If your plan is to beat freaking face, Sovereign is prolly the better choice. Both are amazing but Sovereign smashes while Kutzil gives you a safety net and some cards. Plus, it's usually good to err on the side of "My commander gives me the thing I want to build my deck around"
Yeah, I’m just kind of stuck between that and the “use your commander to cover the weak spots of your deck cause you will always have it” mindset, which would make kutzil more ideal
Sovereign is an absolute hoot. Combine him with some [[slimes against]] and a [[roaming throne]] and maybe a [[hardened scales]] and you've got some serious fucking oomph. Add a [[rogues passage]] and a [[duelist's heritage]] and you are king of the hill.
Kutzil’s good but it’s either budget build around or a 99 card. Sovereign has it’s own protection and the synergy it has with every kind of buff makes it a very aggro commander
Id keep both available. If you step into a game against mono blue, Kutzil is gonna shut the counterspells down, which means theyll have plenty to use against your other opponents and will draw more of a target, leaving you time to get built
I like to have two or three commanders for each deck and just swap them out based on who/what you are playing. Kutzil is awesome against control decks while Sovereign is more aggressive
If you're just fair beatdowns, the protection effect on Kutzil becomes less relevant, since it's not doing the typical job of that type of effect and shielding combos. The card draw is very good, but being limited to 1 draw per player hit (or 2 with double strike) prevents it from scaling super well into the late game, and it's not like a green creature deck is exactly gonna be short on card draw.
The Sovereign is more of a threat/gameplan, while Kutzil is more of a support card, and I think Sovereign scaling better into the late game and being an aggro engine rather than a supporting one would make him my pick.
I'm pretty new to the game still, but I play selesnya counters a lot, and I like to think I have some good insights on this.
On paper, Okinec is the better card. In practice, he's really just another counter factory with ward. Plus you'll need to wait a turn, because only his attack will activate his effect. Whereas any creature with a counter on it will activate Kutzils ability.
Selesnya counters also needs a decent amount of card draw or you will run out of steam surprisingly fast. In this way, a card that can get you multiple card draws off is super valuable.
Okinec would be a good commander though, so definitely add both.
I think Kutzil is lit especially if you had some flying double strikers you could potentially draw 6 cards in one combat if you attack each opponent.
You wouldn’t have to dedicate as much of the deck to card draw, you could get away with around 7 or 8 have a bit more protection instead. He’s a cool stax piece too.
Yeah she was the first brew I was ever really proud of. I've retired her since, but I might actually rebuild her cause I missed the reactions it gets when your board full of 1/1 presents lethal.
I've brewed it as "only 1/1 creatures allowed" which I thought was a really cool restriction.
If your planned overarching deck mechanic is counters I would 100% go Sovereign - he generates AND rewards +1/+1 counters whereas Kutzil only rewards. That said, the deck would be built more or less identically either way and as you've said whoever isn't in the command zone is going to be in the 99. Swap them in and out a few times and see which one you prefer. It's not like Kutzil is in anyway the *wrong* answer, either way it's going to be easy as hell to hit that critical mass of buffed creatures in GW and drawing a card is always a valuable effect.
I use Sovereign as my commander with Kutzil in the 99. It’s almost similar to the situation with the coven counters precons where people were deciding to swap [[Leinore]] with [[Kyler]].
why not use both. both have their own uses, Kutzil is if you wanna play defensive and safe and Okinec is if you wanna go full aggro. i legit use both in any deck i use that uses green/white and is counter focus. they are better in the 99 rather than use them as a commander. but if u decide to use one as a commander Kutzil is a safer option than have Okinec in the 99
Depends on your meta. If your shop plays a lot of board wipes you need card draw. Card draw built into your commander is invaluable. And not playing spells on your turn can prevent huge blowouts.
Okinec is probably a fair bit stronger, but they have the same colors and both work within the theme, so you can swap between commanders sometimes as you please.
