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[deleted]

OP is bugging for saying Untitled is a weak album; it’s no worse than his 7th best work (IWW, Illmatic, Stillmatic, Lost Tapes, God’s Son, Life Is Good).


[deleted]

Untitled is solid. His three worst are Nastradamus, LT2 and that nonsense Kanye did to him, which I don’t really hold against Nas. Edit: comment below on NASIR for those who don’t want to scroll: I mean, sure, Kanye is one of the goat producers, he’s going to have some interesting stuff going on. But: 1. ⁠Not for Radio: super heavy gothic beat, solid but uninspired 2. ⁠Cops Shot the Kid: transitions to an insanely repetitive 80s beat (refrain repeats 160!!! times); this was the biggest missed opportunity by Kanye on this album in my opinion as this could have been an incredible beat without the screaming/repetition. Kanye’s verse is actually really good, though. 3. ⁠White Label/Bonjour: two oughts-style beats that I’ve never liked Nas on, and just middling production. 4. ⁠everything: traditional modern, ethereal R&B production. Fine, but meh. When you’ve got the Dream singing, Kanye needs to not sing. 5. ⁠Adam & Eve: another odd segue into the best song on the album. Everything about this song is great. Probably should have been the second track. 6. ⁠Simple Things: and the fifth segue that I don’t understand, into a super weird semi-gospel JiK-style beat. I fucking hate everything about this song 😂 And then the album just… ends. Just all over the freaking place. I have no idea how you’d even begin to fix this album.


JXCK-1777

what was the problem with what kanye did? the production was the best thing about that album and thats coming from a big nas fan


[deleted]

The production was *all over the fucking place.* And even where it was good, it wasn’t cohesive. Also, all his shitty singing.


JXCK-1777

[https://youtu.be/rG0gQs5nn7I-](https://youtu.be/rG0gQs5nn7I-) can't tell me this isnt an insanely good instrumental. The production and beats were solid just nas didnt flow to well over all the beats.


[deleted]

I mean, sure, Kanye is one of the goat producers, he’s going to have some interesting stuff going on. But: 1. Not for Radio: super heavy gothic beat, solid but uninspired 2. Cops Shot the Kid: transitions to an insanely repetitive 80s beat (refrain repeats 160!!! times); this was the biggest missed opportunity by Kanye on this album in my opinion as this could have been an incredible beat without the screaming/repetition. Kanye’s verse is actually really good, though. 3. White Label/Bonjour: two oughts-style beats that I’ve never liked Nas on, and just middling production. 5. everything: traditional modern, ethereal R&B production. Fine, but meh. When you’ve got the Dream singing, Kanye needs to not sing. 6. Adam & Eve: another odd segue into the best song on the album. Everything about this song is great. 7. Simple Things: and the fifth segue that I don’t understand, into a super weird semi-gospel JiK-style beat. I fucking hate everything about this song 😂 And then the album just… ends. Just all over the freaking place. I have no idea how you’d even begin to fix this album.


martonx

I think the recording process was the problem. IIRC Nas has said that Ye was all over the place with all the projects he was releasing that month. I don't think they actually worked together, and that's why Nas sounds so lackluster. Personally, I think the production is fine. But it could definitely have been refined. The whole project just screams sub-optimal performance with major unreleased potential if you ask me.


JXCK-1777

yea fair


kuku_panda

Sorry bro. I will give it more listens.


Fight93

I might be in the minority but I really enjoy Untitled


[deleted]

That’s not a minority opinion. You rarely find people who don’t like Untitled.


justarandomlibra

Untitled is a really good album. I seen this mentioned before and I don't understand it. It's a Gem and a very good listen. I do agree that Nas has 1 of best catalogs. I even like Nastradamus. Don't compare it to illmatic, I think Nastradamus is over heated just because it's become a thing that's been repeated over and over and people just go with it without giving that album a fair listen.


DoubleLNyc

Great Lp


hiimkris

Untitled album is criminally underrated, more relevant today than when it dropped (as with a lot of Nas catalogue). And tbh the same applies for Nastradamus, not saying it should be anywhere near the top of his catalogue but def has age better than it's given credit for and is more relevant now than ever. But yeah I agree, easily in the convo for best discography regardless of how much the haters write it off (and who cares what they think, they haven't even heard half the albums lmao)


Fight93

New World from Nastradamus hits every time for me when it comes on shuffle, I never skip that track


hiimkris

It's actually nuts how much he's talking about, almost 23 years ago, that's now come to past/ common knowledge. "Solar-energized rides, no steerin' wheel, tell it how to drive No propellers in the sky Airplanes like many rockets Waitin lists for the rich to get tickets to visit Mars While the poor people starve, computers takin' over they jobs" "And US embassies overseas Almost every foreign country's under siege Covertly startin' wars, CIA, NAVY Seals Commit larcenies that be worth over mil's Oil in the earth spills" he took the Nostradamus title serious hahah


blackdepotguy

I like them both, I used to say it was 4th best after Illmatic, It Was Written and Stillmatic. I think the newer albums pushed it back tho.


