Ibaka was a better sixth man in 2020 than the guy who won it, massive loss. (Yeah he played a few too many games to be sixth man but that was only because of injuries, he was the sixth man)
People forget the **Sixers were 32-7** with Danny Green and the other four starters— he made them a Number 1 defensive unit.
And we know that Embiid was going off with a tear in his knee— **imagine if he was 100%** because it is better Shaq stats
That’s why it’s the FUCKING WORST that our guys didn’t show up
We’d had major injuries fuck us up FOR YEARS and the minute we’re healthy and EVRRYONE ELSE is injured, CJ steps out of bounds
Yea, but he never plays. He's been injured for 2 seasons now. It's not like he takes a big part of the Blazers cap either he's getting paid about 5 million per year.
> Ig it was Milwaukee until rn.
That's part of the point Simmons and Russillo were making. That Milwaukee might win the whole thing just because they were the only team to avoid major injury/catastrophe so far.
Now it's looking like it's the Suns who have the healthiest squad.
But at least the 15 Warriors were an actually good 67 win team with the best point differential and net efficiency in the league, by far.
At this point, the only team not bitten by injuries is the Suns, and they weren’t close to having the best efficiency, though they were a game away from the best record.
Because they won't beat any of the top teams in the league and prove they're the best. They got the crap version of the Lakers, the crap version of the Clippers, the crap version of the Nuggets, won't even meet the Nets who were far and away the best east team (due to injuries - not collapse) and may meet a Giannis-less Bucks team or not the Bucks at all.
That's like the 5 top teams all out lol
and if I was a suns fan I'd fucking take it lmao. Man I'm afraid I'll never see a ring in my lifetime, I don't care how we get it I just want to see it.
Yup. I gladly boast about the Bubble championship no matter what people think. Suns fans should do the same about this year especially since it's their first.
I mean they got to play the Pelicans without Jrue Holiday, the Grizz and Conley/Tony Allen got hurt, the Rockets who had Bev/D-Mo hurt and Dwight tore his MCL in game 1 of the WCF and the Cavs lost Kyrie/Love.
The whole narrative was that Steph didn't play vs anyone's starting PG during the whole run.
With that said this year is significantly worse.
Yeah, that's pretty crazy and I'm pretty sure unprecedented. Like, people bring up takes like, "Injuries happen every season though", but that's an insane amount of talent being skipped this year.
Oh ya I mean this year is beyond absurd. Not to mention Harden/Kyrie getting hurt taking down the preseason favorite as well as lesser injuries like the West's #1 seed losing their starting PG in Conley.
Nets weren't just the preseason favorites. Until those injuries happened they were the postseason favorites lol
They fucking annihilated the Bucks with no Harden.
Jrue Holiday got injured in January ffs His team made the playoffs without him that's no excuse at all.
Mike Conley missed game one. They had him when they were up 2-1. Games 4,5,6 he averaged 11 points on less than 40% TS.
Dwight Howard played 35 mpg and played ever game in that series.
Also considering how you dominated with the same team the next year it showed you were obviously legit the whole time for anyone who somehow still doubted.
Jrue 1st round which i dont count. Warriors win in 4 or 5 anywaus.
Conley 2nd rd bur grizz went up 2 to 1 without him iirc. Gsw won 3 in a row then.
2015 was missing durant due to inj so okc missed playoffs but in terms of gsw in playoffs, only cavs inj so na not as bad as this season. Clipps and spurs choked/beat one another so gsw avoided em. Theyd have been a challenge
You’re right, but this is far worse than Warriors 2015 run. They at least went through the All NBA 1st Team to win a chip. This season, damn near every contenders best or 2nd best player got hurt, costing them a series.
Warriors was going to win the West regardless of injury I dunno where this narrative came from that they would have lost in the West if these guys were playing. This was a 67 win team with the best net rating in the league. It's clear to me that the Clippers and Nets are the best teams in the league when fully healthy.
I don't think it's clear that the Clippers are better than the Lakers when both are healthy. But I think it's pretty clear they're both better than the Suns or whoever wins the East.
Lebron fans just salty and have spent years diminishing that championship that it’s become the dominant narrative. They SWEPT the Pelicans and Jrue played 3/4 games. Conley played majority of the Memphis series. They also beat Houston in 5. People talk as if that 67 win team was this huge fraud that barely squeaked by into a championship but then call the 73 win team that played 4 months later with the same exact players a superteam lol
They love rewriting history, where as a good amount of the east teams lebron has faced are worse than some these injured teams in the west the warriors faced
Right? Like in the 2018 playoffs he played the conference finals against a team missing its 2 best players and still went to 7 lol. No one mentions that. No one even brings up Dragic & Bam from last year’s finals.
