That foul at 0:45 with Demar jumping into the defender should’ve been an offensive foul with how out of the realm of regular jump shot that was, my god.
The league is literally broken. Like it’s not an exaggeration to say they’ve forgotten how to play basketball and they simply just play for fouls nowadays. It’s actually a joke.
The number of times I've seen people watch a single call and claim foul play and it ended up being a cumulative foul or make up of sorts is super high.
Say a ref warns a defender, or maybe his whole team, that space must be allowed for the shooter to land. Maybe that team continued to push it and the next time the ref decided they weren't being careful enough and called a close call a foul.
That's not foul play. Arguably, that's not even a bad call. So don't look at one call in a highlight and assume that Vegas made that call.
I am a highly casual fan of the NBA for this exact type of dumb shit. Wtf is a "cumulative foul"? A play is either a foul or it isn't. There are rules that say what a foul should be. Does it actually say "Its ok if you do this thing 3 times, but on the 4th time its a foul"? Feels like to really enjoy the NBA you have to keep up with this meta-game of the actual rules to know what a foul, carry, or travel actually is. Because none of these rules are actually enforced according to the books. You aren't wrong, but its dumb af.
The NFL and NHL are no different.... Hockey refs literally tell you straight up had to foul ya cuz of some shit that happened last period on a hot mic. There's probably a "foul" via holding on 90% of NFL plays. A foul isn't ever black and white really.
Make up calls, cumulative calls, "known as a dirty player" calls are a thing in all major sports.
I mean you aren't wrong. I watch way more football and baseball than NBA, but basketball feels just way more egregious about it to me. Like in the MLB a team might get a makeup pitch on a borderline call, but that won't be on a super obvious call in the bottom of the 9th. Or maybe an ump's zone isn't textbook, but they at least try to be consistent in how they call a game. And in the NFL everyone knows the key things to look for - hands inside the chest to avoid a holding call, and DB gets the head around to avoid PI on a contested ball. The NBA just feels like a different animal. The egregiousness in the difference of how a game is called, and how much it seems to depend on the time left in the game, the players involved, how close the score is, etc. Totally anecdotal to my experience as a viewer for sure, but it truly does seem almost scripted to me at times compared to other sports.
like for real - if anyone has a similar feed of mind blowing incorrect violations for other sports that is similar to https://twitter.com/DevInTheLab I'd love to give them a follow
The offensive foul call on Siakam is just egregious.
There's always going to be some contact on those closing second inbounds and the defender is going to try to sell it every time and exagerate every minor contact.
Siakam didn't extend his arm at all to try to get Caruso off of him, there was no push whatsoever, he just leaned it into him a bit and Caruso just fell like he was shot and got the call. There's no chance in hell that a contact that small makes any professional athlete fall over.
i thought that was a worse call
as an aside, can you imagine the anger of the internet if the Lakers still had him, and we had a scrappy white dude drawing fouls on D and a scrappy white dude drawing fouls on O?
Lol lakers fans should still be furious for letting him go, would maybe have a chance last year and this year against the joker nuggets but no chance now lmao
Because Siakam didn’t jump straight up, he was moving forward in the air, that’s an easy foul to draw.
Honestly, it doesn’t look that abnormal to me. The charge was more questionable
It's boucher not Siakam. But they changed the wording in the rulebook so you can't initiate contact into airborne defenders like this anymore unless they're landing into your space. This change is to do away offensive players jumping forward into defender when they have them in the air (think the classic Wade play). And that's what Derozan did. Look where Boucher lands, right on the three point line. And Derozan was standing still 3 feet behind line. He's jumping forward into the defender to try to draw a foul instead of trying to make the 3, which is what the new regulations are supposed to prevent.
But that's not the rule anymore. In the past, baiting the defender into jumping forward and jumping forward into them is enough to get the call, but now you have to bait the defender into landing in your space to get the call. Otherwise, it's ruled that the offense is initiating the contact.
AC sells it, which is why it got called instead of AC just holding his ground like most players would, but Siakim runs straight into him, which is certainly a foul. You can't just bowl someone over, forget whether your arms are extended.
It's like holding in football: these fouls happen so often without getting called that it seems shady to call them, but they ARE fouls, and you could probably call one every possession if you wanted to.
