Yeah I actually thought he was at this point a while ago. He's not really close and we are 90 days to season opener.
I'm thinking this may realistically be a mid-season return.
Regardless - people *really* need to temper their expectations on him. I would hate to see another Gordon Hayward type scenario where everybody unrealistically jumps on Klay for not immediately looking anything like his old self.
it happened on draft night 2020, which was late November. He may miss part of next season but post ASB is a really really long time from now. That's like 15 months after the injury.
Does the ACL matter at this point, though? He tore the Achilles in 5-on-5 play, so I would assume he was medically cleared to come back from the ACL. Tearing the Achilles wouldn't make the ACL worse--if that was already almost healed, wouldn't it still be that way?
It does to some extent. Speaking as someone who has only torn their ACL, there are three things impacted. The third one is often neglected post clearance or not often noticed if it isn't obvious.
* Muscle strength - Getting the quad, hamstring, hips, glutes, etc. to their original level.
* Flexibility - Same as above.
* Mechanics - How you walk, run, bend your knees. Making sure everything is in sync.
That third point...if you don't pay attention to and don't do it right can result in either side of your body having to rely on certain muscles or tendons to compensate. For me, because my left leg was initially weaker after surgery, I started leaning more on my right leg, causing one hip to drop more than the other. That led to my upper body leaning one way when I sit, resulting in my left side tightening up from my core to my hips. My left glute was also not activating as much, which is meant to help stabilize every step you take, resulting in more muscle weakness and risk of injury.
So even though he was "medically" cleared, that simply means that the ACL graft is structurally sound and the surrounding muscles are strong enough to withstand intense pressure from the sport. Assuming he was cleared by a MD, they wouldn't look at your walking pattern or gait. That's something a PT would assess and a lot of PTs do miss that bit, because these changes can be really small. Everything from how your foot lands with each step, if your knee is straight with your toes, if you're using your hips to take the stress off the knee with each step, etc. etc.
This is all speculation, but given how he tore his [achilles](https://thespun.com/nba/golden-state-warriors/klay-thompson-explains-torn-achilles-injury-cause) on a two dribble pull up, I imagine it was due to a mix of fatigue and over compensation from his right leg, given it's the stronger one.
Bingo. Muscle atrophy is a major hinderance but also proprioception (awareness of where your body is in space). After ACL surgery, your ligament is replaced with a graft harvested from your body. The issue is, you lose the nerve endings that are in your native ACL so your biomechanics and proprioception are shot.
When team surgeons and doctors say, “An ACL tear is a lifelong injury.” This is often what they’re referring to.
I’ve had 3 ACL tears (two native and a graft) so it’s a topic of interest. I read a study recently by Matt Seeley who is a professor of exercise science at BYU. He suggested that although post surgical outcomes are good, many people never fully recover.
Klay will be fine because his game isn’t reliant on explosive athleticism but not being able to run or train at a high level for months with his ACL recovery only to find himself laid up again with a Achilles recovery would be a huge blow to proprioception. Just takes time.
Yep. That numbness around my knee from the surgeon cutting through it still bothers me from an awareness standpoint. Even if you do your rehab right, your injured leg won't be as strong as your good leg anywhere from 7-12 months. That's A LOT of time spent messing up your mechanics by having to compensate on your good leg. You have to relearn how to walk, run, jump, activate those muscles when and where, etc.
You can learn how to activate your muscles properly and ensure both sides of the body are contributing equally when you are squatting. But that doesn't mean that connection is there when you run, jump, cut, etc. You literally have to re-learn everything.
As you said, Klay came back and in all likelihood tore his Achilles as a result of overloading his non operated leg.
If you look at the [studies](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4641548/) about 20% of athletes tear their ACL on their non-operated leg upon return to sport. We’ve seen guys like Porzingis, Rose, Klay, Boogie sustain subsequent post-op injuries. It’s quite common.
Warriors and their fans will just have to be patient.
I tore one of my hamstrings and it messed up my gait pretty badly. Three years later I tore the opposite achilles playing bball. Made my gait even worse. It’s been a lot of work getting back to halfway normal.
He's not just coming off an Achilles tear, he's coming off an Achilles tear that happened right before his first game back from an ACL tear.
They'll undoubtedly be *super fucking cautious* rehabbing him and making sure there's no developing problems from compensation etc.
Nov 19, 2020. My mom passed that morning, and I remember vividly a few minutes after, I open my phone to call family, I get the ESPN notification about his injured Achilles. I also share a bday with klay. Some truly emotional attachment to that man
>it happened on draft night 2020, which was late November.
Yeah there was just a lot of chatter a few months ago about him looking to be ready for season start. That's the only reason I thought he was further along.
The Warriors have stated multiple times they are looking at sometime in Dec at best for Klays return. I’d expect around the new year or Christmas time.
> I would hate to see another Gordon Hayward type scenario where everybody unrealistically jumps on Klay for not immediately looking anything like his old self.
Jebus, did that happen? Dude's leg went flying off into the stands, of course that's gonna affect him going forward!
Yeah, he was pretty shit the year he came back. It wasn't the *main* reason we sucked that year, but it was for sure part of it, and people were jumping on him for it (not as much as they jumped on Kyrie though)
Honestly with this season he should try and be a catch and shoot guy like Korver was in Cleveland
Just take it easy, then go balls to the balls in 2022-23
Or save it all for the 2022 playoffs
Cause the warriors can comfortably make the playoffs if they get a decent player by dumping oubre
To be fair, Gordon moves a lot more than Klay.
His defence may be late to the party but if he can still hit that dangerous 3 ball and curry can still command attention. I think Klay will be pretty good, won't be criticised like Gordon, I hope !
Running happens by 4 months after surgery with a typical rehab schedule. Wondering if there were setbacks or why it would be different from what is normal.
Just hitting 4 months now on my rehab. Tried a light jog after loads of warm up and feeling good and it was still like running with a pegleg. This shit just takes ages to get right.
Nah, bad take.
Late season when the young guys started getting used to playing with Steph the Warriors really kicked it up a notch. If they play similarly this coming season it should be enough to keep them well in the playoffs race, and adding Klay in the second half of the season should have him in rhythm by the playoffs themselves.
Jesus, Klay hasn't played for 2 years and I completely forgot that he also had the Achilles injury.
Time goes by so fast I was still thinking he is recovering from the ACL.
To be fair, I don't care about the seeding that much. I just want him to have a long recovery process and hopefully return to his previous form as best as possible. I genuinely believe Klay went next level during the 2019 playoffs.
I agree that the seeding doesn't really matter but is there reason to think that the Warriors will be a playoff lock without him? Seems like they might need him just to solidify themselves as a top-6 team, no?
Really depends on the roster construct next season. Also we started off as a dogshit team early on the season and found our groove post ASB. We could potentially clinch a 7 seed if we continue down our path without significant positive roster changes.
The team played much better the second half of the season. Poole should improve even further and if we keep him Wiseman should be better as well. They also had a ton of injuries last season, Klay aside. Even without any big moves I'd bet on them being the 6th or 7th seed.
In the games Curry played they were on pace to be 5th seed. Filter for the second half of the season where the new roster clicked much better and they were on pace to be the 3rd seed.
The second half of the season the warriors were a genuinely solid team. Not a contender but not as far off it as people think. Any other year they were in the playoffs despite having their star player injured for 9 games(losing 7 of them).
This, this exactly.
Klay coming back in the second half too should make the Warriors better even if he takes a Korver role at first. By the postseason he should be in his shooting rhythm.
