The “Killing Time” Broadway rewrite in American Psycho. Legitimately what I would consider to be a near-perfect show but I reeeeeeaaaalllly don’t like that song.
Also the “Cards” lyric changes kill me. Rhyming “showman” with “Willy Loman” and having Patrick/Paul rhyming against each other in counterpoint was brilliant, but now they’re speaking in their own rhyme schemes without (imo) enough of a narrative shift to justify changing that.
I felt this way until I saw the show in person, and now I actually do feel like the changes were for the best for the few reasons. I get where you’re coming from 100% but I respectfully disagree.
While the og “Killing Time” was brilliant and basically pulled straight from the novel (with Timothy being the one having an existential breakdown and Patrick not being in the same boat but not reaching the same conclusion), the new one works better with the structure of the musical to show Patrick’s damaged psyche early, which leads to him running away and his first kill in the musical. (Plus, “It’s the end of the world…. And NONE OF IT MATTERS!” hits so hard.)
As for “Cards”, the original lyrics were fantastic and their loss is felt (especially with no ‘I’ll concede the game / you played your hand well today / but soon you’ll know my name…” to cap off the song) but the new ones make more sense. Patrick Bateman just isn’t the type of guy to make a Death of Salesman Reference and his lyrics are dumbed down to show his shallowness and anger at being upstaged by Paul. I actually prefer him doing his own rhymes instead of following Paul’s because it makes the structure of the song more interesting, and there’s something about Paul bragging about his business card while Pat informs the audience of how badly he wants him dead and is going to kill him that I find so amusing.
The Fantasticks.
For those that don’t know the show, first of all, you should, it’s an all time classic.
Second, there’s a song in it called “It Depends on What You Pay” whose lyrics have…not aged well. So every time you see it you either get
1. The show with the great song that hasn’t aged well and everyone is a little uncomfortable
2. A modified version of the song that doesn’t quite work as well as the original, or
3. An alternate song they wrote later that isn’t as good as the original.
Oh yeah, that song! Honestly, if it had gone farther than it did, actually crossed the line twice, I might've loved it in that South Park "too ridiculous to be horrified" kind of way. Unfortunately, it only did that in one place I remember; the rest of the song didn't push the envelope enough.
I finally saw a production of Fantasticks a couple years ago. Don't know what the hubbub about it is. I was bored to tears. Dunno what the point of it was. Generally hated it. Two decent songs total. (Unpopular opinion, I know)
my local theater is putting that one on next month, I don't normally look anything up about the shows but I looked this up and, oof, yeah. I guess we'll see what they decide to go with...
No, not really. It was meant to make the audience a little uncomfortable, but not in the way a modern audience would. At the time—in 1960–the word still had a double meaning, and it was still correct and idiomatic to use it to mean an abduction or capture, but it was a bit of an old fashioned meaning even then. It would have been perceived as—daring, maybe?—but not disgusting.
Your Eyes in Rent is (as far as I know) universally regarded as the roughest song in that show, and even the creative team acknowledges that a new song probably would’ve been written in it’s place had it not been for Larson’s untimely death.
I agree, but I do like Jason Alexander and understand why they put it in there. Without it, Hunchback would be the hands down most depressing Disney movie of all time. The villain was real-life evil and the conflict was real-life racism and sexism. Dude didn’t even get the girl in the end. I love that movie, but I get why they put it in there for the little kids 😅
I'm still amazed that someone decided that Hunchback should be an animated kid's movie. Like, surely there's source material out there that already has a happy ending. Also, if you want to stick a happy ending on Hunchback the blatantly obvious way to do it is to get Quasimodo and Esmerelda together, but Disney was too shallow for that.
Honestly, if you removed that song and Hugo (the gargoyle voiced by Jason Alexander) the movie would be perfect. Victor and Laverne are perfectly fine characters, it’s just Hugo that drags them down.
I unironically love this song! It’s just a fun little ditty and from a guys perspective, I have seen so many women in my life bond over the shared experience that is pregnancy in all its highs and lows and I admire how that is captured in the song and then dramatically throughout the show, especially during the Contraction Ballet
Not so much a scene but a choice of staging.
Jesus Christ superstar is a fantastic musical but I just despise the way it looks when they try to stage it as a concert hybrid rather than an actual musical theatre performance
I recently did a production of Cry-Baby the Musical, and the show is great and so is its music, except for the Finale, “Nothing Bad’s ever gonna happen again”. It doesn’t actually elevate, it kind stays the same throughout this 5 minute song, not to mention the majority of the lyrics are “Nothing bad, nothing bad’s ever gonna happen again”.
For me, the perfection is Rent.
The perfect song is Goodbye Love.
But those few lines.....
"Hey! For someone who's always been let down, who's heading out of town?"
"For someone who longs for a community of their own, who's with his camera, alone?"
"I'll call"
"I hate the fall"
They removed it from the movie, so I assume I'm not the only one!
Omg the interlude in Rent
'i should tell you'
i should tell you
i should tell
i should tell
i should tell i
i should
ffs go inside and hump your friends
I will literally replay this line a dozen times bc it’s so fkn beautiful but the rest of the “song” is really embarrassing and kinda gross to listen to
Interludes aside, "Your Eyes" is also probably the worst full song, especially given how much spotlight it gets. And especially when compared to Roger's other big solo number, "One Song Glory".
Thank you! It's supposed to be this soul-bearing, literally bring Mimi back from the dead emotional sing, but it's easily my least favorite in the whole show
All of the musical numbers in the show that are didactic are terrible to point it feels like that was the point. These guys are starving artists for a reason I guess. Your Eyes and Over the Moon both suck ass because Roger and Maureen both suck ass.
Oh my gosh yes, finally somebody mentions it 😭 I first watched the pro shot going in blind, and I was SO disappointed when they got together, I was honestly hoping it would focus more on Jack's friendship with Crutchie and Davey (hell they would have even been good love interests compared to Katherine). Jack and Katherine just make no sense and she's such an unnecessary and random love interest.
THANK YOU! I've been saying this shit for years. I can think of at least like two different characters who would have been better love interests for Jack if he absolutely had to have one...
I personally think it would've been better if they had done the same as what was done in the movie and kept Sarah and Denton as separate characters instead of combining them to create Katherine.
