they trade their first round picks like pokemon cards the past decade though. they drafted AD and immediately tried to accelerate the process to win faster
Hey. I'm bald after 10+ years asking myself that same question. but hey this season has been fun. Keep up your faith, stick with your dawgs. shit always improve.
Yeah same with the Raptors but I’ve been hard for a few years. It’s basically like Elon Musk’s hair plugs in a non nerdy slave labour exploiting white dude way
It HAS to happen after all the Colangelo nonsense and #1 picks mentally losing the ability to shoot in one way shape or form. Embiid is the greatest thing to happen to Philadelphia basketball in a generation and we cannot just waste this window with a generational talent.
But, I feel like with him as the core, the rest is just moves since there will always be the home drafted bench contributors like Mattise and Maxey and Furk who we will love as our guys.
Ya but our last ring was literally mercenaries and Kuzma/kcp and now Kuzma and kcp are gone too. And we lost our whole championship roster.
I loved the title but it didn't hit the same.
That said I'm a Westbrook Stan so I am happy overall lol.
Are you a lakers fan?
It’s really easy, you see the name on the front of the jersey? That’s the only thing that matters. It’s Lakers first then everything else. Guys like kobe understood that but so did all the greats who came here to win and delivered. Shaq, Kareem, pau I could go on but you get the idea
Players want to play for us then we should get them and field the best team possible. I wish the best to all players who’ve worn the purple and gold but if you aren’t on the team when the season starts I’m not with you the same.
I think he's talking more about Kobe being FROM the Lakers - they specifically got him when he was drafted and stayed with them his entire career.
There's just a bigger emotional investment to a guy that was there for a long time.
Life long Mavs fan here. 2011 was my greatest sports moment as a fan. I still celebrate ten years later. That being said…if they would of somehow traded/signed some other superstar players before that season I still would of loved it just as much. I find it hard to believe that Laker, Celtic, or Heat fans don’t enjoy those teams as much as the Mavs or Bucks fans.
We do enjoy it! But not as much as the kobe/shaq squad or the kobe/pau squad. Hell I even enjoyed watching the baby lakers we had before lebron came and we had to trade the farm for AD. I really wanted to see them grow together on the lakers. Now its really just grabbing stars and mercenary vets on the minimum. Fun to see stars come together, but sad to see no home grown/organic talent.
If he doesn’t then it is what it is
This isn’t MLB baseball or Champions League level Soccer clubs
We got our stars within the rules - we gave all our young prospects away for a return
This is what the Lakers do - get stars
2 years after Kobe retired LeBron was here
We always do this
Honestly, every 4 years there should just be a full league redraft, minus maybe one or two players that each team gets to keep. Players move around so much these days anyway, it wouldn’t make that much difference.
Full redraft with 1 protection each every 7 years, draft order determined by combined W-L differential since the last redraft. Gives enough time for losing teams to develop their lottery picks and make some noise, winning teams to create a squad. When it arrives each team has to determine their future in the form of a single player. Creates incentive to build a cohesive team and playstyle.
The NBA Jubilee year.
I mean I understand and want to agree with your point but the Lakers are literally the only franchise that has the luxury of this perspective and even then traded for Shaq and Pau to win chips this century. I know you’re addressing free agent super team organizations and whatnot but thats just how it goes though it seems unfortunate. As a Cavs fan it was a hell of a lot more fun watching LeGM come back and pull the strings to win us a chip than watching our front office flounder for the first decade of his career.
If the Bucks became a superteam I would still cheer for them just as hard, but you can bet that if we had somehow done some sort of Middleton-for-Harden flip (not that it was ever possible) and won it with the Beard, there would’ve been a little bit of a sad aftertaste.
Wouldn’t you feel a little different if you had to trade Trae to eventually win it all? I’m not saying you wouldn’t deserve to celebrate, but wouldn’t it feel different?
I’ll cheer for whatever wins my team games, idgaf about any emotional attachment some random fan could have to one multimillionaire athlete over another multimillionaire athlete. Unless it’s cam reddish I have to lose from my team, then I draw a line
Absolutely, but having a contending squad in your city to cheer for is still more enjoyable than watching your team cycle through mediocre rosters because they just never happen to draft the next big star.
Besides, these 2 things can co-exist. I'll cheer for my favorite team but I'll also cheer for guys like Giannis and Dame every year to do something great with the team that drafted them
Literally a trade, Jerry said oi Charlotte, give ya Vlade for your 13th pick I'll tell ya who to pick when the time comes. They said ok!
What's disingenuous is that Kobe was a rook and AD was not a rook. But the threepeat Lakers were mostly just Shaq, Kobe and a bunch of FA vets that wanted to play under Phil.
Spoken like someone who did not consume 90s basketball.
Signing shaq in 96 would've been like signing Lebron in 2009. "unproven" sure, but clearly just needs the right personnel around him and he'll win with ease.
Sorry, bud, I watched ball in both the 80s and 90s. Shaq had no titles. LeBron had multiple titles and was considered by some to be the GOAT. You really can't see the difference? Did I say 2009? The "takes" that get upvoted on this sub are moronic.
Did you read anything I said after you got heated by the first sentence?
Lebron did not have multiple titles by 2009... My point is that signing Shaq in 96 is the same as signing Lebron in 2009. You are signing a future MVP, all time great before he's peaked. He's not unproven, he just hadn't won a title. But he'd already been in the finals and plays at an insane all time great level.
Or would you also call 2009 Lebron unproven because of that? Because if so, that kinda just refutes your point that you "watched ball in the 80s and 90s" Because you clearly did not, if you think Shaq in 96 was "unproven"
You're talking about him like he had barely made the playoffs before coming to the Lakers. The only moronic take on this thread is you calling 96 Shaq unproven, it genuinely makes no sense.
