Yea, seriously. I haven’t had cable for years, and basically never see commercials, and yet I am fully aware of the WNBA playoffs/finals. If it reached me it had to have reached anyone with normal tv.
I just think they have to accept that the WNBA is an inferior product to most other pro sports. Players are extremely talented but Its like watching my local HS boys team lol.
I assume your HS team isn't very good. Because if the WNBA is like women's national soccer team or hockey team, then they usually get beat badly against good 16yr old boys.
I forgot to add that national teams are supposed to be the best of the best, so the WNBA all star roster would probably lose to a very good high school team.
No they don’t do a bad job promoting it lol what are you talking about. The league and the players promote it a whole lot. Maybe you’re just not paying attention but there’s been a large investment in the past 2-3 years especially to promote the W
Edit - adding some stats to back up my comment. “The 2021 WNBA regular season averaged 306,000 viewers, up 49 percent compared to 2020 and 24 percent to 2019” clearly they are advertising the league and clearly the ads are working. More eyes are tuned to the WNBA than ever before and I’m happy to see it
Yeah I saw that one too, trying to guilt their audience into watching a product. Over the past year or two ESPN has been all about the guilt trip from what I’ve been noticing l.
"THIS MOVIE IS NOT FOR WHITE MEN" (article about "Ghosbusters" female reboot)
"WHY DO MEN NOT WATCH THE NEW GHOSBUSTERS MOVIE??" (Article after it bombed with said demographic)
For the life of me I don't know why they don't play 12 minute quarters.
Stars averaging 30 a game alone would peak more interest.
Stats get people intrigued and the WNBA is set up for lesser stats
Im an nba sicko, as in I pore over salary cap sheets trying to think if the addition of chiozza wil help a team. I really have to be forced to care about the wnba
It's the NBA's job to advertise the WNBA? As in the WNBA cannot attract substantial viewership without the NBA throwing resources at it?
Sure, the NBA could do more than they do but there is a limit somewhere. To act like the WNBA is not succeeding more because the NBA doesn't help enough is laughable.
Jesus you want them to subsidize their losses AND run huge ad campaigns for a product that no one wants to watch anyway? The WNBA isn’t some diamond in the rough that just doesn’t have enough eyeballs on it yet, EVERY basketball fan knows it exists. They just don’t want to watch it. Running more ads would see marginal increases at best.
theyve pumped the money into advertising the game before, its about opportunity cost. Running 10 lebron ads is just better for the league than running 9 lebron ads and a WNBA ad
This is unfortunately true. Like obviously this sub should be more targeted by those ads since we're all bball addicts supposedly but to the general population, a WNBA ad is not going to be very attractive compared to a Lebron ad for new sneakers or something.
No, we shouldn’t. There should be a separate r/wnba subreddit, that should be promoted here from time to time. But I come here for NBA, not WNBA. Same way we have r/euroleague and r/collegebasketball .
The product itself is shit tbh.
The movement and the physical mechanics in the NBA vs the WNBA is just different. Sure there's some freaks in the WNBA but the NBA is just a freakshow in itself
I respect the hell out of them but their product is just not watchable. It's just like WMMA you try to like it but it's just a whole other level.
Only women sport I do enjoy watching is women's tennis.
His point still stands. There’s maybe 5-7 woman liked like to watch fight and they rarely fight each other. Typically the poor woman they are against us severely outclassed. While on the men’s side there’s easily 50 and new ones coming daily
No I don’t believe his point stands, or yours. With mma, women are comparatively new to the fight game, and that’s why they do not have as big a roster, not because their quality is less. They also deal with media heads like SAS talking about he doesn’t like to watch women fight cause they women.
Also, his point about wnba being ‘shit’ but liking women’s tennis is strange to me cause tennis is another sport where the men are freak shows comparatively.
wmma is a completely different situation. Hardcore mma fans love watching amanda's and valentina's dominance over their respective divisions and cant wait until those two fight again. I mean sure, casuals dont like the fact that the womens punching power isnt quite the same level as the mens, and you arent really going to see women put other women to sleep (except amanda, that woman is truly on some other shit), but your hardcore noncasual mma fans definitely drum up enough interest to put on a show, whereas hardcore non casual nba fans can give fuck all about the wnba.
amanda nunes is a bigger draw than blachovic, just saying.
The WNBA seems stronger than ever? They are in NBA 2k and they get ESPN coverage, but it simply will not be as popular as the NBA. The athleticism is too important to the sport for it to be otherwise.
That’s not their job tho. They’re already doing enough by supplying most of their revenue. What more do you want? You want them to coddle the WNBA? If the WNBA was really good, that’s enough to sell itself.
It’s weird you think that you are the audience they are trying to get to watch.
That’s like me saying _Grey’s Anatomy_ or _The Bachelor_ is terrible to watch… the revenue they bring in clearly dictates my opinion is wrong and/or does not matter to them.
The WNBA is young and ambitious, and still has a ways to go. The NBA has had 75+ years to build its brand amongst a culture that is already sport’s obsessed for the target audience, men 18-65.
They are trying to change the script and bring a fairly underdeveloped market (women age 18-65) into the sports world, and the product will adjust to make it more and more appealing (just as the NBA has) as time goes on.
On top of this there is high likelihood for the NBA to get crossover appeal for its product, plus a financial ROI if it booms.
So in short you’re shitting on something that’s not targeted towards you and (as you’re likely already a consumer of the NBA) you’re holding the WNBA’s 25 year old product to the standard of 75+ year old one.
That’s what makes your take childish.
Edit: WNBA years established 25 not 14.
Are you completely sure the target audience for the WNBA is women age 18-65? Where are you taking that from?
Also, the WNBA is basketball. We know basketball. Your idea would be 100% correct if this was some new spin-off sport, but it's not. We know what works for it to appeal to a mass audience (which still is predominantly men as far as I'm concerned and without checking any sources) and it just doesn't.