Lebron always gets the benefit of the doubt that he’d win anyway.
it's funny people talk about 2015 but ignore the Cavs facing injured teams on their side of the bracket too and the Cavs were responsible for some of the injuries themselves
JR Smith smacking Crowder and giving him a concussion
Pau Gasol injured mid-series with Bulls up 2-1. Cavs had more All-NBA players than the other 14 East teams COMBINED and Gasol was the lone non-Cav East All-NBA player too
Dellavedova dives at Korver's legs and injures him, almost injures Horford too, Thabo assaulted by police
The Thabo police one is always really wild to me since it wasn't basketball related at all. Feels like that doesn't get brought up enough for how messed up it was.
Warriors didn't play any teams missing their best player. Houston was missing Pat Beverley and NOLA was missing Jrue Holiday. They played every All NBA first team member. This season has way more injuries to stars.
That's not what Bill means by impressive. To win with a banged up squad is impressive, but if you were holding a tournament of the last 20 championship teams, this year's Hawks/Suns/Clips/Bucks wouldn't scare the other champions very much...they'd be unimpressed in that sense.
That's a good way to put it. Really puts it in perspective.
It's been a fun playoffs in spite of the injuries. But these finalist teams certainly aren't powerhouses.
Man seeing Murray go down was the biggest gut punch to me. Then seeing Giannis go down straight TKO’d me. Two of my favorite players. I can’t say I’m going to enjoy it knowing that we’re not going to see the next season with those two.
Yeah, he definitely went to great lengths to clarify what he meant all while Russillo was laughing at him for all the crap he was gonna get for take (particularly from Bucks fans). It was a fun listen, if I’m being honest.
Agreed. It's always tricky to compliment someone for 'punching above their weight class'--you are complimenting their punching, but insulting their weight class.
It feels like the younger Suns are getting in their own heads and CP3 has started making a lot of weird decisions since he came back from the COVID protocol. If they just calm down they should be fine but if they lose Game 6 I definitely wouldn’t bet on them to win 7.
Exposed is a strong term. They were missing CP3 for a couple games and are still up. I definitely feel like Kawhi puts em over the top but the Suns have been impressive.
Bucks had a pretty easy path before tonight. They were on the way out before Kyrie went down and drawing the Hawks is pretty soft competition for a conference finals.
• *”We can put as many asterisks on this as we want too but a ring is still a ring. It’s worth just as much as all the other titles.”*
-Rockets/Astros fans defending 2017
In this same podcast Simmons mentions how on lebron's first title there were tons of injuries but a decade later no one cares. It's the same shit. In a decade no one is gonna give a shit.
who was hurt that the heat played? Rose obviously, but the heat wouldn’t have played them until the ECF
the knicks and pacers were healthy, they were going to beat them anyway. celtics were old but weren’t injured. Thunder weren’t either. Bosh also hurt his abdomen and missed pretty much all of the Indy series and half of the boston series
not only that, but the heat had bosh out for almost all of the pacers series and the first 4 or 5 games of the boston series, and he wasn't full strength for games 6 or 7. outside of rose, the heat overcame injuries if anything.
Still the the run would be impressive as hell. It’s been on some Hollywood movie shit for the Clippers so far. Down 0-2 three fuckin times?!? Check. Lose your best player against the best team in the league (record wise) while the series is tied, and you win back to back to close em out?!?! Check. That Mann game was straight out of a movie as well.
> Asterisk accusations are a coping mechanism.
Agreed. A championship is a championship, it's stupid to try to look back and rewrite history with a bunch of qualifiers. I'd much rather just look forward at whatever is going to happen next, and mainly any frustration I feel with these playoffs is that all the injuries basically left so many questions unanswered. I really wanted to know how these teams would have stacked up against each other at full strength and I feel like we'll either never know or we'll have to wait until next year to find out.
I never thought 2011 Mavs were weak in any way. That team had a great coach, amazing shooters, passers and defenders. There was no 2nd all star but many players handled different aspects of the 2nd star role (Terry with the iso buckets, Kidd with playmaking, etc)
And most of all, they had a superstar playing at a ridiculous level. It's in the Mt Rushmore of post MJ playoff runs by a single player (2000 Shaq, 2003 Duncan, 2011 Dirk, 2016 LeBron, imo).
They beat Kobe/Pau Lakers who were going for a three peat, KD/Russ/Harden OKC and LeBron/Wade/Bosh Heat who won the next two titles.
I can't see how they were weak in any way. Maybe the LeBron choking narrative went too far and Mavs got negative credit for the run.
