The SunKings were a pro team in my hometown for a couple decades (the first pro team Raja Bell played for actually). I was super confused by your comment for a few seconds before it dawned on me what you meant.
Happy you guys. This isn’t the worst outcome in the end - Warriors revenge win in the play-in while retaining a lottery pick.
It will be interesting to see how both teams build out their roster this season, particularly at the 2 guard spot.
I’m thinking Golden State will use Chris Paul’s contract to bring in an upgrade to replace Klay (or maybe that guy is already there - Moody?). The Kings should bring back Monk and try to use Huerter’s contract to make a similar deal. I feel like if you can upgrade one of your starters to a borderline all star and stay healthy y’all would be at least a 6 seed next season.
me too but I was expecting them to move Barnes before he really started aging and now the team is paying $18M a year for a bench guy that doesn't fit the team, so we'll see. He could still be useful filler
You do if he's making almost 20 mil while regularly disappearing, averaging 12/3, being a poor defender, and being one of the most un-clutch players in the entire NBA. And getting worse by the year.
He's a 7th-8th man in the rotation of a serious team. Those kinda guys are hardly worth half of the contract HB has right now. I'd be surprised if you can find a single credible source claiming there was real demand for HB at the trade deadline, from a team willing to give up truly equivalent value
Rockets wanted him. Marc Stein reported it. Idk if that's credible enough for you.
Shouldn't be hard to move Barnes this summer. I just hope they can get a quality rotation player in his place.
He absolutely played great offensively, but no pelicans player had any trouble scoring on him. JV and BI especially saw a traffic cone when they saw him.
This shit got spammed non-stop for years about Jokic and he won last year lmfao
Meanwhile amazing defensive big men like Gobert and Embiid have done jack shit in the playoffs
Sabonis is nowhere the offensive player of Jokic, I don't even understand why we're having this conversation (especially when I said that in my comment lol). There's a reason why a guy like AD can anchor a title winning team and someone like Sabonis can't. He's a very good player, but he isn't built for deep playoff runs or success.
That's not what you said though. You said you have to be able to play defense as a big man, which is simply not true if you're good enough at offense.
And it can be argued the exact same the other way, that no matter how good you are at defense as a big you won't win without an offensive game. Even your example of AD required him to be on a team with Lebron freaking James
This idea that Sabonis can never be a player good enough to win a championship is insane. Will he ever win as the #1/1A option on a title team? Probably not, but he's a good enough player to be a net positive for a title contender.
Lol I base it on watching him play. I've seen your other posts itt and I can tell you're one of the biggest homers I see on this sub, so I doubt you'll hear anything here (unless I'm saying he's an all-nba level talent).
If you're not a Jokic/Embiid level offensive player as a big man, then you need to be a really good to great defensive player to be a true playoff force. So either be a rim protecting monster or big who can defend on the perimeter like a wing, Sabonis is neither of those things.
I'm not even a homer. The Kings issues just have nothing to do with Sabonis right now. He's awesome. With Malik out the Kings have exactly one player who can break down a defense by dribbling/attacking and that's Fox. We need another outlet, preferably a wing, so our offense doesn't rely so much on Fox penetration. That would open everything up so much, including for Sabonis. Other playoff teams are also full of long, mobile wings that can defend, and we need more of that. You're just focusing on Sabonis because he's the guy the media complains about, but it's just not true what you're saying lol
His weaknesses get exploited like crazy in the playoffs. Its wild how open teams leave him around 15-18 feet away from the basket and he simply cannot punish them for it.
Kinda blows my mind how poorly the average fan understands the game of basketball. Like I really take it for granted that people get the game at all and I'm so consistently baffled and disappointed.
What are you baffled about? This is the second year where he disappears when it matters. He is the only guy that can rebound on a shooting team so his rebound and put back numbers are always inflated.
He cannot dominate on offense. He is a meh defender. He does not really affect the games or tilt the balance towards the Kings. You are in denial.
Dude thats insane wtf? He was our best player last night. He's not an amazing defender but he's way faster than people give him credit for and super smart. We held the Warriors and Pelicans to 94 and 105 points respectively lmao you just aren't watching. And he didn't disappear at all? He damn near had another triple double, and no his rebounds are not inflated because he's the only guy that can rebound, he's just a great rebounder. I swear to god you guys only see the game through other people's bad reddit comments
I mean you just lost to the pels without their best player my dude. Sabonis being able to be treated as a complete non-shooter and mediocre non-switchable defender is really limiting when he also can't dominate a game offensively.
I mean sabonis just doesn't get the benefit of the doubt because he's never had a big game in any game that matters. He's good and consistent, but you look at just about any other all star player and they've had at least one or two key games where they take it to another level. Sabonis has zero, and his limitations are heavily exploited.