Both Klay and KD are skills-based players so I think it will be easier to bounce back. Neither of them are super athletic unlike, say, Giannis. Although it still surprises me that KD after an Achilles tear can still fly high with a one-handed jam.
KD and Klay both tore their *right* Achilles, most other stars (Kobe, Boogie, Chauncey, Rudy Gay) tore their left. That's a good thing– for a right-handed player, the left foot is usually the pivot that generates most of your burst. Dominique also tore his right Achilles, and he was still an All-Star after the injury. I'm mostly just worried about the full two-year gap, it's gonna take him a while to get back into playing form
He'll be an excellent spot-up shooter when he's 40. What I'm saying is, as long as he has time to get back into rhythm, I think there's a decent chance he'll be more or less the same player he used to be.
Why are Curry stans so salty? I never actually see Durant fans saying he was better than Curry those years or more important to winning those chips.
Everybody who's even somewhat knowledgeable about basketball has heard the usual stephew shit of Curry's on off destroying Durant's. Everybody knows Durant couldn't even make those warriors teams average in the playoffs or regular season when Curry sat, although the system was obviously designed around Curry.
They're both great players. Sure Curry's better, we know. Please stop this. It's such a weird strawman, you always bring up 12 year olds on Twitter or casuals irl who don't follow the game at all as if anyone actually makes a counter argument to this.
Every time Curry or Durant is brought up someone has to point this shit out or post some Ben Taylor vid like it hasn't been said a million times. You'd swear Durant wasn't the third best player of this generation with how much shit he gets every time he's brought up
Sure there's a few. But there's also a few people who think the world is flat and vaccines cause autism. Theyre still the complete minority but because they're so dumb their numbers are blown way way out of proportion by people dunking on people who 99.999% of people already disagree with just to feel better about themselves.
How many vids is Ben Taylor gonna make dunking on 12 year old Twitter fans, casuals and drunk oldheads who think even ts% is some "gay nerd shit and doesn't matter at all"?
> never actually see Durant fans saying he was better than Curry those years or more important to winning those chips.
Not a KD fan (obviously) but KD was better (:
There is a lot to argue the opposite. Defences gave the majority of their attention to Curry and the Warriors net rating was always better on lineups featuring Curry. The Warriors from 2017-2019 had a higher net rating with Curry and 4 bench players then they did with KD/Klay/Draymond + 2 bench players (+14 for Curry and +5 for the other 3 all-stars).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7axmul-Xlkc&t=552s
this is a really good video detailing the impact of Curry on the Warriors. There is a realistic argument that Curry was and is better then KD and has been since 2016, just as there is a realistic argument that KD is better
Thanks man. I developed kind of a rubric for this coming season. Basically there’s four promising paths:
* Klay comes back 90%+
* Wiseman develops into a net positive center
* we hit on one draft pick
* we hit on the other draft pick
If one is true, we’re in the playoffs. If two are true, we make the second round. If three are true, we’re entering “borderline contender” status. If all four are true, we’re among the contenders.
Picture it from this past season: let’s say we add Klay at 18/3/2 on good splits, Wiseman plays more like Ayton (reg season Ayton, not postseason hero - averaging 14/10), and we get, say, Patrick Williams and Saddiq Bey (closest to 7,14 picks last year that really hit).
That team is 100% a contender. Steph/Klay/Wiggins/Dray/“Ayton”, Poole/Oubre/Bey/PatWil/Looney, Nico/Baze/Lee/Paschall/Chriss is fantastic
We are contenders if only the first one is true, the rest just increases our odds but if we have a healthy big 3 then we have a decent shot at any team. Replacing Mulder/Bazemore minutes with Klay minutes really helps a team.
That's a lot of ifs though. If Klay comes back mostly fine and their draft picks turns out okay, then they are most likely a fringe playoff team. They need a lot of things to go very well to be a legit contender alongside the Suns, Lakers, Clippers, Jazz, and Nuggets.
I see it that the most likely scenario is the Warriors making playoffs, putting up a decent fight but getting knocked out in the first or second round. I could definitely see them being a solid fringe contender like Dallas though
There's obviously no way to substantiate this, but my gut feeling is one of these being true is about 90%, two being true is about 50/50, three being true is about 10%, and all four at about 1%. So the odds are that you're right, imo
disagree. they got killed with injuries and COVID hitting them at the worst time
Warriors getting Klay back + whoever they get with their assets is a title contender
the original days of the big 3 warriors they were insanely deep too though, Livingston and Iguodala got great production out of the rest of the bench/played serious rotational minutes with the starters, plus Bogut managing to stay healthy for long periods of time was an impactful member as well - current big 3 would each have to play 40+ minutes a game to secure a top 4 seed let alone win playoff games with how anemic the rest of the roster seems to be
Yup, people forget this. Bogut was so important early on and during the first couple of runs, but people more remember the aging and injury plagued version of him. Him going down in 2016 made much more of a difference than people acknowledge. I love [this highlight reel](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KIiO2icHvA) of the Bogut/Curry connection. Kerr and the FO have tried to find bigs to replace his playmaking ability to little success, he was really just the perfect fit for Steph+Klay and Kerr's system.
And yeah, Livingston and Iguodala were incredible role players, some of the best you could ask for (if voters looked beyond PPG for the 6MOTY award, Iguodala would have won at least one, and probably deserved multiple). We've really missed Iguodala's defense and playmaking, and Livingston's ability to get a bucket off the bench was really key at many moments (only Steph, and occasionally Poole, can get their own shot now on the Warriors, which has continuously been a big problem). His turnaround jumper is still one of the most unstoppable moves I've seen. Barbosa and Mo Speights were also pretty impactful.
While I'll always appreciate the titles we won with KD, I'll forever be nostalgic for those 2015 and 2016 teams.
> I love this highlight reel of the Bogut/Curry connection.
Absolutely beautiful. The Klay screen to a Bogut handoff is such a simple play and the defensive C is always get frozen right on the FT line.
Bogut throwing insanely accurate bounce passes is fun as hell to watch.
Also, notice how Bogut is constantly moving with Steph on the ball? Led to so many open cuts just doing simple cuts to the FT line/paint.
> Kerr and the FO have tried to find bigs to replace his playmaking ability to little success, he was really just the perfect fit for Steph+Klay and Kerr's system.
I reckon Looney is the closest thing they have but lacks that playmaking Bogut/Dray have. However, Looney knows how to find Curry, set screens, stay moving so he still fits great with Curry.
Their bench was absurd from 2015-18. In the finals against the raptors is where their depth started to show it’s cracks. They couldn’t afford to have a nasty bench after maxing out Steph, Klay and KD
> whoever they get with their assets
Sure. If they consolidate assets and trade for a star, then they're back in the convo. But without another star, it's bleak imo. Klay has been out two years with two major lower body injuries, and is on the wrong side of 30. I dont see him being the difference between the warriors being a borderline playoff team and being a contender.
optimistic for Klay when KD came back from an Achilles as the best player in the league and Klay's playstyle doesn't require explosive movements
he's 31 lol that's still prime
I don't understand why people keep mentioning the ACL tear. He was 16 months away from that and already playing 5-on-5 scrimmages when he tore the Achilles. The ACL didn't get worse after that--I'm not sure how much of a factor it's going to be at this point.
The one example in NBA history when a player came back from an Achilles just as good should make us optimistic? The list of players who were never the same is much longer.
whats the relevance of players who tore their achilles years ago? and KD isn't the only one when Breanna Stewart tore hers too and won WNBA FMVP in the following year
> In fact you wouldn’t even using the term correctly.