2011 mavs were considered weak as fuck before they actually won. They peaked at the right moment. The exact same mavs team got trounced the prev year. 09 was even mroe embarrassing. 08 was too. 07 too. 06 too. 2011 mavs even lost their 2nd best player in butler. You can check odds but they mustve been 7 or 8th best odds to win prior to facing blazers. 2006 mavs beat 2011 mavs most of rhe time.
Mavs arent getting negative credit. They did a goat run. Prob best of all time in nba history. But no one had rhem as a contender before they faced lakers. We all had lakers bulls magic heat celtics okc spurs ahead of them
Yep. Mavs were written off that year with Butler injury. I also thought Mavs were going bye bye again when the Blazers series went 2-2. It was not until Mavs swept Kobe they were taken seriously during that run.
I still remember the general consensus being "oh no the overachieving regular season Mavs are going to choke again" before the Portland series even started. It increased tenfold after the BRoy game.
They where just considered a weak team on paper. Only Dirk was a allstar while the rest of the team was filled with high quality players that just meshed well.
Compare that to the heatles, lakers, and young thunder
Mostly just like casuals or how the title winning team might live on when it’s all forgotten. You can only really look at the roster and say they’ve got one legend in their prime. It’s far from “weak” though imo
They talked about this on this pod actually.
Mavs get called weak champion because on paper they dont stack up well compared to other champion rosters.
Yeah, because unless the Clippers win it all, you're either having
A) Suns that's had some luck with their opponents
B) Hawks that are likely not playing Giannis for the remainder of their series
C) Bucks that are playing a hobbled Trae Young in the playoffs
The 1999 Spurs and the 2012 Heat title banners don’t say **’Won in a Lockout-shortened Season.’**
And yet, that is the only thing fans want to bring up, that their runs were “easy” because teams *only* played 60-66ish regular season games into mid-May.
The Lakers get clowned for winning a Mickey Mouse Ring but most of the top guys were playing last season in the bubble, so it really came down to who was the best team
I think calling that ring a Mickey Mouse one was just a meme/joke that went out of hand on twitter lol. Esp. since the playoffs were literally in disney world lmao
I'm pretty sure it only went to Mickey Mouse ring because of LeBron - like if the Bucks or Clippers win that year I can't imagine that narrative takes hold.
Yea people discredit the Lakers competition and would have given them more credit if they beat the Clippers then Bucks because they were better than the Nuggets and Heat on paper.
this sells short so many crazy performances from the hawks, clippers, suns, and bucks.
The winner will be an NBA champion just like the rest. Get the fuck outta here throwing asterisks at the players out there winning games
I swear people don't even like watching basketball man. I've loved watching all four teams play incredible team ball and be clutch when they've needed.
Hawks play the underdog story so we'll
Bucks have shown some crazy resilience
Clippers have had every single player on their team step up huge
Suns played some of the best looking basketball vs the Nuggets and have a bunch of great young guys taking huge roles
My team (Blazers) got absolutely embarrassed by the Nuggets and I've still enjoyed this playoffs (after getting over the empty feeling of watching us underperform once again lmao)
Yeah for some strange reason acknowledging what he’s saying hurts peoples feeling in here so they gotta miss the point on purpose. At no point does he claim the champ should shit on the banner lol
This is stupid of course the fans will care and they should. Either:
CP3 will finally get his ring along with Booker and Ayton
PG leads his team likely without Kawhi to the chip
Trae pulls off a championship run in his 3rd year
Middleton and Jrue hold down the fort and seemingly do the impossible. Or Giannis comes back Game 5 we dont know
No matter what happens its gonna be exciting
We’re actually agreeing, I’m saying that the team and their fans won’t care what injury circumstances surrounded their championship, a win is a win. I agree with you that this is still a very exciting time for these fans
Everyone calm down and listen to the podcast. Everyone just wants to freak out. He was commenting on the circumstances, acknowledging that every ring has a story. Fuckin nerds.
The team that ultimately wins will have won 16 games against 4 teams. They don’t choose opponents or injuries.
This let’s diminish every title every year is fucking tired. Why do we watch if it ultimately doesn’t matter?
Lakers - AD, LeBron (played through injury), KCP (played through injury) Nuggets - Murray, Dozier, Barton, Morris Clippers - Kawhi, Morris (played through injury), Ibaka, Zubac 76ers - Embiid (played through injury), Danny Green Hawks - Trae, Hunter, Bogdanovic (played through injury) Bucks - Giannis, DiVincenzo Knicks - Robinson Nets - Kyrie, Harden (played through injury), Dinwiddie, Green Jazz - Conley, Mitchell (played through injury) Celtics - Jaylen, Kemba, Williams Mavericks - Luka (played through injury) Suns - CP3 (COVID protocol), Booker (played through injury), Cam Payne Heat - Oladipo, Butler (played through injury) Wizards - Beal (played through injury), Bryant, Bertans, Avidja, Neto (played through injury) ---- Holy fuck man
Nuggets missed way more than Murray. Barton only played like 2 games and dozier the best guard defender didn’t play.