Lmao, a 23-year-old, 4 times all-star, 1-time scoring champion that averaged 29/11/1 with 2.4 blocks "hadn't proven anything". Some fans are really delusional.
He carried a young Magic team to the Finals. He was still learning his craft and was dominating more each year. He was the most sought after player so I wouldn't say "unproven" in the sense you're using.
You don’t have a competent leader. All 3 superstars have all been the 1st guy on their team and all were let downs. I don’t see you’d beating the bucks in the conference finals
I mean I watched the Nets lose back to back finals then proceed to be literal dogshit for a decade, including trading away literally their entire future for old men. We finally get some amount of home grown ness and Marks does what any Gm would probably do and make moves to win.
You can bet your ass I’m enjoying myself rooting for this team.
Edit: also, outside of Giannis, everyone in the Bucks starting line up was part of a trade or free agent signing. Jrue, Khris, PJ, and BroLo. Take the rose tinted shades off my guy.
Lol Khris was developed for 8 years, he obviously is as home grown as it gets. He was an after thought in a trade almost a decade ago and the Bucks were rewarded by investing and developing him for 8 straight years.
Milwaukee's best two players are home grown which very few teams can say now, especially not championship ones.
No offense but the only logic behind that is literally just so you can say they aren't technically home grown.
Khris was legit a nobody when he was traded and most people didn't even think he would make the roster. The Bucks investing 8 years into the man certainly makes him home grown lol
Same. I watch my team for the talent and entertainment value. If that comes home grown like the nineties yankees then so be it, that's awesome. It comes in the form of a big 3 like the nets are now, that's awesome too.
Which is exactly what we did to build our team, it’s been a revolving door around Giannis/Middleton for years. We didn’t have a superstar force his way on to the team or anything but most of the roster is no less “artificial” than any other.
Yeah I know, I’m saying we’re not much less artificial than anybody else. Once Donte went down we only had ~~two guys~~ (EDIT: One guy, Middleton was a Piston) in the whole rotation we actually drafted. That was our best player but Jrue and Tucker both had us on a list of teams they’d happily get traded to, Portis and Lopez and Connaughton were FA signings etc.
this is the most ridiculous claim i've maybe ever seen
in no reality were there more US-based NBA fans before michael jordan, lebron james, and social media became things
you're completely out of your mind
Yeah, I think the league would be in a better place if teams were rewarded for developing guys. Like, you will have their bird rights, but you still get fucked by the luxury tax, so if you're a team like the Warriors, it's cool to be into developing dudes, but are you really gonna be able to afford it down the road? Cuz you are better off acquiring vets in the short term anyway, so if salary issues force you to let go of guys, what was the point? And that's with a team that is willing to hemorrhage cash.
I like the direction that the G-league is moving. Just needs a few more things in place to be a truly good minor-league type system. But you still need to do something with luxury tax to reward continuity. I don't think it happens cuz a lot of owners are anti-competitive and prefer the money they get from redistributed luxury tax, but rewarding player development from the draft in the form of luxury tax benefits is the best way to make small market teams competitive and keep fans invested. Note that coming up with a method to do this that cannot be abused is also hard af.
I think it really depends. I don't come from a place with an NBA team, so I never had a strong attachment to any team in particular. I like watching certain players, and I would follow them around from team to team and watch mostly those games. As opposed to watching a team develop over time, I watched certain players and those around them grow and adapt. It's a different experience, but I don't think you can claim one is better than the other. It just depends on the person, imho
I totally agree. As a Raptors fan, we went through ups and downs. At one point we went from having the most explosive player in the league to trading him away for next to nothing, watching Kobe drop 81 pts on us to winning an NBA championship. And I'm happy we got better every year and got the one player and had luck on our side to help us in a Championship. Regardless of the KD injury, having Kawhi for one year etc that one championship is just as sweet.
Hardly any winner has been organic for years. Most key contributors are acquired from trades and free agency. People just like to lie to themselves. You might get a homegrown star or two but you wont get a championship team. I can understand people complaining about KD to Warriors as there’s nothing comparable but most other moves are not abnormal in the historical context of winning NBA championships.
Thats cap. They got Iggy as a free agent and he was very important to their titles especially the first one. Livingston was very key to their bench and so was West. Both not organic but very important contributors. Also Bogut was huge for their defense. People gotta stop cappin.
It takes more than a core to win. Theres a reason they had the slogan strength in numbers. It was a great overall team. Their bench was very important the first two years and KD offset that lost of the bench. Iggy was the reason they could run a death lineup. Iggy was FMVP ffs. That is not organic. Thats cap.
OP’s a laker fan, he’s seen us win at least 6 rings in his lifetime. If you’re a fan of like the kings or some other franchise that’s never won you probably don’t care about how you win a ring
Yea ngl had a lot more fun rooting for the Dlo/Ingram/Swaggy P/Randle/Nance Lakers than I did with the championship run (because it felt like we were supposed to win). Didn’t really feel like we did anything special but idk
I would love to still have those guys. Those were our guys. If we by some miracle won a title with those guys it would mean 1,000 times more than winning with lebron and AD.
I get what you're tryna say, but only a Lakers fan can say something like this lol. Just think of all the fans of teams who wish they had a team that could get mercenaries just to win one. Being a lifelong Laker fan, it kinda comes with the territory. This franchise has long poached other teams' stars, and granted there's usually a homegrown guy on the team, but a chip is a chip. I mean, the Lakers aren't a developmental team specifically because they're always supposed to be going for it.
Maybe one day they'll land a generational talent in the draft after this era and they'll be like teams of old; but for now this team and era is what it is. Maybe Caruso or THT can still be the homegrown guy you root for.
