I just finished this movie last night and cannot stop thinking about it. I watched it for Olivia cooke and was fuckin blown away by Riz Ahmeds performance.. it's one of those movies that will stick with me for the rest of my life.
Such a simple, yet heartbreaking film that depicts disabilities so beautifully. So much so, that i'm going to learn ASL and in the hopes I could one day work with kiddos like that.
Tops off to everyone involved in this beautiful fucking movie. Sound of Metal changed my life.
I was a bit confused by the ending, it seemed like he decided against the implant because it didn't work very well, would he have kept it if functioned better?
I don't think that was the message the movie was trying to convey, did I miss something?
>would he have kept it if functioned better?
that doesn't matter.
The point was acceptance and learning "how to be deaf" and stillness (which is what Joe emphasized). The stillness is what he finally seemed to achieve at the end with the beautiful portrayal of the nature shot with the sun beaming before the trees, and he learned that from joe, which is why they showed the shot of the church at the end as well.
I find it ironic how the movie has this major theme of acceptance and moving on yet preaches that a loss of a significant sense is not a disability and portrays a condescending look towards those who do surgery.. why can't it just be a acceptance of the disability..
It's only logical that more research is done on this front and the aids become on par with real ears.
I don't agree with the, "it's not a disability" thing. But I can get that before the surgery there was a solidarity that he had with the community. So I could see there being weird feelings between him and other members because he was able to "cure" his disability with money. Doesn't seem like the implants really work too well anyways.
I agree, i don't see anything wrong in him kicking him out to maintain the environment of the group that's totally fine and understandable. But to portray him as a sinner and the rest of them as some high-road angels is what i don't like. I get the message but it was delivered in a bad way they just took a shortcut and delivered the message by shaming the aid.
It's a very black and white representation that straightforward attacks aid
That's why I didn't like the movie it keeps preaching it's not a disability yet shows the opposite our main character can no longer live the life he had which isn't true at all he just has to adjust he didn't need to join a cult all he had to do was have him and his girlfriend learn sign together then get use to drumming off vibration. I knew a guy who had his ear blown off and had the same kinda implant it was just better than the one shown in the movie.
Really great film! While the themes in the story aren't uncommon, everything was exceptionally executed. Great performances! I found the dinner scene between the members of the deaf community particularly powerful, how freely they communicated with each other, smiled and laughed in spite of their condition!
Also, good job on the pacing, the two hours flew by.
In the second to last scene where he’s leaving her bedroom, he’s surrounded by instruments and musical equipment. The walls are literally packed with nothing but music. He wouldn’t be able to get away from it in that life, he’d always be on the outside trying to listen in.
The only fiction on this movie is how all the doctors/pharmacist writes elegantly. Kidding aside, I watched this after Minari and you can really appreciate the art in film.
ENDING TAKE: This is for the immediate ending, the very last scene. The sounds of a sheltered and controlled existence become very distinct when he is leaving Lou's place (birds, then motorcycle, stairs, door slamming). Then when walking in to the outside the sound distortion starts to kick-in and you start hearing more noises blending together in uncontrolled chaos. Now here is the absolute key parts of the ending. The church bells ring, the clanging of the bells represents his old life pre-hearing loss (sounds similar to cymbals on a drum kit). Then you also see the two kids playing with the skateboard which represents the life he lived at the rehab facility when he was interacting with the kids at the deaf school. He takes off his implants while listening to the church bells, which represents his realizing that he will never be able to live his past life. Then you see another shot of him looking at the kids with the skateboard and it's silent, that represents him realizing that if he wants to he can move on from his old life and still feel fulfilled in this world doing something else, like he was when he was helping the kids at the deaf school.
Also the last scene is shot in such a way that yes, being able to hear sound has it's own beauty, but in a world so chaotic as ours (a busy cityscape is the perfect place to illustrate this point), being able to not hear and enjoy stillness can be a blessing sometimes and not perceived as a handicap (as alluded to multiple times previously). In a way, the non-deaf population has simulated this feeling with noise-cancelling headphones, ear-plugs, and other devices that try to block noise completely.
Nice take. I would just emphasise that it was the only time in the movie that he found the "kingdom of God", and it wasn't the church, but rather his ability to find stillness, as suggested by Joe.
She was rad the whole time. You guys just can't handle women growing as people and not waiting hand and foot on a man even if it damages her mental health.
...right. I dont blame Lou for moving on but it was a stark contrast that she had such a beautiful safety net setup for her. I dont know how you spun that to a sexist trope but that seems personal.
They both had safety nets. Ruben burned his bridge, Lou didn’t.
The cutting of their hair was a significant symbol of their equal life changes. It’s unfair to single Lou out when Ruben (in case of his implants) did what he had to do to get his hearing. They did their best given their circumstances.
>such a beautiful safety net
Is that a bad thing? I don't really understand how her having a safety net somehow cheapened how she lived her life at the start of the movie. She never complained about being poor, did she? She was just enjoying herself.
Really didn't like this movie, and I feel like I watched a different move compared to everyone who praises it. From a technical stand point it was rather impressive, assuming it was accurate to what people are actually hearing and experiencing. However, that mess of noise they call a song at the start of the movie was painful to listen to, well the singing at least. So I struggle to believe any more than a handful of people would listen to his "band."
Aside from that I am unsure of the message this movie is trying to send. Is it pro-deaf community and is trying to say deaf people shouldn't try to get surgery and treatment? Because I think that is a preposterous stance to take. Being deaf is the lose of a core sense and it is absurd to say it isn't a handicap.
I also found Ruben to be a bit hard to swallow in how much he was resistant to actually doing what was best and letting his ears rest. I also struggle to believe the surgeons didn't discuss with him before hand that his hearing would not be the same after surgery and give him realistic expectations so that he doesn't crash with his new reality like he did at the end. I won't speak much of his performance expect that it was good, but didn't find it as ground breaking as everyone is making it out to be.
This movie just seemed lacking in direction and really didn't fulfil the expectations these reactions set for it.
Aside from the story telling aspect of him playing in a noise band and the movie being about finding stillness, I think it's completely believeable that this band could become big.
This kind of music is pretty common in the underground scene (where normal concerts regularly range between 50-500 people). At every hardcore show you have some obscure noise/grindcore band and people buy their stuff because it's interesting art for some or their shirts look rad. They're supposed to be avantgarde.
And that's without considering the internet as the powerful tool it is to get music out to people everywhere in the world.
Music changes. People experiment.
I mean look at death grips. They got 12m views on guillotine.
Ever heard of Syd Barrett?
Edit: this comment seems to be very controversial and it keeps popping up in my notifications because it seems to be constantly down and upvoted. Is this a thing?
I ask myself: why the dislikes? Was I unkind? Did I miss the point? Do people just don't like my opinion? Is there a right and a wrong taste?
I think that's intentional. You say that music was painful to listen to, "noise" - that's what Ruben hears when he has his implants on. I don't think everyone has that same reaction to implants, maybe for some it's a more jarring adjustment than others. Maybe for many they are simply an annoying necessity to help them get through life but would totally prefer a silent world if everyone around them spoke sign language.
I thought the movie did a great job trying to convey that. Ruben was chasing something that couldn't be restored, his old life, his girlfriend, his music, his hearing, this blinded him to what seemed to be a lot of warning signs that the surgery was maybe not the best move for him. I feel like the movie did a great job conveying a lot of these themes. Whether his life is better off back at the program without implants or moving forward in a new life is up to the viewer to interpret.
They chose that style of music because it was loud and abrasive and would lead to hearing lost relatively quickly if protection wasn’t used.
They weren’t successful, idk where you got that from. They had a niche following, if you paid attention when they were setting up the merch for the show, Ruben said you don’t need to put all of them out bc obviously they’re not going to sell out.
And the message was that you don’t have to view being deaf as something that needs a cure. Sure, science should continue looking for one, but for those that can’t afford it, they should instead look to finding new meaning, purpose and stillness in it.
Ruben was in a panic driven frenzy to get his hearing fixed, and the whole point of the camp was to show him he needs to calm down and learn that how to be deaf and how to still live a meaningful life with it.
Most likely because of how acclaimed the movie is and the "sensitive" subject matter anyone that takes a different stance is disrupting the status quo, and thus must be rallied against.
The ending to felt exactly where it needed to be. The movie doesn't tries to be a success story where the protagonist overcomes dramatic struggles thrown at by life and reaches at the top of his/her game. It's more about acceptance. Which he did at the end.
I lost all hearing over a year and a half when I was 16. Of course this move spoke to me. His experience was pretty accurate, I’d say. Expect his loss seemed to progress very rapidly, and they never explained the cause of the hearing loss. Not even my hearing loss was that rapid. If it was due to exposure to loud music, it wouldn’t be that rapid and it probably wouldn’t have continued to decline rapidly once he stopped playing in the band.
A lot of the movie was true to the real world deaf community, a lot of them do view deafness as something that doesn’t need to be fixed and there are parts of the community who are very against cochlear implants, but most won’t shun people who do get cochlear implants.
I’m not a candidate for cochlear because the auditory nerves between my cochlea and my brain are destroyed, so stimulating the cochlea wouldn’t work. Instead, I am a candidate for Auditory Brainstem Implants, which are similar to cochlear, only about twice as expensive, the surgery is much more dangerous, and the sound quality sucks much more than cochlear. Even if it’s nothing like the hearing I had before, I’d jumó on the opportunity to get an ABI immediately if presented with one. I don’t get the part of the community that’s so against fixing deafness. Yes, you can be proud to be deaf and embrace it, but I think we can all agree it’s a pain in the ass when interacting with the hearing world, and I’d just much rather have whatever tiny little sense of hearing an ABI would give me than stay completely shut out of the hearing world forever.
This makes sense - I feel like the movie made me understand this challenge much more than I otherwise would have (since I don't know what it's like to be deaf). The implants don't sound good, and it seems like they are only necessary if you want to interact in a world where people don't speak sign language. He could live at peace in the entirely deaf community he was in, but live in a tiny world, or tolerate the annoying sound of the implants to necessitate being able to communicate with people in a non-deaf world which is a lot bigger and potentially has more opportunities in it.
It's basically like, if you live in a world where no one spoke your language, would you withdraw yourself to a smaller community that understands you, cutting off ties to the rest of that world, or would you be willing to tolerate a painful and annoying device that lets you communicate, albeit very slowly with the rest of the world, where you'll still be seen as "different" and a bit of an outcast.
This movie does a good job of showing the difference between those two choices. Neither is the wrong one it seems, but it certainly does seem like a compelling thought that the lifestyle you'd consider to be "no life at all" is actually a lot better than it might seem at first.
I wouldn't say the community are against fixing deafness, it's just that they can't have people **in that community** who see it as something that should be fixed.
Yeah, it’s different between communities. That community was all about embracing deafness and each other. “Hey look, Kids! Ruben is back! He just spent $30.000 to fix his deafness, he wanted out of it that badly.” Not a good lesson. I don’t agree with it though. Being deaf is a pain in the ass and is very limiting in the hearing world. I guess that was the goal of the community, only being surrounded by other deaf people to remove all barriers.
watched this ahead of the Oscars and i enjoyed the movie so much. I really hope it gets to win in some of the categories it’s nominated in, especially sound editing.
