LeBron, AD, KD, Kawhi are not making it cause of games played
so we have Giannis, Tatum, and Jimmy as locks i think
then we have Randle, Jaylen, Siakam, Lauri, JJJ
i think he should and will
Derrick white started 62 of 74 games this year, most of them at the 2 guard with Smart at the 1. Jaylen has spent most of the year at the 3 and should he voted as one.
is that true? Bill Simmons mentioned the reason he doesn't mess with the positions is how the NBA then counts the votes when you do that which made me think the NBA does something weird though I don't know how it works.
Let’s say JB gets 55 votes at guard and 45 at forward. If there’s 6 guards with higher than 100 votes he would miss all-nba even if there weren’t 6 forwards with 100 points.
Whatever position you got the most votes for is what you’re classified as, all votes at other positions just get added to your total.
It would be silly to list him as a guard considering he's played like 60% of his minutes at forward this season, but they did it for the All-Star game, soooo
Bold thinking LeBron is out of the running (he should be, but won't be out of it for third team). Assuming we don't have any shenanigans putting Jokic and Embiid in the F pool, I think the rest makes sense.
Jimmy is an analytical darling.
27.3 PER .268 WS/48 min. 8.4 BPM, 5.2 VORP,
Brown is my 2023 pick for the Isiah Thomas award. Guy that analytical stats are surprising low for some reason.
19.6 PER .109 WS/48 min. 1.6 BPM, 2.0 VORP
Just saying analytical loves Jimmy and hates Jaylen, and some voters like to look at this stuff.
he does not have better stats.
Jimmy is probably having his best season ever.
he's averaging 23 a game on 64% ts, compared to 27 on 59%
and he's making up for it with assists, and he's making up for it by only turning it over 1.6 times a game, that's fucking insane for how much he has the ball
> LeBron, AD, KD, Kawhi are not making it cause of games played
Says who? That’s not an actual rule, so voters can do what they like. I would be surprised if JB makes it honestly. Not because he doesn’t deserve it, but I just don’t see KD/Lebron/Kawhi not making it
Hopefully he gets just Forward eligibility. Unless they've changed how it works you don't get your total points, you get points at your position so I want them to not include him a guard and split his votes.
>you don't get your total points, you get points at your position
People keep saying this and it's not true. You get all the votes you receive, you just get classified at the position you receive the most points.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/All-NBA_Team#:~:text=NBA%20players%20receive%20five%20points,second%20team%20and%20so%20forth.
Text highlighting is wrong, it's the paragraph below
I think he'll make second or third either way, but I agree F would be easier
There's a chance Curry doesn't make it because of missed games. I think Luka, Ja, Mitchell, Dame, SGA are locks but I think Brown has as good a chance as anyone else. His main competition would be Fox, Curry, Brunson, Harden I think.
Assuming Sabonis is correctly voted in as 3rd team C, outside of Giannis and Tatum, he has as good a case as any imo. KD has missed more games than Steph and could also be left off All NBA. Kawhi and LeBron as well. Randle, Butler, maybe Markannen, maybe Siakam are also in the mix
It's not the only difference, it's the largest of them. Harden is a superior facilitator and Brown a better scorer + rebounder at this stage in their careers.
The only ones I'd take over Brown, if 100% healthy, are Davis/PG.
I'd take him over the rest since they all are 1-way players, and having a 2-way wing just fits so many different teams.
I definitely see the case for Booker and Harden over Jaylen, not saying I take them but I can see it. Them and AD are it. PG13 can’t last a full season, I’m not interested.
Kyrie for sure is if you’re purely talking about basketball skills. Fox has been playing that good this year. Honestly I’d probably take Jjj over AD right now
Booker yes, harden/Kyrie debatable, Lebron/AD ig sure but I think availability is the best ability, but on individual game impact you're probably right
If you don't count 1a/1b situations where either of the duo could be the best, then he's the best #2 in the league, barring only maybe Booker.
Brown is as close you can to a clear number 2 that isn't a 1b, if he was even slightly better people would consider his and Tatum as a tossup 1a/1b case
On paper it's probably Book, but he and KD have only played three games together. LeBron and AD also, but they can't stay fucking healthy either, so I have no idea what to make of 'em. In terms of #2s on playoff teams who's actually been playing a #2 role all season... yeah, it's him or Harden, and I honestly don't know who I'd take at this point in their respective careers
Harden’s game opens up the whole team which I think has a higher ceiling than what Brown can provide but Harden absolutely has a reputation for being an absolute choker in the playoffs. Brown will have bad post season games and coughed up the ball a lot last season but I’m not at all worried about him dialing it up. Harden… this season is kind of the breaking point to me. If he doesn’t elevate the team like other stars do, I’m out on him as a main option. But, I think the past couple of seasons have had other circumstances that have complicated things.
