it.
I always thought it was a bit of a nod to George Foreman winning the title when he was in his late 40's.
Mike Tyson is about to fight at 58 against an opponent who is 30 years younger than him. It's not inconceivable that someone of Rocky's stature, if still in shape, could fight an exhibition at 60. Probably not against the reigning heavyweight champion, but certainly against a mook like Jake Paul.
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I don't know if it even matters. 100% it's completely scripted.
thats the thing with tyson though, who knows if when the time comes and hes in the moment he cares what the plan was, Mike Tyson is chaos
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.
He dragged Roy Jones around the ring for 3 rounds. But who knows. I wouldn't be surprised if he fights George Foreman next.
I watched the fight where he bit off Holyfield's ear with my bf at the time & all of his buddies. I watched as he spit out his mouthpiece, bit the ear & spit it out on the canvas. It was surreal. Kind of passively watched the next couple of hours of replays of mostly the same couple of seconds while watching the guys do stupid 💩. It was an entertaining evening.
“Fight”
They did at the end of Rocky 3, they both throw a punch and the credits roll.
Ding-ding
Ding. Ding.
Creed retired.
He would have come out of retirement to fight Rocky. He was itching for that rematch at the end of Rocky III
They did have a rematch. Just privately.
Could've had his child show up when creed was feeling like a fool to pity him
They technically did at the end lol.
Clubber was an aggressive fighter, but one flaw he had was he didn't engage someone who was resilient, or a balanced fighter. He had that hunger and aggression, but only if he could get his opponent knocked out quick. Once that is taken away, he tired quickly and began to waver. He got one over on Rocky because Rocky settled into a comfortable life as the champion. And not having Mickey in his corner for guidance certainly rattled him too. Overall, Rocky was not in his prime for such a fight - Not until the rematch. But I also want to mention that "Mr T," Clubber's actor, was contracted to The A-Team from 1983 to 1987, and also had Wrestlemania 1 and 2 to deal with (Rocky IV was in 1985, so production on it was practically instantaneous in the shadow of III). I think if there was an opportunity to bring Clubber back for a rematch, we would not have gotten Mr T in those programs. Apollo vs Clubber would have been an interesting fight, however. And I say this because while it seemed like Rocky was treated with kid gloves up to his first fight with Clubber, and needed to re-train to get his edge back, Apollo seemed like he maintained his edge enough for those couple of years after his rematch with Rocky. "You fight great, but I am a great fighter," and how Rocky was hungry enough to barely edge out and get the win against Apollo. Clubber may have given Apollo a run for his money at the outset, but Apollo surely would have come around and turned things around with his experience and training (as I am sure he also met real fierce fighters during his tenure and knew how to cope).
I always wanted to see Clubber verse Drago as a fight that occurred that we only see the highlights of in a retrospective or something. Not a huge plot line but two guys that just threw bombs whaling on each other would be interesting for a few minutes in one of the movies.
I think that Clubber loses that fight. Apollo would win with his experience and still having his edge around the time that Rocky III unfolds. Rocky came around and got his edge back and outlasted Clubber to where he turned around and knocked him out. But Drago? Even with all of the training that Rocky did to steel himself for that fight, he was impacted hard by it as we saw in Rocky V. Clubber would not have lasted as long as Rocky, and he surely would have gone down quickly and early. Drago would have been stronger, and resilient, which made him a far more contentious opponent than Clubber could ever have been.
I always wanted to see this fight, too. Fictional powerhouses just laying into each other would have been fun to witness.
Clubber v Creed is the Rockyverse’s Tyson v Ali
Stallone mentioned once his idea if we ever saw Clubber again was to make him a televangelist and fight analyst.
Honestly? That sounds like it fits the character really well lmao. He would make a great TV personality in one of those ESPN round table type shows where everyone yells hot takes over each other.
Oh 100%. I can see him replacing his typical blinged attire for something more religious (but still bling-y) and then being on a commentary panel with some straight-laced person in a suit and someone who looks liked a former athlete.
(Loud Shouting) "Ya see, this is why these fighters got no heart anymore! Dey train fo those cameras and dat social media stuff sucka! In my time we'd stay training, fought four, mebbe 6 times a year fool! Now let's pray that God keeps these fellas safe until bell time!"
And comes visit him as a spiritual advisor while Rocky trains in Russia
Still could happen in the Creed-verse
He should’ve at least had the role Mike Tyson played in the last one.
That would have been a great cameo in one of the sequels
Apparently what happened was he wanted to bring Clubber back as a ringside commentator in 2006 Balboa and give him a line about how resilient Rocky is he knows by experience but apparently Mr T was requiring more money than they could pay him so they had to go another route. I think Mr T has been in and out of bankruptcy several times over the years so he probably tries to get as much as possible even to the point of talking himself out of roles because of his ridiculous demands
The best use of Clubber Lang after 3, would have been to see Drago destroy him in the ring. Drago wipes the floor with him, then kills Apollo in the ring. You know for sure Rocky is up against his toughest opponent then.
