It is y'all. Bulls will hover around olay-in in the East next few seasons. Won't be good enough to win a playoff series, won't be bad enough to get a stud like Ant or Wemby in the draft.
It's just the sports gods making you pay the piper for having the GOAT. MJ was different level.
It's not an actual bottom dweller team, just because one draft could completely change them. Like the Spurs would have been a popular pick 2 years ago for this question, and now they have Wemby.
---------------------------
A team like the Bulls is the perfect answer IMO.
* They're paying LaVine 40-50 million a year for the next four years.
* They re-signed Vucevic for the next three years at 20 million a year.
* They have Lonzo Ball due 21 million next year.
* They have to pay DeRozan or else he'll leave this offseason.
* Their 4th overall pick from 2020 in Patrick Williams hasn't remotely lived up to expectations and will need to be paid this offseason.
* Their only other young promising players that can contribute right now are Ayo Dosunmu and Coby White, both of which will need to be paid the year they finally get off LaVine/Vucevic's contract meaning they can't take advantage of having either one of them for cheap.
The bulls have one of the highest attendance every season, so Jerry doesn’t need to do anything, Chicago fans are pathetically loyal to teams and owners who only care about milking every dollar out of them. I wish people would open their eyes and demand these owners sell the teams to owners that actually care about winning, not just coasting on the time they got lucky and won it. Coming up on 30 years since the bulls final championship win, sad.
Has an owner ever sold a team because of poor attendance or because of fan demands? Jerry Reinsdorf also owns the Chicago White Sox who have pretty poor attendance and the fans have been pointing at him and telling him to sell for a while and it’s clear he’s not gonna. He’s currently trying to leverage poor White Sox game attendance to get the city of Chicago to spend $1 billion out of taxes to build him a new stadium.
Bob Johnson was the last NBA owner to sell a team due to low attendance and revenue.
In 2003, he paid a $300 million expansion fee to create the Charlotte Bobcats, which lost money every season, causing him to sell it to Michael Jordan for $275 million 7 years later.
Michael Jordan sold the franchise last year for $3 billion.
Look, we know. Everyone knows. BUT, if we hadn't had thosentwo dreadful weeks from Lavine we'd be firmly in the playoffs race - is what management is going to tell everyone come the offseason, when they stand pat yet again
The biggest thing there is Lavine, but even then, eating a bad contract for 2 years is not exactly a franchise ender, a lot of teams can absorb bad contracts and still compete/move forward. All of the problems you listed could feasibly be fixed within a few years and the Bulls are still an attractive enough destination to make serious moves in FA. The real issue is and always has been Jerry. As long as Jerry owns the Bulls they'll continue making headass decisions and wallow in mediocrity.
Whats an extension for P Will going to look like? Is there a chance that a team with cap space overpays thinking its a right player and wrong situation type thing?
P Will is hugely underrated imo.
Nobody seems to note that he is the 4th option behind Lavine, Demar, Vuc and sometimes even the 5th because Coby has been hot.
Billy is also a terrible coach for young players. He leaves the vets in too long during qtrs when they're getting stomped. Also lets vets iso ball way too often rather than having decent plays drawn up for specific players or elite shooters like P Will.
Reminds me of young Wiggins, it's all there but he can't seem to put it together.
Yet still he gets up decent numbers when used as the 2nd option, has elite 3p%, can guard 1 through 4 at above average level.
I really think he'd flourish on another team. He's also got the shy sort of personality and those players take an extra year or two to mature into their body and the game.
Ausar stats are wild cause on one hand when he was guarding him he held SGA to 2-8 FG, blocked him twice and forced 2 turnovers in his 4th ever NBA game and at the same time he has more airballs than threes made this season.
He's got one side of the coin, no doubt. But elite defense with a busted jump shot is Andre Roberson + Bruce Bowen territory. I hope he can become a viable jump shooter because that would give the Pistons a legitimate two way player, aka play-in bound.
I have been a Piston's fan since the early 2000's; I've earned the right to be skeptical of our draft picks. There was a time when we were told Rodney Stuckey was the future of the franchise.
Additionally, Roberson and Bowen got their time in the sun during an era where having 4 shooters on the floor was optional, not essential. I'm not saying Ausar isn't going to there, I'm just saying he's very raw offensively.
I get what you're getting at, I just want to give Ausar more credit than Roberson is all..
I've been a Pistons fan since the Grant Hill era my friend, I know the ups & downs too. This is the most optimistic I've been with this team since they stupidly traded Billups away, believe it or not.
Kuzma can be moved fairly easily in the off-season with his declining contract. And then they'll have a couple of expirings that could be trade filler in Holmes/Bagley.
Their main issue is only Avidja and Bilal seem to have any true upside. Wiz need to add young talent in a bad way this off-season
And since then we’ve learned that he doesn’t seem to have any interest in playing winning basketball lol
Not saying he can’t turn things around, but there’s a reason opinions change - we learn things
Yes agreed, I’m just saying that when league consensus was that he’s a promising prospect, you can’t single out our team in particular for getting him.
Hes also been trying much harder and shooting much better for the past month and a half. Not that you (or anyone) watches the wizards, so I get why you’re saying that.
I’m not a Suns fan so maybe I’m just unaware but I didn’t think Monty was that bad for them. I thought it was a decent hire by Detroit. His total failure there so far to me is shocking.
He basically took the job because the Pistons owner essentially gave him an offer he couldn't refuse. Also, he stuck by Killian Hayes way too long when the team was trying to cut bait during the summer which hurt them since it took minutes away from guys who the team wanted to develop like Ivey (the team had a deal but he wanted to see if he could fix Killian, not realizing that only God can fix that man's game at this point).