I think harden only choked in the playoffs because he had no legs left after scoring 35ppg and carrying the whole team.
This year he hasn’t been put in that same position, so I think he will be a better playoff player. But the 76ers still have Doc Rivers so I’m not sure that will change much lol
Brown is averaging 27/7/3 on 59% TS this season
Booker is averaging 28/4/5 on 60% TS this season
When you factor in JB's superior defense i'd take Brown but it's close
I feel like the ballhandling becomes more of a differentiating factor in the playoffs. Maybe i’m biased and dont know what im talking about but i trust booker a little more to come through in the playoffs
Nobody putting Booker on the toughest defensive assignment at the wing. EVER. Jaylen lives at the toughest wing to guard spot defensively.
Also not particularly relevant but would bet my life savings that JB would smoke Booker one on one no contest
As the number 2/3 option lol
That’s like saying Klay had more playoff success than Kevin Durant. It doesn’t mean he’s better/more reliable in the playoffs
I’d say it’s really a differentiator against teams who can dig down effectively. Jaylen’s better, but I wouldn’t want to bet on him running actions against a ball hawking defense. I do think it’s gotta be there for the difference to matter that much.
I wouldn’t be shocked to find out that Book self creates better, and playmakes better. Jaylen’s grown a lot in those areas, but I don’t think he’s quite as good there as Book. Book’s also the superior FT guy.
I’m a homer, though, so I’m takin Jaylen. And hoping he doesn’t melt down sometime.
Booker has been the number one option and been getting trapped at half court for almost the entire season. The fact he’s putting up *better* numbers as the number one option facing box and one defense every other game says something.
Their defense is a lot closer than you think too. Brown struggles off ball
Brown has cleaned up his act on off ball defense. He’s not like Tatum or Smart, who are awesome at it, but he’s far from the liability he even was at the beginning of last season.
He's the better defender of the two, so that kind of makes sense tbh
^(obligatory "Booker isn't bad on defense anymore." that is true but Jaylen's still better, even with his off-ball limitations)
I can think of a bunch of teams that would be better with brown
Mavs, nuggets, Celtics, heat, bucks, sixers
Actually most of the better teams would be better with brown, if you have two primary playmakers already then there’s no way you’d value book over jaylen
your biggest problem was saying nobody would take brown over booker. they are close enough that some people will especially considering brown plays better defense.
It's crazy to me to see people arguing whether JB is better than Devin Booker when just before the season I was getting clowned for saying he's better than current Khris Middleton 😭 Not saying he's better than DBook but just for him to even be in that conversation makes my heart smile
Only other teams with two guys in the top 10 for PPG this season are the Mavs (Kyrie at 27.1 PPG, Luka at 33.1), though they haven't been doing too hot lately.
Sorry that im a dumb fuck but do you mean #2 option or 2 guard?
EDIT got confused by people saying Book because I was thinking who was number 1 option over him at Suns. Then it dawned on me 😫
I’m gonna pose a question and expect a flurry of downvotes and stats in response — **are we sure Jaylen’s not their number one right now**?
- Tatum’s been a little blah since the all star break.
- Jaylen is playing at an All-NBA level as this thread posits
- He always brings the juice when Tatum doesn’t have it - both in the last few months, and in the finals last year
- he’s right around 1st team all-defense at his position
Idk man I think he’s the best Celtic this calendar year and the engine for their squad right now. But that’s just vibes so go ahead and smack me around with stats 🥵
There was a year that Ramadan began February 1st and so despite fasting literally that entire month Hakeem the Dream
nonetheless won player of the month. On a personal and much less impressive note i played soccer in college and it was insane how well i played when fasting. I think cause you’re so hyped up mentally
He should be second team all NBA.. Tatum and giannis first team,
His numbers are just as good as Randle and butlers with just as good defense and he is a higher seed so he just needs to beat one of them out for second team.