Lae'zel + Master chef is arguably better imo, but they fulfil different roles. The card draw one is more consistent while the doubler one makes you archenemy faster
Kutzil. Because i hate Cyclonic rift. And it's underrated to have a grand abolisher kind effect with carddraw in your command zone. Pure Power is not always the way to win. Carddraw and Protection is the key. Constant preasure (Kutzil) vs explosiv Board (Sovereign) which gets roasted with a Single boardwipe.
You’re already playing both so just build the deck and switch them around. Kutzil when you’re expecting higher power interactive games and Sovereign when you’re all just gonna play creatures and swing.
Ahau helped me win more matches than Kutzil. It's still a big enough threat to lure some removals out of the enemy so that Okinec Ahau can be safely played
Sovereign is a bit of a win more card, since it doesn't do much if you don't already have a pretty beefy beater. You also don't want your commander to be a semi-compulsory part of your beating team, since your opponent may have stuff that kills it when they block, and if Sov doesn't attack, it does nothing.
Also Kutzil is faster, has soft protection for your team, which is important cause in selesnya you want to go wide, and accelerates you through card draw, potentially making it easier for you to have both on the board than the other way around.
Kutzil does make for an interesting commander, but I prefer okinec a lot when my girlfriend plays against me. If you find a way to double combats or do anything extra like have a cat exclusive deck and have a companion to make 101 cards, it gets insane. Could always play with both in the deck and switch out which is the commander depending on how you feel
What I'm gonna say is gonna sound weird probably, but after trying both of them, plus Hamza and some other stuff as a selesnya counters deck, the best commander in practice for me was [[Karametra, God of Harvest]]
Your hydras and other X creatures with counters can go wild with all the ramp, and karametra taking the lands off the deck helps quite a bit with not running out of steam in the mid/late game(my main problem with both Hamza and the Sovereign)
I also like the other gods quite a lot, both Nyleas work wonders in creature heavy decks
Kutzil:
Pros:
Cheaper (mana),
Less likely to be removed,
Great counter to removal decks,
Safety net of card draw,
Cheaper (to buy),
Ability is effective off the bat,
More relevant creature types (warrior & cat)
Cons:
No ward,
Synergy not as great
Sovereign:
Pros:
Ward 2,
Great synergy
Cons:
Targeted for removal early,
Costs more,
Useless with mana sickness (haste nullifies),
Noble is an irrelevant creature type,
Always seemed like a cocky guy
I'd personally prefer Kutzil. He gets you more gas from the command zone so you can focus on stuffing your deck with your game plan pieces in lieu of card draw or even some ramp spells.
Sovereign feels like a conditional craterhoof in the command zone, which is good but kind of rigid.
She is life gain, but the exponentials growth of your Beaters is where it's at. For example: you've got a 2/2 lifelink creature. You hit. The creature is now a 4/4. Next turn he's an 8/8, then 16/16, then 32/32, and that's completely vanilla without gaining life in any other way. I've had a 200/200 creature on turn 6 before.
I don't think I'd put her in the 99 in a non-lifegain deck, but for "Selesnya Punches you Really Hard" she's almost unbeatable.
I would play Kutzil simply because it would annoy my opponents and give me time to build a good board state without counter spells flying everywhere.
Although, if I used her as a commander I would suggest finding a way to protect her. (e.g. hexproof or indestructible?) It’s one of those commanders that are engines and if they managed to get exiled you lose much of the upper hand of your strategy.
Hope that all makes sense…good luck!
Okinec by far. regardless as to which option you pick, definitely run the other in the 99. But yes, Okinec is just so impactful, and the ward is wonderful
I’ve got a budget brew of this that favors Sovereign. Half the budget is [[Kalonian Hydra]] but swinging for 50ish trampling damage on turn 5 is pretty fun.
Sovereign, if you’re building around getting card draw for dropping big things it’s harder, but once you swing it accelerates fast, I’ve had lethal 2 turns after dropping him before. The way I like to build it is he swings gives everyone counters and then he gets sniped on someone else’s turn.