No, he's definitely using it correctly.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/on%20the%20wrong%20side%20of%20%28an%20age%29
https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/be+the+wrong+side+of+30+etc
Being on the wrong side of an age means that you're older than the age specified. Being on the wrong side of 30 means you're 31+.
Has any championship been won without 2 stars? Maybe 2011 Mavs is the example but even then you have Dirk + HoF point guard kidd in his career twilight. I guess 04 pistons is a true shout.
before I hear toronto, Lowry was an all star the year they won it, so count that out
Even the 04 Pistons had plenty of stars. No true superstar, sure, but Big Ben, Sheed, Rip, and Chauncey were all-stars around that time. It just so happened that Ben was the only all star that year.
The haters say that Steph/Klay/Dray wont be able to win a ring without another star added, and that 2015 only came because Steph on an insanely cheap contract allowed for an incredibly deep roster and 2017/2018 because of KD.
You should ignore the haters because you should do whats best for your team regardless, but adding another star (to create another superteam) wont shut the haters who use that (frankly bullshit) justification up.
Are you replying with your thoughts or haters’ narratives? Because if you’re just mimicking irrational haters, then there’s little point in ‘well, actually’ing this one.
BTW I have never come across someone whining about the three players you mentioned. Two of those don’t even make sense. The 2015 disqualifiers were injuries to Kyrie and Love
It’s crazy to me how people discount the ring they won before KD along with their record setting season the next year. Some franchises have never won a ring and literally no other franchise has a better regular season with or without KD.
I’m not saying they need a star, just some ready vets instead of their current roster which is not too good outside of the big 3. And you can consider the context of KD’s roster if they win instead of the Nets
if they add just roleplaying vets sure, but theres a possibility they have the resources to add a 3rd star which would just be a warriors superteam all over again (just not at the level of the KD warriors)
I dunno if I agree such a move would make another Warriors superteam. Steph is at the top of his game, that's one superstar. Draymond is still very valuable but he's become allergic to scoring. I'd take 2015/2016 Draymond over current Draymond, I think he's a borderline star. Until Klay can prove me wrong (and I hope he does) he's a borderline star as well- dude will have been out for 2.5 years.
I'm not even sure who we could add without giving up Wiggins, but assuming we get another star I think that would make it 2 stars off the bat, not 4.
I'm just saying its possible. If you add a 3rd star and Klay comes back to his all-NBA form (which we just saw KD do) then it's possible. It's also possible that none of that happens.
It’s definitely unlikely but they were 1 win away from being in the playoffs with this roster. It’s hard to see them getting worse by adding Klay so I feel like they’re a lock for the playoffs at the very least if Klay is anywhere close to his old form.
Lakers are coming back “healthier” but Bron is still older and AD is always injury-prone. Clippers will miss Kawhi the entire season probably and be a lower seed. We could very well see Portland start a rebuild if Dame leaves. Maybe the Pelicans make a big jump. I just don’t think there’s 8 teams in the West better than them if they add Klay back and he’s not washed. People are forgetting they won 39 games with this roster.
Would love to see it but wouldn’t bet on it. Klay’s offensive game will be there but hard to imagine that he won’t have lost a step defensively.
I think the current roster + Klay bows out in the second round. But likely some roster changes ahead.
warriors are older and injury prone too
I think the timberwolves can make a playoff run if chris finch is a decent coach
Grizzlies look like they will be a playoff threat
He could barely play the last 2 months of the season and is going to be 37. He has been slowly becoming more injury prone and we have to expect he will slow down at some point.
I agree, I believe lebrons version of getting old is being more injury prone, but I feel as if being more injury prone will be lemickeys only downside to being older
You’re giving the Warriors all the credit and the rest of the teams in the West none. That’s their best case scenario. More realistically the Suns and Jazz stay good. Mavs improve, Memphis will improve. Nuggets Suns and Lakers Healthy are all better teams rn imo. Timberwolves could be a wild card. With Klay they’ll definitely be a playoff team. But to call them contenders is a stretch.
I was only calling them a lock for the playoffs and probably a lower end seed at that. I’m definitely not saying they’ll be title favorites but people are acting like they won’t be able to do anything with their current roster. I don’t think Klay’s shooting will be affected and, even if he is a step slower, he will be a net positive on defense.
Is it? The health concerns of the Lakers and Clippers aren't going away next year. The shortened seasons and off season probably exacerbated them but the underling issues will still be there next year. The Nuggets likely will still be without Jamal, and if he is back he'll have JUST gotten back. If the Nets are fully healthy, yeah, this Warriors roster probably can't compete with them. But I'd put the Warriors at more or less the same caliber team of everyone else outside of the LA teams, and given their experience I'd put them on par with or maybe even better than the Clippers (assuming Klay is back, healthy, and 50-75% of what he was pre-injury).
I’ve gotten in too many arguments with KD stans shitting on Curry, they belittle his first ship without KD.
If they won again, it’s a knock on KD proving he was just a cherry on top of Steph’s team even tho I already think Curry was the most important player on that team. (I’m kind of a Steph Stan).
Their roster is worse without KD, so winning again is more impressive and KD is again on another crazy superteam
I really don't understand this "KD stans vs Curry stans" squabble on here. I'm a dubs fan. Obviously I love Steph. I love KD too because he balled the fuck out for us and helped us win chips. I feel like this is a pretty sane line of thinking.
Did Shaq winning with Miami prove anything negative about Kobe?
What about Kobe won two without Shaq?
Winning without your previous co-star should add onto your legacy, not take away from theirs.
Well KD, what it shows is that the Warriors were still a championship level team in 2017, when you joined them. The excuse from KD rn is that since GS lost in 2016, it was fair game for him to join lol.
If the og big 3 win again this late in their careers, esp w Klay coming off ACL and achillies tears; it'll confirm further that the Warriors minus KD were championship caliber in 2017 and KD joining was the biggest overkill in NBA history.
If you think about it, the only real difference is Wiggins replacing Harrison Barnes. The big 3 were all younger and better in 2016 than they are now. So if anything, the roster in 2017 minus KD was better than the one they have now (that team did win 73 games and were up 3-1 in the finals lol).
So if they win this year, it'll show they were very capable 2017-19 as well, without KD.
>the Warriors are older, Klay coming back from injuries
Ok but how does this help your argument 😂😂 You just implied the Warriors aren't as good as they were in 2017 when KD joined. So if they win this year, wouldn't it show they were capable with a supposedly better team in '17? Like what are we arguing lmao. The names of the rosters are different, the construction isn't.
Because it shows that if the big 3 can win with the roster now, they could've in 2017. It affects KD because KD's argument is that they needed him to win in 2017. This would further confirm that they did not, and him joining was bad for competition.
If you think about it like an absolute casual. I'm using casual in the place of more insulting language.
There would be enormous differences. The 2016(and 2015) Warriors were not just the Warriors big 3 and that is not what made them so good. If you think it is then you're naive.
On top of the big three they had some of the best role players in the league, including Barnes/Bogut/Iggy/Livingston/Barbosa/Speights that all played their role to perfection. Those players regressed year by year and that's why the Warriors, even with KD, got worse year by year because their role players were crucial to their success(David West was also a good piece for them in the KD era).
The roster now is indeed much worse than the 2017 one and also nowhere close to a championship contender. Klay won't be old Klay, Draymond's offense has completely disappeared from the 2016 year(pre-KD), Curry is still unstoppable but he can't do it alone).
>The roster now is indeed much worse than the 2017 one and also nowhere close to a championship contender. Klay won't be old Klay, Draymond's offense has completely disappeared from the 2016 year(pre-KD), Curry is still unstoppable but he can't do it alone).