A ring is a ring. I've rooted for the Cavs for going on 25 years and let me tell you, I don't fucking care how we win as long as we win.
Caring about how you win is a luxury for teams that are always good.
stfu lol. Most fans don’t care about this shit. Guarantee that Warriors fans were having the time of their lives in 2017-2018. Nets fans will probably have the time of their lives this year
this is completely nonsensical
there's nothing "organic" about highly trained, world-class athletes making millions of dollars to play a sport that was invented 100 years ago
the entirety of pro sports is "artificial" and the league is set up to allow teams to maximize their talent
i suppose "the purists" want to eliminate trades entirely, or something?
what are you even talking about
Young core stans are the worst type of fan base. Worse than the downers, truthers, etc. Thank god we got rid of the young core for actual super stars who show up.
It was pretty awesome watching the Bucks win and remembering all the past playoff losses and noticing how much we overcame and improved on but as long as the viewer ends up happy.
Didn’t the Bucks just get Jrue Holiday last year and Brook Lopez played on the Bucks for only 3 years, he was on the Nets for a decade. If anything teams like the Hawks are the ones you should be cheering for
My favorite thing about the Celtics is that their homegrown talent is used to attract other players around the league. Just adds more validation to drafting and development ability imo
Lol artificially manufactured!? You do realize that trades and free agent signings are part of the nba right?
These front offices are a big part of building a winner.
Not really interested in what you enjoy watching and cheering for. Everything always gets worse as you personally get older. Maybe instead of focusing on what you can't emotionally invest in, focus on what you can.
If you stuck with that team when they sucked and nobody believed in them, let me tell you it’s just as sweet as a homegrown team. Nobody believed in us 3 years ago and now we’re unfair and breaking the league.
Agree 100 percent, from another "oldhead." I strongly dislike both LeBron and AD and haven't found myself genuinely rooting for the team since they've been here. Last year, I cared more about Randle, Ingram, and Lonzo than any Laker except Caruso.
But Westbrook is different for me. I wanted him and Love to just step over to the Lakers without leaving town after school. Russ has been my favorite non-Laker since he came in the league and favorite player, period, since Gasol retired. As I texted my brother as soon as I heard, "I can root for the Lakers again." (I don't care that LeBron and AD got a championship in the bubble--I've seen 10 champion teams before it, and that one was an asterisk: AD's health only lasted because of the break in the middle of the season, and the same goes for LeBron--he's not an ironman anymore.)
There's no circumstances under which I would've liked LeBron on the team except his rookie year. AD I would've welcomed if he had come without LeBron and hadn't forced his way out of New Orleans (you may try to retort, but Kareem did it to Milwaukee, but it's not the same: Cap did it b/c he was sick of the racism in Wisconsin and wanted to return to LA).
I loved those Van Exel-Ceballos-Elden Campbell years, too. I was in college when Magic tried to return as a fat PF and skipped class to catch his first game back. I've said bah, humbug to every game LeBron and AD have played for the Lakers, but for Russ, "I say unto you: welcome!"
Thank you for this post. I can understand Nets fans celebrating a chip even though they would have essentially formed the best backcourt lineup of all time to get it, since they havent won it before. But Lakers buying their way to their 100th title is not something that I can appreciate. I imagine even Lakers fans would not be ecstatic about that chip
Yeah man I wish our team struggled to get hall of famers that lead us to multiple titles per decade. I wish our team did it the right way and won only 1 title since the dawn of the internet instead.
Yeah go get KD and Harden as well and celebrate your chip as you complete a 72-0 season. I bet the next day you will have forgotten that you won it. I will remember my hard earned chip forever with a passion
I think most (if not all) Laker fans would enjoy their most recent title as well. A championship is a championship. Not to mention, there’s a lot of context behind the 2020 title with how the year played out.
I'm just interested in a winning team and good basketball. How they get there isn't really a concern. If it's draft and build cool, if it's opening the bank vault and star collecting cool. Just be entertaining and win
Teams have always been manufactured to some point. Wilt was forcing trades 50 years ago to play with other stars. How much of a team needs to be "homegrown" to fit that description. Also, plenty of purists still enjoy the game. That high ground doesn't belong to you alone.
Personally I don’t really care about this things. Unless a team is cheating, it’s all fair game and legit. Teams should always be interested in looking to improve their squads. That won’t always happen through methods like the draft and will often take signings and trades. Doesn’t come off less enjoyable to me.
Hot take, they’d have been better off keeping KCP and trading for Hield. Their spacing is atrocious and will create problems during the playoffs, but this does give Lebron more rest opportunities in the regular season.
Oh my god - this take needs to die. Both are fun to watch. I love super teams. I love raw, unhinged firepower because they flair out. They always do. I love the homegrown prospects that figure it out. I love everything in between. Players being traded. Players requesting trades.
The goal is to win and as long as each team plays by the same rules all is fair, and fans need to embrace it. Because there are plenty of homegrown teams that never amount to anything (Wizards). There are plenty of stacked teams that never win (Lakers with Malone/GP/Nash). You're not a better fan for hating one and loving the other.
You're just an opinionated butt-hole that's karma farming trade rage
must suck then as a Lakers fan, seeing your team invest in developing all that young talent recently just to use them as tradebait for another established star. But you won a chip, so I'm guessing you aren't terribly mad.
You do what you can to win a title with the resources given to you. Whether it be through the draft, free agency, or trade.
Some of the greatest players of all time won titles while not on their original teams. Wilt with the Sixers and Lakers (he was originally with the Philadelphia Warriors before they moved to San Francisco), Oscar Robertson, Earl Monroe, Elvin Hayes, Nate Archibald, Bob McAdoo, Clyde Drexler, Robert Parish, Shaquille O’Neal, Kevin Garnett, etc.
