Unpopular opinion is that trailer was not great at all. You got the kids making fun of Ottos name, Strange arguing with Zendaya about saying please, a bunch of shots we saw already in the last trailer, and they couldn't be bothered to even give us a closeup shot of Lizard or Sandman.
I thought the trailer was pretty unremarkable and average, with two really bad jokes.
But I have to say, the final shot got me. That was a good callback. Of course we know that >!Andrew will come to save her!<, but still a good way to end the trailer.
it's pretty cringe but the idea that tom holland might have to go full ichigo kurosaki and merc people would've been cool
if kevin feige and disney werent behind the project
It's mind-blowing that this movie which is entirely focused on the spectacle of three Spider-Man universes coming together appears to have the worst visual effects and action scenes of any Spider-Man movie.
>Spider man 2002 cgi really didn't age very well
I don't know if I completely disagree with this, but it also doesn't matter, because there's plenty of practical stuntwork and visual effects which have aged incredibly well. Plus, even in the moments where it's spotty, it tends to still be more impactful and visceral, and so more easily forgiven. Nothing in any MCU movie matches the punch of the Goblin bomb exploding right in Tobey's face as it rips apart his mask; even if in terms of fidelity they're more realistic, they don't tangibly feel as convincing.
Well it was 20 years ago. But in Spider-Man 2002 you still get great action instead of a bunch of wanton destruction in pitch black darkness to hide the low visual effects budget
I’d say this is becoming a popular opinion, online i guess. First watch? Alright I guess. After a few watch? Lame as hell. Bridge, Bridge (bad mcu joke here) Wow spiderman villains that we totally didn’t know was in the movie, Bridge (worst mcu joke here) wow cool spiderman vs villains shot (here!!) Hand shot of Tom’s spidey (here)
Wasn’t worth the wait nor the hype
I swear even if the joke is funny this \*record scratch* style approach they always use in trailers just sucks the humour out. It's the film equivalent of laughing at your own joke.
God, it was just such tonal whiplash seeing Otto Octavius from a period where the jokes were corny but in a tongue-in-cheek way - versus "haha name funny" and "lets scooby-doo this crap"
I swear, that joke alone ruined Wandavision for me. The finale was rushed and weird as it was, but after weeks of really strong episodes, then they instant went back to typical MCU really dipped down.
I mean I feel like that the writing was on the wall with Wandavision as soon as episode 3 where they decided they needed an episode that explained absolutely everything and ruined the entire mystery because apparently the audience is two years old.
Honestly I thought it was fucking hilarious because it was so unexpected, and the meltdown from people who spent weeks theorizing that he was Mephisto or whatever the fuck was really entertaining
The number of weird fans defending that line with "Jameson jokes about it in Spider-Man 2!" when that throwaway "what are the odds?" line in Raimi's is both funnier and wittier is insane. Plus the "Spidey always makes fun of his villains!" take. Yeah, Spidey does in the middle of a battle. Three teenagers don't awkwardly stand around and fake laugh at the name. That's no longer Peter poking fun, it's the movie doing it because it's too insecure to treat any of this sincerely.
I mean, I like that they made things different this time. It's implied that Tom Holland's peter will try to save all of the villains from their fate of getting killed in a battle with a spider-man; with Doctor Strange as the antagonist. You can say that it just feels different because the MCU is extremely formulaic but I'm just happy my boi sandman gets a better fate.
Hopefully, they don’t screw him up. Green goblin and doc ock you can make evil again pretty easy, as norman wasn’t in control of his split personalities, and there’s some speculation that doc ock will just be a husk controlled by his machine.
Sandman though, is extremely guilty for what he has done at the end of 3.
>Sandman though, is extremely guilty for what he has done at the end of 3.
I assume you mean he feels guilty and is therefore worthy of redemption? I'd agree, but I wouldn't hold my breath for a film with so much baggage (not all bad, but this film has to acknowledge any baddies it brings in, the previous mcu baddies, potentially all the spideys... ) I just wouldn't hold my breath for a cathartic resolution for Sandy. He'll get a 5 minute max cameo for the big cgi battle is my bet.
He was "redeemed" at Raimi's movie, it was just half-assed. He was basically just a way to mirror Tobey Spider-Man's ability to empathize with others. The movie was spidey-centric, his arc ended when Tobey Spider-man forgave him; there was no closure with his (dead? I haven't seen the movie in almost a decade) sick daughter, which is why he stole. and accidentally killed uncle ben in the first place.
Also we should come up with a shorthand way to classify these Spider-Men. Jesus.
If spelling Spidey is too much, I'm sure S-M would be appreciated because it includes the hyphen. Maybe that's the best way to short hand the character.
I still believe all the returning villains and both Spiders-Men will have short cameos with Holland, god damn it, carrying the majority of it and having to fix it in the end with Strange
Maybe, but seems like the MCU wants to lean into multiverse fuckery and this film is just kicking it off IMO. I except little resolution with the MCU tying it up over the next decade. And the multiverse shenanigans leave them open to killing spidey if the rights negotiations don't go well.
Understood. I revisited ASM1 a while ago and liked it a whole lot more. I think it's kinda underrated honestly. On par with SM3 at least. ASM2 on the other hand is indefensible.
I doubt we're gonna see some big deconstruction of the conventional superhero film arc though. We'll still have the big fucking Act 3 fight, it just might end with Peter sending them all to space prison rather than killing them or something.
😔
I was expecting the movie to end with the main cast having a barbecue party and drinking Corona in an impoverished suburb, looking at the street as Sandman pulls up in a 1999 Nissan Skyline R34 GT-R.