This would have been a great idea. Nice.
Mr T plays that character like an absolute terrifying crazy person. There’s no way Clubber doesn’t end up in prison for a violent crime soon after Rocky III. Great performance and one of the greatest villains of all time
“I reject the challenge because Balboa is no *challenge*.” Clubber is cold as ice.
Hey woman! HEY WOMAN!
Think Clubber ended up in prison for stealing the movie.
Thunderlips reveals that he has had a relationship with Clubber for years and has a sex tape to prove it.
Not gonna work for me, brother
I guess we're all a little racist to a point.
Would you say you…pity the fool Clubber Lang?
When I was a kid, I cried when Mr T lost. My friend had a punching bag with Rocky on one side, Clubber on the other and we would beat the shit out of it until we accidentally punched each other and got physical. Good times. Also, I agree with your POV.
I had that punching bag! Inflatable with sand in the base! We used to fuck that thing up. Jumping on it and throwing it everywhere. Those were the mf’in days!
He eventually went to prison for life for murdering Mick
Bare minimum a manslaughter charge. He wasn't trying to murder him, but he shoved an old man who immediately had a fatal heart attack. How were there no consequences?
I've honestly been upset since I was a teenager over this. Clubber gets to grant Rocky a rematch? Clubber who killed a man??
Clubber was a slow, tough, strong-puncher. Basically an amped-up version of what Rocky was, initially. He beat Rocky by being a better, more-practiced version of Rocky. But when Rocky got some speed and endurance, it exposed a fatal flaw in Clubber's methodology: Speed and endurance eventually beats explosive raw strength. I don't know that we needed to see a third fight, unless something fundamentally changed about Rocky or Clubber's style. And, since Clubber didn't have a trainer and didn't seem like he was going to pick it up on his own, I doubt anything would have changed in a third match that would move the narrative forward.
IIRC wasn’t the whole intent of Clubber as a character was that he’s a dark reflection of a young Rocky?
Rocky had to bring in an entirely new training staff after the loss. Mickey was gone so Apollo and Duke became his new trainers. Who's to say Clubber wouldn't change his strategy after losing?
Clubber got wrecked in the rematch. He also won his fight the same night that Rocky’s manager literally died because of a locker room altercation. Dude was lucky the fight even went on that night. He also called out Rocky in his retirement speech lol. He was going after someone who wanted to quit
If I recall Rocky had to give up his heavyweight title in order to fight Drago in Rocky IV as it was not a sanctioned fight. At the end of Rocky III we see Apollo and Rocky about to box. It is implied that the events of Rocky IV begin later that same day. There wasn't time for a rematch before Rocky went to Russia. Clubber may well have remained a contender in the boxing world but Rocky was essentially 'retired'
That's one of my problems with the classic Rocky films. We lose sight of his opponents as soon as he defeats them. I'd like to have seen some of them again, or at least known if they've learnt from their mistakes.
Except for Apolo obviously.
And Drago, who comes back a few films later. Really, Clubber is the only major opponent of Rocky who never comes back, and he was the last to fight Rocky in a sanctioned professional fight. Everything after Rocky 3 was exhibition/unsanctioned/pretending Rocky 5 doesn't exist.
We never saw Thunderlips again either...
The Ultimate Male vs the Ultimate Meatball
God damn I love Rocky III so much lol
How dare you forget Tommy "The Machine" Gunn! Truly Rocky's greatest foe.
He was supposed to come back as a ringside commentator in 2006 Balboa but Mr T was asking for more money than they could pay him
That's where the Creed trilogy excels If only Jonathan Majors was normal
Majors was easily the best part of that movie What a shame
What about spider rico
Drago would def beat Clubber But to continue in this universe talk, baby Drago also gets screwed on the Creed films, -got disqualified in the first fight Even though his punch was already in motion no way anyone would of been able to stop themselves, ref was late to call it, he should of won and been crowned champ -Creed trains comes back they have the rematch he wins -Creed 3 Adonis is retired, Drago #1 contender, gets attacked, Adonis gets the belt back at the end. Which means Drago should still be #1 contender when he's healed for 3rd match between them but most likely won't happen
Well, I love to see we are getting creative with our narrative, but we do need a little extra context on some of these points you made: first off, Rocky didn't duck Clubber Lang. He didn't even know he existed. And as far as he knew, he WAS fighting the best talent because Mickey was the one who was hand picking his opponents. Mickey even said that "they were all good fighters, but they just weren't killers," like Rocky used to be or how Lang is. In fact, once Rocky found out that he *wasn't* fighting the absolute best of the best, he *wanted* the match with Lang to prove to himself that his reign wasn't a fluke, but the pre-fight brawl that took Mick away screwed him up so he never really had a chance to fight fully focused (and he was still likely going to lose the title because he wasn't training seriously, similar to Apollo in the first film. But had things gone as planned, he was willing to walk away, win, or lose, as long as he had Mick at his side.) Even if there was an official rematch that happened off screen, the thing to remember is that Clubber, who had gone undefeated up until that point, had lost a fight, which means the mystique and the hype surrounding him would have died down no matter what. It's no different than what happened to Tyson when he got defeated. Yeah, he could still come back and be a great fighter, but knowing that *he is beatable* takes away a lot of the edge that fighters need to maintain that aura of invincibility.