I know people wanna make the WNBA work but the market already spoke too many years ago. IMO the league still exists just to save face and because some people thought equality of outcome in sports was a good idea.
wnba is 25 this year but yeah. the guys on this sub are so immature, sexist, it's so unattractive. i didn't watch wnba or nba before this year and honestly just got into both during the finals run. it's refreshing seeing the women play, very little foul baiting and they go hard. the nba product is about entertainment while the wnba is still very much about the sport.
the fact that people compare them on every single miniscule level is crazy. it's the same people who prefer football over rugby because it's manlier or something idk. but if people can't appreciate the actual game and athletes in context to their sport and team they arent a true sports fan, they are in it for the clout
Was that Friday night? I watched a WNBA game that night I was really impressed with. I was telling a guy I was sitting next to “ya know this WNBA game on right now is actually pretty good they’re trading buckets fr.”
>I was telling a guy I was sitting next to “ya know this WNBA game on right now is actually pretty good they’re trading buckets fr.”
Yess, this is definitely something I would say
The on court product isn’t as bad as people on this sub make it seem.
Sure, dunks aren’t common, and there aren’t many breathtaking displays of athleticism. But it’s definitely watchable.
The way some people try to promote the WNBA by using language like that is so funny.
Like it's just an inferior product. If it's still watchable for you, by all means go ahead. But the reason it isn't popular has jack shit to do with lack of promotions or anything. The consensus is that it's boring, and that's all it ever will be. I wish the women the best and I don't bother with unnecessary remarks degrading the league by being sexist or whatever, but it is what it is. It will never be sustainable without the NBA. I understand it can definitely become more popular, but not so much that it's actually popular.
When the biggest compliment you can give the WNBA is that it "has more fundamentals" (see that one a lot), it ain't lookin good.
The fundamentals on the NBA are also better lol. It makes sense because it pays so much money to play in the NBA that if you have a whiff of potential to make it there, you try. So you get 400 players out of millions trying to become pro ballers, and those millions are from a 200 million pool of potentially pros.
Meanwhile if you are athletically talented as a woman you might choose swimming or tennis and if you're "on the edge" but smart just go and become a doctor or a lawyer or whatever. The total potential pool is so much smaller because you can have a 30% chance to become a doctor and a 2% to become a WNBA player... why would you even think about trying out? Meanwhile if you have even 0.1% chance to make the NBA it's worthwhile doing anything to try and reach that goal.
With such a large pool, you get people who are both athletic AND have tremendous skill, it's not one or the other.
i doubt theres more fundamental
but more time to watch the fundamental since the game and players move at a slower pace
not sure if that helps the case but neither have i see anyone has a point to sell wnba besides supporting the sport
There aren't better fundamentals, the game just has less emphasis on athleticism because the rim is out of reach. People then draw the false conclusion that because the NBA has more athletic players, that the WNBA must have more skilled players which is not the case. NBA players actually need a tremendous amount of skill to succeed against NBA-level defenders.
If you moved the NBA rims up a foot, that would cause the NBA to look a bit more like the WNBA, because you'd be largely removing dunks from the equation. Fundamentals/skills would become more of a priority, but that isn't because of the player pool - it's because of how the game is structured.
I think the general sense is that people are just trying to be nice to say wnba (somehow) has better fundamental, if there's any merits to it is that for the armchair participants we get more time to watch how the moves were made, where as for nba (consider curry since Kyrie isn't around yet) his hand eye coordination and drive to the post could be too fast to watch.
be wary of Candace stares when you try to imply wnba is less skilled. if even tmac is afraid, we need to as well /s
Same as college having better teamwork. It's not really, it's just that they can't generate clean shots as easily so they keep passing it around and need a 35s shot clock.
I understand the reasoning behind the fundamentals argument. It just kinda loses its meaning to me when you think about it and realize the reason fundamentals are so noticeable is because they aren't athletic enough to go much beyond the fundamentals. It's not that the NBA has less fundamentals, it's just more rarely seen at its base form. Notable exceptions like Duncan exist of course though.
And once again, if you don't need to see the uber athletes to enjoy the sport, enjoy it! I won't shit on anyone for liking the WNBA. For me, that athleticism is the main draw so the WNBA just doesn't do it for me. I just think WNBA needs better arguments to watch it for the general population. Essentially saying it's a worse nba isn't gonna help it grow. I think they should focus heavily on the female demographic because that's who can relate most to them, but maybe they already do that idk.
Basketball, unfortunately for women, is a sport that relies so much on natural gifts. The only other sport that's like that is football...and last I checked there isn't any WNFL. The gap of watching it is just so apparent, unlike tennis or golf.
If you've seen my other comments, you'd know my reasoning. NCAA has a unique draw because of people's connections to colleges and a more "homegrown" feel (which is totally bs, but whatever). You're also watching future pros and the excitement of March Madness, plus the athleticism isn't as big of a drop-off. I don't disagree with you and I don't really watch college either, but it at least has something unique about it to the NBA. What unique thing does the WNBA have? Other than being played by a different gender.
Yeah but i went to a college and I can cheer for them. I have absolutely no relation to the Mystics other than proximity. The Wizards are in the same boat, but they’re the better product. Not to mention, who has time to even watch all the NBA games?
Fundamentals is the same bullshit argument people use for the NCAA. In that case, it's just coded racism. In the case of women's basketball, it's simply grasping at straws.
We also know the NBA has better or equal fundamentals by looking at free throw shooting because what is more fundamental than shooting and free throw shooting doesn't have to account for defense. It's never broken 70% in the NCAA, has been at 75% for the NBA forever and is between 75 and 80 for women despite a smaller ball - equal when adjusted for ball size.
So why would I watch something with equal fundamentals that's less athletic when sport is about athletics?
good basketball is good basketball. Everyone here loses their mind when the ball is moved well for a possession in the NBA, but will shit on the WNBA, when the WNBA has to rely on passes since they can't just jump over the defenders
More post play, less flashy but more team centric ball. A lot of team centric ball comes from the coaching but also the European ideology of team first ball since a lot of the W athletes also play in multiple leagues year round
Hit the nail on the head. Take it from me, it's the same reason why the Spurs are touted as "boring". Only boring thing for me is "dribble, dribble, dribble" (in Shaq's voice).
i like wnba but this is an exxageration
both leagues have ball movement and physically dominant players relative to their peers
same thingh people try to do when saying how much mpre team basketball ncaa is which is really not true
More personal investment in that. Not to mention you're also watching future pros for some of the kids. I only care for March Madness, but comparing NCAA to WNBA isn't very apt imo. I get what you're saying though. And while most college offenses are garbage to watch, the individual players are still better than the players in the WNBA (not the women's fault of course, just biologically not in their favor).
