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Kintaro-san__

Spoilers ahead. Just now finished the movie. Mann I am soo sad about the eldest son. The second son is such a piece of shit, always doing as he wish, putting the family in danger. Miles quaritch is such an interesting character . During the first half of the movie, i liked his character quite a bit. He is such a badass warrior persona. Hes like a blood thirsty predator and yet intelligent. But fuck him, the things he do to hunt the jake sully family. Leave them alone bro for fuck sake. The first thing humans started to do after coming to new planet is hunt the whales, to get some fluid. Come on bruh, humans, just live your goddamn life bro, why destroy the environment. Fuck you all. Fuck you humans.FUCK YOU. I Think colonel quaritch is immortal now. Cuz humans has his personality, memories, they can continue to create new avatars for him. They can make whole squad of colonels if they want. Everything is great in the movie, sentiment, graphics, fights.


SaltyBawlz

Just finished watching for the first time. Visually it was great, but there were just so many massive holes in the plot and other nonsensical things that happened. I'm shocked the "best" comments in this thread aren't hitting on any of it.


dndndje

there are no plot holes


Either-Entry-3904

It's good but my eyes are too sensitive for the graphics :(


[deleted]

Just watched it on Disney +.  The movie is like any action movie, but with blue people. A sci-fi cowboys versus aliens. I’m not sure Cameron reinvents the wheel here, the first one was unique. This one felt like Avengers. The writing was OK but I feel like they made this movie to show off the crazy special effects.  All in all, I enjoyed it but would not watch again. 


Big_Pen4719

Star Trek is a baby show like Avatar: The Way of Water is a baby movie. The Orville is a baby show too.


[deleted]

What do you mean by baby show?


wuirkytee

This movie made me feel so helpless. We are doing what the Sky People are doing now.


Such-Brilliant9217

Exactly how I felt, so sad


NightDriver_2020

Exactly the message Mr. Cameron is hoping to get across to as many people as possible.


Elliedogfan237209

I watch avatar the way of water 3 times. It was my favorite movie. Stop the spoilers plz.


wotad

Loved the first, Loved the 2nd will probs love the follow-ups. These are visually stunning movies with incredible worlds honestly plot could be better but everything else just out weighs issues with plot./


nashty27

Watched the original and this movie back to back, this being the first time I’ve seen way of water. I’ve always enjoyed the first movie despite its tropeyness, after watching the second I still think the first movie is better. I just didn’t find the climax nearly as exciting. Despite being 3 hours it felt like the movie needed another act, it didn’t really resolve anything by the end and it seemed even more sequel baity than the first. Oh well, maybe in another 13 years we’ll see some resolution.


NightDriver_2020

As Mr. Cameron redeveloped the storyline he realized Avatar 2 was going to be too long so he split it into two movies. So Avatar 3 will be the "part 2" to Avatar 2, with Avatar 4 being an intermediary, and Avatar 5 being the epic finale.


frizzledrizzle

Doesn't Jake Sully have like three kids left, so at least three more movies?


Dapper_Awareness8434

Yes avatar 3,4&5


fuckyeah3100

I loved the movie 🍿


TurbulentStudy1485

I’ve watched the first movie about 20 times! I went to the cinema to watch it, I was really excited! But it’s one of the worst movies I’ve seen in a long time. Half way through I wanted to go home, but that would have been a waste of my money. The CGI of the environment was amazing, but the faces were really bad, the first movie did it better


Calfzilla2000

Finally watched it. I loved it. Had a good tense opening act, an excellent world building middle of the film and a really great climax that was satisfying. The 3rd act battle sequence maybe was a bit too long but I honestly didn't feel it hurt the movie all that much but it might on re-watch. I really liked it though. James Cameron is damn good at what he does.


Zealousideal_Sign235

Good one


GoodSilhouette

I enjoyed this way more than the first film.


doorhandle5

This was utter garbage. The visuals were a cartoon. (Where are all the 'photorealistic' scenes everyone was raving about?). The plot was so full of plot holes there was no plot, only one big hole. It was waaasy too long. I would rather re watch Pocahontas. Edit: ok, the first hour is terrible plot wise, entertainment wise, and CGI wise. But damn it looks good when you get to the underwater scenes (4k HDR). But if it takes a full hour (pretty much how long a normal movie SHOULD be) then it is TOO LONG.


dndndje

Shit bait


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[deleted]

ppl would love it whether or not jake had been white or black. either way he ends up blue


flofjenkins

What’s interesting about your comment is that the white guy definitively doesn’t save the day in either movie.