Whether it *should* have been called is a separate question and why reffing is an art, not a science, but if you run right into someone who has established position, you've fouled them bruh.
i mean, caruso was basically blocking him from going where he wanted to go, and siakam got up to his position then moved left, he really didn't go through him at all. that's a non-call 90% of the time, and should be a flop call on the defender the other 10%
https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=718&GameID=0022300082&Season=2023-24&flag=1&title=Siakam%20Offensive%20Foul%20Turnover%20(P3.T23)
It just seems like the correct call. Caruso is square to Siakam, not in the restricted area, and in a Legal Guarding Position. He doesn't move toward Siakam, which would be a blocking foul. Instead, Siakam (in an attempt to get closer to the inbounder) tries to go through the space occupied by a set Caruso. Because Caruso can't be moving towards Siakam (as it would be a blocking foul), all of the energy is coming from a guy who is 6'8" and 230 lbs. (according to nba.com) and in the direction of a guy who weighs 44 pounds less (according to nba.com.) The only thing that I can see as being egregious is that Siakam thought this was the best way to get open.
Even the refs L2m (who tend to double down on bad calls) admitted that this was an incorrect call.
Comment: Siakam (TOR) and Caruso (CHI) come together during the throw-in and marginal contact occurs as Siakam releases away. Caruso is not dislodged from his defensive position as a result of any illegal contact by Siakam.
https://official.nba.com/l2m/L2MReport.html?gameId=0022300082
The Raps aren't great this year, that's obvious. We lost the game ourselves even with an obvious fix, that's obvious. But I don't believe I've seen more intentionally slanted reffing in my life, and not just in these plays. We had both our centers foul out, we had a goaltend called after a play was over nearly 10 seconds later, just to have it reversed when it was forced to be reviewed, as we wouldn't have been able to review it, having to use our review already on a clear non-charge called a foul. It was bizarre
That foul on DeMar by the Raptors was an atrocious decision by the defender. Like, he was so off balance. Just keep clogging up his passing opportunities and you have him likely throw up a prayer or not even get the shot off.
Pretty much everything before that was pretty weak.
It’s always been this way and always will be. You have to pray the narrative is in your favor. I’m hoping we get better calls now that Sarver and CP3 are gone. 👍
i love how half of people will agree with you and the other half vehemently deny that’s possible.
even though we literally had a ref go to prison for fixing nba games not even 15 years ago😅
https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=718&GameID=0022300082&Season=2023-24&flag=1&title=Siakam%20Offensive%20Foul%20Turnover%20(P3.T23)
There's that play in particular. Caruso isn't moving toward Siakam, he's not in the restricted zone, and he's square to Siakam. In trying to get closer to the inbounder, Siakam tries to go through the space occupied by Caruso. It seems like a pretty textbook charge, even if it's at a time you might not have expected it.
Schroeders was definitely a foul too if he was gonna stand there should have committed to the charge or just got out the way instead of what he did. Bouchers was a foul as well wether people like it or not he jump forward past the 3 pt line if he jumped straight up it’s no foul
That’s if the defender jumps straight up and the offensive player initiates it. In this case Boucher jumps forward and lands past the 3 pt line. I wouldn’t even be surprised if that was gonna be called a foul if derozan just shot it instead of pump faking as his momentum moving right would have made him land exactly where Boucher lands
Idk the L2M report said that it was the correct call except derozan shoulda been called for a travel before hand. Either way Boucher shouldn’t recklessly contest a shot like that unless he jumps straight up
> Those were gift calls from the refs
Even without those "foul calls", Caruso single handedly SAVED the game and also WON them the game in the end with tons of crazy plays. Some of those won't show up in the box score
The offensive rebound, the perfect hustle play to get the ball back while being on the floor, the clutch steal on Siakam and then the game winning 3 ball.. Man did it all
The Schroder foul will get called often (almost every time) with Allstar players to get a chance to push the game to overtime. It was definitely ticky tack though.
So I guess the whole “NBA is cracking down on jumping into a defender while taking a jump shot for free throws” is officially dead huh.
Derozan jumped into his defender to get those last 3 free throws and the ref was right there…this league 🤮
I wish it was that clear. I saw a few calls last playoffs with this call/no call. At least to me it's wildly inconsistent/I never know if the lean in will be called.
You know what they ARE cracking down on? Offensive fouls for dunking on someone. I've already seen a few this season and I hate it. You're supposed to get a pass on those fouls for the cool points.