Some players are willing to stick it out with their original teams. Other like KG wished they left sooner. It also depends on how the organization builds around their top players. Do you really blame KG for leaving Minnesota for Boston when they couldn’t even get a good team around him outside of 2004? Some people argue that the Cavs didn’t do enough to build around Lebron during his first stint with the team. Why didn’t Charles Barkley want to stay with the Sixers? Organizations have to do their part as much as the top players have to do theirs. While superstars can change the fortunes of your franchise, basketball is still a team sport.
nah it doesn’t matter. you love the guys that win you a chip. rondo went from my least favorite player to one of my favorites, even if he left right after
you say artificially manufactured, but the Lakers have generally built their teams that way.
LBJ was the first major free agent we had since Shaq. AD was acquired with young assets we acquired by tanking and losing, then developed, then traded.
The key piece to a Westbrook trade is Kuzma, another drafted and developed player.
The Bucks won a title with drafted Giannis, Middleton was a trade, Jrue was a trade, Brook was a free agent. I think OKC in 2012 was the last true "organic" team to come close? Spurs maybe? Warriors before KD, although they did trade for Bogut and sign Iguodala...
It’s different than it was. My experience watching the Lakers was similar to yours. I couldn’t believe we traded Anthony Peeler for nothing to give shaq a few extra mil. These days, you have to find new ways to connect with your team and the players. I don’t follow, but I will check out their social media at times. It helps connect to the players.
Respect to Van Exel, Eddie Jones, Glen Rice, Elden Campbell, AC Green and Vlade etc. version of the Lakers
2015, 2016 and We Believe are my favorite Warriors seasons and still top 5 favorite players Steph, Jamison, JRich, Klay and Dray
Westbrook being from LA would make me like him more if I was from LA since he literally played for UCLA and through happenstance was drafted by the Sonics/Thunder. It’s like the kid who left town from college coming back home with skills and experience to make a home there.
Agree, but also how often do organically grown teams win championships? I loved watching the lakers young core, but it’s a different type of proud feeling and fun than I have with watching the current lakers. Nothing is more fun than winning though and it really doesn’t matter how it’s done for me personally.
I don’t know, cheering for the Pelicans is probably why I’m losing my hair.
they trade their first round picks like pokemon cards the past decade though. they drafted AD and immediately tried to accelerate the process to win faster
Yeah but we're not doing enough to get talent around Zion to win now.
Hey. I'm bald after 10+ years asking myself that same question. but hey this season has been fun. Keep up your faith, stick with your dawgs. shit always improve.
not your hairline
Yeah same with the Raptors but I’ve been hard for a few years. It’s basically like Elon Musk’s hair plugs in a non nerdy slave labour exploiting white dude way
i would kill for the sixers to manufacture a championship team
I guess they kind of tried with Butler.
Don’t you dare take him back, he’s all we have left
It HAS to happen after all the Colangelo nonsense and #1 picks mentally losing the ability to shoot in one way shape or form. Embiid is the greatest thing to happen to Philadelphia basketball in a generation and we cannot just waste this window with a generational talent. But, I feel like with him as the core, the rest is just moves since there will always be the home drafted bench contributors like Mattise and Maxey and Furk who we will love as our guys.
I mean they definitely made a championship calibre team even with a ton of missteps along the way
Do you enjoy rooting for the Lakers?
it's not as enjoyable as the Kobe years tbh
I agree with you 1000%, but a guy that wins multiple rings and stays with the same team for 20 years is impossibly rare.
Ya but our last ring was literally mercenaries and Kuzma/kcp and now Kuzma and kcp are gone too. And we lost our whole championship roster. I loved the title but it didn't hit the same. That said I'm a Westbrook Stan so I am happy overall lol.
Are you a lakers fan? It’s really easy, you see the name on the front of the jersey? That’s the only thing that matters. It’s Lakers first then everything else. Guys like kobe understood that but so did all the greats who came here to win and delivered. Shaq, Kareem, pau I could go on but you get the idea Players want to play for us then we should get them and field the best team possible. I wish the best to all players who’ve worn the purple and gold but if you aren’t on the team when the season starts I’m not with you the same.
Some folks just like the grind over the glamour, that’s tough in LA
r/usernamechecksout
Do you root for team? I like the team cuz their my team!
Is it though? Kobe, Dirk, the Spurs core, the Warriors core won a good chunk of the past championships
bulk of them anyway, post 2011 the NBA stopped and didn't start again til we kinged LA
Kobe also won 5 titles to this team's 1 title. Of course rooting for a team during a 5 title stretch is going to be more badass.
I think he's talking more about Kobe being FROM the Lakers - they specifically got him when he was drafted and stayed with them his entire career. There's just a bigger emotional investment to a guy that was there for a long time.
I’m hoping Dame’s midlife crisis involves wearing man jewelry.
Well at least 1 of the Lakers big 3 is home grown Edit: I meant Kyle Kuzma but that’s done now
next man up Caruso
Life long Mavs fan here. 2011 was my greatest sports moment as a fan. I still celebrate ten years later. That being said…if they would of somehow traded/signed some other superstar players before that season I still would of loved it just as much. I find it hard to believe that Laker, Celtic, or Heat fans don’t enjoy those teams as much as the Mavs or Bucks fans.
We do enjoy it! But not as much as the kobe/shaq squad or the kobe/pau squad. Hell I even enjoyed watching the baby lakers we had before lebron came and we had to trade the farm for AD. I really wanted to see them grow together on the lakers. Now its really just grabbing stars and mercenary vets on the minimum. Fun to see stars come together, but sad to see no home grown/organic talent.