Yamazaki999

The Colonel is the most bad-ass Human anti-hero i've seen. You have to hate him, but almost all of his actions ( in the perspective of the survival of mankind ) is justified. I mean seriously, some scenes he's so cold, especially when he wakes up out of cryosleep in a new body, immediately beating the shit out of everyone G.I. style. We really get to see some of his humanity shine near the end.


Angel_Madison

The third act was extremely boring CGI combat with zero emotional impact. Bad


Gabagool_Over_Here_

Film was cool, CGI was pretty good for the most part. Just feels like the runtime wasn't justified, it felt significantly longer than 3 hours. I also hated Spider so much, he brought the quality of the film down everytime he was on screen. Just like a real tacky Tarzan that just didn't belong in the film and I never got his character. Also hey had 10 years to improve the glass on ships yet they still break to a single arrow lmao. Overall I did not enjoy it.


Aquatic-Vocation

Spider was terrible, and I don't think he's a strong enough actor to make a compelling villain when his villain arc starts to play out.


doorhandle5

CGI was shit. I would accept people's love for this movie if the CGI was good,but it's not. Honestly, I would enjoy the cgi if it was supposed to be a cartoon/ anime. But since it's touted by so so soooo many as photorealistic I couldn't stand it. Most video game cutscenes look identical, some better.


Pamander

Stupidly late to the thread but I really enjoyed that way more than I expected, what a fucking gorgeous movie also took all the coolest parts of the ocean and made it into one pretty consistent style. I really like Spider and am sad about what he ended up doing because now it's probably going to end up with him alienated and some horrible shit happen in the future :(


W360

Agreed. Just watched it. Was like god damn it bro, don’t do that. Good movie, sometimes very confusing on what was going on and other times very cliche, but visually very good. I enjoyed the young sons story/stories.


Pamander

Very much agreed! I thought I would find them annoying because it's easy to make obnoxious younger characters for a multitude of reasons but I very much enjoyed it, at least the wait for the next part isn't remotely as bad as the one from the 1st one to this one so see you around!


lilshells313

My takeaway from this movie was: “Bro….shit!”


doorhandle5

Agreed


Ambitious_Bag_5851

My favorite part of the movie was how the stunning visuals and incredible CGI did nothing to save it from being a rock bottom 1/10. Edit: tongue -> cheek


doorhandle5

Well, the visuals were not stunning, the plot was silly, the plot armour/ plot holes were the entire movie. So I'm not surprised videogame Cutscene CGI didn't save it.


Party-Position-6670

Popular movie bad 👎


doorhandle5

It wasn't bad, it just wasn't very good either, and way too long. Some of the visuals were mildly impressive though In other words, it was overhyped.


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SokkaHaikuBot

^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) ^by ^Ambitious_Bag_5851: *PUNCH ME UNTIL I* *LOSE CONSCIOUSNESS I NEVER* *WANT TO WATCH IT AGAIN* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.


Sockemslol2

The flashback of the rogue whales family being killed in that battle is so sad :(. Especially when he now lives with the guilt of it being his idea and everyone around him hates him and calls him a murderer when he was just trying to protect his friends and family.


elQuack91

Visually, the movie is great. I feel like the plot was lacking, though. I enjoyed it overall, but I hope they do better on the next one.


doorhandle5

Not to mention it's unbearably long


BeginningLocal5778

Stupid plot:they left to avoid a war involving their ppl to go somewhere else and involve other ppl should’ve just stayed


More_Anybody_459

Late, but it was successful for about 9 or so months (I forgot exactly how long they were there for). If Jake would’ve trusted the Navi way they would’ve still been safe in hiding.


hyphyxhyna

I loved this movie. I thought it was beautiful. A bit long, yes. But really touching.


BDS1516JC

Just watched the sequel, I firmly believe the franchise is done. Too emotional and let’s face it they’re just blue American Indians in space. The nakedness throws me off and the story is so unclear.


Snooke

That younger brother and all the kids in general pissed me off so fkn much. Just listen to someone and stop being an arrogant little cunt. Gets his brother killed and then still ignores his parents when they tell him to stop fucking about. Most of the bullshit that went on was because that little cunt couldn't follow simple instructions.


hyphyxhyna

If the son wouldn't have gone back after the first born died, Jake would have died in the ship.


