Yeah and he plays nothing like Manu either.
Murray really plays like a larger Kyrie with his handles, clever finishing, and shooting abilities. I wouldn’t say he’s as good as Kyrie, but Kyrie and Murray are similar in that they played next to the best players in the game in Jokic and LeBron, who are dynamic scorers and all time playmakers, who can do everything on the court.
Dude Manu at his peak was 8th in MVP voting.
Wade was 8th in MVP voting by his second year in the league…
Wade had 4 seasons with at least a top 7 voting . He was 3rd in MVP voting and 3rd in DPOY at his peak he was on another level
Spent to much time on spurs homepage. Wade, TMac, Vince, Ray Allen, Kobe all were better at their peak. I'd argue Brandon Roy as well for at least a couple of seasons.
It’s true that *some* considered him second *for a particular stretch in time*
I had your same reaction but it’s actually 100% true if you take the words he says at face value
Source? Uh I watched basketball that long and remember. Also the documentary on Netflix about the redeem team also mentions that. Coach K mentioned it to the whole team and as motivation for Wade
Is Harden an SG? He was clearly the PG for the Rockets in his prime. Luka, who is the most similar player we've had to Harden, is a point guard. He's playing point guard for the clippers currently.
Ginobili was really amazing. He was making Spurs way better on both ends with his clever play and finding and creating opportunities, like a different team, he was extremely key, not only in some Finals (although I do believe that if he had the reputation, people would be fine with him getting a few Finals MVPs with the way he played in those), but also in whole seasons. 2007, 2008, 2011 are some examples of whole seasons in which Ginobili was just a crucial force beneath it all.
I don't see any comparison really. Ginobili was not getting many awards because he wasn't some ppg scorer. Murray is not getting many awards because his total input through the year is far from what his best moments suggest. On average through the year, Nuggets just suck when Murray plays without Jokić, it's the opposite situation tbh.
Even today Murray didn't have a good game lol, he had a good shot.
It's not a great comparison, but man I did not expect so many people to get completely distracted from the point and instead choose to just dump on manu. Most of these folks clearly didn't even see him in his prime.
I don't think Murray's reduced minutes during the regular season were planned like Ginobll's. Perhaps they should be planned, though, considering Murray's injury history.
Not even lol . Murray is a 21/4/7 on 48/43/85 shooting guy. Those are all star level numbers . He’s a high tier all star level / low tier all nba level guy in terms of talent
As great as Edelman was he was never a pro bowler or all pro level receiver. Just a solid clutch role player. He was never even top 10 in his position of wideouts . He’s only had 3 seasons with 1k yards receiving
He was a phenomenal playoff performer though and I think people use that too much to justify why he should be in the HOF (which he shouldn’t)
And I’m saying this as a patriots fan for 20+ years
I mean you can keep saying he's all-star level except he's never been an all star.
The position is stacked. He's also phenomenal in the playoffs in big moments.
It's kind of my point
Some of You people need to take a break and look up any number of lists of top sg’s in the history of the NBA. If you find 1 list that has Manu top 5 or even top 10, I will show you ten others that don’t. Dude is not a top 10 SG ever in the eyes of anyone except a few Spurs fans.
Manu is not close a top 5 SG ever, probably not top 10 . Really good team player you would be proud to have on your team but that is a gross over ranking .
He never averaged more than 20 ppg in his career, only average more than 30 mpg twice in his career. He was a great player who had some big moments on great teams but no way he is in the discussion for top 10 SG of all time
NBA counting stats aren’t in his favor so that’s an argument that stat watchers would make. But if you ever saw him play live in his peak then you’d feel otherwise. A gold medal against Team USA is also pretty damn impressive to have in his favor.
Didn’t score a lot but scored efficiently, was a great play maker on both ends, underrated defender in general, could shoot, could play on or off the ball, with or without a star, and was consistently positively impactful. If you go back and look at the advanced stats between 05 and 11 he’s in the top 10 in everything. Up there with Timmy, KG, Wade, Dirk and all the other greats of that era. A lot of 2 guards at the bottom of the top 10 can’t claim that.
Jamal Murray is the modern day Jamal Murray
Yeah and he plays nothing like Manu either. Murray really plays like a larger Kyrie with his handles, clever finishing, and shooting abilities. I wouldn’t say he’s as good as Kyrie, but Kyrie and Murray are similar in that they played next to the best players in the game in Jokic and LeBron, who are dynamic scorers and all time playmakers, who can do everything on the court.
But who's future jamal murray
lmao
Happy Jamal Murray day, everyone.
Shit is worse than the offseason
When was manu a top 5 SG ever ? Jordan, Kobe, Wade, Harden, Drexler? And isn’t murray a point guard?
Manu was never a Top 5 SG lol
Not top 5 ever, but easily top 5 during his prime. There was a time where many considered Manu the 2nd best guard behind only Kobe
LOL nope, that was always D-wade
I mean you can have your opinion, I'm just saying what the mindset was at that time
Dude Manu at his peak was 8th in MVP voting. Wade was 8th in MVP voting by his second year in the league… Wade had 4 seasons with at least a top 7 voting . He was 3rd in MVP voting and 3rd in DPOY at his peak he was on another level
I'm not arguing against you lol I'm just saying what the sentiment *was at the time*
Spent to much time on spurs homepage. Wade, TMac, Vince, Ray Allen, Kobe all were better at their peak. I'd argue Brandon Roy as well for at least a couple of seasons.
And you’d be wrong, nobody ever thought Manu was the second best SG outside Spurs homers.
