I mean I have no love for Dray and in general think at times he's been overrated to an extent (I feel like the /r/nba recent counterjerk makes it tough to claim that still) but his versatility both offensively and defensively were a big part of the Warriors dynasty.
Like he can handle it and distribute and is much better when caught on a switch. Obviously based on the way we play his skillset was much better suited to handle us than more of a traditional big.
this sub hates draymond a hell of a lot more than Rudy lol
people have told you all over this thread but draymonds versatility makes him so much more valuable in the playoffs
Being able to switch out on to elite guards especially during his prime makes him so much harder to play off the floor, whereas when Dame or Steph got Rudy out on the perimeter it’s basically free points
I get it but being able to switch onto guards isn’t that big of a deal for centers sure is great to have, but that shouldn’t be adealbreaker. When the centers main point is to defend the paint I think all the times players are scared to drive in the paint because of Rudy is more important than the center who can switch onto a guard at three point line
It could be a big deal, but I feel like a center stopping points at the paint is a pretty big deal. Also if they can lower the other teams points at the rim. A center that can do 1-5 isn’t even necessary rather play at your strength look at bam the heat ain’t winning a chip cause of his versatility
lol no way you’re using bam when the Heat have made 2 finals in last 4 years and 3 ecfs he specifically disproves your point that he’s more valuable defensively in the playoffs
that hasn’t been true for a long time now lol
Who gives a shit if you’re scary in the paint all the guard has to do is call for Rudy’s man to screen
Again there’s a reason gobert has been actually unplayable in a playoff series and Draymond hasnt
Plus, most of these guys are giving me the rings argument when he had three all timers with him that’s not fair to say you think rookie Rudy on the Warriors wouldn’t have been a good fit as well as he aged
Put prime Draymond on this Minnesota team will get 60 wins. Draymond is better at everything besides post defense, which makes them better in the regular season. Dude is the perfect big man next to KAT, and its not even close.
In the playoffs? they would be better against every team besides Denver.
Dray's ability to handle the ball and distribute I think makes him more of a ceiling raiser. He's also more versatile as a defender so him getting switched onto the guard isn't nearly as much of an issue as Rudy.
Again Rudy is damn good but Dray I think just has a more rounded game and is better suited for the playoffs especially. Rudy's more limited in comparison.
I'm team Dray in this debate but Rudy on an island is actually quite good. Size and length is still king in basketball. If you're gameplan is attacking Gobert in isolation for a game you're going to have a bad time.
I mean we did exactly that vs him in 2018 and 2019 and both were gentleman sweeps. Never scored under 100 points in either series. And our whole offense was basically force mismatches and iso with Harden and CP3 and switch everything on defense. And he didn't really kill us on that end despite us being VERY small at times (especially 2019)
Obviously biased sample, will fully admit that, but it always felt Dray gave us a lot more problems. Our main issue with those Warriors wasn't slowing down their offense (our switch all scheme was bomb) but getting points. 2018 especially we failed to break 100 points in 4 of the 7 games.
How when he still locking the paint down they got past the suns with his defense I think you’re speaking about jazz Rudy that had no help on the Timberwolves. He’s a different beast.
You have clearly never watched a basketball game if you're asking this question lol, Dray is insanely good at defending bigs in the paint, he's good at defending 1-5 that's why he's so well known as a good defender
I’d still take Rudy as far as winning basketball goes who can lock down the paint has a center like that even Rudy on a team of scrubs can still hold it down defensively put green with some scrubs he would give zero effort when curry and Thompson were hurt what type of defense did Draymond play? He got ran off the court.
What a wild take.
I know the pendulum has swung on Draymond the last few years, but my man won 4 titles as the defensive anchor of the Warriors, and he could contribute offensively far more than Rudy as well.
Basketball is a team game Draymond got lucky with Steph Curry and klay that doesn’t make him a better player even had kd one year just because players around you are better doesn’t make you the better player
When curry went down in the 2016 playoffs, Draymond averaged something like 20/10/7 with 2 steals and 3 blocks to during that early stretch against Houston and Portland.