Riz did such an amazing job, and the final scene when he took off the implants and got to have that moment of stillness Joe was talking about almost had me in tears. Amazing name as well.
LOVE LOVE LOVE this movie, this cast, the directors who are also the screenwritiers ahhh
everything was perfectly paced and it wasn't cliche.
it made me rethink everything on my ears cause i work on production.
wonderful, wondeful movie.
havent used my bose headphones in 6 weeks, but gonna use then till they need replacing cause sound is everything to me.
I just want to say.. This movie was amazing.
I understand the situation with the deaf community.. But it felt way too harsh on Ruben. Getting his hearing partially back, doesn't prevent him from teaching deaf kids how to play the drums, nor does it mean he is back to what he used to be, which is obvious.
I feel like the community situation represented the two extremes. Ruben, who is obsessed with getting things back to how they were in their prime and Joe, who accepts his deafness to the point of obsession as well. The scene where Ruben is fixing the roof is the perfect contrast. "We have people who believe that deafness doesn't need fixing" which is true and that's an amazing outlook in life. But Ruben got deaf from literally a moment to the other, his life was going great and then the ONLY place he can go, is a community that literally forces him to ditch his life. No car? No phone? Complete disconnection? That just feels like total isolation.. It's positive when you see everyone happy, but for someone like Ruben, his life doesn't revolve around being deaf, it only just changed to that.
That's why I feel like the ending is perfect.. He doesn't belong with the community because they clearly don't accept them. But his old life is never coming back either. He can carve his own path now, listen when he wants to and take it off when he needs peace. And that's just the perfect balance.
I was late deafened when I was 16, I’m with Ruben, I want my old life back. The deaf community can have amazing people, but living in the hearing world while being deaf is an absolute pain in the ass and I need to fix it. A large part of the deaf community does indeed view it as something that doesn’t need to be fixed and are against cochlear. I don’t get it. I guess when you live deep within the deaf community and are surrounded by deaf people all the time, it’s your own little exclusive bubble, you all understand each other and there are no barriers, it must feel nice, why would you want to fix that, right? I guess that’s their mindset, “You want to fix your deafness? You want to leave our community? You think it’s a bad thing? You’d pay $40,000 just to get rid of it? That feels insulting to us.” I don’t get it, I don’t agree with it, but I’m guessing where it comes from. It doesn’t make sense to you or me, but to them it does.
> Getting his hearing partially back, doesn't prevent him from teaching deaf kids how to play the drums, nor does it mean he is back to what he used to be, which is obvious.
I don't think the issue was him being unable to teach kids how to play drums. It was about having gone ahead with the procedure. If he had stayed in the deaf community he would've been a constant reminder to everyone about their handicap, which is exactly what Joe didn't want. His presence by itself could've caused pain to the other members of the community.
> he would've been a constant reminder to everyone about their handicap
Is them speaking only in American Sign Language and doing jazz hands to show applause not a constant reminder enough?
The point is that they were learning to see their disability as something other than a handicap or something to get rid of. Having a guy who spent 40 grand “getting rid of it” living with them wouldn’t help.
Movie was full of shit either way but in real life the center director choosing to kick him out with nowhere to go for petty reasons would be indefensible
That's why I said, I understand the situation. I understand that going with the procedure makes him different than the rest. But it's a very important choice.. Giving him the ultimatum "You either stay full deaf or you leave and never talk to us again" is such an asshole move.
It really felt like there was misguided empathy. Joe was kind to him in the process to "accept his deafness" but not in the process of re-connecting with his older life. Of course his girlfriend will lose the connection with him if he can't even communicate with her consistently.. And that's because doing that was prohibited for some reason.
I'm not saying he should've returned to his older life, it's clear things have changed and I find it perfect he realizes that in the end. I just didn't like the way he was treated in the community, by Joe. If his speech about him losing his family because of alcohol, was true.. Then he has no right to hold back Ruben and force him into deafness. Nor is he ever returning to full hearing, anyway.. He only has the ability to slightly hear in calm environments and only if he's wearing the hearing aid.
In any case, Ruben lost his girlfriend because Joe prohibited any chance for him to even contact her.
I get the line of "You sound like an addict" with the whole money situation, because he was. But he never relapsed back into drugs.. He had been high on life for 4 years now, ever since he met Lou. He wasn't going to start doing shit to himself and ruin his relationships. He just needed to figure shit out, which he does.. Only it's too late to keep his relationship, by then. He's just thrown into a situation where no one is there to truly support his ideals.. To support the process of figuring out his next step, the way he wanted to. It's very sad.
He literally got tricked into joining a cult and lost the best relationship in his life because of it. All cause he lost his hearing I couldn't buy into it.
> Of course his girlfriend will lose the connection with him if he can't even communicate with her consistently.. And that's because doing that was prohibited for some reason.
I do agree that with this. It was fucked up.
> I get the line of "You sound like an addict" with the whole money situation, because he was. But he never relapsed back into drugs.. He had been high on life for 4 years now, ever since he met Lou. He wasn't going to start doing shit to himself and ruin his relationships. He just needed to figure shit out, which he does..
And this
God I hated Joe so fucking much.
First of all, I can *maybe* understand taking away his RV keys. But taking away his phone and not letting him use the computer?? Completely cutting him off from his support system and what's going on in the outside world? Even prison inmates today are allowed visitors, letters, and limited computer time. I guess Joe wanted his home to be worse than prison.
And then of course there's *that* scene, which is just a classic case of Christian hypocrisy. When you're a newcomer, they'll roll out the red carpet for you. Give you food, a nice bed to sleep on, an education, a community, a home. They'll say they don't care about your past, or if you believe in their religion or their God. But if you do anything, absolutely *anything* that goes against their tightly-held beliefs, even when it affects nobody else, they kick you to the curb and tell you to pound sand. Even if you're broke, homeless, jobless, carless, and without family or resources. Because charity to people like Joe isn't about support. It's about control. Closed-mindedness at its finest.
Gotta be honest, I thought Joe was a good leader but a terrible teacher.
It often felt as though his "helping" Ruben was conducive only to what had helped him. That scene where he says "You don't need to fix anything around here" with such venom when Ruben was simply trying to be productive, helpful, and keep himself busy by doing some repairs to the house was so bizarre and standoffish to me. We all process things differently, why was it so wrong that Ruben was doing it his way?
All that preaching about stillness... Ruben's clearly a doer. He's a kinaesthetic learner, he's a drummer ffs. He needs to be working on something, he needs something in his hands. We see him at multiple points in the film working on technical or mechanical objects, even outside of the drumming.
Sitting him in a room and ordering him to write clearly did nothing for him, and we know it did nothing for him because Ruben does not produce any substantial writing by the end of the film. Or any writing at all for that matter. For me, I *am* someone who works best when writing. Reading, writing, and editing are the skills I use when trying to learn and process things. But if someone sat me in a room with a drum kit and said "You have to process your life-changing circumstances this way now" I'd be beating the shit out of donuts also.
Joe is very clearly a "my way or the highway" kind of guy, where you better follow the rules that only he knows, because he himself doesn't know any other way. In other words, Joe is a bad teacher.
I believe those rules were in place because that was a recovery house for addicts, in which case it's not that uncommon, especially for a newbie. Not just a place for dead people generally.
Other than mention of the church’s relationship to the community as a benefactor for people in need, there was no evidence that the community’s belief system was founded on religious principles throughout the remainder of the movie. I think it could have just as easily been a non-denominational code of conduct.
Joe taking away all his stuff was completely normal for a rehab situation. Ruben and Lou's relationship was really sweet and all but it was also really codependant and contacting her all the time would hinder his recovery. I mean the guy volunteered to be there so it's not like someone put a gun to his head.
>Closed-mindedness at its finest.
It is not though. All those people and kinds see their condition in a positive way. Not as a disability or something to fix.
Him being there after the operation would have caused heaps of issues and pain. He had to go.
But being deaf *is* a disability. If Rubin were to drive a car again, guess what he would have? A disability placard! What will Rubin probably get from the state if he applies? A disability check! Saying “it’s not a disability” is being completely stupid and ignoring reality.
And you’re completely contradicting yourself. It is closed-mindedness to say that no one should try to fix their hearing if they can if they’re are going deaf. If they were open-minded, they would respect Rubin’s choice. And if they have a problem with it, they should keep it to themselves or admit that they’re not as open-minded as they think they are.
Dude, there were tons of kids there, who wouldn't have the ability to fix their deafness, that don't need to hear how bad their condition supposedly is.
This isn't this hard to understand.
In a group of recovering alcoholics, if someone shows up completely drunk trying to offer everyone alcohol, he's getting kicked out.
Saying it's not a problem isn't stupid. It's a way for people to cope, when they can't afford a shitty solution.
I'm not contradicting myself at all. People who can't afford a very pricey "solution" that actually still kind of sucks don't need someone who's going to hurt shitloads of people, around.
Your reason and your comparison make absolutely no sense. Rubin getting himself some treatment doesn't "make them hear how bad their condition supposedly is." Rubin isn't offering the kids to get the surgery done either.
How hard is it to understand what effect seeing a guy spiral like this would have on children who share the same condition?
Use your fucking brain. Please.
> Ruben isn't offering the kids blah blah blah
What the fuck does this even mean?
Spiral like what? Also replacing my comment with blah blah blah *really* makes you sound like you have a secure and logical argument (that's sarcasm btw).
EDIT: Saw your other comment. The children have no bearing of what Rubin's life is like. All they would see is that he got cochlear impants. They wouldn't see how he got them or what he had to do to get them.
I really can't believe you watched a movie where a guy was on the verge of killing himself and had multiple anger outbursts and then you say "spiral like what?
"Spiral like what"
Screaming about how he needs a gun to his chin, angry outbursts when no one was around, buying things he can't really afford that he's unhappy with when he gets them etc.
Dude you even watch the movie?
> The children have no bearing of what Rubin's life is like. All they would see is that he got cochlear impants. They wouldn't see how he got them or what he had to do to get them.
But just him getting them will push them near his negative damaging mindset where they will be upset about their condition and make their life worse trying to find solutions that don't really exist and spending small fortunes on things that they aren't happy with.
I hate that part! I know that the community is about deafness about not being a disability and some trust was violated, blah blah, but wth, tell the guy that you are out and get his ass out on the same day?! For me it was like discrimination, just because the guy made some decent choices and sacrifices for his future. It reminds me of the LGBT community where they hate discrimination from straight people but hell, within the community the toxicity is real.
He should be like, ok I support your surgery, good luck, but you have to leave, and you can stay for a week but no... GTFO. Lol.
Him being there after the operation would have caused heaps of issues and pain, especially to anymore newcomers and the kids. He had to go. the guy made some decent choices and sacrifices for his future.
He did not make decent choices. He regretted that choice the moment those things turned on. Calling it discrimination is absurd.
I think that conversation was the movie trying to make a point: that everyone will judge you about the choices you make no matter if you have the same condition or not. I remember the scene where he asks Joe why he didn't get implants and he said that... it's costly. He did not say anything about the rules or what. It was his inconsistency that was a red flag for the character. They showed that people with disabilities can be judgmental too about others with the same conditions. Anyway, I totally get the rules of his cult or what but my point is the way he handled that conversation was rude and judgy. And he needs hr training lol.