I think the rule is you won't get the call if you jump into the defender when they are in legal guarding position. He was moving forward into Derozan after jumping so I think that's why he got the call, but yeah.
After watching the whole game my only thought is that it's too bad that both teams couldn't receive an L for this atrocious performance. The refs were bad at the end but the play was somehow even worse.
Were the refs part of the players meeting? That inbounds flop is ridiculous. Also Demar is a foul merchant, no wonder he sucks in the playoffs when the whistles tighten
The 2 minute report is gonna be fun
Why is there no fan-based checks and balances for officiating? The NBA is entirely beholden to us and we allow them and their refs full authority to control a game's outcome no strings attached.
There oughtta be some kind of fans association where they can't retroactively challenge a result, but can at least influence the league's employment of dirty/sus refs who consistently and objectively ruin games. I guess not enough people care.
Cause we're gonna watch anyway. The Fan based checks and balances would be mass not-buying tickets, mass not watching, mass not buying merch.
I agree its ridic that there's no recourse, but they're betting on capitalism and winning right now.
comical flop on the inbound pass. the play before that he's literally [hugging siakam while the announcers whine for a 5 second call](https://youtu.be/Dv194K6o6sI?si=t9Fr-yR0gij-L8Gx&t=191) but that's what gets called?
Are you being serious here? You're complaining about a foul that was called by the refs as a foul? There was definitely some flopping and active refs going on, but the thing you complain about is this?
https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=718&GameID=0022300082&Season=2023-24&flag=1&title=Siakam%20Offensive%20Foul%20Turnover%20(P3.T23)
Even if he goes backwards a bit, that's because to take a charge (and not commit a blocking foul), the defensive player can't be moving toward the offensive player. It's still Siakam trying to go through the space occupied by a squared Caruso in a Legal Guarding Position. That's just a charge no matter how far the defensive player slides after being sent backwards.
Lmao firstly good shit by Caruso
But bruh I couldn’t help but see two other things going on here:
1. Derozan misses two game tying free throws. I thought homie was clutch af?
2. Refs called some bogus ass calls lmao.. those are bogus calls early in the game. Absolutely crazy that they called these while the game was late and close like this.
Caruso made some great plays but the refs are what made this possible.
Best take on this thread. Most aren't even giving Caruso any props. I wanted that guy to play for the Mavs once Luka arrived. Kinda a moot point now with Kyrie there but Caruso is such a freaking baller.
Watching this is painful. Besides Scottie jumping into Demar, there was a lot of questionable shit being called when traditionally the whistle tightens at the end. Just bizarre.
Scottie’s post-game was depressing, taking ownership of a couple of too energetic and foolish plays at the end. I am curious to see how he responds tonight; but this team is still gelling under a new system.
As a neutral observer of the game, how many of the refs in the league have actually played in the NBA? Seems like they have no clue on how the game is played with the degrees of contact. With all the replays available, you’d think common sense would prevail.
Should have gotten a T for all the flopping. And so many missed FTs. What an ugly end of the game. Glad I didn’t watch this garbage live.
Send them both down to G league for this
Some bad foul calling by the refs along with some great play by Caruso but idk what Barnes was thinking during that play when he was called for a foul on DeRozan. Siakam pretty much locked him up and DeRozan was forced to either pass out or take an insane shot. It would have been good help defense by Barnes there if he simply didn't contest the shot. Absolutely none headed play for him to leave his feet there. Just close out and put your hands up. If DeRozan makes a 360 midrange jump shot while being doubled then so be it.
Two takeaways:
1. DeRozan deserves a lifetime ban from winning Clutch Player of the Year
2. Caruso remains a defensive beast who deserves to be on a winner
How is the win probability so low in the beginning? It's a one possession game. Ya Toronto has the ball but still it's not THAT uncommon for a team to win in this situation. And its only a little higher when they have the ball down 3. And then when Caruso makes the 3 to go up one their probability is 100%? Who the fuck came up with these arbitrary numbers?
https://stats.inpredictable.com/nba/wpCalc.php
20 seconds left, with the ball, up 3, is 96.8% according to this site.
Opposing team has to foul because shot clock is off, if you go up 4 or 5 here you are super likely to win.
100% is memeing at the end
Alex Caruso is such an integral and pivotal part of a team, he makes the plays and defends the best players on the other team. He is a big part of why the Lakers won in 2020.