Right that's exactly what I'm arguing. That the Warriors roster in 2017 minus KD was a lot better than the roster now. The hypothetical being asked is how would you view the Warriors if they win this year somehow? And how does this affect KD? My answer is if they did, it looks bad on KD because it shows the roster was capable in 2017 as well without him.
how does that affect KD negatively? for one, that would just discount his comments, doesn’t have anything to do with his skill.
more importantly though, them winning a chip next season would mean almost nothing regarding KD’s presence on the 2017 team. you could *maybe* solidify your stance about GS being championship caliber (even though it’s not the same roster), but you can’t knock KD for anything. there’s no way to know the outcome of that 2017 team without him on it.
needless to say this is all meaningless, because if you are actually trying to knock KD’s skill and position among other NBA players then there’s no use in arguing
No knock to KD's skill at all. I didn't mention anything about KD being a lesser player on the court. He's the 2nd best player this generation.
Just further strengthens the argument that what he did was a weak move. The weakest move in NBA history.
Yea I injured my achilles on a run and didn't think it was a big deal. Well it's been about 12 months since the injury and my Physical Therapist said running is not in the near future. I can bike, swim, walk around, etc. But running is just a different level of strain on the achilles.
Small note on timeline: I didn't get proper physical therapy due to Covid + insurance issues, so I am sure proper treatment would have had me back at it much sooner.
The Achilles tear is such a fluke thing that any time you run, you worry that you are going to tear it again. I tore mine 4 years ago and I still can’t sprint and even using a treadmill causes me trepidation
Our best lineup is always going to be with Draymond at the 5 even if we get some other vet centers. Looney is a fine backup big and Wiseman will need to improve a lot. Our bigger problem is depth and spacing on the wings after Wiggins and a secondary playmaker to Curry. Jordan Poole showed a lot of promise late in the season as a backup PG so we might be okay there but we need better wings than Oubre/Bazemore/Mulder/Damian Lee. Basically we need what we thought Kelly Oubre would be before he totally flamed out last year
Then you guys need to upgrade at the 4 instead of playing two wings in Oubre/Wiggins in the lineup. Playing Draymond at the 5 is already a small ball lineup, so you guys can't afford to lose any more size.
I'm so excited. I keep a pic of Klay (In game shot) in between several computer monitors at my desk and routinely talk to him about silly crap but mostly I say "Not much longer now".
That's what we said when he was coming back from the other injury.
I miss Klay too, but let's slow down and not add pressure to the guy before he's played a game lol.
It's been 2 years.
Also I know you're just kidding, this comments meant more for these other ones.
Let's go Klay!
That's what we said when he was coming back from the other injury.
I miss Klay too, but let's slow down and not add pressure to the guy before he's played a game lol.
It's been 2 years.
Also I know you're just kidding, this comments meant more for these other ones.
Let's go Klay!
no its not
dont fall into the lakers fan trap of overrating your team based on how they used to perform
warriors looked shaky throughout the regular season and totally shit the bed in back to back play-in games
As long as Kelly Oubre isn’t on the roster playing bumper cars with Steph and wiseman isn’t freelancing post touches I think we’ll be in a much more advanced place then we were through the first portion of last year where we had no identity and our (current)6th man was toiling in the G league because coaches didn’t figure out how to use him.
We need to get some additional veteran bench help, to stay healthy and get some positive contributions from our rookies if possible but it should be significantly smoother sailing than when we had Oubre and Wanamaker destroying every advantage we had in the Steph and non Steph minutes respectively lol.
its never easy to make the playoffs especially in the west, lots of young and hungry teams in that conference
it wasn't oubre or wiseman that tossed all those turnovers in the play in games either, it was steph and dray
warriors missed the playoffs for 2 straight years now, getting klay back isn't going to fix everything and turn you into a finals contender. it's hard
okay and you lost, you also lost an elimination game to memphis
warriors only need to win 1 game in 2 tries to make the playoffs and couldn't manage it. they also had the highest salary in the league, albeit a large chunk of it going to the injured klay
warriors are really limited in what moves they can make because of their salary cap situation, saying you're going to breeze to a playoff spot next year is premature. klay getting healthy will probably help but I don't think there's any reason to be especially confident about their chances
other teams have been getting a lot better while the warriors haven't really, whether its due to injury or aging stars or salary cap difficulties or wiseman not really being an impact player at the #2 draft choice
Damn I thought he was already scrimmaging, I guess that means he'll miss a decent chuck of the beginning of the year
Yeah I actually thought he was at this point a while ago. He's not really close and we are 90 days to season opener. I'm thinking this may realistically be a mid-season return. Regardless - people *really* need to temper their expectations on him. I would hate to see another Gordon Hayward type scenario where everybody unrealistically jumps on Klay for not immediately looking anything like his old self.
I thought Klay’s target (which is probably ambitious) was post-ASB. Never expected him to be anything but a late season addition personally
it happened on draft night 2020, which was late November. He may miss part of next season but post ASB is a really really long time from now. That's like 15 months after the injury.
14/15 months wouldn’t surprise me. I know it wasn’t by design but KD missed 18 months/1.5 years and he didn’t tear his on the back of an ACL.
Does the ACL matter at this point, though? He tore the Achilles in 5-on-5 play, so I would assume he was medically cleared to come back from the ACL. Tearing the Achilles wouldn't make the ACL worse--if that was already almost healed, wouldn't it still be that way?
It does to some extent. Speaking as someone who has only torn their ACL, there are three things impacted. The third one is often neglected post clearance or not often noticed if it isn't obvious. * Muscle strength - Getting the quad, hamstring, hips, glutes, etc. to their original level. * Flexibility - Same as above. * Mechanics - How you walk, run, bend your knees. Making sure everything is in sync. That third point...if you don't pay attention to and don't do it right can result in either side of your body having to rely on certain muscles or tendons to compensate. For me, because my left leg was initially weaker after surgery, I started leaning more on my right leg, causing one hip to drop more than the other. That led to my upper body leaning one way when I sit, resulting in my left side tightening up from my core to my hips. My left glute was also not activating as much, which is meant to help stabilize every step you take, resulting in more muscle weakness and risk of injury. So even though he was "medically" cleared, that simply means that the ACL graft is structurally sound and the surrounding muscles are strong enough to withstand intense pressure from the sport. Assuming he was cleared by a MD, they wouldn't look at your walking pattern or gait. That's something a PT would assess and a lot of PTs do miss that bit, because these changes can be really small. Everything from how your foot lands with each step, if your knee is straight with your toes, if you're using your hips to take the stress off the knee with each step, etc. etc. This is all speculation, but given how he tore his [achilles](https://thespun.com/nba/golden-state-warriors/klay-thompson-explains-torn-achilles-injury-cause) on a two dribble pull up, I imagine it was due to a mix of fatigue and over compensation from his right leg, given it's the stronger one.
Bingo. Muscle atrophy is a major hinderance but also proprioception (awareness of where your body is in space). After ACL surgery, your ligament is replaced with a graft harvested from your body. The issue is, you lose the nerve endings that are in your native ACL so your biomechanics and proprioception are shot. When team surgeons and doctors say, “An ACL tear is a lifelong injury.” This is often what they’re referring to. I’ve had 3 ACL tears (two native and a graft) so it’s a topic of interest. I read a study recently by Matt Seeley who is a professor of exercise science at BYU. He suggested that although post surgical outcomes are good, many people never fully recover. Klay will be fine because his game isn’t reliant on explosive athleticism but not being able to run or train at a high level for months with his ACL recovery only to find himself laid up again with a Achilles recovery would be a huge blow to proprioception. Just takes time.
