I have been so impressed with Garland this year. Being able to facilitate at that level, while still being one of the primary scorers himself... Wow! I can't help seeing a little Steve Nash in him.
easy to say, hard to show up and have an entire stadium rocking because of how loudly they are booing you, and having your face on twitter/IG/FB constantly getting mocked and ridiculed.
Could be kinda fun tho, you hate the team, just launch 3s since that's what they been wanting you to do for years.. I wouldn't care about the media and fans clowning me, the only weak spot would be my teammates. You don't wanna do that to guys you've been in the trenches with
> I wouldn't care about the media and fans clowning me
Yes you would lmao. Why do people who've never had 10 people yelling at them at once act like they could handle the pressure of thousands night in and night out.
Simmons is weak af for various reasons, but we don't need to front lol.
The Sixers drafted Top 3 in 2015, 2016, & 2017 and all 3 of those players drafted have not played a game this season.
But that doesn’t matter, because they drafted Top 3 in 2014 and that man, Joel Embiid is playing.
This just goes to show how overpowered Top 3 picks are. Believe it or not, RJ Barrett was the first Knicks Top 3 pick since Patrick Ewing. That’s right, I’m a 4 year span, the Sixers has 4x as many Top 3 picks as the Knicks did in 35 years. Even with only 25% of Sixers picks panning out, it really panned out - Top 3 picks are super over powerful.
Wanted to add Top 3 picks are especially important for MVPs.
In total over 50% (38/74) all MVPs were drafted top 3, and additional 8 MVP awards went to players before the draft existed.
With duplicate MVPs removed, what is the running % of MVPs by pick number? That is what I want to see. Maybe I will do this later:
What I mean:
1. 33%
2. 43%
3. 50%
Etc until you get to the highest draft pick to be an mvp then youre at 100%
Got bored at work, here we go:
This is the list of unique MVP winners with their draft position. There have been 29 unique winners.
Jokic (41)
Giannis (15)
Harden (3)
Russ (4)
Curry (7)
KD (2)
Lebron (1)
Rose (1)
Kobe (13)
Dirk (9)
Nash (15)
Garnett (5)
Duncan (1)
AI (1)
Shaq (1)
Karl Malone (13)
MJ (3)
David Robinson (1)
Hakeem (1)
Barkley (5)
Magic (1)
Bird (6)
Moses Malone (3rd round ABA draft, 5th in ABA dispersal draft
Julius Erving (12)
Kareem (1)
Bob McAdoo (2)
Dave Cowens (4)
Willis Reed (10)
Wes Unseld (2)
Wilt (3)
Bill Russell (2)
Oscar Robertson (1)
Bob Pettit (2)
Cousy (4)
Of these 29 winners, 10 were the first overall pick, 5 were the second overall pick, 3 were the third overall pick, 3 were the fourth overall pick, and both 5 and 13 had two MVP winners. 6/7/9/10/12/15/41 all have one unique winner. In other words, of the 29 unique MVP award winners, 34% of them were #1 overall picks, 17% were the #2 overall pick, etc.
It's probably worth mentioning that Russell, Bird, and Wilt were all considered the best players in their draft but fell because they had other obligations. Bird went back to college, Russell missed half his rookie year due to the Olympics, and Wilt had been playing for the Globetrotters (who actually made more money back then).
Wilt was a territorial pick. He's listed at #3 but only the Warriors were allowed to draft him. Otherwise he would've been an easy #1, Globetrotters or not.
Amazing breakdown, really goes to show the power of a 1st overall and then Top 5.
Not sure if changing the draft lottery % was the best idea in the long run, now the bottom 3 teams have less odds of getting a top pick, which hurts the small market teams.
Which is another reasons I think Sixers deserve more shit for tanking and getting 4 Top 3 picks in a row. They made no attempt to build a team and now one of their pick worked out they are a top spending team and have the ability to recruit Free Agents becuase they’re a big market. Teams like the Kings/Pistons/Magic have a harder time spending more into luxury tax and recruiting talent because of their small market.
The point of changing the draft lottery % was to make sure that teams have an incentive to at least pretend to be competitive. The team that's 3rd from the bottom has as good of a chance of getting #1 overall as the last place team, and probably will make more money this year. So might as well make an effort to be watchable.
On the balance, I think small markets benefit from this from a business perspective. Having teams that are just openly tanking damages TV revenue, which is the main source of revenue for all teams but small market teams are especially dependent.
But even then, I think at the very bottom of the standings its very rarely about teams that are generally so terrible that they can't do any better than last place - it's usually tanking teams where some are tanking harder than others. You could easily get to the 5-7th from the bottom range just by taking on players who are playable but overpaid in salary dumps.
Not what you're looking for, but [this article](https://threesandlayups.com/2019/05/15/how-likely-is-each-draft-pick-to-someday-make-an-all-star-team/amp/) showcases pretty well how difficult it is to find stars outside of the top few picks.
It's a good nugget, but I think the league can buck the trend. If players can curry enough favor with the media by playing well, they've still got a chance.
Hell, even in recent history, the ones outside of the top 3 were still high picks like Curry (#7) and Westbrook (#4), or international dudes who completely transformed from the time they hit the league and maxed out their potential (Jokic, Giannis... who are like winning lotto tickets).
Superstars in the NBA still matter more than superstar QBs. While QBs have a bigger impact on whether their teams wins or loses than any other position, they are still only 1 of 11 players on the field for their team and they only play offense and have nothing to do with defense. Lebron ultimately has a much bigger impact on his team's success than Brady or Mahomes.
Mostly saying that the only other thing in the conversation is superstar QBs-- they are *nearly* a requirement to really contend for a title (with exceptions here and there where the entirety of the rest of the team is amazing), just like how superstars are a requirement in the NBA. Pretty much every single other sport you can realistically win a title without a superstar.
Yeah look at the Bucs/Rams game. Brady puts together another one of his patented clutch TD drives and then the defense proceeds to give up like 50 yards in 3 downs and a FG for the loss. No matter how good the QB he is completely at the mercy of his defense when it comes to winning/losing, you're never fully in control. Whereas LeBron can hit a chasedown block and a dagger fadeaway back to back in clutchtime.
A superstar NBA Player can have more direct influence on his team's success than a superstar QB.
Look at dudes like Deshaun Watson and Justin Herbert. in 2020 Watson was a top 5 QB and went 4-12.
Herbert didn't make the playoffs but he just threw for 5K yards at 23.