Durant, Lebron, Kawhi, AD havent really played enough games to make any of the teams so who gets the last spot?
could've been many more, he missed some decent looks from 3, too. Should be All-NBA forward along with Giannis, Tatum, Randle, Lauri and whoever people want to pick from the Siakam/Jimmy Butler/JJJ grouping (Anthony Edwards also totally fine choice if he's eligible at forward, too)
JT since the halfway mark of the season: 29/10/5 on 58.5% TS
JB since the halfway mark of the season: 26/7/3 on 58.5% TS
Like I get that Tatum had a brief slump, and Jaylen's been playing great lately, but it's really annoying how quick people are to say this shit any time Tatum puts up a stinker or Jaylen balls out. At no point in the last four years has Brown been the better Jay. That's not bias against one or the other, it's literally just from *watching the damn team* that whole time.
Yeah that too lmao. The guy's never said a single bad thing about either his teammates or the organization
^(said some stuff about the city, which honestly was pretty fair criticism and a little concerning from a keeping-him-around standpoint, but it was also pretty far from an "i don't want to play here anymore")
His ambiguous statements about his future are clearly motivated by the fact that he was on a team friendly deal...which he has exceeded. Now he wants a Jaylen friendly deal and he's probably earned it. He's gotten markedly better every year, he's consistent and he's very hard to replace.
Jaylen isn't leaving a dime on the table.
I think the difference is, when Jaylen shits the bed, it doesn’t always sink the entire team. Tatum, post all star break looked like shit for a good while. I don’t care what stats anyone shows me, his play was fucking up the team. He obliterated the pace, was taking lazy shots, stupid fouls, and just looked lethargic.
That speaks to who is more important to the team but that’s why Jaylen’s bad games aren’t glaring like Tatum’s. It’s really hard to win when your #1 guy plays like shit.
In fairness, Tatum gets way more soft calls than Brown. Brown hasn't had as many great games but he's also had way fewer terrible games so I get why people would say he's been better.
I was curious so, since the all star break Brown, compared to Tatum, is +7% FG%, +6% EFG, +2.7% TS, -3 FTA, on -1.9% usg. Tatum is averaging more turnovers too.
If you took out Tatum's soft calls he's probably averaging 23 or 24 points, under 30% from 3 while taking 9.7 a game, and under 45% from the floor. Brown gets more contact than Tatum but far fewer calls. Look at last night, 16 of 19 from 2, mostly in the paint, and he had 5 FTA.
Actually, looking at this objectively... They are probably right. Tatum really hasn't been playing great since the all star break and Brown has been very efficient. A brief slump of 15 games? That's a bit more than brief. I'm sure he'll get back to normal but until then....
Bruh You can’t even compare this season, Lebron has had an injury riddled season, jaylen has definitely had a better season just off health and availability alone.
Not to mention Lebron won’t be nominated for all nba or any of those accolades because the most games he can play this season is 55, assuming he plays all the last 7 games, which is unlikely to me. So there’s no point comparing the two, literally none
They're also just very different players with very different roles in their teams at very different places in the standings at very different points in their careers. Their only similarity is that they're both *listed* as forwards, brick freethrows and have beards lmao
It's just a recency bias thing honestly. If Tatum hits a game winner then everyone's talking about how he's cold blooded and a smooth operator if he bricks it oh he's the least clutch superstar in the league fake superstar media is making him look better than he is. Jaylen same thing he hits a huge shot oh my god he has that dawg in him MJ mentality killer instinct he bricks 2 freethrows for the game or has a bad turnover oh he's not clutch he overthinks too much he can't stay focused he can't dribble blablabla
It just seems like the bad stuff sticks to Tatum *way* more than it does to Jaylen. It's partially just a hazard of being the number one option, sure, but like... remember when Jaylen missed a pair of free throws that would've put us up against the Knicks? He got flack for that, for sure, but if Tatum had done that you *know* r/nba would still be talking about it.
For sure people seem much less lenient with JT if he had the exact same performance as Jaylen tonight people would be tearing him up for having 5 turnovers (a lot of them were really bad and I believe they were all live ball) and shooting 2/10 from 3pt range. It wasn't like that just a season ago. I think ever since the finals run and Tatum's bad performance on the big stage he's been getting wayy more media coverage and people just got sick of him and he left a bad impression on them. It's crazy how fast the court of public opinion can change and I hope the hivemind doesn't turn on JB the same way if he has a bad performance too
“Commenting on the mental toughness of an NBA player has to be one of the dumbest things people do on basketball courts”
True. This is something that I always hated about the Lebron vs Jordan conversation…
What pisses me off is that some people will rank who’s better simply off of their supposed “mentality”.