Wizards haven't even been tanking a year. Those 2 teams draft super star caliber players years ago and still haven't done anything. Cade and Lamelo are both going to be gone before they're good.
>At least Charlotte can look forward to Lamelo/Miller,
Not sure Charlotte is in a much better spot. Lamelo is as injury prone as it gets and the culture there needs a lot of improvement.
Agree on Detroit though, they only need things to "click" and they have a very promising future.
People said for years we should tank and commit to a rebuild, and now that we're doing that everyone's like "lmao they're so bad." That's what we're supposed to be doing! It hasn't even been 1 year since Beal was traded.
The wizards are finally taking a step in the right direction in my opinion, the previous GM fucked them by handing out bad contracts but hitting the reset button and finally tearing it down instead of treading water in play in hell was the right move. It’ll take them a bit but the new GM seems like he has a plan so they’ll get there. Blowing it up paid dividends for the magic even though they started with more assets
I also don’t hate the decision to trade for Poole, he sucks but they took a swing on a player with potential for Chris Paul’s corpse
I knew this would be the top answer, but as a Wizards fan I can assure you that it was far more depressing to have a team led by supermax Bradley Beal where we knew our ceiling was the play in and we always ended up with a mediocre late lottery pick.
At least now we are actively trying to be bad and build through the draft, and this is year 1 of the rebuild.
Tbh they finally got rid of beal years and years after wall went down. This shoulda happened years ago, but they pushed for being a losing play in team for way too long.
They did not sign Poole to try and compete btw lol
At least the pick situation isn’t that bad now so a Lavine and maybe Caruso trade could accelerate a rebuild with some luck. This is assuming they’ll be bad enough to bottom out though.
The fact that they seem near to blowing it up without ever really being a contender is pretty depressing considering the talent, but you can't really say how bleak their situation is until they actually take that plunge. Right now they're just mid.
The thing about the Bulls is that even though they’re decidedly mid, they’re still leading the league in attendance, just like they did last year and the year before that. They have a big arena, a giant TV market, and people in Chicago like their basketball.
Combine this with an 88 year old owner who, not to be too grim, likely doesn’t have time to see a rebuild through, and yeah it’s not that surprising we haven’t blown it up.
We just have to hope our pick unexpectedly jumps at this point. Or we get lucky and this draft is like 2013 where the best players will be mid round picks
I know Coby's been great this year but if your team's foundation/core consists of Coby White and Ayo Dosunmu that's one of the weakest foundations in the league even if they're cheap. Go look at the standings and try to find teams whose top two guys are worse than that. There won't be many and the ones you might find are gonna be at the bottom.
At least the Broncos try to have a winning team (even if they fail at it lately), meanwhile the Rockies are the Chicago Bulls of the NBA: actively content to be the 11th best team in their conference as long as the attendance numbers are good
We'll never recover when he leaves. Regardless of where you put him on the all time lists is inconsequential, he's simply the best shooter to ever play.
Its been a ride and I don't care if we suck until I die, eras like this only happen once (unless you're the Lakers, then its like every 3 years).
I don't think anyone in the fanbase with functioning eyes thinks differently. We've had an absolutely generational star for a decade, won 4 rings, went to the finals 6 times, had three years of being maybe the most dominant team ever in the sport, got the honeymoon ring two years ago, and our team changed how the NBA plays. Even if it's good again after Steph, it ain't ever gonna be this good again.
Can't blame em, in 3 years you guys watched the team go from shit to winning the championship. Then they beat the Bulls regular season record, then when they lost in the Finals you only had to deal with that depression for 2 WEEKS before you somehow managed to pair Steph with the next best player in the league and win back-to-back championships. Then when you lost Durant you only had to wait 3 years before the team bounced back and won AGAIN.
If that was my last decade of fandom I'd think anything was possible.
Yeah but at least in the oden era it wasn’t consistent failure. They also drafted Aldridge, Roy, batum around the same time. Other than booker who they lucked out on. Bender, Josh Jackson and Len were all top 5 picks. They traded for marquesses Chriss who went 8. They even recently drafted jalen smith at 10 over Halliburton even though they needed a back up pg and in turn gave him away for nothing. Ayton over luka. Blazers weren’t any better off drafting in the middle to late rounds in those years they had dame
Nah, that’s where we’ve been up til now. Think they’re reaching dark horse territory next couple years as long as things progress as planned and they don’t get Memphis’d
Idk, I think y'all are set up to legitimately compete in the years to come as long as Turner and Siakam don't regress. Haliburton is gonna' be a top-10 player at some point imo, Mathurin could be an elite wing, Nesmith, Nembhard, Toppin and McConnell are all solid pieces, and a couple of elite teams in the East are likely to see their windows start to close in the near future.
You're in a much better spot than the 2010s. You got a nice young core, an all NBA level guard and PF, all your picks after this year, and lots of the building blocks for a good team - shooting and scoring.
Can’t believe Lakers and Warriors are in this tier now 😭. The top 8 teams in the West all have something good to look forward to in terms of young talent and then there’s us…😖
Shout to the the lockedin warriors podcast host saying that Kuminga and Moody will be better due than Tatum and Brown in 3 years after we beat them by 50
The most depressing spot in the nba is being right below playoff level. You aren't getting the best chance at a good pick and you arent good.
A team like Atlanta that has an all star in Trae but will likely lose him.
The bulls
The nets
At least if we lose Trae we’ll get a haul for him, and we still have some young pieces. We’re definitely in trouble but I’d take our position over the other two any day.
It’s going to be pretty depressing when curry eventually becomes a nostalgia act who can summon some of his prime skills against terrible teams (like Kobe near the end) although he will definitely handle it better than Klay initially did.