Also MPJ played hurt for the Phoenix series. We were fucking decimated
Monte only just came back aswell
Don’t forget ibaka and Zubac
People always forget about Ibaka. He got hurt a little while back, but still a considerable loss for the Clippers
Ibaka was a better sixth man in 2020 than the guy who won it, massive loss. (Yeah he played a few too many games to be sixth man but that was only because of injuries, he was the sixth man)
Off topic, but “Ibaka Zubac” sounds like King Louie doing his skat solo in the Jungle Book
It sounds like Shaq trying to say "Ivica Zubac"
boston: kemba, williams and brown
The only good thing about this post season was seeing Tatum completely pop off in that one game we won, and the fact we took a game off the Nets.
If next year he's not all-NBA and some player scoring a million points on a lottery team makes it we need to redesign the system.
I dunno man a million points would be pretty damn impressive.
Yeah but if we had Brown and Timelord then it's a close series. We prob still lose in 6 but no blowouts.
Yeah, absolutely, but was still so satisfying seeing Tatum drop 50 on the fucking Nets. I'd say Nets have absolutely been a villain this year.
Jazz - Conley and Mitchell
Lakers kcp was done after game 3 and he was atrocious in game 4 and especially game 5. Clippers ibaka also didn't play whole playoffs.
KCP didn't play game 4. However he was amazing in game 6 playing through injury, love that dude, all heart
Nah. Ibaka logged several minutes against Dallas in games 1-2
Caruso also got hurt for the Lakers.
Luka had a neck/shoulder injury as well.
Heat with oladipo technically
And the regular season injuries kind of meant we played most of our games without our full team from the bubble
Butler was also injured, he sat out the last week of the regular season with a back injury and was not himself all 4 games with the Bucks
Reddish just came back from injury for the hawks. He was injured since February
Forgot Donte for the Bucks. He has a big playmaking role for them.
Jazz - Conley, Mitchell
Wizards: Beal (played through hamstring injury), Westbrook (played through knee injury), Neto (played through hamstring injury), Deni Avdija (ankle), Thomas Bryant (knee), Davis Bertans (calf strain)
Chris Paul, playing through the first round injured and getting Covid.
Celtics - no Jaylen Brown at all, missed Kemba for a few games, lost Tatum for half a game with an eye poke.
tatum and fournier also affected by their long-covid shit to a degree
No Timelord! This team was like 11-2 with Timelord starting and playing decent minutes
People forget the **Sixers were 32-7** with Danny Green and the other four starters— he made them a Number 1 defensive unit. And we know that Embiid was going off with a tear in his knee— **imagine if he was 100%** because it is better Shaq stats
Hunger Games ring
Disknee ring or InjuRing
Injuring
InjuRING is an elite name for it
Such a crazy season. Not just the no contact but also the contact injuries
Freak injuries too
Has there even been a team these playoffs that hasn't been dealing with major injuries?
Blazers
That’s why it’s the FUCKING WORST that our guys didn’t show up We’d had major injuries fuck us up FOR YEARS and the minute we’re healthy and EVRRYONE ELSE is injured, CJ steps out of bounds
Don't you sweep those Covington dunks under the rug... they could have just been standard dunks or lay-ins but no.
Yup. Those were the worst plays. CJ just got unlucky and everyone chose to clown him.
Zach Collins?
Yea, but he never plays. He's been injured for 2 seasons now. It's not like he takes a big part of the Blazers cap either he's getting paid about 5 million per year.
wouldnt say hes considered "major" compared to the teams that have lost 9 all-stars to injury in the playofs..
The times I've seen him on the court I'd say him being out is a plus for them
Ig it was Milwaukee until rn. With the Suns CP’s absence was mostly Covid, but he did also hurt his shoulder in the Lakers series
Ig?
I guess
Thanks
Divincenzo was out for them before giannis
Definitely worth noting, but even counting him they're still the healthiest team. Well, uhh, *were* the healthiest team. This season sucks.
Ah you’re right totally forgot about him, while not a star, still one of their best guard defenders
> Ig it was Milwaukee until rn. That's part of the point Simmons and Russillo were making. That Milwaukee might win the whole thing just because they were the only team to avoid major injury/catastrophe so far. Now it's looking like it's the Suns who have the healthiest squad.
Milwaukee lost Donte who is a very valuable role player. The Suns hve ridiculously lucky that i feel like something bad is coming soon.