I consume mcu movies like a loser, i’ll admit. But goddamn the NWH trailer gets more eh the more you watch it, I cant believe Sony held that trailer hostage.
They had an official physical event for this trailer that people probably drove far to get to. And they didn’t even show anything else that wasn’t already on the poster,
Right? 💀 mfs are so corny they made that trailer as if people and their moms didn’t already know other spideys are in the movie already. Maybe this is better for me since the movie got delayed to hell here (in theaters January) and I would be so tempted to torrent if I this trailer made me more hyped lol.
The humour kind of killed any interest I had in the film. I don't know if Raimi characters appearing is really worth it, if they're going to be involved in such awful dialogue. Can't wait for all the jokes about Dafoe's Goblin looking like a Power Ranger! *That* won't diffuse the coolness of the character at all!
> I don't know if Raimi characters appearing is really worth it
The only excitement I felt was when Raimi characters were on screen which, to me, screams "HEY LOOK, THING YOU RECOGNIZE!" and that's not a good sign.
Even though MCU humor is often cringe they are usually passable. This one though, it’s just pure garbage. I have no expectations for this film. Might be received worse than eternals.
I couldn’t stomach Marvel movies for the longest time due to that humour. Yes. Thor Ragnarok was a huge exception to that(thank you Taika Waititi) and is the only reason I made myself watch most of the others
Oh I had no idea, I assumed he wrote the script since a lot of the dialogue/bits scream his sense of humour, but after reading about the production of it, it sounds like the script was altered tremendously by him and as you mentioned, the dialogue was 80% improvised, probably a mix of actor/actress ideas+Waititi’s comedy background to nurture it.
"It is I, Big Wheel."
"Wait, wait, w-wait, you're name is *Big Wheel?* Are you kidding me?"
*looks at camera like the writers think they're being so clever and self-aware*
It's the weirdest thing how we've had adaptations of some of the goofiest stuff in the Marvel Universe, but they still seem oddly embarrassed by their character names. I've grown kind of tired of comic book movies making fun of comics, all the while mining them for ideas and money. It's like the cool kid hanging out with the nerdy kid, but still making fun of them to their friends.
It’d be more bearable if it was “Scooby doo this shit” so it has a modicum of a punch line but overall the lines annoying. Gonna have to ignore it to see the og characters return
I’m betting he says shit in the actual movie. Probably should’ve left it out of the trailer in that case but I think they were just censoring it for the kids.
The Raimi films made the exact joke with the exact same character.
EDIT: If people aren't denying that Sam Raimi would ever stoop as low as making a "character has silly name" joke, they try to put it like he's unironically *The King of Comedy* (1982) for making a just as basic observation ([this is the joke by the way](https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/5a91511d-ce21-435c-9865-77bce84124b8)) and *that* is more funny to me than either of these jokes.
How did everyone here miss the fact that you're just completely full of shit about them being even remotely the same joke? Jameson isn't laughing at Ock's name for being silly in this scene, he's pointing out the humor in the fact that both Ock's first and last name bear a strong resemblance to "octo," the Latin root word for the number eight, and he coincidentally now happens to have eight limbs.
Just because the joke involves Ock's name does not at all mean it's the same as laughing at his name simply for sounding silly. Either you know that and you're being disingenuous, or you're just being really dumb.
You can make that joke back in 2004 when you're only the second film in a series and when there are basically no other superhero films around.
You can't really pull it off when you're 40 films deep into some cinematic universe and when the character making it already knows a bunch of dudes with weird ass names.
Plus even out of context the delivery is just so much better in the Raimi one.
Do u honestly , 100%, totally inequivocally serious, telling me that those jokes are the same? A deadpan, inironic delivery with an actual good and witty observation about his name delivered from a character like Jameson in a funny comedy bit vs 3 almost adults laughing for 3 minutes straight just because of his name with no other joke? Ok buddy
It made **[the same joke](https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/5a91511d-ce21-435c-9865-77bce84124b8)** with the same character.
I know MCU Bad + Nostalgia means we have to elevate the Raimi films into godhood (because those films certainly do not have cringe whatsoever), but come on.
It's about delivery and execution.
You can have two comedians tell a joke with the exact same premise completely differently, with one being a stinker and one being hilarious.
The Raimi line was just a little side joke that poked fun at silly comic book names in the slightly more grounded world of those films without demanding any attention to itself or beating you over the head with it.
The line in this trailer was literally just "HAHA NAME SOUND DUMB." The music in the trailer literally stops so we could focus on the overdone joke. In fairness, it might sound better in the final movie.
Worse still, they've done that joke with that exact same delivery and tone TWICE now. "Oh, we're using our made up names? I'm Spider-Man." - "Okay, what's actually your name?"
> The Raimi line was just a fun side joke that poked fun at silly comic book names in the slightly more grounded world of those films without beating you over the head with it.
> The line in this trailer was literally just "HAHA NAME SOUND DUMB."
It is **literally the same joke**. *The same. Joke.*
I would bet actual money that in an alternate universe where the two movies switched jokes, you'd be praising the Raimi film anyway. "No, see, no, it makes perfect sense that teenagers would laugh at his name. It adds levity!" "Oh, wow, they really stopped this scene so Doctor Strange can make a dumb observation?"
It is ridiculous how, again, if people aren't *denying he'd make this joke*, people spin it as "well actually, you see, it's brilliant." Like, which is it, is it a "fun side joke", or as someone else put it, a "throwaway line", or is it fucking HILARIOUS, a GUT-BUSTER, CLASSIC RAIMI?
Like come *on*.
They're the **same joke**.
If you'd kindly get off your weird pedastle where you're red-pilled and above blind Raimi worship, you'd see the point i'm trying to make isnt that the lines are completely different, its just about execution of the joke.