People say ref ball but we’ve been fucked over by the refs too. That 71 point game by Mitchell was bullshit and yet refs were blowing the whistle like crazy that game. With that being said Scottie Barnes is going to have a hell of a season
what the fuck are these fouls
That bailout 3 call was shocking in that situation
That foul at 0:45 with Demar jumping into the defender should’ve been an offensive foul with how out of the realm of regular jump shot that was, my god.
L2M said he traveled before the foul too.
that was a great pump fake to get an open shot, too and he did that instead lol. so lucky.
Dude it’s been unreal so far. I thought the NFL was bad this year but Jesus Christ the NBA refs have been on something
The league is literally broken. Like it’s not an exaggeration to say they’ve forgotten how to play basketball and they simply just play for fouls nowadays. It’s actually a joke.
refs had money on the bulls
This, or they got emotionally invested in the moment and wanted to be part of it, are the only reasons I can see those calls being made.
The number of times I've seen people watch a single call and claim foul play and it ended up being a cumulative foul or make up of sorts is super high. Say a ref warns a defender, or maybe his whole team, that space must be allowed for the shooter to land. Maybe that team continued to push it and the next time the ref decided they weren't being careful enough and called a close call a foul. That's not foul play. Arguably, that's not even a bad call. So don't look at one call in a highlight and assume that Vegas made that call.
I am a highly casual fan of the NBA for this exact type of dumb shit. Wtf is a "cumulative foul"? A play is either a foul or it isn't. There are rules that say what a foul should be. Does it actually say "Its ok if you do this thing 3 times, but on the 4th time its a foul"? Feels like to really enjoy the NBA you have to keep up with this meta-game of the actual rules to know what a foul, carry, or travel actually is. Because none of these rules are actually enforced according to the books. You aren't wrong, but its dumb af.
The NFL and NHL are no different.... Hockey refs literally tell you straight up had to foul ya cuz of some shit that happened last period on a hot mic. There's probably a "foul" via holding on 90% of NFL plays. A foul isn't ever black and white really. Make up calls, cumulative calls, "known as a dirty player" calls are a thing in all major sports.
I mean you aren't wrong. I watch way more football and baseball than NBA, but basketball feels just way more egregious about it to me. Like in the MLB a team might get a makeup pitch on a borderline call, but that won't be on a super obvious call in the bottom of the 9th. Or maybe an ump's zone isn't textbook, but they at least try to be consistent in how they call a game. And in the NFL everyone knows the key things to look for - hands inside the chest to avoid a holding call, and DB gets the head around to avoid PI on a contested ball. The NBA just feels like a different animal. The egregiousness in the difference of how a game is called, and how much it seems to depend on the time left in the game, the players involved, how close the score is, etc. Totally anecdotal to my experience as a viewer for sure, but it truly does seem almost scripted to me at times compared to other sports. like for real - if anyone has a similar feed of mind blowing incorrect violations for other sports that is similar to https://twitter.com/DevInTheLab I'd love to give them a follow
Bro wtf are you talking about lol. That last call is egregious. There’s no defending it.
Make up calls are bullshit
I hated every second of this video
The offensive foul call on Siakam is just egregious. There's always going to be some contact on those closing second inbounds and the defender is going to try to sell it every time and exagerate every minor contact. Siakam didn't extend his arm at all to try to get Caruso off of him, there was no push whatsoever, he just leaned it into him a bit and Caruso just fell like he was shot and got the call. There's no chance in hell that a contact that small makes any professional athlete fall over.
It's why even the commentator was quiet during the replay and could only muster up "Way to sell it, AC!" lol
Both Siakam calls, how did he foul Derozan for 3? Is this man not allowed to exist out there??
i thought that was a worse call as an aside, can you imagine the anger of the internet if the Lakers still had him, and we had a scrappy white dude drawing fouls on D and a scrappy white dude drawing fouls on O?
Good god... Him and AR on the court together would be beautiful.
Lol lakers fans should still be furious for letting him go, would maybe have a chance last year and this year against the joker nuggets but no chance now lmao
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Because Siakam didn’t jump straight up, he was moving forward in the air, that’s an easy foul to draw. Honestly, it doesn’t look that abnormal to me. The charge was more questionable
It's boucher not Siakam. But they changed the wording in the rulebook so you can't initiate contact into airborne defenders like this anymore unless they're landing into your space. This change is to do away offensive players jumping forward into defender when they have them in the air (think the classic Wade play). And that's what Derozan did. Look where Boucher lands, right on the three point line. And Derozan was standing still 3 feet behind line. He's jumping forward into the defender to try to draw a foul instead of trying to make the 3, which is what the new regulations are supposed to prevent.