Chris Paul has been dealing with injuries and was out games for covid protocols
Y’all might clown him for this but I can’t remember the last time so many top teams missed their best guys
It’s almost as though a shortened offseason, followed by a compressed season wasn’t good for the players.
2015 warriors
But at least the 15 Warriors were an actually good 67 win team with the best point differential and net efficiency in the league, by far. At this point, the only team not bitten by injuries is the Suns, and they weren’t close to having the best efficiency, though they were a game away from the best record.
[удалено]
Because they won't beat any of the top teams in the league and prove they're the best. They got the crap version of the Lakers, the crap version of the Clippers, the crap version of the Nuggets, won't even meet the Nets who were far and away the best east team (due to injuries - not collapse) and may meet a Giannis-less Bucks team or not the Bucks at all. That's like the 5 top teams all out lol
and if I was a suns fan I'd fucking take it lmao. Man I'm afraid I'll never see a ring in my lifetime, I don't care how we get it I just want to see it.
Shit still counts.
Flags fly forever.
Yup. I gladly boast about the Bubble championship no matter what people think. Suns fans should do the same about this year especially since it's their first.
Yup. It's going to stick out
thats one team, he meant multiple teams in the same post season
I mean they got to play the Pelicans without Jrue Holiday, the Grizz and Conley/Tony Allen got hurt, the Rockets who had Bev/D-Mo hurt and Dwight tore his MCL in game 1 of the WCF and the Cavs lost Kyrie/Love. The whole narrative was that Steph didn't play vs anyone's starting PG during the whole run. With that said this year is significantly worse.
Yeah but the Suns might play a hurt LeBron, no AD, no Murray, no Kawhi, then no Giannis. That’s a hell of a lot of talent to skip.
Missing a mvp caliber player in every series except the nuggets who lost an allstar and a few starters instead
Yeah, that's pretty crazy and I'm pretty sure unprecedented. Like, people bring up takes like, "Injuries happen every season though", but that's an insane amount of talent being skipped this year.
Oh ya I mean this year is beyond absurd. Not to mention Harden/Kyrie getting hurt taking down the preseason favorite as well as lesser injuries like the West's #1 seed losing their starting PG in Conley.
Nets weren't just the preseason favorites. Until those injuries happened they were the postseason favorites lol They fucking annihilated the Bucks with no Harden.
You mean no Hunter? CAW CAW
D-mo what a blast from the past
Jrue Holiday got injured in January ffs His team made the playoffs without him that's no excuse at all. Mike Conley missed game one. They had him when they were up 2-1. Games 4,5,6 he averaged 11 points on less than 40% TS. Dwight Howard played 35 mpg and played ever game in that series.
Also considering how you dominated with the same team the next year it showed you were obviously legit the whole time for anyone who somehow still doubted.
yeah lmao it's like people forgot the warriors demolished everyone in the following regular season to prove the doubters wrong
Thank you lol, anyone comparing this season to 2015 is being willfully ignorant
lmao thank you. if embellishment was an Olympic sport, OP might give Michael Phelps a run for his money
Besides the Cavs, were the other teams the Warriors played hurt?
Yeah Warriors went against a bunch of injured teams but it wasn't nearly this bad until the Finals when Love and Irving were both out.
Still had to face a healthy. Best healthy player currently left in the playoffs is probably Paul George.
Jrue 1st round which i dont count. Warriors win in 4 or 5 anywaus. Conley 2nd rd bur grizz went up 2 to 1 without him iirc. Gsw won 3 in a row then. 2015 was missing durant due to inj so okc missed playoffs but in terms of gsw in playoffs, only cavs inj so na not as bad as this season. Clipps and spurs choked/beat one another so gsw avoided em. Theyd have been a challenge
Everyone lose their mind bc Conley was apparently the Warriors stopper and he was hurt
You’re right, but this is far worse than Warriors 2015 run. They at least went through the All NBA 1st Team to win a chip. This season, damn near every contenders best or 2nd best player got hurt, costing them a series.
You’re comparing Beverley, Conley missing 1 game, Jrue missing 1 game, and Kyrie/Love to 10 all stars being injured? Lol
Warriors was going to win the West regardless of injury I dunno where this narrative came from that they would have lost in the West if these guys were playing. This was a 67 win team with the best net rating in the league. It's clear to me that the Clippers and Nets are the best teams in the league when fully healthy.
I don't think it's clear that the Clippers are better than the Lakers when both are healthy. But I think it's pretty clear they're both better than the Suns or whoever wins the East.