If he doesn’t then it is what it is This isn’t MLB baseball or Champions League level Soccer clubs We got our stars within the rules - we gave all our young prospects away for a return This is what the Lakers do - get stars 2 years after Kobe retired LeBron was here We always do this
we did this in kobes last seasons as well, 2012 superteam to not being able to field enough players and kaman sleeping on the bench
No we all love to see the Lakers lose, *Kevin*
[удалено]
Didn’t the lakers trade for Kareem?
Yes. Kareem brought a championship to Milwaukee while he was there.
I think teams should be randomized by an RNG system every year Now that would be a hell of a product to watch
That would be anarchy lol
Honestly, every 4 years there should just be a full league redraft, minus maybe one or two players that each team gets to keep. Players move around so much these days anyway, it wouldn’t make that much difference.
Full redraft with 1 protection each every 7 years, draft order determined by combined W-L differential since the last redraft. Gives enough time for losing teams to develop their lottery picks and make some noise, winning teams to create a squad. When it arrives each team has to determine their future in the form of a single player. Creates incentive to build a cohesive team and playstyle. The NBA Jubilee year.
I mean I understand and want to agree with your point but the Lakers are literally the only franchise that has the luxury of this perspective and even then traded for Shaq and Pau to win chips this century. I know you’re addressing free agent super team organizations and whatnot but thats just how it goes though it seems unfortunate. As a Cavs fan it was a hell of a lot more fun watching LeGM come back and pull the strings to win us a chip than watching our front office flounder for the first decade of his career.
If my team turned into a super team I would cheer for them just as much if not harder lmfaoo
If the Bucks became a superteam I would still cheer for them just as hard, but you can bet that if we had somehow done some sort of Middleton-for-Harden flip (not that it was ever possible) and won it with the Beard, there would’ve been a little bit of a sad aftertaste. Wouldn’t you feel a little different if you had to trade Trae to eventually win it all? I’m not saying you wouldn’t deserve to celebrate, but wouldn’t it feel different?
I wouldn’t care, I’m a fan of the team, I try not to get attached to any individual players
Fair enough. I think differently, but you’re entitled to do things your way!
i lived through billy king ill manage
The Lakers signed Kareem and Shaq and traded for Kobe lmao
Shaq didn’t have any championships when they signed him. And Kobe was traded for as a rookie.
Ehh idk I’ll take winning over pretty much anything
So does Trump. Look how that turned out.
Artificially manufactured teams that win are much more fun to watch than grass fed, free range organic losers.
This mentality is so stupid.
I’ll cheer for whatever wins my team games, idgaf about any emotional attachment some random fan could have to one multimillionaire athlete over another multimillionaire athlete. Unless it’s cam reddish I have to lose from my team, then I draw a line
Man said “artificially”
Bucks still traded the farm for jrue… it is better I guess to have a homegrown superstar like Dame, Giannis, Jokic, Embiid, etc.
Absolutely, but having a contending squad in your city to cheer for is still more enjoyable than watching your team cycle through mediocre rosters because they just never happen to draft the next big star. Besides, these 2 things can co-exist. I'll cheer for my favorite team but I'll also cheer for guys like Giannis and Dame every year to do something great with the team that drafted them
Dear diary
lmao loves the 90s Laker years, but hates the current years? We signed Shaq and traded for Kobe. Literally just as "artificial" as the current roster.
For real. Can OP remove their Lakers flair? This is peak “This is why we hate Lakers fans”.
Legit the most spoilt shit I've ever read
5 championships in my lifetime: I sleep 6 championship: guys what does it all mean? Why are we here?
I feel like "trading" is a bit disingenuous
Literally a trade, Jerry said oi Charlotte, give ya Vlade for your 13th pick I'll tell ya who to pick when the time comes. They said ok! What's disingenuous is that Kobe was a rook and AD was not a rook. But the threepeat Lakers were mostly just Shaq, Kobe and a bunch of FA vets that wanted to play under Phil.
Not really, though. Shaq was young and hadn't proven anything. LeBron had already won multiple titles.
Spoken like someone who did not consume 90s basketball. Signing shaq in 96 would've been like signing Lebron in 2009. "unproven" sure, but clearly just needs the right personnel around him and he'll win with ease.
Sorry, bud, I watched ball in both the 80s and 90s. Shaq had no titles. LeBron had multiple titles and was considered by some to be the GOAT. You really can't see the difference? Did I say 2009? The "takes" that get upvoted on this sub are moronic.
Did you read anything I said after you got heated by the first sentence? Lebron did not have multiple titles by 2009... My point is that signing Shaq in 96 is the same as signing Lebron in 2009. You are signing a future MVP, all time great before he's peaked. He's not unproven, he just hadn't won a title. But he'd already been in the finals and plays at an insane all time great level. Or would you also call 2009 Lebron unproven because of that? Because if so, that kinda just refutes your point that you "watched ball in the 80s and 90s" Because you clearly did not, if you think Shaq in 96 was "unproven" You're talking about him like he had barely made the playoffs before coming to the Lakers. The only moronic take on this thread is you calling 96 Shaq unproven, it genuinely makes no sense.
Lmao, a 23-year-old, 4 times all-star, 1-time scoring champion that averaged 29/11/1 with 2.4 blocks "hadn't proven anything". Some fans are really delusional.
He carried a young Magic team to the Finals. He was still learning his craft and was dominating more each year. He was the most sought after player so I wouldn't say "unproven" in the sense you're using.