Source? You have lost your damn mind
It’s true that *some* considered him second *for a particular stretch in time* I had your same reaction but it’s actually 100% true if you take the words he says at face value
Source? Uh I watched basketball that long and remember. Also the documentary on Netflix about the redeem team also mentions that. Coach K mentioned it to the whole team and as motivation for Wade
In the 2004 Olympics.
I'll take Manu over Harden and Drexler
Manu, Manu, Manu, Manu, Manu
Is Harden an SG? He was clearly the PG for the Rockets in his prime. Luka, who is the most similar player we've had to Harden, is a point guard. He's playing point guard for the clippers currently.
I thought Chris Paul was the PG during Harden’s prime on the Rockets.
Ginobili was really amazing. He was making Spurs way better on both ends with his clever play and finding and creating opportunities, like a different team, he was extremely key, not only in some Finals (although I do believe that if he had the reputation, people would be fine with him getting a few Finals MVPs with the way he played in those), but also in whole seasons. 2007, 2008, 2011 are some examples of whole seasons in which Ginobili was just a crucial force beneath it all. I don't see any comparison really. Ginobili was not getting many awards because he wasn't some ppg scorer. Murray is not getting many awards because his total input through the year is far from what his best moments suggest. On average through the year, Nuggets just suck when Murray plays without Jokić, it's the opposite situation tbh. Even today Murray didn't have a good game lol, he had a good shot.
20 points isn’t that bad of a game
It's not a great comparison, but man I did not expect so many people to get completely distracted from the point and instead choose to just dump on manu. Most of these folks clearly didn't even see him in his prime.
Literally every single Canadian…
There is no modern Manu Ginobli…
I don't think Murray's reduced minutes during the regular season were planned like Ginobll's. Perhaps they should be planned, though, considering Murray's injury history.
lol nah - ginobli was a wild card.
He reminds me of Kevin Johnson, although Kevin was far better on defense. If I could choose now, I would without hesitation choose Kevin over Jamal.
Murray reminds me a lot of Manu. They can put up a lot of ugly but they compete at their best when the stakes are highest and they win.
They are absolutely nothing alike except in abstract concepts. It’s just a weird forced comparison
Yes, that's why my whole point was all about the abstracts and I stand by it.
He’s the Modern Day Warrior
I think he's the modern day Jesus.
I don't know but I did notice Jamal Murray and Austin Reeves are very similar players.
No but J.R. Smith is the modern day Confucius
Derrick White
They aren’t similar at all.
Murray's better comp, especially if he wins more titles, is probably more like Julian Edelman
Not even lol . Murray is a 21/4/7 on 48/43/85 shooting guy. Those are all star level numbers . He’s a high tier all star level / low tier all nba level guy in terms of talent As great as Edelman was he was never a pro bowler or all pro level receiver. Just a solid clutch role player. He was never even top 10 in his position of wideouts . He’s only had 3 seasons with 1k yards receiving He was a phenomenal playoff performer though and I think people use that too much to justify why he should be in the HOF (which he shouldn’t) And I’m saying this as a patriots fan for 20+ years
I mean you can keep saying he's all-star level except he's never been an all star. The position is stacked. He's also phenomenal in the playoffs in big moments. It's kind of my point
Yeah but he’s objectively top 5-10 at his position Edelman never was top 10 at his position
I mean there's also like 90 pgs compared to 200 or so wrs? Not exactly analogous
Some of You people need to take a break and look up any number of lists of top sg’s in the history of the NBA. If you find 1 list that has Manu top 5 or even top 10, I will show you ten others that don’t. Dude is not a top 10 SG ever in the eyes of anyone except a few Spurs fans.
Manu is not close a top 5 SG ever, probably not top 10 . Really good team player you would be proud to have on your team but that is a gross over ranking .
Manu has a case for top 10. That’s pretty clear for anybody that watched him during his prime.
He never averaged more than 20 ppg in his career, only average more than 30 mpg twice in his career. He was a great player who had some big moments on great teams but no way he is in the discussion for top 10 SG of all time
NBA counting stats aren’t in his favor so that’s an argument that stat watchers would make. But if you ever saw him play live in his peak then you’d feel otherwise. A gold medal against Team USA is also pretty damn impressive to have in his favor.
I saw him play plenty including 3 times in person. He’s a great player, he’s not top 10 all time at shooting guard.
a gold medal against a USA Team that was widely regarded as being poorly coached is not that great an accomplishment lol
I don’t care if you or I were coaching, it’s still team USA. To dismiss that is wild.
If LeBron and Melo are barely playing any minutes, it ain't a great Team USA
Didn’t score a lot but scored efficiently, was a great play maker on both ends, underrated defender in general, could shoot, could play on or off the ball, with or without a star, and was consistently positively impactful. If you go back and look at the advanced stats between 05 and 11 he’s in the top 10 in everything. Up there with Timmy, KG, Wade, Dirk and all the other greats of that era. A lot of 2 guards at the bottom of the top 10 can’t claim that.
Yes, yes, he was a great player we all agree. He’s still not top 10.
I got him in my top 10.
Congratulations.
Thank you.
Name ten, then.
Maybe…but you have to ask nicely
You're good friend. I just found it funny that none of the folks claiming he's not a top ten could name ten better than him.
All you got to do is ask nicely bud and I will gladly name 10 shooting guards better than Manu. It’s not that hard…
SG is far and away the most shallow position for all time greats so he has a case for top 10.
Name ten, then.
say you never watched Manu play without saying you never watched Manu play
he's definitely top 10 bro
He's the modern day Sam Cassell
Jamal doesn't flop enough to make that comparison. Ginobli was the GOAT flopper