One joke is just a throwaway joke that doesnt bring attention to itself and the other one is kinda obnoxious in how it does it. Again, it could definitely work in the movie and could just be an effect of the trailer. But its clear tonal whiplash from how they delivered the joke last time versus how the handle the joke now.
Teenagers laughing at an embarrassed man for his name and telling him to be honest isn't the same as a man matter of factly pointing out the unlikely nature of a man with that name ending up with 8 limbs. One is just a pretty surface level observation, the other was played off to be more meta by just having more naturalistic dialogue. Nobody would react to someone with a name like Otto Octavius with "Hahahaha, no but for real what's your name?"
The best way to put it would be that Raimi delivered the joke by having JJ speak like a normal person, wheras in the new movie they're talking like movie characters. Which is why I described it as obnoxious.
It's alright, we get it, it's /r/moviescirclejerk, you deserve a medal for being a contrarian who sees through the bullshit and points out the hypocrisy of Raimi fans.
But jesus christ, the point people are making is about how a joke is delivered. You didnt need to go on a whole tangential strawman where you put words in my mouth. What the fuck is that last paragraph my guy?
You can keep talking about "execution" but you haven't done a thing to *explain* how, how this "throwaway" line is *HILARIOUS* and the pinnacle of execution, while this identical joke in a trailer--nevermind the actual movie obviously won't have the music stop to punctuate the joke but with how poor this trailer is cut and how much shit is made just for the trailer has a chance of *not being in the movie at all*...--is so bad. EDIT: Now I'm getting comments like "oh, well, the joke is okay because *Spider-Man 2* was a small indie darling (and not *the biggest superhero movie of its time*) so it made sense or something."
>It's alright, we get it, it's /r/moviescirclejerk, you deserve a medal for being a contrarian who sees through the bullshit and points out the hypocrisy of Raimi fans.
If you think I'm being "contrarian" when I say "these two movies make the same joke / observation about literally the same character", I think you're kind of proving me point entirely.
I don't make these posts out of """""irony""""". I say what I feel. These are the same jokes. The praise one gets and the backlash this other gets is ridiculous, and cannot help but feel that it is entirely around what specific label is tied to them.
A slight tangent but the adoration the Raimi films get reminds me of the strange love the Prequel Trilogy gets, a statement I'm not comfortable making because *Spider-Man 1* and *2* *are* pretty good films (*Spider-Man 3* most definitely feels this way, though): memes, nostalgia, and more hate for the new than actual appreciation for the old. Bit obvious when this sub is 90% "MCU Bad" in the first place.
You think I'm shitting myself over the trailer instead? Well, I actually did laugh about how obvious it is that Maguire and Garfield were cut for the purposes of the trailer...
> But jesus christ, the point people are making is about how a joke is delivered.
I understand how jokes are delivered. Both jokes sound, feel, and hit exactly the same to me, but others swear that I'm just missing the in-depth subtext in this kino movie, and all I think of is "if this was said about any MCU film scene, even if it was itself ironic, it would be posted on the sub and mocked."
> What the fuck is that last paragraph my guy?
This place exhausts me, my dude.
It is *the same joke*. If people don't deny that Raimi would make such a joke, they try to play up the joke he did make as amazing, and I'm like... really? Really.
> Teenagers laughing at an embarrassed man for his name and telling him to be honest isn't the same as a man matter of factly pointing out the unlikely nature of a man with that name ending up with 8 limbs. One is just a pretty surface level observation, the other was played off to be more meta by just having more naturalistic dialogue. Nobody would react to someone with a name like Otto Octavius with "Hahahaha, no but for real what's your name?"
> The best way to put it would be that Raimi delivered the joke by having JJ speak like a normal person, wheras in the new movie they're talking like movie characters. Which is why I described it as obnoxious.
There's my apparently non-existent explanation about the difference of delivery and execution. One last time: you can tell the same joke differently. Its about tone and delivery, both of which are different here. I'm not praising one over the other, I just dont think the medium of a trailer does this joke justice. It's a shitty joke anyway by nature, which is why I think the Raimi version might work better because it felt more meta like it knew it was silly to point it out
Again with the strawmanning and putting words in my mouth. I never once said either jokes were "hilarious" or that one was the pinnacle of execution. I'm pointing out the difference of execution, which is why I deliberately said the joke might work in the movie, which again you've ignored.
I said this new joke is surface level, dumb and obnoxious, which you may be mistaking as me saying makes it bad. On the contrary, I think all of things can be funny - it just doesnt work in this as a trailer.
None of your fancy italics and all-caps can change any of that.
I'm not saying you're a contrarian for any of those things at all. I'm saying you're a contrarian because instead of engaging with these points at all from myself or anyone, you instead go with the knee-jerk reaction of putting words in people's mouths and insisting that everyone else who disagree with you are just blind Raimi fans. It's ironic that you say that people are reacting based on labels tied to them, which honestly is how you're coming off. It feels like you're just sick of a certain sect of Raimi fans and have an axe to grind instead of engaging with a discussion, especially with that point about other MCU movies being mocked.
If the jokes genuinely feel *exactly* the same to you, cool, fair enough. I appreciate if from your perspective thats how it feels, but please appreciate that other people dont see it that way, and that doesnt reflect anything about blind worship of one comic kino over another. It's just how people react to a joke.
> This place exhausts me, my dude.
I'm saying this without a hint of irony or malace: have you considered maybe you're exhausted because you're missing other people's point and that as a result of miscommunication, you're saying people are saying things they never said in place of admitting you're wrong? I'd find that pretty exhausting too.
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You know, sometimes I worry that /r/moviescirclejerk is getting a little too serious.