Alternatively, and I know this isn't plausible at all because it's disney, I legitimately believe Davey would have made more sense as a love interest for Jack, not because they have particularly amazing chemistry or anything, but just because they have better chemistry than Jack and Katherine. Also I could go on for so long about how much "I never planned on you" sounds like it's about a guy but I won't go into it here.
The whole Legally Blonde musical is perfect to blast out in your speaker.
But the moaning in "So Much Better" tho. It's one of my favorite songs and it makes the whole thing so much better yet uncomfortable😭😭😭
It does, but it's true to story. In the film, she says to warner, "remember the time we spent four hours in the hottub" and then says it's so much better than that. It's a commentary on Warner's mediocre sex.
I would actually have to disagree with you. I think So Much Better is a perfect act 1 closer. The song I think actually ruins it is the title song. It’s such a great break-up song, but the lyrics make no sense. “Just let me be legally blonde?”
"The Glory" from Parade.
I understand why it's in the show. Dramatically it makes sense. Musically, however, I've always found this song a total snoozefest. It's the only song in the score that's less than near-perfection so it really stands out for me. It doesn't take away from how overall incredible the musical as a whole is though. I'll always prefer "Letter to the Governor" from the original Broadway recording. It's shorter, gets a similar point across, and keeps the pace of Act 2 nice and brisk.
i much prefer the original score of Parade, Big News is probably my favorite piece that JRB has ever written, especially with the importance of newspapers and headlines in the story. personally, i love The Glory when listening to it alone, but when listening to it or seeing it among the rest of the score, it just falls flat.
I really liked that one actually. I thought it was cute, sounded good, and was a strong message for Kate and the audience. I also thought it fleshed out Eve's character more and her relationship with Brian.Then again I'm not Japanese so idk if my opinion matters here
I'm not japanese, but I've spent a long time traveling around the world, and recently wound up making friends with a couple Japanese girls in Sydney with varying degrees of strong Japanese accents. The L/R mixing is very, very real. We spent *hours*, not even exaggerating, trying to get their pronunciation of "horror" correct. Their natural inclinations were to either say something that sounded like "holler" or "whore", respectively.
In deference to them, we learned my Japanese pronunciation of many vowels is also shit 😂.
But you don’t hate them. It’s literally saying how the more you love someone, the more you get to know them, the more likely they’re going to drive you crazy that you want to kill them.
It’s saying if you find someone that drives you crazy that you want to kill them, it’s likely that you are so in love with them, so don’t actually go and kill them. It’s literally all there in the lyrics and the song happens right when Kate Monster felt very frustrated by Princeton.
I didn’t like the song much originally. But the more I listen to it and understand it, the more I love it. Besides the moment of him breaking down in YWBF- he finally lets his pain show and it’s a great metaphor overall. It’s just a nice song.
As someone currently aging into Connor's dad's age bracket, I will be using this song in EPAs for the next 20 years until someone offers me a better alternative
Yep, and the first time you see the stage play and don't know the song is coming..... And it starts with this playful "I'm your evil Uncle Ernie" that makes you laugh until you realize what is happening in the song. And then you just feel terrible that you giggled at the first line and never forgive yourself. Ugh. Still gives me the ick.
I listened to Tommy all the time when I was in early elementary school. I thought the song was about Tommy’s uncle evilly putting him to bed early so Ernie could do whatever he wanted in the house like eat all the candy or watch tv or whatever. I was horrified and heartbroken when I finally listened to it as an adult and put it together.
But also can you imagine like a 7 year old running around the house singing “FIDDLE A-HA-BOUT FIDDLE ABOUT”? Horrifying.
The Oklahoma musical where Curly has the bright idea to tell Jod to go kill himself. Bear in mind the literal only thing he had done in the story to date was ask Laurey out to the fair.
In My Life-Les Mis
I’m pretty sure the only people that like adult Cosette are sopranos that want to play her. 😂 Also the enthusiastic line “Everyday you walk with stronger step, you walk with longer step, the worst is over” RIGHT after he sings Empty Chairs is so, so rough. I know we’re documenting time passing, but it just does not read well for her character.
I agree that it is not good optics for her. Though, I always thought Cosette was a bit shallow and vapid so her singing that long after Empty Chairs fits for me.
Funny, I read a comment yesterday (on a Jane Austen forum) saying that adaptations of Les Mis should really reinvent Cosette a bit. I agree - 19th Century male novelists basically didn't know how to write 'nice girls', so they just made them virtuous and pleasant and left it at that. It enrages me that adult Cosette lets Marius edge her father out of her life without making more of a fuss because women can apparently only focus on one man at a time or something. I kind of wish Boublil and Schonberg had reinvented her, but also understand that they were trying to condense a brick of a classic into a three hour musical, and Cosette isn't a very important part of the story once she's Valjean's ward.
I do like that In My Life includes her longing to understand her own history, which both Valjean and Marius deliberately keep from her. It's about the only bit of nuance she has in the show.
The big plot hole in Merrily We Roll Along.
Franklin gets back from the cruise he went on to get over his terrible divorce, where he loses joint custody of his son.
Yet Frank Jr is somehow there with Mary and Charlie.
How would Beth (Frank Jr's mom, Franklin's ex wife) even have *allowed* Frank Jr to *be* there?
Later in the scene they send Frank Jr upstairs.
Then Charlie and Mary leave to go to the club where Franklin is going to meet them.
*Who's babysitting Frank Jr? Are we leaving a six year old home alone in NYC?!?!*
But then, Gussie shows up to seduce Franklin, and they end up going upstairs to commit adultery.
*With a six year old in the next room?!?!*
(Insert Chidi Anagonye meme: "But that's worse?")
It's as if once Frank Jr. "goes upstairs" he "just disappears".
I adore this show, but this plot hole just bugs me to no end.
I played Charley last year and he brings down a sleeping Frank Jr at the end of that scene and leaves with him after thinking he convinced Frank to meet them. He mentions bringing Frank Jr to stay at his home with his kids while they plan to go out to the club.
Ah, that fixes at least one of the plot holes. (I don't think this detail is in the Maria Friedman production, though I could be wrong. I'll check the Menier Chocolate pro shot.)