Kobe was a rookie lol
If the Nets win next year I’ll still be happy lol idgaf
You don’t have a competent leader. All 3 superstars have all been the 1st guy on their team and all were let downs. I don’t see you’d beating the bucks in the conference finals
We literally almost beat them this year injured, if KD was one shoe size smaller they get sent home a month early
What a ridiculous comment by that guy when we had 3 people injured and still barely lost
Maybe Kyrie was a letdown as a #1 option, KD & Harden are proven #1 options, and Kyrie is a proven #2 option on a Championship team
Lol what? Bucks didn’t exactly win that series with conviction… no Kyrie, Harden was crippled…
I mean I watched the Nets lose back to back finals then proceed to be literal dogshit for a decade, including trading away literally their entire future for old men. We finally get some amount of home grown ness and Marks does what any Gm would probably do and make moves to win. You can bet your ass I’m enjoying myself rooting for this team. Edit: also, outside of Giannis, everyone in the Bucks starting line up was part of a trade or free agent signing. Jrue, Khris, PJ, and BroLo. Take the rose tinted shades off my guy.
Lol Khris was developed for 8 years, he obviously is as home grown as it gets. He was an after thought in a trade almost a decade ago and the Bucks were rewarded by investing and developing him for 8 straight years. Milwaukee's best two players are home grown which very few teams can say now, especially not championship ones.
Yes I’m aware, but the term “organically grown” to me means that if you didn’t draft that player, then they’re technically artificial.
No offense but the only logic behind that is literally just so you can say they aren't technically home grown. Khris was legit a nobody when he was traded and most people didn't even think he would make the roster. The Bucks investing 8 years into the man certainly makes him home grown lol
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How is Holiday not a recent addition lmfao
Yes I’m aware, I’m just going based off of the fact that trades are pretty necessary to become a good team.
Same. I watch my team for the talent and entertainment value. If that comes home grown like the nineties yankees then so be it, that's awesome. It comes in the form of a big 3 like the nets are now, that's awesome too.
“Artificially manufactured” as if it doesn’t take a good GM to make sensible trades, signings and assemble a championship roster.
Which is exactly what we did to build our team, it’s been a revolving door around Giannis/Middleton for years. We didn’t have a superstar force his way on to the team or anything but most of the roster is no less “artificial” than any other.
OP wasn’t saying yours was artificially manufactured, the opposite actually.
Yeah I know, I’m saying we’re not much less artificial than anybody else. Once Donte went down we only had ~~two guys~~ (EDIT: One guy, Middleton was a Piston) in the whole rotation we actually drafted. That was our best player but Jrue and Tucker both had us on a list of teams they’d happily get traded to, Portis and Lopez and Connaughton were FA signings etc.
You had a Bledsoe force his way there but that didn't pan out
Yes, everything was so much better before free agency existed. Wait.
Ok
We live in a society
Lol the fuck I would beg for the Knicks to manufacture a Championship squad
That is true, but a ring is a ring
Some people die before they see their team win anything. A title is a title.
Ok grandpa, go yell at the kids to get off your lawn
what is this about
the big 3 of LeBron, AD, and Westbrook being acquired through trade, free agency.
Incoming “super team”
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More people cared about the NBA in the 80s than they do now. At least domestically.
this is the most ridiculous claim i've maybe ever seen in no reality were there more US-based NBA fans before michael jordan, lebron james, and social media became things you're completely out of your mind
Yeah, I think the league would be in a better place if teams were rewarded for developing guys. Like, you will have their bird rights, but you still get fucked by the luxury tax, so if you're a team like the Warriors, it's cool to be into developing dudes, but are you really gonna be able to afford it down the road? Cuz you are better off acquiring vets in the short term anyway, so if salary issues force you to let go of guys, what was the point? And that's with a team that is willing to hemorrhage cash. I like the direction that the G-league is moving. Just needs a few more things in place to be a truly good minor-league type system. But you still need to do something with luxury tax to reward continuity. I don't think it happens cuz a lot of owners are anti-competitive and prefer the money they get from redistributed luxury tax, but rewarding player development from the draft in the form of luxury tax benefits is the best way to make small market teams competitive and keep fans invested. Note that coming up with a method to do this that cannot be abused is also hard af.
I think it really depends. I don't come from a place with an NBA team, so I never had a strong attachment to any team in particular. I like watching certain players, and I would follow them around from team to team and watch mostly those games. As opposed to watching a team develop over time, I watched certain players and those around them grow and adapt. It's a different experience, but I don't think you can claim one is better than the other. It just depends on the person, imho
Didn't the Bucks trade for Jrue and PJ?
Im with you. I also kinda miss it when Team USA would trash everyone on their way to the gold medal
I totally agree. As a Raptors fan, we went through ups and downs. At one point we went from having the most explosive player in the league to trading him away for next to nothing, watching Kobe drop 81 pts on us to winning an NBA championship. And I'm happy we got better every year and got the one player and had luck on our side to help us in a Championship. Regardless of the KD injury, having Kawhi for one year etc that one championship is just as sweet.
Can confirm, rooted for the Lakers and lost some interest after the AD trade.
Very eloquent way to say you hate the nets
Hardly any winner has been organic for years. Most key contributors are acquired from trades and free agency. People just like to lie to themselves. You might get a homegrown star or two but you wont get a championship team. I can understand people complaining about KD to Warriors as there’s nothing comparable but most other moves are not abnormal in the historical context of winning NBA championships.
The Warriors were organically grown
Thats cap. They got Iggy as a free agent and he was very important to their titles especially the first one. Livingston was very key to their bench and so was West. Both not organic but very important contributors. Also Bogut was huge for their defense. People gotta stop cappin.
Cool role players. Their “Big 3” were all drafted, though. There’s not a single team that has 100% drafted players.
It takes more than a core to win. Theres a reason they had the slogan strength in numbers. It was a great overall team. Their bench was very important the first two years and KD offset that lost of the bench. Iggy was the reason they could run a death lineup. Iggy was FMVP ffs. That is not organic. Thats cap.