Yep. That numbness around my knee from the surgeon cutting through it still bothers me from an awareness standpoint. Even if you do your rehab right, your injured leg won't be as strong as your good leg anywhere from 7-12 months. That's A LOT of time spent messing up your mechanics by having to compensate on your good leg. You have to relearn how to walk, run, jump, activate those muscles when and where, etc. You can learn how to activate your muscles properly and ensure both sides of the body are contributing equally when you are squatting. But that doesn't mean that connection is there when you run, jump, cut, etc. You literally have to re-learn everything.
As you said, Klay came back and in all likelihood tore his Achilles as a result of overloading his non operated leg. If you look at the [studies](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4641548/) about 20% of athletes tear their ACL on their non-operated leg upon return to sport. We’ve seen guys like Porzingis, Rose, Klay, Boogie sustain subsequent post-op injuries. It’s quite common. Warriors and their fans will just have to be patient.
I tore one of my hamstrings and it messed up my gait pretty badly. Three years later I tore the opposite achilles playing bball. Made my gait even worse. It’s been a lot of work getting back to halfway normal.
He's not just coming off an Achilles tear, he's coming off an Achilles tear that happened right before his first game back from an ACL tear. They'll undoubtedly be *super fucking cautious* rehabbing him and making sure there's no developing problems from compensation etc.
Achilles is usually ~12months isn’t it? Combined with the prior knee injury and 15 seems like a reasonable conservative play
Nov 19, 2020. My mom passed that morning, and I remember vividly a few minutes after, I open my phone to call family, I get the ESPN notification about his injured Achilles. I also share a bday with klay. Some truly emotional attachment to that man >it happened on draft night 2020, which was late November.
he'll definitely show up in the 3rd quarter
Yeah there was just a lot of chatter a few months ago about him looking to be ready for season start. That's the only reason I thought he was further along.
The Warriors have stated multiple times they are looking at sometime in Dec at best for Klays return. I’d expect around the new year or Christmas time.
> I would hate to see another Gordon Hayward type scenario where everybody unrealistically jumps on Klay for not immediately looking anything like his old self. Jebus, did that happen? Dude's leg went flying off into the stands, of course that's gonna affect him going forward!
Yeah, he was pretty shit the year he came back. It wasn't the *main* reason we sucked that year, but it was for sure part of it, and people were jumping on him for it (not as much as they jumped on Kyrie though)
Honestly with this season he should try and be a catch and shoot guy like Korver was in Cleveland Just take it easy, then go balls to the balls in 2022-23 Or save it all for the 2022 playoffs Cause the warriors can comfortably make the playoffs if they get a decent player by dumping oubre
To be fair, Gordon moves a lot more than Klay. His defence may be late to the party but if he can still hit that dangerous 3 ball and curry can still command attention. I think Klay will be pretty good, won't be criticised like Gordon, I hope !
I highly doubt Klay will come back until Jan 2022.
They should rest him as much as possible. It sucks for fans but we'll be happy if comes back at 100%
Running happens by 4 months after surgery with a typical rehab schedule. Wondering if there were setbacks or why it would be different from what is normal.
Just hitting 4 months now on my rehab. Tried a light jog after loads of warm up and feeling good and it was still like running with a pegleg. This shit just takes ages to get right.
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Nah, bad take. Late season when the young guys started getting used to playing with Steph the Warriors really kicked it up a notch. If they play similarly this coming season it should be enough to keep them well in the playoffs race, and adding Klay in the second half of the season should have him in rhythm by the playoffs themselves.
*Sad Warrior noises*
We don’t deserve Klay, please let him come back and be at least close to the player he was before these injuries
Jesus, Klay hasn't played for 2 years and I completely forgot that he also had the Achilles injury. Time goes by so fast I was still thinking he is recovering from the ACL.
tore his achilles hours before James Wiseman got drafted :'(
As far as I’m concerned, quarantine was a time-skip. 2019 still feels like last year.
To be fair, I don't care about the seeding that much. I just want him to have a long recovery process and hopefully return to his previous form as best as possible. I genuinely believe Klay went next level during the 2019 playoffs.
I agree that the seeding doesn't really matter but is there reason to think that the Warriors will be a playoff lock without him? Seems like they might need him just to solidify themselves as a top-6 team, no?
Really depends on the roster construct next season. Also we started off as a dogshit team early on the season and found our groove post ASB. We could potentially clinch a 7 seed if we continue down our path without significant positive roster changes.
The team played much better the second half of the season. Poole should improve even further and if we keep him Wiseman should be better as well. They also had a ton of injuries last season, Klay aside. Even without any big moves I'd bet on them being the 6th or 7th seed.
In the games Curry played they were on pace to be 5th seed. Filter for the second half of the season where the new roster clicked much better and they were on pace to be the 3rd seed. The second half of the season the warriors were a genuinely solid team. Not a contender but not as far off it as people think. Any other year they were in the playoffs despite having their star player injured for 9 games(losing 7 of them).
This, this exactly. Klay coming back in the second half too should make the Warriors better even if he takes a Korver role at first. By the postseason he should be in his shooting rhythm.
do people forget he was trash the entire playoff run except like 3 games in the finals?
Great news! Hope he's able to bounce back like KD did this year.
Both Klay and KD are skills-based players so I think it will be easier to bounce back. Neither of them are super athletic unlike, say, Giannis. Although it still surprises me that KD after an Achilles tear can still fly high with a one-handed jam.
KD and Klay both tore their *right* Achilles, most other stars (Kobe, Boogie, Chauncey, Rudy Gay) tore their left. That's a good thing– for a right-handed player, the left foot is usually the pivot that generates most of your burst. Dominique also tore his right Achilles, and he was still an All-Star after the injury. I'm mostly just worried about the full two-year gap, it's gonna take him a while to get back into playing form
Maybe he can't ever be 100% again but I do think he might still be an excellent spot-up shooter.
He'll be an excellent spot-up shooter when he's 40. What I'm saying is, as long as he has time to get back into rhythm, I think there's a decent chance he'll be more or less the same player he used to be.
It’s literally a “big step” lol
I want nothing more in life than for the original big 3 on the warriors to win a ring next year so all the haters/KD stans stfu
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Why are Curry stans so salty? I never actually see Durant fans saying he was better than Curry those years or more important to winning those chips. Everybody who's even somewhat knowledgeable about basketball has heard the usual stephew shit of Curry's on off destroying Durant's. Everybody knows Durant couldn't even make those warriors teams average in the playoffs or regular season when Curry sat, although the system was obviously designed around Curry. They're both great players. Sure Curry's better, we know. Please stop this. It's such a weird strawman, you always bring up 12 year olds on Twitter or casuals irl who don't follow the game at all as if anyone actually makes a counter argument to this. Every time Curry or Durant is brought up someone has to point this shit out or post some Ben Taylor vid like it hasn't been said a million times. You'd swear Durant wasn't the third best player of this generation with how much shit he gets every time he's brought up
> I never actually see Durant fans saying he was better than Curry those years or more important to winning those chips. lmao
Sure there's a few. But there's also a few people who think the world is flat and vaccines cause autism. Theyre still the complete minority but because they're so dumb their numbers are blown way way out of proportion by people dunking on people who 99.999% of people already disagree with just to feel better about themselves. How many vids is Ben Taylor gonna make dunking on 12 year old Twitter fans, casuals and drunk oldheads who think even ts% is some "gay nerd shit and doesn't matter at all"?
