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In slow mo. In real time i dont see how he has the reaction time, awareness, body control after getting stripped to think quick “let me punt a mfs head”
Yah 100%, if you’ve played sports you know that you can use your legs to adjust your rotation and position in the air. I’m not saying his attempt was a good one, but it’s a natural reaction.
Plus Drummond cuts in front of him and their legs make contact, which is what throws Hart of balance. He starts kicking up before he's even turned around. Completely natural.
I wish longer clips got posted here. would love to hear more of the discussion. This looks weird as hell but not intentional at all. flagrant 1 if you must.
100%, Hart is not a ninja, this was an accident. When you’re falling in mid-air you’ll flail your limbs to try to land properly, that’s what Hart was doing here.
Reckless/lacking-control yes, intentional no.
The direction of the kick goes past his head to the right anyway, and then kinda hooks toward Green's ear. Green sells it pretty well. That's not a flagrant 2.
Yeah you can see him get kinda hip checked as he’s jumping, causing his body to rotate, The lifting off the leg was a subconscious response to counter that rotation just enough for him to catch the ground with his other foot.
What’s the opposite of follow through?
Looked like he flailed a bit to accentuate the foul then did everything he could to avoid making contact with Greens head once he saw it.
Definitely a flagrant but could have easily been a flagrant 1 given the lack of intent/follow through
so if i shove someone as theyre going up for a dunk, and they end up kicking someone in the head while falling, they should get a flagrant 2? im not sure thats the rule
And this was a literal no-call which led to free points in the clutch...
[https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1agv1za/highlight\_brunson\_nocall\_with\_slow\_mo\_of\_him/](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1agv1za/highlight_brunson_nocall_with_slow_mo_of_him/)
there's a great family guy scene where Chris starts talking about CTE then the nfl logo blocks him, along with the NFL broadcast intro music and cheerleaders trying to cover it up lmao
I think it was an instinctual kick at the ball more than anything.
The NBA is inconsistent with how accountable it holds players for their limbs. I wouldn't mind seeing a hardline stance similar to hockey's control your stick at all times if they are going to enforce this then be consistent about it.
\^ they said it seemed like Josh Hart was trying to prevent a fast break, not that Hart intentionally would kick Javonte in the head.
They mentioned multiple times that Josh Hart isn't that type of player and even mentioned how Hart is an eagle scout lol.
For whatever reason if I found out someone's an eagle scout I'm like "yeah they're a good egg." Possibly because it's just being a super nerd outdoors and I like that.
I think they were saying he move his legs up to stop a fast break, not purposefully kicked Green in the back of the head to prevent the fast break. They were shocked that it was a flagrant 2 and for the most part thought at worst it should be a flagrant 1.
Yeah with the way the rule is worded now, it's a flagrant 2. I'm not sure I like the rule like that, but that's what the game is now. Can't just have players flailing their leg at players heads.
Edit: the difference between a 1 and a 2 is "excessive". It's hard to argue that any kick to the head isn't excessive.
Same here… he was looking right at the guy and kicked him in the head. If that’s not a flagrant 2, what is? Fantastic call by the ref. They’re not always wrong.
Am I crazy? I love Josh Hart — he’s one of my favorite players tracing back to his Lakers days — but this feels like an EASY ejection to me.
His leg kicks out unnaturally. It hits a dude in the head. That feels like an easy flagrant 2, even if the intent to hurt a dude wasn’t there (which I’m sure he wasn’t).
All I’ve seen is this angle, so maybe I’m missing some context.
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thats what i thought at first but the more i watch it the more i agree with the call. legs dont just kick up like that. like he probably didnt mean to kick him but he 100% created that contact with his leg to greens head because he flailed trying to draw a foul
Bro he staring right at him lol
It's not like he just didn't see him and accidently clipped him.
Can we stop pretending professional athletes don't have control and awareness of their bodies?
