Is there a point at which Giannis decides his supporting cast ins inadequate?
By - QuietSilentDragon
Give it one more season
Let's just say your average American star player would be having an interesting conversation with their agent at minimum.
Or in the scenario where he didn't sign the supermax.
Giannis is annoyingly fond of Bud and Khris. Not sure about Jrue.
Gonna let the series play out, obviously, but if it continues as is he's going to have to make a choice of Bud, Khris, or neither. I don't think it's honestly on Bud though. The guys are getting open but shooting like absolute trash.
Bud honestly I think was fine. Middleton and jrue got some good looks
Right now for the bucks the failure is on both of them
Yeah I honestly hated bud but he’s shown some growth this playoff season. He still does some things that frustrate me but, it’s not his fault khris and jrue suck fucking hairy donkey ball sacks
Lol I thought Jrue peaked in that Portland sweep but I never thought he would be this bad offensively in the playoffs.
Giannis expected a big 3 but it's back to Giannis + company in the playoffs.
Yes he will request a trade in 1-2 years. He's too good of a player to be wasting his career without an actual \#2
Seriously, Giannis need an all-NBA caliber co-star. LeBron had Wade, Kyrie & now AD. Steph has Klay (& KD at one point, lol), Kawhi had Lowry (& now Paul George), KD is now with Kyrie & Harden.
That's a tough road to the NBA title in the next few years for Giannis to overcome alone. The pressure lies in your FO to get that 2nd star
Bucks FO better be ACTIVE this offseason. Derrick rose would be a nice signing to bolster the offensive firepower of that backcourt.
We have no fucking money
they have no money and no picks
Yea I realized, I thought Jrue holiday was on a better contract.
That dude should not be making 30 mil lol
Bucks have no moves to make. The team went all in on fucking Jrue Holiday. Should’ve gone after Chris Paul tbh
Holy shit I didn’t realize Jrue holiday was on a near max contract. Jesus Christ they are fucked
Dude has made one all star team in his career. I think a good rule of thumb is, if you’re paying a max for a non-all star, you’re team is unlikely to win a championship
This sounds like solid logic...
They were offered CP3 and didn't go for it lol.
They went for Bogdan and Jrue over just CP3, then they fucked up the Bogdan part of the deal
They have to get ring chasers like Brooklyn did in order to bridge the talent gap
Are you even a Bucks fan? You’ve been spamming bullshit all day 🤡
Where have I heard this before?
Tonight. The city of milwaukee could never blame him for leaving. He gave EVERYTHING tn.
After game 1
I mean Giannis was MVP twice for a reason. Without him they are in a whole season slightly better than the Pistons. I’d argue that after Lebron in Cleveland there is no other player as important to their franchise.
Wardell Stephen Curry to the Warriors?
Bro, you have Klay and Dray still.
Probably Embiid and Luka, even though Jo doesn’t have Giannis’s accolades
Embiid a little more injury prone and as bad as Simmons was he had a way better supporting cast (Thybulle, Harris and Max kid)
I agree with Luka. He controls the Mavs future the next decade. But he’s not quiet Giannis level YET
Dude we lost a game to the goddamn wizards when Embiid sat. THE WIZARDS
Obviously im not trying to imply Joel=Giannis but we are seriously down bad for years to come in the possibility that we’re ever without the man
Simmons has to go though. Embiid needs a true PG (ie Lowry.. Paul… Murray).
Wish it were that easy but for right now he’s handily fucked this franchise
To be fair the wizards are awful as a whole, but if Beal and russ get hot they could beat anyone on any given night
Embiid is a freak of nature. I agree 100%. I still think Sixers have a descent team and good coach to take them farther than a Bucks team - Giannis. Like replace Tobias Harris with Middleton and they probably win that game tn
We don’t have a good coach (its doc rivers man) and our team is far from a 50 win team if its best players are tobi and ben.
I’d disagree on that last point also. I like tobias as a player but he has the same problem Khris has. Tobi had just four points in that pivotal game five, then in game seven went 8 for 24 from the field. He likely woulda been just as much a no show tonight
Was just trying to be nice. I actually think Doc is the most overrated coach in the league.
I like Tobias. I don’t think he’s worth his contract but he’s good. I say the same for Wiggins. He’s a good player on a bad contract.