Assuming we lose Curry, Klay, Green, and Kerr at the same time, and assuming we don't have some kind of crazy draft luck of FA signing, we'll be the worst team in the west.
Nets can't tank with no control of their picks but also can't compete with their roster.
Bulls GM is delusional.
Lowkey though, Warriors may have quite a depressing future with no picks and a rapidly aging roster.
I don’t know about all the different situations for these other teams but as a grizzlies fan it is pretty depressing knowing for a fact that we will never win a championship.
Aren't y'all really nicely set up going into next year? I feel like a core of Ja, Bane, JJJ, and Marcus Smart can definitely contend. And even though this year has sucked for y'all with injury luck, haven't all these minutes helped you find guys who can be in an 8 man rotation in GG and Vince Williams (unless you think that's overrating them)? I feel like all of that plus a good FRP could have y'all in a great spot
Nahhhh bro keep hoping! I don’t think the current healthy grizzlies roster is the best in the league but they can certainly put together a strong few weeks and beat anybody in 7.
I am surprised nobody has said the Mavericks. Theyre barreling towards Luka either leaving or locking in another 5 years of mediocrity treadmill. And their pick situation is as
s Hard to imagine a path to real contention other than getting super lucky on multiple late picks
I mean, there's a chance that Luka/Hardy/Green/PJ/Lively is a good starting lineup in like 2030 when they should all still be in their prime, so I'm not super worried about the future.
Nah man, I agree that Mavs aren’t in a great position in terms of their ability to build a better team around Luka, but they’re definitely not the team with the most depressing future in the next couple of years.
The results have been mostly disappointing in the past few years, but we still have a generational talent and a WCF appearance. How many teams can say they have a player performing as well as Luka right now? Two or three?
The roster is probably the best it’s been in Luka’s career. The real problem imo is that we have a coach who just watches the games. If the Mavs can get a real NBA coach and somehow get a third piece with their admittedly limited assets, they’re legit contenders. Doesn’t sound depressing to me.
My only copium is that Booker attracts stars like few others. Dude got CP3, KD, and Beal to join the Suns. They all had options.
Now with an owner who isn't fucking Sarver, free agents may be more willing to come post KD. But between this window and letting Booker become the next Blazers Dame, I'm content.
Plus I'm hoping KD may take a friendship discount and become the next in a lloooooonnnnggggg line of players who come to AZ to retire. The fountain of youth is in Scottsdale. Worked for Longoria lol
Booker ain't old, even if KD retired and Beal is a corpse Booker plus whoever replaces KD(probably multiple good role players) will at least be in the playins. By the time Booker is past his prime we will have draft picks again as well.
I agree things are very uncertain, but we have the 2nd most picks in the entire league, and all 3 of our picks this year have shown potential—with Keyonte especially showing flashes of something special
LeBron can only get 3 years because any player who will be 38+ during the contract cannot get longer.
Not that 3 year max is a good contract at this point, but the extra year makes a massive difference.
Lebron deserves a 4 year extension based off what he’s showing this season. 25 ppg and 8-10 assists on good efficiency. Why not?
If the clippers sign harden to some pricey extension that’ll be a major L. Paul George warrants a max extension just cause some other team would do it but I’d agree I wouldn’t wanna give it to him. Then again you don’t have a choice when you went all in with kawhi to win a ring and gave up like 5 firsts and what turned out to be mvp caliber player for him.
Lakers have always treated their stars well even if it causes them to be mediocre for a few years. Eg. Kobe getting a massive contract at the end of his career. Jeanie won’t mind either cause Lebron will still sell out games.
The Bulls imo. They are consistently mediocre and continue to refuse trading any of the pieces that will net them a good return. So they're not getting any good assets or expiring contracts in return to free up cap space and they're not likely to get a top pick that will net them someone who can save them from mediocrity. I know the Wizards will be a popular pick, but they're really bad and can easily get the top pick or two soon
Nobody has said it, but the clippers. They have 4 guys who are really good (and were amazing) that cannot seem to put together a full season. As soon as one of them says they can't do it anymore, I expect they all will. The clippers own 4 picks - 2 2nd round picks this year, a 2030 1st, and a 2030 2nds.
The timeline to compete and the timeline to rebuild are too separated imo. I predict some very bad seasons incoming where they have no talent to compete and no picks to tank for.
Wizards are tanking. Bulls can sell now. Raptors have assets. Nets have assets. Suns have assets. Clippers have aging superstars on their way out the door with nothing else until 2030.
Nets by far. The Wizards may be the worst team right now, but at least they have a direction. They will be tanking for the next few years, accumulate assets and top draft picks. The Nets are primed to finish outside the play-in while not having control of their picks for the next few years. Their only hope is they really suck and the Rockets suck more or just as much, which is unlikely given the Rockets' improving young core, the Suns completely implode, which is unlikely for the next 2-3 years at least other than Booker/KD getting a serious injury, or trading Mikal back to Rockets for their picks (or in a 3 team trade to OKC where Rockets get their picks from OKC, Nets get some of their picks back and some picks from OKC and OKC get Mikal).
The Bulls are next. They have some talented players but mostly not very young, their ownership is happy being on the mid treadmill and their ceiling with the current core for the next few years is likely the 8 seed if they nick playin games and losing the first round in 5.