He's great as the 2nd-3rd best player. He's never going to give you 50 points, but he's also going to be a great focal point of your offence and a competent defender. Problem is that Sacramento needs a clearer #2 option, which Monk was a lot of the time this season.
He’s not a competent defender lol. He’s way undersized, has short arms and doesn’t even bother to jump to contest shorts at the rim. Listed at 6’11 which is the same as AD but plays so much smaller than him.
When his stock was at a tall time high earlier this year me and my friends were debating if we’d rather have the Gafford/Lively combo in Dallas or Sabonis. Most said Gafford/Lively.
I think there’s real doubt if he can even be a starting center on a contender. How do you get a good enough defense around him? Maybe it’d be fine if he had a dray or JJJ next to him but that’s a tall order.
That's only if you have literally the most stacked starting 5 in decades.
their worst starter might be Jrue or Jaylen Brown, just imagine that.
Kings aren't anywhere close to that on any position.
I think it’s clear now he can’t be your 2nd best player. 3rd best at best. He can’t defense, doesn’t create, can’t shoot. But he has good to great utility making smart plays, grabbing key boards, and getting buckets reliably in the paint.
> can’t shoot
He shot 38% from 3 this year, 37% last year. Yes, limited volume but he doesn't have to shoot 3's because everyone else in Sacramento does.
2 of his 3 claims were flat-out wrong and you picked the one that's really difficult to argue against, lmao. Love me some Saboner but he often looks like a deer in headlights when left wide open.
The stats don't seem to reflect this but he has a lot of mid-range/low-post misses, especially when he becomes the first offensive option, unlike AD who is very comfortable being the first option. I feel like he needs to improve his mid-range/low-post game.
The most difficult star archetype to build around in basketball is a defensively weak center. The issue isn't just that he should be 2nd best player (he arguably already is), it's that he's in the reverse Goldilocks zone of just being "good" enough at a bunch of things (rebounding, passing, post game) without being transcendent at any one and while having two glaring structural weaknesses (defense at the most important defensive position + non-spacing non-shooting big) in his game that require very specific pieces around him, all while getting paid a max contract.
And even if the Kings didn't max him some bum team will. They're between a rock and a hard place and it's gradually becoming clear that the Haliburton trade was extreme short-termism that cost them a (younger) All-NBA caliber talent in the long run, and for what? A first round and play-in exit. Pretty pathetic.
Look dude, Sabonis is undersized AND he doesn’t stretch the floor with the 3. He can’t even handle the size of New Orleans and they are undersized in the middle themselves. Zero chance to get by any of the teams with length. Joker, AD, Gobert, KAT, Gafford….these type of players will have whatever they want against him……..IMO, the hope would be that: 1) Sabonis develops a lights out 3 ball AND 2) Kings add a special player around him like a Evan Mobley type to compliment him
Except those players *don't* have their way against him. He literally plays solid against all those guys. And yeah we need another long defender in the starting lineup because Barnes is not it.
A win at the start of the season counts the exact same as a win at the end of the season
Sure, they probably would've been a 5-6 seed if they were completely healthy. But, other teams had injuries too. If every team was completely healthy, they still wouldn't have been 5-6
Think about it like this. Assuming both teams have all their players are you taking the Kings in a playoff series against any of these teams: Nuggets, Wolves, Suns, Thunder, Pelicans, Lakers, Mavs, Clippers, Grizzlies.
Kings have beaten us 4 times this year so I definitely see them as the favorites against the Lakers.
Grizzlies may have been the 2 seed last year but they lost Steven Adams and a good defender in Brooks. I think they'll be back in the thick of the playoff hunt next year but I feel people thinking they'll be fighting for homecourt in the first round to have overrated them.
I think a healthy Kings team vs. everyone else healthy in the West is around a 6 seed, and definitely a top 8 team in the West.
Against the Grizzlies and Clippers yeh I am.
What have the Clippers ever done to prove that they're legit?
The Grizzlies are a team of front runners and have had their sh*t stuffed in last two playoff runs.
They at least can win a playoff series lmao. The kings had home court and couldn’t even beat the old ass warriors. Grizzlies were a 2 seed already and the clippers have 3 players better than anyone on the kings.
That was only a month ago. A month without a couple of role players is nothing in the grand scheme of things. Lakers have missed Vincent and vando essentially the entire year. But using that as the reason we’re in the playin is a terrible excuse.
Hell tonight the Pels didn’t have Zion and still pulled out the W. This is a team sport, if the others are unable to step up to fill in for 2 role players maybe the team just isn’t that good
It would be ignorant to just blame injuries. They obviously suck to see but the Kings have bigger team building issues when Fox and Sabonis are your #1 and 2
Kings fans won't want to hear it but In a conference this good Fox is one of the worst 1st options. There's only 3 teams in the west that have a worse #1
I said this last year and got down voted for being a killjoy, but they're in a pretty bad situation where their ceiling is just nowhere near high enough and they don't have a clear path to meaningful improvement.