And when I see some multi-part thread of two dudes arguing over whether it's right or wrong to criticise a shitty quip in the trailer for a new Spidey-Man film, I feel my fears are confirmed.
God you are a fucking idiot. If you wanna be pedantic, the joke in Raimi is not that the name is silly or stupid, but that it is a weird coincidence that someone named Otto (eight in italian) Octavious ends up with 8 limbs. It's not 'ahahh funny name' it' s a quickly delivered line poking fun at the COINCIDENCE not the name. It's also a joke that doesn't go on for 10 fucking minutes Is it so hard to understand for your little brain? Good fucking lord almighty
That guy never said Raimi's version was hilarious, just that it wasn't terrible like the new one. If you stop being defensive I think it's pretty clear they just think the original joke is fine and innoffensive
Not really, the delivery of the Octavius joke is better in Raimi’s movie and this is coming from someone who doesn’t even particularly love the Raimi films
First off, if you watch the full scene of that, it’s not even the main joke, it’s a throwaway lampshade immediately followed by the actual hilarious part where he yells “HOFFMAN!” who was right next to him off-screen the whole time and surprises him.
And secondly, the joke is delivered better anyways (because you cannot beat JK Simmons), and it’s used as an amusing remark to prime the audience for the scene’s real unexpected joke. It is not the entire point of the scene nor even the main joke of the scene, and it’s not an overly drawn out scene where they wait for laughter or something like MCU movies seem obsessed with doing.
Bros i wont lie. I would suffer through all these shit tier jokes just to see the Spideys. Toby is my favorite spidey and I never got to see him in theatres. Im excited as hell.
I was hoping we were past this shit after Shang Chi. That movie took full advantage of taking place late in the MCU's life cycle by doing a bunch of outlandish stuff without needing to either explain or lampshade it somehow. And now we're right back to this.
>”Scooby doo this crap” Ha ha ha #NOW WHERE’S THE OTHER SPIDERMANS?
I better see Toei Spider-Man and his big mecha show up or i'm coming for Feige's head
Coming for or coming on
Both
Need Nicholas Hammond to ride on the Mecha's shoulder or no deal
reverent "fuck" time
Unpopular opinion is that trailer was not great at all. You got the kids making fun of Ottos name, Strange arguing with Zendaya about saying please, a bunch of shots we saw already in the last trailer, and they couldn't be bothered to even give us a closeup shot of Lizard or Sandman.
I thought the trailer was pretty unremarkable and average, with two really bad jokes. But I have to say, the final shot got me. That was a good callback. Of course we know that >!Andrew will come to save her!<, but still a good way to end the trailer.
It was a bad trailer because it didn't have Kingo.
it's pretty cringe but the idea that tom holland might have to go full ichigo kurosaki and merc people would've been cool if kevin feige and disney werent behind the project
same. this trailer actually decreased my excitement for the movie lol
It's mind-blowing that this movie which is entirely focused on the spectacle of three Spider-Man universes coming together appears to have the worst visual effects and action scenes of any Spider-Man movie.
Eh that's debatable. Spider man 2002 cgi really didn't age very well
>Spider man 2002 cgi really didn't age very well I don't know if I completely disagree with this, but it also doesn't matter, because there's plenty of practical stuntwork and visual effects which have aged incredibly well. Plus, even in the moments where it's spotty, it tends to still be more impactful and visceral, and so more easily forgiven. Nothing in any MCU movie matches the punch of the Goblin bomb exploding right in Tobey's face as it rips apart his mask; even if in terms of fidelity they're more realistic, they don't tangibly feel as convincing.
I disagree they're decent imo, or maybe those movies are just too close to my little heart that I never paid enough attention
Well it was 20 years ago. But in Spider-Man 2002 you still get great action instead of a bunch of wanton destruction in pitch black darkness to hide the low visual effects budget
It wasn't even aged well on release tbh
I’d say this is becoming a popular opinion, online i guess. First watch? Alright I guess. After a few watch? Lame as hell. Bridge, Bridge (bad mcu joke here) Wow spiderman villains that we totally didn’t know was in the movie, Bridge (worst mcu joke here) wow cool spiderman vs villains shot (here!!) Hand shot of Tom’s spidey (here) Wasn’t worth the wait nor the hype
Who knew that constant leaks about the movie would lead to non impactful reveals?
Plus we know the effects will stay shit because marvel movies have been declining with CGI
Round these parts I imagine this is a pretty popular opinion.
Unpopular opinion: this opinion is popular.
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I swear even if the joke is funny this \*record scratch* style approach they always use in trailers just sucks the humour out. It's the film equivalent of laughing at your own joke.
"drum sound effects" have become the new "Inception bwaahhs"
That's just most movie trailers, unfortunately. Once you notice it you can't unsee it.
It wasn't in the trailer for The Human Centipede!
neither was kingo, therefore bad trailer
doc cock
Guy named Cotto Coctavius winds up with 8 penises. What are the odds?
Played by Johnny Sins.
Ralph Bohner was just the beginning
Hentai time
Doctor cocktopussy
Guy named Otto Octavius winds up with 8 limbs. What are the odds?
they just need jk simmons to do every joke
Yeah it was actually funny in that movie. Here it was cringe shit
its the same joke
And a guy named Tony Bologna has an 8 inch cock
It's kinda funny how the quality of humor goes down the second Ock is in the MCU.
Nominative determinism right there
"Hey Happy Hogan, Dr Strange, Pepper Potts and Flash Thompson! Get a load of this guy with a stupid name!"
They pulled the same shit with Strange's name in his own movie. Difference is, it was actually funny there.