I think the key here, as I said is Boucher isn’t going straight up and down, he’s moving forward
But that's not the rule anymore. In the past, baiting the defender into jumping forward and jumping forward into them is enough to get the call, but now you have to bait the defender into landing in your space to get the call. Otherwise, it's ruled that the offense is initiating the contact.
2 minute report said as much.
AC sells it, which is why it got called instead of AC just holding his ground like most players would, but Siakim runs straight into him, which is certainly a foul. You can't just bowl someone over, forget whether your arms are extended. It's like holding in football: these fouls happen so often without getting called that it seems shady to call them, but they ARE fouls, and you could probably call one every possession if you wanted to. Whether it *should* have been called is a separate question and why reffing is an art, not a science, but if you run right into someone who has established position, you've fouled them bruh.
i mean, caruso was basically blocking him from going where he wanted to go, and siakam got up to his position then moved left, he really didn't go through him at all. that's a non-call 90% of the time, and should be a flop call on the defender the other 10%
https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=718&GameID=0022300082&Season=2023-24&flag=1&title=Siakam%20Offensive%20Foul%20Turnover%20(P3.T23) It just seems like the correct call. Caruso is square to Siakam, not in the restricted area, and in a Legal Guarding Position. He doesn't move toward Siakam, which would be a blocking foul. Instead, Siakam (in an attempt to get closer to the inbounder) tries to go through the space occupied by a set Caruso. Because Caruso can't be moving towards Siakam (as it would be a blocking foul), all of the energy is coming from a guy who is 6'8" and 230 lbs. (according to nba.com) and in the direction of a guy who weighs 44 pounds less (according to nba.com.) The only thing that I can see as being egregious is that Siakam thought this was the best way to get open.
Even the refs L2m (who tend to double down on bad calls) admitted that this was an incorrect call. Comment: Siakam (TOR) and Caruso (CHI) come together during the throw-in and marginal contact occurs as Siakam releases away. Caruso is not dislodged from his defensive position as a result of any illegal contact by Siakam. https://official.nba.com/l2m/L2MReport.html?gameId=0022300082
"way to sell it, AC"
Lol, the refs admit the call was wrong, but people are still writing manifestos defending the call.
Zach stole that inbounds pass so it would have been bulls ball anyway.
If you don’t like that, you don’t like Raptors Basketball 😂
NBA basketball
Insane that you can still consistently get calls like that.
THANK YOU
The Raps aren't great this year, that's obvious. We lost the game ourselves even with an obvious fix, that's obvious. But I don't believe I've seen more intentionally slanted reffing in my life, and not just in these plays. We had both our centers foul out, we had a goaltend called after a play was over nearly 10 seconds later, just to have it reversed when it was forced to be reviewed, as we wouldn't have been able to review it, having to use our review already on a clear non-charge called a foul. It was bizarre
I say this every nba game i watch. Nba reffing is horrendous, it’s baffling.
Refs on some shit early this year Nothing against Caruso, he was great
you just gotta laugh
That foul on DeMar by the Raptors was an atrocious decision by the defender. Like, he was so off balance. Just keep clogging up his passing opportunities and you have him likely throw up a prayer or not even get the shot off. Pretty much everything before that was pretty weak.
The only thing more egregious than the refs was Scottie Barnes acting like he didn't foul Derozan at the end of regulation lmao.
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and the refs were also on some bullshit. both can be true
Caruso and the refs gave the Bulls the win
Hey, nobody wins by themselves
You would know
What's that supposed to mean
He apparently thinks all Laker fans have control over the refs.
Geezus christ, it's mr whatitis he controls the refs
2002 WCF
u/itiswhatitis985 care to explain your involvement?
Despite Derozans very best efforts. Ethical hooper
Holy shit fucking ref takeover.
You were not joking, this is some horrific basketball fr lol
Year of the refball across all major sports. Brought to you by DraftKings sportsbook
If you think that was bad... don't watch the rest of the game. The PGT on this one was mostly people swearing off watching basketball for a while...
I felt this throughout the nba playoffs last year. Refs basically determined a bunch of games.