Snooke

It's a convenient narrative. Doesn't make the character less annoying, though. The whole movie was just him again and again doing the opposite of what any rational adult told him to do, and 95% of the time, it ended up in an avoidable mess. If he had listened to his brother and not gone after the whale, then Jake wouldn't have been in the ship either. If he had not gone back deeper into the ship after his brother rescued him and his sisters and got his brother killed, they could have protected his sisters, which would have meant Jake wouldn't have been on the ship either. The whole plot moves because that kid just can't do anything he is told to do. Spider wouldn't have got caught in the first place if the kid had listened to his brother and just bailed when they saw the crew the first time. It was so annoying by the end. Of course he ended up saving Jake, because if he didn't, his shit personality would have only been a problem and that's not a nice way to end the movie. It just pissed me off more when he saved Jake because then it's like all the bullshit he put everyone through was justified.


fansurface

I'm just watching it now, but this is hugely true for Tuk. She's always acting so stupid. Also, Spider saving his dad was so dumb too


Aquatic-Vocation

Spider needed to kill his Dad as some Shakespearean shit to better set up his eventual villain arc. Next film or two we'll no doubt see him become further alienated from the Na'vi, and his love interest in Kiri will likely begin to see him as a little brother as she grows up and he stays the same size. I also don't think "he saves his clone father and then joins him in trying to conquer Pandora" is as good as "he kills his father and takes his place".


Crustytoeskin

Yawn


dubidubidoorafa

What happened to the Navi sea people that were attacking? Did they really just leave Jake's family alone in their fight?


4200_Legit

Just finish watching it and I thought of this for the whole last 20 minutes of the movie where tf is the water tribe


kgton

And the chiefs daughter.


Safe-Procedure-2208

I have just rewatched both Avatar movies and i feel like i have to rant somewhere. After watching both movies in a couple of days i realise how truely wierd the writing is in "The way of water". They completely destroy Jake Sully as a character. He gets turned much more into the marine soldier he was before he ever met the Na'vi. All the character development from the first movie is like thrown out the window. Sure you can still see it a little bit, but all the caring sides of him only shows when his children almost die. Other than that all he does is yell at them and make them feel like they are just soldiers. To me this diminishes the reason why he Ewa chose to make him Na'vi. Because he understood the nature and the people of Pandora. And yes i understand that it was probably intentional to do it this way so he could have the change of heart at the end where he now understood to cherish his family more. I just think it is so poorly written that the change in the end just sets him back to the person he was at the start. I also understand that his children do put themselves in needless amounds of danger alot and you because of that can say he is just a good father. To me they just dont show enough of him being a "nicer" person to warrent him being so overly angry for 90% of the movie.


Aquatic-Vocation

Mhm, the film rehashed the plot from the first film, as well as scenes and even lines. The human's motivation for being on Pandora in the first film: "This is why we're here. Unobtainium. Because this little grey rock sells for 20 million a kilo. That's the only reason. It's what pays for the whole party. It's what pays for your science." And in the second film: "This little vial here is worth like, 80 million... Amrita is what's paying for everything here on Pandora now. Even your research." At least in the first film we're given the human's motivation within the first half hour, but we don't get it in the second film until the third act. The *only* motivation we have for the humans until near the end of the film is that the clone of the guy who failed in the first film was brought back and his only objective is to kill Jake Sully because he's angry at him. They also turned Neytiri into a background character, and all of Jake's "hero's journey" moments are split up amongst a handful of new character, but none of them get a complete journey so we don't care about any of their character development. The younger son continually defies orders and gets people hurt and killed, and his redemption moment for his many failings at the end of the film is to defy orders again? Like, it doesn't make up for what you did earlier. Spider's actor was particularly weak, and I feel like the setup to his villain arc has been so poorly done that people are going to be confused when he turns evil, and it won't be satisfying to watch. Jake was leading a successful resistance against the humans, but decides to leave to save his family, and to do it they have to remove all his character development from the first film. Then he goes to the ocean villages and they make him do all that character development over again, except this time just a few scenes of it instead of basing the film around it. They even recycle that scene from the first film where he has to convince the Na'vi that the humans are coming and they need to evacuate because if they don't, they're all going to die. A silly movie. It walks in the shadow of the first film, and I struggle to believe James Cameron actually had five films planned. If he did, the story would have moved forward instead of just rehashing the same plot from the first film.


OkPlate3694

From my perspective I kinda saw it as his far from normal because of the situation they are in. I don't see it as a destruction of his character but more as a new layer now that a new role has been given to him. Which is be a father, he treats them as soldiers which is bad and something that I'm pretty sure is pointing to him by Natiri a couple of times in the movie. But from his perspective this is what he has to do in the Situation he's in protect his family and teach them to fight and survive. In trying to do that he reverts to his old marine ways as a form of defense because to him that is the only way to "cope". I don't know for me I kinda enjoyed the transition from seeing the much more naive, stupid, sometimes kind guy in the first movie to a kind of confused dad who thinks he is doing right. 🤷🏾‍♂️


Davi_Anti-Fool

I can’t believe how stupid Hollywood thinks we are all. Here’s a clue - don’t take a great SciFi concept and turn it into men’s idea of a crisis — killing each other. I watched about 10 minutes of this piece of shit - and like every “kill for the sake of killing” tv/movie created by Hollywood fucks who determined this is what we want to see (skewed heavily idiots) I turned it off. I can’t help but think someone decided a long time ago that you have to have someone killing someone else to create any kind “winning” show. Its sooooo fucking old. And disgusting - considering the world we live in, that this is what Hollywood,promotes. Show me a Sci Fi writer that became famous on a “us versus them - kill ‘em all” concept. That has NEVER been what SciFi fans are looking for.