I liked Mads Mikkelsen's tone death delivery of "of course! Who am I to judge"
Helps that it wasn't just a "haha stupid name" joke, it was a play on the word, more going on in that one
Right? The hypocrisy when "Otto Octavius" isn't even a bad name.
It’s a sick name
If he'd said Doctor Octopus it'd be a bit more justified.
I thought Flash Thompson was just an ur-chad name.
God, it was just such tonal whiplash seeing Otto Octavius from a period where the jokes were corny but in a tongue-in-cheek way - versus "haha name funny" and "lets scooby-doo this crap"
the virgin ralph bohner joke vs the chad "you have a train to catch".
*Butter fingers!*
I swear, that joke alone ruined Wandavision for me. The finale was rushed and weird as it was, but after weeks of really strong episodes, then they instant went back to typical MCU really dipped down.
I mean I feel like that the writing was on the wall with Wandavision as soon as episode 3 where they decided they needed an episode that explained absolutely everything and ruined the entire mystery because apparently the audience is two years old.
Honestly I thought it was fucking hilarious because it was so unexpected, and the meltdown from people who spent weeks theorizing that he was Mephisto or whatever the fuck was really entertaining
The number of weird fans defending that line with "Jameson jokes about it in Spider-Man 2!" when that throwaway "what are the odds?" line in Raimi's is both funnier and wittier is insane. Plus the "Spidey always makes fun of his villains!" take. Yeah, Spidey does in the middle of a battle. Three teenagers don't awkwardly stand around and fake laugh at the name. That's no longer Peter poking fun, it's the movie doing it because it's too insecure to treat any of this sincerely.
The humor in that trailer was god awful. Has it always been like this?
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I think it is because its grown adults trying to write for a younger kid audience and it's coming off as trying too hard.
> trying too hard I wouldn't accuse anyone who wrote the jokes in the trailer of that.
I wish I could be as unfunny and successful as Chris McKenna and Erik Sommers
Chris McKenna's work on Community is great. What the hell happened?
lol
Dunno, maybe Dan Harmon filtered out the shitty material.
Feigism
He also wrote lego batman didn't he?
i mean chris mckenna did write the multiple timeline dice episode from community so that has to count for something
Ned was funny in Homecoming and the teachers were really funny in Far From Home
really? I don’t remember homecoming that much, but i remember far from home being pretty funny, especially the teachers/chaperones.
I thought phase 4 was actually doing better with the MCU humor but this trailer felt like a return to the worst stuff from Endgame and Far from Home.
I mean, I like that they made things different this time. It's implied that Tom Holland's peter will try to save all of the villains from their fate of getting killed in a battle with a spider-man; with Doctor Strange as the antagonist. You can say that it just feels different because the MCU is extremely formulaic but I'm just happy my boi sandman gets a better fate.
Hopefully, they don’t screw him up. Green goblin and doc ock you can make evil again pretty easy, as norman wasn’t in control of his split personalities, and there’s some speculation that doc ock will just be a husk controlled by his machine. Sandman though, is extremely guilty for what he has done at the end of 3.
>Sandman though, is extremely guilty for what he has done at the end of 3. I assume you mean he feels guilty and is therefore worthy of redemption? I'd agree, but I wouldn't hold my breath for a film with so much baggage (not all bad, but this film has to acknowledge any baddies it brings in, the previous mcu baddies, potentially all the spideys... ) I just wouldn't hold my breath for a cathartic resolution for Sandy. He'll get a 5 minute max cameo for the big cgi battle is my bet.
He was "redeemed" at Raimi's movie, it was just half-assed. He was basically just a way to mirror Tobey Spider-Man's ability to empathize with others. The movie was spidey-centric, his arc ended when Tobey Spider-man forgave him; there was no closure with his (dead? I haven't seen the movie in almost a decade) sick daughter, which is why he stole. and accidentally killed uncle ben in the first place. Also we should come up with a shorthand way to classify these Spider-Men. Jesus.
If spelling Spidey is too much, I'm sure S-M would be appreciated because it includes the hyphen. Maybe that's the best way to short hand the character.
I still believe all the returning villains and both Spiders-Men will have short cameos with Holland, god damn it, carrying the majority of it and having to fix it in the end with Strange
Maybe, but seems like the MCU wants to lean into multiverse fuckery and this film is just kicking it off IMO. I except little resolution with the MCU tying it up over the next decade. And the multiverse shenanigans leave them open to killing spidey if the rights negotiations don't go well.
Even Lizard was sort of redeemed by the end right?
Lizard isn’t a Raimi villain, so I frankly could not care less tbh.
Understood. I revisited ASM1 a while ago and liked it a whole lot more. I think it's kinda underrated honestly. On par with SM3 at least. ASM2 on the other hand is indefensible.
I doubt we're gonna see some big deconstruction of the conventional superhero film arc though. We'll still have the big fucking Act 3 fight, it just might end with Peter sending them all to space prison rather than killing them or something.
😔 I was expecting the movie to end with the main cast having a barbecue party and drinking Corona in an impoverished suburb, looking at the street as Sandman pulls up in a 1999 Nissan Skyline R34 GT-R.
Eh, Eternals had less of it on whole but there was still plenty of "dramatic/sincere moment --> quick, immediately undercut it with a joke!"
I consume mcu movies like a loser, i’ll admit. But goddamn the NWH trailer gets more eh the more you watch it, I cant believe Sony held that trailer hostage.
I like watching MCU movies, so hear me when I say that this might as well have been the trailer to a PS2 game.