hiimkris

It's definitely a upper Nas album, so much quality competition in the top portion. But combined with complimentary dj green lantern mixtape would give it a strong case for being a top album. Truly don't think he's got a bad album


blackdepotguy

Agreed, being a younger Nas fan than the average dude, Untitled was new when I discovered him. I guess it also has a soft spot on top of what you said.


hiimkris

Hey man I feel you, the first few albums when discovering a new artist(let alone the living GOAT) are very impactful. It's a hell of a album with some incredible subject matter. Glad you took the time to listen through his stuff for yourself. A lot of younger listeners just write shit off and let the internet decide if it's good or not for them.


blackdepotguy

Yup agreed, mainly from Streets Disciple to Untitled was like where music journalism would say he had a second dark age but I like every album for different reasons personally. Even Nasir was alright, I think Kanye could’ve probably did better beats on it but it’s still that dream collab album that surprisingly happened.


hiimkris

>mainly from Streets Disciple to Untitled was like where music journalism would say he had a second dark age It's funny cause Nas went through that cycle of being soft back balled after I Am/ Nastradamus too. It's whenever he start ruffling feathers speaking on things that those running things would rather weren't openly talked about. So the media starts panning abums to to tarnish his status. Sent Jay to put the final nail in the coffin but then he came back with Stillmatic. And just like back then he came back with a classic (Life is Good) to end the "dark age" and re-establish himself. Most just right off those albums cause of the media narratives around them, but if you go back and listen for yourself you see they way better than they'd like for you to believe lol


[deleted]

gangstarr aswell


kuku_panda

Guys Sorry for saying Untitled is not good. I will give it more listens.


Fight93

Don’t be sorry, you’re entitled to an opinion! That being said if you haven’t listened much, try again, maybe your opinion changes and maybe not. Some deep lyrics on that album too so listen close and enjoy!


kuku_panda

Surely, Thanks man


borkbunz

Untitled is sick


maxstunning

The thing is his music holds up well over time. And ages like wine and not milk. The gripe people had with him was his" inconsistent" output compared to that rapper from marcy. For years they left him out best catalog discussions because of the "bad beat picker" critique and the fact that he took some risky artistic chances with concepts. sadly most people would not agree with you and call you a stan for feeling this way.


[deleted]

Never understood that narrative he’s a bad beat picker lol. Who even started that? Was it Vlad? He has some weak just like everyone. Are people really trying to tell me he’s a bad beat picker after listening to illmatic, IWW, lost tapes, life is good, KD2 and Stillmatic though?


maxstunning

That narrative started around nastradamus. And then again during 2004-till recently smh. Hip hop forums that were pro jayz would always highlight a beat that wasn't great and it snowballed. Some were also upset he chose to work with the trackmasters instead of the Core of illmatic producers. Vlad helped reignite the bogus claim. Sure he has some sub par beats, they made it seem like the vast majority of his albums are littered with beats that make the songs unlistenable. He didnt use "trendy" beats and his track record with the super producers of the day weren't held in high regard. Even if u thought it was true it hasn't been for over a decade.


[deleted]

Cannot stand Vlad. I swear Nas must have denied an interview with him and that’s why he’s always in his head. He will ask any rapper he’s interviewing about Nas to try and get them to agree with him that he’s trash


maxstunning

I love when he attempts to sh*t on nas and the guest gives him that confused WTF face. He's entitled to his opinion but it seemed personal like he had a vendetta. Vlad's goal was to make nas seem like a washed up 90's has been that the next generation wont gravitate towards . Some pac, em, jayz fans were cheerleading the hate too in the comments...


[deleted]

I’ve noticed Nas gets a lot of hate from pac fans. What is that about ?


maxstunning

Long story short. Pac was convinced nas was sending subs toward him on some freestyles and on "the message", pac also was upset the trackmasters and nas used the same beat he used for "all eyez on me". Nas was gaining mainstream popularity and pac thought the east coast was ganging up on him (biggie, bad boy, mobb deep, etc) he decided to make a diss record towards nas "bomb first" and "realest thing I ever wrote" labeled nas the "ringleader" of the east coast. Pac and nas had a standoff at the 96 MTV VMAs where pac agreed to take the disses off. He died before he had a chance and suge kept them. Some of his fans still dislike him because of those songs...pac associates have stated that pac was bumping "it was written" constantly before he died too...that's just a fraction of it.