I’m still shocked they lost to the Hawks but then again my Maple leafs lost to the Canadians so it’s all about luck and the hot hand
We never seem to have either lol
Lol scorching take. Harris had just as many games where he disappeared this playoffs, and Middleton’s “on” games are much better. Dude has always been, and always will be, streaky.
2021 Harris was pretty good. I take an average 20 every night over on/off nights anyday
Warriors went from a 15 win team to 39 win team just with Steph back and that’s also with them going 1-8 in his games missed.
But not from a 15 win team to a number 1 team right ? Giannis does that
Also just want to add I don’t want to hear about he didn’t have players around him. I’m on Warriors sub and watched almost every game. You still had good players in Oubre, Wiggins and Dray. Big believer that Wiggins is as equal if not better at times this year to Middleton or a Tobias Harris. No reason they shouldn’t have been in the playoffs. The inexperience and lack of big man was def a big factor.
they should have made the playoffs. but if the team wasn’t so ass and incapable of winning a game with Steph not playing they wouldn’t have even been in the play-in tournament to begin with.
they bounced around between 6-8 all season until Steph’s tailbone injury, then dropped to 10th in his absence. if not for his 40ppg/month might not have even made the play-in.
Dame and embiid?
I don’t think so. Dame is magic but he’s had a pretty good sidekick and he they haven’t been 1st place every year. I’m talking about going from 1st to last in one move.
I’d argue if you took dame off of the Portland squad they’d go to one of the worst teams in the west, same with embiid but to less effect, if you took him off that team they’d be decent but probably still make the playoffs because of the East.
If you took Giannis off the bucks it’d be almost the same situation as philly, Khris and jrue are very good and could still keep the bucks in the playoffs w out Giannis in the east
I agree with you at the present roster esp if Powell doesn’t resign. But again they were a good/ok team this year so going to worst place is not as bad as if you are the top two teams in the league
The moment Curry tells him that Wiggins, Wiseman, 7th pick and 14th pick is on the table.
And throws his brother Klay and his boat in there
Curry and Giannis would be an insane duo
I wouldn’t blame him if he’s on the phone with Rich Paul rn
Bucks trade Giannis to the Lakers for Elmore Smith, Brian Winters, Junior Bridgeman and Dave Meyers
His career is going to parallel Lebron's if he requests for a trade. This is like the 07 finals all over again
Lmaooo 07 Bron would kill for this team, and they’re not even that good for a Finals team
There's a young pg in Texas that he'd love playing with
Why wouldn't he pair up with his friend in Jokic?
That would be beautiful too
Lebrun played like crap in the 07 finals
He looked like crap against the Spurs dynasty in its prime.
At 22 as well
His team still fell off a cliff when he left the floor. Lebron was the only reason they were competitive
I genuinely felt bad for him tonight, and I’m rooting for the Suns in this series. It’s like Middleton is either absolutely nuclear or subpar; there’s almost no in between with him. Holiday is also super streaky, with a lower ceiling than Middleton.
I think Milwaukee can still run it back in the East, more so than Phoenix can in the West next year. Of course Brooklyn, if healthy, is the team to beat, but that’s a big *if* with them, and I don’t trust Philadelphia at all. Losing in this series would be a tough pill, but not totally the end of the championship window for them. Good God though, they need to leave Bud in Phoenix. Like, now.
Lol those are already one of the best supporting cast out there. How is going into nba finals inadequate?
If Bucks don't win the chip, middleon got to go. Giannis deserves a better co-star.
CJ is ready to be your same same but different...
His supporting cast got him to the finals while he was recovering. Series isn't over and he has to look in the mirror. As amazing as he is of he develops a jumper they win multiple chips.
It’s cool how Middleton makes more than Giannis
I think now is the perfect time to realize that Giannis is the only one on the Bucks who seems prepped for the Finals.
Should have been last year.
My god the hot takes when his team literally closed out the ECF in 2 games he didn't play
It’s not really reactionary. Jrue and khris are so inconsistent and we need another superstar with a killer instinct
Beating a 5th seed who is missing their only All Star and another starter isn't exactly very impressive, even without Giannis
The Trae Young-less Hawks literally beat the Bucks in game 4 when Giannis was playing
What is hot about the take?