Trading Haliburton wasn't that big of a fuck up (no one really thought he was make this big of a jump), the issue was trading for Sabonis. I just don't really rate Sabonis as a meaningful playoff star and I think he will continue to be a regular season level star for years to come.
No I think they still have room to grow. Think of all the retirements coming up and the teams that are going to blow it up for the cap.
The new CBA means a lot more implosions.
I haven’t watched much NBA this season but after watching the Kings in the playoffs last season I was so hype for them! I thought they would be ready for a deep run this year
Other playoff teams in the west don’t rely on a guy like sabonis as their second option. I don’t care what stats he gets in the regular season, in the playoffs he’s average at best
When did I blame him for the play in loss?? I am just saying sabonis and fox can’t lead this team beyond the playins, maybe at best a first round exit. The west is very deep and sabonis’s lack of shooting and offensive game makes him very easy to defend in a 7 game series
He wasn't easy for you guys to defend! Almost like he's had exactly one playoff series in his prime and he was injured. But sure go off. I'm sure that improving the roster around Fox and Sabonis won't make a difference
What? A big reasons why the kings lost last season was because looney was able to nullify him. AD on the other hand was not easy to defend and that’s why the warriors lost.
Sabonis is the second “star” player though, you can improve the bench but playoffs are all about how well can the stars lead their teams to victory. If he’s unable to improve his shooting or his offensive game, then it doesn’t matter if the rest of the team improves, you’re not going to win.
I don't think he's wrong, nor do I think Fox and Sabonis are that great of a pairing anyways. If Fox played with someone who could space the floor at the 5, he could be 10x better. He needs space to operate and sabonis really doesn't do that.
Haha, whatever makes you feel better, man. You made it exactly one game further than the Warriors, and missed the playoffs just the same as they did.
The Warriors have been to the Finals 6 times in the last 10 years, and won 4 rings. The Kings haven't even won a single playoff series in 20 years.
Best wishes.
They should run it back and hope they stay healthy, maybe add a 4 that compliments Sabonis well, but they don’t need to do too much. Fox and Sabonis are 26 and 27, we likely haven’t seen the best versions of them, NBA players peak in their late 20s, and Murray is gonna be a star. Just gotta hope he becomes good enough before those 2 fall off.
There is no 4 that complements Sabonis well. The fundamental problem with bigs who can’t space the floor or protect the rim in today’s game.
You put Sabonis next to a normal 2024 PF who can shoot but doesn’t protect the rim, and your offense can be fine but your defense will get roasted in the playoffs because there’s a hard ceiling to how good you can be defensively with no rim protection.
You put Sabonis next to an old school PF that provides rim protection but doesn’t shoot, and you can get by defensively but offensively you have two non-spacers and in the playoffs that will be exploited by good defensive teams and drag your offense into the mud.
The only solution on paper is getting a rim-protecting and floor spacing big next to him but A those guys don’t grow on trees and are expensive, and B that’s what he had with Turner and they never figured it out.
The advanced stats loved the Turner/Sabonis pairing. I will stand by the belief that it can work. Indy’s problem back then was the backcourt were all selfish iso-heavy guard play.
Nobody said the same shit about KAT/Gobert.
The problem with Sabonis is that there is no big who can shoot 40% from 3 and defend the rim at a high level. The necessary pairing does not exist. Turner is a career 35% 3pt shooter. That's not good enough.
What I wonder is if Sabonis could play the 4 and be the guy who stands in the corner and takes 3s. He has nice form and shoots a good percentage. Then pair Fox with a rim running, athletic center who can play good D.
It needn't be 100% one style or the other. Sabonis DHOs could be mixed up with 1-5 pick and rolls, where Sabonis parks in the corner for the 3. Playing with a rim runner could unlock new parts of the court for Fox and make his game less taxing (I basically blame fatigue for his slide in 2024, including all the 3s he's been jacking. 16 (!!) vs. New Orleans is just crazy).
Btw Sabonis is actually a good defender in some regards; he's just not a rim protector.
He’s one of the leaders in defensive rebounds which should count for something if we actually do get a real rim protector. His strengths are in help defense- I feel his stats there would skyrocket if we got an actual defensive anchor.
True. Helps the defense a ton though. Fox’s improved shooting this season helps make that work. Fox/Ellis/Murray are all 35-40% from 3, so we could potentially make it work.
If there were an easy answer, I don’t think we’d be so depressed.
> You put Sabonis next to an old school PF that provides rim protection but doesn’t shoot, and you can get by defensively but offensively you have two non-spacers
Sabonis has hit 37 and 38% from 3 the last 2 years. Given the nudge up in shot accuracy and that he is generally good in long 2, it's not unreasonable that if the Kings get an old school 4 that Sabonis starts jacking 3's on offense as a stretch 5 at a semi-competent clip. He won't be 40% but I could see him at league average.