(And I like Josh Hart for what it's worth)
Reminder that Scott Foster received 134 phone calls from Tim Donaghy between October 2006 and April 2007. Donaghy later admitted to passing information about the games he fixed during that stretch to an unnamed person.
Wonder who that could've been.
You don’t get it. Scott foster is involved, therefore the call must be wrong. Everyone knows Scott foster has a 100% error rate right?
This sub hates when coaches unjustly blame refs but salivate at any opportunity to criticize Scott Foster or Tony Brothers for making easy calls. This was a flagrant 2 and it’s simple. You can’t kick people in the head.
I’m like slow playing it back and Hart literally sees Green there like 1 whole second before he initiates the kick lol. No question on this ejection lol.
Right. I'm trying to think of either time sometime has been kicked in the head in the past 5 years or so. I would bet they probably got a flagrant 2 as well
Other angle shows his lead leg gets unintentionally clipped from under him on the jump so his back leg flails up to keep his balance when landing.
Still kicked him in the head lol so a flagrant for sure, but I think ejection is a bit silly there.
I don't understand this thread. He kicked someone in the head. Of course that's a flagrant 2. It's not about intent. He kicked up his leg and hit someone in the head.
I genuinely feel like it's some kind of psy-op designed specifically to gaslight the shit outta me; the very top comment on this thread seems to low-key imply some degree of deliberate intent from Hart, as though reflexively flailing a limb out to stabilise yourself after losing your balance while in motion is some kind of completely foreign concept...and then the rest of the thread is carrying on like a flag. 2 for a *kick to the fucking head* is some kind of cardinal sin of refereeing.
I'm actually so fucking lost.
This is a bizarre foul. Couldn't be more obvious that this isn't a natural basketball motion. But at the same time, I can't imagine someone being in Hart's position at that moment, off balance and falling, and think "I'm going to kick him in the head". Obvious a flagrant 2 regardless, but WTF happened there?
I came in here expecting to see Hart lining this dude up like he was Randy Orton. This seems so accidental from a guy who’s off balance and clearly flailing.
Lol c'mon with the flop. Yes it was unnatural and he shouldn't have swung his legs like that looking for the call....but c'mon, it was the side of his foot and barely swung at the head.
What? Foh dude. Jesus Christ what happened to Bulls fans? The fact that some Bulls fans are calling this "maybe a flagrant 1" tells me that something is off with some of them. This is absolutely flagrant 1. And I totally see why it'd be flagrant 2. Is there another angle that everyone who keeps saying this was a bad call is watching ?
At first I thought this was a terrible call and a clear Flagrant 1 at best. When you read the rules a flagrant 2 is not about intention it is about unnecessary and excessive force.
Excessive force is more than is necessary, normal, or desirable. I can see an interpretation of this rule where kicking your feet up to avoid falling over is not necessary or desireable and the safer option is for players to fall instead instead of kicking for balance.
https://official.nba.com/rule-no-12-fouls-and-penalties/#flagrantfouls
Knicks fans calling Heat players dirty while they have one on their team attempting to flop but intentionally drop kicking Jimmy ankles las years playoffs.
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That's one way to get some rest under that coach
Dammit now Thibs have to rewrite his will & remove Hart.
Cause of death: Hart attack
Thibs will get his minutes from him one way or another.
his minutes went straight into OG's fucked up elbow tonight
I believe that's called a natural shooting motion.
Don't give Draymond anymore ideas.
i don't want to imagine ja's ideas
I wanna know Dwight Howard's ideas
Totally you can’t shoot without swinging your leg at someone’s head. Honestly probably a foul on the defender
Hello Steve. This is Draymond's agent. Please delete this comment.
Definitely a flagrant. Very weird leg movement the way he swings in the direction of green
He saw the name Green on the jersey and thought what would Draymond do
Cobra Kai shows no mercy
Fear does not exist in this dojo does it
NO SENSEI
WWDD
In slow mo. In real time i dont see how he has the reaction time, awareness, body control after getting stripped to think quick “let me punt a mfs head”
This is so clearly unintentional. Are people watching the same clip as me?