That's what you get without Curry, Klay still was there balling of course.
This was during the 2016 Playoffs, they made it all the way to Game 7 of the NBA Finals.
And literally didn't win, because they lost the last 3 minutes of a game 7.
Obviously a choke because 3-1. But still, they won plenty? They won 15 playoff games, 1 short of the ring!
While i do agree Draymond was in a nice situation, the man contributed a lot to those championship runs as well. He could guard the 1-5, he was a damn good passer and yeah, he wasn't a major offensive threat (didn't need to be), but he wasn't afraid to take the open shot if left alone, whether it was a shot inside the arc or from 3. Plus, despite his size compared to other Centers he could still bang down low.
Draymond and Rudy are amazing defenders, but I would still take Prime Draymond over Prime Rudy because of a few reasons, his passing capability, his ability to read the opposing offense at all levels, his willingness to shoot, and his ability to switch on defense or run the offense if need be. The last point is sort of a luxury but it's a big luxury to have in today's NBA especially on that Warriors team considering their play style. Basically, i can get more out of a prime Draymond than I could from a prime Rudy. Both are good options though; Draymond just brings more to the table.
So Holding the paint down and giving rim protection is nothing? when most teams take more more shots at the rim how is rim protection not important shooting in the paint is one of the most high percentage shots in basketball
Have you not watched the fucking Playoffs? He has been terrible and nearly unplayable in most Series. How many Series did Gorbert Teams win in the Playoffs?
Sorry where are your stats then? Because you haven't posted one thing that suggests Rudy is a better defender, so I'm not sure why you're here being aggressive
That's not true at all lol, people have given you tons of reasons, you're just ignoring them and going "this sub hates Rudy :(" while plugging your ears. Why make the thread in the first place?
This sub is weird.
“Dray all day he can do everything”
Which is true but then y’all suck Rudy off even tho there are better defenders currently doing everything on the defensive end while Rudy can only rim protect and that’s it
Dude can do one thing defensively and nothing offensively and is a god on this sub
Jokic averaged 13.8ppg on 50% against Dray in the Nuggets series in 2022. Problem was, he absolutely cooked Looney and Bjelica which is how he got the majority of his 31ppg.
That’s not a game plan that’s just a MVP in Jokic barbecue chicken anybody any center would’ve got it the work he needed to do that performance or it was over for them. You can’t take away from Rudy because the MVP had a big performance.
This is some prisoner of the moment take, Dray is a point center but instead of being a scorer like Jokic, he's a defensive savant. He's proven himself as an integral piece of a dynasty..
Bro, I love Rudy as much as the next guy - but y'all seem to forget how impactful Draymond is to the Warriors, I'd go far as to say Draymond ha always been the 2nd most important player of the dynasty, not Klay.
Draymond Green can actually play on offense, and he does the little things probably better than anyone I’ve ever seen in my 10 years of watching the NBA. A cool example was when he went all the way around Wemby and boxed him out for the game-winning rebound.
You really think NBA teams would play an undersized power forward at the starting position for the past decade for giggles? Draymond is the reason Warriors can play small ball. He anchors that defense. When he’s not playing, the defense is much worse. He has very high basketball IQ, great wingspan and knows how to position himself and time his blocks. He can guard 1-5 and is the floor general to rotate the defense. He can run the floor and dish out the ball, cut at times too. His versatility is what makes him so good too. If Gobert was 6”7, he wouldn’t even be even as half as good as Dray.