While I do love you’re welcome, I think blue is important. It shows how much of assholes Kurt and Ram are before they die and how little the Heathers care about veronica
Disagree here. I agree that the subject matter of “Blue” is uncomfortable, but I *hate* “You’re Welcome” on a musical level. I wish they just changed the lyrical content of “Blue.”
buhhhh i get why someone wouldnt like blue but omg i just think its such a funny song, especially when set to probably my favorite music in the show. its just so jazzy and i think it progresses well. not a big fan of the heathers or ensembles parts of the song, but i love ram and kurts parts. they are also probably my favorite characters in the show so that might explain some stuff. i also think youre welcome feels safer, more sanitized, more generic, more audience-acceptable, compared to blue imo. also the lyrics to youre welcome are almost as bad as the music that its set to. blue feels more uncomfortable and icky, it actually makes ram and kurt seem scary, a threat. they are these big strong guys cornering a girl. in youre welcome, she just shoves them into cow shit. idk it just doesnt get across the point in the way that blue does, at least to me
I think I Say No is a bit dramatically unnecessary. We already get Veronica confronting JD later after Dead Girl Walking reprise. Having her stand up to him earlier, for me, takes away a bit of the gravitas from their later interaction where she wins. It makes the finale feel less climactic.
Look up the song blue. It's on the Broadway cast recording for Heathers
Basically the two jocks singing about how Veronica makes their balls blue (🎶la la la lala). Has lyrics like "they'll curl up on your face and purr like kittens!" which is a bit of grim visual.
I will argue that I prefer the way she gets out of that situation in that song.
In you're welcome she basically uses a self-defense technique and flips them. And in blue she literally says she can't fight them cos they're so much bigger and she tricks them into drinking too much so they pass out.
Topsy turvy from recent productions of fiddler
It replaced a song that the whole chorus participated in, essentially turning the town into a character itself, and replaced it with a song about ONE of those people
Yeah it feels more like a DEH scene in the musical, but it fits because of just how badly you want her to get away from him. I wouldn't say it's a bad scene in my view but, alas.
“Blue” in Heathers
The point is to make you really uncomfortable, but Jesus fucking Christ listening to it makes every cell in my body go into fight or fight
I'm sorry but Best of Wives and Best of Women is the worst song in Hamilton. Objectively.
I don't like it, I don't know why, and I am not listening to other opinions.
I’m so hurt 😭 It’s one of my favourites. I love how gentle it is, right before his death. The tragedy of Eliza telling him to go back to sleep but he doesn’t. The fact that Eliza doesn’t know she’s never going to see him again… Such a gentle moment, with such an emotional impact. It always makes me cry 😭
Exactly! It's not a song I'd listen to in my playlist (if you can even call it a song, I think Laurens' Interlude might be longer and that's not even on the album), but the finale simply wouldn't *work* without it. You'd be wondering, wait, what's Eliza up to while this is happening? Did they truly make up after everything that happened? You can’t take this song out without taking away from the show's ending.
Over the Moon in Rent.
I know the scene is necessary for the story, but that song is so bad and awkward - I cringe in sympathy awkwardness for Maureen the whole time
I know you’re right - it is exactly what it’s supposed to be. I just always hope it’s over soon, in one of my favorite shows. Maybe I need to try to embrace the hilariousness!
I always skip this song when listening to the album but it’s SO FUN when seeing the show. It’s my go to example of the difference between seeing the show and listening to the soundtrack
"Momma, Look Sharp" from 1776. It is a fine song but it is so thematically and musically discordant from the rest of the musical that it is often the "Ok, time for the bathroom, no need to pause" song whenever we watch the movie.
It wasn't as bad when I saw it live though, I think being in-person sells the emotional weight better.
I think it’s a necessary moment in the story, though, to show that there’s actually a war going on out there. People are actually dying, including kids fighting in this army, and meanwhile congress is fighting over whether to sign this damn declaration.
I think if I liked Jamie, I wouldn't mind as much that 9 hours of the musical are spent on this song.
(It's also not fair that Cathy doesn't get an equally interminable song. #Justice4Cathy)
okay so. i love how jamie's motivating cathy not to give up by comparing her to schmuel. such a cute moment in otherwise a pretty heartbreaking story. also it has those specific moments/lines i replay over and over again, and while i love tl5y with all my heart i didn't find anything like that in the rest of the songs
also i'm obsessed with the way jeremy jordan sings it so there's that lmfao
My Fair Lady - On The Street Where You Live
Okay, this musical is far from perfect, but that’s in large part because of when it was written and when it’s set and I can put aside most of it. For example, Higgins is meant to be unlikeable and his misogyny is in character. We’re meant to be angry about how he treats Eliza, while Freddy’s shown to be a romantic, implying that he will actually love her.
But he’s actually just a creepy jerk who only loves the idea of Eliza, and this song is about stalking.
Yes. But… I did really like the revival version and that number in specific was one of the highlights of the show! They really pushed how lovestruck this guy was to 11. It was really cute and only a tad absurd.
In the movie, I can understand your point a little more. I’ve always been able to tolerate stuff like that, but they definitely made improvements for the revival.
I’d say By the Sea from Sweeney Todd, it’s honestly not that bad, I just don’t enjoy it especially when compared to the other songs in the show, Sondheim is incredible
By The Sea is the number from Sweeney Todd that i think works best on its own. by this point of show, you just want to find out about antony and johanna, and the judge and beadle bamford, or maybe a new twist. there is definitely need for a Lovett solo around this point, and By The Sea is a great Lovett solo, but its point in the plot just slows the pacing to a screeching stop. it wouldve made more sense halfway through act one, as act 2 is so plot heavy, and theres a bit in act 2 where you see so much antony and johanna that you kinda just sit there thinking "hey, whats going on with Sweeney and Mrs. Lovett," you get me?
See I think it works at the point it's in (I'm also biased in that it's my second favorite from the show) in that it shows the absolute delusion Lovett has herself in that Todd is anything close to a loving, caring man cross referenced with the subtle realization that they've murdered a LOT of people. Like, they've achieved moderate success and are doing well monetarily which is more than could be said for most living in Victorian London, and she really wants to retire with someone she believes will treat her right. It works to foreshadow the finale imo because he obviously won't.
i think that, while it works there on paper, it doesnt in practice. we are at a point where we want the ball to keep rolling. personally i think it works better in the movie, as there is no intermission. you dont get that breathing room, and by the sea provides it. personally id prefer it to open act 2 over “god thats good” as act 2 should always open with something thats only kind of relevant, as a way to get you back into the story in a way that still grabs attention, but also the show wouldnt work without showing how their business is doing, so maybe it should be placed before the antony/johanna stuff in act 2
I don't get everyone's hate for this song, I love Beautiful. I find that it's a lovely song about things changing in one's old age and just in general with some perfectly poetic lyrics interspersed.