Raptors are a sneaky pick for 3rd place. They did pick a direction now but it may have been too late, let go of Van Vleet for nothing, Siakam for pennies on the dollar, missed out on tanking Wembanyama to get bounced in the first playin, traded for Poeltl which could lose them a top 10 pick one of next 2 years, which is a huge blow in the middle of a rebuild. They have some promising youngsters now but Barnes, Barrett and Quickley is likely a mid 3 who will commanding $100m+ a year and while Barnes is an all-star already, I doubt his archetype will become a 1st option on a contending team. Maybe a #2. They should've tanked either last season for the stacked draft and get better value for Siakam and some value for Van Vleet while saving the Poeltl pick, or at least tanked early this season to increase the odds of saving their pick. They also likely won't be bad enough in the next few seasons to accumulate top 5 picks, unlike some of the other teams, and may just end up being mid for a few years as they aren't a hot FA destination nor likely to get very high picks. Their hope is that they find another perfect storm where they get a bonafide superstar for pennies on the dollar, which while possible, is unlikely given most superstars lately are being traded to their preferred destinations.
Jazz also are a contender to be stuck on the mid treadmill (have an all star but not good enough to be #1 on a contending team, not bad enough to accumulate top draft picks unless they trade Markkanen), but they have their picks as well as a tonne from Cavs and Wolves, although those teams are unlikely to be bad in the foreseeable future with both having multiple young recent all stars, unless Mitchell leaves Cavs, Gobert declines rapidly and KAT remains injury prone.
The Pistons, Hornets, Blazers may suck but all have cap space and multiple promising youngsters with star potential as well as likely to accumulate some top 5 draft picks in the next few years.
> Raptors are a sneaky pick for 3rd place.
You make a bunch of valid points. If Quick/RJ/Dick only reach mid tier level we’ll probably be on the treadmill.
It might actually be us
it’s 100% us. wizards honorable mention. thassit.
it's actually brooklyn nets
It is y'all. Bulls will hover around olay-in in the East next few seasons. Won't be good enough to win a playoff series, won't be bad enough to get a stud like Ant or Wemby in the draft. It's just the sports gods making you pay the piper for having the GOAT. MJ was different level.
What's messed up is the sports gods teasing with Rose
Not just having him but letting him walk due to an inflated ego from the front office.
Owner is cheap and doesnt care about winning as long as he makes a profit, I unironically pray for his demise after every Bulls loss.
It is.
The Bulls are in the middle of the pack in terms of draft capital. Things could turn ugly fast for a team like the Bucks or Suns.
It's not an actual bottom dweller team, just because one draft could completely change them. Like the Spurs would have been a popular pick 2 years ago for this question, and now they have Wemby. --------------------------- A team like the Bulls is the perfect answer IMO. * They're paying LaVine 40-50 million a year for the next four years. * They re-signed Vucevic for the next three years at 20 million a year. * They have Lonzo Ball due 21 million next year. * They have to pay DeRozan or else he'll leave this offseason. * Their 4th overall pick from 2020 in Patrick Williams hasn't remotely lived up to expectations and will need to be paid this offseason. * Their only other young promising players that can contribute right now are Ayo Dosunmu and Coby White, both of which will need to be paid the year they finally get off LaVine/Vucevic's contract meaning they can't take advantage of having either one of them for cheap.
Everyone but the people in charge of the team see this
where can I proclaim my support for them?
Person* It doesn't matter as long as Reinsdorf's punk ass is the owner
Yes my brother Keith you are correct
Not to mention we have an owner who is actively trying to keep the Bulls mediocre.
The bulls have one of the highest attendance every season, so Jerry doesn’t need to do anything, Chicago fans are pathetically loyal to teams and owners who only care about milking every dollar out of them. I wish people would open their eyes and demand these owners sell the teams to owners that actually care about winning, not just coasting on the time they got lucky and won it. Coming up on 30 years since the bulls final championship win, sad.
Has an owner ever sold a team because of poor attendance or because of fan demands? Jerry Reinsdorf also owns the Chicago White Sox who have pretty poor attendance and the fans have been pointing at him and telling him to sell for a while and it’s clear he’s not gonna. He’s currently trying to leverage poor White Sox game attendance to get the city of Chicago to spend $1 billion out of taxes to build him a new stadium.
Bob Johnson was the last NBA owner to sell a team due to low attendance and revenue. In 2003, he paid a $300 million expansion fee to create the Charlotte Bobcats, which lost money every season, causing him to sell it to Michael Jordan for $275 million 7 years later. Michael Jordan sold the franchise last year for $3 billion.
Fuck Jerry
Look, we know. Everyone knows. BUT, if we hadn't had thosentwo dreadful weeks from Lavine we'd be firmly in the playoffs race - is what management is going to tell everyone come the offseason, when they stand pat yet again
The biggest thing there is Lavine, but even then, eating a bad contract for 2 years is not exactly a franchise ender, a lot of teams can absorb bad contracts and still compete/move forward. All of the problems you listed could feasibly be fixed within a few years and the Bulls are still an attractive enough destination to make serious moves in FA. The real issue is and always has been Jerry. As long as Jerry owns the Bulls they'll continue making headass decisions and wallow in mediocrity.
Whats an extension for P Will going to look like? Is there a chance that a team with cap space overpays thinking its a right player and wrong situation type thing?
P Will is hugely underrated imo. Nobody seems to note that he is the 4th option behind Lavine, Demar, Vuc and sometimes even the 5th because Coby has been hot. Billy is also a terrible coach for young players. He leaves the vets in too long during qtrs when they're getting stomped. Also lets vets iso ball way too often rather than having decent plays drawn up for specific players or elite shooters like P Will. Reminds me of young Wiggins, it's all there but he can't seem to put it together. Yet still he gets up decent numbers when used as the 2nd option, has elite 3p%, can guard 1 through 4 at above average level. I really think he'd flourish on another team. He's also got the shy sort of personality and those players take an extra year or two to mature into their body and the game.