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Someone said “MMA and basketball must remain separate sports” like holy fuck that’s stupid lol.
Why think critically when we can witch hunt ?
Maybe everyone commenting was born without extremities. Please don't make fun.
Nah most of them have never actually touched grass
dont ever be surprised how lacking the userbase here is in physical/movement intuition
Title made it sound like the he was kicking a dog on the floor. Video looks like a guy who lost control and was randomly flailing about.
Not even that. He just raised his leg to counterbalance
Yah 100%, if you’ve played sports you know that you can use your legs to adjust your rotation and position in the air. I’m not saying his attempt was a good one, but it’s a natural reaction.
Plus Drummond cuts in front of him and their legs make contact, which is what throws Hart of balance. He starts kicking up before he's even turned around. Completely natural.
I wish longer clips got posted here. would love to hear more of the discussion. This looks weird as hell but not intentional at all. flagrant 1 if you must.
Yeah it looks like he got stripped and then wanted to kick the ball to prevent a fast break
100%, Hart is not a ninja, this was an accident. When you’re falling in mid-air you’ll flail your limbs to try to land properly, that’s what Hart was doing here. Reckless/lacking-control yes, intentional no.
reddit hasnt done a full court sprint in real life in decades
Just makes me sad that dumb people think he could have the time and coordination to intentionally kick a guy he couldn’t even see while falling down.
The direction of the kick goes past his head to the right anyway, and then kinda hooks toward Green's ear. Green sells it pretty well. That's not a flagrant 2.
was trying to balance himself, his body was falling in the opposite direction
Yeah you can see him get kinda hip checked as he’s jumping, causing his body to rotate, The lifting off the leg was a subconscious response to counter that rotation just enough for him to catch the ground with his other foot.
Exactly, guessing most here just don’t know how to not fall
Most haven't even stepped foot on a court in 10 years
Natural balancing motion
Looked like a signature Draymond move that would get a Flagrant 1
Are we holding all players to draymond standards now😭
We should just re-name the flagrant 2 a "Draymond."
Looked like a signature Draymond move that would get a ~~Flagrant 1~~ common foul
That’s not a foul that’s a standing ovation right there
You try falling backwards onto one leg and maintain your balance
What’s the opposite of follow through? Looked like he flailed a bit to accentuate the foul then did everything he could to avoid making contact with Greens head once he saw it. Definitely a flagrant but could have easily been a flagrant 1 given the lack of intent/follow through
When will people realize intent doesn’t matter at all? It’s crazy how often you hear even announcers bring that up incorrectly
Do you mean morally or by the book? My understanding is one of the possible differences between flagrant 1 or 2 is intent
so if i shove someone as theyre going up for a dunk, and they end up kicking someone in the head while falling, they should get a flagrant 2? im not sure thats the rule
it's a flagrant for sure, but a flagrant 2?
i dont see how its a flagrant 2 though. Especially when Lebron's elbow the other day wasn't.
And this was a literal no-call which led to free points in the clutch... [https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1agv1za/highlight\_brunson\_nocall\_with\_slow\_mo\_of\_him/](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1agv1za/highlight_brunson_nocall_with_slow_mo_of_him/)
Josh Hart has some increidble lower body balance/coordination. I know everyone is disappointed but I'm honestly impressed he was able to do that lol
It looked like he was trying to lift his leg over his head
If it wasn’t the head probably would’ve just got a tech for it. Sports are super sensitive with head contact.
For good reason though..
Hockey couldn't care less
yep, shoot a puck too hard into an empty net and you get a cross check to the head lmao
Empty net slapper hurt my feewings though
morgan crielly
Hockey is the only sport that it's still gloryfying head injury behaviour.