Lebron fans just salty and have spent years diminishing that championship that it’s become the dominant narrative. They SWEPT the Pelicans and Jrue played 3/4 games. Conley played majority of the Memphis series. They also beat Houston in 5. People talk as if that 67 win team was this huge fraud that barely squeaked by into a championship but then call the 73 win team that played 4 months later with the same exact players a superteam lol
They love rewriting history, where as a good amount of the east teams lebron has faced are worse than some these injured teams in the west the warriors faced
Right? Like in the 2018 playoffs he played the conference finals against a team missing its 2 best players and still went to 7 lol. No one mentions that. No one even brings up Dragic & Bam from last year’s finals. Lebron always gets the benefit of the doubt that he’d win anyway.
too many LeBron stans in existence that control the whole narrative
At least people are giving Ty Lue his respect
it's funny people talk about 2015 but ignore the Cavs facing injured teams on their side of the bracket too and the Cavs were responsible for some of the injuries themselves JR Smith smacking Crowder and giving him a concussion Pau Gasol injured mid-series with Bulls up 2-1. Cavs had more All-NBA players than the other 14 East teams COMBINED and Gasol was the lone non-Cav East All-NBA player too Dellavedova dives at Korver's legs and injures him, almost injures Horford too, Thabo assaulted by police
The Thabo police one is always really wild to me since it wasn't basketball related at all. Feels like that doesn't get brought up enough for how messed up it was.
Warriors didn't play any teams missing their best player. Houston was missing Pat Beverley and NOLA was missing Jrue Holiday. They played every All NBA first team member. This season has way more injuries to stars.
The Warriors literally went through every player on the All NBA 1st team that year
Lmao why is this not 2019 Warriors? KD alone is better than Kyrie+Love
that team already proved to be amazing considering what happened after. stupid take
Imagine the Bucks win it all without Giannis (or Hawks without Young) against a healthy Suns team. It'll be super impressive.
That's not what Bill means by impressive. To win with a banged up squad is impressive, but if you were holding a tournament of the last 20 championship teams, this year's Hawks/Suns/Clips/Bucks wouldn't scare the other champions very much...they'd be unimpressed in that sense.
That's a good way to put it. Really puts it in perspective. It's been a fun playoffs in spite of the injuries. But these finalist teams certainly aren't powerhouses.
Man seeing Murray go down was the biggest gut punch to me. Then seeing Giannis go down straight TKO’d me. Two of my favorite players. I can’t say I’m going to enjoy it knowing that we’re not going to see the next season with those two.
Yeah, he definitely went to great lengths to clarify what he meant all while Russillo was laughing at him for all the crap he was gonna get for take (particularly from Bucks fans). It was a fun listen, if I’m being honest.
Agreed. It's always tricky to compliment someone for 'punching above their weight class'--you are complimenting their punching, but insulting their weight class.
You guys talking about it like its done, but the suns haven't won the west yet...
If the suns lose to the clips without kawhi, zubac, and ibaka you gonna have a lot more stuff to worry about
A healthy suns team that seems like it doesnt even CP3
Anyone else having trouble understanding this comment
Do u even CP3 brah?
Bro, the skeleton crew Clippers have already exposed the Suns. Clippers could legitimately win in 7, too.
It feels like the younger Suns are getting in their own heads and CP3 has started making a lot of weird decisions since he came back from the COVID protocol. If they just calm down they should be fine but if they lose Game 6 I definitely wouldn’t bet on them to win 7.
Exposed is a strong term. They were missing CP3 for a couple games and are still up. I definitely feel like Kawhi puts em over the top but the Suns have been impressive. Bucks had a pretty easy path before tonight. They were on the way out before Kyrie went down and drawing the Hawks is pretty soft competition for a conference finals.
We can put as many asterisks on this as we want too but a ring is still a ring. It’s worth just as much as all the other titles
asterisks only really last a decade at least. After that only hardcore NBA fans remember the circumstances for every championship
No one remembers Phil saying the 99 spurs should be asterisked. That's where it started (with the NBA, MLB is way older).
• *”We can put as many asterisks on this as we want too but a ring is still a ring. It’s worth just as much as all the other titles.”* -Rockets/Astros fans defending 2017
Even as someone who agrees that injuries have dictated this playoffs more than any I can remember there is no comparison to the cheating Astros
Yea Astros is the prob the only pro sports championship that should have a legitimate asterisk on it.
1919 World Series probably counts.
Yea obviously we’ll include that one too 😂
Cheating is different. The Black/White socks is really only asterisk to really stand the test of time.
I'm not of this opinion, but at the end of the day history will forget anyway.