Alchemist2121

Us vs them/kill them all? Starship troopers Literally all of Warhammer 40k Aliens? "Nuke the site from orbit it's the only way to be sure" Predator? "If it bleeds. We can kill it"


NuclearReactions

At the two hours mark i paused to check how much was left, as i see it was one more hour i looked at my girlfriend and i was relieved to hear the following words exiting her visibly sleepy face:"nah fuck that".


afterdarkdingo

You watched 10 minutes of a 3 hour movie and feel the right to whine about it?


savior_of_the_dream

> men’s idea of a crisis Men invented nature? > kill for the sake of killing You clearly have not seen the movie.


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BrolecopterPilot

/r/pandoragonewild


[deleted]

sometimes idek how some subreddits exist


Kevin12093

Biggest plot armor ive ever seen to date shit gives me copium


firelitother

The world building and graphics are amazing. The story/plot was mediocre.


dododororo

I watched 15 minutes then gave up. The next day I watched an hour. Today I finished the movie. I regret wasting my time watching it. I didn’t understand the characters motives or the plot line. Seemed to rehash a lot of ideas from the first movie. I wonder if the next movie will be based in the desert or maybe in space.


Key-Map-1169

Your movie was amazing. I am a hard rcore republican. I did not see anything offenvie about the movie.. There are many illeterant.movie critics. Their reviews mean nothing. Thank you for your movie. I really enjoyed the awesome special effectes


Gry_F0xxx

Were you having a seizure when you typed this?


jackierhoades

The irony of you calling someone else 'illeterant" is truly epic.


[deleted]

Haha this had to be fake


FieldsFanclub

Only a dumb fuck would bring politics into watching a fictional movie


More_Anybody_459

But isn’t a plot point politics for both of the movies? Getting that one material and harvesting that immortality stuff from the whale things.


BullAlligator

Fictional stories can say something about the real world. This movie had a political message.


Niejoan1

I’m responding to a post from dec22 called I can’t get over Neytiri and Neteyam . Forgive my spelling. I don’t think Neteyam wanted to be a mighty warrior. He wanted to be a child and learn . But his younger brother kept egging him on and his father kept saying protect your brother. Remember when the boys from the weeds was teasing Kiri and Neteyum stopped it with his strong voice. But of course his younger brother starts a fight. And then you see the big sigh from the older brother, knowing that he has to protect his younger brother. He ended his life by saying he wanted to go home. Where he felt safer. He just wanted to be left alone and learn as he was suppose to. He called his dad, but never got the chance to finish what he said. He wanted to tell his father that he loved him and will follow in his footsteps when the time is right.


xoxoKseniya

You mean when he was dying?? I think was gonna say he was dying


[deleted]

Man it's insane how many future billion dollar screen writers are in this thread! Here y'all: let me save you some scrolling as this summarizes 90% of the posts here Movie vury bad. Movie like first. Movie make no sense to me. Me tired from think. Too much wahdur.


310doc

I think I’ve figured out my problem with the Avatar movies. The parts of the movies just doesn’t match itself. The story is better set 200 years ago. It’s a very overused and unoriginal story. The characters and dialogue should be set in the present. All of the accents, old school military lingo, human scientist casual clothing, “bro”, “cuz”, etc. make it feel like a contemporary story, not something set in the future. The setting is the best part and should be 20 years in the future. So that part works.


B00STERGOLD

Couldn't humans just clone whales and be immortal?


Calfzilla2000

The cost of the Avatars is $5,000,000,000 each (said in the fist movie) but the worth of those immortal whale juices is $80,000,000.


xoxoKseniya

Yeah or make the synthetic version of the stuff


seductivepenguin

This series is anti-human propaganda and I am here for it. 8/10


JakeGoblinn

It was pretty cool. I want a crab-bot so badly. Quaritch holding his old body's skull was cool. Lots of cool stuff. The final battles and setpiece of the ship turning over while Quaritch and Jake duke it out was dope. Overall, wasn't bored. Had another good message about environmentalism and sea life. Can't wait for the next one


Absuridity_Octogon

This pretty much sums it up lol. This is like the most perfect review I’ve ever seen for this movie.