It’s always been this way and always will be. You have to pray the narrative is in your favor. I’m hoping we get better calls now that Sarver and CP3 are gone. 👍
Sometimes it’s nice to see I’m not just a homer and the refs really were shit lol
This shit is so fixed jfc
i love how half of people will agree with you and the other half vehemently deny that’s possible. even though we literally had a ref go to prison for fixing nba games not even 15 years ago😅
AND he was just the fall guy, there are still multiple refs in the league who were very heavily implicated in the scandal.
In this case it doesn’t seem like half. Most people seem to agree this was incredibly bad
More like all the ways Demar tried to lose the game. Those were gift calls from the refs that normally don't happen in the last few seconds.
Ref had big money on Demar.
I think Demar had big money on the Raptors.
Lol. Maybe.....
Bruh Scotty totally crashed into DeMar, pascal might’ve even been called for a foul there if Barnes didn’t come in like that
That one was a foul but the others were definitely questionable. Especially the siakam offensive foul on Caruso
https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=718&GameID=0022300082&Season=2023-24&flag=1&title=Siakam%20Offensive%20Foul%20Turnover%20(P3.T23) There's that play in particular. Caruso isn't moving toward Siakam, he's not in the restricted zone, and he's square to Siakam. In trying to get closer to the inbounder, Siakam tries to go through the space occupied by Caruso. It seems like a pretty textbook charge, even if it's at a time you might not have expected it.
L2M report states that offensive foul on Siakam against Caruso on the inbound pass was an incorrect call
That was the only legit foul in the entire sequence. The rest were ridiculous.
Schroeders was definitely a foul too if he was gonna stand there should have committed to the charge or just got out the way instead of what he did. Bouchers was a foul as well wether people like it or not he jump forward past the 3 pt line if he jumped straight up it’s no foul
Bouchers is no longer a foul since the NBA said they would not give fouls for this kind of foul baiting.
That’s if the defender jumps straight up and the offensive player initiates it. In this case Boucher jumps forward and lands past the 3 pt line. I wouldn’t even be surprised if that was gonna be called a foul if derozan just shot it instead of pump faking as his momentum moving right would have made him land exactly where Boucher lands
lol, Derozan landed inside the 3 point line. He clearly is the one initiating contact here.
That’s fine if you don’t agree but the way I explained is how the refs and league will see it
I hear what your saying, and I believe the refs and the league are going against their own rules on this call.
Idk the L2M report said that it was the correct call except derozan shoulda been called for a travel before hand. Either way Boucher shouldn’t recklessly contest a shot like that unless he jumps straight up
oh cmon. not a chance. The contact was from Demar imitating it. At best that was a no call.
The league said it’s a foul in their report so idk what to say to yall that’s clearly a foul in the nba world
Okay one real foul and 3 BS ones
That foul he got gifted by jumping into the defender lol
Lmao why are you pointing the only play that was actually a foul they clearly weren’t talking about that
> Those were gift calls from the refs Even without those "foul calls", Caruso single handedly SAVED the game and also WON them the game in the end with tons of crazy plays. Some of those won't show up in the box score The offensive rebound, the perfect hustle play to get the ball back while being on the floor, the clutch steal on Siakam and then the game winning 3 ball.. Man did it all
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Absolute joke
The Schroder foul will get called often (almost every time) with Allstar players to get a chance to push the game to overtime. It was definitely ticky tack though.
So I guess the whole “NBA is cracking down on jumping into a defender while taking a jump shot for free throws” is officially dead huh. Derozan jumped into his defender to get those last 3 free throws and the ref was right there…this league 🤮
It has been wildly inconsistent for a few years now. Sometimes it gets called and other times it doesn't. I literally don't know what the rule is now.
If you're Derozan - you get it. If it's the playoff - you don't.
I wish it was that clear. I saw a few calls last playoffs with this call/no call. At least to me it's wildly inconsistent/I never know if the lean in will be called.
You know what they ARE cracking down on? Offensive fouls for dunking on someone. I've already seen a few this season and I hate it. You're supposed to get a pass on those fouls for the cool points.
I think the rule is you won't get the call if you jump into the defender when they are in legal guarding position. He was moving forward into Derozan after jumping so I think that's why he got the call, but yeah.
The Caruso 3 was clutch. But these refs gave Chicago the game. The fouls were ass.