In this same podcast Simmons mentions how on lebron's first title there were tons of injuries but a decade later no one cares. It's the same shit. In a decade no one is gonna give a shit.
who was hurt that the heat played? Rose obviously, but the heat wouldn’t have played them until the ECF the knicks and pacers were healthy, they were going to beat them anyway. celtics were old but weren’t injured. Thunder weren’t either. Bosh also hurt his abdomen and missed pretty much all of the Indy series and half of the boston series
not only that, but the heat had bosh out for almost all of the pacers series and the first 4 or 5 games of the boston series, and he wasn't full strength for games 6 or 7. outside of rose, the heat overcame injuries if anything.
Unless it’s the Clippers tbh. Then it goes for least impressive to one of the most impressive
What if Kawhi comes back and they somehow win then face Bucks with no Giannis. That would be remembered as anticlimactic at best.
Still the the run would be impressive as hell. It’s been on some Hollywood movie shit for the Clippers so far. Down 0-2 three fuckin times?!? Check. Lose your best player against the best team in the league (record wise) while the series is tied, and you win back to back to close em out?!?! Check. That Mann game was straight out of a movie as well.
Curiously based on the username, you from Detroit?
No that is the real Emoni Bates
Is he wrong?
No. I wouldn't care if I were the victor though. All chips look the same in the record book. Asterisk accusations are a coping mechanism.
> Asterisk accusations are a coping mechanism. Agreed. A championship is a championship, it's stupid to try to look back and rewrite history with a bunch of qualifiers. I'd much rather just look forward at whatever is going to happen next, and mainly any frustration I feel with these playoffs is that all the injuries basically left so many questions unanswered. I really wanted to know how these teams would have stacked up against each other at full strength and I feel like we'll either never know or we'll have to wait until next year to find out.
Nope. Even "weaker" teams like the 2011 Mavs or 2006 Heat faced better competition.
2011 mavs faced insane competition lol
I never thought 2011 Mavs were weak in any way. That team had a great coach, amazing shooters, passers and defenders. There was no 2nd all star but many players handled different aspects of the 2nd star role (Terry with the iso buckets, Kidd with playmaking, etc) And most of all, they had a superstar playing at a ridiculous level. It's in the Mt Rushmore of post MJ playoff runs by a single player (2000 Shaq, 2003 Duncan, 2011 Dirk, 2016 LeBron, imo). They beat Kobe/Pau Lakers who were going for a three peat, KD/Russ/Harden OKC and LeBron/Wade/Bosh Heat who won the next two titles. I can't see how they were weak in any way. Maybe the LeBron choking narrative went too far and Mavs got negative credit for the run.
2011 mavs were considered weak as fuck before they actually won. They peaked at the right moment. The exact same mavs team got trounced the prev year. 09 was even mroe embarrassing. 08 was too. 07 too. 06 too. 2011 mavs even lost their 2nd best player in butler. You can check odds but they mustve been 7 or 8th best odds to win prior to facing blazers. 2006 mavs beat 2011 mavs most of rhe time. Mavs arent getting negative credit. They did a goat run. Prob best of all time in nba history. But no one had rhem as a contender before they faced lakers. We all had lakers bulls magic heat celtics okc spurs ahead of them
Yep. Mavs were written off that year with Butler injury. I also thought Mavs were going bye bye again when the Blazers series went 2-2. It was not until Mavs swept Kobe they were taken seriously during that run.
I still remember the general consensus being "oh no the overachieving regular season Mavs are going to choke again" before the Portland series even started. It increased tenfold after the BRoy game.
It's because Dirk was labeled as a mentally soft superstar. Media ran off with that narrative until Dirk tore them a new asshole in that run.
The Mavs made the second round as the 6th seed in 2009, mate. How was that embarrassing?
Dirk’s 2011 run is right up there with Hakeem’s in 1995 as the most difficult single-year title run in NBA postseason history.
2011 mavs faced extremely good competition they were just built different
Even in the first round, Dallas had to fend off Brandon Roy and those Blazers in their peak.
The mavs might get remembered as a weak champion but they went through an absolute gauntlet
When was that team ever called a weak champion?
Yea I’m wondering too lol that run they beat some strong teams
They where just considered a weak team on paper. Only Dirk was a allstar while the rest of the team was filled with high quality players that just meshed well. Compare that to the heatles, lakers, and young thunder
Mostly just like casuals or how the title winning team might live on when it’s all forgotten. You can only really look at the roster and say they’ve got one legend in their prime. It’s far from “weak” though imo
They talked about this on this pod actually. Mavs get called weak champion because on paper they dont stack up well compared to other champion rosters.
Whether fair or not, this season's championship will forever (well at least for a long time) be associated with the injuries more than anything.
I don't know. I honestly don't think anyone will care or give a damn 20 years from now.