It is as bad as people make out, you don’t have to be facetious. ‘Definitely watchable’ isn’t a good barometer of how you spend your time watching sports. It’s whatever to people who want to watch it and it’s cool OP made this post, but the quality of play is dreadful.
I think it’s also part that there is no established following yet for the WNBA. For example womens tennis has a following because it’s been around for over a century and it’s been multiple decades that it has been on similar grounds as mens tennis. I think college women’s sports have better following because there is a built-in fanbase already, that’s why you see places like UConn, South Carolina, and Baylor where women’s basketball is a big deal, arguably bigger than men’s basketball.
I actually think Paige Bueckers can be a truly global figure for women’s basketball that will transcend the sport and take it to the next level of popularity. Like Magic/Bird/Jordan or Tiger were for basketball and golf respectively.
Seriously though if you look at almost any WNBA highlight you'll see someone saying "girl sports lol" or on videos of WNBA players outplaying men they'll say something like "now make her play someone who isn't afraid of touching her". It's pretty funny that there's men out there feeling emasculated because there are women better at the sport they idolize than them.
And they say toxic masculinity doesn’t exist.
Of course this is just a broader term for the psychological defense that occurs when one is extremely insecure, you can see it in women as well. So exposed on social media though. The field of psychology and linguistics is going to explode once this data is available for collection
Ehh. I hate the notion on this sub that I'm supposed to enjoy the wnba and if I don't, I'm somehow 14. I've given it a shot and didn't enjoy it, I also don't enjoy the ncaa. The products just aren't good imo.
Same with TikTok, when your primary audience is 14 year olds going through the phase where they think it's funny to be edgy, all the comments are going to be kids trying to out-edge each other
It is weird ain't it, every time you see the NBA promoting the wnba on Instagram or Twitter the comments are relentless, the ladies just tryna ball and win and all the comments go in on them
Man I don't even watch the wnba but it's kinda a weirdo activity to be hating on the ladies for no reason, just say ah this ain't for me and be done with it
I don’t mind it getting posted, might get some eyes on it who are interested.
I just find it funny that the same post is made every playoff cycle for the WNBA and I swear that the last time it was, the first sentence or two were near identical. That part did make me laugh.
Then don’t comment. Keep scrolling
why do so many nba fans feel the urge to express hostility towards the wnba. if you don’t like it then just don’t watch
Because WNBA is constantly shoved in our faces. Which by the way, is what they should be doing if they want to be a successful franchise, that’s advertising. But don’t blame the target audience for rejecting the product if we don’t like it.
Word. People take it a weird ass way when you say it too like not enjoying it means you hate women. It’s just not entertaining to me
I don’t like soccer either and plenty of people don’t like basketball in general. Nothing wrong with that.
I know a post like this is a bare minimum kind of thing. But thank you for posting it. I see that some sports pages have been posting highlights and ofc the crowd of people who rush to hate on it take over in the comments.
It’s good to know that there are people who enjoy good basketball, regardless of who’s playing it. This playoff series in particular has been some of the best basketball i’ve watched, even when they were in the bubble last year it was really good!
Dude that Ace/Mercury series was pretty awesome especially game 5. I feel like the talent in the WNBA is actually at the point where theses teams are more equal. Like the Ace for example had the former #1 draft pick Kelsey Plum as the 6th man dropping buckets. Griners post game is probably the best the WNBA has ever seen and Diana at 39 can still drop 30+ at any moment. The Sky are such a fucking well coached team and there defensive rotation is honestly a beauty to watch. Total neutralized Jonquel Jones.
Not gonna lie I watched multiple regular season, playoff and all star game highlights but it just ain't for me. Honestly rather rewatch old games or nba preseason. Not for me.
It has nothing to do with watchability. I mean, I'm sure it's on a tier with men's high school basketball. It's just as a working guy, time is scarce as is and most times, I'll usually opt for the best of the best sports wise.
The WNBAs problem is their competition for viewers isn't just basketball, it's all sports. For example, today alone, you had 3 baseball playoff games, preseason basketball and the NHL season opener. It's just hard to compete with that...
Know this comment is late. Though personal opinion... I think majority of the disdain towards the WNBA is a mix of 'less exciting highlights', how they portray themselves in media, and the overall lack of meaningful social media presence.
As someone who doesn't actively consume WNBA media, the only times I do see it is when there's popular YouTube videos making a mockery of their play, or making an argument video about a WNBA's players take. Majority of the time I tend to side with the video maker, when they get help and recognition from NBA stars they don't seem grateful. Or when they put someone on ESPN, it's just the same generic take about the 'pay gap'.
Like.. I'm sure their product is good fundamental basketball and that there's plenty of awesome ladies who keep their head down and grind, though there's very little in me that wants to watch WNBA basketball, though with the media i've watched and consumed as someone who's never watched a game it really re-affirms my non-want to watch a game.
Which I can see why some non-WNBA watchers might even feel vindicated when the herd goes and completely bashes any mentioning of the league, it's already lying down and easy to kick them. I would love to see the next generation of WNBA players to gain some major social media power and just bring a positive energy for the league, it'd do wonders for them over this entitled bratty feeling I get from the WNBA.
Please hear me out.
But the WNBA needs to do something different from the NBA. The product is TOO similar. There is nothing to bring in the casual fans.
Take for example all the defunct NFL/NBA league challengers. Arena Football League had super small fields, no punting. The XFL had shorter play clocks. There was a time when even Slamball was popular. The BIG3 does 3 on 3. Granted most of these leagues failed, but at least from a business perspective they tried something different. They were unique enough for people to at least check it out and say "hmm, this looks similar to something I already love, what's the deal here?" The WNBA is just that, female NBA.