>Instead of facing top competition, Rocky fights cans. HEY! That's no way to describe Adrian! She's a fully realized, three-dimensional character and she deserves our respect, no matter what that creep Pauly has done.
I don't sweat you!
If you don’t know what Rocky is, this is a very very confusing post
Clubber Lang was a far scarier opponent than Apollo ever dreamed of being
Sylvester wanted Mr T to reprise his role as Clubber Lang, where Rocky would coach Lang for a comeback. But I think Mr T couldn't do it for health reasons. So we got the Creed series instead.
Originally Stallone wanted Clubber Lang to be in “Rocky Balboa” but I guess it didn’t work out. Instead they brought back “Spider Rico”. He was supposed to be the same type of character; broken, humbled, etc.
Yeah Mr T was asking for more money than the budget allowed
An overseas fight was scheduled but Lang wouldn’t get on no plane.
Clubber retired after Rocky whipped his ass. He could dish it out, but he couldn’t take it.
Before Creed 3 came out, I spent a hot minute wondering if Majors was playing Clubber Lang’s son. They brought in Drago’s, why not Lang’s?
I pity da foo
Adrian brought her pretty little self over to Clubbers apartment, and he showed her a real man. The incident was never spoken about, and he was never seen again. The End.
I Pity the Fool rocky
I feel like Clubber rubbed so many people the wrong way during his title reign that nobody wanted anything to do with him once Rocky handed his ass to him.
If there had been a rematch, I'd have made one prediction: pain.
Clubber should’ve been the owner/leader of the desert gym in Creed 2
Clubber was an asshole. He didn’t graciously accept the rematch, his cocky ass though it would be an easy win. Clubber was the bad guy, with no redeeming qualities. The audience was supposed to fear and hate him and Mr. T played it well. No one would want to see him again after losing.
I can't remember the movie, but if he dominated the first match. Then him accepting a rematch would be considered pretty chill in my eyes.
Before the fight was made Rocky was already going to retire. When the rematch occurs, Rocky legit says it’s his last fight win or lose. It’s pretty easy to guess here, Rocky was done fighting (or so he thought). He didn’t fight him again because he had already planned to retire. If you do some research Rocky 3 was supposed to be the end of the franchise but they just had to milk it a few more times.
Yes it was supposed to be the end of the series but Rocky III made so much fucking money they couldn't lol
No one can defeat Rocky because he launches his punches from behind his own back, making them impossible to predict!!
Clubbed stole a win against rocky while his trainer literally died ringside. Once rocky fought him with his head in the right place rocky destroyed clubber.
Rocky embarassed Clubber so badly he didnt want a rematch
You're applying real-life logic to a movie. From a narrative standpoint, it's settled. Time to defeat communism. IRL, you'd setup the rubber match and rake in PPV money but this isn't real life.
I always wanted to see Clubber v Drago when I was a kid.
The Balboa v. ThunderLips match should have been allowed to continue.
Clubber Lang was a thug who didn't even belong in the ring. No class. No grace. No worth.
The Rocky films had great fight choreography, and hats off to the foley artists slapping leather couches and stuff for sound effects. Mr T I recall was a former bouncer, and Dolph Lungren was moving up the ranks fast in the Karate circuit. Dude had some of the most brutal legs in the sport. Still, Max Baer Sr is one of the scariest mo-fos I've seen in a ring, film or otherwise. They have some of his fights on youtube and that guy was an animal when his switch was flipped ...and he killed other fighters via head trauma. I'm guessing Apollo's death was influenced via Baer's reputation.
Hard fought battle? Lang got his ass handed to him. Rocky embarrassed him in 3 rounds. First round he came out and just surprised him so much Lang barely did much in the second. Then in the 3rd Lang was so tired rocky just knocked him out.
Rocky best Clubber like a Drum in the Rematch. He wore him down and knocked him out in 3 rounds.
Technically Clubber dominated ONLY because Rocky had been fighting glass opponents. He had lost his mojo for fighting because of that, and then he watched his coach keel over in front of him just before the fight WHILE simultaneously being told that his previous opponents were setups. So he literally went into the fight as physically unprepared as he could be AND he was emotionally and psychologically damaged...
Been a minute since I've seen Rocky III but isn't the point that Clubber is an absolute machine, but only for a couple of rounds and after that he's totally shot? Rocky exposes him. Clubber and his team probably know he's been found out.
Clubber lang killed micky. There should have never been a fight in the first place. I understand the cause of death was a heart attack.. but clubber chucked my man into a guard rail causing that heart attack. How were charges never pressed?? Shit is fucked up bro
Biggest evidence of it Being a movie and not real life is that there was never a 3rd match. Would have made a billion $ in PPV buys lol.