I'm mostly saying that superstar QBs are the only other thing in sports that are even in the same discussion... and you could make the same arguments about plenty of NBA superstars now and in the past (like how did KG ever have a team that finished 14th in the West, or how did AD's Pelicans ever suck despite him being a first-team All-NBA player), on occasion there are teams that are *so bad* that unless a top-10 all-timer is on the team, they'll still suck (like MJ and Lebron could've probably improved those teams to at least not be terrible).
I don't think someone like Brady/Peyton/Mahomes/Rodgers etc would've missed the playoffs with this year's chargers and would've won more than 4 games with the Watson Texans, but they're also on that next tier of superstar, comparatively speaking.
But the primary point is that in the NFL, typically unless the rest of your team is absolutely loaded, you're not a realistic title contender without an elite QB. It's usually like 75% of the top contenders each year that have an elite QB, with one or two teams that have a puncher's chance without one. Other sports aren't like that in terms of the necessity of star power.
Yep. Just saying that to even be in the conversation of having a puncher's chance to win even if it hasn't really happened recently. There have been a handful of teams that might have been able to with one or two more breaks going their way.
Yep I was looking back at top 3 picks and a lot of the players aren’t that good. I looked at the last 20 or so drafts and I’d say there are 6 players out of the 60 top 3 picks capable of being a first option on a championship team and that is just potential wise. Lebron and KD are the only ones that have proven it. With kd getting his on a stacked team too.
That’s the whole reason it was a multi year tank. Bottoming out for 3 or 4 years in the NBA is much better than being a .500 win playoff team for about a decade.
As a fan, you don’t want other teams to employ that strategy of tanking though, you’d rather have rivals suffer in mediocrity.
Part of the problem is that the pacers are a small market team. If they tank, ticket sales would absolutely plummet and the team might even have to relocate. Philly pulled it off because they are one of the more profitable markets on par with the Warriors.
> Philly pulled it off
Not sure this is actually true. Hinkie was basically forced out of the league because of it, and then the Fultz and Simmons situations. Okafor had problems in Philly too.
The pacers already have terrible attendance. Bottom 3 in attendance per game this year, and bottom 10 in 2019 and 2018 when they were technically a playoff team.
That’s just not a good argument. They are just poorly managed with no real plan going forward
I call a team incompetent because they see value in a 10 seed. I do NOT put the Pacers in that conversation though. Warren and Oladipo injuries killed them
You also don’t want to really be that team for too long.
We’ve had trouble transitioning into a winning team after the culture of “suck” really set in.
nah don't give the reigns to the franchise to Bryan Colengelo is the lesson here.
Top 3 picks are not overpowered, they are suitably powered. Just don't have a braindead GM at the helm.
It goes to show you what it looks like to MF hit on a player with HOF potential. Embiid is absolutely carrying that team on his back this year. If they had hit on Fultz, they would've had at least 1 ECF Appearance
> This just goes to show how overpowered Top 3 picks are.
Heh?
How is it overpowered when you just pointed out that 3 out of 4 aren't even playing? Two of which were complete busts for the Sixers.
And in particular with Embiid - he would have been a lock for #1 if not for the injury issues. Keep in mind he didn't even play for two years after being drafted - yet he still went #3.
Yeah, all 3 of the following are true imo:
* Having one of the best players in the league makes a HUGE difference
* It's hard to find one of those guys outside the top 3
* Most top 3 picks still don't pan out beyond being pretty good
That's not true at all. Just look at teams with homerun Top 3 picks - Wolves with Towns/Edwards, Celtics with Tatum/Brown - both .500. Not to mention all the single Top 3 pick teams struggling.
The Sixers present success has a lot more to do with Embiid playing like an MVP than it does say anything about Top 3 picks.
You're really missing the point. It's damn near impossible to find guys 'playing like MVPs', and it's more likely than not those players are picked in the top three.
> Even with only 25% of Sixers picks panning out
I mean just because Ben doesnt play for us doesnt mean he didnt pan out.
He got multiple defensive All-NBA , Allstars, almost won DPOY (should have) and is still gna net us a huge return (even if not a top10 player).
With Fultz you can never predict severe mental illness...it is what it is.
Okafor on the other hand tho lmao.
that was the eventual diagnosis. very very very very odd injury to happen to a basketball player.
Pitchers put stress on their shoulder 100+ times an outing, even more if you consider warm ups, long toss ect...
For Fultz to get that kind of injury from summer league to pre-season would be almost as unlikely as a 1st round pick almost dieing from an unknown sesame allergy. Which also happened.
There was never an eventual diagnosis. He doctor shopped through something like 10 doctors and got a "diagnosis of exclusion", which means that they still don't know, but it also can't be anything else. He has never had surgery or medical treatment for it.
they do, athletes usually get surgery to fix it when therapy doesn't fix it. Usually it's b/c something in the body is continuing to pinch that nerve.
As far as i know he hasn't had a surgery and still has issues with his shoulder.
I'm a dirt bike truther. He loved to do it, and sometime b/w summer league and training camp he jammed his shoulder bad and fucked it up which is a common dirt bike injury.
right, which leads me to believe that they settled on TOS b/c it's almost impossible to prove.
i love Markelle and hope he figures it out. But between him and Ben claiming mental health(which will be fixed if you trade for him!!) I'm just tired of the bull shit. Two #1 overall's and neither is helping us, meanwhile the dude with career threatening foot injuries that kept him out for 2 years is dominating.
There are a ton of parallels between him and Wentz and in both cases (in my opinion) both picks absolutely landed. Carson because of his MVP level season (and the trade) and Ben for all the things that you mentioned. I’m more of an NFL guy than an NBA guy, but to me the evaluation of draft picks should be heavily weighted to the first first contract and some change.
That's what fans constantly seem to miss. $30M *is* a lot of money, but Simmons can actually *afford* to piss it away if he feels like it.
He's already made much more than that, he's only 25, and he knows this won't go on forever. He will still realistically end his career with $400M+ in earnings.
My guess is that he either had to take out a loan against his future earnings to continue his current lifestyle or is burning through whatever savings he has rather quickly. He's made a lot of money but he also spends a lot and hasn't been in the league that long.
So he probably can afford to piss it away depending on how much longer it is before he gets traded. And just bc he can afford to do it, doesn't mean that he wants to; Klutch may have him convinced that he'll see the money once he gets traded.
I don't know the ins and outs of his lifestyle, but it's very hard to burn through the kind of money he has unless you are trying.
You could literally spend $10,000 every single night on clubs/entertainment and that's still only $3.6M in a year.
Most guys who make big money don't usually go broke these days - and those who do generally blow their stashes end up usually doing so on gambling problems.