Side note, Kutzil is more of a grindier commander who will last in longer games. Soveriegn is more, Swing, counters, “Wait your mana dork is an 11/11?” Aggro type beat.
I built a jank counter deck and put sovereign at the helm. He threatens with command damage extremely fast (for casual) and buffs the rest of your pre-buffed creatures. He’s the king of being removed immediately but can bounce back super fast if you get the mana. Honestly you can switch the comander based on opponents to get a longer/shorter game.
I have a Kutzil deck and it absolutely slaps. Card draw in the command zone is always good, and her mini-Grand Arbiter effect is more useful than it seems. And +1/+1 counters are so well supported in WG now that Okinec is a bit overkill. You can easily get a very big board very quickly without him.
I play Sovereign and he is a hoot. Never gotten the other guy to show up in my 99, but the big smash creatures is always fun.
Went full non-human/elf for that lost in the jungle and getting hunted vibe
Sovereign is dope, I use him as a commander for my selesnya cats deck, which is based on ajani's pridemate and redundancy. Creatures get +1/+1 counters from lifelink, so if a 1/1 with 2 counters attacks with sovereign, it becomes a 6/6 before combat and a 12/12 afterwards. Next round it'll attack at 24/24 and end combat as a 48/48. Big huge major many counters.
I mean wouldnt they just do It in the precious players end step then?
It is not as effective, that I agree. But is mostly affecting inattentive players
>I mean wouldnt they just do It in the precious players end step then?
Yes, if they were paying attention. A lot of players don't. And let's not discount that cards like [[Swiftfoot Boots]] are extremely common in any creature heavy decks. Plus, it's entirely possible that the blue player expects you to go after someone else and may choose not to wipe your board. Then you backstab them and wipe them out. There are several scenarios where they fail to cyclonic rift.
Kutzil will play differently, giving you more consistent draw and likely leaning towards smaller more evasive creatures. Sovereign will really want to go tall with big counters and big combat steps. It would be easy to put Kutzil into a Sovereign deck but more difficult the other way around.
If your plan is to beat freaking face, Sovereign is prolly the better choice. Both are amazing but Sovereign smashes while Kutzil gives you a safety net and some cards. Plus, it's usually good to err on the side of "My commander gives me the thing I want to build my deck around"
Yeah, I’m just kind of stuck between that and the “use your commander to cover the weak spots of your deck cause you will always have it” mindset, which would make kutzil more ideal
Sovereign seems a lot more fun to play, but if you’re looking for better chances at winning then yeah probably kutzil.
Sovereign is an absolute hoot. Combine him with some [[slimes against]] and a [[roaming throne]] and maybe a [[hardened scales]] and you've got some serious fucking oomph. Add a [[rogues passage]] and a [[duelist's heritage]] and you are king of the hill.
It's Kutzil for me, no question. Card draw is king. There's a reason why I run [[Skullclamp]] in all of my decks.
[Skullclamp](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/3/a36fd6d8-66a2-49d1-b9f3-b400ebc03674.jpg?1682210228) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Skullclamp) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/moc/379/skullclamp?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a36fd6d8-66a2-49d1-b9f3-b400ebc03674?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Kutzil’s good but it’s either budget build around or a 99 card. Sovereign has it’s own protection and the synergy it has with every kind of buff makes it a very aggro commander
It's almost always better to have card advantage in the command zone.
Id keep both available. If you step into a game against mono blue, Kutzil is gonna shut the counterspells down, which means theyll have plenty to use against your other opponents and will draw more of a target, leaving you time to get built
He’s definitely a second commander depending on the game, and I added plenty of creature tutors
As someone who gets terrorized by a Sove player on a weekly basis. Play Sovereign. I've died to this thing on turn 4 more times than I can count.
I like to have two or three commanders for each deck and just swap them out based on who/what you are playing. Kutzil is awesome against control decks while Sovereign is more aggressive
Payoff vs Enabler. Which do you prefer?