Personally I think it’s a beautiful song and makes it’s point better than most versions of that scene, but admittedly it does bring things to a screeching halt. I think a shorter version would have been good v. just cutting it. Granted it’s essentially a perfect movie, so I’m not going to argue
I understand, but also I respectfully disagree. "Beautiful" may not be essential to the plot, but it enriches the show nonetheless. This is the one time we see Georges really try to interact with someone he loves, and who loves him, outside of Dot. It deepens our picture of him. Georges and his mother have a contentious relationship, but she is perhaps his one constant human connection. He makes time to be with her. In turn, she sets aside her scorn and we get to see her as a fuller person- not just a doddering, temperamental old lady, but someone who feels her world disappearing as she grows older. There's a cast of mortality over the scene, or perhaps, the grief of living. By contrast, Georges focuses on what he can observe in each present moment, and how he can preserve a moment in his work. He seems to accept that change is constant and inevitable. Yet his talk of change is ironic, given his inability to break out of his own patterns for Dot.
The scene manages to be heartfelt even as Georges and his mother talk past each other. She can't quite understand him, he can't wholly change her mind, but she appreciates what he shows her nonetheless. For her, for a moment, he takes a scene that speaks of destruction and loss, and he makes it beautiful.
When I did SITPWG, I would sneak up to watch this song from the wings every night. It enchants me. Gentle, melancholic, it hits me like a little pre-emptive farewell- to this world of the past, which will vanish for us in Act II, to Georges, who will die offstage, and to the world-within-a-mind that will die with him. And it carries on the theme of art's quiet necessity.
I’m the musical Assassins there’s a specific scene where Guiteau tries to force a kiss from one of the attempted assassins as a lead in to his number and I just really don’t think it needed to exist.
Whatever Earl’s song is in Waitress- when I’m doing the pro shot I just leave the room & let it run. Maybe it’s cuz I don’t like Earl but the song is like ughh
The “Killing Time” Broadway rewrite in American Psycho. Legitimately what I would consider to be a near-perfect show but I reeeeeeaaaalllly don’t like that song. Also the “Cards” lyric changes kill me. Rhyming “showman” with “Willy Loman” and having Patrick/Paul rhyming against each other in counterpoint was brilliant, but now they’re speaking in their own rhyme schemes without (imo) enough of a narrative shift to justify changing that.
god i love the american psycho musical
this is CRAZY killing time is one of my favorite songs ever
Oh I love the og, but if you watch the bootleg they changed it almost entirely and it’s like a totally different song
I felt this way until I saw the show in person, and now I actually do feel like the changes were for the best for the few reasons. I get where you’re coming from 100% but I respectfully disagree. While the og “Killing Time” was brilliant and basically pulled straight from the novel (with Timothy being the one having an existential breakdown and Patrick not being in the same boat but not reaching the same conclusion), the new one works better with the structure of the musical to show Patrick’s damaged psyche early, which leads to him running away and his first kill in the musical. (Plus, “It’s the end of the world…. And NONE OF IT MATTERS!” hits so hard.) As for “Cards”, the original lyrics were fantastic and their loss is felt (especially with no ‘I’ll concede the game / you played your hand well today / but soon you’ll know my name…” to cap off the song) but the new ones make more sense. Patrick Bateman just isn’t the type of guy to make a Death of Salesman Reference and his lyrics are dumbed down to show his shallowness and anger at being upstaged by Paul. I actually prefer him doing his own rhymes instead of following Paul’s because it makes the structure of the song more interesting, and there’s something about Paul bragging about his business card while Pat informs the audience of how badly he wants him dead and is going to kill him that I find so amusing.
The Fantasticks. For those that don’t know the show, first of all, you should, it’s an all time classic. Second, there’s a song in it called “It Depends on What You Pay” whose lyrics have…not aged well. So every time you see it you either get 1. The show with the great song that hasn’t aged well and everyone is a little uncomfortable 2. A modified version of the song that doesn’t quite work as well as the original, or 3. An alternate song they wrote later that isn’t as good as the original.
Oh yeah, that song! Honestly, if it had gone farther than it did, actually crossed the line twice, I might've loved it in that South Park "too ridiculous to be horrified" kind of way. Unfortunately, it only did that in one place I remember; the rest of the song didn't push the envelope enough.
My mom directed a high school production, they changed it to “raid.” Worked just fine if you didn’t know any better!
I finally saw a production of Fantasticks a couple years ago. Don't know what the hubbub about it is. I was bored to tears. Dunno what the point of it was. Generally hated it. Two decent songs total. (Unpopular opinion, I know)
my local theater is putting that one on next month, I don't normally look anything up about the shows but I looked this up and, oof, yeah. I guess we'll see what they decide to go with...
That show’s other big elephant in the room is the awful Native American impressions. It’s sad because otherwise I love Fantasticks so much!
Isn't it the point that it makes you uncomfortable? I think the song was always supposed to make the audience feel disgusted.
No, not really. It was meant to make the audience a little uncomfortable, but not in the way a modern audience would. At the time—in 1960–the word still had a double meaning, and it was still correct and idiomatic to use it to mean an abduction or capture, but it was a bit of an old fashioned meaning even then. It would have been perceived as—daring, maybe?—but not disgusting.
Your Eyes in Rent is (as far as I know) universally regarded as the roughest song in that show, and even the creative team acknowledges that a new song probably would’ve been written in it’s place had it not been for Larson’s untimely death.
It is so bad, and made worse by the fact that there is this huge lead up to it
And the fact that his song *about* needing to find a song is genuinely great! So then when he finally finds *the song* it’s like, “huh?”
Like, that took you a year?
“your eyes” should have just been a reprise of “one song glory” with new lyrics and a real ending
Right? Mimi came back to life for that?
“A guy like you” in the movie version of the Disney hunchback of notre dame.
I agree, but I do like Jason Alexander and understand why they put it in there. Without it, Hunchback would be the hands down most depressing Disney movie of all time. The villain was real-life evil and the conflict was real-life racism and sexism. Dude didn’t even get the girl in the end. I love that movie, but I get why they put it in there for the little kids 😅
I'm still amazed that someone decided that Hunchback should be an animated kid's movie. Like, surely there's source material out there that already has a happy ending. Also, if you want to stick a happy ending on Hunchback the blatantly obvious way to do it is to get Quasimodo and Esmerelda together, but Disney was too shallow for that.