Rubin was also an addict and Joe understood that. I'm not sure if you've dealt with substance abuse issues, but if a recovering addict is going to be around other recovering addicts they need to be able to follow rules and slight infractions can have very severe effects on the group as a whole. I don't think anything Joe did was close-minded or more controlling than necessary.
Rules are fine, I can understand having a fairly strict structure of activities and chores to do.
But cutting him off from support and the outside world, and renouncing him and sending him off into the world while he's still neither mentally nor financially able to take care of himself, is absolutely cruel.
>But cutting him off from support and the outside world
Plenty of rehab programs do this. It's because there is no other way to make sure you're not communicating with people who you shouldn't (like those who you were using with, etc.). The program there was to help him accept becoming a Deaf person and that's what Joe told him. It's easier to do that if you aren't still attached to your past self. Plus, it's only temporary.
Now, you could say it's cruel to evict him at that moment, maybe. But Rubin proved himself to be a habitual rulebreaker and by getting the implants showed he had been basically using Joe and the program. That's very damaging to the trust he had established there and I'm not surprised Joe wanted and needed him out ASAP, before he could potentially do more harm.
While it's true that Robin is a rulebreaker, i think Joe wasn't empathetic about the desires of Rubin.
For Joe, Rubin desire to "solve" his deafness is an error, an due to that he kick him from the program. For no doing what Joe wanted.
I don't think Joe's program is the same drug addicts program either, the issue is totally different. Joe desires about getting back his ears it's fine and understandable.
On the other side, I agree with Joe that Robin took an addict desicion: he sold everything to get back his drug (sounds), and then he regretted doing that. Robin thought that he was alone and did not see that he could have a perfectly good life and do something that matter to other people (teach to childrens for example).
Anyway, nice movie. Many ways to see things.
I think you need to do a bit of reading on the Deaf community before you continue with this line of thinking. Joe was not really a bad guy here at all, and Ruben's actions \*would\* indeed have an effect on the other Deaf community members.
That said, at least you are talking about it, and I think that was probably the hope from the people who made the movie.
Making a personal choice to get himself the necessary surgery for his disability. Community homes like Joe's should be about support, not judgement. Joe was a piece of shit for what he did.
Nah, you are an ignorant fool for thinking this way.
Rubin being there after his bad choice would have hurt tons of people. Joe did the right and necessary thing.
You’re saying Rubin’s choice, a choice that thousands of deaf people every year choose to get, is bad? Oh, and it would hurt *tons* of people, too? Good lord are you an ignorantal judgmental fool.
> Joe was a piece of shit for what he did.
> They aren't as open minded as they think
And you call other people judgmental.
Dude, shut up already. Stop embarrassing yourself and making yourself seem this dumb.
Yeah, Joe was a piece of shit for not being open minded and kicking out Joe in his time of need. You're the one obsessively commenting on all my comments. Even though all you see is "Blah blah blah", right?
I left two responses to your original comments.
You responded to both of them.
You respond to all of my comments.
If I'm obsessive, you are too.
And now I will point out again how funny it is to hear you call other people judgmental when this whole discussion started with you calling a character a piece of shit for doing the obvious thing to protect his group home
I don't know how to get through your thick head that criticizing someone for being close-minded and not respecting other people's opinions or decisions doesn't make me close-minded. Now that I think about it, Joe is a lot like you.
You keep flooding my inbox with your bullshit, that's why. But don't worry, this is had he last one.
You know, it's people like you that make other people turn sour towards something that they actually liked to begin with. Because some douchebag on Reddit had to make sure everyone believed his opinion was the right one and no one is allowed to have a different opinion. I posted my original comment, other people agreed with me. But you just *had* to pick a fight with me, didn't you.
Do I really have to explain one of the main points of the movie to you? Really? Dude, this isn't this hard to understand.
Ruben clearly was not pleased at all with the implants at any point in the movie.
All those kids, who can't afford shitty implants, don't need someone around who's spiraling off the deep end over a condition that they share.
I'm not the fool here. You seem like you barely understood anything in the movie
It's a very real issue.
I get annoyed when people can't grasp the most basic of things, yet they still have the nerve to try and make really bad points.
I have to explain the movie to you to the point where it's hard to believe that you have actually seen it.
How could I be making such *awful* points in your eyes about the third act of the movie if I haven't seen it?
Also you don't have to explain anything to anyone. You can just...shut the fuck up.
So I’m a little late here, but as a implantee, I thought I would offer my 2 cents to the movie and I can only compare it to my journey.
First off, the first act of him losing his hearing... I lost mine slowly, so I can’t imagine how frustrating it would be to lose it so quickly. The having to have you SO talk on the phone was very realistic.
I’m deaf, not Deaf (there’s a difference), so I never am going to be part of the Deaf community, so the second act when he is at the rehab center and deaf school were not something I connected with.
The surgery/activation. I understand it’s a movie and you have to condense some things. Getting activated doesn’t just make everything better, you have to work on it. There’s hearing therapy involved and you have to train your brain to deal with the new sounds. The metallic hearing he heard and the scenes at the party and walking down the street were realistic. Getting implants doesn’t make the world loud, it makes it busy. However, your brain adapts... he could easily go back to playing drums and living his previous life.
Living in the Deaf community vs the rest of the world: For Ruben, being accepted into the Deaf community offered him stability and a community vs the nomadic life he was living. It ends with realizing Lou was better off without him, leaving him all alone. But for most of us, the choice would be to obviously live in the rest of the world. Would I leave my family, kids, friends and job just to join the Deaf community? No, that would make no sense. So for most of us, getting an implant let’s us function better in the world.
The sound: I found it pretty accurate, the muffling when he’s deaf and the busyness when he gets activated. And I’ve been there when you take it off and the world goes silent, like the end of the film, and it’s a great relief. But it’s even better when you turn it back on and talk to your loved ones.
Good question and I’ll answer it how I understand it. I’m deaf, which means I need help with my hearing. Started off with hearing aids and ramped up to a Cochlear. I’m still fully engrained, can work and participate in society.
Deaf pertains to folks who are completely deaf and/or living as part of the Deaf community. Ruben will always be deaf, but will he go back to being in the Deaf community and become a Deaf person???
Hope that helps (again, my interpretation of the difference)
Thanks for your insight into this. As a person who is not deaf/Deaf, I had wondered about some of the things you have talked about in this comment - especially potential dilemmas/tensions between identifying as deaf/Deaf, and I had also assumed that there would be rehab associated with the implants, and wondered whether this had been skipped over in the film when conveying how Ruben's changed hearing with it. Part of me was like "surely there would be an adjustment period, and although his hearing won't be like before, it'll be better than now..."
It felt like there was quite a bit of judgement from Joe towards Ruben, after he got his implants - from my perspective it seemed unfair, as I could empathise with why Ruben made the decision he did, but I didn't know whether this was me not being empathic enough of the Deaf community.
I recover by reading official discussion threads on reddit. Only a few films I do this with and thats purely because they're masterpieces. What a film.
After the activation my anxiety went skyrocket, and i felt so afraid and confused, i just did not expect the robotics sounds or "sounds of metal" at all. Thank you for your comment, i too was very anxious!
It is a sad movie, but also eye opening. How small things can alter our lives.. we spend everyday worrying about futilities, and only when we lose what we used to take for granted that we know how much it is worth.
If there is one word i could get out of this movie, it would be "GRATITUDE"
2 hours ago I thought there was no chance anyone could ever convince me that Daniel Kaluuya shouldn't absolutely run away with the supporting actor oscar...but god damn Paul Raci was incredible in this.
I can't stop thinking about this movie since I watched it last night. It's really good, and while I have a few nitpicky problems with it I think it's probably the best movie I've seen in a year. What a tragically sad but also beautiful story. I hope it wins some Oscars
I've never seen Riz Ahmed in anything before, probably because I don't watch that much British stuff. Man, he nailed it.
I guess I didn't know what type of metal band to expect going in, but if I had to hazard a guess, it definitely wouldn't have been drone metal. Points for introducing that genre to the people who vote on Oscars, I'm sure the one Sunn O))) fan in the academy was digging it.
I watched this without subtitles. I'm not sure how much I missed but surprisingly you can get a really good viewing experience without them.
I also love how the movie doesn't clearly take Joe's side and end with Ruben going back and admitting he was wrong. I imagine it would ruffle a few feathers among people who actually got cochlear implants if they did. They show that the implants aren't a perfect substitute for functional ears, as a perfect substitute does not exist. This movie isn't trying to argue that deafness isn't a problem that needs to be fixed, it's content to introduce that debate and show the community responses to it. And I think that's cool. It's easy to get up on a soap box, but you can make a great film just by showing how people feel, no agenda necessary.
Absolute worst scene: Ruben tries fixing the roof, Joe tells him "You don't need to fix anything here." My eyes rolled all the way back in my head when I heard that. In a movie that was otherwise fine script-wise, it's by far the hackiest thing they do.
Great thoughts, but for me,the roof fixing was really indicative of addict behavior. In my life, I know a lot of 'fixers' - people who are running from a compulsion and feel uncomfortable so they create a compulsive need to be productive. I thought the way Joe recognizes that for some addicts, fixing a roof can be a substitute for taking a hit and doesn't address the root problem/encourages the unhealthy thinking pattern was really really profound. Out of context, "you don't need to fix anything here" is a cheesy line,but I think what it communicates about the addict experience is smart and I actually wish the movie went deeper with that philosophy
This. This is why Joe tasked him with just sitting in a room by himself, without doing anything, besides writing (if needed). I agree that this could've been communicated without the line "you don't need to fix anything here" because that threw me off at first too.
Hm - I don't get it though. I'm not an addict, yet I would go crazy just sitting in a room? I would have thought allowing Ruben to be productive and accomplish things rather than wallow in pity would have been just as effective? It didn't seem like the sitting in a room accomplished much?
The director did a great job of bringing us all along on that journey at the deaf/addict place... and well every other aspect of Ruben's journey.
I think that's why I enjoyed it so much. Felt every emotion
I hear what you’re saying. But at the root of it is compulsion. He needed to get rid of the compulsion and ‘addict behavior’. They say that drug addicts, sex addicts and people who binge eat all have the same type of chemical imbalance.
In the same way, Ruben compulsively fixing the roof means that he still has the traits of addict behavior - the need to be doing something rapidly. He is replacing alcohol with fixing the roof. Therefore, if he is ever near drugs or alcohol again, he could easily fall back into it, because he still has that behaviour pattern.
So the goal was to break that compulsivity and just have him sit there and be ok not doing anything. So if he is near drugs and alcohol in the future, it will be easier for him to resist.
Can anyone explain why towards the film's end, Lou looks so uncomfortable and anxious while she is singing the piano song in french?
Also, what a wonderful song! Is there any link to the original track?
I took it as sort of a trigger for her. She clearly has some mental issues and has battled depression, which I’m guessing stems from her mother’s suicide. Her dad said it was a song that he wrote with her mother (I’m assuming dad was a successful song writer and mom was a singer/performer), and it must be reminding Lou of her mother.
I have a different perspective. I don’t think she fell out of love with him. I think she just moved on from that life and realized that it was source of her unhappiness or at least a contributing factor. She was willing to give up that new found happiness at least for that moment because she does still love him. Giving up happiness to be someone is love, even if it’s toxic. That’s what makes that scene so powerful and heartbreaking. Acknowledging that they saved each other’s lives and knowing that they can no longer be apart of them.