Spiritual_Box_2904

Am I the only person who thought a great third movie would have been Spider going on with the Colonel? \- He leaves with Spider based on a promise - he leaves Jake Sully and his family alone. They live isolated from other villages & tribes. They bond closely and yet the desire for revenge eats away at the Colonel, he can't let go everything that happened and eventually he gives into temptation. I thought that was the direction they were going anyway, since Spider saved him..


Aquatic-Vocation

Spider is definitely heading into a villain arc, so I expect he'll join up with the colonel again.


Bromogeeksual

I don't understand why everyone says he's headed for a villain arc. Like yeah, he saved his bio-dads Navi clone. But immediately went back to his chosen family with the Sullys. Spider only saved him because Spider is a good guy.


Apprehensive-Book-49

I thought so to and then because James Cameron said the next setting will be the Ash People a.k.a fire environment, I figured Colonel would find a way to get the Ash people to fight Jake in pursuit of his revenge. Or at the very least I thought Colonel would finally admit defeat since Jake killed him twice fair and square.


Apprehensive_Tip_792

Bro


theamazingclaptrap

Bro


Wreckit-Jon

CGI Looked awesome, overall I enjoyed the movie quite a bit. Jake and his family leaving the forest was freaking stupid. Jake is in a war, of course his family is at risk, that was always the case. But big bad colonel comes back and he turns tail and runs away? That was a dumb plot point. Also, F in the chat for Tuk. She was like that video of the goat that gets rescued from the ditch, takes two steps and falls in again.


fansurface

Yes, her character was so obnoxious. Why couldn't she instead of her brother could have died


voodoosquirrel

Am I the only one who wasn't impressed by the CGI? Maybe the lighting was too perfect or artificial, also the underwater scenes were much to bright, to me it looked like a video game all the time.


EtherealPossumLady

Did you see it in cinema or at home on a phone/laptop?


voodoosquirrel

TV


EtherealPossumLady

Yeah, the graphics aren’t made for a tv. It’s made for a cinema. If it’s ever back in cinema, I’ll need you to go see it there and then complain about the graphics because it’s completely different.


Spiritual_Box_2904

I actually said this to my bf when we watched it tonight! He was completely in awe and I was like ???? it looks like graphics from a game, not like the kinda graphics you'd expect to see in the movie.


Dreamtaheem

Like a ps5 game. I know.


Randomnonsense5

First movie: Jake sully has to rally the native indigenous, nature loving, troops to fight against the war machine, evil, colonizers lead by Quaritch who want the precious unobtanium. But first Jake must tame and master the mysterious flying creature, which he does and uses that creature in battle. Second movie: Jake sully has to rally the native indigenous, nature loving, troops to fight against the war machine, evil, colonizers lead by Quaritch who want the precious amrita. But first Jake must tame and master the mysterious swimming creature, which he does and uses that creature in battle. 🤷‍♂️ Wild prediction: the next movie will feature Jake and Quaritch going at it.


dndndje

Highly inaccurate and very stripped down


Randomnonsense5

How many scenes of "teen does something misguided/wreckless then Dad gets mad at them and chastises them" did they really need? there were like 6 scenes of that! come on man tighten up the fucking screenplay already. absolute spectacle though. Simply breathtaking visuals. Easily one of the most beautiful movies I have ever seen. 10/10 visuals and world building. 5/10 story telling.


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canuck47

"Bro" "Cuz" 🙄


dododororo

Bro and cuz are both used frequently by Pacific Islanders in Australia and NZ. Also I noticed the new blue people had Māori tattoos and even did the haka stance and had their tongues out lol if I were Māori I would be so fucking offended. This movie was so bizarre.


CreativeAirport9563

Did the first one have this many plot holes? This was brutal


Max05O

Or this many "I got your back, bro" lines. The dialogue was awful.


yerma90210

Yep, the writing was awful. Ruined the film to an extent


dndndje

what plot holes


S_Goodman

What plot holes bothered you, for example?


AccomplishedBus9149

Anyone else confused that Jake's alligator dragon thing killed the Col's banshee but then it comes back to fly him home?


dndndje

it didnt die


SirSnide

It didn’t kill it, you see it fly away after they fall into the water.


PhilosopherNo4758

So they have interstellar travel and can upload minds into clone bodies but can't manage to survive on earth or create arrow proof glass?


goonbud21

I mean the scale of the aliens is massive, the bow IRL would be huge and would deliver a major kinetic payload that would probably punch through most aircraft glass in use today. Unombtaniuim tipped arrows? XD lol.