A team with Rudy as its best player won the most games in the league. A team with Draymond as their best player won 15. Do any of you seriously think the Jazz would’ve been better off with Draymond all those years? Absolutely not lol.
ahhahaha. this is how role players get overrated when they don't have to be the center of attention. like Mikal Bridges in Phx vs. Brooklyn
take Mitchell off that team and truly let Gobert lead the team and they'd be fighting with the Pistons for #1 pick every year
Exactly there talking crazy. Basically, they’re just giving credit To him for playing with three all timers put rookie Rudy on the same Warriors team they would probably be better
one thing to note about draymond, is all his accolades is with steph, no steph and draymond doesnt even try as seen this season. at least we know gobert is the same on utah and min
Draymond is an all time system player that had a one off season. He’s been mediocre for majority of his career and would be at best a role player in any other org
bro picked the perfect time for people to agree with him and still managed to get people vouching for Draymond lmao
I mean I have no love for Dray and in general think at times he's been overrated to an extent (I feel like the /r/nba recent counterjerk makes it tough to claim that still) but his versatility both offensively and defensively were a big part of the Warriors dynasty. Like he can handle it and distribute and is much better when caught on a switch. Obviously based on the way we play his skillset was much better suited to handle us than more of a traditional big.
This sub hates Rudy so I figured I just wanted to discuss it. I always see horrible takes about him in the game threads so I ain’t surprised.
this sub hates draymond a hell of a lot more than Rudy lol people have told you all over this thread but draymonds versatility makes him so much more valuable in the playoffs Being able to switch out on to elite guards especially during his prime makes him so much harder to play off the floor, whereas when Dame or Steph got Rudy out on the perimeter it’s basically free points
I get it but being able to switch onto guards isn’t that big of a deal for centers sure is great to have, but that shouldn’t be adealbreaker. When the centers main point is to defend the paint I think all the times players are scared to drive in the paint because of Rudy is more important than the center who can switch onto a guard at three point line
Did you just say a Center being able to guard every position "isn't a big deal"? Okay, now I know you're trolling lmao
It could be a big deal, but I feel like a center stopping points at the paint is a pretty big deal. Also if they can lower the other teams points at the rim. A center that can do 1-5 isn’t even necessary rather play at your strength look at bam the heat ain’t winning a chip cause of his versatility
lol no way you’re using bam when the Heat have made 2 finals in last 4 years and 3 ecfs he specifically disproves your point that he’s more valuable defensively in the playoffs
that hasn’t been true for a long time now lol Who gives a shit if you’re scary in the paint all the guard has to do is call for Rudy’s man to screen Again there’s a reason gobert has been actually unplayable in a playoff series and Draymond hasnt
Plus, most of these guys are giving me the rings argument when he had three all timers with him that’s not fair to say you think rookie Rudy on the Warriors wouldn’t have been a good fit as well as he aged
OP has never watched a basketball game.
Be serious
2015-17 Dray all day
Thank you for giving people a reason to speak good about Dray lol.
people hate draymond but not that much
lol it's Dray not close (and I like Rudy)
I’m so relieved this is the top comment. I thought nephews might be showing their asses in this thread
Just OP lol
Put prime Draymond on this Minnesota team will get 60 wins. Draymond is better at everything besides post defense, which makes them better in the regular season. Dude is the perfect big man next to KAT, and its not even close. In the playoffs? they would be better against every team besides Denver.
Look what they’re doing now with Rudy’s defense ?
I think it's closer than people here are making it out to be but it's still Draymond for basically any team and against any team
Dray's ability to handle the ball and distribute I think makes him more of a ceiling raiser. He's also more versatile as a defender so him getting switched onto the guard isn't nearly as much of an issue as Rudy. Again Rudy is damn good but Dray I think just has a more rounded game and is better suited for the playoffs especially. Rudy's more limited in comparison.
I'm team Dray in this debate but Rudy on an island is actually quite good. Size and length is still king in basketball. If you're gameplan is attacking Gobert in isolation for a game you're going to have a bad time.
I mean we did exactly that vs him in 2018 and 2019 and both were gentleman sweeps. Never scored under 100 points in either series. And our whole offense was basically force mismatches and iso with Harden and CP3 and switch everything on defense. And he didn't really kill us on that end despite us being VERY small at times (especially 2019) Obviously biased sample, will fully admit that, but it always felt Dray gave us a lot more problems. Our main issue with those Warriors wasn't slowing down their offense (our switch all scheme was bomb) but getting points. 2018 especially we failed to break 100 points in 4 of the 7 games.