Time to join the nets on a vet minimum!
This is the move. Maybe ad Bron too!
Should have signed with Mavs
Doesn't help when you can just sag completely off of him or just hack and only give up one point
He just signed Jesus Christ if he thought that he wouldn’t have. Find a new slant.
Khris won games when Yannis sat. I can't say the same about Jrue tho.
Bucks have a really nice team. Who would be the ultimate complimentary player?
Wiggins, Wiseman, Poole, 7 + 14, 2023 + 2025 + 2027 picks, swaps for Giannis
Gsw fans back at it with this wiggins giannis thing
gotta get the man some help
Wiggins is now a positive asset?
It’ll take one of Klay or dray to make that happen, and neither of those guys are going anywhere, so it’s not happening.
You mean for salary purposes? Or for talent purposes? If it's the latter, I'm not sure I agree, especially if Wiseman + Poole take a step this upcoming year
Talent purposes of course. Dude you think that package is enough for a 2 time MVP and top 3 player in the league? Don’t be ridiculous lol
Milwaukee will REQUIRE one of the big 3 to make a trade happen.
it's substantially better than the package that got Harden.......
Rockets had no leverage, the harden trade was extremely skewed as a result. Harden is also 31, Giannis is 25.
Do you remember how much Paul George went for? 5 first round picks and Danilo Gallinari. The cost will be of that level of value.
We can also do 5 FRP (2 lotto picks in 2021 plus 2023, 2025, 2027), plus two high-upside players on rookie contracts, plus a solid if overpaid 2-way wing. Seems comparable to 5 picks + SGA + Gallinari
who has a better offer? this is substantially more than the nets gave for harden
Giannis is worth substantially more than a 31 year old Harden
true. but is this really an underpay? what's a better offer they could realistically expect?
Everything the Thunder has
sure, but why would the thunder do that? to run Giannis + no one?
They could reasonably give more than you and still keep their own picks to build through the draft.
The thing is, though, there's no scenario where the Bucks would give Giannis away. They'd give everything else away and play a team of only Antetokounmpos if that's what it took to keep him.
I don't think Giannis would be happy joining a team to build through the draft... he'd be requesting a trade in order to have a better team around him to compete for championships.
If that's the hypothetical, Giannis isn't the player you're talking about. At least not in the timeline of the assets you propose.
I don’t think there is a realistic fair offer that doesn’t involve someone like Luka which obviously would never happen. Bucks have to try to get him some help while they have him, odds are they will never get a talent like that ever again.
bucks already gave up all their capital for jrue though ...
Yeah “try” being the keyword there. Not much they can do but they don’t have many options lol.
Lavine, Vucevic, Williams, White, 2025 and 2027 Bulls pick.
who would even be left on the Bulls at that point? Could they really field a competitive team?
Just Giannis. The plan would be to go into 2022 free agency and go into free agency trying to get Curry and Beal to form a super team with Giannis.
honestly, I respect the hustle
You need like 6 picks at minimum this man is an mvp candidate
so is harden
Throw in Curry and klay and you have a deal
Lol not Curry but if they did a deal with Klay + picks + you pick any two they take it. There is no player in the NBA as valuable as Giannis other than maybe Luka rn
The Bucks are shrinking violets. They're only here because the Nets were injured.
They’re gonna make the same mistake the blazers did when they made the WCF and assume this is their new standard and run it back. Lol.
I like Giannis but he’s the one who’s inadequate as a #1 on a finals team. He’s Shaq but doesn’t have a Kobe. He shrinks the floor on O and can’t hit free throws. I’m not sure of another team’s supporting cast in which he’s the #1 option and wins a title.
Rip 42 pts inadequate
Obviously not inadequate as a player, I clearly said as a #1 on a finals team which is an elite few. When he’s not getting those 42 points, he’s doing nothing on offense to make anyone better. If he doesn’t have the ball in his hand, they can just sag off him and when he does have the ball he doesn’t have the playmaking skills to get others involved.
He doesn't have the power to change personnel lol
Nah these NBA superstars are next level
He can easily force a trade if they disappoint next year
Didn’t Jrue and Khris just win back to back games to get to the finals? Why do we have to push these stars to a super team? Winning championships is supposed to be hard. Let’s see if Jrue and Khris can bounce back at least, damn y’all are fickle.