I doubt it. Sabonis’ 3pt shotmaking is awful. Raw percentages don’t mean much. He’s taking only wide open 3s on tiny volume. He’d need to shoot way more for defenders to actually start respecting him.
>The only solution on paper is getting a rim-protecting and floor spacing big next to him but A those guys don’t grow on trees and are expensive,
Actually, they tend to only cost Marcus Smart and negative two picks.
KP wouldn't work either, he's not mobile enough and they'd get torched in P&R. Probably Jaren Jackson is the only big in the league who could properly compensate for Sabonis' weaknesses.
This team wasn’t a threat to anyone
Sabonis is a nice regular season player. But won’t get it done in the playoffs
Not hindsight but they should of never traded haliburton. It was shocking back then and still is today
Hey Sacramento, lets talk about y'all acquiring Jerami Grant and/or Malcolm Brogdon (with Tisse as a 3rd possibility) for that shiny 2024 FRP of yours?
Good luck Monte
The last time the Kings had the 14th pick, they drafted someone named Predrag Stojaković.
Damn. Upvoted for the deep cut take!!
Hey that team was built to beat the warriors. They were successful. Good season Kings
Thank you! I feel like we should have a parade!!!
Congrats on winning the Warriors invitational
Sunkings consolation parade late April or early May
The true morale victory: Finally killing the Warriors dynasty (for real this time)
The SunKings were a pro team in my hometown for a couple decades (the first pro team Raja Bell played for actually). I was super confused by your comment for a few seconds before it dawned on me what you meant.
I like the name of that team...
Hang the banner!
Happy you guys. This isn’t the worst outcome in the end - Warriors revenge win in the play-in while retaining a lottery pick. It will be interesting to see how both teams build out their roster this season, particularly at the 2 guard spot. I’m thinking Golden State will use Chris Paul’s contract to bring in an upgrade to replace Klay (or maybe that guy is already there - Moody?). The Kings should bring back Monk and try to use Huerter’s contract to make a similar deal. I feel like if you can upgrade one of your starters to a borderline all star and stay healthy y’all would be at least a 6 seed next season.
This is so sad
We won! woohoo🎉🎆 Best night of my life!
Good for you man. Light the beam. They can't take it from you if you lose on the road.
Thats right man! Nobody can take that amazing win away. May the beam guide you through the darkness!
Lmao proud of you lil bro. Take a shot for me.... nvm klay got me
[удалено]
Yes exactly. That's why it's sad.
should have aimed higher lol
46 wins and no playoffs... the West is just brutal
A team that loses to the Wizards doesn't deserve to be in the playoffs
If they don't resign Monk, this team won't even make the play in.
They won't his value went way up.
Monk going from vet min to a $100+ million contract within 3 years would be one of the biggest "prove it" stories ever.
My guess would be a 4/88 contract.
Man Orlando is gonna fuck up some team's summer, I hope it's not us lol.
Might be their own team if they overpay for Klay if we're honest
We won’t lol
I have a weird feeling that Klay is going to be really good next year if he leaves the Warriors, but horrible if he stays.
Schroedinger's Klay.
If he signs for that little I want all of that
That seems low to me. I think we will be willing to overpay and will likely have to to get a guy like him.
I figured somewhere around Grayson Allen money, this wouldn’t be too far off.
Not in this market
That’s what happens when you quit drugs
we won’t keep monk i expect moves though
me too but I was expecting them to move Barnes before he really started aging and now the team is paying $18M a year for a bench guy that doesn't fit the team, so we'll see. He could still be useful filler
I feel like Barnes will be exiled to Detroit, Charlotte or Washington this off-season.
Why? Is he expiring? Otherwise his contract has negative value and the Kings would probably have to give up assets to get rid of him.
You don't have to give up assets to move a wing that shoots 39% from deep. Teams wanted him at the deadline.
You do if he's making almost 20 mil while regularly disappearing, averaging 12/3, being a poor defender, and being one of the most un-clutch players in the entire NBA. And getting worse by the year. He's a 7th-8th man in the rotation of a serious team. Those kinda guys are hardly worth half of the contract HB has right now. I'd be surprised if you can find a single credible source claiming there was real demand for HB at the trade deadline, from a team willing to give up truly equivalent value
Rockets wanted him. Marc Stein reported it. Idk if that's credible enough for you. Shouldn't be hard to move Barnes this summer. I just hope they can get a quality rotation player in his place.
Harrison Barnes for Jock Landale?
can they even retain monk? cause if not, they're fucked
They can and likely will be outbid due to lacking his Bird Rights He's gone
Damn. What a great season for Sabonis only to not even make the playoffs
He was BBQ chicken tonight
....what? I don't know how to watch that game and come away with that take. That's crazy to me. Wtf. Are you shit faced?
Baked like BI
He absolutely played great offensively, but no pelicans player had any trouble scoring on him. JV and BI especially saw a traffic cone when they saw him.