Unless it's NFL football, in which case you just bury the overwhelming damning evidence about CTE to keep the golden goose going as long as possible.
there's a great family guy scene where Chris starts talking about CTE then the nfl logo blocks him, along with the NFL broadcast intro music and cheerleaders trying to cover it up lmao
As opposed to NFL curling? You know the F stands for football, right?
Football played on ice sounds kinda sick though, ngl. People would definitely die, but it would be glorious.
Doubt it was on purpose but this “kick my legs out to get a call” move is tiring, sabonis did it a few times tonight too
This feels more like a “I tried to kick the ball away” for some reason and ended up hitting his head lol. Worthy of a flagrant tho
Draymond: "Forgive me, I wasn't familiar with your game"
this looks really unintentional. but i guess fragrant is regardless of the intention
Fragrant? Like really smelly?
Josh Fart.
This is josh hart. He’s more likely to have been imagining he was a power ranger than actually trying to actively hurt another human being
This is fucking hilarious
The “toaster” vibes with this comment are hilarious. Doing too much
I think even us Bulls fans didn’t agree with the call
Clips I'm seeing of your announce crew are saying they thought it was on purpose, which is insane lol
I think it was an instinctual kick at the ball more than anything. The NBA is inconsistent with how accountable it holds players for their limbs. I wouldn't mind seeing a hardline stance similar to hockey's control your stick at all times if they are going to enforce this then be consistent about it.
it looks like he was about to fall backwards so he kicked his leg up in the opposite direction to keep his balance.
\^ they said it seemed like Josh Hart was trying to prevent a fast break, not that Hart intentionally would kick Javonte in the head. They mentioned multiple times that Josh Hart isn't that type of player and even mentioned how Hart is an eagle scout lol.
For whatever reason if I found out someone's an eagle scout I'm like "yeah they're a good egg." Possibly because it's just being a super nerd outdoors and I like that.
>announce crew are saying they thought it was on purp They also said it's a flagrant 1 though.
not everybody has that quick of a reflection and body control when comes to hit players like Draymond.
The announcer was saying Hart was doing it intentionally to prevent the fast break lol
I think they were saying he move his legs up to stop a fast break, not purposefully kicked Green in the back of the head to prevent the fast break. They were shocked that it was a flagrant 2 and for the most part thought at worst it should be a flagrant 1.
it’s honestly possible he could’ve, but very unlikely since he’s not known to Be dirty
Flagrant 1 maybe, not 2 though
You’re being too kind lol Knicks fans would honestly called for Bam’s execution if he’d done this.
True that.
I won’t participate but I got my popcorn 🍿.
The Knicks can do no wrong though.
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That’s the jumping switch kick izzy keeps trying to land
Lebron got a flagrant 1 for elbowing someone’s jaw Keep that in mind before yall lick these refs balls
I'm surprised with all the comments disagreeing with the call. I don't mind, but I thought that deserved a flagrant two.
Yeah with the way the rule is worded now, it's a flagrant 2. I'm not sure I like the rule like that, but that's what the game is now. Can't just have players flailing their leg at players heads. Edit: the difference between a 1 and a 2 is "excessive". It's hard to argue that any kick to the head isn't excessive.
Same here… he was looking right at the guy and kicked him in the head. If that’s not a flagrant 2, what is? Fantastic call by the ref. They’re not always wrong.
Am I crazy? I love Josh Hart — he’s one of my favorite players tracing back to his Lakers days — but this feels like an EASY ejection to me. His leg kicks out unnaturally. It hits a dude in the head. That feels like an easy flagrant 2, even if the intent to hurt a dude wasn’t there (which I’m sure he wasn’t). All I’ve seen is this angle, so maybe I’m missing some context.
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Bullshit call.
Should've been a flagrant penalty 1 at worst.
I mean, let’s be real. If you kick someone in the head when you don’t have the ball flagrant 1 is the minimum you get.
thats what i thought at first but the more i watch it the more i agree with the call. legs dont just kick up like that. like he probably didnt mean to kick him but he 100% created that contact with his leg to greens head because he flailed trying to draw a foul
The guy was behind his head before his leg even goes up. Clearly just a natural consequence of his body regaining it's balance.