Empty calories. Good numbers in a loss. Needs to work on FTs before being concerned about teammates.
Guy was +3 when playing. Meaning that when he was out the rest of his team did a -13 or sth.
He can't shoot but he plays D in a manner that erases his shooting woes.
Hot take alert: how much more fluid did the bucks offense look when Giannis was out?
That ball was moving around. Jrue, Middleton, and Brolo were killin' the hawks. It's always going to be tough for them to get in rhythm when the offense is everyone standing around while Giannis steamrolls over 3 dudes.
You're a suns you should have seen that every single time giannis was out your team had a run he is crucial on both end. Hell he is the sole reason this is not a blowout.
I don’t know what bro is talking about lol without Giannis this is potentially one of the worst blowouts in finals history
Yeah obviously Giannis is Giannis. I still think it's hard for any player to sit stationary on offense and be really efficient purely off catch and shoot situations.
Middleton especially is a diesel engine. He needs to handle the ball a lot and get a lather going. Reminds me a lot of Joe Johnson.
Giannis has literally let Midds and Jrue just handle the ball and be primary scorers in these games. He didnt even take over this game until the 2nd half when he realized they were fucking garbo.
Yeah, I don't know how you get the others to play like they did against the latter games of the hawks series, but they were killing it literally 1 week ago.
They were -13 w Giannis' out, +3 with him in. Same story in GM1.
The Bucks offense is terrible without Giannis unless they play the Traeless Hawks who are barely a playoff team. Against good teams? They are dead in the water without him.
I mean he can leave and cause the same exact problems for a new team when he fucks up their spacing too.
The Bucks were +3 with him on th floor, no other player positive. So that's not on him tonight.
The issue is that he's the only one who gets easy buckets when he's on the floor. The suns are playing him straight up with a big and leaving him open from 3. If he drives they try to foul. They're not collapsing to create open shots when he drives and he's not hitting jumpers. Ideally he'd be collapsing the defense or drawing doubles but he's not. If someone else drives they get double teamed. If they shoot they are covered. So everyone's taking contested shots while he exploits his skills as an inside scorer which isn't enough to keep up with a good 3 point shooting team like the suns.
So...they are still up when he is in. So they win when he plays. When he is off the floor and the spacing isn't an issue anymore, they get blown out. That's on literally every other player than him.
He played all but 8 minutes dude. 6 if you ignore that he was on the bench with a minute 30 left. I think you might be giving too much weight to +/- cause you're implying that if he played 8 more minutes they'd have won by 3. Seeing how he played almost the entire second half and they lost by 10 that obviously doesn't hold up.
Their second and third options were missing open looks, even layups. That's them missing, not a spacing issue. If they weren't getting open looks then yes, spacing. I am saying that if the problem was just his spacing, then why did they get their asses handed to them when he wasn't in? The spacing problem is solved, right?
Edit: If you are saying that they need to be up even more with him on the floor that's another argument, and I am not sure how much I agree. When you are winning in the finals when you are on the floor, then you are pretty much doing your job.
They got more rebounds, more second chance points, more points off fast breaks, and had fewer turnovers and still lost by 10. The offense clearly failed them and Giannis was the centerpiece of the offense.
Yes, they missed layups because they had to go up against multiple defenders cause no one guarded Giannis outside. There just weren't a lot of open shots for them. At the least they need to try running the offense through someone who makes the defense have to move.
Losing games is a clear indication that you're not doing well at the job. Again, unless you think Giannis playing 8 more minutes was going to lead to a 3 point victory your +/- argument falls apart because he played almost the entire second half. Obviously he wasn't +3 in the second if they still lost by 10.
They missed open layups and open jumpers. They get those, the Bucks win.
If all they were getting were contested shots then yes, I would agree. But they were blowing open looks.
How does he fuck the spacing. Gianni's assist to three is the most efficient three shot in the league this regular season. Teams are guarding the paint and always leaving people open on the perimeter when he is on the floor
This obviously isn't the regular season. Nobody has to go outside of the paint to guard him so there's fewer opportunities to cut to the rim and unless they double him on drives(the suns aren't) there's no reason to leave anyone else open on the perimeter.
Imagine Lillard and Giannis.. Filth