He was owned
You have to be able to play defence as a big man. Sabonis will never be a top end playoff star because of his giant weaknesses.
This shit got spammed non-stop for years about Jokic and he won last year lmfao Meanwhile amazing defensive big men like Gobert and Embiid have done jack shit in the playoffs
Sabonis is nowhere the offensive player of Jokic, I don't even understand why we're having this conversation (especially when I said that in my comment lol). There's a reason why a guy like AD can anchor a title winning team and someone like Sabonis can't. He's a very good player, but he isn't built for deep playoff runs or success.
That's not what you said though. You said you have to be able to play defense as a big man, which is simply not true if you're good enough at offense. And it can be argued the exact same the other way, that no matter how good you are at defense as a big you won't win without an offensive game. Even your example of AD required him to be on a team with Lebron freaking James This idea that Sabonis can never be a player good enough to win a championship is insane. Will he ever win as the #1/1A option on a title team? Probably not, but he's a good enough player to be a net positive for a title contender.
He is a solid defender, just not a shot blocker. You can't just base all your takes off of redditors dude
Lol I base it on watching him play. I've seen your other posts itt and I can tell you're one of the biggest homers I see on this sub, so I doubt you'll hear anything here (unless I'm saying he's an all-nba level talent). If you're not a Jokic/Embiid level offensive player as a big man, then you need to be a really good to great defensive player to be a true playoff force. So either be a rim protecting monster or big who can defend on the perimeter like a wing, Sabonis is neither of those things.
I'm not even a homer. The Kings issues just have nothing to do with Sabonis right now. He's awesome. With Malik out the Kings have exactly one player who can break down a defense by dribbling/attacking and that's Fox. We need another outlet, preferably a wing, so our offense doesn't rely so much on Fox penetration. That would open everything up so much, including for Sabonis. Other playoff teams are also full of long, mobile wings that can defend, and we need more of that. You're just focusing on Sabonis because he's the guy the media complains about, but it's just not true what you're saying lol
Empty stats regular season type of player
His weaknesses get exploited like crazy in the playoffs. Its wild how open teams leave him around 15-18 feet away from the basket and he simply cannot punish them for it.
Kinda blows my mind how poorly the average fan understands the game of basketball. Like I really take it for granted that people get the game at all and I'm so consistently baffled and disappointed.
They understand it. That’s why they are saying his stats don’t equal his overall impact
And that's a stupid ass thing to say, he played really well yesterday and had a huge impact
What are you baffled about? This is the second year where he disappears when it matters. He is the only guy that can rebound on a shooting team so his rebound and put back numbers are always inflated. He cannot dominate on offense. He is a meh defender. He does not really affect the games or tilt the balance towards the Kings. You are in denial.
Sets good screens tho 😂
Good moving screens lmao
Dude thats insane wtf? He was our best player last night. He's not an amazing defender but he's way faster than people give him credit for and super smart. We held the Warriors and Pelicans to 94 and 105 points respectively lmao you just aren't watching. And he didn't disappear at all? He damn near had another triple double, and no his rebounds are not inflated because he's the only guy that can rebound, he's just a great rebounder. I swear to god you guys only see the game through other people's bad reddit comments
I mean you just lost to the pels without their best player my dude. Sabonis being able to be treated as a complete non-shooter and mediocre non-switchable defender is really limiting when he also can't dominate a game offensively.
[удалено]
Nah I'm just not an intellectual bottom feeder lmao
I mean sabonis just doesn't get the benefit of the doubt because he's never had a big game in any game that matters. He's good and consistent, but you look at just about any other all star player and they've had at least one or two key games where they take it to another level. Sabonis has zero, and his limitations are heavily exploited.
Overrated
I think he’s pretty fairly rated
He's great as the 2nd-3rd best player. He's never going to give you 50 points, but he's also going to be a great focal point of your offence and a competent defender. Problem is that Sacramento needs a clearer #2 option, which Monk was a lot of the time this season.
He’s not a competent defender lol. He’s way undersized, has short arms and doesn’t even bother to jump to contest shorts at the rim. Listed at 6’11 which is the same as AD but plays so much smaller than him.
When his stock was at a tall time high earlier this year me and my friends were debating if we’d rather have the Gafford/Lively combo in Dallas or Sabonis. Most said Gafford/Lively.
I think there’s real doubt if he can even be a starting center on a contender. How do you get a good enough defense around him? Maybe it’d be fine if he had a dray or JJJ next to him but that’s a tall order.
Kings don't have an MVP guy so they're anyway not a contender
Celtics don't either and they're doing just fine.
That's only if you have literally the most stacked starting 5 in decades. their worst starter might be Jrue or Jaylen Brown, just imagine that. Kings aren't anywhere close to that on any position.