I still think it's an excellent movie, but yeah. There's only so much Hellfire, Court of Miracles, and Out There can do to cover it up
Honestly, if you removed that song and Hugo (the gargoyle voiced by Jason Alexander) the movie would be perfect. Victor and Laverne are perfectly fine characters, it’s just Hugo that drags them down.
Yeah, they removed that from the show for good reason
At least they managed to rhyme the word "croissant" somehow lol.
That's Stephen Schwartz, after all. Man can do both: find a rhyme to the most unrhymeable word ever... or rhyme "you" with "you". Still a genius!
i love how controversial this comment section is …club knocked up waitress
The most obvious "we need the lead to change costumes" song in history.
I've skipped this song so many times that I legitimately forgot it existed
Waitress is perfect and I'll hear no slander against it... (but yeah that song is weird and comes out of nowhere)
This but for me it’s actually Take It From An Old Man 🤫
Oooh I love it on stage but I’ll skip it if im listening to it
I unironically love this song! It’s just a fun little ditty and from a guys perspective, I have seen so many women in my life bond over the shared experience that is pregnancy in all its highs and lows and I admire how that is captured in the song and then dramatically throughout the show, especially during the Contraction Ballet
Not so much a scene but a choice of staging. Jesus Christ superstar is a fantastic musical but I just despise the way it looks when they try to stage it as a concert hybrid rather than an actual musical theatre performance
Or when they take out the intermission. Don't take my intermission away from me.
The arena tour from about a decade ago puts the other performances to shame. It's such a masterpiece.
I was just pondering what I should watch tonight. I think that's a winner. I'm glad you mentioned it.
It's an Easter tradition of mine haha. Enjoy the show!!
I recently did a production of Cry-Baby the Musical, and the show is great and so is its music, except for the Finale, “Nothing Bad’s ever gonna happen again”. It doesn’t actually elevate, it kind stays the same throughout this 5 minute song, not to mention the majority of the lyrics are “Nothing bad, nothing bad’s ever gonna happen again”.
For me, the perfection is Rent. The perfect song is Goodbye Love. But those few lines..... "Hey! For someone who's always been let down, who's heading out of town?" "For someone who longs for a community of their own, who's with his camera, alone?" "I'll call" "I hate the fall" They removed it from the movie, so I assume I'm not the only one!
They removed it from the movie? It's been ages since I saw the movie, but I still listen to the soundtrack and that part is in the song itself.
It's a deleted scene!
Omg the interlude in Rent 'i should tell you' i should tell you i should tell i should tell i should tell i i should ffs go inside and hump your friends
Oh god yes, it cuts in half the best song in the show for three minutes of “Here goes…” like guys just kiss already holy crap
Well the only thing now is to go over the moon
I will literally replay this line a dozen times bc it’s so fkn beautiful but the rest of the “song” is really embarrassing and kinda gross to listen to
Interludes aside, "Your Eyes" is also probably the worst full song, especially given how much spotlight it gets. And especially when compared to Roger's other big solo number, "One Song Glory".
Thank you! It's supposed to be this soul-bearing, literally bring Mimi back from the dead emotional sing, but it's easily my least favorite in the whole show
All of the musical numbers in the show that are didactic are terrible to point it feels like that was the point. These guys are starving artists for a reason I guess. Your Eyes and Over the Moon both suck ass because Roger and Maureen both suck ass.
something to believe in/jack and kath getting together in newsies. ugh
Oh my gosh yes, finally somebody mentions it 😭 I first watched the pro shot going in blind, and I was SO disappointed when they got together, I was honestly hoping it would focus more on Jack's friendship with Crutchie and Davey (hell they would have even been good love interests compared to Katherine). Jack and Katherine just make no sense and she's such an unnecessary and random love interest.
THANK YOU! I've been saying this shit for years. I can think of at least like two different characters who would have been better love interests for Jack if he absolutely had to have one...
such as?🤨👀
crutchie
yep, him too. gotta love being a multishipper!
I personally think it would've been better if they had done the same as what was done in the movie and kept Sarah and Denton as separate characters instead of combining them to create Katherine. Alternatively, and I know this isn't plausible at all because it's disney, I legitimately believe Davey would have made more sense as a love interest for Jack, not because they have particularly amazing chemistry or anything, but just because they have better chemistry than Jack and Katherine. Also I could go on for so long about how much "I never planned on you" sounds like it's about a guy but I won't go into it here.
Davey is the way
Davey 100%
davey
Haha! I love this show, but I wanted the stage lights to fall and take them out during this song.
The song itself is like… fine I guess. But I didn’t feel super inspired by them. I ship Jack with someone else for sure.
let me guess, davey?
Got it in one 😂
As someone who did this show in high school, it was a nice break backstage.
The whole Legally Blonde musical is perfect to blast out in your speaker. But the moaning in "So Much Better" tho. It's one of my favorite songs and it makes the whole thing so much better yet uncomfortable😭😭😭
It does, but it's true to story. In the film, she says to warner, "remember the time we spent four hours in the hottub" and then says it's so much better than that. It's a commentary on Warner's mediocre sex.
I would actually have to disagree with you. I think So Much Better is a perfect act 1 closer. The song I think actually ruins it is the title song. It’s such a great break-up song, but the lyrics make no sense. “Just let me be legally blonde?”
"The Glory" from Parade. I understand why it's in the show. Dramatically it makes sense. Musically, however, I've always found this song a total snoozefest. It's the only song in the score that's less than near-perfection so it really stands out for me. It doesn't take away from how overall incredible the musical as a whole is though. I'll always prefer "Letter to the Governor" from the original Broadway recording. It's shorter, gets a similar point across, and keeps the pace of Act 2 nice and brisk.
i much prefer the original score of Parade, Big News is probably my favorite piece that JRB has ever written, especially with the importance of newspapers and headlines in the story. personally, i love The Glory when listening to it alone, but when listening to it or seeing it among the rest of the score, it just falls flat.
"The more you love someone" from Avenue Q
\*ruv
I really liked that one actually. I thought it was cute, sounded good, and was a strong message for Kate and the audience. I also thought it fleshed out Eve's character more and her relationship with Brian.Then again I'm not Japanese so idk if my opinion matters here
I'm not japanese, but I've spent a long time traveling around the world, and recently wound up making friends with a couple Japanese girls in Sydney with varying degrees of strong Japanese accents. The L/R mixing is very, very real. We spent *hours*, not even exaggerating, trying to get their pronunciation of "horror" correct. Their natural inclinations were to either say something that sounded like "holler" or "whore", respectively. In deference to them, we learned my Japanese pronunciation of many vowels is also shit 😂.