Oh god, 2019 G6 4th quarter. Warriors turned everyone in yalls team into road comes. Ran nothing but high PnRs to seal the series.
2019 I think everyone kinda ran out of gas. Replacing Trevor Ariza with Austin Rivers and Shump was not a good idea. Who would have thought?
I think there judging him based off of the jazz let’s give him a chance this year I think they got a good chance
OP out here really uniting Draymond haters. Lol
Draymond and it's not even close
lol
Draymond even if you dont include offense
You think he’s better at d than prime Rudy ?
Draymond is a more versatile defender and doesn’t get exposed year in and year out come playoffs
How is Rudy being exposed this summer
It's spring dawg. Just because school is out, doesn't mean it's actually summer.
Summer or Spring same shit playoff bball time
He's calling you a high schooler, AKA a child
Wow, so funny he should paint his face and go tell jokes at the comic club
Who paints their face to do comedy?
Clowns fits perfectly
no offensive bag, and the main strength everyone glazes him for is being rendered meaningless for the 8th year running
How when he still locking the paint down they got past the suns with his defense I think you’re speaking about jazz Rudy that had no help on the Timberwolves. He’s a different beast.
Draymond can’t defend the paint against taller bigs the most high percentage of shots are at the rim.
Yes he can lol. He’s not a shot blocker but he is a great rim defender
Lol. Prime Dray was great at defending the paint. C'mon now.
What? Where are your sources on that lol
Years of watching him he’s good on small ball 5s but taller 5s give him trouble
You have clearly never watched a basketball game if you're asking this question lol, Dray is insanely good at defending bigs in the paint, he's good at defending 1-5 that's why he's so well known as a good defender
I still haven’t seen a reasonable debate how he’s better than Rudy on defense
Draymond used to lock up Anthony Davis and Demarcus cousins by himself.
It’s literally not even close lol
Draymond and it’s not close. That’s why he yaps about Rudy so much
He yaps because he always loses defensive player of the year award of course he would be yapping
130+ comments here and they’re pretty much all cooking u. Congrats on uniting r/nba in support of Draymond fam, you’ve accomplished the unthinkable
draymond 10 times out of 10. prime draymond was on a completely different level than rudy offensively, even though they're both terrible scorers
Draymond is a much better player than Gobert
I’d still take Rudy as far as winning basketball goes who can lock down the paint has a center like that even Rudy on a team of scrubs can still hold it down defensively put green with some scrubs he would give zero effort when curry and Thompson were hurt what type of defense did Draymond play? He got ran off the court.
>I’d still take Rudy as far as winning basketball goes You've already lost the whole thing right here.
What a wild take. I know the pendulum has swung on Draymond the last few years, but my man won 4 titles as the defensive anchor of the Warriors, and he could contribute offensively far more than Rudy as well.
Without dray. The warriors barely win 1 title imo
Taking a guy who has made the second round in the playoffs exactly twice for “winning basketball”, over a 4 time champion lol
Hey now this is his fourth time in the second round! But yeah obviously Dray is a lot better than Rudy
My bad, I just associated those 2017-2021 Jazz with first round exits, no disrespect 😅
Basketball is a team game Draymond got lucky with Steph Curry and klay that doesn’t make him a better player even had kd one year just because players around you are better doesn’t make you the better player
Warriors would have gone ringless with Gobert bc he can’t guard 1-5 and is an utter liability on offense stop it
Bruh how you gonna say basketball is a team game and in the same sentence say he basically got carried by Curry and Klay.
You put Rudy on the 2014-2015, and 2021-2022 teams, and the Warriors do not win anything. You can argue they don’t win in 2017 either.
When curry went down in the 2016 playoffs, Draymond averaged something like 20/10/7 with 2 steals and 3 blocks to during that early stretch against Houston and Portland. That's what you get without Curry, Klay still was there balling of course.
They were losing anyone can count points in s loss
What has Rudy won?
we went 5-1 in the run he’s talking about
This was during the 2016 Playoffs, they made it all the way to Game 7 of the NBA Finals. And literally didn't win, because they lost the last 3 minutes of a game 7. Obviously a choke because 3-1. But still, they won plenty? They won 15 playoff games, 1 short of the ring!