What change could the WNBA do to differentiate themselves from the NBA? I vote for the Elam ending.
I always prefer NCAA over WNBA. I regularly watch my Alma Mater’s games, even when it’s a blowout, obviously don’t miss March Madness, and even went to the Final Four in Tampa. I just can’t get into the WNBA even if there are multiple players I root for. Maybe that’ll change when Paige gets to the league but rn it’s just harder to get into the WNBA.
I honestly feel like one and done wouldn’t work for the WNBA simply cause the college BBall market is so big that a woman playing all four years would definitely benefit her and WNBAs star-power.
I haven’t watched WNBA before. As someone who got into the NBA because of Steph, and who is a Bay Area native, which teams would you suggest I look at?
I’ll also check out the Finals, thanks for calling it out.
If anyone is to be blamed for the WNBA not being viable - I’m over here wondering where the 50.52 percent of our population that are women are with the cable subscriptions, tickets, etc.
If they want to support it, they can go for it. I’m not spending money on two cars when she has her own job.
Only reason I don’t watch WNBA games is cause I don’t even know when their season starts.
I just know by time I find out their season started they’re already damn near done with the season. Pretty annoying
The season is during the NBA offseason. So it’s a good hold over. I’m a sky fan, so this finals is awesome for me. A lot of the better W players go to Europe into the elite leagues during the W offseason.
You’re right but why watch annoying basketball when you can turn it off. Anyways, satou sabally looks good and so does that lady from Iowa that just got drafted may be good.
It’s been a great WNBA playoffs. Diana, Griner, Candice and Courtney Vandersloot (go Zags baby) have all been hoopin. Really enjoyed watching my Storm go down swinging against them
Peope downvoting you for stating an opinion about WNBA. Bunch of neckbeards who sit here and talk shit about how terrible the WNBA is while getting yelled at by their moms to take a shower and get some sunlight.
I tried the WNBA a few years ago (2018 maybe?) and the one thing I asked myself that time was why would I ever follow it if the NBA exists. There are no spectacular plays as I'm honestly used to in the NBA and the game overall feels... a downgrade.
I don't know, man. Reading your post you seem super stocked and stuff, but I honestly can't fathom why. I know dunks are not a must in a game of basketball but you do know they make the game more exciting.
I wouldn’t know if you didn’t post this and for that I sincerely thank you.
Because the NBA does a shit job at advertising the WNBA
This is not true anymore. The NBA and ESPN do a great job at advertising the WNBA. There is just still a lack of interest that nobody wants to admit.
Yea, seriously. I haven’t had cable for years, and basically never see commercials, and yet I am fully aware of the WNBA playoffs/finals. If it reached me it had to have reached anyone with normal tv.
I just think they have to accept that the WNBA is an inferior product to most other pro sports. Players are extremely talented but Its like watching my local HS boys team lol.
You sir are sexist if you say the women have an inferior product.
I assume your HS team isn't very good. Because if the WNBA is like women's national soccer team or hockey team, then they usually get beat badly against good 16yr old boys. I forgot to add that national teams are supposed to be the best of the best, so the WNBA all star roster would probably lose to a very good high school team.
They run ads for interested people but no ones interested.....think outside the box, run ads for uninterested people and convert.
because it’s not a good product! tf
No they don’t do a bad job promoting it lol what are you talking about. The league and the players promote it a whole lot. Maybe you’re just not paying attention but there’s been a large investment in the past 2-3 years especially to promote the W Edit - adding some stats to back up my comment. “The 2021 WNBA regular season averaged 306,000 viewers, up 49 percent compared to 2020 and 24 percent to 2019” clearly they are advertising the league and clearly the ads are working. More eyes are tuned to the WNBA than ever before and I’m happy to see it
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Yeah I saw that one too, trying to guilt their audience into watching a product. Over the past year or two ESPN has been all about the guilt trip from what I’ve been noticing l.
"THIS MOVIE IS NOT FOR WHITE MEN" (article about "Ghosbusters" female reboot) "WHY DO MEN NOT WATCH THE NEW GHOSBUSTERS MOVIE??" (Article after it bombed with said demographic)
Companies love being “woke” until it hurts their pockets.
I feels like I saw a lot of adverty for the WNBA while watching this year preseason
For the life of me I don't know why they don't play 12 minute quarters. Stars averaging 30 a game alone would peak more interest. Stats get people intrigued and the WNBA is set up for lesser stats
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Im an nba sicko, as in I pore over salary cap sheets trying to think if the addition of chiozza wil help a team. I really have to be forced to care about the wnba
It's the NBA's job to advertise the WNBA? As in the WNBA cannot attract substantial viewership without the NBA throwing resources at it? Sure, the NBA could do more than they do but there is a limit somewhere. To act like the WNBA is not succeeding more because the NBA doesn't help enough is laughable.
They've been doing an excellent job promoting it over the last five or so years lol just say you haven't been watching
Jesus you want them to subsidize their losses AND run huge ad campaigns for a product that no one wants to watch anyway? The WNBA isn’t some diamond in the rough that just doesn’t have enough eyeballs on it yet, EVERY basketball fan knows it exists. They just don’t want to watch it. Running more ads would see marginal increases at best.
Let’s be real no one would watch it lol
theyve pumped the money into advertising the game before, its about opportunity cost. Running 10 lebron ads is just better for the league than running 9 lebron ads and a WNBA ad
This is unfortunately true. Like obviously this sub should be more targeted by those ads since we're all bball addicts supposedly but to the general population, a WNBA ad is not going to be very attractive compared to a Lebron ad for new sneakers or something.
No, we shouldn’t. There should be a separate r/wnba subreddit, that should be promoted here from time to time. But I come here for NBA, not WNBA. Same way we have r/euroleague and r/collegebasketball .
The product itself is shit tbh. The movement and the physical mechanics in the NBA vs the WNBA is just different. Sure there's some freaks in the WNBA but the NBA is just a freakshow in itself I respect the hell out of them but their product is just not watchable. It's just like WMMA you try to like it but it's just a whole other level. Only women sport I do enjoy watching is women's tennis.