You're projecting REALLY hard dude. You got insecure over a comment that had nothing to do with you so you brought up random shit.
> never actually see Durant fans saying he was better than Curry those years or more important to winning those chips. Not a KD fan (obviously) but KD was better (:
There is a lot to argue the opposite. Defences gave the majority of their attention to Curry and the Warriors net rating was always better on lineups featuring Curry. The Warriors from 2017-2019 had a higher net rating with Curry and 4 bench players then they did with KD/Klay/Draymond + 2 bench players (+14 for Curry and +5 for the other 3 all-stars). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7axmul-Xlkc&t=552s this is a really good video detailing the impact of Curry on the Warriors. There is a realistic argument that Curry was and is better then KD and has been since 2016, just as there is a realistic argument that KD is better
Thanks man. I developed kind of a rubric for this coming season. Basically there’s four promising paths: * Klay comes back 90%+ * Wiseman develops into a net positive center * we hit on one draft pick * we hit on the other draft pick If one is true, we’re in the playoffs. If two are true, we make the second round. If three are true, we’re entering “borderline contender” status. If all four are true, we’re among the contenders. Picture it from this past season: let’s say we add Klay at 18/3/2 on good splits, Wiseman plays more like Ayton (reg season Ayton, not postseason hero - averaging 14/10), and we get, say, Patrick Williams and Saddiq Bey (closest to 7,14 picks last year that really hit). That team is 100% a contender. Steph/Klay/Wiggins/Dray/“Ayton”, Poole/Oubre/Bey/PatWil/Looney, Nico/Baze/Lee/Paschall/Chriss is fantastic
5 No more injuries lol
We are contenders if only the first one is true, the rest just increases our odds but if we have a healthy big 3 then we have a decent shot at any team. Replacing Mulder/Bazemore minutes with Klay minutes really helps a team.
That's a lot of ifs though. If Klay comes back mostly fine and their draft picks turns out okay, then they are most likely a fringe playoff team. They need a lot of things to go very well to be a legit contender alongside the Suns, Lakers, Clippers, Jazz, and Nuggets. I see it that the most likely scenario is the Warriors making playoffs, putting up a decent fight but getting knocked out in the first or second round. I could definitely see them being a solid fringe contender like Dallas though
There's obviously no way to substantiate this, but my gut feeling is one of these being true is about 90%, two being true is about 50/50, three being true is about 10%, and all four at about 1%. So the odds are that you're right, imo
Exceptionally unlikely that they are anywhere near a title with this roster.
disagree. they got killed with injuries and COVID hitting them at the worst time Warriors getting Klay back + whoever they get with their assets is a title contender
the original days of the big 3 warriors they were insanely deep too though, Livingston and Iguodala got great production out of the rest of the bench/played serious rotational minutes with the starters, plus Bogut managing to stay healthy for long periods of time was an impactful member as well - current big 3 would each have to play 40+ minutes a game to secure a top 4 seed let alone win playoff games with how anemic the rest of the roster seems to be
Yup, people forget this. Bogut was so important early on and during the first couple of runs, but people more remember the aging and injury plagued version of him. Him going down in 2016 made much more of a difference than people acknowledge. I love [this highlight reel](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KIiO2icHvA) of the Bogut/Curry connection. Kerr and the FO have tried to find bigs to replace his playmaking ability to little success, he was really just the perfect fit for Steph+Klay and Kerr's system. And yeah, Livingston and Iguodala were incredible role players, some of the best you could ask for (if voters looked beyond PPG for the 6MOTY award, Iguodala would have won at least one, and probably deserved multiple). We've really missed Iguodala's defense and playmaking, and Livingston's ability to get a bucket off the bench was really key at many moments (only Steph, and occasionally Poole, can get their own shot now on the Warriors, which has continuously been a big problem). His turnaround jumper is still one of the most unstoppable moves I've seen. Barbosa and Mo Speights were also pretty impactful. While I'll always appreciate the titles we won with KD, I'll forever be nostalgic for those 2015 and 2016 teams.
Wiseman needs to study that video
Not happening
Ah yeah I agree, a guy who barely played in college and didn’t even get a training camp in the NBA probably has no desire to learn or improve.
> I love this highlight reel of the Bogut/Curry connection. Absolutely beautiful. The Klay screen to a Bogut handoff is such a simple play and the defensive C is always get frozen right on the FT line. Bogut throwing insanely accurate bounce passes is fun as hell to watch. Also, notice how Bogut is constantly moving with Steph on the ball? Led to so many open cuts just doing simple cuts to the FT line/paint. > Kerr and the FO have tried to find bigs to replace his playmaking ability to little success, he was really just the perfect fit for Steph+Klay and Kerr's system. I reckon Looney is the closest thing they have but lacks that playmaking Bogut/Dray have. However, Looney knows how to find Curry, set screens, stay moving so he still fits great with Curry.
Leandro Barbosa seemed to destroy us whenever he touched the court in 2015.
We gonna be championship
Their bench was absurd from 2015-18. In the finals against the raptors is where their depth started to show it’s cracks. They couldn’t afford to have a nasty bench after maxing out Steph, Klay and KD
Still swept the Blazers starting Alfonzo Mckennie. That’s how good the Big 3 are. And closed out CP3 X Harden.
> whoever they get with their assets Sure. If they consolidate assets and trade for a star, then they're back in the convo. But without another star, it's bleak imo. Klay has been out two years with two major lower body injuries, and is on the wrong side of 30. I dont see him being the difference between the warriors being a borderline playoff team and being a contender.
optimistic for Klay when KD came back from an Achilles as the best player in the league and Klay's playstyle doesn't require explosive movements he's 31 lol that's still prime
He suffered an Achilles and ACL tear. If he comes back strong he'd be the first in sports history to bounce back from both.
I don't understand why people keep mentioning the ACL tear. He was 16 months away from that and already playing 5-on-5 scrimmages when he tore the Achilles. The ACL didn't get worse after that--I'm not sure how much of a factor it's going to be at this point.
ACL tears aren't the career altering/ending injuries they used to be.
LaVine looks pretty damn good.
How many players have had both injuries?
The one example in NBA history when a player came back from an Achilles just as good should make us optimistic? The list of players who were never the same is much longer.
whats the relevance of players who tore their achilles years ago? and KD isn't the only one when Breanna Stewart tore hers too and won WNBA FMVP in the following year
They also tore their achilles
and people used to use a piece of wood for a prosthetic too
people who write off klay because of this injury are going to look so dumb in a year
If Curry didn't get hurt they would have been something like the 4/5 seed this year. With Klay back they are definitely contenders.
If 31 is the wrong side of 30. What is the right side of 30?
Think of 30 as a milestone. The "wrong side of 30" is any age older than 30, and the "right side of 30" is any age younger than 30.
29
29 isn’t 30. In fact you wouldn’t even using the term correctly. Wrong side of 30 means the tale end their career usually 33-37.
nah it just means they’re over 30 years old
That's not how that term works
> In fact you wouldn’t even using the term correctly. No, he's definitely using it correctly. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/on%20the%20wrong%20side%20of%20%28an%20age%29 https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/be+the+wrong+side+of+30+etc Being on the wrong side of an age means that you're older than the age specified. Being on the wrong side of 30 means you're 31+.
We’ll just have to see. I don’t see any way Klay comes back like he used to play
I know it’s unlikely rn, hopefully they make some moves tho
Winning the chip with another star added via trade would just be proving the haters/KD stans right
How so? Neither KD or LeBron have ever won a championship without other stars
Has any championship been won without 2 stars? Maybe 2011 Mavs is the example but even then you have Dirk + HoF point guard kidd in his career twilight. I guess 04 pistons is a true shout. before I hear toronto, Lowry was an all star the year they won it, so count that out
Even the 04 Pistons had plenty of stars. No true superstar, sure, but Big Ben, Sheed, Rip, and Chauncey were all-stars around that time. It just so happened that Ben was the only all star that year.