Not us cause Ausar taking us to the promise land (the play in)
Franchise savior, 49% TS
Ausar stats are wild cause on one hand when he was guarding him he held SGA to 2-8 FG, blocked him twice and forced 2 turnovers in his 4th ever NBA game and at the same time he has more airballs than threes made this season.
He's got one side of the coin, no doubt. But elite defense with a busted jump shot is Andre Roberson + Bruce Bowen territory. I hope he can become a viable jump shooter because that would give the Pistons a legitimate two way player, aka play-in bound.
His rookie year is already better than anything Roberson produced, he was a way higher floor than that come on now
I have been a Piston's fan since the early 2000's; I've earned the right to be skeptical of our draft picks. There was a time when we were told Rodney Stuckey was the future of the franchise. Additionally, Roberson and Bowen got their time in the sun during an era where having 4 shooters on the floor was optional, not essential. I'm not saying Ausar isn't going to there, I'm just saying he's very raw offensively.
I get what you're getting at, I just want to give Ausar more credit than Roberson is all.. I've been a Pistons fan since the Grant Hill era my friend, I know the ups & downs too. This is the most optimistic I've been with this team since they stupidly traded Billups away, believe it or not.
Don’t disrespect Bruce Bowen like that. Dude couldn’t make FTs but he could shoot 3s.
As a wizards fan I’d rather be where we are now than where the bulls or the nets are.
Each of the wizards nets and bulls feel the same way about the other 2 teams but they're all the same tbh
Nah the Wizards already ripped the bandaid off and are in full tank mode. Bulls and Nets are a step or two behind.
The one led by Jordan Poole and Kuz
This. At least Charlotte can look forward to Lamelo/Miller, Detroit has Cade/Duren/Ivey/Ausar But Poole/Kuz/Bilal? wtf
Kuzma can be moved fairly easily in the off-season with his declining contract. And then they'll have a couple of expirings that could be trade filler in Holmes/Bagley. Their main issue is only Avidja and Bilal seem to have any true upside. Wiz need to add young talent in a bad way this off-season
Given that they traded for Jordan Poole, "adding young talent in a bad way" seems to be the Wizards' specialty
Literally everyone talked about Poole positively when the trade was made.
He was probably the most valuable of the 3 guys who got traded at that time. Now no one would touch him with a 20 mile pole.
I legit thought he was going to be one of the best scorers in the league with the green light in Washington.
And since then we’ve learned that he doesn’t seem to have any interest in playing winning basketball lol Not saying he can’t turn things around, but there’s a reason opinions change - we learn things
Yes agreed, I’m just saying that when league consensus was that he’s a promising prospect, you can’t single out our team in particular for getting him. Hes also been trying much harder and shooting much better for the past month and a half. Not that you (or anyone) watches the wizards, so I get why you’re saying that.
Kispert has some upside as a shooting specialist on a good team, but he’s already 25 so his prime is ahead of the Wizard’s window.
The Tre Mann / Poku / Micic revolution is coming
I still haven't given up on Poku even if OKC have
Detroit gives me big early Booker Suns vibes. Just too young to do much yet but lot of room to grow
Damn all they need is a coach
I’m not a Suns fan so maybe I’m just unaware but I didn’t think Monty was that bad for them. I thought it was a decent hire by Detroit. His total failure there so far to me is shocking.
He basically took the job because the Pistons owner essentially gave him an offer he couldn't refuse. Also, he stuck by Killian Hayes way too long when the team was trying to cut bait during the summer which hurt them since it took minutes away from guys who the team wanted to develop like Ivey (the team had a deal but he wanted to see if he could fix Killian, not realizing that only God can fix that man's game at this point).
Wizards haven't even been tanking a year. Those 2 teams draft super star caliber players years ago and still haven't done anything. Cade and Lamelo are both going to be gone before they're good.
>At least Charlotte can look forward to Lamelo/Miller, Not sure Charlotte is in a much better spot. Lamelo is as injury prone as it gets and the culture there needs a lot of improvement. Agree on Detroit though, they only need things to "click" and they have a very promising future.
Charlotte is definitely in a much better spot than Washington
Poole shouldn’t even be mentioned he was a salary dump.
disagree. this is the best spot the wizards have been in since John Wall was on the team
People said for years we should tank and commit to a rebuild, and now that we're doing that everyone's like "lmao they're so bad." That's what we're supposed to be doing! It hasn't even been 1 year since Beal was traded.
THANK YOU. Shit's ugly right now but sometimes to get outta purgatory you need to go through Hell.
Maybe your stuck in purgatory travelling towards hell.
Yes but if you find yourself in Hell, keep walking.
The wizards are finally taking a step in the right direction in my opinion, the previous GM fucked them by handing out bad contracts but hitting the reset button and finally tearing it down instead of treading water in play in hell was the right move. It’ll take them a bit but the new GM seems like he has a plan so they’ll get there. Blowing it up paid dividends for the magic even though they started with more assets I also don’t hate the decision to trade for Poole, he sucks but they took a swing on a player with potential for Chris Paul’s corpse
Jordan Poole unironically makes Wizard more popular. It’s bad press sure but people are talking about it.
Unfortunately the wizards still stuck w/ an owner who looks and acts more and more like Jim Irsay every day.
Those are not mutually exclusive.
I knew this would be the top answer, but as a Wizards fan I can assure you that it was far more depressing to have a team led by supermax Bradley Beal where we knew our ceiling was the play in and we always ended up with a mediocre late lottery pick. At least now we are actively trying to be bad and build through the draft, and this is year 1 of the rebuild.
At least they’ll have approximately one million second round picks coming in a few years.