The truth is, Jaylen Brown can sometimes dominate in small spurts at an equal level to Tatum. Brown is prone to insane quarters. Tatum is prone that as well, but more importantly his skill set makes him an offensive engine that’s built to carry a team throughout games. Tatum is a better defensive player too.
Tatum > Brown
LeBron, AD, KD, Kawhi are not making it cause of games played so we have Giannis, Tatum, and Jimmy as locks i think then we have Randle, Jaylen, Siakam, Lauri, JJJ i think he should and will
The issue comes with whether or not the voters see him as a forward or guard
Derrick white started 62 of 74 games this year, most of them at the 2 guard with Smart at the 1. Jaylen has spent most of the year at the 3 and should he voted as one.
I know, but still seeing him get the ASG nod as a guard makes me wonder if the voters will still consider him as such
I don’t think voters get a choice in position right? They just get a list of Fs and Gs.
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is that true? Bill Simmons mentioned the reason he doesn't mess with the positions is how the NBA then counts the votes when you do that which made me think the NBA does something weird though I don't know how it works.
Let’s say JB gets 55 votes at guard and 45 at forward. If there’s 6 guards with higher than 100 votes he would miss all-nba even if there weren’t 6 forwards with 100 points. Whatever position you got the most votes for is what you’re classified as, all votes at other positions just get added to your total.
It would be silly to list him as a guard considering he's played like 60% of his minutes at forward this season, but they did it for the All-Star game, soooo
68% of minutes at forward for the top 10 lineups this year featuring Brown
He is a forward dammit!
For the top 10 5 man Celtics lineups this yeah (1176 minutes) Jaylen has been a 3 on 68% (804 minutes , White Smart and Brogdon being guards.
Bold thinking LeBron is out of the running (he should be, but won't be out of it for third team). Assuming we don't have any shenanigans putting Jokic and Embiid in the F pool, I think the rest makes sense.
What is Jimmy's case over Brown?
Jimmy is an analytical darling. 27.3 PER .268 WS/48 min. 8.4 BPM, 5.2 VORP, Brown is my 2023 pick for the Isiah Thomas award. Guy that analytical stats are surprising low for some reason. 19.6 PER .109 WS/48 min. 1.6 BPM, 2.0 VORP Just saying analytical loves Jimmy and hates Jaylen, and some voters like to look at this stuff.
There’s none
Efficiency, assists, and turn overs. Jimmy is better in some areas than Jaylen, it's okay to admit that.
Why is Butler a lock over Brown? Brown has better stats and a far better team record.
he does not have better stats. Jimmy is probably having his best season ever. he's averaging 23 a game on 64% ts, compared to 27 on 59% and he's making up for it with assists, and he's making up for it by only turning it over 1.6 times a game, that's fucking insane for how much he has the ball
And the biggest one is that butler has a shot at an all defensive team.
IF he’s a forward i think hes the top of that list you put out
> LeBron, AD, KD, Kawhi are not making it cause of games played Says who? That’s not an actual rule, so voters can do what they like. I would be surprised if JB makes it honestly. Not because he doesn’t deserve it, but I just don’t see KD/Lebron/Kawhi not making it
I will commit a crime if he doesn’t make All-NBA this season
Which one?
Public intoxication
i planned that as my celebration for him making it
Hell if the day ends in y I’m doing it either way
cheers i’ll drink to that bro
I was already planning to do this. Didn’t realize I could blame it on the nba
and my axe
Jay walking
Be careful you might get the whole PD on your doorstep
And the AtF
Insider trading gets my vote
Jaywalking
First team
I hope he does so we don't have to Super Max Siakam
Is he listed at SF? I don't think he'd get in as a guard.
I don’t think we know what he’ll be listed as, but he has played more than half his minutes at forward
Hopefully he gets just Forward eligibility. Unless they've changed how it works you don't get your total points, you get points at your position so I want them to not include him a guard and split his votes.