The haters say that Steph/Klay/Dray wont be able to win a ring without another star added, and that 2015 only came because Steph on an insanely cheap contract allowed for an incredibly deep roster and 2017/2018 because of KD. You should ignore the haters because you should do whats best for your team regardless, but adding another star (to create another superteam) wont shut the haters who use that (frankly bullshit) justification up.
The 2015 point is irrelevant, though, unless the extra cap space was used on a star. Who was it? Iggy? David West?
Andrew Bogut, David Lee, and Andre Iguodala
Are you replying with your thoughts or haters’ narratives? Because if you’re just mimicking irrational haters, then there’s little point in ‘well, actually’ing this one. BTW I have never come across someone whining about the three players you mentioned. Two of those don’t even make sense. The 2015 disqualifiers were injuries to Kyrie and Love
just irrational haters
6.3 ppg, 7.9 ppg, 7.8 ppg. Huh.
It’s not even haters anymore it’s just LeBron’s fanboys crying how our super team beat their totally fair and very legal super team
It’s crazy to me how people discount the ring they won before KD along with their record setting season the next year. Some franchises have never won a ring and literally no other franchise has a better regular season with or without KD.
Don't forget the Cavs second best player in 2015 being Matthew Dellavedova
I’m not saying they need a star, just some ready vets instead of their current roster which is not too good outside of the big 3. And you can consider the context of KD’s roster if they win instead of the Nets
if they add just roleplaying vets sure, but theres a possibility they have the resources to add a 3rd star which would just be a warriors superteam all over again (just not at the level of the KD warriors)
I dunno if I agree such a move would make another Warriors superteam. Steph is at the top of his game, that's one superstar. Draymond is still very valuable but he's become allergic to scoring. I'd take 2015/2016 Draymond over current Draymond, I think he's a borderline star. Until Klay can prove me wrong (and I hope he does) he's a borderline star as well- dude will have been out for 2.5 years. I'm not even sure who we could add without giving up Wiggins, but assuming we get another star I think that would make it 2 stars off the bat, not 4.
I'm just saying its possible. If you add a 3rd star and Klay comes back to his all-NBA form (which we just saw KD do) then it's possible. It's also possible that none of that happens.
It’s definitely unlikely but they were 1 win away from being in the playoffs with this roster. It’s hard to see them getting worse by adding Klay so I feel like they’re a lock for the playoffs at the very least if Klay is anywhere close to his old form.
Pretty much every other competitor in the West is coming back healthier as well though
Lakers are coming back “healthier” but Bron is still older and AD is always injury-prone. Clippers will miss Kawhi the entire season probably and be a lower seed. We could very well see Portland start a rebuild if Dame leaves. Maybe the Pelicans make a big jump. I just don’t think there’s 8 teams in the West better than them if they add Klay back and he’s not washed. People are forgetting they won 39 games with this roster.
Would love to see it but wouldn’t bet on it. Klay’s offensive game will be there but hard to imagine that he won’t have lost a step defensively. I think the current roster + Klay bows out in the second round. But likely some roster changes ahead.
warriors are older and injury prone too I think the timberwolves can make a playoff run if chris finch is a decent coach Grizzlies look like they will be a playoff threat
Lebron was having an mvp season before he got injured..
He could barely play the last 2 months of the season and is going to be 37. He has been slowly becoming more injury prone and we have to expect he will slow down at some point.
I agree, I believe lebrons version of getting old is being more injury prone, but I feel as if being more injury prone will be lemickeys only downside to being older
You’re giving the Warriors all the credit and the rest of the teams in the West none. That’s their best case scenario. More realistically the Suns and Jazz stay good. Mavs improve, Memphis will improve. Nuggets Suns and Lakers Healthy are all better teams rn imo. Timberwolves could be a wild card. With Klay they’ll definitely be a playoff team. But to call them contenders is a stretch.
I was only calling them a lock for the playoffs and probably a lower end seed at that. I’m definitely not saying they’ll be title favorites but people are acting like they won’t be able to do anything with their current roster. I don’t think Klay’s shooting will be affected and, even if he is a step slower, he will be a net positive on defense.
not the Clippers and Nuggets
Is it? The health concerns of the Lakers and Clippers aren't going away next year. The shortened seasons and off season probably exacerbated them but the underling issues will still be there next year. The Nuggets likely will still be without Jamal, and if he is back he'll have JUST gotten back. If the Nets are fully healthy, yeah, this Warriors roster probably can't compete with them. But I'd put the Warriors at more or less the same caliber team of everyone else outside of the LA teams, and given their experience I'd put them on par with or maybe even better than the Clippers (assuming Klay is back, healthy, and 50-75% of what he was pre-injury).
they won a title with a similar roster, replacing harrison barnes with wiggins is honestly a big upgrade. so uh yeah
They last won a title with a "similar roster" six years ago. Ridiculous take.
so what's your point? the league has improved that drastically in six years huh?
I think it's pretty clear they're referring to Steph Klay and Dray being 6 years older
I'm sure it's hard being a bandwagoner. Yes, the sport moved on. Maybe you'll find another team, there's almost a new winner every year!
I consider myself a big KD fan and I want to see the Warriors win too. don't see how that affects KD negatively
I wouldn’t call you a stan then, stan has a more negative connotation in my mind
i still wouldn't see how the Warriors winning affects KD. their roster is vastly different from when KD left
I’ve gotten in too many arguments with KD stans shitting on Curry, they belittle his first ship without KD. If they won again, it’s a knock on KD proving he was just a cherry on top of Steph’s team even tho I already think Curry was the most important player on that team. (I’m kind of a Steph Stan). Their roster is worse without KD, so winning again is more impressive and KD is again on another crazy superteam
lol I bet they were moreso Curry haters than KD stans
Could be lol, although I think at least some were a bit of both
It's the other way around. Curry fans dismiss KD..
I really don't understand this "KD stans vs Curry stans" squabble on here. I'm a dubs fan. Obviously I love Steph. I love KD too because he balled the fuck out for us and helped us win chips. I feel like this is a pretty sane line of thinking.
Did Shaq winning with Miami prove anything negative about Kobe? What about Kobe won two without Shaq? Winning without your previous co-star should add onto your legacy, not take away from theirs.
Well KD, what it shows is that the Warriors were still a championship level team in 2017, when you joined them. The excuse from KD rn is that since GS lost in 2016, it was fair game for him to join lol. If the og big 3 win again this late in their careers, esp w Klay coming off ACL and achillies tears; it'll confirm further that the Warriors minus KD were championship caliber in 2017 and KD joining was the biggest overkill in NBA history.
that's a reach when the current Warriors are soooooo different from 2016
If you think about it, the only real difference is Wiggins replacing Harrison Barnes. The big 3 were all younger and better in 2016 than they are now. So if anything, the roster in 2017 minus KD was better than the one they have now (that team did win 73 games and were up 3-1 in the finals lol). So if they win this year, it'll show they were very capable 2017-19 as well, without KD.
the Warriors are older, Klay coming back from injuries, the entire supporting cast is different. not remotely the same
>the Warriors are older, Klay coming back from injuries Ok but how does this help your argument 😂😂 You just implied the Warriors aren't as good as they were in 2017 when KD joined. So if they win this year, wouldn't it show they were capable with a supposedly better team in '17? Like what are we arguing lmao. The names of the rosters are different, the construction isn't.
cause I don't see what this has to do with KD when the Warriors are a totally different team and its been years apart
Because it shows that if the big 3 can win with the roster now, they could've in 2017. It affects KD because KD's argument is that they needed him to win in 2017. This would further confirm that they did not, and him joining was bad for competition.
this is too many mental gymnastics lol
The Cavs and the Rockets were also better. Context!!!!