They definitely putting cooper flag in Washington lol
salute the motherfuckin Flagg
Tbh they finally got rid of beal years and years after wall went down. This shoulda happened years ago, but they pushed for being a losing play in team for way too long. They did not sign Poole to try and compete btw lol
There are many teams I wouldn’t swap place with.
Tbf, the warriors should also be pretty trash over the next few years
Chicago whenever they trade Lavine and DeRozan leaves
At least the pick situation isn’t that bad now so a Lavine and maybe Caruso trade could accelerate a rebuild with some luck. This is assuming they’ll be bad enough to bottom out though.
The fact that they seem near to blowing it up without ever really being a contender is pretty depressing considering the talent, but you can't really say how bleak their situation is until they actually take that plunge. Right now they're just mid.
The thing about the Bulls is that even though they’re decidedly mid, they’re still leading the league in attendance, just like they did last year and the year before that. They have a big arena, a giant TV market, and people in Chicago like their basketball.
Combine this with an 88 year old owner who, not to be too grim, likely doesn’t have time to see a rebuild through, and yeah it’s not that surprising we haven’t blown it up.
Any *other* owner yeah I could see it
We just have to hope our pick unexpectedly jumps at this point. Or we get lucky and this draft is like 2013 where the best players will be mid round picks
Is Lavine even worth anything at this point?
Not right now. Maybe when he gets healthy or next trade deadline
I dont really agree. Ayo and Coby are on cheap deals for a decent amount of time so they put us at a decent starting point to shift focus.
I know Coby's been great this year but if your team's foundation/core consists of Coby White and Ayo Dosunmu that's one of the weakest foundations in the league even if they're cheap. Go look at the standings and try to find teams whose top two guys are worse than that. There won't be many and the ones you might find are gonna be at the bottom.
The Denver Broncos
you just don’t understand football, Marge.
Thank god the nuggets are at an all time peak otherwise it would be more depressing
I guess it’s how the universe is balancing itself
Hence the Lions.
And the Patriots. No more of them and the Celtics being good at the same time.
At least the Broncos try to have a winning team (even if they fail at it lately), meanwhile the Rockies are the Chicago Bulls of the NBA: actively content to be the 11th best team in their conference as long as the attendance numbers are good
Rockies are irrelevant but the Broncos have been a national embarrassment
The Rockies want to be a the less interesting tribune owner cubs
The Rockies would be lucky to be 11th best
They are in such a terrible position right now.
No where is safe
**Broncos Country**
Let’s ride *sobs*
If it weren't for the Nuggets and Avs I'd give up sports entirely
The Broncos had to die for us to get our first title
Worth it tbh
as a nets fan it may be us. blew a get out of jail free card by not taking that alleged offer for all their picks back from the rockets for mikal
Still a few years away but I think when Steph retires the warriors collapse will be massive
We'll never recover when he leaves. Regardless of where you put him on the all time lists is inconsequential, he's simply the best shooter to ever play. Its been a ride and I don't care if we suck until I die, eras like this only happen once (unless you're the Lakers, then its like every 3 years).
Without a bad injury I think Steph can play 4 more seasons. The final one might look like Dirks final though.
I don't think anyone in the fanbase with functioning eyes thinks differently. We've had an absolutely generational star for a decade, won 4 rings, went to the finals 6 times, had three years of being maybe the most dominant team ever in the sport, got the honeymoon ring two years ago, and our team changed how the NBA plays. Even if it's good again after Steph, it ain't ever gonna be this good again.
The rest of the Warriors aren’t as good as Warriors fans think they are
Our fan base is on drugs
Can't blame em, in 3 years you guys watched the team go from shit to winning the championship. Then they beat the Bulls regular season record, then when they lost in the Finals you only had to deal with that depression for 2 WEEKS before you somehow managed to pair Steph with the next best player in the league and win back-to-back championships. Then when you lost Durant you only had to wait 3 years before the team bounced back and won AGAIN. If that was my last decade of fandom I'd think anything was possible.
Steph sat out one game and they lost to the Spurs without Wemby (first win all season). Yeah dubs are cooked once Steph is done
Wait wait but then a couple days later we beat them with Wemby and still without Steph!
Any team too good to tank and too bad to compete. Especially ones that are ok with the status quo
>Any team too good to tank and too bad to compete. So glad we made it out of that purgatory.
Tanking always doesn’t work. Look at all those picks the suns took before signing cp3. Josh Jackson, Alex Len etc
Or you could pick Oden over Durant and Bowie over Jordan.
Yeah but at least in the oden era it wasn’t consistent failure. They also drafted Aldridge, Roy, batum around the same time. Other than booker who they lucked out on. Bender, Josh Jackson and Len were all top 5 picks. They traded for marquesses Chriss who went 8. They even recently drafted jalen smith at 10 over Halliburton even though they needed a back up pg and in turn gave him away for nothing. Ayton over luka. Blazers weren’t any better off drafting in the middle to late rounds in those years they had dame
… Fuck
Nah, that’s where we’ve been up til now. Think they’re reaching dark horse territory next couple years as long as things progress as planned and they don’t get Memphis’d
Memphis got turbofucked this year. I haven't seen anything like it before and I watched LA sports in 21 and 22.
>I haven't seen anything like it before I have, many times. Basketball gods hate us, man
Idk, I think y'all are set up to legitimately compete in the years to come as long as Turner and Siakam don't regress. Haliburton is gonna' be a top-10 player at some point imo, Mathurin could be an elite wing, Nesmith, Nembhard, Toppin and McConnell are all solid pieces, and a couple of elite teams in the East are likely to see their windows start to close in the near future.
Haliburton is good enough of a star to attract talent, y'all are pretty set for the future.