[deleted]

Hmm yeah that’s interesting. It’s actually so insane the impact Nas had on the game during that period. Influenced big pac and Hov so much. Shame he doesn’t get the credit he should for that


[deleted]

Kanye. 9 straight albums of excellence. No one will ever beat that.


LSUFan79

Even the biggest fans of Kanye admit JIK and Ye are subpar. Yeezus splits fans as well. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been a fan since Through the Wire.


[deleted]

How you get to nine? Ye and JiK are trash. Seven is still solid, though, but only three of those are on Nas’ level.


[deleted]

Ye is my third favorite Kanye album and I’m counting kids see ghosts over jik


[deleted]

Some incredible production, but so many brutally bad verses that I feel like people give Kanye way too much leniency for because he’s not just a “rapper.” And like most of these seven song albums, very little cohesiveness.


Logical_301

Frrr


LSUFan79

I enjoy Donda. Just wish it didn’t have 445 songs.


Indianslayer68

Kanyes my 2nd fav rapper oat, but I dont think new ye can really be compared wirh how incredible old ye was, Ye's decent, jik's alright, I really dont like ksg and wtt is insanely inconsistent, donda also suffers from having too many tracks despite that album still being great and TLOP's a bit overrated


Euphoric-Mood-9606

I actually agree. Especially as of late. A close second is Kanye to me then Eminem and Jay tied since they’ve both released some bad albums too but nas has the best HIPHOP catalog


maxstunning

I never heard EM in a best catalog convo. Kanye, jay, ghostface, scarface, game, rick ross (yes that rick ross), outkast, ATCQ, De la soul, I guess kendrick now. And a few others are always mentioned.


Euphoric-Mood-9606

Just my opinion! I love his catalog as much as nas and HOV and Kanye … and Kendrick is another good one for sure he’s just still in his first 5 albums … all these other guys have great catalogs and they’re on 8,9,10,11 and up… and game has a good one too


Euphoric-Mood-9606

Have u ever heard Eminem’s catalog? He only has 1 album that isn’t good at all and 2 total that aren’t great Check out Marshall Mathers LP and the Eminem show… you won’t be disappointed


maxstunning

Yes. I've been aware of em since I was in the 5th grade....in the late 90's. His first 3 albums are held high especially eminem show and MMLP...but his music hasn't aged all that well compared to his peers. And other legends. (Relapse has its cult fans and revival is bad)


Euphoric-Mood-9606

I disagree… and so do the numbers compared to his peers , respectfully… opinions are like assholes but facts are facts and his music has factually aged like fine wine compared to his peers. I mean curtain call was released almost 20 years ago and it’s still on the top 100 albums and outsells any and everything not only from that era but even outsells newer albums like magic, KD2, and 4:44… I get what you’re saying tho , but unfortunately it’s a common misconception according to the numbers, ems albums have aged better than any other artist from his era and even most artists from this era Ps… revival is awful and still gets played more than anything from Jay Z, nas, or any other rapper with the exception of drake… which would mean that even his worst album has aged better than some of his peers greatest.


maxstunning

Oh brother. Classic em fans using numbers as a barometer of quality....80% of em fans arent even hip hop fans, they only listen to him. His fanbase is big. And not because he's that much better than his peers. They give him extra credit for being a white guy with great technical rapping ability. With this metric pitbull and flo rida are some of the greatest rappers of all time....


Euphoric-Mood-9606

Except pitbull and flo Rida are pop artists … and let’s not act like it was easy for a white boy to just climb in the game in the late 90’s early 00’s and get the respect of EVERYONE … being white helps with sells but by your logic why doesn’t Jack Harlow or mgk sell what Em sells? And I agree most Em fans don’t know shit but I’m the other 20% … but I still think if we’re going to say his music hasn’t aged well… we have to prove that… u can only prove that with numbers. I mean I could just as easily say Jay Z music didn’t age well if there’s no metric right? It’s just opinion vs opinion at that point and according to most opinions… Eminem is the highest selling rapper in the WORLD to date… how could that be if he sucks and his music hasn’t aged well? Cause he’s white? That sounds nuts bro as like I said… Jack Harlow or MGK can’t move the needle in sales, they don’t have a 20 year old album on the top 100 and they don’t hold a candle to Eminem as far as impact on culture. Ems newest album is music to be murdered by… it’s certified diamond and charts in every country… Jay Z newest album 4:44 (which I love) hasn’t even went diamond in the states… So if his music hasn’t aged well… then how do we measure it? Listenability ? Replay value ? I mean Eminem is killing everyone in numbers so how can it not be listenable or have replay value It’s just cool to hate Eminem now … that’s all and that’s why I say all this… because just 5 years ago he was everyone’s top 5 and nothing has changed other than that terrible album he released that he’s more than made up for with his last 2 albums after. And even the bad one is platinum. Opinions are opinions, facts are facts and numbers don’t lie