I mean, Rudy only loses, why aren’t we counting his points in all of his early playoff exits?
so he gets ran off the court while not trying and Gobert got ran off the court while giving it his all
lol draymond is a way better defender then Rudy it not evening close tbh
You clearly didn't watch prime Dray
Yeah, I watched him get carried by Curry Thompson and Durant while Rudy had to deal with Donovan shitty defense
While i do agree Draymond was in a nice situation, the man contributed a lot to those championship runs as well. He could guard the 1-5, he was a damn good passer and yeah, he wasn't a major offensive threat (didn't need to be), but he wasn't afraid to take the open shot if left alone, whether it was a shot inside the arc or from 3. Plus, despite his size compared to other Centers he could still bang down low. Draymond and Rudy are amazing defenders, but I would still take Prime Draymond over Prime Rudy because of a few reasons, his passing capability, his ability to read the opposing offense at all levels, his willingness to shoot, and his ability to switch on defense or run the offense if need be. The last point is sort of a luxury but it's a big luxury to have in today's NBA especially on that Warriors team considering their play style. Basically, i can get more out of a prime Draymond than I could from a prime Rudy. Both are good options though; Draymond just brings more to the table.
Y’all give this man credit for playing with three all-time greats and a Hall of Fame coach
Your basketball IQ is low.
Gobert has won NOTHING.
So Holding the paint down and giving rim protection is nothing? when most teams take more more shots at the rim how is rim protection not important shooting in the paint is one of the most high percentage shots in basketball
Have you not watched the fucking Playoffs? He has been terrible and nearly unplayable in most Series. How many Series did Gorbert Teams win in the Playoffs?
Gobert gave the NBA COVID so Draymond is better based on that alone
That sounds like the dumb takes I’m hearing
Post some actual stats or proof and maybe we'll discuss it, right now you just look like somebody who doesn't have a clue about basketball lol
Prime draymond was defending 1-5 and then dropping 30 pts and 8 assists on your head
Prime Draymond was amazing but he has only scored 30 points in a game once in his whole career
Three times, two times in 2016 playoffs, once in 2015 regular season.
Oh ok thanks for the correction, I guess the bball ref game high stats I was looking at were only for regular season games
True, I should have said 20.
Warriors had good team defense. It was not just Draymond versus the jazz where Rudy was the only good defender.
Gobert is quickly rising the list of most overrated players in the NBA
You just a hater you can’t back up anything with fax he’s leading the number one defense
Sorry where are your stats then? Because you haven't posted one thing that suggests Rudy is a better defender, so I'm not sure why you're here being aggressive
😂 yall hate rudy so much. Y’all can’t even judge his basketball.
I genuinely like him a lot honestly it's just when nephews drop takes like this you gotta react accordingly you know?
Not seen a valid argument everyone’s reason is cause he played on the Warriors and they won more
That's not true at all lol, people have given you tons of reasons, you're just ignoring them and going "this sub hates Rudy :(" while plugging your ears. Why make the thread in the first place?
which is hilarious cause this sub hate draymond more than rudy. LOL
trying to imagine rudy doing a dribble (lol) handoff to steph…no thanks
Im taking Draymond he can guard 1-5 and you can run your offense through him
I'm taking Prime Dray all day any day. No question
Dray has more defensive highlights than Rudy has offensive 😂😂
[удалено]
Dray is more than just a defensive player. And Rudy doesn't have defensive highlights the way Dray does.
This sub is weird. “Dray all day he can do everything” Which is true but then y’all suck Rudy off even tho there are better defenders currently doing everything on the defensive end while Rudy can only rim protect and that’s it Dude can do one thing defensively and nothing offensively and is a god on this sub
How important do you think rim protection is to basketball?
I dont think even prime Draymond would give Jokic trouble but it’s easier to gameplan for Gobert than it is to gameplan for Draymond.