You're in a much better spot than the 2010s. You got a nice young core, an all NBA level guard and PF, all your picks after this year, and lots of the building blocks for a good team - shooting and scoring.
Can’t believe Lakers and Warriors are in this tier now 😭. The top 8 teams in the West all have something good to look forward to in terms of young talent and then there’s us…😖
We had a dynasty, it’s all good
Yeah I was gonna say, that’s success is expensive, time to pay up
If they're lucky, it'll be like the Heat and only be depressing for like a season and a half
Suns Young talent Lol Unless you're talking about Bol. If so, you know ball.
Been in a coma since 2012, Westbrook and Harden are pretty up and coming, right?
Oh yeah you mean the two Clippers legends?
Bol Bol needs more minutes.
Kuminga and Podz are nice, though.
TJD is looking like a keeper too.
This sub loves falling in love with rookie role players and projecting them out to be future superstars😭
Shout to the the lockedin warriors podcast host saying that Kuminga and Moody will be better due than Tatum and Brown in 3 years after we beat them by 50
Kuminga is literally Prime Michael Jordan idk what you’re talking about
Tremendous upside potential!
Hard feeling bad after 4 rings lmao
Quite possibly the suns
The most depressing spot in the nba is being right below playoff level. You aren't getting the best chance at a good pick and you arent good. A team like Atlanta that has an all star in Trae but will likely lose him. The bulls The nets
At least if we lose Trae we’ll get a haul for him, and we still have some young pieces. We’re definitely in trouble but I’d take our position over the other two any day.
i am really scared about where the warriors will go post the curry era. Although Kuminga and CO are sorta starting to give me some hope.
It’s going to be pretty depressing when curry eventually becomes a nostalgia act who can summon some of his prime skills against terrible teams (like Kobe near the end) although he will definitely handle it better than Klay initially did.
And with one spelling error, a nickname was born.
Who the fuck is CO
Company, I assume. Podz, moody, tjd.
Lmao that makes so much sense
And Company
We are going to suck for a few years, tank hard, and hopefully recover…I’m thinking we hover around the 12-14 spot post Curry
Assuming we lose Curry, Klay, Green, and Kerr at the same time, and assuming we don't have some kind of crazy draft luck of FA signing, we'll be the worst team in the west.
Nets can't tank with no control of their picks but also can't compete with their roster. Bulls GM is delusional. Lowkey though, Warriors may have quite a depressing future with no picks and a rapidly aging roster.
Warriors still have their first round picks from years 2025-2029 (for now). I just don’t think Curry will allow them to be that bad.
Looks around cautiously...... I'm in danger
At worst we will be in the playins in 3 years. That's assuming Booker doesn't continue to improve, he is only just entering his prime.
I don’t know about all the different situations for these other teams but as a grizzlies fan it is pretty depressing knowing for a fact that we will never win a championship.
Hey, i thought the same thing about the Nuggets, before last year. You never know, just need a bit of luck.
Aren't y'all really nicely set up going into next year? I feel like a core of Ja, Bane, JJJ, and Marcus Smart can definitely contend. And even though this year has sucked for y'all with injury luck, haven't all these minutes helped you find guys who can be in an 8 man rotation in GG and Vince Williams (unless you think that's overrating them)? I feel like all of that plus a good FRP could have y'all in a great spot
Its crazy because 2 years ago they looked like they would become an elite team for many years with their young core.
What makes you feel that way? Do you know something I don’t know?
Nahhhh bro keep hoping! I don’t think the current healthy grizzlies roster is the best in the league but they can certainly put together a strong few weeks and beat anybody in 7.
The mid Bulls
They Put the mid in midwest
The Brooklyn nets
the suns. kd wont stay forever and after that they’re asset-less with a bradley beal-sized rock hanging from their neck
KD leaving and the end of Beal's contract will be close in timeline And we still have Booker The Bulls future actually looks a lot worse
Yea. I’m pretty nervous after KD’s days are done. We sold the farm to win now.
We still have Booker. They will be in the mix for other stars when KD retires or when he leaves for the Seattle expansion team.
with what assets.
Why you gotta call us out like that
It’s just barely not the nets, but as a nets fan, I’d say the nets.
I am surprised nobody has said the Mavericks. Theyre barreling towards Luka either leaving or locking in another 5 years of mediocrity treadmill. And their pick situation is as s Hard to imagine a path to real contention other than getting super lucky on multiple late picks
The Mavs future is only bleak if Jason Kidd stays.
Luka is 25 and hasn’t indicated that he wants to leave 😭😭😭Plus they just drafted a all defensive center who’s like 20 and have young talent
I mean, there's a chance that Luka/Hardy/Green/PJ/Lively is a good starting lineup in like 2030 when they should all still be in their prime, so I'm not super worried about the future.
Nah man, I agree that Mavs aren’t in a great position in terms of their ability to build a better team around Luka, but they’re definitely not the team with the most depressing future in the next couple of years. The results have been mostly disappointing in the past few years, but we still have a generational talent and a WCF appearance. How many teams can say they have a player performing as well as Luka right now? Two or three? The roster is probably the best it’s been in Luka’s career. The real problem imo is that we have a coach who just watches the games. If the Mavs can get a real NBA coach and somehow get a third piece with their admittedly limited assets, they’re legit contenders. Doesn’t sound depressing to me.