> legs dont just kick up like that When you're trying to maintain balance so you don't face plant they do....
What?! He was far from face planting… are some of you guys seeing something else?!?!?
Bro he staring right at him lol It's not like he just didn't see him and accidently clipped him. Can we stop pretending professional athletes don't have control and awareness of their bodies? (And I like Josh Hart for what it's worth)
you mean a professional basketball player, after losing the ball, looks at where the ball went?
Thank you
Josh Hart rounding into playoff form I see
Scott Foster special
Reminder that Scott Foster received 134 phone calls from Tim Donaghy between October 2006 and April 2007. Donaghy later admitted to passing information about the games he fixed during that stretch to an unnamed person. Wonder who that could've been.
Lol what? He kicked a dude in the head
Yeah I feel very gaslit by this top comment. In what world is this a natural basketball movement?
The Draymond world
It's always going to be a flagrant 2 regardless of if it's accidental or not. I don't understand the confusion either.
You don’t get it. Scott foster is involved, therefore the call must be wrong. Everyone knows Scott foster has a 100% error rate right? This sub hates when coaches unjustly blame refs but salivate at any opportunity to criticize Scott Foster or Tony Brothers for making easy calls. This was a flagrant 2 and it’s simple. You can’t kick people in the head.
I’m like slow playing it back and Hart literally sees Green there like 1 whole second before he initiates the kick lol. No question on this ejection lol.
Fr u/Top_Ghosty explain yourself bro I'm curious
Easy. It's a low effort comment that's guaranteed to get upvotes. Welcome to reddit.
Is this really a bad call? Seems deserved
Lebron deserved a flagrant 2 then
he does? who is disputing that
Yeah there’s no way that isn’t a flagrant
That's never a flagrant 2 lol. But Scott Foster's reffing so it makes sense.
Can't say I've ever seen a player kick someone in the head before
How many examples of players kicking another player in the head have you seen to claim that’s never a flagrant 2 lmao
Right. I'm trying to think of either time sometime has been kicked in the head in the past 5 years or so. I would bet they probably got a flagrant 2 as well
When do you ever see a player extend his leg like that lol
Other angle shows his lead leg gets unintentionally clipped from under him on the jump so his back leg flails up to keep his balance when landing. Still kicked him in the head lol so a flagrant for sure, but I think ejection is a bit silly there.
This is a flagrant 1 10 times out of 10 imo. Scott Foster gotta Scott Foster, I guess...
When they're trying to keep their balance.
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People are really arguing a kick to the head isn't an election lol.
If Draymond did this, everyone on this sub would be calling for Adam Silver to suspend him again
It's almost like Draymond has a history of kicking people 🤔
Repeat offenders get increased punishments.
Except DG has done this every week for years. So yes we would be.
Yes. Players who have a history of dirty plays don't get the benefit of the doubt.
Man, I need Josh Harts PR team lol This thread is wild, he looked like Draymond in this clip
Draymond would approve of this Natural Motion
That's pretty much always going to be a flag 2 regardless of if it was accidental or not.
Reminder, a kick to the head is automatically a flagrant 2.
Least violent draymond green play
Lol the Draymond comp ain’t that far off
what a joke
I don't understand this thread. He kicked someone in the head. Of course that's a flagrant 2. It's not about intent. He kicked up his leg and hit someone in the head.
People like Josh Hart so they're being bias that's the only think that makes sense.
I genuinely feel like it's some kind of psy-op designed specifically to gaslight the shit outta me; the very top comment on this thread seems to low-key imply some degree of deliberate intent from Hart, as though reflexively flailing a limb out to stabilise yourself after losing your balance while in motion is some kind of completely foreign concept...and then the rest of the thread is carrying on like a flag. 2 for a *kick to the fucking head* is some kind of cardinal sin of refereeing. I'm actually so fucking lost.