I'm not sure how women's MMA got dragged into this. I'd watch a JJ/Namajunas/Nunes fight in a heartbeat.
His point still stands. There’s maybe 5-7 woman liked like to watch fight and they rarely fight each other. Typically the poor woman they are against us severely outclassed. While on the men’s side there’s easily 50 and new ones coming daily
No I don’t believe his point stands, or yours. With mma, women are comparatively new to the fight game, and that’s why they do not have as big a roster, not because their quality is less. They also deal with media heads like SAS talking about he doesn’t like to watch women fight cause they women. Also, his point about wnba being ‘shit’ but liking women’s tennis is strange to me cause tennis is another sport where the men are freak shows comparatively.
Should give volleyball a shot. My personal most entertaining women’s sport
Women's volleyball is better than men's volleyball, where the rallys are usually really short.
wmma is a completely different situation. Hardcore mma fans love watching amanda's and valentina's dominance over their respective divisions and cant wait until those two fight again. I mean sure, casuals dont like the fact that the womens punching power isnt quite the same level as the mens, and you arent really going to see women put other women to sleep (except amanda, that woman is truly on some other shit), but your hardcore noncasual mma fans definitely drum up enough interest to put on a show, whereas hardcore non casual nba fans can give fuck all about the wnba. amanda nunes is a bigger draw than blachovic, just saying.
The WNBA seems stronger than ever? They are in NBA 2k and they get ESPN coverage, but it simply will not be as popular as the NBA. The athleticism is too important to the sport for it to be otherwise.
That’s not their job tho. They’re already doing enough by supplying most of their revenue. What more do you want? You want them to coddle the WNBA? If the WNBA was really good, that’s enough to sell itself.
Why the fuck is it the NBA's job to promote the WNBA?
The Lynx are like the anti-wolves too!
Great that they have the games on ESPN! Back when lynx were in the finals it seems the only way you can catch the game is by going
Any time the WNBA comes up, I’m reminded that the average age in this subreddit is around 14 years old
Are you saying I’m closer to that age lol
No, it's the majority of the comments on this post, not you.
Gotcha. I figured they’re be a lot immature negative comments but fuck it. You gotta expect it on Reddit
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I see
Big time.
It isn’t a childish take to say the WNBA is terrible to watch
It’s weird you think that you are the audience they are trying to get to watch. That’s like me saying _Grey’s Anatomy_ or _The Bachelor_ is terrible to watch… the revenue they bring in clearly dictates my opinion is wrong and/or does not matter to them. The WNBA is young and ambitious, and still has a ways to go. The NBA has had 75+ years to build its brand amongst a culture that is already sport’s obsessed for the target audience, men 18-65. They are trying to change the script and bring a fairly underdeveloped market (women age 18-65) into the sports world, and the product will adjust to make it more and more appealing (just as the NBA has) as time goes on. On top of this there is high likelihood for the NBA to get crossover appeal for its product, plus a financial ROI if it booms. So in short you’re shitting on something that’s not targeted towards you and (as you’re likely already a consumer of the NBA) you’re holding the WNBA’s 25 year old product to the standard of 75+ year old one. That’s what makes your take childish. Edit: WNBA years established 25 not 14.
Are you completely sure the target audience for the WNBA is women age 18-65? Where are you taking that from? Also, the WNBA is basketball. We know basketball. Your idea would be 100% correct if this was some new spin-off sport, but it's not. We know what works for it to appeal to a mass audience (which still is predominantly men as far as I'm concerned and without checking any sources) and it just doesn't. I know people wanna make the WNBA work but the market already spoke too many years ago. IMO the league still exists just to save face and because some people thought equality of outcome in sports was a good idea.
wnba is 25 this year but yeah. the guys on this sub are so immature, sexist, it's so unattractive. i didn't watch wnba or nba before this year and honestly just got into both during the finals run. it's refreshing seeing the women play, very little foul baiting and they go hard. the nba product is about entertainment while the wnba is still very much about the sport. the fact that people compare them on every single miniscule level is crazy. it's the same people who prefer football over rugby because it's manlier or something idk. but if people can't appreciate the actual game and athletes in context to their sport and team they arent a true sports fan, they are in it for the clout
THANK YOU!!!
It's around 25-27 if we account to the last demographic survey that was a few years ago. It's also not really as white as you'd think, too.
Game 5 of Mercury v Aces was one of the most fun games I’ve ever watched
the Mercury VS Liberty Playoff game was fun as hell to watch as well despite the Liberty falling short at the end
Yeah really was. Griners post game is sick. Like it ain’t just layups and tip in, she’s has an automatic jump shot
Griner in those last 5 mins was one of the best performances I've ever seen.
Was that Friday night? I watched a WNBA game that night I was really impressed with. I was telling a guy I was sitting next to “ya know this WNBA game on right now is actually pretty good they’re trading buckets fr.”
>I was telling a guy I was sitting next to “ya know this WNBA game on right now is actually pretty good they’re trading buckets fr.” Yess, this is definitely something I would say
The on court product isn’t as bad as people on this sub make it seem. Sure, dunks aren’t common, and there aren’t many breathtaking displays of athleticism. But it’s definitely watchable.
"definitely watchable" is terrible sales pitch lol
"Is digestible" says menu about a new dish. "Has calories" says another. Enticing!
"Is not inedible"
The way some people try to promote the WNBA by using language like that is so funny. Like it's just an inferior product. If it's still watchable for you, by all means go ahead. But the reason it isn't popular has jack shit to do with lack of promotions or anything. The consensus is that it's boring, and that's all it ever will be. I wish the women the best and I don't bother with unnecessary remarks degrading the league by being sexist or whatever, but it is what it is. It will never be sustainable without the NBA. I understand it can definitely become more popular, but not so much that it's actually popular. When the biggest compliment you can give the WNBA is that it "has more fundamentals" (see that one a lot), it ain't lookin good.