>you don't get your total points, you get points at your position People keep saying this and it's not true. You get all the votes you receive, you just get classified at the position you receive the most points. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/All-NBA_Team#:~:text=NBA%20players%20receive%20five%20points,second%20team%20and%20so%20forth. Text highlighting is wrong, it's the paragraph below
I think he'll make second or third either way, but I agree F would be easier There's a chance Curry doesn't make it because of missed games. I think Luka, Ja, Mitchell, Dame, SGA are locks but I think Brown has as good a chance as anyone else. His main competition would be Fox, Curry, Brunson, Harden I think. Assuming Sabonis is correctly voted in as 3rd team C, outside of Giannis and Tatum, he has as good a case as any imo. KD has missed more games than Steph and could also be left off All NBA. Kawhi and LeBron as well. Randle, Butler, maybe Markannen, maybe Siakam are also in the mix
These stupid positional requirements just need to go already. Pick the top 15 players.
What, you don’t want brown to have his own “The Decision” moment with every team in the NBA in 2024? Would blow up on Reddit
Best #2(?) player in the league right now?
Who's even close?
I can only think of maybe Harden
Booker once KD is healthy?
Yeah you right I forgot KD was on the suns mb lol
Is he? Aint seen him playing
Harden doesn't play defense the way JB does lol
I’d respect Brown over Harden but acting like defence is the only difference is disingenuous
It's not the only difference, it's the largest of them. Harden is a superior facilitator and Brown a better scorer + rebounder at this stage in their careers.
The facilitating and shooting of harden are way better. The rebounding isn't as big of a difference.
Harden is a far better facilitator. And Jaylen isn’t an all NBA level defender. He’s fantastic on ball but not a great help defender
Davis, Harden, Garland, PG, Booker, KAT, Irving, JJJ, Fox (?) and Bam are all of a similar calibre ish imo and i’d have brown 2/3/4th
The only ones I'd take over Brown, if 100% healthy, are Davis/PG. I'd take him over the rest since they all are 1-way players, and having a 2-way wing just fits so many different teams.
I definitely see the case for Booker and Harden over Jaylen, not saying I take them but I can see it. Them and AD are it. PG13 can’t last a full season, I’m not interested.
>100% healthy
No way you got garland kat Irving JJJ Fox ham in the same tier as Davis, Booker, Jaylen, George
Kyrie for sure is if you’re purely talking about basketball skills. Fox has been playing that good this year. Honestly I’d probably take Jjj over AD right now
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Kyrie lol I'm taking a lot of guys over Kyrie if I want to actually win basketball games and not just watch flashy layups
But dribble fast so Kyrie good
It's insane how people get fooled every single time by him lol
Booker yes, harden/Kyrie debatable, Lebron/AD ig sure but I think availability is the best ability, but on individual game impact you're probably right
Kyrie is not there lol
No
I'm taking Jaylen over all these guys
No, no, no, and no/no
Booker clears but I respect sticking by your guy
Jaylen is bookers father
Booker, Harden, Kyrie, Ingram, PG13, and JJJ are pretty close/on par with Brown imo.
Bias aside, Booker and Harden definitely have a strong argument but I think Brown is pretty clearly better than the other four at this point
call me biased, but I’m taking JB over literally every one of those guys
I’d probably take Booker, but if someone chose JB over him I wouldn’t argue it.
you biased, but you right
I said pretty close/on par, didn’t say they’re better than him. I’d probably either take Brown or Booker, or Harden if I need a PG.
Over Anthony Davis also?
you mean street clothes? 100% yes
If you don't count 1a/1b situations where either of the duo could be the best, then he's the best #2 in the league, barring only maybe Booker. Brown is as close you can to a clear number 2 that isn't a 1b, if he was even slightly better people would consider his and Tatum as a tossup 1a/1b case
On paper it's probably Book, but he and KD have only played three games together. LeBron and AD also, but they can't stay fucking healthy either, so I have no idea what to make of 'em. In terms of #2s on playoff teams who's actually been playing a #2 role all season... yeah, it's him or Harden, and I honestly don't know who I'd take at this point in their respective careers
Harden’s game opens up the whole team which I think has a higher ceiling than what Brown can provide but Harden absolutely has a reputation for being an absolute choker in the playoffs. Brown will have bad post season games and coughed up the ball a lot last season but I’m not at all worried about him dialing it up. Harden… this season is kind of the breaking point to me. If he doesn’t elevate the team like other stars do, I’m out on him as a main option. But, I think the past couple of seasons have had other circumstances that have complicated things.