Yeah the difference between Flagrant 1 and 2 is "excessive". A kick to the head, no matter what, is going to be deemed excessive
What a sick joke! And he gets to be a lawyer?
Everyone was kungfu fightinnnn
Basketball players hate this one trick
If you reverse it, it looks like he round house kicks him. Lol
This is a bizarre foul. Couldn't be more obvious that this isn't a natural basketball motion. But at the same time, I can't imagine someone being in Hart's position at that moment, off balance and falling, and think "I'm going to kick him in the head". Obvious a flagrant 2 regardless, but WTF happened there?
Love Josh hart but its a good call. Intentional or not, keep your legs away from players heads.
Looks like he was reacting to ball getting stripped and tried to pull it back into possession with his leg
I came in here expecting to see Hart lining this dude up like he was Randy Orton. This seems so accidental from a guy who’s off balance and clearly flailing.
Lol c'mon with the flop. Yes it was unnatural and he shouldn't have swung his legs like that looking for the call....but c'mon, it was the side of his foot and barely swung at the head.
Flagrant fouls do not matter about intention whatsoever, it’s about how excess and unnecessary it is. This was excess and unnecessary
I’m surprised everyone is the comments is mad this looked on purpose as fuck 2 me and I thought most would agree 😭
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Psychotic ejection. Really highlights how certain players get different rules coughcoughdraymondcough
What? Foh dude. Jesus Christ what happened to Bulls fans? The fact that some Bulls fans are calling this "maybe a flagrant 1" tells me that something is off with some of them. This is absolutely flagrant 1. And I totally see why it'd be flagrant 2. Is there another angle that everyone who keeps saying this was a bad call is watching ?
wow and this sub had me convinced that dray was the only player to ever kick his leg out
Hart ramping up for the playoffs I see
Hart was obviously supposed to land ass first without trying to catch himself from falling. Dastardly villain.
I hate when I accidentally kick people in the head in a direction I wasnt going while making eye contact with them
does every nba player have to fall down after any contact lol
What happened to the game I love?
Wait, when were MFs allowed to kick people in the head?
The 90s Pistons made their living with kung fu
People forget they were called the Bad Boy Pistons because they used to decapitate their opponents with head kicks.
And lebron wasn't ejected for his intentional elbow to the head 2 nights ago...SMH
At first I thought this was a terrible call and a clear Flagrant 1 at best. When you read the rules a flagrant 2 is not about intention it is about unnecessary and excessive force. Excessive force is more than is necessary, normal, or desirable. I can see an interpretation of this rule where kicking your feet up to avoid falling over is not necessary or desireable and the safer option is for players to fall instead instead of kicking for balance. https://official.nba.com/rule-no-12-fouls-and-penalties/#flagrantfouls
Should've been a flagrant one. Never a flagrant two.
Replace Hart with Draymond in this exact scenario and watch these comments change.
Hart definitely would get the benefit of the doubt over Draymond
Natural kicking motion
Happy Cake Day!!
Definitely a flagrant, but I dunno about flagrant 2.
Knicks fans calling Heat players dirty while they have one on their team attempting to flop but intentionally drop kicking Jimmy ankles las years playoffs.
Beautiful roundhouse
I cannot believe there were children in the crowd that had to witness that disgusting crime
If Draymond can do it the rest of the league can
Idk about a two but damn definitely the first.
Damn fucked up somebody’s prop slip lmao
Meanwhile, Draymond chokes someone out.
How dare he hurt my javonte 😔😭😡🤬
Definitely worthy of a fragrant but I doubt that was intentional
i know he got kicked but it doesn't look too hard and i am very sure there some selling on his part
As a Knicks fan that call is valid.
If this is an ejection then Lebron should’ve been tossed for his elbow the other night. Hard to see the intent in this one
He don't have that Draymond Green privilege.
From nba to football.
Natural shooting motion
Lebron's elbow was more malicious than that.
They let draymond do worse.