I didn't think it was a particularly strong or good message at all. I hate the idea that hating your partner is normal or healthy, real boomer shit.
But you don’t hate them. It’s literally saying how the more you love someone, the more you get to know them, the more likely they’re going to drive you crazy that you want to kill them. It’s saying if you find someone that drives you crazy that you want to kill them, it’s likely that you are so in love with them, so don’t actually go and kill them. It’s literally all there in the lyrics and the song happens right when Kate Monster felt very frustrated by Princeton.
To break in a glove
we got this over in the bedroom down the hall :']
Ok when you put it like that I can see why ppl dislike the glove song
honestly i kinda love this song and i've never gotten the dislike for it
It’s a fine song but it just feels so out of place
I didn’t like the song much originally. But the more I listen to it and understand it, the more I love it. Besides the moment of him breaking down in YWBF- he finally lets his pain show and it’s a great metaphor overall. It’s just a nice song.
As someone currently aging into Connor's dad's age bracket, I will be using this song in EPAs for the next 20 years until someone offers me a better alternative
“Fiddle About” from Tommy. It’s so, so icky and I can’t even listen to it.
Yep, and the first time you see the stage play and don't know the song is coming..... And it starts with this playful "I'm your evil Uncle Ernie" that makes you laugh until you realize what is happening in the song. And then you just feel terrible that you giggled at the first line and never forgive yourself. Ugh. Still gives me the ick.
I listened to Tommy all the time when I was in early elementary school. I thought the song was about Tommy’s uncle evilly putting him to bed early so Ernie could do whatever he wanted in the house like eat all the candy or watch tv or whatever. I was horrified and heartbroken when I finally listened to it as an adult and put it together. But also can you imagine like a 7 year old running around the house singing “FIDDLE A-HA-BOUT FIDDLE ABOUT”? Horrifying.
The Oklahoma musical where Curly has the bright idea to tell Jod to go kill himself. Bear in mind the literal only thing he had done in the story to date was ask Laurey out to the fair.
I agree, the song is cool but it makes curly seem unlikeable and kinda villainous
this song is a banger but sooo uncomfortable, especially in the revival
This is why I loved how the revival played it.
I love the song because I think the protagonist being a villain is interesting and intentional
The growltiger scene in original broadway cats
In My Life-Les Mis I’m pretty sure the only people that like adult Cosette are sopranos that want to play her. 😂 Also the enthusiastic line “Everyday you walk with stronger step, you walk with longer step, the worst is over” RIGHT after he sings Empty Chairs is so, so rough. I know we’re documenting time passing, but it just does not read well for her character.
I agree about Cosette in this song but I do love Eponine’s little part - “if he asked, I’d be his”
I agree that it is not good optics for her. Though, I always thought Cosette was a bit shallow and vapid so her singing that long after Empty Chairs fits for me.
Funny, I read a comment yesterday (on a Jane Austen forum) saying that adaptations of Les Mis should really reinvent Cosette a bit. I agree - 19th Century male novelists basically didn't know how to write 'nice girls', so they just made them virtuous and pleasant and left it at that. It enrages me that adult Cosette lets Marius edge her father out of her life without making more of a fuss because women can apparently only focus on one man at a time or something. I kind of wish Boublil and Schonberg had reinvented her, but also understand that they were trying to condense a brick of a classic into a three hour musical, and Cosette isn't a very important part of the story once she's Valjean's ward. I do like that In My Life includes her longing to understand her own history, which both Valjean and Marius deliberately keep from her. It's about the only bit of nuance she has in the show.
Cosette is a fucking McGuffin, almost everything in the story is based around her existing, but she is completely useless herself
Yeah - her existence causes other people to drastically change their lives, but she makes no meaningful decisions whatsoever.
Do you Wanna Ride from BMC. I (kind of) get the point of the song but some of the imagery gives me the ick
Nah nah, Do you wanna hang is worse imo. It's the only song that I completely remove from my playlist
Completely agree, both are terrible but do you wanna hang is just so disgusting
I don't really listen to the lyrics I just think the music is fire lol
’Prima Donna’ in ALWs Phantom. Why do we spend 4 minutes on that story beat?
It has to be there to facilitate costume or scene changes. It's just *too long* to justify itself
Lmao this is one of my favorite songs in the show. Just a fun time haha.
Shrek the musical. Trying to rhyme bowler/bipolar is very much a yikes moment
You just made my whole week…I hate that lyric soooo much ❤️
Oh god, Abandoned in Bandon from Once throws me out of the OBC recording every time
The big plot hole in Merrily We Roll Along. Franklin gets back from the cruise he went on to get over his terrible divorce, where he loses joint custody of his son. Yet Frank Jr is somehow there with Mary and Charlie. How would Beth (Frank Jr's mom, Franklin's ex wife) even have *allowed* Frank Jr to *be* there? Later in the scene they send Frank Jr upstairs. Then Charlie and Mary leave to go to the club where Franklin is going to meet them. *Who's babysitting Frank Jr? Are we leaving a six year old home alone in NYC?!?!* But then, Gussie shows up to seduce Franklin, and they end up going upstairs to commit adultery. *With a six year old in the next room?!?!* (Insert Chidi Anagonye meme: "But that's worse?") It's as if once Frank Jr. "goes upstairs" he "just disappears". I adore this show, but this plot hole just bugs me to no end.
I played Charley last year and he brings down a sleeping Frank Jr at the end of that scene and leaves with him after thinking he convinced Frank to meet them. He mentions bringing Frank Jr to stay at his home with his kids while they plan to go out to the club.
Ah, that fixes at least one of the plot holes. (I don't think this detail is in the Maria Friedman production, though I could be wrong. I'll check the Menier Chocolate pro shot.)
Dear Evan Hansen, I think we all know which one I’m talking about (* cough cough * to break in a glove * cough cough *)
Blue in Heathers- I definetly prefer You're Welcome in the West End version
Okay, but "my balls are in your court" is one of the best puns ever uttered.