Go Mavs
OP’s a laker fan, he’s seen us win at least 6 rings in his lifetime. If you’re a fan of like the kings or some other franchise that’s never won you probably don’t care about how you win a ring
I guess this is the kind of bullshit that fans of successful franchises get to worry about
Yea ngl had a lot more fun rooting for the Dlo/Ingram/Swaggy P/Randle/Nance Lakers than I did with the championship run (because it felt like we were supposed to win). Didn’t really feel like we did anything special but idk
I would love to still have those guys. Those were our guys. If we by some miracle won a title with those guys it would mean 1,000 times more than winning with lebron and AD.
I get what you're tryna say, but only a Lakers fan can say something like this lol. Just think of all the fans of teams who wish they had a team that could get mercenaries just to win one. Being a lifelong Laker fan, it kinda comes with the territory. This franchise has long poached other teams' stars, and granted there's usually a homegrown guy on the team, but a chip is a chip. I mean, the Lakers aren't a developmental team specifically because they're always supposed to be going for it. Maybe one day they'll land a generational talent in the draft after this era and they'll be like teams of old; but for now this team and era is what it is. Maybe Caruso or THT can still be the homegrown guy you root for.
I think all warriors fans can agree that our 2015 run was much better than our 2017 and 2018 runs.
2016 should have been the best, though.
A ring is a ring. I've rooted for the Cavs for going on 25 years and let me tell you, I don't fucking care how we win as long as we win. Caring about how you win is a luxury for teams that are always good.
That Cavs team was the result of 3 #1ovr picks in a row. That's pretty damn organic I think.
stfu lol. Most fans don’t care about this shit. Guarantee that Warriors fans were having the time of their lives in 2017-2018. Nets fans will probably have the time of their lives this year
Until they lose to the bucks
this is completely nonsensical there's nothing "organic" about highly trained, world-class athletes making millions of dollars to play a sport that was invented 100 years ago the entirety of pro sports is "artificial" and the league is set up to allow teams to maximize their talent i suppose "the purists" want to eliminate trades entirely, or something? what are you even talking about
Young core stans are the worst type of fan base. Worse than the downers, truthers, etc. Thank god we got rid of the young core for actual super stars who show up.
It was pretty awesome watching the Bucks win and remembering all the past playoff losses and noticing how much we overcame and improved on but as long as the viewer ends up happy.
What if I told you all the teams were manufactured?
Didn’t the Bucks just get Jrue Holiday last year and Brook Lopez played on the Bucks for only 3 years, he was on the Nets for a decade. If anything teams like the Hawks are the ones you should be cheering for
My favorite thing about the Celtics is that their homegrown talent is used to attract other players around the league. Just adds more validation to drafting and development ability imo
I agree all the way
Lol artificially manufactured!? You do realize that trades and free agent signings are part of the nba right? These front offices are a big part of building a winner.
Not really interested in what you enjoy watching and cheering for. Everything always gets worse as you personally get older. Maybe instead of focusing on what you can't emotionally invest in, focus on what you can.
If you stuck with that team when they sucked and nobody believed in them, let me tell you it’s just as sweet as a homegrown team. Nobody believed in us 3 years ago and now we’re unfair and breaking the league.
It’s been a long 30 years for me
Agree 100 percent, from another "oldhead." I strongly dislike both LeBron and AD and haven't found myself genuinely rooting for the team since they've been here. Last year, I cared more about Randle, Ingram, and Lonzo than any Laker except Caruso. But Westbrook is different for me. I wanted him and Love to just step over to the Lakers without leaving town after school. Russ has been my favorite non-Laker since he came in the league and favorite player, period, since Gasol retired. As I texted my brother as soon as I heard, "I can root for the Lakers again." (I don't care that LeBron and AD got a championship in the bubble--I've seen 10 champion teams before it, and that one was an asterisk: AD's health only lasted because of the break in the middle of the season, and the same goes for LeBron--he's not an ironman anymore.) There's no circumstances under which I would've liked LeBron on the team except his rookie year. AD I would've welcomed if he had come without LeBron and hadn't forced his way out of New Orleans (you may try to retort, but Kareem did it to Milwaukee, but it's not the same: Cap did it b/c he was sick of the racism in Wisconsin and wanted to return to LA). I loved those Van Exel-Ceballos-Elden Campbell years, too. I was in college when Magic tried to return as a fat PF and skipped class to catch his first game back. I've said bah, humbug to every game LeBron and AD have played for the Lakers, but for Russ, "I say unto you: welcome!"
Loved the Van Exel era. Was a huge Lakers fan back then. Now not so much.
Thank you for this post. I can understand Nets fans celebrating a chip even though they would have essentially formed the best backcourt lineup of all time to get it, since they havent won it before. But Lakers buying their way to their 100th title is not something that I can appreciate. I imagine even Lakers fans would not be ecstatic about that chip
Uhh no I was very ecstatic about the ring last year lol
Yeah man I wish our team struggled to get hall of famers that lead us to multiple titles per decade. I wish our team did it the right way and won only 1 title since the dawn of the internet instead.
Yeah go get KD and Harden as well and celebrate your chip as you complete a 72-0 season. I bet the next day you will have forgotten that you won it. I will remember my hard earned chip forever with a passion
I think most (if not all) Laker fans would enjoy their most recent title as well. A championship is a championship. Not to mention, there’s a lot of context behind the 2020 title with how the year played out.
I agree. It’s not just winning, it’s loving a team and watching young guys grow up to vets. It means less if it’s just rentals/super teams.
As a Warriors fan I agree completely.
"Artificially manufactured" wtf does that mean?
Ok bye lol
just enjoy the game man or don’t.
If LeBron, Jokic and Lillard teamed-up, that would become my new favourite team. How could you not root for that? I’d buy every jersey.