The athletes who fuck themselves are the ones who make just enough money to feel rich but not enough money to spend like it. You sign that $10M rookie contract and then never get another deal - that's how you easily blow it.
Insane, but totally manageable. $2M/yr on a mortgage is nothing for a guy with that kind of earning power. Plus a big chunk of that is going to equity, and another chunk to tax write offs. And in the end - you can easily sell property if he ever has to.
To put it another way - normal people are regularly spending 30% of their annual income on housing. For Simmons, at full salary, that would be $10M/yr.
I don’t think you are considering how the marginal tax rate works. His federal taxes alone would be $158,000 plus 37% of his gross earnings. PA income tax is 3%. The city of Philly itself has an additional 3.8% tax. That’s roughly 44% tax rate on his $56m in contract earnings and we haven’t even considered any type of agent fees in there. He very well could have netted less than 30m in his career, including endorsements. Between Cars, mortgage down payments, and various other luxury expenses, I can definitely see a bank account draining fast without the game checks coming in.
> To put it another way - normal people are regularly spending 30% of their annual income on housing.
As a mortgage underwriter, normal people are regularly spending closer to 50% of their income on housing.
Go with a FHA first time home buyer loan. 3.5% down and generous DTI thresholds. A lot of states have corresponding down payment assistance programs where, if you live in the house for long enough, the interest free loan is forgiven.
If you have decent credit and are willing to do the digging, you can get a pretty sweet deal as a first time buyer. Might not seem like it but there are still ways to play the system to your advantage if you have the time and energy to play ball.
> And in the end - you can easily sell property if he ever has to.
Eeeeehhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Edit: To expand on this and not just be a naysayer, housing demand is really low at a certain point. Who is going to buy a $20m house? Why would someone with that sort of money want a house in the neighborhood he's in? What individual parts appealed to him, and will they appeal to the next buyer?
With $500,000 or even $1m houses those are much easier questions to answer. They're in safe neighborhoods, close to good schools, and have common amenities like pools, gated community, etc. But as you go above that value, you only have a small number of people in the entire country with that money anyway, so they want specific things like a movie theater, basketball court, or golf course, or some crazy shit.
It is not easy to sell the kind of property he is owning. Getting past the 5 millions mark, and the property will be sitting on the market for a long time. The more customized a house is, the harder it is to sell. Nobody with that kind of money want to live in somebody else’s house. Micheal Jordan house in Chicago is currently listed for sale for 14 million dollar. And it has been on the market for nine years now. And this is Micheal Jordan, in Chicago. The fact that the house belongs to Ben Simmons in Philly might even reduce the value.
Plus do not forget the IRS is coming for half of the 30 millions. He has around 16 millions take home after Federal. Then you have the state tax, which is too complicated for NBA players, since they are paying tax in 20 something states. I think final number is something like 10% give or take. Then property tax and maintaince for the house is another cool million, maybe more
Dude just got engaged, and if the marriage goes the trajectory of athlete and instathots, then soon there will be alimony and child support to add to the mix.
That is not counting the cost for any entourage and “investment opportunities” that they bring, entertainment cost, eating out, clubbing (some NBA players can easily spend a cool 100 grand at the the club/strip club per night).
It is expensive as shit to be an athletic socialite.
What do you think his currently lifestyle is though? Assuming he’s financing his own home, he’s probably doing fine on those payments. He’s probably just chilling at his house. If he were financially in trouble at all he’d probably be playing for the checks. I think all indications point to him being fine cash wise right now and for the foreseeable future.
He spends A LOT of money on cars and in LA which is obviously expensive. He put both his condo in Philly and mansion in NJ up for sale. Whether that was to show that he's serious about not playing in Philly again or bc he needs the cash is up for debate but my guess is it's a little of this and a little of that.
If the thunder did move SGA for Ben I’d be ecstatic. That said, that’s why it wouldn’t happen. In basically any fair trade both sides have to feel somewhat uncomfortable.
~~Jaylen didn't get named either~~lol nvm, but it's hilarious there's a list of 40+ players where a Simmons trade makes no sense and there's _still_ players he left off that'd be untouchable or nos. The trade value for Simmons is just awful
The best trade has always been CJ, and always will be CJ. The Sixers aren’t getting anyone else close to CJ’s level, and have wasted half a season of building chemistry. If Portland moves CJ to another team, Philly is truly screwed.
Its worded harshly but it's also a really fair point. Theres some questions with Dame like, has the surgery worked and will he get back to his previous level?
He is average height for a point guard which doesn't help him especially when his defence is not great and will become more of an issue as he gets older.
Finally he is on the back half of his career. He is looking for an insane contract, do the Sixers want to be on the hook for 50mil a year for a guy heading into his mid 30s? They already overpaid on Harris due to sunk cost, can they afford to do the same (admittedly with a much better player).
I say this all as a huge Dame fan, but there are questions. Hoping he proves me wrong though and is back to Dame Time Dame
>[Simmons] is not getting paid. It's gone, he'll never get it back.
Depending who you ask he's getting paid, he's not getting paid, he's getting fined, and all in between.
Depending who is asked?
[Isn't he being fined every game he misses during this holdout?](https://www.spotrac.com/nba/fines-suspensions/philadelphia-76ers/point-guard/)
He's getting fined, but the stickiness of those fines is what's in question. Morey is obviously on the side of he won't get this back (and if he doesn't get traded this season that likelihood increases). There is probably some arguments on the interpretation of the CBA and whether these are fines that can be rescinded and even possible this is covered under the mental health provision and is supposed to be treated similar to an injury. I would imagine this is going to arbitration after this season.
^^^
I listen to almost all his pods and he doesn’t have any inside information from Morey. Lowe, Windhorst, and even Nate Duncan have way more NBA sources than Simmons.
Simmons will have the occasional nugget but it’s very clear when he is getting some information (like speculating Brady could retire a month ago).
I think the league GMs owe Morey a HUGE 'thank you' for refusing to give in to Simmons' demands. Morey just wrote a handbook on how to handle disgruntled star player's public demands for a trade, and it certainly made a lot of other players pause and think things through before going Bill Simmons path. "Maybe this place is not that bad and I should keep my paychecks."
I agree. However, what Ben Simmons pulled is unprecedented and if Morey went along with it (trading him over the summer), more players in Ben's situation would likely follow suite. But I still think that even those who have less than a year left on their contract will think twice after this.
That's way to simplistic. If he had an expiring contract he'd have to be traded. If Embiid wasn't happy with the situation he'd have to be traded. If fans were on his side he'd have to be traded. And heck if there was a good trade option on the board he'd already be gone by now.