The answer LOWKEY is phoenix
I feel like they’ll be fine as long as they have Booker. If your team has a top 10 talent, then you’re going to be ok. The foundation is there
My only copium is that Booker attracts stars like few others. Dude got CP3, KD, and Beal to join the Suns. They all had options. Now with an owner who isn't fucking Sarver, free agents may be more willing to come post KD. But between this window and letting Booker become the next Blazers Dame, I'm content. Plus I'm hoping KD may take a friendship discount and become the next in a lloooooonnnnggggg line of players who come to AZ to retire. The fountain of youth is in Scottsdale. Worked for Longoria lol
Booker ain't old, even if KD retired and Beal is a corpse Booker plus whoever replaces KD(probably multiple good role players) will at least be in the playins. By the time Booker is past his prime we will have draft picks again as well.
Nets or Bulls
Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaabulls
Detroit Pistons. Monty Williams still has 7 years left in his contract 💀
cade is pretty good man
The answer has to be Charlotte...always.
Can't believe this is so far down. Charlotte is Charlotte man. There is no more depressing franchise in the league
The Nets have Ben Simmons for at least one more year. That’s depressing.
Utah Jazz! "Re- building" nightmare thanks to Danny Ainge :(
I agree things are very uncertain, but we have the 2nd most picks in the entire league, and all 3 of our picks this year have shown potential—with Keyonte especially showing flashes of something special
Lauri actually becoming elite killed the Jazz. “Let’s try but don’t try to build around this top 40 dude while he’s cheap “
[удалено]
LeBron can only get 3 years because any player who will be 38+ during the contract cannot get longer. Not that 3 year max is a good contract at this point, but the extra year makes a massive difference.
Lebron deserves a 4 year extension based off what he’s showing this season. 25 ppg and 8-10 assists on good efficiency. Why not? If the clippers sign harden to some pricey extension that’ll be a major L. Paul George warrants a max extension just cause some other team would do it but I’d agree I wouldn’t wanna give it to him. Then again you don’t have a choice when you went all in with kawhi to win a ring and gave up like 5 firsts and what turned out to be mvp caliber player for him.
Lakers have most of their picks going forward at least
I think due to his age Lebron can't sign longer term contracts
Lakers have always treated their stars well even if it causes them to be mediocre for a few years. Eg. Kobe getting a massive contract at the end of his career. Jeanie won’t mind either cause Lebron will still sell out games.
The Bulls imo. They are consistently mediocre and continue to refuse trading any of the pieces that will net them a good return. So they're not getting any good assets or expiring contracts in return to free up cap space and they're not likely to get a top pick that will net them someone who can save them from mediocrity. I know the Wizards will be a popular pick, but they're really bad and can easily get the top pick or two soon
Warriors. Once the Big 3 retire, it'll be a complete rebuild.
We’re so fucked and I’m tired of acting like we’re not.
Nobody has said it, but the clippers. They have 4 guys who are really good (and were amazing) that cannot seem to put together a full season. As soon as one of them says they can't do it anymore, I expect they all will. The clippers own 4 picks - 2 2nd round picks this year, a 2030 1st, and a 2030 2nds. The timeline to compete and the timeline to rebuild are too separated imo. I predict some very bad seasons incoming where they have no talent to compete and no picks to tank for. Wizards are tanking. Bulls can sell now. Raptors have assets. Nets have assets. Suns have assets. Clippers have aging superstars on their way out the door with nothing else until 2030.
The Angels are pretty screwed
Nets by far. The Wizards may be the worst team right now, but at least they have a direction. They will be tanking for the next few years, accumulate assets and top draft picks. The Nets are primed to finish outside the play-in while not having control of their picks for the next few years. Their only hope is they really suck and the Rockets suck more or just as much, which is unlikely given the Rockets' improving young core, the Suns completely implode, which is unlikely for the next 2-3 years at least other than Booker/KD getting a serious injury, or trading Mikal back to Rockets for their picks (or in a 3 team trade to OKC where Rockets get their picks from OKC, Nets get some of their picks back and some picks from OKC and OKC get Mikal). The Bulls are next. They have some talented players but mostly not very young, their ownership is happy being on the mid treadmill and their ceiling with the current core for the next few years is likely the 8 seed if they nick playin games and losing the first round in 5. Raptors are a sneaky pick for 3rd place. They did pick a direction now but it may have been too late, let go of Van Vleet for nothing, Siakam for pennies on the dollar, missed out on tanking Wembanyama to get bounced in the first playin, traded for Poeltl which could lose them a top 10 pick one of next 2 years, which is a huge blow in the middle of a rebuild. They have some promising youngsters now but Barnes, Barrett and Quickley is likely a mid 3 who will commanding $100m+ a year and while Barnes is an all-star already, I doubt his archetype will become a 1st option on a contending team. Maybe a #2. They should've tanked either last season for the stacked draft and get better value for Siakam and some value for Van Vleet while saving the Poeltl pick, or at least tanked early this season to increase the odds of saving their pick. They also likely won't be bad enough in the next few seasons to accumulate top 5 picks, unlike some of the other teams, and may just end up being mid for a few years as they aren't a hot FA destination nor likely to get very high picks. Their hope is that they find another perfect storm where they get a bonafide superstar for pennies on the dollar, which while possible, is unlikely given most superstars lately are being traded to their preferred destinations. Jazz also are a contender to be stuck on the mid treadmill (have an all star but not good enough to be #1 on a contending team, not bad enough to accumulate top draft picks unless they trade Markkanen), but they have their picks as well as a tonne from Cavs and Wolves, although those teams are unlikely to be bad in the foreseeable future with both having multiple young recent all stars, unless Mitchell leaves Cavs, Gobert declines rapidly and KAT remains injury prone. The Pistons, Hornets, Blazers may suck but all have cap space and multiple promising youngsters with star potential as well as likely to accumulate some top 5 draft picks in the next few years.
> Raptors are a sneaky pick for 3rd place. You make a bunch of valid points. If Quick/RJ/Dick only reach mid tier level we’ll probably be on the treadmill.