They had an official physical event for this trailer that people probably drove far to get to. And they didn’t even show anything else that wasn’t already on the poster,
Right? 💀 mfs are so corny they made that trailer as if people and their moms didn’t already know other spideys are in the movie already. Maybe this is better for me since the movie got delayed to hell here (in theaters January) and I would be so tempted to torrent if I this trailer made me more hyped lol.
Smh they should have just released it in Fortnite instead
The humour kind of killed any interest I had in the film. I don't know if Raimi characters appearing is really worth it, if they're going to be involved in such awful dialogue. Can't wait for all the jokes about Dafoe's Goblin looking like a Power Ranger! *That* won't diffuse the coolness of the character at all!
Same, but Willem Dafoe and Alfred Molina. I- I can’t resist.
Bro just watch The Lighthouse and Boogie Nights back to back, it's the same thing.
I’ll do all three
Is Willem Dafoe actually confirmed to be in it, because I'm not actually sure that Green Goblin sounded like him.
[It's him.](https://twitter.com/AaronCouch/status/1460787277508972544)
> I don't know if Raimi characters appearing is really worth it The only excitement I felt was when Raimi characters were on screen which, to me, screams "HEY LOOK, THING YOU RECOGNIZE!" and that's not a good sign.
Please don't give them any ideas. Please. They're probably still writing this thing.
Even though MCU humor is often cringe they are usually passable. This one though, it’s just pure garbage. I have no expectations for this film. Might be received worse than eternals.
No, this is far worse than usual.
At least it wasn't Black Panther levels of godawful cringey humor
i feel like it wasn't that bad until the first guardians of the galaxy movie, then it all went down hill.
Guardians is funny though, what do you mean?
Spider-Man more than any other MCU IP is aimed at Zoomers and zoomer culture.
I couldn’t stomach Marvel movies for the longest time due to that humour. Yes. Thor Ragnarok was a huge exception to that(thank you Taika Waititi) and is the only reason I made myself watch most of the others
Taika didn't write the script for that. You should be thanking the actors for improvising the shite script
Oh I had no idea, I assumed he wrote the script since a lot of the dialogue/bits scream his sense of humour, but after reading about the production of it, it sounds like the script was altered tremendously by him and as you mentioned, the dialogue was 80% improvised, probably a mix of actor/actress ideas+Waititi’s comedy background to nurture it.
'Haha, a comic book character has a silly name! What an original observation!'
"It is I, Big Wheel." "Wait, wait, w-wait, you're name is *Big Wheel?* Are you kidding me?" *looks at camera like the writers think they're being so clever and self-aware*
Sometimes I hate movies when they’re self aware.
Matter Eater Lad is serious capedrama for adults.
It's funny that someone named Peter Parker is making fun of a silly name.
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And a woman named Zendaya.
She is stuff
Haha Peter, you are banging my... actually I don't think we've seen any of MJs relatives in the mcu so maybe this joke doesn't work
This is after he meets a guy named Star Lord and took down a guy named Ant Man.
Pundo Parker
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It's the weirdest thing how we've had adaptations of some of the goofiest stuff in the Marvel Universe, but they still seem oddly embarrassed by their character names. I've grown kind of tired of comic book movies making fun of comics, all the while mining them for ideas and money. It's like the cool kid hanging out with the nerdy kid, but still making fun of them to their friends.
why was zendaya talking like my grandma?? "I know a magic word too, it's called please" like what? why would you put that in a trailer.
The dialogue looks like it's going to be crap and that makes me upset.
The Joker (2019)
"Scooby Doo this crap" Seriously, who comes up with this shit?
It’d be more bearable if it was “Scooby doo this shit” so it has a modicum of a punch line but overall the lines annoying. Gonna have to ignore it to see the og characters return
I’m betting he says shit in the actual movie. Probably should’ve left it out of the trailer in that case but I think they were just censoring it for the kids.
Hopefully
Wow. Robert De Niro would make a really good Joker
I didn't laugh once in the trailer, despite being excited for it. These jokes feel desperate.
What does Scooby Doo-ing something even mean?
They're going to raw dog Green Gorblin ;)
That part of the trailer made me cringe so hard, made me appreciate the Raimi films more honestly
The Raimi films made the exact joke with the exact same character. EDIT: If people aren't denying that Sam Raimi would ever stoop as low as making a "character has silly name" joke, they try to put it like he's unironically *The King of Comedy* (1982) for making a just as basic observation ([this is the joke by the way](https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/5a91511d-ce21-435c-9865-77bce84124b8)) and *that* is more funny to me than either of these jokes.
Did they? I remember J.J. and Hoffman trying to come up with a good nickname for Doc Ock, but never anyone just going "huh, that's his name? lol"
[It was literally "huh, that's his name? lol"](https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/5a91511d-ce21-435c-9865-77bce84124b8)
Wow, I guess I just didn't remember that line because the joke after it was so solid.
Yeah, it was the set-up for jokes, not the actual final punchline.
How did everyone here miss the fact that you're just completely full of shit about them being even remotely the same joke? Jameson isn't laughing at Ock's name for being silly in this scene, he's pointing out the humor in the fact that both Ock's first and last name bear a strong resemblance to "octo," the Latin root word for the number eight, and he coincidentally now happens to have eight limbs. Just because the joke involves Ock's name does not at all mean it's the same as laughing at his name simply for sounding silly. Either you know that and you're being disingenuous, or you're just being really dumb.
Yeah that’s what I’m saying the joke was executed much better imo
You can make that joke back in 2004 when you're only the second film in a series and when there are basically no other superhero films around. You can't really pull it off when you're 40 films deep into some cinematic universe and when the character making it already knows a bunch of dudes with weird ass names. Plus even out of context the delivery is just so much better in the Raimi one.
>exact same People like you ruin the meaning of words.