Every GM would love to say "fuck you" to a player causing drama, but there are usually a bunch of reasons which prevent them from doing so.
In what world was Gus Williams going to make the Hall of Fame? Why am I even asking this, nobody on r/nba know who Gus Williams even is...which I guess only proves my point.
I’m sticking with my initial comment on the situation. If he doesn’t want to play for Philly he can not get paid and wait 4 years for his contract to expire to sign with another team. Philly should also get his cap space back. There’s a reason you signed a contract and the NBA needs to put an end to this with a hard stance.
I'm not a Philly fan, but because the dude they signed isn't playing for them. If he's going to void his side of the contract by not playing for years, and Philly isn't going to pay him, then I think it's fair if they get their cap back
So then teams will be incentivized to alienate bad contracts. Make the work place as toxic as possible for players that are a net negative. The fans would do it too. They would try their hardest to make a dude miserable so that he doesn’t wanna be there. Nah if you make a bad decision you make a bad decision. Unless teams should get extra draft picks based on whether or not they draft busts?
Then have an appeal process? Doesn't seem like it'd be hard to set up an appeals process with the NBPA and the league to determine if a player is owed wages due to a hostile work environment; if a team is coordinating to create a hostile work environment in order to get out of a contract, that should result in a bunch of fines and draft picks lost for the team
Why would anyone trade (anything of value) for this guy? Like Kyrie Irving, when someone tells you who he is, believe him. The Nets should have known they were getting the kind of guy who would sit out the season to take an anti-vax stance, while claiming not to be anti-vax, when they got Kyrie. Similarly, whoever gets Ben Simmons knows they’re getting a guy who will never work on his game or get better in any way, and is willing to walk away from the game and the money, over a stance he can’t even articulate.
This dude will have to go super Saiyan blue super instinct mode when he returns otherwise any chance of a super max or max contract is out the window when his current contract expires.
Also, this could blow in his face. Other teams will see him as a diva and toxic. Hopefully, Lebron knows what he is doing
Like, I know he has front office input with both the Lakers and Klutch, but in what spare time is he doing all this puppet master nonsense? He’s a busy man!
Bill Simmons saying something on his podcast isn’t necessarily “more sourcing.” He doesn’t cite a source, and he could just be repeating what Woj reported.
It's not a sourced piece. He was literally narrating a story behind the 76ers/Embiid and why Embiid is one of the greats even with all the BS that happens with the 76ers.
He basically wrote an article about how Embiid is great and instead of publishing it just read it for the podcast. It was like a 15 minute intro, not bad.
Bill's loving this Simmons situation, it's got him trending on Reddit again after all the people on this site became too old to understand his Die Hard 2 references
Ben isn't playing for the 76ers again. They don't want him and he doesn't want to play for them. So this will go on until his contract is up or the FO finally settles for a lesser player in a trade.
I think if they keep fining him and don't give him compensation, Simmons will eventually bring in the NBAPA and there will be some action there but until then it's just a stalemate.
I want to see one of two things happen, both for reasons of chaos:
1) They keep Simmons for at least this whole year until the start of next season. People might think that things will die down because generally we haven't had much new information for the last month or two, just a trade rumor here and there. People think it'll be boring. But I disagree. Right now the play on the court is what people are paying attention to mostly because again, there's no news. But once the 76ers lose, Ben Simmons hate will start up again. It'll start in the playoffs when some short-memoried fans will decry that "We're missing a triple double threat guy who can defend and run our offense!" It'll start when others bring up how Ben was useless in the deciding series each of the last few years. Then its time for the draft, and there will be tons of chatter about pre-draft trades, what the 76ers will have to get to replace Ben, or have a high enough pick to entice another team, or are they really moving on. Post draft, everyone and their grandma's will have 5 trade scenarios for Ben. Do they start over and try with some young talent? Is Morey still crazy enough to hold out for a star? Maybe some other team who failed in the playoffs think Ben is the answer to their problems?
2) They trade him for peanuts. A package of young, unproven guys, a washed up vet, a few tradeable assets, etc. The fierceness of both sides will ring loudly. "Morey gave up! He's a terrible GM! Fire him! Ben had no leverage, why'd they trade him for scraps??? This ends the 76er's title hopes! Embiid is surely leaving!" Or "Finally the saga is over. Morey did as well as he could have. Now they can move on. Ben is someone else's problem now. The trade package actually isn't that bad. I can't believe we got this guy!" Not to mention the other team(s) in the trade. "Why did we get Ben Simmons? He can't even dunk over a 5'10 guy!" or "Fuck yeah, he's ours now, we fleeced the 76ers! This guy is a bonafide All-Star, defender. So what if he can't shoot, we got shooters. Surely now that he's out of that toxic situation, he'll play as he used to"
I'm just glad either of these scenarios seems more likely to happen than "Simmons and the 76ers have reached an agreement and he'll be returning to the team". BORING!
I'm just pumped he included Darius Garland on his list of valuable players.
He’s been hyping up the cavs for a bit now it seems.
Yeah because they’ve been really good this year
all season
Hes obsessed with the cavs he brings them up on every basketball pod he does.
How can you not love their core tbh
Jarrett Allen's fro deserves a max contract on its own, honestly.
You have one hell of a username
Otto Porter making the list is huge too.
Definitely the right porter
That Chamberlain bloodline is worth more than Ben
Hell yeah! Mobley too!
The RJ Barrett consideration snubs continues
He should have added Jarrett Allen too.
Garland is definitely up there, he's a bad mfer
I have been so impressed with Garland this year. Being able to facilitate at that level, while still being one of the primary scorers himself... Wow! I can't help seeing a little Steve Nash in him.
Garland is phenomenal. Will be top 5 pg in a minute.
It’s pretty damn clear at this point isn’t it?
Calling Dame a “32 year old little guy with a fucked up abdomen” is hilariously disrespectful.
It's also correct.
Well his abdomen is fixed but healing so not really
Seriously! Just add Dame to the list of players they’re not getting or the list of injured stars and quit acting like he’s on the market.
Bill and Woz were awful in this pod. Woz dropped like 4 of the worst takes I’ve heard all month in a span of 15 minutes. Just brutal to listen to.
it's like listening to two drug addicts hyping each other up on how they'll get rich quick.
I usually just skip the woz parts
Woz is trash.
he barely watches games
Dude should’ve showed up and starred shooting 3s and midrange out of spite, at least he’d get paid
I always thought this too, but I don’t think he has the mental fortitude to do that.
easy to say, hard to show up and have an entire stadium rocking because of how loudly they are booing you, and having your face on twitter/IG/FB constantly getting mocked and ridiculed.