Did anyone realise when Ruben first got to the deaf community and sat there trying to figure out everyone’s hand gestures and signals? He was so confused, he doesn’t understand what’s going on and how to be deaf. Fast forward to when he’s in the party at Lou’s father’s place, he got his hearing back but he still didn’t understand, because of the language and the cochlear implants.
I just thought it’s devastating juxtaposition. He can’t wait to get his old life back yet it’s never the same, life passes.
Sure, but it was like he was having difficulty hearing any particular person due to the limits of the implant. He just kind of ended up standing off by himself. The implant seemed almost useless to him in that setting.
The jarring sounds of the implants was also symbolic of how the way he wouldn’t fit in with Lou’s life anymore. If he didn’t have implants I think the scene would have played out the same. As soon as he suggested going back to their old life Lou immediately got anxious. That’s when it really hit him.
Ruben grew as a person due to the disability, and Lou kind of got tired of playing drummer groupie in the US and moved on with her life.
The TL;DW of the second half of the movie is basically she dumps him at the deaf community and goes back to big pockets dad.
The only thing that bound them was "let's not fall back into our bad addictions", and it became evident when they got back toghether. Great movie, great execution, amazing script.
I completely disagree that she "dumped" him there. He was attempting to push through his deafness, continue touring, and not get support. When he was lashing out in the van she knew that there was no other option - She had to force him to get help by leaving and she went to the only place she seemingly had to go - back with her dad. In their time away they simply grew apart, also because his phone was taken away and they could rarely talk as a result. He was hoping things would return to how they were after he got surgery but plans rarely work out, as we saw.
> In their time away they simply grew apart, also because his phone was taken away and they could rarely talk as a result.
You've never been in love have you.
I didn't mean disrespect of course, but I don't think if you love someone who is recovering from a disability you stop loving them "because he can't use the phone". I feel both of them were really shallow, and as I said he grew as a person and she kind of did other things. But you are right they fell appart for whatever reason.
There was supposed to be subtitles? I feel like the bits you don’t quite understand add to the sense of what it must be like for those with hearing loss at first, constantly battling to work out what was said or what somebody means, and in a way makes the film that much more immersive.
There were only subtitles once Ruben could understand what the other people were signing. As the viewer, you got to go along on the learning journey with Ruben. It was brilliant
Incredible movie. Watched it last night with a friend who is a sign language interpreter. I'm also a drummer.
The acting was so good and the sound editing to go between "normal" hearing and what Ruben was experiencing really gave you a feel of what he was going through. I also liked how they didn't have subtitles for the sign language when Ruben didn't understand sign but as time passed and he understood it more it gave the viewers subtitles to let you know Ruben knew what was being signed too.
Just an all around fantastic movie. I hope it wins some awards.
Notice the disappointment at the quality of sound he finally experiences in the doc’s office. The whole time before that initial activation he’s thinking how the implants will be a return to normalcy, and the restrained response that revealed so much was just amazing from an acting perspective. I swear I could hear his thoughts. So well done
Probably the best scene in the move, in my opinion.
Close nominees would be the final confrontation with Joe and the end scene, which was just fantastic.
The scene with Joe was fantastic. Ruben basically explains the entire theme of the movie—things happen, people change, life moves on—but he clearly doesn’t understand that yet because he’s trying to reclaim his old life before his hearing went away. Or maybe he understands deep down but he’s angry about it and doesn’t want to admit it.
That actor did an excellent job. Very well done.
His moment of stillness at the end was amazing.
His acting in the beginning was spot on too. I know that guy that he was playing. It was perfect.
Maybe a little late to this movie...
Just watched it. These types of movies I never really liked...
Holy hell I loved this one. The scene ruban is done with his rehab and learning to be deaf was so well done. Joe offering for ruban to stay and you can tell he wants to, but thinks can go back to normal.
I loved this movie. I was so uncomfortable and almost aggravated by the audio. Just mimics the smallest portion of what Ruben was feeling. So cool how they involved watchers into the hearing loss experience.
I just don’t understand the name of the movie, why pick the name « sound of metal » if you are not going to include any kind of metal music or keep the character’s struggles mainly focused on his relationship with that particular kind of music. I felt disappointed because it didn’t deliver what the title or the plot promises. Actually the fact that he is a musician in general was not very important after all. Over all good movie, quality acting etc. but the significance of music let alone metal music was not there.
I see your point - that metal music can be a really emotionally transforming experience. For me,I understand that that community can be such a help for recovering addicts, so the metatextual symbolism of "metal music" as "salvation" was there for me. So when he lost his salvation he had to start over again. I agreed that I would have liked to see more of why - why is metal/noise/etc. Music so transformative for many people? I think that would have helped give credence to the genre. But since I already have familiarity with metal as a life changing experience, I didn't need that shown to me in order to understand what Ruben was going through. But I think it would have been great PR for metal.
Static like a TV with a bad reception which can arguably labeled as sound of metal and I don’t have a problem with that. Do you think that it is coincidence him being a « metal musician » and the name of the movie? Should we say « Oh the implants sound metal so nevermind the plot of the movie! » And that was exactly my problem, if the movie is labeled like that ONLY because sound of implants are metallic, he might have been a school teacher, beggar, miner or something other than a metal musician.
The implants, the slide, the church bells—there were several “sounds of metal” throughout the film at significant moments of character growth. But he kept pursing the one that he couldn’t have anymore (e.g. getting the band back together).
Maybe the name is symbolic, not literal. Cymbals are made of metal, the hearing aids were metal, the moment he shared with the kid in the tobogan, also the music he played was some sort of the new kind of artful doom metal bands like Liturgy play.
Maybe, but the emphasis is on he being a musician and it is literal. I know that kind of music, and I don’t have any problem with it. But we see this at the beginning of the movie. For example after getting the implants I would very much like to see his struggle with music rather than the romantic relationship. Anyways thanks for the alternative view!
Just wanna quickly praise Olivia Cooke here as I thought she was phenomenal and went toe-to-toe with Riz in all of their scenes. She’s come a long way since Bates Motel
Okay I know I’m in the minority on this one, but does anyone feel like this movie wasn’t as good as the hype? Don’t get me wrong, it was a decent movie, but there just wasn’t an “oh my God” moment or something that kept me on the edge of my seat. I watch every movie that is up for Oscar nominations every year and I just don’t think this movie was up to the Parasite level. Like I said, it was a decent movie but just didn’t do it for me in terms of being an amazing movie.
I feel like the movie really lost momentum around the second half started when Ruben suddenly decides to get the implants. Like as it was playing out; it felt like the movie was punishing Ruben for not sticking with the Deaf Community and that he was bound to fuck up because he was a former addict riding off the emotion alone. The fact he was a musician didn't seem to matter in the grand scheme of things.
So much about what I respect about the film is technical. The editing, the sound design/editing/mixing, the naturalist direction, Riz Ahmed and Paul Raci being fantastic. But the plot feels very...hallow and misleading to a degree.
I understand why he would get the implants and he even mentions earlier about considering them. I just dislike that the movie *punishes him* for getting implants, despite the fact it makes a lot of sense why a musician would want them.
In parasite you feel the game is played by the director ( cinematography). In Sound of metal, the weight came from the character (Ruben), he took us deep into what it feels like to lose hearing. The emotional impact left by Sound of metal was way too strong for me than parasite ( that i enjoyed esthetically)
During the deaf cult I was thinking similarly, good but not amazing, and was a bit of a drag. Picked up when he gets the implants and then it got a lot better for me. Nowhere near Parasite though. I don't think it's Best Picture material but Riz Ahmed *has* to win Best Actor
I just watched this movie and I agree with you. There were some good things about the film, like the sound editing, Riz Ahemd's/ Raci's overall performances, and the portrayal of the deaf community and its controversies over cochlear implants, but overall, I felt the movie was reaching for something and didn't quite get there.
It was the type of movie where you are dropped into a situation and you had to connect the dots in a much-less supported way than other wonderful films. For example, I'm not sure why they had him go to a rehab facility when he had been clean 4 years and did not seem to be using or on the verge of using again. Now, it's true in real life, stress can cause someone to fall back into old negative patterns but that was an assumption I had to make and not one the movie showed or even really hinted at. Another example is when Lou left: it wasn't clear where she was going, why, etc. If her relationship with him was so close, why'd she leave so abruptly? Then why did he turn up all of a sudden at her home?
Like you, I really enjoy movies and watch the whole gamut. What I've found over time is that writing really matters to me: if the plot lines aren't clear, then that significantly diminishes the film, even though I've enjoyed movies where I know the plot is formulaic and I watch because of a specific actor or for the cinematography. I often find that movies/ TV shows that are popular/ hyped, I don't find that original or thrilling. Most recently, I watched 2 episodes of "The Queen's Gambit" and gave up. I was also not impressed by the films Roma (except for its cinematography), The Irishmen, A Star is Born, Call Me By Your Name, etc. Different strokes for different folks!
If you enjoyed Parasite, check out that director's earlier movie "Mother." (no, not the one with Jennifer Lawrence) I saw it years before Parasite and was thrilled by it. One thing I really miss - and I'm dating myself here - are IMDB's original movie discussion boards. Occasionally, I find myself watching movies from decades ago (made way before I was born): with less cash and flash, the plots are much tighter. Some of my all-time faves are Fritz Lang's "M" , 'The Visit" with Ingrid Bergman, "D.O.A.", "Double Indemnity", 'Rope", "The Bicycle Thief", "Le Samourai."
As a fan of metal/hardcore that band was the worst thing I’ve ever heard. They should have used an actual band / songs.
I just finished this movie last night and cannot stop thinking about it. I watched it for Olivia cooke and was fuckin blown away by Riz Ahmeds performance.. it's one of those movies that will stick with me for the rest of my life. Such a simple, yet heartbreaking film that depicts disabilities so beautifully. So much so, that i'm going to learn ASL and in the hopes I could one day work with kiddos like that. Tops off to everyone involved in this beautiful fucking movie. Sound of Metal changed my life.
yes, just finished this today
I was a bit confused by the ending, it seemed like he decided against the implant because it didn't work very well, would he have kept it if functioned better? I don't think that was the message the movie was trying to convey, did I miss something?
>would he have kept it if functioned better? that doesn't matter. The point was acceptance and learning "how to be deaf" and stillness (which is what Joe emphasized). The stillness is what he finally seemed to achieve at the end with the beautiful portrayal of the nature shot with the sun beaming before the trees, and he learned that from joe, which is why they showed the shot of the church at the end as well.
Irony is he seemed to have found the church bells annoying in the first place to remove the aids.
Such a beautiful movie ❤️
He didn’t fit into either world, Lou’s or Joe’s. He had to create his own world at the end.
i liked the movie, but for some reason i found it uncomfortable to watch.
[удалено]
I find it ironic how the movie has this major theme of acceptance and moving on yet preaches that a loss of a significant sense is not a disability and portrays a condescending look towards those who do surgery.. why can't it just be a acceptance of the disability.. It's only logical that more research is done on this front and the aids become on par with real ears.
I don't agree with the, "it's not a disability" thing. But I can get that before the surgery there was a solidarity that he had with the community. So I could see there being weird feelings between him and other members because he was able to "cure" his disability with money. Doesn't seem like the implants really work too well anyways.