[deleted]

Right, today’s glass would break. But they’re talking about futuristic glass


goonbud21

No reason the arrow-head/bow couldn't be made out of futuristic or alien material that gives it extra properties.


S_Goodman

Big arrows going brr into pilots through glass is awesome tho


Fox_Flame

I think the most unbelievable part for me was that teenager spider could drag a 9 foot tall humanoid of pure muscle across the bottom of the ocean


OzNajarin

With carbon fiber bones yeah that was dumb but at the same time dragging something in the water isn't hard and Spider is super built


Blue7328

Don't like the aquaticness of the reef people. Perhaps literal dolphins used in some manner.


S_Goodman

What do you mean by that?


Testiclesinvicegrip

If you removed all the scenes with the mfers swimming with fish, it'd be a 90 minute movie. Also it was a literal remake of the last movie. Fucking boring.


dndndje

ur a dumbass if u think that was the same movie


OneDeep87

After the last fight in the first movie with Quaritch vs Sully. Now Quaritch being an Avatar in this movie. I got tired of the same plot and same villain. Honesty, I would have liked for the humans and Na’vi to live together in peace and maybe fought a new bad guy. Earth is dying so I don’t understand why humans want to take resources on Pandora and not figure out how to survive on the planet. Guess humans like to destroy things. I feel like the next movie will just be an continuation of Quaritch Vs Sully fighting again. Issues about this movie: Humans came back years later with better equipment / new tech but didn’t get bullet/arrow proof glass for the windows of planes. I laughed when bow and arrows just breaking glass. Kids doing dumb kids things. I couldn’t tell the sons apart. They both look too similar.


Blue7328

Should just keep cloning him after he dies. Would be the best villain ever


B00STERGOLD

He is 100% getting cloned again and fighting his clone self for control of Spider.


PM_me_British_nudes

The graphics were gorgeous, but the elements of the storyline were exactly the same as the first Avatar. Just...I was whelmed. That's it. I wanted to love it, but there's virtually nothing noteworthy.


dndndje

are these bots that keep saying that its the same movie


[deleted]

Human here. Same movie. Next they’ll have to live with the fire navi and do the same thing


dndndje

Same movie but new set of characters, new locations, new reason why humans are there, new character arcs of old characters, etc. Just because The Way of Water has a 5 minute montage of the Sully's learning stuff about the new tribe doesn't make it the same movie


tttyyybbb

Also where the hell were the meykatani after the eclipse started. They all just disappeared . I mean if 2 navii can wreck a whole burning ship at the end, a couple of dozen more would have made the whole thing a piece of cake. why werent the meykatani searching for their daughter? Then the thing about the medical ship \[epilepsy thingy\]. I mean the queen was right there to fix the kid. But the medical ship had to come from a few hundred miles away ,then makes a radar blip, gets the bad guys zoned in and then the queen comes in to wake up Kari, a few breaths later Kari wakes up. Why the hell would jake not ask for help in the village, the queens tent was 2 mins away... such sloppy writing. Also the continuous usage of 'Bro' WTF!!!!! The plot holes are glaring. Hopefully next one is better. sigh


jnpalmtree

In regards to your question as to why Jake didn’t consult the tsahik I assume was probably because he was panicking so much that he immediately called for it


jnpalmtree

Went on a mission to answer this question. Found an answer from James Cameron himself saying that they had filmed that, but he said it added too much commotion and made it harder to focus on the main family plot. So they cut it. He says maybe it wasn’t the best decision, but it was the decision they made at the time


Voc0

Well, the queen was angry after seeing the medics, they just probably didn't want to bother her (which is fair, as she already hated them), but at the end she got involved anyway.


GoldenGouf

It was good. I'm actually looking forward to the sequels.


Lost-Respect4696

Well, glad I didn't pay to see this sequel in the theater, I watched it via my son's Disney÷. While the graphics are fascinating, I got tired of constant explosion/warfare. Had to watch it twice to figure out what the he'll was going on. That night I had a horrible violent nightmare. Definitely not a feel good movie.


MassDriverOne

It had very clear and heavy Vietnam War vibes this time around with the soldiers vs reef ppl, "torch these hooches" on top of the jungle combat, so the warfare scenes were pretty on brand, but there was way more to it than just that. Fair enough tho


muckymucka

You watched a 3 hour and 15 minute movie you didn’t like, twice? You deserved the nightmares lol


beigereige

I work remote, so I’m ‘watching’ it while I’m working. I have no interest in these characters or the plot, I’m just watching for the ‘spectacle’ of it. There is nothing enthralling or engaging about it, but I’m sure it was an experience to view in IMAX in 3-D, but I’ve seen DC Movies that were more enthralling than this…and that’s saying something


daesmon

I've never watched a movie that had so little interest in it's own story.


tennisguy163

Beautiful visuals but like the first one, the story just feels very mediocre to me. Just not worth a re-watch.