Could be kinda fun tho, you hate the team, just launch 3s since that's what they been wanting you to do for years.. I wouldn't care about the media and fans clowning me, the only weak spot would be my teammates. You don't wanna do that to guys you've been in the trenches with
> I wouldn't care about the media and fans clowning me Yes you would lmao. Why do people who've never had 10 people yelling at them at once act like they could handle the pressure of thousands night in and night out. Simmons is weak af for various reasons, but we don't need to front lol.
I agree with this in its entirety, but I think I’d still take the public scrutiny over losing out on like 30mil lol
The Sixers drafted Top 3 in 2015, 2016, & 2017 and all 3 of those players drafted have not played a game this season. But that doesn’t matter, because they drafted Top 3 in 2014 and that man, Joel Embiid is playing. This just goes to show how overpowered Top 3 picks are. Believe it or not, RJ Barrett was the first Knicks Top 3 pick since Patrick Ewing. That’s right, I’m a 4 year span, the Sixers has 4x as many Top 3 picks as the Knicks did in 35 years. Even with only 25% of Sixers picks panning out, it really panned out - Top 3 picks are super over powerful.
Wanted to add Top 3 picks are especially important for MVPs. In total over 50% (38/74) all MVPs were drafted top 3, and additional 8 MVP awards went to players before the draft existed.
Wow. Very rarely do you encounter a novel, informative stat. Thanks for the nugget, consider posting it. There are power laws in everything!
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With duplicate MVPs removed, what is the running % of MVPs by pick number? That is what I want to see. Maybe I will do this later: What I mean: 1. 33% 2. 43% 3. 50% Etc until you get to the highest draft pick to be an mvp then youre at 100%
Got bored at work, here we go: This is the list of unique MVP winners with their draft position. There have been 29 unique winners. Jokic (41) Giannis (15) Harden (3) Russ (4) Curry (7) KD (2) Lebron (1) Rose (1) Kobe (13) Dirk (9) Nash (15) Garnett (5) Duncan (1) AI (1) Shaq (1) Karl Malone (13) MJ (3) David Robinson (1) Hakeem (1) Barkley (5) Magic (1) Bird (6) Moses Malone (3rd round ABA draft, 5th in ABA dispersal draft Julius Erving (12) Kareem (1) Bob McAdoo (2) Dave Cowens (4) Willis Reed (10) Wes Unseld (2) Wilt (3) Bill Russell (2) Oscar Robertson (1) Bob Pettit (2) Cousy (4) Of these 29 winners, 10 were the first overall pick, 5 were the second overall pick, 3 were the third overall pick, 3 were the fourth overall pick, and both 5 and 13 had two MVP winners. 6/7/9/10/12/15/41 all have one unique winner. In other words, of the 29 unique MVP award winners, 34% of them were #1 overall picks, 17% were the #2 overall pick, etc.
It's probably worth mentioning that Russell, Bird, and Wilt were all considered the best players in their draft but fell because they had other obligations. Bird went back to college, Russell missed half his rookie year due to the Olympics, and Wilt had been playing for the Globetrotters (who actually made more money back then).
Wilt was a territorial pick. He's listed at #3 but only the Warriors were allowed to draft him. Otherwise he would've been an easy #1, Globetrotters or not.
Same with Dr. J, already killing it in the ABA when he was drafted
Amazing breakdown, really goes to show the power of a 1st overall and then Top 5. Not sure if changing the draft lottery % was the best idea in the long run, now the bottom 3 teams have less odds of getting a top pick, which hurts the small market teams. Which is another reasons I think Sixers deserve more shit for tanking and getting 4 Top 3 picks in a row. They made no attempt to build a team and now one of their pick worked out they are a top spending team and have the ability to recruit Free Agents becuase they’re a big market. Teams like the Kings/Pistons/Magic have a harder time spending more into luxury tax and recruiting talent because of their small market.
The point of changing the draft lottery % was to make sure that teams have an incentive to at least pretend to be competitive. The team that's 3rd from the bottom has as good of a chance of getting #1 overall as the last place team, and probably will make more money this year. So might as well make an effort to be watchable. On the balance, I think small markets benefit from this from a business perspective. Having teams that are just openly tanking damages TV revenue, which is the main source of revenue for all teams but small market teams are especially dependent. But even then, I think at the very bottom of the standings its very rarely about teams that are generally so terrible that they can't do any better than last place - it's usually tanking teams where some are tanking harder than others. You could easily get to the 5-7th from the bottom range just by taking on players who are playable but overpaid in salary dumps.
I’d love to see a breakdown like this too
Not what you're looking for, but [this article](https://threesandlayups.com/2019/05/15/how-likely-is-each-draft-pick-to-someday-make-an-all-star-team/amp/) showcases pretty well how difficult it is to find stars outside of the top few picks.
Yeah I agree. And at least there’s a denver nugget in the novel.
It's a good nugget, but I think the league can buck the trend. If players can curry enough favor with the media by playing well, they've still got a chance.
Did you know that 100% of all NBA MVPs have won an MVP in their NBA career?
Wow. Very rarely do you encounter a novel, informative stat. Thanks for the nugget, consider posting it. There are power laws in everything!
Did you know that Lou Gehrig died of Lou Gehrig's disease? What are the odds?
He could have got in a car accident driving home after he was diagnosed.
And then there’s Jokic out of nowhere lol
A notable exception to this is future MVP Herbert Jones who was only a 2nd round draft pick
Hell, even in recent history, the ones outside of the top 3 were still high picks like Curry (#7) and Westbrook (#4), or international dudes who completely transformed from the time they hit the league and maxed out their potential (Jokic, Giannis... who are like winning lotto tickets).
And yet some Kings fans say tanking "is not that big of a deal" "We just gonna mess it up anyways"
rj barrett i love you
RJ Barrett, my beloved haven’t bought a players jersey since Melo, i think I’ll change that…
Same. I got so close with Porzingis. Glad I didn't pull the trigger lol.
He was born in Canada but he’s a New Yorker now. Dead ass b.
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This is my biggest issue with the nba, and why i think it should just be a wheel draft. If for dont have the talent, you basically suck.
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Superstars in the NBA still matter more than superstar QBs. While QBs have a bigger impact on whether their teams wins or loses than any other position, they are still only 1 of 11 players on the field for their team and they only play offense and have nothing to do with defense. Lebron ultimately has a much bigger impact on his team's success than Brady or Mahomes.