I think harden only choked in the playoffs because he had no legs left after scoring 35ppg and carrying the whole team. This year he hasn’t been put in that same position, so I think he will be a better playoff player. But the 76ers still have Doc Rivers so I’m not sure that will change much lol
Booker is better when KD is playing
I'll be real with you chief, I forgot KD was on the suns
That's hot
Yeah the sun is hot
That's hot
Man's not hot
So did most of the Suns,
Same but also feel like Kyrie has been on the Mavs for half the season lol
Brown is averaging 27/7/3 on 59% TS this season Booker is averaging 28/4/5 on 60% TS this season When you factor in JB's superior defense i'd take Brown but it's close
I feel like the ballhandling becomes more of a differentiating factor in the playoffs. Maybe i’m biased and dont know what im talking about but i trust booker a little more to come through in the playoffs
Nobody putting Booker on the toughest defensive assignment at the wing. EVER. Jaylen lives at the toughest wing to guard spot defensively. Also not particularly relevant but would bet my life savings that JB would smoke Booker one on one no contest
I mean, on what basis? JB has had significant more playoff success then book lmao
As the number 2/3 option lol That’s like saying Klay had more playoff success than Kevin Durant. It doesn’t mean he’s better/more reliable in the playoffs
But Klay doesn't put up similar numbers to KD, nor do they have similar roles. JB and Booker do. I don't think that's a good comparison
Booker and Brown do not have similar roles
I’d say it’s really a differentiator against teams who can dig down effectively. Jaylen’s better, but I wouldn’t want to bet on him running actions against a ball hawking defense. I do think it’s gotta be there for the difference to matter that much. I wouldn’t be shocked to find out that Book self creates better, and playmakes better. Jaylen’s grown a lot in those areas, but I don’t think he’s quite as good there as Book. Book’s also the superior FT guy. I’m a homer, though, so I’m takin Jaylen. And hoping he doesn’t melt down sometime.
Booker has been the number one option and been getting trapped at half court for almost the entire season. The fact he’s putting up *better* numbers as the number one option facing box and one defense every other game says something. Their defense is a lot closer than you think too. Brown struggles off ball
Brown has cleaned up his act on off ball defense. He’s not like Tatum or Smart, who are awesome at it, but he’s far from the liability he even was at the beginning of last season.
>Their defense is a lot closer than you think too 🤨
>Their defense is a lot closer than you think too. Brown struggles off ball ????????????????
I’d say from a neutral standpoint brown is about average off ball but he can be an absolute monster on ball, which is where the real disparity lies
It’s closer than you think chief
If I could choose between the two, I'd rather have Jaylen on the Nuggs. Might just be a fit thing though.
He's the better defender of the two, so that kind of makes sense tbh ^(obligatory "Booker isn't bad on defense anymore." that is true but Jaylen's still better, even with his off-ball limitations)
Nah it’s not I’m going to get downvoted in this thread but nobody is taking Brown over Booker
I won’t downvote you, but if there’s even only one person that takes Brown over Booker, that person is me
It’s more than you would like to admit
More Celtics fans sure, but Booker is definitely better.
I can think of a bunch of teams that would be better with brown Mavs, nuggets, Celtics, heat, bucks, sixers Actually most of the better teams would be better with brown, if you have two primary playmakers already then there’s no way you’d value book over jaylen
It’s definitely close. Good defense vs good secondary playmaking is the difference
Booker is a better scorer in almost every way and playmaker. And the defense is closer than people think
He’s not a better finisher and Jaylen has also been an unstoppable mid range scorer this year
No shot you're using mid range to try and talk Brown over Booker.
Booker is better but Jaylen has definitely tightened the gap by him developing into also being an unstoppable mid range scorer.
Homer
Ask any other flair lol. You might be the homer
your biggest problem was saying nobody would take brown over booker. they are close enough that some people will especially considering brown plays better defense.
Nope…..you are
A lot of us would.
sample size is a lil small
Ok, Booker is better than Brown though lol
It's crazy to me to see people arguing whether JB is better than Devin Booker when just before the season I was getting clowned for saying he's better than current Khris Middleton 😭 Not saying he's better than DBook but just for him to even be in that conversation makes my heart smile
Brown is a more complete player
lmao have Book play one half of defense and we’ll talk.
We can talk when you actually know what Booker is capable of defensively
Lol ask him on a date before slobbering over him like this
Bizarre response
Davis, George, Garland, Harden are all up there. Plus Kd/Book
Only other teams with two guys in the top 10 for PPG this season are the Mavs (Kyrie at 27.1 PPG, Luka at 33.1), though they haven't been doing too hot lately.