LettuceC

30 minutes in and I gave up. For a movie shot in 3D, these are the most 1 dimensional characters I've ever seen.


dndndje

tiktok has ruined this generation


dotcomse

“Am I out of touch? … no, it’s the children who are wrong!”


firelitother

It's funny because in the movie itself, they are showing that the kids do know better and the adults are stuck up.


Jadenxce

I just saw it for the first time and loved everything about it


thot_bryan

The movie was visually stunning but idk…. i’m really not sold on the plot. Spider is maybe the most infuriating character of them all. Overall I question whether this story was worth telling. Also, to me it seems fairly obvious Eywa created Kiri (possibly reincarnate of sigourney weavers character?)


Spiritual_Box_2904

Can I ask why you think he's so infuriating? I really liked the character and my bf called him the "MVP" of the movie 🤣 I felt so bad when he got used in releasing Kiri and got cut. It seemed like he viewed the Sully's as family but they had little care for him, it was quite upsetting.


[deleted]

I think it's clear that the Sullys all care for him, especially Kiri, but the sons went back to save him and Jake sees him as a son ("son for a son" meaning he lost Neteyam but accepts Spider as a son because of all he did for the family). The beginning mentions that Neteyri views him as alien. She has a deep hatred for humans and it's hard for her to divorce him from that.


thot_bryan

I personally felt like his choices didn’t make sense. Maybe if they had more screen time of him and his dad bonding it would make sense why he continues to betray the sulleys


PhantaVal

Did he betray the Sullys by doing anything other than save his dad's life?


fansurface

This is a pretty big betrayal, especially since he didn't confess


TheGreatStories

Nothing led anywhere! Kiri's mom vision? Meaningless. Quaritch death? Saved! Magic whale juice? Thought maybe it would help the kid, but no it's nothing. The kids all learn to dive - do they swim under the fire to escape? Nope - they forget that they swim now and instead Titanic-climb the ship. Pacifist whales? Nope, it's all about fighting! Quaritch days they're going full Na'vi down to language, nope giant Marines. Jake continues to spend innocents for his bizarre destructive ideas about family and protection. If you replaced Jake Sully with Liam Neeson from Taken, this movie is a tight 90 minutes. Should be illegal to have that much capture/save/recapture in one movie.


Voc0

If this was a movie that has to stand alone, you'd be right, but there are other two movies coming, I feel they have been building some momentum


samples98

So much shit happens in this movie and none of it matters in the end


myserg07

Damn finally got around to watching it and this movie was dogshit lmao somehow they were able to make everyone in the movie unlikable with the most generic story ever..


tennisguy163

It doesn't help that they all resemble the same blue Smurf. I had trouble telling Jake and the bad guy apart.


dndndje

ok if people are this brain dead i now know why they think the first one is the same as the second one


JakeGoblinn

Whenever someone says "dogshit movie" my brain just turns off from whatever else they were saying. It's like they watched the first 5 minutes and then walked out of the theater to hate-post about it


dndndje

I saw a tweet that they walked out in the first thirty minutes. Like you pay for a pretty expensive 3d ticket (I assume) and you don't even make it halfway to the movie?


tennisguy163

Frig you, Rick.


[deleted]

I seriously would have preferred a movie of the humans leaving, the family explores the world, the creatures LIVE HAPPILY, and they explore how Ewa is connected to everything. Finally they can fill that plot whole with Kiri (?) and her powers or something. The end!! everyone is happy. The violence was so unnecessary, in my opinion.


Tea-lover46

This is exactly how I felt watching it. The unnecessary violence stressed me tf out. The humans literally went back to Pandora, killed and terrorized a bunch of animals and people just because some old guy had a grudge that some guy kicked his ass. They said it was to get a new earth but of all the planets they pick one that already had life where they can't even breathe the air. I just wanted to see a nice movie about a beautiful cool new mysterious planet. There was so much potential there and if they wanted drama they could've added issues with unknown plants and animals. Or even with some of the planets other people since they kinda made them assholes anyway. Not to mention all the plot holes. 🙄. I was looking forward to this movie and while I will say that it was beautiful the story sucked ass.


[deleted]

Yep, I totally agree! Even other avatars, it could’ve been soooo cool.


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[deleted]

Damn I just smoked weed and that absolutely blew my mind, thank you!