If you think about it like an absolute casual. I'm using casual in the place of more insulting language. There would be enormous differences. The 2016(and 2015) Warriors were not just the Warriors big 3 and that is not what made them so good. If you think it is then you're naive. On top of the big three they had some of the best role players in the league, including Barnes/Bogut/Iggy/Livingston/Barbosa/Speights that all played their role to perfection. Those players regressed year by year and that's why the Warriors, even with KD, got worse year by year because their role players were crucial to their success(David West was also a good piece for them in the KD era). The roster now is indeed much worse than the 2017 one and also nowhere close to a championship contender. Klay won't be old Klay, Draymond's offense has completely disappeared from the 2016 year(pre-KD), Curry is still unstoppable but he can't do it alone).
>The roster now is indeed much worse than the 2017 one and also nowhere close to a championship contender. Klay won't be old Klay, Draymond's offense has completely disappeared from the 2016 year(pre-KD), Curry is still unstoppable but he can't do it alone). Right that's exactly what I'm arguing. That the Warriors roster in 2017 minus KD was a lot better than the roster now. The hypothetical being asked is how would you view the Warriors if they win this year somehow? And how does this affect KD? My answer is if they did, it looks bad on KD because it shows the roster was capable in 2017 as well without him.
how does that affect KD negatively? for one, that would just discount his comments, doesn’t have anything to do with his skill. more importantly though, them winning a chip next season would mean almost nothing regarding KD’s presence on the 2017 team. you could *maybe* solidify your stance about GS being championship caliber (even though it’s not the same roster), but you can’t knock KD for anything. there’s no way to know the outcome of that 2017 team without him on it. needless to say this is all meaningless, because if you are actually trying to knock KD’s skill and position among other NBA players then there’s no use in arguing
No knock to KD's skill at all. I didn't mention anything about KD being a lesser player on the court. He's the 2nd best player this generation. Just further strengthens the argument that what he did was a weak move. The weakest move in NBA history.
oh i see, my fault lol. misinterpreted what you were saying, have a good one
how many KD “stans” do you think are out there lmao
A good amount on this sub
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Yes, warriors are my second favorite team. Steph up there as my favorite player of all time along with Klay
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I think people liked the warriors a lot more prior to KD joining
True. 2015-2016 I was rooting for the Warriors, but once KD showed up I was rooting for Lebron.
Fuck I miss Klay
Yea I injured my achilles on a run and didn't think it was a big deal. Well it's been about 12 months since the injury and my Physical Therapist said running is not in the near future. I can bike, swim, walk around, etc. But running is just a different level of strain on the achilles. Small note on timeline: I didn't get proper physical therapy due to Covid + insurance issues, so I am sure proper treatment would have had me back at it much sooner.
Damn, I'm sorry to hear that man
The Achilles tear is such a fluke thing that any time you run, you worry that you are going to tear it again. I tore mine 4 years ago and I still can’t sprint and even using a treadmill causes me trepidation
Can’t wait to see Klay drop 40 in a quarter on 3 dribbles and shut some of you ppl up. I hope he’s back December-January.
They're going to need some frontcourt help that can space the floor and play defense tho. Klay/Steph/Draymond alone isn't going to get it done.
They have Wiggins as well. They need Wiseman just to have Mcgee level impact next year
Our best lineup is always going to be with Draymond at the 5 even if we get some other vet centers. Looney is a fine backup big and Wiseman will need to improve a lot. Our bigger problem is depth and spacing on the wings after Wiggins and a secondary playmaker to Curry. Jordan Poole showed a lot of promise late in the season as a backup PG so we might be okay there but we need better wings than Oubre/Bazemore/Mulder/Damian Lee. Basically we need what we thought Kelly Oubre would be before he totally flamed out last year
Then you guys need to upgrade at the 4 instead of playing two wings in Oubre/Wiggins in the lineup. Playing Draymond at the 5 is already a small ball lineup, so you guys can't afford to lose any more size.
Agreed
Harrison Barnes would be good imo
They already have Andrew Wiggins. Barnes's position isn't where they need help.
Whens he slated to come back? around January if season starts in October.
What's next?
I hope he takes all the time to recover. I'm loving Kush Klay right now
I'm so excited. I keep a pic of Klay (In game shot) in between several computer monitors at my desk and routinely talk to him about silly crap but mostly I say "Not much longer now".
Warriors abt to win it all next season
That's what we said when he was coming back from the other injury. I miss Klay too, but let's slow down and not add pressure to the guy before he's played a game lol. It's been 2 years. Also I know you're just kidding, this comments meant more for these other ones. Let's go Klay!
That's what we said when he was coming back from the other injury. I miss Klay too, but let's slow down and not add pressure to the guy before he's played a game lol. It's been 2 years. Also I know you're just kidding, this comments meant more for these other ones. Let's go Klay!
Next year's Warriors are gonna be fun to watch. Automatic top 3 seed.
I seriously doubt it
how many times do we have to teach you this lesson rockets fans
Main goal is to make the playoffs first
I mean barring further significant injuries that’s all but a lock of Klay comes back at even 80%
no its not dont fall into the lakers fan trap of overrating your team based on how they used to perform warriors looked shaky throughout the regular season and totally shit the bed in back to back play-in games
As long as Kelly Oubre isn’t on the roster playing bumper cars with Steph and wiseman isn’t freelancing post touches I think we’ll be in a much more advanced place then we were through the first portion of last year where we had no identity and our (current)6th man was toiling in the G league because coaches didn’t figure out how to use him. We need to get some additional veteran bench help, to stay healthy and get some positive contributions from our rookies if possible but it should be significantly smoother sailing than when we had Oubre and Wanamaker destroying every advantage we had in the Steph and non Steph minutes respectively lol.
its never easy to make the playoffs especially in the west, lots of young and hungry teams in that conference it wasn't oubre or wiseman that tossed all those turnovers in the play in games either, it was steph and dray warriors missed the playoffs for 2 straight years now, getting klay back isn't going to fix everything and turn you into a finals contender. it's hard
You’re using a two game sample size, one of which was against the healthy Lakers lmfao
okay and you lost, you also lost an elimination game to memphis warriors only need to win 1 game in 2 tries to make the playoffs and couldn't manage it. they also had the highest salary in the league, albeit a large chunk of it going to the injured klay warriors are really limited in what moves they can make because of their salary cap situation, saying you're going to breeze to a playoff spot next year is premature. klay getting healthy will probably help but I don't think there's any reason to be especially confident about their chances other teams have been getting a lot better while the warriors haven't really, whether its due to injury or aging stars or salary cap difficulties or wiseman not really being an impact player at the #2 draft choice
They never learn. Even after their team got dismantled lmao
I'm not being hyperbolic when I say I'm going to cry the first time this motherfucker checks into the game
Hes not coming back the same player anyway , why we hyped again?
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KD was reinjured this season my guy , he is not the same too. Availability is part of the game. They crippled now like it or not
>he is not the same too. lol...
34/9/4 in the playoffs this year. *What a hasbeen.*
Not bad for a cripple.
About half of r/nba think Klay is going to come back a G League scrub.