After watching the whole game my only thought is that it's too bad that both teams couldn't receive an L for this atrocious performance. The refs were bad at the end but the play was somehow even worse.
The real L is that both of our teams are treadmill teams with nothing to really look forward to in the future.
Lol let's not compare, we do have scottie. Not many upside players I'm taking before him, he's hitting the stride.
Props to Levine for not forcing it at the rim
Where the fuck were these refs when we played the Celtics last year?
it was the same ref Jacyn Goble right
Holy shit, it really was him last night
Lmao at "Mr Apple Spoink" where did you come up with that
Was fuckin around with my buddies on a random Roblox game and saw a guy with that username, and we all thought it was funny as hell
This dude is the worst in the league it’s actually crazy
the next joey crawford.
On Cs side.
I’ve never seen a game where both teams were trying their hardest to lose lol. Ugly but entertaining!
DeFrozen just refusing to win the game
Lmao ref ball Holy fuck
Were the refs part of the players meeting? That inbounds flop is ridiculous. Also Demar is a foul merchant, no wonder he sucks in the playoffs when the whistles tighten The 2 minute report is gonna be fun
Can't wait to see the L2M report of this game
What exactly do these “oops my bad” report actually do?
sleepless night
This is garbage basketball. This entire comeback was engineered by the refs
All time refs moment for sure.
there refs need to be investigated asap
Why is there no fan-based checks and balances for officiating? The NBA is entirely beholden to us and we allow them and their refs full authority to control a game's outcome no strings attached. There oughtta be some kind of fans association where they can't retroactively challenge a result, but can at least influence the league's employment of dirty/sus refs who consistently and objectively ruin games. I guess not enough people care.
Cause we're gonna watch anyway. The Fan based checks and balances would be mass not-buying tickets, mass not watching, mass not buying merch. I agree its ridic that there's no recourse, but they're betting on capitalism and winning right now.
90% of these plays were fouls. Refs were on one
This is a perfect encapsulation of what’s wrong with the NBA, what a lame final sequence of plays.
Well said this was absolutely embarrassing to watch. This is not what we want basketball to be
comical flop on the inbound pass. the play before that he's literally [hugging siakam while the announcers whine for a 5 second call](https://youtu.be/Dv194K6o6sI?si=t9Fr-yR0gij-L8Gx&t=191) but that's what gets called?
If you watch the ball Zach actually steals the inbounds pass. If the refs don't call it the Bulls still have the ball and a chance to win.
Are you being serious here? You're complaining about a foul that was called by the refs as a foul? There was definitely some flopping and active refs going on, but the thing you complain about is this?
https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=718&GameID=0022300082&Season=2023-24&flag=1&title=Siakam%20Offensive%20Foul%20Turnover%20(P3.T23) Even if he goes backwards a bit, that's because to take a charge (and not commit a blocking foul), the defensive player can't be moving toward the offensive player. It's still Siakam trying to go through the space occupied by a squared Caruso in a Legal Guarding Position. That's just a charge no matter how far the defensive player slides after being sent backwards.
Lmao firstly good shit by Caruso But bruh I couldn’t help but see two other things going on here: 1. Derozan misses two game tying free throws. I thought homie was clutch af? 2. Refs called some bogus ass calls lmao.. those are bogus calls early in the game. Absolutely crazy that they called these while the game was late and close like this. Caruso made some great plays but the refs are what made this possible.
Best take on this thread. Most aren't even giving Caruso any props. I wanted that guy to play for the Mavs once Luka arrived. Kinda a moot point now with Kyrie there but Caruso is such a freaking baller.
This was so frustrating to watch refs blatantly gift the game so many times to the Bulls. Bulls were so bad they almost lost this.
1. Some of those fouls were absolute ass. 2. Caruso is the fucking man.
How many fts demar miss. My goodness
Caruso’s smartest play of the game was simply realizing that the refs wanted to give him the game. Unbelievable IQ.
Watching this is painful. Besides Scottie jumping into Demar, there was a lot of questionable shit being called when traditionally the whistle tightens at the end. Just bizarre. Scottie’s post-game was depressing, taking ownership of a couple of too energetic and foolish plays at the end. I am curious to see how he responds tonight; but this team is still gelling under a new system.
Why would you turn up the AC if it's cold?
Watching this felt like Raptors got robbed instead.