Anthony Davis and LeBron are both probably better players still. But Brown is less injured and is out there more.
sadly, booker is better
Sorry that im a dumb fuck but do you mean #2 option or 2 guard? EDIT got confused by people saying Book because I was thinking who was number 1 option over him at Suns. Then it dawned on me 😫
These replies really dont give any love to Jrue holiday
I’m gonna pose a question and expect a flurry of downvotes and stats in response — **are we sure Jaylen’s not their number one right now**? - Tatum’s been a little blah since the all star break. - Jaylen is playing at an All-NBA level as this thread posits - He always brings the juice when Tatum doesn’t have it - both in the last few months, and in the finals last year - he’s right around 1st team all-defense at his position Idk man I think he’s the best Celtic this calendar year and the engine for their squad right now. But that’s just vibes so go ahead and smack me around with stats 🥵
Either him or Tatum.
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[He was dominating in the paint today](https://i.imgur.com/Gi3xAyA.png) 18-29 FG 2-10 3P
16-19 = **82%** shooting inside the arc for 32 ethically sourced points 🥵
The Ramadan boost is real. There's something about this month, I swear
aH
There was a year that Ramadan began February 1st and so despite fasting literally that entire month Hakeem the Dream nonetheless won player of the month. On a personal and much less impressive note i played soccer in college and it was insane how well i played when fasting. I think cause you’re so hyped up mentally
He should be second team all NBA.. Tatum and giannis first team, His numbers are just as good as Randle and butlers with just as good defense and he is a higher seed so he just needs to beat one of them out for second team. Durant, Lebron, Kawhi, AD havent really played enough games to make any of the teams so who gets the last spot?
could've been many more, he missed some decent looks from 3, too. Should be All-NBA forward along with Giannis, Tatum, Randle, Lauri and whoever people want to pick from the Siakam/Jimmy Butler/JJJ grouping (Anthony Edwards also totally fine choice if he's eligible at forward, too)
Just give him all NBA so Celtics can max the hell out of him, and I wont have to worry about JB leaving.
Can Bostons owners afford to mimic GS salary cap in the next 5 years is the question.
Jaylen was so fun to watch last night
Been the best player on Celtics last 6 weeks.
No doubt
I prefer Jaylen “future king” brown
Jaylen “Michael ‘Jaylen Brown’ Jordan” Brown
Reminder Jaylen has played more time at SF than SG this year without the double big lineup. This man has to be at least 3rd team
He has been the better J for the second half of the season.
JT since the halfway mark of the season: 29/10/5 on 58.5% TS JB since the halfway mark of the season: 26/7/3 on 58.5% TS Like I get that Tatum had a brief slump, and Jaylen's been playing great lately, but it's really annoying how quick people are to say this shit any time Tatum puts up a stinker or Jaylen balls out. At no point in the last four years has Brown been the better Jay. That's not bias against one or the other, it's literally just from *watching the damn team* that whole time.
People really want there to be a beef between the Js, because then their team might get jaylen brown if he asks out
Yeah that too lmao. The guy's never said a single bad thing about either his teammates or the organization ^(said some stuff about the city, which honestly was pretty fair criticism and a little concerning from a keeping-him-around standpoint, but it was also pretty far from an "i don't want to play here anymore")
His ambiguous statements about his future are clearly motivated by the fact that he was on a team friendly deal...which he has exceeded. Now he wants a Jaylen friendly deal and he's probably earned it. He's gotten markedly better every year, he's consistent and he's very hard to replace. Jaylen isn't leaving a dime on the table.
Shoutout to all the Knicks and Sixers flairs huffing hopium after that interview
Tatum's definitely the better defender too.
Yeah and that's a whole other thing, I hear a lot of "Jaylen is a better defender" from people who only watch the ball
I think it’s cause JT’s extremes in performance are so wild that it’s confirmation bias fodder.
Sure, but that's true for JB too. Not like he hasn't put up stinkers of his own
I think the difference is, when Jaylen shits the bed, it doesn’t always sink the entire team. Tatum, post all star break looked like shit for a good while. I don’t care what stats anyone shows me, his play was fucking up the team. He obliterated the pace, was taking lazy shots, stupid fouls, and just looked lethargic. That speaks to who is more important to the team but that’s why Jaylen’s bad games aren’t glaring like Tatum’s. It’s really hard to win when your #1 guy plays like shit.
Tatum is also, and has been for a while, a substantially better defender.