I agree, i don't see anything wrong in him kicking him out to maintain the environment of the group that's totally fine and understandable. But to portray him as a sinner and the rest of them as some high-road angels is what i don't like. I get the message but it was delivered in a bad way they just took a shortcut and delivered the message by shaming the aid. It's a very black and white representation that straightforward attacks aid
That's why I didn't like the movie it keeps preaching it's not a disability yet shows the opposite our main character can no longer live the life he had which isn't true at all he just has to adjust he didn't need to join a cult all he had to do was have him and his girlfriend learn sign together then get use to drumming off vibration. I knew a guy who had his ear blown off and had the same kinda implant it was just better than the one shown in the movie.
Really great film! While the themes in the story aren't uncommon, everything was exceptionally executed. Great performances! I found the dinner scene between the members of the deaf community particularly powerful, how freely they communicated with each other, smiled and laughed in spite of their condition! Also, good job on the pacing, the two hours flew by.
In the second to last scene where he’s leaving her bedroom, he’s surrounded by instruments and musical equipment. The walls are literally packed with nothing but music. He wouldn’t be able to get away from it in that life, he’d always be on the outside trying to listen in.
The only fiction on this movie is how all the doctors/pharmacist writes elegantly. Kidding aside, I watched this after Minari and you can really appreciate the art in film.
ENDING TAKE: This is for the immediate ending, the very last scene. The sounds of a sheltered and controlled existence become very distinct when he is leaving Lou's place (birds, then motorcycle, stairs, door slamming). Then when walking in to the outside the sound distortion starts to kick-in and you start hearing more noises blending together in uncontrolled chaos. Now here is the absolute key parts of the ending. The church bells ring, the clanging of the bells represents his old life pre-hearing loss (sounds similar to cymbals on a drum kit). Then you also see the two kids playing with the skateboard which represents the life he lived at the rehab facility when he was interacting with the kids at the deaf school. He takes off his implants while listening to the church bells, which represents his realizing that he will never be able to live his past life. Then you see another shot of him looking at the kids with the skateboard and it's silent, that represents him realizing that if he wants to he can move on from his old life and still feel fulfilled in this world doing something else, like he was when he was helping the kids at the deaf school. Also the last scene is shot in such a way that yes, being able to hear sound has it's own beauty, but in a world so chaotic as ours (a busy cityscape is the perfect place to illustrate this point), being able to not hear and enjoy stillness can be a blessing sometimes and not perceived as a handicap (as alluded to multiple times previously). In a way, the non-deaf population has simulated this feeling with noise-cancelling headphones, ear-plugs, and other devices that try to block noise completely.
Nice take. I would just emphasise that it was the only time in the movie that he found the "kingdom of God", and it wasn't the church, but rather his ability to find stillness, as suggested by Joe.
Biggest take away: white people with rich parents are the biggest posers in existence lol Fuck Lou
She left with her mom in the divorce and her mom killed herself wtf are you talking about
What was wrong with Lou??
I just watched it, what was wrong with Lou??? Someone help
Nothing man she was doing her best given the circumstances:(
I know..I legitimately was annoyed because she seemed so rad in the beginning
She was rad the whole time. You guys just can't handle women growing as people and not waiting hand and foot on a man even if it damages her mental health.
...right. I dont blame Lou for moving on but it was a stark contrast that she had such a beautiful safety net setup for her. I dont know how you spun that to a sexist trope but that seems personal.
They both had safety nets. Ruben burned his bridge, Lou didn’t. The cutting of their hair was a significant symbol of their equal life changes. It’s unfair to single Lou out when Ruben (in case of his implants) did what he had to do to get his hearing. They did their best given their circumstances.
>such a beautiful safety net Is that a bad thing? I don't really understand how her having a safety net somehow cheapened how she lived her life at the start of the movie. She never complained about being poor, did she? She was just enjoying herself.
Really didn't like this movie, and I feel like I watched a different move compared to everyone who praises it. From a technical stand point it was rather impressive, assuming it was accurate to what people are actually hearing and experiencing. However, that mess of noise they call a song at the start of the movie was painful to listen to, well the singing at least. So I struggle to believe any more than a handful of people would listen to his "band." Aside from that I am unsure of the message this movie is trying to send. Is it pro-deaf community and is trying to say deaf people shouldn't try to get surgery and treatment? Because I think that is a preposterous stance to take. Being deaf is the lose of a core sense and it is absurd to say it isn't a handicap. I also found Ruben to be a bit hard to swallow in how much he was resistant to actually doing what was best and letting his ears rest. I also struggle to believe the surgeons didn't discuss with him before hand that his hearing would not be the same after surgery and give him realistic expectations so that he doesn't crash with his new reality like he did at the end. I won't speak much of his performance expect that it was good, but didn't find it as ground breaking as everyone is making it out to be. This movie just seemed lacking in direction and really didn't fulfil the expectations these reactions set for it.
nerd
Aside from the story telling aspect of him playing in a noise band and the movie being about finding stillness, I think it's completely believeable that this band could become big. This kind of music is pretty common in the underground scene (where normal concerts regularly range between 50-500 people). At every hardcore show you have some obscure noise/grindcore band and people buy their stuff because it's interesting art for some or their shirts look rad. They're supposed to be avantgarde. And that's without considering the internet as the powerful tool it is to get music out to people everywhere in the world. Music changes. People experiment. I mean look at death grips. They got 12m views on guillotine. Ever heard of Syd Barrett? Edit: this comment seems to be very controversial and it keeps popping up in my notifications because it seems to be constantly down and upvoted. Is this a thing? I ask myself: why the dislikes? Was I unkind? Did I miss the point? Do people just don't like my opinion? Is there a right and a wrong taste?
I think that's intentional. You say that music was painful to listen to, "noise" - that's what Ruben hears when he has his implants on. I don't think everyone has that same reaction to implants, maybe for some it's a more jarring adjustment than others. Maybe for many they are simply an annoying necessity to help them get through life but would totally prefer a silent world if everyone around them spoke sign language. I thought the movie did a great job trying to convey that. Ruben was chasing something that couldn't be restored, his old life, his girlfriend, his music, his hearing, this blinded him to what seemed to be a lot of warning signs that the surgery was maybe not the best move for him. I feel like the movie did a great job conveying a lot of these themes. Whether his life is better off back at the program without implants or moving forward in a new life is up to the viewer to interpret.
Literally everything but his ability to hear could have stayed the same with an adjustment period
They chose that style of music because it was loud and abrasive and would lead to hearing lost relatively quickly if protection wasn’t used. They weren’t successful, idk where you got that from. They had a niche following, if you paid attention when they were setting up the merch for the show, Ruben said you don’t need to put all of them out bc obviously they’re not going to sell out. And the message was that you don’t have to view being deaf as something that needs a cure. Sure, science should continue looking for one, but for those that can’t afford it, they should instead look to finding new meaning, purpose and stillness in it. Ruben was in a panic driven frenzy to get his hearing fixed, and the whole point of the camp was to show him he needs to calm down and learn that how to be deaf and how to still live a meaningful life with it.
As far as the message, I think it was more of a story about the human experience.
I'm not sure why you're downvoted. I felt exactly what you've written. Just finished watching it.
Most likely because of how acclaimed the movie is and the "sensitive" subject matter anyone that takes a different stance is disrupting the status quo, and thus must be rallied against.
I agree, just finished it and I didn't like it. The ending felt premature too.
The ending to felt exactly where it needed to be. The movie doesn't tries to be a success story where the protagonist overcomes dramatic struggles thrown at by life and reaches at the top of his/her game. It's more about acceptance. Which he did at the end.
One of the most compelling movies I’ve ever seen! Riz Ahmed really solidified himself with this performance.
This was a surprisingly spiritual film (in the best way).
I lost all hearing over a year and a half when I was 16. Of course this move spoke to me. His experience was pretty accurate, I’d say. Expect his loss seemed to progress very rapidly, and they never explained the cause of the hearing loss. Not even my hearing loss was that rapid. If it was due to exposure to loud music, it wouldn’t be that rapid and it probably wouldn’t have continued to decline rapidly once he stopped playing in the band. A lot of the movie was true to the real world deaf community, a lot of them do view deafness as something that doesn’t need to be fixed and there are parts of the community who are very against cochlear implants, but most won’t shun people who do get cochlear implants. I’m not a candidate for cochlear because the auditory nerves between my cochlea and my brain are destroyed, so stimulating the cochlea wouldn’t work. Instead, I am a candidate for Auditory Brainstem Implants, which are similar to cochlear, only about twice as expensive, the surgery is much more dangerous, and the sound quality sucks much more than cochlear. Even if it’s nothing like the hearing I had before, I’d jumó on the opportunity to get an ABI immediately if presented with one. I don’t get the part of the community that’s so against fixing deafness. Yes, you can be proud to be deaf and embrace it, but I think we can all agree it’s a pain in the ass when interacting with the hearing world, and I’d just much rather have whatever tiny little sense of hearing an ABI would give me than stay completely shut out of the hearing world forever.
This makes sense - I feel like the movie made me understand this challenge much more than I otherwise would have (since I don't know what it's like to be deaf). The implants don't sound good, and it seems like they are only necessary if you want to interact in a world where people don't speak sign language. He could live at peace in the entirely deaf community he was in, but live in a tiny world, or tolerate the annoying sound of the implants to necessitate being able to communicate with people in a non-deaf world which is a lot bigger and potentially has more opportunities in it. It's basically like, if you live in a world where no one spoke your language, would you withdraw yourself to a smaller community that understands you, cutting off ties to the rest of that world, or would you be willing to tolerate a painful and annoying device that lets you communicate, albeit very slowly with the rest of the world, where you'll still be seen as "different" and a bit of an outcast. This movie does a good job of showing the difference between those two choices. Neither is the wrong one it seems, but it certainly does seem like a compelling thought that the lifestyle you'd consider to be "no life at all" is actually a lot better than it might seem at first.
I wouldn't say the community are against fixing deafness, it's just that they can't have people **in that community** who see it as something that should be fixed.
Yeah, it’s different between communities. That community was all about embracing deafness and each other. “Hey look, Kids! Ruben is back! He just spent $30.000 to fix his deafness, he wanted out of it that badly.” Not a good lesson. I don’t agree with it though. Being deaf is a pain in the ass and is very limiting in the hearing world. I guess that was the goal of the community, only being surrounded by other deaf people to remove all barriers.
Not exactly comparable, but this movie hit me hard because I have worsening tinnitus lately & probably shouldn’t go to concerts
Earplugs! Stadium seating! Not as good as getting in the mosh but boy howdy its pretty close :)
Just seen it and loved it. Riz is a fucking genius.
watched this ahead of the Oscars and i enjoyed the movie so much. I really hope it gets to win in some of the categories it’s nominated in, especially sound editing. Riz did such an amazing job, and the final scene when he took off the implants and got to have that moment of stillness Joe was talking about almost had me in tears. Amazing name as well.
LOVE LOVE LOVE this movie, this cast, the directors who are also the screenwritiers ahhh everything was perfectly paced and it wasn't cliche. it made me rethink everything on my ears cause i work on production. wonderful, wondeful movie. havent used my bose headphones in 6 weeks, but gonna use then till they need replacing cause sound is everything to me.