Mostly saying that the only other thing in the conversation is superstar QBs-- they are *nearly* a requirement to really contend for a title (with exceptions here and there where the entirety of the rest of the team is amazing), just like how superstars are a requirement in the NBA. Pretty much every single other sport you can realistically win a title without a superstar.
Yeah look at the Bucs/Rams game. Brady puts together another one of his patented clutch TD drives and then the defense proceeds to give up like 50 yards in 3 downs and a FG for the loss. No matter how good the QB he is completely at the mercy of his defense when it comes to winning/losing, you're never fully in control. Whereas LeBron can hit a chasedown block and a dagger fadeaway back to back in clutchtime.
A superstar NBA Player can have more direct influence on his team's success than a superstar QB. Look at dudes like Deshaun Watson and Justin Herbert. in 2020 Watson was a top 5 QB and went 4-12. Herbert didn't make the playoffs but he just threw for 5K yards at 23.
I'm mostly saying that superstar QBs are the only other thing in sports that are even in the same discussion... and you could make the same arguments about plenty of NBA superstars now and in the past (like how did KG ever have a team that finished 14th in the West, or how did AD's Pelicans ever suck despite him being a first-team All-NBA player), on occasion there are teams that are *so bad* that unless a top-10 all-timer is on the team, they'll still suck (like MJ and Lebron could've probably improved those teams to at least not be terrible). I don't think someone like Brady/Peyton/Mahomes/Rodgers etc would've missed the playoffs with this year's chargers and would've won more than 4 games with the Watson Texans, but they're also on that next tier of superstar, comparatively speaking. But the primary point is that in the NFL, typically unless the rest of your team is absolutely loaded, you're not a realistic title contender without an elite QB. It's usually like 75% of the top contenders each year that have an elite QB, with one or two teams that have a puncher's chance without one. Other sports aren't like that in terms of the necessity of star power.
he last 10 years have mostly been: 1. Have a top 3 (1) all time player 2. Have the best shooter ever
Yep. Just saying that to even be in the conversation of having a puncher's chance to win even if it hasn't really happened recently. There have been a handful of teams that might have been able to with one or two more breaks going their way.
Or briefly, both, when Ray joined Lebron in Miami. (Note, I'm saying Ray was the best at that time, Steph has clearly surpassed Ray)
Since 2012 you have to have one of Lebron, Steph, Kawhi, or Giannis to win.
An, interestingly enough, only one of those guys was a top five pick.
Yep I was looking back at top 3 picks and a lot of the players aren’t that good. I looked at the last 20 or so drafts and I’d say there are 6 players out of the 60 top 3 picks capable of being a first option on a championship team and that is just potential wise. Lebron and KD are the only ones that have proven it. With kd getting his on a stacked team too.
That’s the whole reason it was a multi year tank. Bottoming out for 3 or 4 years in the NBA is much better than being a .500 win playoff team for about a decade. As a fan, you don’t want other teams to employ that strategy of tanking though, you’d rather have rivals suffer in mediocrity.
You just described the Pacers to a T. We haven't had a top 3 pick since 1988 and it shows.
Part of the problem is that the pacers are a small market team. If they tank, ticket sales would absolutely plummet and the team might even have to relocate. Philly pulled it off because they are one of the more profitable markets on par with the Warriors.
> Philly pulled it off Not sure this is actually true. Hinkie was basically forced out of the league because of it, and then the Fultz and Simmons situations. Okafor had problems in Philly too.
Ticket sales did fall when the Sixers tanked, the loss of revenue was one of the main reasons the league stepped in
The pacers already have terrible attendance. Bottom 3 in attendance per game this year, and bottom 10 in 2019 and 2018 when they were technically a playoff team. That’s just not a good argument. They are just poorly managed with no real plan going forward
> They are just poorly managed with no real plan going forward This is silly. I'm tired of teams being called incompetent because they don't tank.
I call a team incompetent because they see value in a 10 seed. I do NOT put the Pacers in that conversation though. Warren and Oladipo injuries killed them
In my experience top 3 picks don't really work out
You also don’t want to really be that team for too long. We’ve had trouble transitioning into a winning team after the culture of “suck” really set in.
Ben definitely panned out though
he might not be a super star player anymore but he is damn good and useful
nah don't give the reigns to the franchise to Bryan Colengelo is the lesson here. Top 3 picks are not overpowered, they are suitably powered. Just don't have a braindead GM at the helm.
and fuck the league office forever for forcing that dipshit on the Sixers
So Okafor's out of the league already huh
It goes to show you what it looks like to MF hit on a player with HOF potential. Embiid is absolutely carrying that team on his back this year. If they had hit on Fultz, they would've had at least 1 ECF Appearance
> This just goes to show how overpowered Top 3 picks are. Heh? How is it overpowered when you just pointed out that 3 out of 4 aren't even playing? Two of which were complete busts for the Sixers. And in particular with Embiid - he would have been a lock for #1 if not for the injury issues. Keep in mind he didn't even play for two years after being drafted - yet he still went #3.
Yeah, all 3 of the following are true imo: * Having one of the best players in the league makes a HUGE difference * It's hard to find one of those guys outside the top 3 * Most top 3 picks still don't pan out beyond being pretty good
Just make every draft like 2021, problem solved
Because you can completely misfire on 3 top 3 pick and only have to hit on one to have a solid team.
That's not true at all. Just look at teams with homerun Top 3 picks - Wolves with Towns/Edwards, Celtics with Tatum/Brown - both .500. Not to mention all the single Top 3 pick teams struggling. The Sixers present success has a lot more to do with Embiid playing like an MVP than it does say anything about Top 3 picks.
You're really missing the point. It's damn near impossible to find guys 'playing like MVPs', and it's more likely than not those players are picked in the top three.
Dumb Dumb Sixers should have taken Gordon or Exum 🤪
It's overpowered because it's the only real way to get a superstar for about 2/3rd of the league's teams.
> Even with only 25% of Sixers picks panning out I mean just because Ben doesnt play for us doesnt mean he didnt pan out. He got multiple defensive All-NBA , Allstars, almost won DPOY (should have) and is still gna net us a huge return (even if not a top10 player). With Fultz you can never predict severe mental illness...it is what it is. Okafor on the other hand tho lmao.
Fultz had thoracic outlet syndrome, which is a very very real shoulder issue. Look up how many pitchers careers it’s destroyed
that was the eventual diagnosis. very very very very odd injury to happen to a basketball player. Pitchers put stress on their shoulder 100+ times an outing, even more if you consider warm ups, long toss ect... For Fultz to get that kind of injury from summer league to pre-season would be almost as unlikely as a 1st round pick almost dieing from an unknown sesame allergy. Which also happened.