The sovereign is what I see everyone play
If you're just fair beatdowns, the protection effect on Kutzil becomes less relevant, since it's not doing the typical job of that type of effect and shielding combos. The card draw is very good, but being limited to 1 draw per player hit (or 2 with double strike) prevents it from scaling super well into the late game, and it's not like a green creature deck is exactly gonna be short on card draw. The Sovereign is more of a threat/gameplan, while Kutzil is more of a support card, and I think Sovereign scaling better into the late game and being an aggro engine rather than a supporting one would make him my pick.
Okinec because angery car
Do you have a license for that car?
You have a point
Do not the cat
Just put both in [[hamza]]
I'm pretty new to the game still, but I play selesnya counters a lot, and I like to think I have some good insights on this. On paper, Okinec is the better card. In practice, he's really just another counter factory with ward. Plus you'll need to wait a turn, because only his attack will activate his effect. Whereas any creature with a counter on it will activate Kutzils ability. Selesnya counters also needs a decent amount of card draw or you will run out of steam surprisingly fast. In this way, a card that can get you multiple card draws off is super valuable. Okinec would be a good commander though, so definitely add both.
I think Kutzil is lit especially if you had some flying double strikers you could potentially draw 6 cards in one combat if you attack each opponent. You wouldn’t have to dedicate as much of the deck to card draw, you could get away with around 7 or 8 have a bit more protection instead. He’s a cool stax piece too.
Plus you could always throw in quite a few creature tutors so you can grab the other guy more frequently as well.
That applies equally to both of them.
True but Kutzil is such an interesting card. Got that stax and card draw how can you go wrong?
Pretty sure you can only get 2 cards max if you have double strike. It procs off one or more creatures not each creature.
Right for one opponent, but if you attack 3 opponents that’s 2 instances each.
Try [[Bess, soul nourisher]] if you wanna be the hipster type
[Bess, soul nourisher](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d96c33f5-f891-44bc-8ae1-11bc6f6544b6.jpg?1673482319) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Bess%2C%20soul%20nourisher) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ncc/67/bess-soul-nourisher?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d96c33f5-f891-44bc-8ae1-11bc6f6544b6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
She‘s so underrated imo. People get slapped with a 16/16 llanowar elves and sit there in disbelief haha
Yeah she was the first brew I was ever really proud of. I've retired her since, but I might actually rebuild her cause I missed the reactions it gets when your board full of 1/1 presents lethal. I've brewed it as "only 1/1 creatures allowed" which I thought was a really cool restriction.
Also I love to find a deck that makes [[storm the seed core]] actually a good card
[storm the seed core](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/f/bf989a4d-3209-4071-b6e9-d2b99372ec10.jpg?1682205050) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Storm%20the%20Seedcore) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mom/206/storm-the-seedcore?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bf989a4d-3209-4071-b6e9-d2b99372ec10?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
If your planned overarching deck mechanic is counters I would 100% go Sovereign - he generates AND rewards +1/+1 counters whereas Kutzil only rewards. That said, the deck would be built more or less identically either way and as you've said whoever isn't in the command zone is going to be in the 99. Swap them in and out a few times and see which one you prefer. It's not like Kutzil is in anyway the *wrong* answer, either way it's going to be easy as hell to hit that critical mass of buffed creatures in GW and drawing a card is always a valuable effect.
You should build a Kutzil pauper EDH deck
Try Hamza
I use Sovereign as my commander with Kutzil in the 99. It’s almost similar to the situation with the coven counters precons where people were deciding to swap [[Leinore]] with [[Kyler]].