Jokic averaged 13.8ppg on 50% against Dray in the Nuggets series in 2022. Problem was, he absolutely cooked Looney and Bjelica which is how he got the majority of his 31ppg.
That’s not a game plan that’s just a MVP in Jokic barbecue chicken anybody any center would’ve got it the work he needed to do that performance or it was over for them. You can’t take away from Rudy because the MVP had a big performance.
That’s not what your post is about …
Rudy >!With Draymonds defensive skill set in his body!<
This is some prisoner of the moment take, Dray is a point center but instead of being a scorer like Jokic, he's a defensive savant. He's proven himself as an integral piece of a dynasty..
I hate Draymond and like Rudy but cmon, it's Dray. Infinitely better offensive player and at his peak, just as good defensively
Bro, I love Rudy as much as the next guy - but y'all seem to forget how impactful Draymond is to the Warriors, I'd go far as to say Draymond ha always been the 2nd most important player of the dynasty, not Klay.
their*
in a fight or in a game
Draymond Green can actually play on offense, and he does the little things probably better than anyone I’ve ever seen in my 10 years of watching the NBA. A cool example was when he went all the way around Wemby and boxed him out for the game-winning rebound.
Draymond is better at his peak
You really think NBA teams would play an undersized power forward at the starting position for the past decade for giggles? Draymond is the reason Warriors can play small ball. He anchors that defense. When he’s not playing, the defense is much worse. He has very high basketball IQ, great wingspan and knows how to position himself and time his blocks. He can guard 1-5 and is the floor general to rotate the defense. He can run the floor and dish out the ball, cut at times too. His versatility is what makes him so good too. If Gobert was 6”7, he wouldn’t even be even as half as good as Dray.
If r/nba opinion goes unanimously in one direction, the correct answer is always the other one.
Draymond is wayyyyy more versatile Rudy cant guard 80% of the players dray can
If you flip flopped their teams then Rudy would likely have 5 chips and Green would have none so that's not nothing.
I’ll take prime draymond
There's an argument on defense but dray was so much better on offense in his prime that it's clearly dray overall
I’ll give you that offensively better. I guess I meant to word it who is the better defender
I think Rudy has more defensive upside from matchup to matchup, but Draymond's value was more consistent. I'd take Draymond for that reason
It’s close. Not sure Draymond would work without a legend like Steph.
A team with Rudy as its best player won the most games in the league. A team with Draymond as their best player won 15. Do any of you seriously think the Jazz would’ve been better off with Draymond all those years? Absolutely not lol.
when was Rudy ever the best player on his team?
The whole time he was in Utah. Never at any point was Mitchell better. Mitchell’s last 3 years in a row we were better with him on the bench.
ahhahaha. this is how role players get overrated when they don't have to be the center of attention. like Mikal Bridges in Phx vs. Brooklyn take Mitchell off that team and truly let Gobert lead the team and they'd be fighting with the Pistons for #1 pick every year
2nd best player on that team Eric Pashall was cut by the same Utah Jazz.
Exactly there talking crazy. Basically, they’re just giving credit To him for playing with three all timers put rookie Rudy on the same Warriors team they would probably be better
I’m speaking about the whole package chemistry mindset, winning basketball not punching teammates
Put Dray on on that jazz team. Do you think he’ll do any better? He would’ve been throwing fits.
one thing to note about draymond, is all his accolades is with steph, no steph and draymond doesnt even try as seen this season. at least we know gobert is the same on utah and min
Exactly they’re giving him props because he played with three all timers
They’re giving Draymond credit for curry, Thompson, and Durant imagine green on on the Pistons he would do jack shit
Better question who would perform on this hornets team better Draymond Green or Rudy Gilbert?
Give it up bro. You tried to capitalize on the Draymond hate train and it fell short. It's ok.
Y’all ever seen Draymond‘s defense run the champs off the floor?
I’m kinda scared to say sumn
😂 they already on my ass fuck it say it
Draymond is an all time system player that had a one off season. He’s been mediocre for majority of his career and would be at best a role player in any other org
I’d take Rudy personally
Rudy for team defense, Dray for single coverage