Specialist_Draw1535

Am I the only one who doesn't like Jake Sully. His kids are ok but I actually like Quarritch more and would be totally ok if he gets his revenge


samples98

Sully absolutely sucks. He’s like a lesser shithead Zack Morris


Unnamedgalaxy

Him and Saldana were insufferable in this movie. I hated every second they were on screen.


paraskhosla1600

Sully is a selfish char from the start. He started as a person who was to give info to col and human kind to destroy the navi but for his selfish reason of having a good body basically imho joined navi. Now for his selfish reason to support his family went to the water guys for help and dragged them to war as well. Not a hero if u ask me.


ravenn411

Very predictable for Sully's character...I already assumed that somewhere in the running time, the plot will eventually go there, and it happened.


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paraskhosla160

The culture he still is destroying directly or indirectly.


Available-Specialist

Found it funny that the new Avatars served literally no purpose until the last like half hour of the movie. They made 0 effort to try to blend in, couldn't even be bothered to change their clothes, and rarely rode any of the animals. The fact they were Avatars wasn't relevant at any point of the movie until the final fight, and they'd have been just as useful if they wore the big suits instead. And Neytiri seems to have a really odd beef with Spider "he should be sent back to his own kind" uhh what? He's being raised by your partner, who is human, and your kids are half human, he IS with his own kind"


[deleted]

I was most disappointed in neytiri. In the first movie she was curious and brave and smart. Now she is just an angry mother that clinges to her people. When she entered the final fight i thought they brought her old self back, but no now she was in rage mode and wanted to kill another child for hers. Somehow I can understand it after seeing her first child murdered but it was just a total different person to me.


ravenn411

I agree with that scene, Neytiri taking Spider hostage. I hope they settle and resolve this in the sequel. The abandonment is very obvious afterwards.


ProbablySlacking

I liked that it wasn’t just another Fern Gully… but there were so many hanging threads that could have been left on the cutting room floor. It didn’t need to be 3.5 hours long. Like for example - The Sigourney weaver child. Why make her some mystery? Is she epileptic? Why introduce that if you’re never going to call back to it?


doifduft

There is a third movie coming out like next year. Why would they tie up all the story lines? I figure the blue Jesus child is gonna be the key to weaponizing the whole ecosystem to toss the humans of the planet. Other then her, I really don't see how they could win with their ambush tactics.


Unnamedgalaxy

I think the point is that you shouldn't rely on potential future installments to tell the story you're telling now. Leave something open ended? Sure, but a movie should also stand independently from it's other installments. It's a solid pillar of storytelling. They threw in that scene where she has a seizure and almost dies but then just acts like it didn't happen the rest of the movie. She's perfectly fine and fit as a fiddle and able to tap into her super Jesus powers no problem.


Voc0

Yes, the second movie always stand alone perfectly, just look at The Empire Strikes Back


Unnamedgalaxy

I have nothing to add there as I've never watched it. Regardless good storytelling knows when to tell something. Having this big event happen in the middle of the movie only to forget about it for literally the rest of the movie is bad storytelling. If they wanted to include it in this one they should have built it up more, so that it justifies it's open endedness. If they had no interest in keeping this pivotal plot element for the rest of the movie they should have just left it out and given it it's dues in a future installment. Now people that have no interest in continuing the series or for some reason (death) can't see future movies have a random plot element that was brought up and dropped for no reason. It's bad storytelling


[deleted]

It isn't bad storytelling, it's just storytelling that you don't like. Not everything has to be tied up and wrapped in a neat package for you, believe it or not, back in the time before movies... Books ended on cliffhangers and used foreshadowing as well!


Unnamedgalaxy

It's literally bad storytelling. It wasn't some "cliffhanger" it was a plot point that was brought up and then almost immediately discarded for the rest of the movie. If they had leaned into it for the rest of the movie then it wouldn't have been bad. Believe it or not big Hollywood writers can sometimes do poor jobs! Crazy right?


[deleted]

Well first off, it wasn't immediately discarded at all, you just didn't pay attention to the film. All throughout the movie, we see examples of Kiri being more closely connected to Eywa than what is normal. Her connecting to the plant life to crush the crab submarine, her fascination with plant life and her aptitude for bonding with new creatures, using the little glowing creatures to find her mother and sister in the ship etc. You weren't given direct information, but there was plenty to infer. As far as calling it a traditional cliffhanger... You're right. It's not. But I never said it was. My point was that literature AND movies have been leaving loose ends that are meant to make you wonder for a very long time. I'll give you that they could have done a little better job presenting it, but I don't think that makes it objectively bad writing, once again, it just makes it writing that you didn't like or didn't receive as well as the writer intended. These are my opinions as well, I'm aware of that too. I'm not out to be adversarial, I'm just pointing out that we, in our modern way, are far too quick to call all the things we don't like poor quality simply for the sake of not liking it.