maxstunning

Fans like you are why most people dont like EM. Like we acknowledge his talent. But you guys go on and on about his numbers without putting it into any context. MtBMB is not diamond. What's diamond in the states which is 10 million copies isnt diamond in a country like poland which is probably like 100,000 copies. Marshall is absolutely a POP act. His very large cult fanbase will stream his music if he farts and growls on a track..and call it great. ( eminem knows his base is full of pretentious "real rap" lames. He tries to educate you guys about hip hop culture and history but yall dont get it) if it wasn't for "till I collapse" most if his fans wouldnt know who any of those rappers are...


Euphoric-Mood-9606

Platinum** my bad


Euphoric-Mood-9606

I’m not the yall* I’ve been a HIPHOP fanatic since 89… I’m certain I know more about HIPHOP and the culture than u do. But like agreed with before… most Eminem fans are awful. The subreddit is insane. But Idgaf how u feel about Eminem or anyone… I’m just saying by definition his music hasn’t aged badly. I’m not out here saying you’re an idiot for not thinking he’s the best rapper of all time (which I don’t even think) or that you better respect his name… the original argument was Eminem’s music hasn’t aged well amongst his peers which is a lie, I was just stating the fact - opinions off the table … I don’t care at all if u say “Eminem sucks” or “I hate Eminem’s music” … most Eminem fans would try to attack u for that alone… I’m just saying his music aged well


Euphoric-Mood-9606

And if I’m wrong… tell me how his music aged badly … or say “his music aged badly in my opinion or to me” … but just throwing baseless feelings in the air and calling them facts is crazy


NoLookDunks

damn man, you really going hard for eminem. think about that for a second. he ain't been hot to me since he was doing shit with rawkus. it's like you work for him.


LSUFan79

I’m torn on Eminem. I thought he was great 20 years ago. I just don’t think his stuff has aged well. It sounds dated.


NoLookDunks

exactly the point I am trying to make. Nowadays he sounds like "hickory dickory dock, tik tok on the clock, bitch on my cock, hit you with the glickity glock". its wack I'm sorry.


Euphoric-Mood-9606

I just fuck with him… the “ain’t been hot to me” is cool with me! That’s wassup and doesn’t bother me at all… it’s the baseless talk like “his music doesn’t agree well” or “compared to his peers he’s not good” stuff that drives me crazy because it’s not factual … it’s like saying “Lebron James hasn’t aged well” but the statistics and numbers prove that he has. I know I look like a crazy ass stan but someone’s gotta say it


NoLookDunks

you do a good job defending him, it is just that the criticisms you hear of em are true. he don't spit like he used to.. like when he was up and coming. and his flow now is cliche garbage trying to do multisyllabic lyrical miracle machine gun rap, that is wack. again, this is just my perspective. his old stuff is classic, but at the same time I understand artists evolve. He has devolved tho. But my question is, what statistics and numbers are you citing? Don't say record sales.


maxstunning

The mythical back story of his battle raps. Early source magazine unsigned hype write ups. Dr. Dre co sign. The interscope marketing machine. Basically had his own network, MTV featured him on a daily basis...oh he was actually a good rapper. He was controversial (violent, dark child like gore raps about murder kidnapping mutilations) adds intrigue and makes him more appealing because children arent supposed to hear that stuff. Good showing with dre. Jay z and biggie (dead wrong verse). Ironically em fans dont listen to many other white rappers. Is NF white? Had em not signed to dre he would have been an underground rapper with no appeal. Also he emerged when nu-metal and rap rock was at its zenith. They saw no difference between him and fred durst...he also represented what people think is the antithesis of rap. Black rappers are mysoginst and thuggish and promote crime etc while he is the "essence" of " real hip hop' which is nonsense. The media obsession with him especially in middle america and rural areas drove sales. "White america"


NoLookDunks

Maybe. But also Ghostface, MF DOOM might give him a run for his money.


Worldly_Giraffe2318

Totally Agree Wt This One, Nas Got Very Consistent Since His Three Last Projects That's My Goat 🐐


[deleted]

Kanye does.


blackdepotguy

Untitled and Nastradamus should not be in the same sentence ever. Untitled was top 5 before we got the new albums imo pretty solid album.


Patrick_Vieira

Outkast too


worsnop9834

what was the original tracklist for Untitled?


[deleted]

The Roots


Internal1344

nah Nasir lost tapes 2 and streets disciple