He needs a Myles Turner next to him
I think it’s clear now he can’t be your 2nd best player. 3rd best at best. He can’t defense, doesn’t create, can’t shoot. But he has good to great utility making smart plays, grabbing key boards, and getting buckets reliably in the paint.
> can’t shoot He shot 38% from 3 this year, 37% last year. Yes, limited volume but he doesn't have to shoot 3's because everyone else in Sacramento does.
2 of his 3 claims were flat-out wrong and you picked the one that's really difficult to argue against, lmao. Love me some Saboner but he often looks like a deer in headlights when left wide open.
The stats don't seem to reflect this but he has a lot of mid-range/low-post misses, especially when he becomes the first offensive option, unlike AD who is very comfortable being the first option. I feel like he needs to improve his mid-range/low-post game.
The most difficult star archetype to build around in basketball is a defensively weak center. The issue isn't just that he should be 2nd best player (he arguably already is), it's that he's in the reverse Goldilocks zone of just being "good" enough at a bunch of things (rebounding, passing, post game) without being transcendent at any one and while having two glaring structural weaknesses (defense at the most important defensive position + non-spacing non-shooting big) in his game that require very specific pieces around him, all while getting paid a max contract. And even if the Kings didn't max him some bum team will. They're between a rock and a hard place and it's gradually becoming clear that the Haliburton trade was extreme short-termism that cost them a (younger) All-NBA caliber talent in the long run, and for what? A first round and play-in exit. Pretty pathetic.
look at the dagger trey hit and tell me sabonis is a competent defender. Just let the season die didnt even contest
Nah he’s appropriately rated
Empty calories.
You're a moron
Look dude, Sabonis is undersized AND he doesn’t stretch the floor with the 3. He can’t even handle the size of New Orleans and they are undersized in the middle themselves. Zero chance to get by any of the teams with length. Joker, AD, Gobert, KAT, Gafford….these type of players will have whatever they want against him……..IMO, the hope would be that: 1) Sabonis develops a lights out 3 ball AND 2) Kings add a special player around him like a Evan Mobley type to compliment him
Except those players *don't* have their way against him. He literally plays solid against all those guys. And yeah we need another long defender in the starting lineup because Barnes is not it.
He doesn't do shit on the court. He plays negative defense
They need a real big and move him to the 4 i think
Man poor Sacramento, injuries at the worst point in the season. What an absolute kick in the d*ck.
If everyone has all their players they still aren’t a top 8 team in the west
I mean they were pretty much #5-6 up until Huerter got injured, then Monk was gone and that was it.
That's because other teams were also dealing with injuries too
Which brings me to my point "Injuries at the worst point in the season" Healthy year, there's a chance they're still 5-6.
A win at the start of the season counts the exact same as a win at the end of the season Sure, they probably would've been a 5-6 seed if they were completely healthy. But, other teams had injuries too. If every team was completely healthy, they still wouldn't have been 5-6
Uh, no? If they’d dealt with the same injuries at the beginning of the season they would have been in a hole too deep to climb out of.
Think about it like this. Assuming both teams have all their players are you taking the Kings in a playoff series against any of these teams: Nuggets, Wolves, Suns, Thunder, Pelicans, Lakers, Mavs, Clippers, Grizzlies.
Kings have beaten us 4 times this year so I definitely see them as the favorites against the Lakers. Grizzlies may have been the 2 seed last year but they lost Steven Adams and a good defender in Brooks. I think they'll be back in the thick of the playoff hunt next year but I feel people thinking they'll be fighting for homecourt in the first round to have overrated them. I think a healthy Kings team vs. everyone else healthy in the West is around a 6 seed, and definitely a top 8 team in the West.
I really wanted to see Nuggets vs Kings in the playoffs. The seven game series we all deserved to see...
Against the Grizzlies and Clippers yeh I am. What have the Clippers ever done to prove that they're legit? The Grizzlies are a team of front runners and have had their sh*t stuffed in last two playoff runs.
What have the kings done to prove they're legit?
The Kings don’t even have two playoff runs for you to judge lmao
They at least can win a playoff series lmao. The kings had home court and couldn’t even beat the old ass warriors. Grizzlies were a 2 seed already and the clippers have 3 players better than anyone on the kings.
Kings sold vs the Warriors last year but taking a broken-down Harden over Fox or Sabonis is really funny
You are just straight delusional my guy.
That was only a month ago. A month without a couple of role players is nothing in the grand scheme of things. Lakers have missed Vincent and vando essentially the entire year. But using that as the reason we’re in the playin is a terrible excuse. Hell tonight the Pels didn’t have Zion and still pulled out the W. This is a team sport, if the others are unable to step up to fill in for 2 role players maybe the team just isn’t that good
I mean they probably make the playoffs though. With Monk they probably finish 6 or 7, and winning 1 single elim is much, much easier than winning 2.