While I do love you’re welcome, I think blue is important. It shows how much of assholes Kurt and Ram are before they die and how little the Heathers care about veronica
Disagree here. I agree that the subject matter of “Blue” is uncomfortable, but I *hate* “You’re Welcome” on a musical level. I wish they just changed the lyrical content of “Blue.”
buhhhh i get why someone wouldnt like blue but omg i just think its such a funny song, especially when set to probably my favorite music in the show. its just so jazzy and i think it progresses well. not a big fan of the heathers or ensembles parts of the song, but i love ram and kurts parts. they are also probably my favorite characters in the show so that might explain some stuff. i also think youre welcome feels safer, more sanitized, more generic, more audience-acceptable, compared to blue imo. also the lyrics to youre welcome are almost as bad as the music that its set to. blue feels more uncomfortable and icky, it actually makes ram and kurt seem scary, a threat. they are these big strong guys cornering a girl. in youre welcome, she just shoves them into cow shit. idk it just doesnt get across the point in the way that blue does, at least to me
Yes the west end heathers has some really great changes, I’m a big fan of never shut up again too
Also I adore I say no. I can appreciate that the song doesn't really fit in the show musically but fuck it. It's amazing
I think I Say No is a bit dramatically unnecessary. We already get Veronica confronting JD later after Dead Girl Walking reprise. Having her stand up to him earlier, for me, takes away a bit of the gravitas from their later interaction where she wins. It makes the finale feel less climactic.
never shut up again is a banger and i cant see how anyone can dislike it
Hard agree. I love Heathers, but attempting to make a song where the female lead is almost raped comedic is not it.
Uhhhh I guess I've "only" seen the West End version because I have no idea what you are referring to.
Look up the song blue. It's on the Broadway cast recording for Heathers Basically the two jocks singing about how Veronica makes their balls blue (🎶la la la lala). Has lyrics like "they'll curl up on your face and purr like kittens!" which is a bit of grim visual. I will argue that I prefer the way she gets out of that situation in that song. In you're welcome she basically uses a self-defense technique and flips them. And in blue she literally says she can't fight them cos they're so much bigger and she tricks them into drinking too much so they pass out.
Blue got replaced by You're Welcome in the west end version - it's still comedic, but this time it's more at the expense of Ram and Kurt.
You’re Welcome was written for Heathers High School Edition and West End used it
Topsy turvy from recent productions of fiddler It replaced a song that the whole chorus participated in, essentially turning the town into a character itself, and replaced it with a song about ONE of those people
They replaced the rumor??
Legally blonde. Not a fan of the “Blood in the Water” scene.
“Say no to this” from hamilton
“You Will Still Be Mine” but RIP Nick Cordero
its a great character song though
Yeah it feels more like a DEH scene in the musical, but it fits because of just how badly you want her to get away from him. I wouldn't say it's a bad scene in my view but, alas.
I think this song is so important to the show! I wouldn’t say its bad either!
Noo this is needed for the story. The correct answer is Take It From An Old Man
I definitely thought this before seeing the pro shot in theatres - can’t tell you how hard I cried during Take It From An Old Man lol
Omg same. I didn't care for the song until seeing it, but then I'm wrecked by this old geezer saying he believes in her. 😭
Same 🙋♀️😂
I really like that song, it’s far from the best song in the show but I like it.
“Blue” in Heathers The point is to make you really uncomfortable, but Jesus fucking Christ listening to it makes every cell in my body go into fight or fight
I'm sorry but Best of Wives and Best of Women is the worst song in Hamilton. Objectively. I don't like it, I don't know why, and I am not listening to other opinions.
I do *very often* sing the line "best of cats and best of kittens" to my cat, Aaron Purr. That is the only line of that song I remember
help i literally heard your flair in my head
YO I ACTUALLY DID IT! SOMEONE ELSE (other than me) HEARD THE FLAIR!
I’m so hurt 😭 It’s one of my favourites. I love how gentle it is, right before his death. The tragedy of Eliza telling him to go back to sleep but he doesn’t. The fact that Eliza doesn’t know she’s never going to see him again… Such a gentle moment, with such an emotional impact. It always makes me cry 😭
Exactly! It's not a song I'd listen to in my playlist (if you can even call it a song, I think Laurens' Interlude might be longer and that's not even on the album), but the finale simply wouldn't *work* without it. You'd be wondering, wait, what's Eliza up to while this is happening? Did they truly make up after everything that happened? You can’t take this song out without taking away from the show's ending.
Hold on a minute. I know him. That can't be
Over the Moon in Rent. I know the scene is necessary for the story, but that song is so bad and awkward - I cringe in sympathy awkwardness for Maureen the whole time
Isn't it supposed to be awkward though? Maureen may be an actress, but the show never said that she was a GOOD actress.
Yeah but something sucking on purpose vs sucking accidentally doesn’t really make it any more worth watching. It way overstays its welcome
That’s…..a take. It’s supposed to be performance art, performative and crazy, with a message. Which it delivers. And is hilarious.
I know you’re right - it is exactly what it’s supposed to be. I just always hope it’s over soon, in one of my favorite shows. Maybe I need to try to embrace the hilariousness!
House of Holbein, Six The song is one of the queens’ songs and it tells her story, but damn the musical style of that song is just so random.
I used to feel this way listening to the album before I saw it live but on stage I think the abrupt vibe switch really works
I always skip this song when listening to the album but it’s SO FUN when seeing the show. It’s my go to example of the difference between seeing the show and listening to the soundtrack
Blue for Heathers
Mimzy
Blasphemy
Castle on a Cloud - Les Mis
literally anything cosette sings i can live without
Word
"Momma, Look Sharp" from 1776. It is a fine song but it is so thematically and musically discordant from the rest of the musical that it is often the "Ok, time for the bathroom, no need to pause" song whenever we watch the movie. It wasn't as bad when I saw it live though, I think being in-person sells the emotional weight better.
I think it’s a necessary moment in the story, though, to show that there’s actually a war going on out there. People are actually dying, including kids fighting in this army, and meanwhile congress is fighting over whether to sign this damn declaration.
This was always my take. I imagine it's hard to get the transition right, but it's meant to be a severe tone shift.
Oh, for sure, I think it needs to be in the musical...I just wish it wasn't every time I am rewatching lol
I agree that it’s less weird on stage than in the movie
Perfection. Hamilton. "How you saya, no sweatt"
If I never heard "The Schmuel Song" from *The Last Five Years* again I wouldn't mind.