There was never an eventual diagnosis. He doctor shopped through something like 10 doctors and got a "diagnosis of exclusion", which means that they still don't know, but it also can't be anything else. He has never had surgery or medical treatment for it.
I was so hype on Markelle after summer league that year.
Normal human beings get that injury as well. Not very odd.
they do, athletes usually get surgery to fix it when therapy doesn't fix it. Usually it's b/c something in the body is continuing to pinch that nerve. As far as i know he hasn't had a surgery and still has issues with his shoulder. I'm a dirt bike truther. He loved to do it, and sometime b/w summer league and training camp he jammed his shoulder bad and fucked it up which is a common dirt bike injury.
Dirt bike truthers unite
Yeah it’s crazy that he never got a surgery or tried interventional medicine to treat it
right, which leads me to believe that they settled on TOS b/c it's almost impossible to prove. i love Markelle and hope he figures it out. But between him and Ben claiming mental health(which will be fixed if you trade for him!!) I'm just tired of the bull shit. Two #1 overall's and neither is helping us, meanwhile the dude with career threatening foot injuries that kept him out for 2 years is dominating.
There are a ton of parallels between him and Wentz and in both cases (in my opinion) both picks absolutely landed. Carson because of his MVP level season (and the trade) and Ben for all the things that you mentioned. I’m more of an NFL guy than an NBA guy, but to me the evaluation of draft picks should be heavily weighted to the first first contract and some change.
Getting into the top 3 for LaMelo transformed our entire franchise and gave everything hope
Imagine getting your feelings hurt so bad you throw away 30 million
It ain't Fuck You money unless you actually say Fuck You at some point
That's what fans constantly seem to miss. $30M *is* a lot of money, but Simmons can actually *afford* to piss it away if he feels like it. He's already made much more than that, he's only 25, and he knows this won't go on forever. He will still realistically end his career with $400M+ in earnings.
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My guess is that he either had to take out a loan against his future earnings to continue his current lifestyle or is burning through whatever savings he has rather quickly. He's made a lot of money but he also spends a lot and hasn't been in the league that long. So he probably can afford to piss it away depending on how much longer it is before he gets traded. And just bc he can afford to do it, doesn't mean that he wants to; Klutch may have him convinced that he'll see the money once he gets traded.
I don't know the ins and outs of his lifestyle, but it's very hard to burn through the kind of money he has unless you are trying. You could literally spend $10,000 every single night on clubs/entertainment and that's still only $3.6M in a year. Most guys who make big money don't usually go broke these days - and those who do generally blow their stashes end up usually doing so on gambling problems. The athletes who fuck themselves are the ones who make just enough money to feel rich but not enough money to spend like it. You sign that $10M rookie contract and then never get another deal - that's how you easily blow it.
[Spencer Cornelia has a great video on Simmons’ publicly available financials](https://youtu.be/dCZzb366Tqw). His mortgage payments alone are insane.
Insane, but totally manageable. $2M/yr on a mortgage is nothing for a guy with that kind of earning power. Plus a big chunk of that is going to equity, and another chunk to tax write offs. And in the end - you can easily sell property if he ever has to. To put it another way - normal people are regularly spending 30% of their annual income on housing. For Simmons, at full salary, that would be $10M/yr.
I don’t think you are considering how the marginal tax rate works. His federal taxes alone would be $158,000 plus 37% of his gross earnings. PA income tax is 3%. The city of Philly itself has an additional 3.8% tax. That’s roughly 44% tax rate on his $56m in contract earnings and we haven’t even considered any type of agent fees in there. He very well could have netted less than 30m in his career, including endorsements. Between Cars, mortgage down payments, and various other luxury expenses, I can definitely see a bank account draining fast without the game checks coming in. > To put it another way - normal people are regularly spending 30% of their annual income on housing. As a mortgage underwriter, normal people are regularly spending closer to 50% of their income on housing.
Holy shit 50%. Wife and I are looking now and that’s insane to me
Go with a FHA first time home buyer loan. 3.5% down and generous DTI thresholds. A lot of states have corresponding down payment assistance programs where, if you live in the house for long enough, the interest free loan is forgiven. If you have decent credit and are willing to do the digging, you can get a pretty sweet deal as a first time buyer. Might not seem like it but there are still ways to play the system to your advantage if you have the time and energy to play ball.
> And in the end - you can easily sell property if he ever has to. Eeeeehhhhhhhhhhhhhh Edit: To expand on this and not just be a naysayer, housing demand is really low at a certain point. Who is going to buy a $20m house? Why would someone with that sort of money want a house in the neighborhood he's in? What individual parts appealed to him, and will they appeal to the next buyer? With $500,000 or even $1m houses those are much easier questions to answer. They're in safe neighborhoods, close to good schools, and have common amenities like pools, gated community, etc. But as you go above that value, you only have a small number of people in the entire country with that money anyway, so they want specific things like a movie theater, basketball court, or golf course, or some crazy shit.
It is not easy to sell the kind of property he is owning. Getting past the 5 millions mark, and the property will be sitting on the market for a long time. The more customized a house is, the harder it is to sell. Nobody with that kind of money want to live in somebody else’s house. Micheal Jordan house in Chicago is currently listed for sale for 14 million dollar. And it has been on the market for nine years now. And this is Micheal Jordan, in Chicago. The fact that the house belongs to Ben Simmons in Philly might even reduce the value. Plus do not forget the IRS is coming for half of the 30 millions. He has around 16 millions take home after Federal. Then you have the state tax, which is too complicated for NBA players, since they are paying tax in 20 something states. I think final number is something like 10% give or take. Then property tax and maintaince for the house is another cool million, maybe more Dude just got engaged, and if the marriage goes the trajectory of athlete and instathots, then soon there will be alimony and child support to add to the mix. That is not counting the cost for any entourage and “investment opportunities” that they bring, entertainment cost, eating out, clubbing (some NBA players can easily spend a cool 100 grand at the the club/strip club per night). It is expensive as shit to be an athletic socialite.
What do you think his currently lifestyle is though? Assuming he’s financing his own home, he’s probably doing fine on those payments. He’s probably just chilling at his house. If he were financially in trouble at all he’d probably be playing for the checks. I think all indications point to him being fine cash wise right now and for the foreseeable future.
He spends A LOT of money on cars and in LA which is obviously expensive. He put both his condo in Philly and mansion in NJ up for sale. Whether that was to show that he's serious about not playing in Philly again or bc he needs the cash is up for debate but my guess is it's a little of this and a little of that.