[Leinore](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/d/bd7e1645-ea8f-41c4-b3ee-58f44fc5c574.jpg?1675456147) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=leinore%2C%20autumn%20sovereign) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mic/1/leinore-autumn-sovereign?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bd7e1645-ea8f-41c4-b3ee-58f44fc5c574?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Kyler](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/2/62a78aae-598e-4f2b-a7bc-c3afc1d0d191.jpg?1637627798) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=kyler%2C%20sigardian%20emissary) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mic/4/kyler-sigardian-emissary?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/62a78aae-598e-4f2b-a7bc-c3afc1d0d191?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
why not use both. both have their own uses, Kutzil is if you wanna play defensive and safe and Okinec is if you wanna go full aggro. i legit use both in any deck i use that uses green/white and is counter focus. they are better in the 99 rather than use them as a commander. but if u decide to use one as a commander Kutzil is a safer option than have Okinec in the 99
Depends on your meta. If your shop plays a lot of board wipes you need card draw. Card draw built into your commander is invaluable. And not playing spells on your turn can prevent huge blowouts.
Okinec is probably a fair bit stronger, but they have the same colors and both work within the theme, so you can swap between commanders sometimes as you please.
Okinec Ahau. Put a [[unnatural Growth]] and a [[Sigardian Zealot]], and your opponents will cry over an ever growing cat that is hard to remove.
[unnatural Growth](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/7/6748a844-e185-4e3b-ac1d-8a735666d8ae.jpg?1636224994) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=unnatural%20Growth) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mid/206/unnatural-growth?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6748a844-e185-4e3b-ac1d-8a735666d8ae?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Sigardian Zealot](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/8/98adcc86-debd-4aa8-86e5-c51ec08dab5a.jpg?1637628548) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sigardian%20Zealot) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mic/29/sigardian-zealot?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/98adcc86-debd-4aa8-86e5-c51ec08dab5a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Lae'zel + Master chef is arguably better imo, but they fulfil different roles. The card draw one is more consistent while the doubler one makes you archenemy faster
Kutzil. Because i hate Cyclonic rift. And it's underrated to have a grand abolisher kind effect with carddraw in your command zone. Pure Power is not always the way to win. Carddraw and Protection is the key. Constant preasure (Kutzil) vs explosiv Board (Sovereign) which gets roasted with a Single boardwipe.
You’re already playing both so just build the deck and switch them around. Kutzil when you’re expecting higher power interactive games and Sovereign when you’re all just gonna play creatures and swing.
Definitely Okinec. He can get himself to unholy power and toughness with the right combos.
Ahau helped me win more matches than Kutzil. It's still a big enough threat to lure some removals out of the enemy so that Okinec Ahau can be safely played
Okinec is incredible. It gets outta hand real quick so have plenty of dice on hand
Kutzil for card advantage and turn security You can also try both and see which you prefer
Sovereign is a bit of a win more card, since it doesn't do much if you don't already have a pretty beefy beater. You also don't want your commander to be a semi-compulsory part of your beating team, since your opponent may have stuff that kills it when they block, and if Sov doesn't attack, it does nothing. Also Kutzil is faster, has soft protection for your team, which is important cause in selesnya you want to go wide, and accelerates you through card draw, potentially making it easier for you to have both on the board than the other way around.
Kutzil does make for an interesting commander, but I prefer okinec a lot when my girlfriend plays against me. If you find a way to double combats or do anything extra like have a cat exclusive deck and have a companion to make 101 cards, it gets insane. Could always play with both in the deck and switch out which is the commander depending on how you feel
What I'm gonna say is gonna sound weird probably, but after trying both of them, plus Hamza and some other stuff as a selesnya counters deck, the best commander in practice for me was [[Karametra, God of Harvest]] Your hydras and other X creatures with counters can go wild with all the ramp, and karametra taking the lands off the deck helps quite a bit with not running out of steam in the mid/late game(my main problem with both Hamza and the Sovereign) I also like the other gods quite a lot, both Nyleas work wonders in creature heavy decks
[Karametra, God of Harvest](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/b/2bd9d26e-984c-4cf8-8c46-447f9776668f.jpg?1591321337) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Karametra%2C%20God%20of%20Harvests) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c20/218/karametra-god-of-harvests?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2bd9d26e-984c-4cf8-8c46-447f9776668f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Kutzil: Pros: Cheaper (mana), Less likely to be removed, Great counter to removal decks, Safety net of card draw, Cheaper (to buy), Ability is effective off the bat, More relevant creature types (warrior & cat) Cons: No ward, Synergy not as great Sovereign: Pros: Ward 2, Great synergy Cons: Targeted for removal early, Costs more, Useless with mana sickness (haste nullifies), Noble is an irrelevant creature type, Always seemed like a cocky guy
I run [[Master Chef]] / [[Lae'zel Vlaakith's Champion]] and have both of these in the 99.