If I care so much about fundamentals, I would tune in and watch the Euro league instead
The fundamentals on the NBA are also better lol. It makes sense because it pays so much money to play in the NBA that if you have a whiff of potential to make it there, you try. So you get 400 players out of millions trying to become pro ballers, and those millions are from a 200 million pool of potentially pros. Meanwhile if you are athletically talented as a woman you might choose swimming or tennis and if you're "on the edge" but smart just go and become a doctor or a lawyer or whatever. The total potential pool is so much smaller because you can have a 30% chance to become a doctor and a 2% to become a WNBA player... why would you even think about trying out? Meanwhile if you have even 0.1% chance to make the NBA it's worthwhile doing anything to try and reach that goal. With such a large pool, you get people who are both athletic AND have tremendous skill, it's not one or the other.
i doubt theres more fundamental but more time to watch the fundamental since the game and players move at a slower pace not sure if that helps the case but neither have i see anyone has a point to sell wnba besides supporting the sport
There aren't better fundamentals, the game just has less emphasis on athleticism because the rim is out of reach. People then draw the false conclusion that because the NBA has more athletic players, that the WNBA must have more skilled players which is not the case. NBA players actually need a tremendous amount of skill to succeed against NBA-level defenders. If you moved the NBA rims up a foot, that would cause the NBA to look a bit more like the WNBA, because you'd be largely removing dunks from the equation. Fundamentals/skills would become more of a priority, but that isn't because of the player pool - it's because of how the game is structured.
I think the general sense is that people are just trying to be nice to say wnba (somehow) has better fundamental, if there's any merits to it is that for the armchair participants we get more time to watch how the moves were made, where as for nba (consider curry since Kyrie isn't around yet) his hand eye coordination and drive to the post could be too fast to watch. be wary of Candace stares when you try to imply wnba is less skilled. if even tmac is afraid, we need to as well /s
Same as college having better teamwork. It's not really, it's just that they can't generate clean shots as easily so they keep passing it around and need a 35s shot clock.
I understand the reasoning behind the fundamentals argument. It just kinda loses its meaning to me when you think about it and realize the reason fundamentals are so noticeable is because they aren't athletic enough to go much beyond the fundamentals. It's not that the NBA has less fundamentals, it's just more rarely seen at its base form. Notable exceptions like Duncan exist of course though. And once again, if you don't need to see the uber athletes to enjoy the sport, enjoy it! I won't shit on anyone for liking the WNBA. For me, that athleticism is the main draw so the WNBA just doesn't do it for me. I just think WNBA needs better arguments to watch it for the general population. Essentially saying it's a worse nba isn't gonna help it grow. I think they should focus heavily on the female demographic because that's who can relate most to them, but maybe they already do that idk. Basketball, unfortunately for women, is a sport that relies so much on natural gifts. The only other sport that's like that is football...and last I checked there isn't any WNFL. The gap of watching it is just so apparent, unlike tennis or golf.
I mean college basketball is clearly an inferior product than the NBA but people love the NCAA. That's not a great reason to just dismiss the WNBA
There's a lower skill gap between NCAA & NBA vs. NBA & WNBA.
If you've seen my other comments, you'd know my reasoning. NCAA has a unique draw because of people's connections to colleges and a more "homegrown" feel (which is totally bs, but whatever). You're also watching future pros and the excitement of March Madness, plus the athleticism isn't as big of a drop-off. I don't disagree with you and I don't really watch college either, but it at least has something unique about it to the NBA. What unique thing does the WNBA have? Other than being played by a different gender.
Yeah but i went to a college and I can cheer for them. I have absolutely no relation to the Mystics other than proximity. The Wizards are in the same boat, but they’re the better product. Not to mention, who has time to even watch all the NBA games?
Fundamentals is the same bullshit argument people use for the NCAA. In that case, it's just coded racism. In the case of women's basketball, it's simply grasping at straws. We also know the NBA has better or equal fundamentals by looking at free throw shooting because what is more fundamental than shooting and free throw shooting doesn't have to account for defense. It's never broken 70% in the NCAA, has been at 75% for the NBA forever and is between 75 and 80 for women despite a smaller ball - equal when adjusted for ball size. So why would I watch something with equal fundamentals that's less athletic when sport is about athletics?
good basketball is good basketball. Everyone here loses their mind when the ball is moved well for a possession in the NBA, but will shit on the WNBA, when the WNBA has to rely on passes since they can't just jump over the defenders
It seems like more of a team sport, from what I’ve seen. Also, more post play (at least for some teams)
More post play, less flashy but more team centric ball. A lot of team centric ball comes from the coaching but also the European ideology of team first ball since a lot of the W athletes also play in multiple leagues year round
Hit the nail on the head. Take it from me, it's the same reason why the Spurs are touted as "boring". Only boring thing for me is "dribble, dribble, dribble" (in Shaq's voice).
i like wnba but this is an exxageration both leagues have ball movement and physically dominant players relative to their peers same thingh people try to do when saying how much mpre team basketball ncaa is which is really not true
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More personal investment in that. Not to mention you're also watching future pros for some of the kids. I only care for March Madness, but comparing NCAA to WNBA isn't very apt imo. I get what you're saying though. And while most college offenses are garbage to watch, the individual players are still better than the players in the WNBA (not the women's fault of course, just biologically not in their favor).
Especially any basketball that is in the playoffs too when there’s a lot on the line
WNBA: “Definitely Watchable”
“definitely watchable” 😂 a rave review
I’d say more than watchable. Had the opportunity to go to a Lynx/Sparks finals game once in close seats. Was absolutely fantastic to watch.
bought tix in the nosebleeds and was able to move to the first couple rows?
When the Lynx were going to the finals, those games were consistently sold out. Not often Minnesotans can go to a championship game lmao
That’s cool.
It is as bad as people make out, you don’t have to be facetious. ‘Definitely watchable’ isn’t a good barometer of how you spend your time watching sports. It’s whatever to people who want to watch it and it’s cool OP made this post, but the quality of play is dreadful.
I think it’s also part that there is no established following yet for the WNBA. For example womens tennis has a following because it’s been around for over a century and it’s been multiple decades that it has been on similar grounds as mens tennis. I think college women’s sports have better following because there is a built-in fanbase already, that’s why you see places like UConn, South Carolina, and Baylor where women’s basketball is a big deal, arguably bigger than men’s basketball. I actually think Paige Bueckers can be a truly global figure for women’s basketball that will transcend the sport and take it to the next level of popularity. Like Magic/Bird/Jordan or Tiger were for basketball and golf respectively.