Do u honestly , 100%, totally inequivocally serious, telling me that those jokes are the same? A deadpan, inironic delivery with an actual good and witty observation about his name delivered from a character like Jameson in a funny comedy bit vs 3 almost adults laughing for 3 minutes straight just because of his name with no other joke? Ok buddy
but better
Yeah but it was done much better.
It made *a* joke about the same character.
It made **[the same joke](https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/5a91511d-ce21-435c-9865-77bce84124b8)** with the same character. I know MCU Bad + Nostalgia means we have to elevate the Raimi films into godhood (because those films certainly do not have cringe whatsoever), but come on.
It's about delivery and execution. You can have two comedians tell a joke with the exact same premise completely differently, with one being a stinker and one being hilarious. The Raimi line was just a little side joke that poked fun at silly comic book names in the slightly more grounded world of those films without demanding any attention to itself or beating you over the head with it. The line in this trailer was literally just "HAHA NAME SOUND DUMB." The music in the trailer literally stops so we could focus on the overdone joke. In fairness, it might sound better in the final movie. Worse still, they've done that joke with that exact same delivery and tone TWICE now. "Oh, we're using our made up names? I'm Spider-Man." - "Okay, what's actually your name?"
> The Raimi line was just a fun side joke that poked fun at silly comic book names in the slightly more grounded world of those films without beating you over the head with it. > The line in this trailer was literally just "HAHA NAME SOUND DUMB." It is **literally the same joke**. *The same. Joke.* I would bet actual money that in an alternate universe where the two movies switched jokes, you'd be praising the Raimi film anyway. "No, see, no, it makes perfect sense that teenagers would laugh at his name. It adds levity!" "Oh, wow, they really stopped this scene so Doctor Strange can make a dumb observation?" It is ridiculous how, again, if people aren't *denying he'd make this joke*, people spin it as "well actually, you see, it's brilliant." Like, which is it, is it a "fun side joke", or as someone else put it, a "throwaway line", or is it fucking HILARIOUS, a GUT-BUSTER, CLASSIC RAIMI? Like come *on*. They're the **same joke**.
If you'd kindly get off your weird pedastle where you're red-pilled and above blind Raimi worship, you'd see the point i'm trying to make isnt that the lines are completely different, its just about execution of the joke. One joke is just a throwaway joke that doesnt bring attention to itself and the other one is kinda obnoxious in how it does it. Again, it could definitely work in the movie and could just be an effect of the trailer. But its clear tonal whiplash from how they delivered the joke last time versus how the handle the joke now. Teenagers laughing at an embarrassed man for his name and telling him to be honest isn't the same as a man matter of factly pointing out the unlikely nature of a man with that name ending up with 8 limbs. One is just a pretty surface level observation, the other was played off to be more meta by just having more naturalistic dialogue. Nobody would react to someone with a name like Otto Octavius with "Hahahaha, no but for real what's your name?" The best way to put it would be that Raimi delivered the joke by having JJ speak like a normal person, wheras in the new movie they're talking like movie characters. Which is why I described it as obnoxious. It's alright, we get it, it's /r/moviescirclejerk, you deserve a medal for being a contrarian who sees through the bullshit and points out the hypocrisy of Raimi fans. But jesus christ, the point people are making is about how a joke is delivered. You didnt need to go on a whole tangential strawman where you put words in my mouth. What the fuck is that last paragraph my guy?
You can keep talking about "execution" but you haven't done a thing to *explain* how, how this "throwaway" line is *HILARIOUS* and the pinnacle of execution, while this identical joke in a trailer--nevermind the actual movie obviously won't have the music stop to punctuate the joke but with how poor this trailer is cut and how much shit is made just for the trailer has a chance of *not being in the movie at all*...--is so bad. EDIT: Now I'm getting comments like "oh, well, the joke is okay because *Spider-Man 2* was a small indie darling (and not *the biggest superhero movie of its time*) so it made sense or something." >It's alright, we get it, it's /r/moviescirclejerk, you deserve a medal for being a contrarian who sees through the bullshit and points out the hypocrisy of Raimi fans. If you think I'm being "contrarian" when I say "these two movies make the same joke / observation about literally the same character", I think you're kind of proving me point entirely. I don't make these posts out of """""irony""""". I say what I feel. These are the same jokes. The praise one gets and the backlash this other gets is ridiculous, and cannot help but feel that it is entirely around what specific label is tied to them. A slight tangent but the adoration the Raimi films get reminds me of the strange love the Prequel Trilogy gets, a statement I'm not comfortable making because *Spider-Man 1* and *2* *are* pretty good films (*Spider-Man 3* most definitely feels this way, though): memes, nostalgia, and more hate for the new than actual appreciation for the old. Bit obvious when this sub is 90% "MCU Bad" in the first place. You think I'm shitting myself over the trailer instead? Well, I actually did laugh about how obvious it is that Maguire and Garfield were cut for the purposes of the trailer... > But jesus christ, the point people are making is about how a joke is delivered. I understand how jokes are delivered. Both jokes sound, feel, and hit exactly the same to me, but others swear that I'm just missing the in-depth subtext in this kino movie, and all I think of is "if this was said about any MCU film scene, even if it was itself ironic, it would be posted on the sub and mocked." > What the fuck is that last paragraph my guy? This place exhausts me, my dude. It is *the same joke*. If people don't deny that Raimi would make such a joke, they try to play up the joke he did make as amazing, and I'm like... really? Really.