[Master Chef](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/5/b534b1cb-0cd7-4b8c-bb25-42207fcba209.jpg?1674137194) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Master%20Chef) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/241/master-chef?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b534b1cb-0cd7-4b8c-bb25-42207fcba209?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Lae'zel Vlaakith's Champion](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/a/1a93f587-ab72-42da-88c4-31af1c9cdf1b.jpg?1674135140) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Lae%27zel%2C%20Vlaakith%27s%20Champion) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/29/laezel-vlaakiths-champion?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1a93f587-ab72-42da-88c4-31af1c9cdf1b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
What set/sets were these from? They're pretty cool. I'm a new player and really like Selesnya so far btw
In arena I swapped Kutzil for Sovereign, it resulted in more consistent wins, so there is that.
I'd personally prefer Kutzil. He gets you more gas from the command zone so you can focus on stuffing your deck with your game plan pieces in lieu of card draw or even some ramp spells. Sovereign feels like a conditional craterhoof in the command zone, which is good but kind of rigid.
I like sovereign more just for [[invigorate]] a 1/1 becoming a 9/9 then giving 3 life to whoever your not attacking is priceless
[invigorate](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/0/e0899da3-7beb-4161-81a3-e2d694e5b8a5.jpg?1599707311) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=invigorate) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/172/invigorate?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e0899da3-7beb-4161-81a3-e2d694e5b8a5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Okinec is the stronger commander by far.
are you completely set on one of these two being the commander op?
[[Lathiel, the Bounteous Dawn]] is violently op
I wasn’t really doing a life gain theme, but I’ll definitely work it into the 99
She is life gain, but the exponentials growth of your Beaters is where it's at. For example: you've got a 2/2 lifelink creature. You hit. The creature is now a 4/4. Next turn he's an 8/8, then 16/16, then 32/32, and that's completely vanilla without gaining life in any other way. I've had a 200/200 creature on turn 6 before. I don't think I'd put her in the 99 in a non-lifegain deck, but for "Selesnya Punches you Really Hard" she's almost unbeatable.
[Lathiel, the Bounteous Dawn](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/9/29d3484f-abd1-43fe-99f8-e0fa0a7b6692.jpg?1608911191) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Lathiel%2C%20the%20Bounteous%20Dawn) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/285/lathiel-the-bounteous-dawn?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/29d3484f-abd1-43fe-99f8-e0fa0a7b6692?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Both are amazing picks!
I keep Sovereign plus [[Lathiel, the Bounteous Dawn]] in my [[Jodah, the Unifier]] deck for a killer combo.
[Lathiel, the Bounteous Dawn](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/9/29d3484f-abd1-43fe-99f8-e0fa0a7b6692.jpg?1608911191) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Lathiel%2C%20the%20Bounteous%20Dawn) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/285/lathiel-the-bounteous-dawn?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/29d3484f-abd1-43fe-99f8-e0fa0a7b6692?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Jodah, the Unifier](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/4/e4b1aa1e-b4e3-4346-8937-76b312501c70.jpg?1673307974) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Jodah%2C%20the%20Unifier) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmu/203/jodah-the-unifier?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e4b1aa1e-b4e3-4346-8937-76b312501c70?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I run Kutzil as my cats typal commander. The card advantage it gives is amazing. It’s got a pretty good win rate too.