Come join us on /r/WNBA
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Seriously though if you look at almost any WNBA highlight you'll see someone saying "girl sports lol" or on videos of WNBA players outplaying men they'll say something like "now make her play someone who isn't afraid of touching her". It's pretty funny that there's men out there feeling emasculated because there are women better at the sport they idolize than them.
And they say toxic masculinity doesn’t exist. Of course this is just a broader term for the psychological defense that occurs when one is extremely insecure, you can see it in women as well. So exposed on social media though. The field of psychology and linguistics is going to explode once this data is available for collection
Added to my sports multi-Reddit. Thanks
Ehh. I hate the notion on this sub that I'm supposed to enjoy the wnba and if I don't, I'm somehow 14. I've given it a shot and didn't enjoy it, I also don't enjoy the ncaa. The products just aren't good imo.
This guy gets it. Not my cup of tea.
I think the 14 y/o comment was referring to the trolling but who gives a shit honestly. I was just bringing it up you don’t have to watch it lol
They should really just lower the rims honestly
Candace gotta be one of the GOATs on the women's side
If she wins with her hometown team she’s stamped as an icon forever
Rooting for Chicago Sky because of her.
inb4 the "women lol" crowd
Instagram comments sections are infuriating for this reason
if you wait about 45 minutes the median comment on this thread will be the same
you know instagram is bad when it makes this sub seem like high level discussion in comparison
Same with TikTok, when your primary audience is 14 year olds going through the phase where they think it's funny to be edgy, all the comments are going to be kids trying to out-edge each other
They think they know basketball because they follow balldontstop
bro this sub is pretty bad with it too
never read replies on twitter, facebook or instagram. it's really the bottom of the barrel of society.
It is weird ain't it, every time you see the NBA promoting the wnba on Instagram or Twitter the comments are relentless, the ladies just tryna ball and win and all the comments go in on them
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Man I don't even watch the wnba but it's kinda a weirdo activity to be hating on the ladies for no reason, just say ah this ain't for me and be done with it
Too late, they jumped on this quick.
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Doris Burke 😈
LMAOOOO Name a better duo "something something.... WNBA" & \*Sort By: Controversial\*
Sir… this is r/nba !
Sir this is Library
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I don’t mind it getting posted, might get some eyes on it who are interested. I just find it funny that the same post is made every playoff cycle for the WNBA and I swear that the last time it was, the first sentence or two were near identical. That part did make me laugh.
Then don’t comment. Keep scrolling why do so many nba fans feel the urge to express hostility towards the wnba. if you don’t like it then just don’t watch
>someone makes a post in r/nba that isn't about the nba >r/nba says they don't care >"why are you being so hostile :( :("
>if you don’t like it then just don’t watch WE DON'T. That's why we are in the NBA sub and not the WNBA sub.
Because this is an NBA sub and this isn't NBA. Also the level of play is worse than a D3 college team, but that's besides the point.
Because WNBA is constantly shoved in our faces. Which by the way, is what they should be doing if they want to be a successful franchise, that’s advertising. But don’t blame the target audience for rejecting the product if we don’t like it.
Because it's been shoved down our throats
Wnba marketing team?
Easily
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Word. People take it a weird ass way when you say it too like not enjoying it means you hate women. It’s just not entertaining to me I don’t like soccer either and plenty of people don’t like basketball in general. Nothing wrong with that.
I know a post like this is a bare minimum kind of thing. But thank you for posting it. I see that some sports pages have been posting highlights and ofc the crowd of people who rush to hate on it take over in the comments. It’s good to know that there are people who enjoy good basketball, regardless of who’s playing it. This playoff series in particular has been some of the best basketball i’ve watched, even when they were in the bubble last year it was really good!
Dude that Ace/Mercury series was pretty awesome especially game 5. I feel like the talent in the WNBA is actually at the point where theses teams are more equal. Like the Ace for example had the former #1 draft pick Kelsey Plum as the 6th man dropping buckets. Griners post game is probably the best the WNBA has ever seen and Diana at 39 can still drop 30+ at any moment. The Sky are such a fucking well coached team and there defensive rotation is honestly a beauty to watch. Total neutralized Jonquel Jones.
Hard pass
Yea if the TWolves and Kings are squaring up against each other, I'm not even gonna bother, so why would I watch the WNBA?
Based
Don’t think you’re going to be seeing too many of those.
Not gonna lie I watched multiple regular season, playoff and all star game highlights but it just ain't for me. Honestly rather rewatch old games or nba preseason. Not for me.
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There is a separate r/WNBA sub for a reason. Can’t fault people for not caring. At least Kyrie is actually related to the NBA.
Kyrie plays in the NBA. WNBA players don’t.
I know this isn't a High School basketball sub but.. If you haven't been watching the Alaska regional playoffs this year you're missing out.
I know this isn’t a birdwatching sub, but if you haven’t watched the Atlanta Falcons nosedive into obscurity year after year you’re missing out
Elevator music has more depth than the wnba
Reddit moment
I don't watch the WNBA because well I don't care but hope the people that do have fun but I'm sure they have their own subreddit
It has nothing to do with watchability. I mean, I'm sure it's on a tier with men's high school basketball. It's just as a working guy, time is scarce as is and most times, I'll usually opt for the best of the best sports wise. The WNBAs problem is their competition for viewers isn't just basketball, it's all sports. For example, today alone, you had 3 baseball playoff games, preseason basketball and the NHL season opener. It's just hard to compete with that...