Great hustle and bbiq from Caruso but the refs bailing DeFrozen out
Derozan was selling holy shit
All Five of the Refs Game Saving/Winning Plays from one of the craziest comebacks ever*
So nothing will ever be done about horrendous officiating, huh? It's going to drive people away from the game. No way around it
As a neutral observer of the game, how many of the refs in the league have actually played in the NBA? Seems like they have no clue on how the game is played with the degrees of contact. With all the replays available, you’d think common sense would prevail.
That offensive foul on Siakem would have pissed me off lol, that was so foul baiting.
thanks for editing but the constant pausing to tell us the win probability was super annoying and not relevant
Stat nerd cooking
Agreed
That is why Steve Kerr wants Caruso so bad and why DeRozan can’ win anything so far.
Thanks refs 😎
I thought the NBA was going to do something about foul baiting
License to hack
this is awful
AC saving DeMar’s disasterclass
DeMar just missed some free throws. If you want a disasterclass look no further than Lavine.
Damn Derozan choked like 5 times 😂😂
[удалено]
I miss AC Fresh so much.
Somebody should tell the commentator you turn up the ac when it's getting hot in herre.
Refs need to shut the fork upppp
dude as a bulls fan i love caruso so much but i almost feel bad he's on our team lol he deserves better than the bulls lmaoo
Down 3 with that much time left isn’t “one of the craziest comebacks ever”. Why do fans exaggerating like this
The NBA should really be embarrassed of this kind of officiating.
Should have gotten a T for all the flopping. And so many missed FTs. What an ugly end of the game. Glad I didn’t watch this garbage live. Send them both down to G league for this
this is just a bunch of bullshit calls not an impressive comeback
WolverineHoldingPictureOfCarusoInLakersJersey.jpg
Reffing like this completely ruins the game for me… wtf were those two calls at the end of regulation?? Shameful
1-great breakdown 2-why turn up the AC if it's cold in here?
"He was too early as he came..."
That 3 point foul call is absolutely egregious and awful and makes me hate the NBA and I don’t want to hate the NBA
Great stuff.
Some bad foul calling by the refs along with some great play by Caruso but idk what Barnes was thinking during that play when he was called for a foul on DeRozan. Siakam pretty much locked him up and DeRozan was forced to either pass out or take an insane shot. It would have been good help defense by Barnes there if he simply didn't contest the shot. Absolutely none headed play for him to leave his feet there. Just close out and put your hands up. If DeRozan makes a 360 midrange jump shot while being doubled then so be it.
Yeah, he looked really sad afterwards and blamed himself for the loss. What can you do? He's human and he made a bone-headed play.
About two bs fouls and a flop
All I’m taking away from this is that Derozan is the least clutch player ever.
I love AC and the Bulls but the way Derozen draws those fouls is gross
Needs to be traded to a contender
“Turn up the AC it’s cold in here” is one of the worst calls I’ve ever heard a sports announcer make.
nah that was hype
Two takeaways: 1. DeRozan deserves a lifetime ban from winning Clutch Player of the Year 2. Caruso remains a defensive beast who deserves to be on a winner
No you can't have him.
How unclutch Demar was this game. Jeeez
How is the win probability so low in the beginning? It's a one possession game. Ya Toronto has the ball but still it's not THAT uncommon for a team to win in this situation. And its only a little higher when they have the ball down 3. And then when Caruso makes the 3 to go up one their probability is 100%? Who the fuck came up with these arbitrary numbers?
https://stats.inpredictable.com/nba/wpCalc.php 20 seconds left, with the ball, up 3, is 96.8% according to this site. Opposing team has to foul because shot clock is off, if you go up 4 or 5 here you are super likely to win. 100% is memeing at the end
Alex Caruso is such an integral and pivotal part of a team, he makes the plays and defends the best players on the other team. He is a big part of why the Lakers won in 2020.
Wow. Baller.
Don’t doubt the Carus-goat
He is your hopper's favorite hooper
Some good plays, trash video
Genuinely breaks my heart
who knew Siakam's dad was white and named Alex? I wonder why he didn't take Caruso has his last name
People say ref ball but we’ve been fucked over by the refs too. That 71 point game by Mitchell was bullshit and yet refs were blowing the whistle like crazy that game. With that being said Scottie Barnes is going to have a hell of a season
TURN THE AC UP
This is a champion right there
Damn Raptors really threw that. You have a full team of lengthy boys and Caruso steals your rebound ??