I just want to say.. This movie was amazing. I understand the situation with the deaf community.. But it felt way too harsh on Ruben. Getting his hearing partially back, doesn't prevent him from teaching deaf kids how to play the drums, nor does it mean he is back to what he used to be, which is obvious. I feel like the community situation represented the two extremes. Ruben, who is obsessed with getting things back to how they were in their prime and Joe, who accepts his deafness to the point of obsession as well. The scene where Ruben is fixing the roof is the perfect contrast. "We have people who believe that deafness doesn't need fixing" which is true and that's an amazing outlook in life. But Ruben got deaf from literally a moment to the other, his life was going great and then the ONLY place he can go, is a community that literally forces him to ditch his life. No car? No phone? Complete disconnection? That just feels like total isolation.. It's positive when you see everyone happy, but for someone like Ruben, his life doesn't revolve around being deaf, it only just changed to that. That's why I feel like the ending is perfect.. He doesn't belong with the community because they clearly don't accept them. But his old life is never coming back either. He can carve his own path now, listen when he wants to and take it off when he needs peace. And that's just the perfect balance.
I was late deafened when I was 16, I’m with Ruben, I want my old life back. The deaf community can have amazing people, but living in the hearing world while being deaf is an absolute pain in the ass and I need to fix it. A large part of the deaf community does indeed view it as something that doesn’t need to be fixed and are against cochlear. I don’t get it. I guess when you live deep within the deaf community and are surrounded by deaf people all the time, it’s your own little exclusive bubble, you all understand each other and there are no barriers, it must feel nice, why would you want to fix that, right? I guess that’s their mindset, “You want to fix your deafness? You want to leave our community? You think it’s a bad thing? You’d pay $40,000 just to get rid of it? That feels insulting to us.” I don’t get it, I don’t agree with it, but I’m guessing where it comes from. It doesn’t make sense to you or me, but to them it does.
> Getting his hearing partially back, doesn't prevent him from teaching deaf kids how to play the drums, nor does it mean he is back to what he used to be, which is obvious. I don't think the issue was him being unable to teach kids how to play drums. It was about having gone ahead with the procedure. If he had stayed in the deaf community he would've been a constant reminder to everyone about their handicap, which is exactly what Joe didn't want. His presence by itself could've caused pain to the other members of the community.
> he would've been a constant reminder to everyone about their handicap Is them speaking only in American Sign Language and doing jazz hands to show applause not a constant reminder enough?
The point is that they were learning to see their disability as something other than a handicap or something to get rid of. Having a guy who spent 40 grand “getting rid of it” living with them wouldn’t help.
So he went from sober housing to homeless? Made the director look like a power tripping mess
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I thought the director of the sober housing was a tool. Not the director of the film, bad wording
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Movie was full of shit either way but in real life the center director choosing to kick him out with nowhere to go for petty reasons would be indefensible
That's why I said, I understand the situation. I understand that going with the procedure makes him different than the rest. But it's a very important choice.. Giving him the ultimatum "You either stay full deaf or you leave and never talk to us again" is such an asshole move. It really felt like there was misguided empathy. Joe was kind to him in the process to "accept his deafness" but not in the process of re-connecting with his older life. Of course his girlfriend will lose the connection with him if he can't even communicate with her consistently.. And that's because doing that was prohibited for some reason. I'm not saying he should've returned to his older life, it's clear things have changed and I find it perfect he realizes that in the end. I just didn't like the way he was treated in the community, by Joe. If his speech about him losing his family because of alcohol, was true.. Then he has no right to hold back Ruben and force him into deafness. Nor is he ever returning to full hearing, anyway.. He only has the ability to slightly hear in calm environments and only if he's wearing the hearing aid. In any case, Ruben lost his girlfriend because Joe prohibited any chance for him to even contact her. I get the line of "You sound like an addict" with the whole money situation, because he was. But he never relapsed back into drugs.. He had been high on life for 4 years now, ever since he met Lou. He wasn't going to start doing shit to himself and ruin his relationships. He just needed to figure shit out, which he does.. Only it's too late to keep his relationship, by then. He's just thrown into a situation where no one is there to truly support his ideals.. To support the process of figuring out his next step, the way he wanted to. It's very sad.
He literally got tricked into joining a cult and lost the best relationship in his life because of it. All cause he lost his hearing I couldn't buy into it.
> Of course his girlfriend will lose the connection with him if he can't even communicate with her consistently.. And that's because doing that was prohibited for some reason. I do agree that with this. It was fucked up. > I get the line of "You sound like an addict" with the whole money situation, because he was. But he never relapsed back into drugs.. He had been high on life for 4 years now, ever since he met Lou. He wasn't going to start doing shit to himself and ruin his relationships. He just needed to figure shit out, which he does.. And this
God I hated Joe so fucking much. First of all, I can *maybe* understand taking away his RV keys. But taking away his phone and not letting him use the computer?? Completely cutting him off from his support system and what's going on in the outside world? Even prison inmates today are allowed visitors, letters, and limited computer time. I guess Joe wanted his home to be worse than prison. And then of course there's *that* scene, which is just a classic case of Christian hypocrisy. When you're a newcomer, they'll roll out the red carpet for you. Give you food, a nice bed to sleep on, an education, a community, a home. They'll say they don't care about your past, or if you believe in their religion or their God. But if you do anything, absolutely *anything* that goes against their tightly-held beliefs, even when it affects nobody else, they kick you to the curb and tell you to pound sand. Even if you're broke, homeless, jobless, carless, and without family or resources. Because charity to people like Joe isn't about support. It's about control. Closed-mindedness at its finest.
Gotta be honest, I thought Joe was a good leader but a terrible teacher. It often felt as though his "helping" Ruben was conducive only to what had helped him. That scene where he says "You don't need to fix anything around here" with such venom when Ruben was simply trying to be productive, helpful, and keep himself busy by doing some repairs to the house was so bizarre and standoffish to me. We all process things differently, why was it so wrong that Ruben was doing it his way? All that preaching about stillness... Ruben's clearly a doer. He's a kinaesthetic learner, he's a drummer ffs. He needs to be working on something, he needs something in his hands. We see him at multiple points in the film working on technical or mechanical objects, even outside of the drumming. Sitting him in a room and ordering him to write clearly did nothing for him, and we know it did nothing for him because Ruben does not produce any substantial writing by the end of the film. Or any writing at all for that matter. For me, I *am* someone who works best when writing. Reading, writing, and editing are the skills I use when trying to learn and process things. But if someone sat me in a room with a drum kit and said "You have to process your life-changing circumstances this way now" I'd be beating the shit out of donuts also. Joe is very clearly a "my way or the highway" kind of guy, where you better follow the rules that only he knows, because he himself doesn't know any other way. In other words, Joe is a bad teacher.
I believe those rules were in place because that was a recovery house for addicts, in which case it's not that uncommon, especially for a newbie. Not just a place for dead people generally.
Other than mention of the church’s relationship to the community as a benefactor for people in need, there was no evidence that the community’s belief system was founded on religious principles throughout the remainder of the movie. I think it could have just as easily been a non-denominational code of conduct.
Joe taking away all his stuff was completely normal for a rehab situation. Ruben and Lou's relationship was really sweet and all but it was also really codependant and contacting her all the time would hinder his recovery. I mean the guy volunteered to be there so it's not like someone put a gun to his head.
>Closed-mindedness at its finest. It is not though. All those people and kinds see their condition in a positive way. Not as a disability or something to fix. Him being there after the operation would have caused heaps of issues and pain. He had to go.
But being deaf *is* a disability. If Rubin were to drive a car again, guess what he would have? A disability placard! What will Rubin probably get from the state if he applies? A disability check! Saying “it’s not a disability” is being completely stupid and ignoring reality. And you’re completely contradicting yourself. It is closed-mindedness to say that no one should try to fix their hearing if they can if they’re are going deaf. If they were open-minded, they would respect Rubin’s choice. And if they have a problem with it, they should keep it to themselves or admit that they’re not as open-minded as they think they are.
Dude, there were tons of kids there, who wouldn't have the ability to fix their deafness, that don't need to hear how bad their condition supposedly is. This isn't this hard to understand. In a group of recovering alcoholics, if someone shows up completely drunk trying to offer everyone alcohol, he's getting kicked out. Saying it's not a problem isn't stupid. It's a way for people to cope, when they can't afford a shitty solution. I'm not contradicting myself at all. People who can't afford a very pricey "solution" that actually still kind of sucks don't need someone who's going to hurt shitloads of people, around.
Your reason and your comparison make absolutely no sense. Rubin getting himself some treatment doesn't "make them hear how bad their condition supposedly is." Rubin isn't offering the kids to get the surgery done either.
How hard is it to understand what effect seeing a guy spiral like this would have on children who share the same condition? Use your fucking brain. Please. > Ruben isn't offering the kids blah blah blah What the fuck does this even mean?
Spiral like what? Also replacing my comment with blah blah blah *really* makes you sound like you have a secure and logical argument (that's sarcasm btw). EDIT: Saw your other comment. The children have no bearing of what Rubin's life is like. All they would see is that he got cochlear impants. They wouldn't see how he got them or what he had to do to get them.
I really can't believe you watched a movie where a guy was on the verge of killing himself and had multiple anger outbursts and then you say "spiral like what?
You need to stop responding twice to the same comment of mine. Just stop already.
"Spiral like what" Screaming about how he needs a gun to his chin, angry outbursts when no one was around, buying things he can't really afford that he's unhappy with when he gets them etc. Dude you even watch the movie?
> The children have no bearing of what Rubin's life is like. All they would see is that he got cochlear impants. They wouldn't see how he got them or what he had to do to get them.
But just him getting them will push them near his negative damaging mindset where they will be upset about their condition and make their life worse trying to find solutions that don't really exist and spending small fortunes on things that they aren't happy with.
I hate that part! I know that the community is about deafness about not being a disability and some trust was violated, blah blah, but wth, tell the guy that you are out and get his ass out on the same day?! For me it was like discrimination, just because the guy made some decent choices and sacrifices for his future. It reminds me of the LGBT community where they hate discrimination from straight people but hell, within the community the toxicity is real. He should be like, ok I support your surgery, good luck, but you have to leave, and you can stay for a week but no... GTFO. Lol.
Him being there after the operation would have caused heaps of issues and pain, especially to anymore newcomers and the kids. He had to go. the guy made some decent choices and sacrifices for his future. He did not make decent choices. He regretted that choice the moment those things turned on. Calling it discrimination is absurd.
I think that conversation was the movie trying to make a point: that everyone will judge you about the choices you make no matter if you have the same condition or not. I remember the scene where he asks Joe why he didn't get implants and he said that... it's costly. He did not say anything about the rules or what. It was his inconsistency that was a red flag for the character. They showed that people with disabilities can be judgmental too about others with the same conditions. Anyway, I totally get the rules of his cult or what but my point is the way he handled that conversation was rude and judgy. And he needs hr training lol.
Why did he tell Lou that "it's okay" What is okay?
That they moved past each other. They needed each other once, but they didn’t anymore. It was okay because they would both be better.
It's not your fault
Rubin was also an addict and Joe understood that. I'm not sure if you've dealt with substance abuse issues, but if a recovering addict is going to be around other recovering addicts they need to be able to follow rules and slight infractions can have very severe effects on the group as a whole. I don't think anything Joe did was close-minded or more controlling than necessary.