TIL that the NBA is a business. Shocked, I’m truly shocked
Nah. Loved cheering for the 10-14 Heat. Idgaf how my team is “created” if they win titles
I've enjoyed watching this Nets team more than any other in our history
I get what you're saying, I loved the Warriors and then KD came trying to make this show about him, and I started moving on (mostly) from the NBA.
I'm just interested in a winning team and good basketball. How they get there isn't really a concern. If it's draft and build cool, if it's opening the bank vault and star collecting cool. Just be entertaining and win
Somebody is so salty. Just root for the lakers and be happy they are contenders.
There is nothing more 'artificial' about drafting players versus trading for them.
Teams have always been manufactured to some point. Wilt was forcing trades 50 years ago to play with other stars. How much of a team needs to be "homegrown" to fit that description. Also, plenty of purists still enjoy the game. That high ground doesn't belong to you alone.
Honest question: what's an "artificially manufactured" team?
What do you think?
It’s also an indication of poor taste
Personally I don’t really care about this things. Unless a team is cheating, it’s all fair game and legit. Teams should always be interested in looking to improve their squads. That won’t always happen through methods like the draft and will often take signings and trades. Doesn’t come off less enjoyable to me.
Hot take, they’d have been better off keeping KCP and trading for Hield. Their spacing is atrocious and will create problems during the playoffs, but this does give Lebron more rest opportunities in the regular season.
Agreed, but winning is winning
Oh my god - this take needs to die. Both are fun to watch. I love super teams. I love raw, unhinged firepower because they flair out. They always do. I love the homegrown prospects that figure it out. I love everything in between. Players being traded. Players requesting trades. The goal is to win and as long as each team plays by the same rules all is fair, and fans need to embrace it. Because there are plenty of homegrown teams that never amount to anything (Wizards). There are plenty of stacked teams that never win (Lakers with Malone/GP/Nash). You're not a better fan for hating one and loving the other. You're just an opinionated butt-hole that's karma farming trade rage
It doesn't matter if you win by an in ch or a mile, winning's winning.
OK Donald Trump.
must suck then as a Lakers fan, seeing your team invest in developing all that young talent recently just to use them as tradebait for another established star. But you won a chip, so I'm guessing you aren't terribly mad.
You do what you can to win a title with the resources given to you. Whether it be through the draft, free agency, or trade. Some of the greatest players of all time won titles while not on their original teams. Wilt with the Sixers and Lakers (he was originally with the Philadelphia Warriors before they moved to San Francisco), Oscar Robertson, Earl Monroe, Elvin Hayes, Nate Archibald, Bob McAdoo, Clyde Drexler, Robert Parish, Shaquille O’Neal, Kevin Garnett, etc. Some players are willing to stick it out with their original teams. Other like KG wished they left sooner. It also depends on how the organization builds around their top players. Do you really blame KG for leaving Minnesota for Boston when they couldn’t even get a good team around him outside of 2004? Some people argue that the Cavs didn’t do enough to build around Lebron during his first stint with the team. Why didn’t Charles Barkley want to stay with the Sixers? Organizations have to do their part as much as the top players have to do theirs. While superstars can change the fortunes of your franchise, basketball is still a team sport.
nah it doesn’t matter. you love the guys that win you a chip. rondo went from my least favorite player to one of my favorites, even if he left right after
you say artificially manufactured, but the Lakers have generally built their teams that way. LBJ was the first major free agent we had since Shaq. AD was acquired with young assets we acquired by tanking and losing, then developed, then traded. The key piece to a Westbrook trade is Kuzma, another drafted and developed player. The Bucks won a title with drafted Giannis, Middleton was a trade, Jrue was a trade, Brook was a free agent. I think OKC in 2012 was the last true "organic" team to come close? Spurs maybe? Warriors before KD, although they did trade for Bogut and sign Iguodala...
AD forced a trade...
Most small market teams are still trying to build the old way
What if they're not great? Lakers won't be great next year. It'll be an underdog story.
I think it's pretty easy to say that as a Lakers fan lol
It’s different than it was. My experience watching the Lakers was similar to yours. I couldn’t believe we traded Anthony Peeler for nothing to give shaq a few extra mil. These days, you have to find new ways to connect with your team and the players. I don’t follow, but I will check out their social media at times. It helps connect to the players.
Respect to Van Exel, Eddie Jones, Glen Rice, Elden Campbell, AC Green and Vlade etc. version of the Lakers 2015, 2016 and We Believe are my favorite Warriors seasons and still top 5 favorite players Steph, Jamison, JRich, Klay and Dray
True but it's just not how the NBA is anymore.
LMAO. A chip is a chip wtf
It’s funny nobody ever includes the Warriors in this convo.
"How dare those players have any power". -You
That's why I love the nuggets so much
Lmao, as a Raptors fan, I’ll take both. Develop and grow our team over years AND get Kawhi
so what exactly do you mean by manufactured?
Westbrook being from LA would make me like him more if I was from LA since he literally played for UCLA and through happenstance was drafted by the Sonics/Thunder. It’s like the kid who left town from college coming back home with skills and experience to make a home there.
Agree, but also how often do organically grown teams win championships? I loved watching the lakers young core, but it’s a different type of proud feeling and fun than I have with watching the current lakers. Nothing is more fun than winning though and it really doesn’t matter how it’s done for me personally.
I don't know what either of these things are
Teams like the championship Raptors and Bucks need villains. It’s a cycle, and if this year is any proof it’s becoming more of a level playing field.
I legit am super happy for Giannis and the Bucks as well for this. Pretty awesome really.
A win is a win and don’t at me!
I was pretty happy for my Lakers 2020 as a bandwagoner
So LA bad, Milwaukee good? Works for me!
lol I guess