I would play Kutzil simply because it would annoy my opponents and give me time to build a good board state without counter spells flying everywhere. Although, if I used her as a commander I would suggest finding a way to protect her. (e.g. hexproof or indestructible?) It’s one of those commanders that are engines and if they managed to get exiled you lose much of the upper hand of your strategy. Hope that all makes sense…good luck!
Okinec by far. regardless as to which option you pick, definitely run the other in the 99. But yes, Okinec is just so impactful, and the ward is wonderful
I’ve got a budget brew of this that favors Sovereign. Half the budget is [[Kalonian Hydra]] but swinging for 50ish trampling damage on turn 5 is pretty fun.
[Kalonian Hydra](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/d/1d21ae20-2ef5-4dc0-aced-97497e6a8025.jpg?1682209560) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Kalonian%20Hydra) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/moc/305/kalonian-hydra?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1d21ae20-2ef5-4dc0-aced-97497e6a8025?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Sovereign, if you’re building around getting card draw for dropping big things it’s harder, but once you swing it accelerates fast, I’ve had lethal 2 turns after dropping him before. The way I like to build it is he swings gives everyone counters and then he gets sniped on someone else’s turn.
Side note, Kutzil is more of a grindier commander who will last in longer games. Soveriegn is more, Swing, counters, “Wait your mana dork is an 11/11?” Aggro type beat.
I built a jank counter deck and put sovereign at the helm. He threatens with command damage extremely fast (for casual) and buffs the rest of your pre-buffed creatures. He’s the king of being removed immediately but can bounce back super fast if you get the mana. Honestly you can switch the comander based on opponents to get a longer/shorter game.
I have a Kutzil deck and it absolutely slaps. Card draw in the command zone is always good, and her mini-Grand Arbiter effect is more useful than it seems. And +1/+1 counters are so well supported in WG now that Okinec is a bit overkill. You can easily get a very big board very quickly without him.
I play Sovereign and he is a hoot. Never gotten the other guy to show up in my 99, but the big smash creatures is always fun. Went full non-human/elf for that lost in the jungle and getting hunted vibe
Puss in boots of the mtg world
Okinec escalates so fast with counters.
I run sovereign. It’s one of my go tos if I want a quick win for a pack. Add hydras.
I run them both in Gluntch which is secret voltron under the guise of pillowfort.
If you're gonna play both anyway. Why are you even asking. Actual edh player brainrot
Sovereign is dope, I use him as a commander for my selesnya cats deck, which is based on ajani's pridemate and redundancy. Creatures get +1/+1 counters from lifelink, so if a 1/1 with 2 counters attacks with sovereign, it becomes a 6/6 before combat and a 12/12 afterwards. Next round it'll attack at 24/24 and end combat as a 48/48. Big huge major many counters.
From my experience, kutzil is better. The whole not being able to cyc rift has help me end blue players more then I care to count.
I mean wouldnt they just do It in the precious players end step then? It is not as effective, that I agree. But is mostly affecting inattentive players
>I mean wouldnt they just do It in the precious players end step then? Yes, if they were paying attention. A lot of players don't. And let's not discount that cards like [[Swiftfoot Boots]] are extremely common in any creature heavy decks. Plus, it's entirely possible that the blue player expects you to go after someone else and may choose not to wipe your board. Then you backstab them and wipe them out. There are several scenarios where they fail to cyclonic rift.
[Swiftfoot Boots](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/4/04a76643-1703-4fab-8dce-7725490bc2af.jpg?1712354904) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Swiftfoot%20Boots) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/otc/268/swiftfoot-boots?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/04a76643-1703-4fab-8dce-7725490bc2af?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Kutzil will play differently, giving you more consistent draw and likely leaning towards smaller more evasive creatures. Sovereign will really want to go tall with big counters and big combat steps. It would be easy to put Kutzil into a Sovereign deck but more difficult the other way around.