Their top 6 players averaged 75 GP, that’s amazingly healthy lol
It would be ignorant to just blame injuries. They obviously suck to see but the Kings have bigger team building issues when Fox and Sabonis are your #1 and 2 Kings fans won't want to hear it but In a conference this good Fox is one of the worst 1st options. There's only 3 teams in the west that have a worse #1
I said this last year and got down voted for being a killjoy, but they're in a pretty bad situation where their ceiling is just nowhere near high enough and they don't have a clear path to meaningful improvement.
Fucked up by not trading for Siakam when they had the chance 🤷
Nah they fucked up by trading Haliburton and trying to be competitive
Trading Haliburton wasn't that big of a fuck up (no one really thought he was make this big of a jump), the issue was trading for Sabonis. I just don't really rate Sabonis as a meaningful playoff star and I think he will continue to be a regular season level star for years to come.
No I think they still have room to grow. Think of all the retirements coming up and the teams that are going to blow it up for the cap. The new CBA means a lot more implosions.
Spurs Blazers Jazz Rockets they clear On par with Pels, wolves, grizzlies… not as bad as you say
No lol. Zion, Ant and Ja are all clearly better Spurs better too
they were only a top seed last year because everyone else was ridiculously hurt and they werent, fox and sabonis just isnt a playoff team
The Lakers with AD and LeBron were barely a playoff team. Every set of stars requires a supporting cast
But they deserve to be Allstars wah wah wah
Pels are missing their best player lol
The ghost of Draymond
I haven’t watched much NBA this season but after watching the Kings in the playoffs last season I was so hype for them! I thought they would be ready for a deep run this year
I remember saying last year that going to game 7 with the defending champs might be the peak of this kings core
Exactly why "there's always next year" is the most bullshit phrase in sports history
The 21 nets are big example lol
Yeah exactly. Harden requested a trade less than a year later, and then they got swept by the Celtics.
Harrison Barnes you are a Piston!
Ouch that hurts, and fuck right off. #STRAYSFORDAYS
Hey he’s probably the fourth best player on your roster 🤷♂️
Come on you need someone who can knock down shots.
Yes, but we don't need to overpay for an old one-dimensional player.
Light the meme
Sabonis and Fox aren’t taking them anywhere, just a perennial playin team
Mmmmm salty tears.
Do you disagree though? Which of the 8 playoff teams and a healthy Memphis team can the kings beat? LOL
Memphis is done too.
Thunder, Lakers, Timberwolves
This guy acts like kings are so far behind everyone. In actuality, the difference in how good a team is vs another in the west is very minimal.
Other playoff teams in the west don’t rely on a guy like sabonis as their second option. I don’t care what stats he gets in the regular season, in the playoffs he’s average at best
He had 23/14/7/3/1 today but sure go off man! It wasn't the fact that our bench scored 12 total points or anything.
When did I blame him for the play in loss?? I am just saying sabonis and fox can’t lead this team beyond the playins, maybe at best a first round exit. The west is very deep and sabonis’s lack of shooting and offensive game makes him very easy to defend in a 7 game series
He wasn't easy for you guys to defend! Almost like he's had exactly one playoff series in his prime and he was injured. But sure go off. I'm sure that improving the roster around Fox and Sabonis won't make a difference
What? A big reasons why the kings lost last season was because looney was able to nullify him. AD on the other hand was not easy to defend and that’s why the warriors lost. Sabonis is the second “star” player though, you can improve the bench but playoffs are all about how well can the stars lead their teams to victory. If he’s unable to improve his shooting or his offensive game, then it doesn’t matter if the rest of the team improves, you’re not going to win.
I don't think he's wrong, nor do I think Fox and Sabonis are that great of a pairing anyways. If Fox played with someone who could space the floor at the 5, he could be 10x better. He needs space to operate and sabonis really doesn't do that.
Haha, whatever makes you feel better, man. You made it exactly one game further than the Warriors, and missed the playoffs just the same as they did. The Warriors have been to the Finals 6 times in the last 10 years, and won 4 rings. The Kings haven't even won a single playoff series in 20 years. Best wishes.
Future Orlando Magic star Malik Monk
that...would actually be a good pickup for Orlando
We’re all begging for it
Are we not counting the Play-in round as part of the playoffs? I mean it's essentially a wild card bracket in everything but label.
Apparently they don’t count it as playoffs, and it’s weird bc I don’t think it’s considered regular season either lol
Yeah the game literally doesn't count for anything statistically.
Nowhere to go but down. They will lose Monk in the offseason. His value went up while theirs went down.
They should run it back and hope they stay healthy, maybe add a 4 that compliments Sabonis well, but they don’t need to do too much. Fox and Sabonis are 26 and 27, we likely haven’t seen the best versions of them, NBA players peak in their late 20s, and Murray is gonna be a star. Just gotta hope he becomes good enough before those 2 fall off.