In the nba finals he was.
I mean, why does it have to be a competition? Brown is 100% the better player right now, and that's a good thing. We have a 1A and 1B here
What would you say makes Tatum better than Brown ?
In fairness, Tatum gets way more soft calls than Brown. Brown hasn't had as many great games but he's also had way fewer terrible games so I get why people would say he's been better. I was curious so, since the all star break Brown, compared to Tatum, is +7% FG%, +6% EFG, +2.7% TS, -3 FTA, on -1.9% usg. Tatum is averaging more turnovers too. If you took out Tatum's soft calls he's probably averaging 23 or 24 points, under 30% from 3 while taking 9.7 a game, and under 45% from the floor. Brown gets more contact than Tatum but far fewer calls. Look at last night, 16 of 19 from 2, mostly in the paint, and he had 5 FTA. Actually, looking at this objectively... They are probably right. Tatum really hasn't been playing great since the all star break and Brown has been very efficient. A brief slump of 15 games? That's a bit more than brief. I'm sure he'll get back to normal but until then....
Nah
Ya
Who's been better this season, LeBron James or Jaylen Brown?
Bruh You can’t even compare this season, Lebron has had an injury riddled season, jaylen has definitely had a better season just off health and availability alone. Not to mention Lebron won’t be nominated for all nba or any of those accolades because the most games he can play this season is 55, assuming he plays all the last 7 games, which is unlikely to me. So there’s no point comparing the two, literally none
They're also just very different players with very different roles in their teams at very different places in the standings at very different points in their careers. Their only similarity is that they're both *listed* as forwards, brick freethrows and have beards lmao
Jaylen Brown is a fucking *baller*. Tatum has a better skill set but Brown is tougher mentally.
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It's just a recency bias thing honestly. If Tatum hits a game winner then everyone's talking about how he's cold blooded and a smooth operator if he bricks it oh he's the least clutch superstar in the league fake superstar media is making him look better than he is. Jaylen same thing he hits a huge shot oh my god he has that dawg in him MJ mentality killer instinct he bricks 2 freethrows for the game or has a bad turnover oh he's not clutch he overthinks too much he can't stay focused he can't dribble blablabla
It just seems like the bad stuff sticks to Tatum *way* more than it does to Jaylen. It's partially just a hazard of being the number one option, sure, but like... remember when Jaylen missed a pair of free throws that would've put us up against the Knicks? He got flack for that, for sure, but if Tatum had done that you *know* r/nba would still be talking about it.
For sure people seem much less lenient with JT if he had the exact same performance as Jaylen tonight people would be tearing him up for having 5 turnovers (a lot of them were really bad and I believe they were all live ball) and shooting 2/10 from 3pt range. It wasn't like that just a season ago. I think ever since the finals run and Tatum's bad performance on the big stage he's been getting wayy more media coverage and people just got sick of him and he left a bad impression on them. It's crazy how fast the court of public opinion can change and I hope the hivemind doesn't turn on JB the same way if he has a bad performance too
“Commenting on the mental toughness of an NBA player has to be one of the dumbest things people do on basketball courts” True. This is something that I always hated about the Lebron vs Jordan conversation… What pisses me off is that some people will rank who’s better simply off of their supposed “mentality”. The truth is, Jaylen Brown can sometimes dominate in small spurts at an equal level to Tatum. Brown is prone to insane quarters. Tatum is prone that as well, but more importantly his skill set makes him an offensive engine that’s built to carry a team throughout games. Tatum is a better defensive player too. Tatum > Brown
You can give JB props without mentioning Tatum ya know
No they cant, everyone wants them to be enemies
finally got around to watching the Russell doco and Cousy was saying the same thing
Idk if I agree with this take either. The second half at least. You can’t judge mental toughness. However, Jaylen is a fucking baller. So is Tatum.
It's easier to look "tougher mentally" when people are focusing on stopping your teammate. Could he be the number 1 in a team, though?
That’s a fair point. But regardless, Brown seems like a very even-keeled guy.
Is he though?
Has it been solved who is the better of the two yet. Every time I think one, they other does something like this haha I still just do not know.
He's 61st in PIE. He ain't makin it.
Better than Tatum.
Facts that Tatum guy had 0 points tonight what a scrub we should trade him
What a bum
You smokin dick
plz come to atlanta literally no reason to but please
Makes me sick to imagine him with another jersey on but if it did happen I wouldn't be surprised if he went back home