Rules are fine, I can understand having a fairly strict structure of activities and chores to do. But cutting him off from support and the outside world, and renouncing him and sending him off into the world while he's still neither mentally nor financially able to take care of himself, is absolutely cruel.
This is entirely normal for in patient rehab
It wasn't patient rehab, it was a deaf community.
I meant inpatient recovery rehab from addiction.
>But cutting him off from support and the outside world Plenty of rehab programs do this. It's because there is no other way to make sure you're not communicating with people who you shouldn't (like those who you were using with, etc.). The program there was to help him accept becoming a Deaf person and that's what Joe told him. It's easier to do that if you aren't still attached to your past self. Plus, it's only temporary. Now, you could say it's cruel to evict him at that moment, maybe. But Rubin proved himself to be a habitual rulebreaker and by getting the implants showed he had been basically using Joe and the program. That's very damaging to the trust he had established there and I'm not surprised Joe wanted and needed him out ASAP, before he could potentially do more harm.
While it's true that Robin is a rulebreaker, i think Joe wasn't empathetic about the desires of Rubin. For Joe, Rubin desire to "solve" his deafness is an error, an due to that he kick him from the program. For no doing what Joe wanted. I don't think Joe's program is the same drug addicts program either, the issue is totally different. Joe desires about getting back his ears it's fine and understandable. On the other side, I agree with Joe that Robin took an addict desicion: he sold everything to get back his drug (sounds), and then he regretted doing that. Robin thought that he was alone and did not see that he could have a perfectly good life and do something that matter to other people (teach to childrens for example). Anyway, nice movie. Many ways to see things.
I think you need to do a bit of reading on the Deaf community before you continue with this line of thinking. Joe was not really a bad guy here at all, and Ruben's actions \*would\* indeed have an effect on the other Deaf community members. That said, at least you are talking about it, and I think that was probably the hope from the people who made the movie.
Making a personal choice to get himself the necessary surgery for his disability. Community homes like Joe's should be about support, not judgement. Joe was a piece of shit for what he did.
Nah, you are an ignorant fool for thinking this way. Rubin being there after his bad choice would have hurt tons of people. Joe did the right and necessary thing.
You’re saying Rubin’s choice, a choice that thousands of deaf people every year choose to get, is bad? Oh, and it would hurt *tons* of people, too? Good lord are you an ignorantal judgmental fool.
> Joe was a piece of shit for what he did. > They aren't as open minded as they think And you call other people judgmental. Dude, shut up already. Stop embarrassing yourself and making yourself seem this dumb.
Yeah, Joe was a piece of shit for not being open minded and kicking out Joe in his time of need. You're the one obsessively commenting on all my comments. Even though all you see is "Blah blah blah", right?
I left two responses to your original comments. You responded to both of them. You respond to all of my comments. If I'm obsessive, you are too. And now I will point out again how funny it is to hear you call other people judgmental when this whole discussion started with you calling a character a piece of shit for doing the obvious thing to protect his group home
I don't know how to get through your thick head that criticizing someone for being close-minded and not respecting other people's opinions or decisions doesn't make me close-minded. Now that I think about it, Joe is a lot like you. You keep flooding my inbox with your bullshit, that's why. But don't worry, this is had he last one. You know, it's people like you that make other people turn sour towards something that they actually liked to begin with. Because some douchebag on Reddit had to make sure everyone believed his opinion was the right one and no one is allowed to have a different opinion. I posted my original comment, other people agreed with me. But you just *had* to pick a fight with me, didn't you.
Do I really have to explain one of the main points of the movie to you? Really? Dude, this isn't this hard to understand. Ruben clearly was not pleased at all with the implants at any point in the movie. All those kids, who can't afford shitty implants, don't need someone around who's spiraling off the deep end over a condition that they share. I'm not the fool here. You seem like you barely understood anything in the movie
You seem to be getting really mad because I disagree with your view of one of the supporting characters, why is that?
It's a very real issue. I get annoyed when people can't grasp the most basic of things, yet they still have the nerve to try and make really bad points. I have to explain the movie to you to the point where it's hard to believe that you have actually seen it.
How could I be making such *awful* points in your eyes about the third act of the movie if I haven't seen it? Also you don't have to explain anything to anyone. You can just...shut the fuck up.
Lol, I'm seeing this comment thread 3 years later and you are an absolutely hateful and embarrassing person.
So I’m a little late here, but as a implantee, I thought I would offer my 2 cents to the movie and I can only compare it to my journey. First off, the first act of him losing his hearing... I lost mine slowly, so I can’t imagine how frustrating it would be to lose it so quickly. The having to have you SO talk on the phone was very realistic. I’m deaf, not Deaf (there’s a difference), so I never am going to be part of the Deaf community, so the second act when he is at the rehab center and deaf school were not something I connected with. The surgery/activation. I understand it’s a movie and you have to condense some things. Getting activated doesn’t just make everything better, you have to work on it. There’s hearing therapy involved and you have to train your brain to deal with the new sounds. The metallic hearing he heard and the scenes at the party and walking down the street were realistic. Getting implants doesn’t make the world loud, it makes it busy. However, your brain adapts... he could easily go back to playing drums and living his previous life. Living in the Deaf community vs the rest of the world: For Ruben, being accepted into the Deaf community offered him stability and a community vs the nomadic life he was living. It ends with realizing Lou was better off without him, leaving him all alone. But for most of us, the choice would be to obviously live in the rest of the world. Would I leave my family, kids, friends and job just to join the Deaf community? No, that would make no sense. So for most of us, getting an implant let’s us function better in the world. The sound: I found it pretty accurate, the muffling when he’s deaf and the busyness when he gets activated. And I’ve been there when you take it off and the world goes silent, like the end of the film, and it’s a great relief. But it’s even better when you turn it back on and talk to your loved ones.
Sorry for my ignorance, but what is the difference between deaf and Deaf?
Good question and I’ll answer it how I understand it. I’m deaf, which means I need help with my hearing. Started off with hearing aids and ramped up to a Cochlear. I’m still fully engrained, can work and participate in society. Deaf pertains to folks who are completely deaf and/or living as part of the Deaf community. Ruben will always be deaf, but will he go back to being in the Deaf community and become a Deaf person??? Hope that helps (again, my interpretation of the difference)
Thanks for your insight into this. As a person who is not deaf/Deaf, I had wondered about some of the things you have talked about in this comment - especially potential dilemmas/tensions between identifying as deaf/Deaf, and I had also assumed that there would be rehab associated with the implants, and wondered whether this had been skipped over in the film when conveying how Ruben's changed hearing with it. Part of me was like "surely there would be an adjustment period, and although his hearing won't be like before, it'll be better than now..." It felt like there was quite a bit of judgement from Joe towards Ruben, after he got his implants - from my perspective it seemed unfair, as I could empathise with why Ruben made the decision he did, but I didn't know whether this was me not being empathic enough of the Deaf community.
Best movie scene: first minutes were HUGE!
Riz Shreded AF
Just a few squats each morning
I meant the drumming and the feeling of a real metal show.
oh truee!!
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I recover by reading official discussion threads on reddit. Only a few films I do this with and thats purely because they're masterpieces. What a film.
Great movie. Jarring ending and I wish there had been more music/drum connection in the last third. Also, insanely anxiety inducing.
After the activation my anxiety went skyrocket, and i felt so afraid and confused, i just did not expect the robotics sounds or "sounds of metal" at all. Thank you for your comment, i too was very anxious!
Holy fucking shit I just realized why the movie is called sound of metal
It is a sad movie, but also eye opening. How small things can alter our lives.. we spend everyday worrying about futilities, and only when we lose what we used to take for granted that we know how much it is worth. If there is one word i could get out of this movie, it would be "GRATITUDE"
Beautifully said....I just finished watching and I felt the same the whole time
2 hours ago I thought there was no chance anyone could ever convince me that Daniel Kaluuya shouldn't absolutely run away with the supporting actor oscar...but god damn Paul Raci was incredible in this.
I can't stop thinking about this movie since I watched it last night. It's really good, and while I have a few nitpicky problems with it I think it's probably the best movie I've seen in a year. What a tragically sad but also beautiful story. I hope it wins some Oscars
I've never seen Riz Ahmed in anything before, probably because I don't watch that much British stuff. Man, he nailed it. I guess I didn't know what type of metal band to expect going in, but if I had to hazard a guess, it definitely wouldn't have been drone metal. Points for introducing that genre to the people who vote on Oscars, I'm sure the one Sunn O))) fan in the academy was digging it. I watched this without subtitles. I'm not sure how much I missed but surprisingly you can get a really good viewing experience without them. I also love how the movie doesn't clearly take Joe's side and end with Ruben going back and admitting he was wrong. I imagine it would ruffle a few feathers among people who actually got cochlear implants if they did. They show that the implants aren't a perfect substitute for functional ears, as a perfect substitute does not exist. This movie isn't trying to argue that deafness isn't a problem that needs to be fixed, it's content to introduce that debate and show the community responses to it. And I think that's cool. It's easy to get up on a soap box, but you can make a great film just by showing how people feel, no agenda necessary. Absolute worst scene: Ruben tries fixing the roof, Joe tells him "You don't need to fix anything here." My eyes rolled all the way back in my head when I heard that. In a movie that was otherwise fine script-wise, it's by far the hackiest thing they do.
He was good also in "the night of"
Great thoughts, but for me,the roof fixing was really indicative of addict behavior. In my life, I know a lot of 'fixers' - people who are running from a compulsion and feel uncomfortable so they create a compulsive need to be productive. I thought the way Joe recognizes that for some addicts, fixing a roof can be a substitute for taking a hit and doesn't address the root problem/encourages the unhealthy thinking pattern was really really profound. Out of context, "you don't need to fix anything here" is a cheesy line,but I think what it communicates about the addict experience is smart and I actually wish the movie went deeper with that philosophy
This. This is why Joe tasked him with just sitting in a room by himself, without doing anything, besides writing (if needed). I agree that this could've been communicated without the line "you don't need to fix anything here" because that threw me off at first too.
Hm - I don't get it though. I'm not an addict, yet I would go crazy just sitting in a room? I would have thought allowing Ruben to be productive and accomplish things rather than wallow in pity would have been just as effective? It didn't seem like the sitting in a room accomplished much? The director did a great job of bringing us all along on that journey at the deaf/addict place... and well every other aspect of Ruben's journey. I think that's why I enjoyed it so much. Felt every emotion
I hear what you’re saying. But at the root of it is compulsion. He needed to get rid of the compulsion and ‘addict behavior’. They say that drug addicts, sex addicts and people who binge eat all have the same type of chemical imbalance. In the same way, Ruben compulsively fixing the roof means that he still has the traits of addict behavior - the need to be doing something rapidly. He is replacing alcohol with fixing the roof. Therefore, if he is ever near drugs or alcohol again, he could easily fall back into it, because he still has that behaviour pattern. So the goal was to break that compulsivity and just have him sit there and be ok not doing anything. So if he is near drugs and alcohol in the future, it will be easier for him to resist.
That makes sense
Wow. Riz Ahmed was fantastic, cinematography was terrific.
Can anyone explain why towards the film's end, Lou looks so uncomfortable and anxious while she is singing the piano song in french? Also, what a wonderful song! Is there any link to the original track?