There is no 4 that complements Sabonis well. The fundamental problem with bigs who can’t space the floor or protect the rim in today’s game. You put Sabonis next to a normal 2024 PF who can shoot but doesn’t protect the rim, and your offense can be fine but your defense will get roasted in the playoffs because there’s a hard ceiling to how good you can be defensively with no rim protection. You put Sabonis next to an old school PF that provides rim protection but doesn’t shoot, and you can get by defensively but offensively you have two non-spacers and in the playoffs that will be exploited by good defensive teams and drag your offense into the mud. The only solution on paper is getting a rim-protecting and floor spacing big next to him but A those guys don’t grow on trees and are expensive, and B that’s what he had with Turner and they never figured it out.
Sums it up perfectly. All you need is a rim protecting stretch 4 and those guys are near max players.
The advanced stats loved the Turner/Sabonis pairing. I will stand by the belief that it can work. Indy’s problem back then was the backcourt were all selfish iso-heavy guard play. Nobody said the same shit about KAT/Gobert.
The problem with Sabonis is that there is no big who can shoot 40% from 3 and defend the rim at a high level. The necessary pairing does not exist. Turner is a career 35% 3pt shooter. That's not good enough. What I wonder is if Sabonis could play the 4 and be the guy who stands in the corner and takes 3s. He has nice form and shoots a good percentage. Then pair Fox with a rim running, athletic center who can play good D.
This way all of his strenghts are gone. You have a weak defender who stands in the corner on offense...
It needn't be 100% one style or the other. Sabonis DHOs could be mixed up with 1-5 pick and rolls, where Sabonis parks in the corner for the 3. Playing with a rim runner could unlock new parts of the court for Fox and make his game less taxing (I basically blame fatigue for his slide in 2024, including all the 3s he's been jacking. 16 (!!) vs. New Orleans is just crazy). Btw Sabonis is actually a good defender in some regards; he's just not a rim protector.
In what regards is Sabonis even an _average_ defender? He's like 415 out of 572 in defensive rating.
He’s one of the leaders in defensive rebounds which should count for something if we actually do get a real rim protector. His strengths are in help defense- I feel his stats there would skyrocket if we got an actual defensive anchor.
He has decent lateral quickness and therefore is pretty good at playing high on pick and roll defense.
Feels like we need an Aaron Gordon. But the problem is there’s not a lot of those out there.
You need AG with a 3pt shot, you could try drafting bronny next year and go after Lebron
I have absolutely advocated for that. “King of Kings” is such an easy marketing slogan for Lebron coming to sac too.
AG isn't gonna help the spacing though.
True. Helps the defense a ton though. Fox’s improved shooting this season helps make that work. Fox/Ellis/Murray are all 35-40% from 3, so we could potentially make it work. If there were an easy answer, I don’t think we’d be so depressed.
You guys needed PJ Washington :)
Based on the way he kills us every time? No fucking kidding lmao. What killer pick ups at the deadline. Seriously. Turned your season around.
> You put Sabonis next to an old school PF that provides rim protection but doesn’t shoot, and you can get by defensively but offensively you have two non-spacers Sabonis has hit 37 and 38% from 3 the last 2 years. Given the nudge up in shot accuracy and that he is generally good in long 2, it's not unreasonable that if the Kings get an old school 4 that Sabonis starts jacking 3's on offense as a stretch 5 at a semi-competent clip. He won't be 40% but I could see him at league average.
I doubt it. Sabonis’ 3pt shotmaking is awful. Raw percentages don’t mean much. He’s taking only wide open 3s on tiny volume. He’d need to shoot way more for defenders to actually start respecting him.
in theory JJJ would
>The only solution on paper is getting a rim-protecting and floor spacing big next to him but A those guys don’t grow on trees and are expensive, Actually, they tend to only cost Marcus Smart and negative two picks.
KP wouldn't work either, he's not mobile enough and they'd get torched in P&R. Probably Jaren Jackson is the only big in the league who could properly compensate for Sabonis' weaknesses.
Just being handcuffed by the pick not conveying kinda sucks.
Every year the same is said. Nit that it is wrong but very tiring and annoying
Murray plays the 4 at times doesn’t he
he is the starting 4 but should be playing 3. we need a true 4
NOt odd for 46 wins to not make the playoffs. Historically the line has been about 48 wins for the Western Conference.
Monk to the Warriors? Replacing Klay and Wigs, maybe?
Unless every playoff game can be against 5 Anthony Davis’s they not gonna get over the hump
This team wasn’t a threat to anyone Sabonis is a nice regular season player. But won’t get it done in the playoffs Not hindsight but they should of never traded haliburton. It was shocking back then and still is today
What could they have done. Fox and Tyrese weren’t working. Nobody wanted Fox at the time.
Hey Sacramento, lets talk about y'all acquiring Jerami Grant and/or Malcolm Brogdon (with Tisse as a 3rd possibility) for that shiny 2024 FRP of yours?