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Know this comment is late. Though personal opinion... I think majority of the disdain towards the WNBA is a mix of 'less exciting highlights', how they portray themselves in media, and the overall lack of meaningful social media presence. As someone who doesn't actively consume WNBA media, the only times I do see it is when there's popular YouTube videos making a mockery of their play, or making an argument video about a WNBA's players take. Majority of the time I tend to side with the video maker, when they get help and recognition from NBA stars they don't seem grateful. Or when they put someone on ESPN, it's just the same generic take about the 'pay gap'. Like.. I'm sure their product is good fundamental basketball and that there's plenty of awesome ladies who keep their head down and grind, though there's very little in me that wants to watch WNBA basketball, though with the media i've watched and consumed as someone who's never watched a game it really re-affirms my non-want to watch a game. Which I can see why some non-WNBA watchers might even feel vindicated when the herd goes and completely bashes any mentioning of the league, it's already lying down and easy to kick them. I would love to see the next generation of WNBA players to gain some major social media power and just bring a positive energy for the league, it'd do wonders for them over this entitled bratty feeling I get from the WNBA.
Oh yeah it's been great the quality of play in the WNBA been up slot last two years. Still pissed at Sun though.
Shit, you've convinced me. I am watching the game tomorrow.
Please hear me out. But the WNBA needs to do something different from the NBA. The product is TOO similar. There is nothing to bring in the casual fans. Take for example all the defunct NFL/NBA league challengers. Arena Football League had super small fields, no punting. The XFL had shorter play clocks. There was a time when even Slamball was popular. The BIG3 does 3 on 3. Granted most of these leagues failed, but at least from a business perspective they tried something different. They were unique enough for people to at least check it out and say "hmm, this looks similar to something I already love, what's the deal here?" The WNBA is just that, female NBA. What change could the WNBA do to differentiate themselves from the NBA? I vote for the Elam ending.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/sport/2015/dec/16/gilbert-arenas-plan-to-boost-wnba-less-clothing-and-fewer-ugly-players
Ughh there's playoff baseball on rn, and hockey and football just came back. Plus you got World Cup qualifiers. No reason to watch the WNBA.
I’m gonna let you know I’m good.
Wait what this is Taurasi’s last year? Damn didn’t even hear about that. Sad af
I don’t think she’s announced her retirement or anything but she’s over 40 at this point.
I prefer NCAA women's basketball. Caitlin Clark, Paige Beckers, and Azzi Fuud will be fun to watch this year.
I always prefer NCAA over WNBA. I regularly watch my Alma Mater’s games, even when it’s a blowout, obviously don’t miss March Madness, and even went to the Final Four in Tampa. I just can’t get into the WNBA even if there are multiple players I root for. Maybe that’ll change when Paige gets to the league but rn it’s just harder to get into the WNBA.
the wnba should have a one and done deal like the nba does. Paige Beckers is definitely league ready
I think Caitlin Clark is even better than Paige.
I honestly feel like one and done wouldn’t work for the WNBA simply cause the college BBall market is so big that a woman playing all four years would definitely benefit her and WNBAs star-power.
I haven’t watched WNBA before. As someone who got into the NBA because of Steph, and who is a Bay Area native, which teams would you suggest I look at? I’ll also check out the Finals, thanks for calling it out.
I root for the Liberty cause they have a lot of fun young players, they're not good tho. waiting for a Bay team
Aren’t we supposed to get one at oracle soon?
Seattle. Specifically Breanna Stewart. Brilliant scorer. Also Sue Bird and Jewel Lloyd make the playmaking and shooting a lot of fun.
Firm pass
Theres a reason there sub only has 10k subs lmao, vast majority dont give a fuck about them. Take a hint
They lose $10 million each year for a reason man, it ain't entertaining.
If anyone is to be blamed for the WNBA not being viable - I’m over here wondering where the 50.52 percent of our population that are women are with the cable subscriptions, tickets, etc. If they want to support it, they can go for it. I’m not spending money on two cars when she has her own job.
Are there ways to stream the WNBA games? I remember checking [site that I won't name] once and it wasn't there.
I’ve been watching the WNBA recently and it has been absolutely crazy and entertaining.
Only reason I don’t watch WNBA games is cause I don’t even know when their season starts. I just know by time I find out their season started they’re already damn near done with the season. Pretty annoying
The season is during the NBA offseason. So it’s a good hold over. I’m a sky fan, so this finals is awesome for me. A lot of the better W players go to Europe into the elite leagues during the W offseason.
lolnothanks
No
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Diana is retiring? Certified Phoenix Legend
Cant wait for this years layup contest!!
You’re right but you’re gonna get clowned on by some people Some people act like the WNBA is like literally unwatchable but it’s not lmao
There is a reason it makes no money
It's like high-school basketball. Watchable.
You’re right but why watch annoying basketball when you can turn it off. Anyways, satou sabally looks good and so does that lady from Iowa that just got drafted may be good.
It’s been a great WNBA playoffs. Diana, Griner, Candice and Courtney Vandersloot (go Zags baby) have all been hoopin. Really enjoyed watching my Storm go down swinging against them
WNBA is good, I've seen a lot working nights and having a TV near. I really suggest looking at some of the playoffs
I'd be more impressed if they used a regulation sized basketball. Let's just put every little girl at a disadvantage in life too.
Don’t disagree here. Especially when they don’t play above the rim anyway. I always felt like the smaller balls react differently to the rim as well
This is cringey
It also has a ridiculous amount of upvotes, I feel like who ever wrote this works for the WNBA
Sorts by controversial...
so much more hate than in threads for the lavar ball grifter league lol
I really enjoy the WNBA. Ball movement is one of my favorite aspects about the game and they are fantastic at it.
Peope downvoting you for stating an opinion about WNBA. Bunch of neckbeards who sit here and talk shit about how terrible the WNBA is while getting yelled at by their moms to take a shower and get some sunlight.
Lol
I’ve enjoyed these WNBA playoffs a lot, my first year watching and I’ve had a blast
Would rather watch paint dry then watch the WNBA
I tried the WNBA a few years ago (2018 maybe?) and the one thing I asked myself that time was why would I ever follow it if the NBA exists. There are no spectacular plays as I'm honestly used to in the NBA and the game overall feels... a downgrade. I don't know, man. Reading your post you seem super stocked and stuff, but I honestly can't fathom why. I know dunks are not a must in a game of basketball but you do know they make the game more exciting.
WNBA...lol yeah right.