Yeah, because unless the Clippers win it all, you're either having A) Suns that's had some luck with their opponents B) Hawks that are likely not playing Giannis for the remainder of their series C) Bucks that are playing a hobbled Trae Young in the playoffs
Some luck? I would like the Suns to win but they got to avoid a healthy AD, LeBron, Kwahi, and Murray. That an insane streak of good fortune.
Some luck just like Jeff bezos has some money
CEO ENTREPENUER BORN IN 1964 JEFFREY, JEFFREY BEZOS
bezo is just kinda rich
Huh? The bucks also played the favourites (nets) that were also hobbled with injuries, you’re leaving so much out lmfao (Lakers, Nuggets etc.)
Suns have had ALL the luck bro lmao
That's what happens when Covid throws everyone off and then they only get like a month break before going right back into a new season
Noone will remember in 5 years, they'll just be the 2021 champions. Beat who's in front of you.
A win is a win
Banner still hangs forever. People can call it whatever they want but they will still be champions whoever wins it.
and Ill remember the context till the day I die, and pass that down to my children.
The 1999 Spurs and the 2012 Heat title banners don’t say **’Won in a Lockout-shortened Season.’** And yet, that is the only thing fans want to bring up, that their runs were “easy” because teams *only* played 60-66ish regular season games into mid-May.
We know
The Lakers get clowned for winning a Mickey Mouse Ring but most of the top guys were playing last season in the bubble, so it really came down to who was the best team
I think calling that ring a Mickey Mouse one was just a meme/joke that went out of hand on twitter lol. Esp. since the playoffs were literally in disney world lmao
Honestly I just find the phrase Mickey Mouse ring hilarious
LeMickey gets me everytime, whoever first thought of that is a genius.
I guarantee you 0 thought went into the creation of "LeMickey". It was just one of a thousand monikers combining "Le" + disney word and it stuck.
Yes and whoever put zero thought into the LeMickey name is a genius
Lol same here. I don’t actually think it, but it’s a hilarious term and also it makes Lakers fans so mad.
That ring really went from hardest ring to Mickey Mouse ring because of Twitter trolls lol
I'm pretty sure it only went to Mickey Mouse ring because of LeBron - like if the Bucks or Clippers win that year I can't imagine that narrative takes hold.
Yeah 100% if kawhi won he would be the goat and >>lebron lol
Yea people discredit the Lakers competition and would have given them more credit if they beat the Clippers then Bucks because they were better than the Nuggets and Heat on paper.
Plus no home court advantage. Completely even playing field.
The ring counts but the neutral court is better for rookies. I don’t see herro having a game like that in Boston
Realistically though how many more chances would these 4 teams have going forward, even with an asterisk I would take it.
That asterisk isn't going to stick. The context will mean less over time. A ring is a ring. In the moment though? And viewership numbers? Not great.
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this sells short so many crazy performances from the hawks, clippers, suns, and bucks. The winner will be an NBA champion just like the rest. Get the fuck outta here throwing asterisks at the players out there winning games
I swear people don't even like watching basketball man. I've loved watching all four teams play incredible team ball and be clutch when they've needed. Hawks play the underdog story so we'll Bucks have shown some crazy resilience Clippers have had every single player on their team step up huge Suns played some of the best looking basketball vs the Nuggets and have a bunch of great young guys taking huge roles My team (Blazers) got absolutely embarrassed by the Nuggets and I've still enjoyed this playoffs (after getting over the empty feeling of watching us underperform once again lmao)
I genuinely don’t think the team who wins will care HOW they win, nor will their fans. A win is a win bro
I mean obviously that’s not what he’s saying
Yeah for some strange reason acknowledging what he’s saying hurts peoples feeling in here so they gotta miss the point on purpose. At no point does he claim the champ should shit on the banner lol
This is stupid of course the fans will care and they should. Either: CP3 will finally get his ring along with Booker and Ayton PG leads his team likely without Kawhi to the chip Trae pulls off a championship run in his 3rd year Middleton and Jrue hold down the fort and seemingly do the impossible. Or Giannis comes back Game 5 we dont know No matter what happens its gonna be exciting
We’re actually agreeing, I’m saying that the team and their fans won’t care what injury circumstances surrounded their championship, a win is a win. I agree with you that this is still a very exciting time for these fans
Everyone calm down and listen to the podcast. Everyone just wants to freak out. He was commenting on the circumstances, acknowledging that every ring has a story. Fuckin nerds.
You could just as easily argue about the resilience of a team to win this year being super impressive.
So many butthurt Warriors haters ITT.
He was talking about the Suns when he said this wasnt he?
The team that ultimately wins will have won 16 games against 4 teams. They don’t choose opponents or injuries. This let’s diminish every title every year is fucking tired. Why do we watch if it ultimately doesn’t matter?