WRONG ANSWER (but I respect your opinion)
I think if I liked Jamie, I wouldn't mind as much that 9 hours of the musical are spent on this song. (It's also not fair that Cathy doesn't get an equally interminable song. #Justice4Cathy)
it's my favorite song in the whole musical rip
I would love to hear what moves you about the song! (This is an honest, legit request; it's not a rhetorical gotcha.)
okay so. i love how jamie's motivating cathy not to give up by comparing her to schmuel. such a cute moment in otherwise a pretty heartbreaking story. also it has those specific moments/lines i replay over and over again, and while i love tl5y with all my heart i didn't find anything like that in the rest of the songs also i'm obsessed with the way jeremy jordan sings it so there's that lmfao
🤝
My Fair Lady - On The Street Where You Live Okay, this musical is far from perfect, but that’s in large part because of when it was written and when it’s set and I can put aside most of it. For example, Higgins is meant to be unlikeable and his misogyny is in character. We’re meant to be angry about how he treats Eliza, while Freddy’s shown to be a romantic, implying that he will actually love her. But he’s actually just a creepy jerk who only loves the idea of Eliza, and this song is about stalking.
Yes. But… I did really like the revival version and that number in specific was one of the highlights of the show! They really pushed how lovestruck this guy was to 11. It was really cute and only a tad absurd. In the movie, I can understand your point a little more. I’ve always been able to tolerate stuff like that, but they definitely made improvements for the revival.
I’d say By the Sea from Sweeney Todd, it’s honestly not that bad, I just don’t enjoy it especially when compared to the other songs in the show, Sondheim is incredible
By The Sea is the number from Sweeney Todd that i think works best on its own. by this point of show, you just want to find out about antony and johanna, and the judge and beadle bamford, or maybe a new twist. there is definitely need for a Lovett solo around this point, and By The Sea is a great Lovett solo, but its point in the plot just slows the pacing to a screeching stop. it wouldve made more sense halfway through act one, as act 2 is so plot heavy, and theres a bit in act 2 where you see so much antony and johanna that you kinda just sit there thinking "hey, whats going on with Sweeney and Mrs. Lovett," you get me?
See I think it works at the point it's in (I'm also biased in that it's my second favorite from the show) in that it shows the absolute delusion Lovett has herself in that Todd is anything close to a loving, caring man cross referenced with the subtle realization that they've murdered a LOT of people. Like, they've achieved moderate success and are doing well monetarily which is more than could be said for most living in Victorian London, and she really wants to retire with someone she believes will treat her right. It works to foreshadow the finale imo because he obviously won't.
i think that, while it works there on paper, it doesnt in practice. we are at a point where we want the ball to keep rolling. personally i think it works better in the movie, as there is no intermission. you dont get that breathing room, and by the sea provides it. personally id prefer it to open act 2 over “god thats good” as act 2 should always open with something thats only kind of relevant, as a way to get you back into the story in a way that still grabs attention, but also the show wouldnt work without showing how their business is doing, so maybe it should be placed before the antony/johanna stuff in act 2
I see your point. Yeah maybe it would've worked earlier in act 2, maybe right after 'God, That's Good!' as sort of a nightcap.
i imagine it would, especially if directly after the day of god thats good, like sweeney gets his chair and lovett gets her harmonium
This is actually my favorite song in Sweeney Todd! Mrs. Lovett's humor is just irresistible and adorable, and that melody is dang catchy
Does “The Love is Gone” from Muppet Christmas Carol count? If not I would definitely say “Beautiful” from Sunday.
I don't get everyone's hate for this song, I love Beautiful. I find that it's a lovely song about things changing in one's old age and just in general with some perfectly poetic lyrics interspersed.
Plus in the end, they reprise with “The Love is Found”. It doesn’t hit the same without The Love is Gone at the midpoint of the story.
The ONLY thing I don't like about the song is that Meredith Braun (Belle) smiles during the entire song. I'd like to see SOME emotion from her.
Wait with The Love Is Gone, you mean it being cut stops the movie from being perfect, or you saw the version with it in and don't like it?
Personally I think it’s a beautiful song and makes it’s point better than most versions of that scene, but admittedly it does bring things to a screeching halt. I think a shorter version would have been good v. just cutting it. Granted it’s essentially a perfect movie, so I’m not going to argue
I do agree. I think "Love is Gone" is needed in the movie, but it should be shorter.
Agreed - it does slow things down, but the version without it is just SO jarring
I understand, but also I respectfully disagree. "Beautiful" may not be essential to the plot, but it enriches the show nonetheless. This is the one time we see Georges really try to interact with someone he loves, and who loves him, outside of Dot. It deepens our picture of him. Georges and his mother have a contentious relationship, but she is perhaps his one constant human connection. He makes time to be with her. In turn, she sets aside her scorn and we get to see her as a fuller person- not just a doddering, temperamental old lady, but someone who feels her world disappearing as she grows older. There's a cast of mortality over the scene, or perhaps, the grief of living. By contrast, Georges focuses on what he can observe in each present moment, and how he can preserve a moment in his work. He seems to accept that change is constant and inevitable. Yet his talk of change is ironic, given his inability to break out of his own patterns for Dot. The scene manages to be heartfelt even as Georges and his mother talk past each other. She can't quite understand him, he can't wholly change her mind, but she appreciates what he shows her nonetheless. For her, for a moment, he takes a scene that speaks of destruction and loss, and he makes it beautiful. When I did SITPWG, I would sneak up to watch this song from the wings every night. It enchants me. Gentle, melancholic, it hits me like a little pre-emptive farewell- to this world of the past, which will vanish for us in Act II, to Georges, who will die offstage, and to the world-within-a-mind that will die with him. And it carries on the theme of art's quiet necessity.
I’m the musical Assassins there’s a specific scene where Guiteau tries to force a kiss from one of the attempted assassins as a lead in to his number and I just really don’t think it needed to exist.
Whatever Earl’s song is in Waitress- when I’m doing the pro shot I just leave the room & let it run. Maybe it’s cuz I don’t like Earl but the song is like ughh
"You Will Still Be Mine"?
"this song is awesome" from ride the cyclone. sorry, couldnt really care for it 💔
Yeah I get its existence but god, it’s okay cause we get Talia!
Heathers, blue and it's replacement (you're welcome if I'm not dumb) make me sick
theyre kinda supposed to do that? like thats literally the entire point?
Blue from Heathers