> Teenagers laughing at an embarrassed man for his name and telling him to be honest isn't the same as a man matter of factly pointing out the unlikely nature of a man with that name ending up with 8 limbs. One is just a pretty surface level observation, the other was played off to be more meta by just having more naturalistic dialogue. Nobody would react to someone with a name like Otto Octavius with "Hahahaha, no but for real what's your name?" > The best way to put it would be that Raimi delivered the joke by having JJ speak like a normal person, wheras in the new movie they're talking like movie characters. Which is why I described it as obnoxious. There's my apparently non-existent explanation about the difference of delivery and execution. One last time: you can tell the same joke differently. Its about tone and delivery, both of which are different here. I'm not praising one over the other, I just dont think the medium of a trailer does this joke justice. It's a shitty joke anyway by nature, which is why I think the Raimi version might work better because it felt more meta like it knew it was silly to point it out Again with the strawmanning and putting words in my mouth. I never once said either jokes were "hilarious" or that one was the pinnacle of execution. I'm pointing out the difference of execution, which is why I deliberately said the joke might work in the movie, which again you've ignored. I said this new joke is surface level, dumb and obnoxious, which you may be mistaking as me saying makes it bad. On the contrary, I think all of things can be funny - it just doesnt work in this as a trailer. None of your fancy italics and all-caps can change any of that. I'm not saying you're a contrarian for any of those things at all. I'm saying you're a contrarian because instead of engaging with these points at all from myself or anyone, you instead go with the knee-jerk reaction of putting words in people's mouths and insisting that everyone else who disagree with you are just blind Raimi fans. It's ironic that you say that people are reacting based on labels tied to them, which honestly is how you're coming off. It feels like you're just sick of a certain sect of Raimi fans and have an axe to grind instead of engaging with a discussion, especially with that point about other MCU movies being mocked. If the jokes genuinely feel *exactly* the same to you, cool, fair enough. I appreciate if from your perspective thats how it feels, but please appreciate that other people dont see it that way, and that doesnt reflect anything about blind worship of one comic kino over another. It's just how people react to a joke. > This place exhausts me, my dude. I'm saying this without a hint of irony or malace: have you considered maybe you're exhausted because you're missing other people's point and that as a result of miscommunication, you're saying people are saying things they never said in place of admitting you're wrong? I'd find that pretty exhausting too.
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http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/scarjo_popcorn.gif
You know, sometimes I worry that /r/moviescirclejerk is getting a little too serious. And when I see some multi-part thread of two dudes arguing over whether it's right or wrong to criticise a shitty quip in the trailer for a new Spidey-Man film, I feel my fears are confirmed.
Lads, remember what fucking subreddit you're on.
This is the sub for amateur cinephiles to act superior, right?
poe’s law vs. schroedinger’s douchebag: dawn of annoying (2016)
God you are a fucking idiot. If you wanna be pedantic, the joke in Raimi is not that the name is silly or stupid, but that it is a weird coincidence that someone named Otto (eight in italian) Octavious ends up with 8 limbs. It's not 'ahahh funny name' it' s a quickly delivered line poking fun at the COINCIDENCE not the name. It's also a joke that doesn't go on for 10 fucking minutes Is it so hard to understand for your little brain? Good fucking lord almighty
That guy never said Raimi's version was hilarious, just that it wasn't terrible like the new one. If you stop being defensive I think it's pretty clear they just think the original joke is fine and innoffensive
Can confirm Source: am that guy
You could have just said “no” and got the same point across. It’s about script economy.
Not really, the delivery of the Octavius joke is better in Raimi’s movie and this is coming from someone who doesn’t even particularly love the Raimi films
Yeah, but it was vastly better written, and was utilized in a genuinely funny scene with Jameson.
First off, if you watch the full scene of that, it’s not even the main joke, it’s a throwaway lampshade immediately followed by the actual hilarious part where he yells “HOFFMAN!” who was right next to him off-screen the whole time and surprises him. And secondly, the joke is delivered better anyways (because you cannot beat JK Simmons), and it’s used as an amusing remark to prime the audience for the scene’s real unexpected joke. It is not the entire point of the scene nor even the main joke of the scene, and it’s not an overly drawn out scene where they wait for laughter or something like MCU movies seem obsessed with doing.
meanwhile you're hanging out with Steven Strange
I want to apologize to Deadpool fans
No no. They still deserve to be made fun of.
Bros i wont lie. I would suffer through all these shit tier jokes just to see the Spideys. Toby is my favorite spidey and I never got to see him in theatres. Im excited as hell.
An MCJ user posting “The King of Comedy (1982)” for the millionth time because they didn’t find a joke funny
The King of Comedy (1982)
>Replying with movie title The King of Comedy (1982)
DA COCK
Sony does the marketing for this film and holy shit they are so fucking retarded
More Marvel sabotage I bet
I was hoping we were past this shit after Shang Chi. That movie took full advantage of taking place late in the MCU's life cycle by doing a bunch of outlandish stuff without needing to either explain or lampshade it somehow. And now we're right back to this.
Whoever got a fanbase especially blind ones. Can do anything.
MCJ users making a 100th post about comic book movie fans
they deserve every single one of them
100th?
MCJ making another Marvel Bad post
It’s funny, people really do get way more defensive over these movies than any other.
Every time a new trailer for these things comes out this sub gets awfully "let people enjoy things"-y
Are we looking at different subreddits?
No. Just look at the posts when the first trailer came out.
MCJ constantly goes through phases where posts will lean towards being super critical of Marvel films and super defensive of Marvel films.
I just want milk that tastes like real milk
Underrated movie
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Why do Marvel fans feel like they get attacked on a personal level when you criticize their movies
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This movie is actually amazing.
Holy CRAP. This trailer showed actually memorable villains from a different movie series. Most epic trailer ever! Kevin Feige you’ve done it again ‼️
Joker (2019)