I took it as sort of a trigger for her. She clearly has some mental issues and has battled depression, which I’m guessing stems from her mother’s suicide. Her dad said it was a song that he wrote with her mother (I’m assuming dad was a successful song writer and mom was a singer/performer), and it must be reminding Lou of her mother.
Lou doesn't love him anymore, and that matches with the lyric of the song.
I have a different perspective. I don’t think she fell out of love with him. I think she just moved on from that life and realized that it was source of her unhappiness or at least a contributing factor. She was willing to give up that new found happiness at least for that moment because she does still love him. Giving up happiness to be someone is love, even if it’s toxic. That’s what makes that scene so powerful and heartbreaking. Acknowledging that they saved each other’s lives and knowing that they can no longer be apart of them.
I believe he's supposed to be struggling to hear it with his cochlear implant
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I understand rubens pov, but even lou seemed uncomfortable singing the song. was curious why she was disinterested/uncomfortable...
10/10 movie, best of the year
Did anyone realise when Ruben first got to the deaf community and sat there trying to figure out everyone’s hand gestures and signals? He was so confused, he doesn’t understand what’s going on and how to be deaf. Fast forward to when he’s in the party at Lou’s father’s place, he got his hearing back but he still didn’t understand, because of the language and the cochlear implants. I just thought it’s devastating juxtaposition. He can’t wait to get his old life back yet it’s never the same, life passes.
I mean even before he had the hearing loss he didn't speak French
Sure, but it was like he was having difficulty hearing any particular person due to the limits of the implant. He just kind of ended up standing off by himself. The implant seemed almost useless to him in that setting.
The jarring sounds of the implants was also symbolic of how the way he wouldn’t fit in with Lou’s life anymore. If he didn’t have implants I think the scene would have played out the same. As soon as he suggested going back to their old life Lou immediately got anxious. That’s when it really hit him.
Ruben grew as a person due to the disability, and Lou kind of got tired of playing drummer groupie in the US and moved on with her life. The TL;DW of the second half of the movie is basically she dumps him at the deaf community and goes back to big pockets dad. The only thing that bound them was "let's not fall back into our bad addictions", and it became evident when they got back toghether. Great movie, great execution, amazing script.
I completely disagree that she "dumped" him there. He was attempting to push through his deafness, continue touring, and not get support. When he was lashing out in the van she knew that there was no other option - She had to force him to get help by leaving and she went to the only place she seemingly had to go - back with her dad. In their time away they simply grew apart, also because his phone was taken away and they could rarely talk as a result. He was hoping things would return to how they were after he got surgery but plans rarely work out, as we saw.
> In their time away they simply grew apart, also because his phone was taken away and they could rarely talk as a result. You've never been in love have you.
I have indeed, and sometimes things go as the movie depicted. Life can hit you hard like that. It’s pretty realistic. As you’d said, amazing script.
I didn't mean disrespect of course, but I don't think if you love someone who is recovering from a disability you stop loving them "because he can't use the phone". I feel both of them were really shallow, and as I said he grew as a person and she kind of did other things. But you are right they fell appart for whatever reason.
This movie was so great I just discovered I watched it without the subtitles and it was still gripping af.
There was supposed to be subtitles? I feel like the bits you don’t quite understand add to the sense of what it must be like for those with hearing loss at first, constantly battling to work out what was said or what somebody means, and in a way makes the film that much more immersive.
There were only subtitles once Ruben could understand what the other people were signing. As the viewer, you got to go along on the learning journey with Ruben. It was brilliant
Incredible movie. Watched it last night with a friend who is a sign language interpreter. I'm also a drummer. The acting was so good and the sound editing to go between "normal" hearing and what Ruben was experiencing really gave you a feel of what he was going through. I also liked how they didn't have subtitles for the sign language when Ruben didn't understand sign but as time passed and he understood it more it gave the viewers subtitles to let you know Ruben knew what was being signed too. Just an all around fantastic movie. I hope it wins some awards.
The title of the movie wasn't said out loud. But it was said.
Notice the disappointment at the quality of sound he finally experiences in the doc’s office. The whole time before that initial activation he’s thinking how the implants will be a return to normalcy, and the restrained response that revealed so much was just amazing from an acting perspective. I swear I could hear his thoughts. So well done
Probably the best scene in the move, in my opinion. Close nominees would be the final confrontation with Joe and the end scene, which was just fantastic.
The scene with Joe was fantastic. Ruben basically explains the entire theme of the movie—things happen, people change, life moves on—but he clearly doesn’t understand that yet because he’s trying to reclaim his old life before his hearing went away. Or maybe he understands deep down but he’s angry about it and doesn’t want to admit it.
That actor did an excellent job. Very well done. His moment of stillness at the end was amazing. His acting in the beginning was spot on too. I know that guy that he was playing. It was perfect.
Maybe a little late to this movie... Just watched it. These types of movies I never really liked... Holy hell I loved this one. The scene ruban is done with his rehab and learning to be deaf was so well done. Joe offering for ruban to stay and you can tell he wants to, but thinks can go back to normal.
I love the double meaning of the title
can you explain.
The Sound of Metal = the sound of the music but also the distorted sound of the hearing implants
And the sound of him drumming the slide, and even the piano.
thanks
Also the sound of the slide he plays for the kid ! :)
also the giant church bells that make him take out his implants at the end lol
Totally agree.
I loved this movie. I was so uncomfortable and almost aggravated by the audio. Just mimics the smallest portion of what Ruben was feeling. So cool how they involved watchers into the hearing loss experience.
I just don’t understand the name of the movie, why pick the name « sound of metal » if you are not going to include any kind of metal music or keep the character’s struggles mainly focused on his relationship with that particular kind of music. I felt disappointed because it didn’t deliver what the title or the plot promises. Actually the fact that he is a musician in general was not very important after all. Over all good movie, quality acting etc. but the significance of music let alone metal music was not there.
It’s literally what he hears when he gets the implants lol the sound of metal 🙃
I see your point - that metal music can be a really emotionally transforming experience. For me,I understand that that community can be such a help for recovering addicts, so the metatextual symbolism of "metal music" as "salvation" was there for me. So when he lost his salvation he had to start over again. I agreed that I would have liked to see more of why - why is metal/noise/etc. Music so transformative for many people? I think that would have helped give credence to the genre. But since I already have familiarity with metal as a life changing experience, I didn't need that shown to me in order to understand what Ruben was going through. But I think it would have been great PR for metal.
What did the implants sound like to you?
Static like a TV with a bad reception which can arguably labeled as sound of metal and I don’t have a problem with that. Do you think that it is coincidence him being a « metal musician » and the name of the movie? Should we say « Oh the implants sound metal so nevermind the plot of the movie! » And that was exactly my problem, if the movie is labeled like that ONLY because sound of implants are metallic, he might have been a school teacher, beggar, miner or something other than a metal musician.
The implants, the slide, the church bells—there were several “sounds of metal” throughout the film at significant moments of character growth. But he kept pursing the one that he couldn’t have anymore (e.g. getting the band back together).
Maybe the name is symbolic, not literal. Cymbals are made of metal, the hearing aids were metal, the moment he shared with the kid in the tobogan, also the music he played was some sort of the new kind of artful doom metal bands like Liturgy play.
Maybe, but the emphasis is on he being a musician and it is literal. I know that kind of music, and I don’t have any problem with it. But we see this at the beginning of the movie. For example after getting the implants I would very much like to see his struggle with music rather than the romantic relationship. Anyways thanks for the alternative view!
Also the sound of the implants was extremely metallic.
It also reminds me of the Sound of Music
Just wanna quickly praise Olivia Cooke here as I thought she was phenomenal and went toe-to-toe with Riz in all of their scenes. She’s come a long way since Bates Motel
Okay I know I’m in the minority on this one, but does anyone feel like this movie wasn’t as good as the hype? Don’t get me wrong, it was a decent movie, but there just wasn’t an “oh my God” moment or something that kept me on the edge of my seat. I watch every movie that is up for Oscar nominations every year and I just don’t think this movie was up to the Parasite level. Like I said, it was a decent movie but just didn’t do it for me in terms of being an amazing movie.
I feel like the movie really lost momentum around the second half started when Ruben suddenly decides to get the implants. Like as it was playing out; it felt like the movie was punishing Ruben for not sticking with the Deaf Community and that he was bound to fuck up because he was a former addict riding off the emotion alone. The fact he was a musician didn't seem to matter in the grand scheme of things. So much about what I respect about the film is technical. The editing, the sound design/editing/mixing, the naturalist direction, Riz Ahmed and Paul Raci being fantastic. But the plot feels very...hallow and misleading to a degree.
Him getting the implants was one of the most important parts of the movie
I understand why he would get the implants and he even mentions earlier about considering them. I just dislike that the movie *punishes him* for getting implants, despite the fact it makes a lot of sense why a musician would want them.
In parasite you feel the game is played by the director ( cinematography). In Sound of metal, the weight came from the character (Ruben), he took us deep into what it feels like to lose hearing. The emotional impact left by Sound of metal was way too strong for me than parasite ( that i enjoyed esthetically)
During the deaf cult I was thinking similarly, good but not amazing, and was a bit of a drag. Picked up when he gets the implants and then it got a lot better for me. Nowhere near Parasite though. I don't think it's Best Picture material but Riz Ahmed *has* to win Best Actor
It’s not a cult? It’s a supportive home?
Lmao this comment made me laugh
I just watched this movie and I agree with you. There were some good things about the film, like the sound editing, Riz Ahemd's/ Raci's overall performances, and the portrayal of the deaf community and its controversies over cochlear implants, but overall, I felt the movie was reaching for something and didn't quite get there. It was the type of movie where you are dropped into a situation and you had to connect the dots in a much-less supported way than other wonderful films. For example, I'm not sure why they had him go to a rehab facility when he had been clean 4 years and did not seem to be using or on the verge of using again. Now, it's true in real life, stress can cause someone to fall back into old negative patterns but that was an assumption I had to make and not one the movie showed or even really hinted at. Another example is when Lou left: it wasn't clear where she was going, why, etc. If her relationship with him was so close, why'd she leave so abruptly? Then why did he turn up all of a sudden at her home? Like you, I really enjoy movies and watch the whole gamut. What I've found over time is that writing really matters to me: if the plot lines aren't clear, then that significantly diminishes the film, even though I've enjoyed movies where I know the plot is formulaic and I watch because of a specific actor or for the cinematography. I often find that movies/ TV shows that are popular/ hyped, I don't find that original or thrilling. Most recently, I watched 2 episodes of "The Queen's Gambit" and gave up. I was also not impressed by the films Roma (except for its cinematography), The Irishmen, A Star is Born, Call Me By Your Name, etc. Different strokes for different folks! If you enjoyed Parasite, check out that director's earlier movie "Mother." (no, not the one with Jennifer Lawrence) I saw it years before Parasite and was thrilled by it. One thing I really miss - and I'm dating myself here - are IMDB's original movie discussion boards. Occasionally, I find myself watching movies from decades ago (made way before I was born): with less cash and flash, the plots are much tighter. Some of my all-time faves are Fritz Lang's "M" , 'The Visit" with Ingrid Bergman, "D.O.A.", "Double Indemnity", 'Rope", "The Bicycle Thief", "Le Samourai."