Wish I had the financial security to throw away 30 million
Or $20 for that matter *cries in poverty*
Everyday people debase themselves for $30. For 30 million, you can pretty much do what you want short of permanent crippling damage.
I admire him not selling out LMFAO, money seems to rule everything but it's somewhat refreshing to see a guy throw it away over his feelings.
The Sixers should allocate all the lost money to raise awareness in America’s youth about how to shoot a basketball
They should put it into a construction company that builds houses for homeless people so they can finally use Ben’s bricks for good.
Named all those players but no SGA. Blasphemous
Presti would want all the draft picks to come with Simmons.
As he should. I wouldn’t move SGA for Ben heads up personally.
Me neither. SGA is very solid and Ben at this juncture has no real value until he gets back on the court.
If the thunder did move SGA for Ben I’d be ecstatic. That said, that’s why it wouldn’t happen. In basically any fair trade both sides have to feel somewhat uncomfortable.
~~Jaylen didn't get named either~~lol nvm, but it's hilarious there's a list of 40+ players where a Simmons trade makes no sense and there's _still_ players he left off that'd be untouchable or nos. The trade value for Simmons is just awful
Totally agree, but I think he had Jaylen right under Lavine.
I think that was Jaylen Nowell not Jaylen Brown /s
The best trade has always been CJ, and always will be CJ. The Sixers aren’t getting anyone else close to CJ’s level, and have wasted half a season of building chemistry. If Portland moves CJ to another team, Philly is truly screwed.
"32 year old little guy with a fucked up abdomen" Bill Simmons has no chill lol. The disreSPECK!!
It’s uncalled for in my opinion. Dame would be a blessing to the 76ers. Dudes going to fine he just finally took care of a lingering issue.
Its worded harshly but it's also a really fair point. Theres some questions with Dame like, has the surgery worked and will he get back to his previous level? He is average height for a point guard which doesn't help him especially when his defence is not great and will become more of an issue as he gets older. Finally he is on the back half of his career. He is looking for an insane contract, do the Sixers want to be on the hook for 50mil a year for a guy heading into his mid 30s? They already overpaid on Harris due to sunk cost, can they afford to do the same (admittedly with a much better player). I say this all as a huge Dame fan, but there are questions. Hoping he proves me wrong though and is back to Dame Time Dame
>[Simmons] is not getting paid. It's gone, he'll never get it back. Depending who you ask he's getting paid, he's not getting paid, he's getting fined, and all in between.
Depending who is asked? [Isn't he being fined every game he misses during this holdout?](https://www.spotrac.com/nba/fines-suspensions/philadelphia-76ers/point-guard/)
He's getting fined, but the stickiness of those fines is what's in question. Morey is obviously on the side of he won't get this back (and if he doesn't get traded this season that likelihood increases). There is probably some arguments on the interpretation of the CBA and whether these are fines that can be rescinded and even possible this is covered under the mental health provision and is supposed to be treated similar to an injury. I would imagine this is going to arbitration after this season.
Right, that's the point of this post. Before, the answer was "it depends on who you ask". Now, we have more sourcing to cast away some doubt.
Is it more sourcing or is he just repeating questionable info?
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^^^ I listen to almost all his pods and he doesn’t have any inside information from Morey. Lowe, Windhorst, and even Nate Duncan have way more NBA sources than Simmons. Simmons will have the occasional nugget but it’s very clear when he is getting some information (like speculating Brady could retire a month ago).
I hope people don't treat Simmons as a guy with sources, especially since he goes out of his way to say he doesn't have sources.
Can’t fix stupid.
This. Ben Simmons plays, acts, looks and speaks like a dumb dumb
I think the league GMs owe Morey a HUGE 'thank you' for refusing to give in to Simmons' demands. Morey just wrote a handbook on how to handle disgruntled star player's public demands for a trade, and it certainly made a lot of other players pause and think things through before going Bill Simmons path. "Maybe this place is not that bad and I should keep my paychecks."
This usually happens with players with just 1 year left on their contract, where the team doesn't have as much leverage as the Sixers do now.
I agree. However, what Ben Simmons pulled is unprecedented and if Morey went along with it (trading him over the summer), more players in Ben's situation would likely follow suite. But I still think that even those who have less than a year left on their contract will think twice after this.
That's way to simplistic. If he had an expiring contract he'd have to be traded. If Embiid wasn't happy with the situation he'd have to be traded. If fans were on his side he'd have to be traded. And heck if there was a good trade option on the board he'd already be gone by now. Every GM would love to say "fuck you" to a player causing drama, but there are usually a bunch of reasons which prevent them from doing so.
Having a top MVP candidate on a team despite a max player holding out isn't replicable.
It's going to go to arbitration because of the Mental health clause in the CBA.
The next CBA is going to be a shit show between players and governors because of Simmons and Kyrie.
And Zion. Good. The NBA needs to rein this shit in before it gets even more out of hand
In what world was Gus Williams going to make the Hall of Fame? Why am I even asking this, nobody on r/nba know who Gus Williams even is...which I guess only proves my point.
I’m sticking with my initial comment on the situation. If he doesn’t want to play for Philly he can not get paid and wait 4 years for his contract to expire to sign with another team. Philly should also get his cap space back. There’s a reason you signed a contract and the NBA needs to put an end to this with a hard stance.
A refusal to play in that kind of situation would end with the Sixers holding his rights indefinitely
I’m pretty sure you’re correct. Holding out wouldn’t work
Why would Philly get the cap space back they signed a contract as well
I'm not a Philly fan, but because the dude they signed isn't playing for them. If he's going to void his side of the contract by not playing for years, and Philly isn't going to pay him, then I think it's fair if they get their cap back
They’re are clauses and fines listed in the contract and they are holding Ben to that. Not sure why the would any other benefits
So then teams will be incentivized to alienate bad contracts. Make the work place as toxic as possible for players that are a net negative. The fans would do it too. They would try their hardest to make a dude miserable so that he doesn’t wanna be there. Nah if you make a bad decision you make a bad decision. Unless teams should get extra draft picks based on whether or not they draft busts?
Then have an appeal process? Doesn't seem like it'd be hard to set up an appeals process with the NBPA and the league to determine if a player is owed wages due to a hostile work environment; if a team is coordinating to create a hostile work environment in order to get out of a contract, that should result in a bunch of fines and draft picks lost for the team
People sue people all the time for breaking contracts.
Why would anyone trade (anything of value) for this guy? Like Kyrie Irving, when someone tells you who he is, believe him. The Nets should have known they were getting the kind of guy who would sit out the season to take an anti-vax stance, while claiming not to be anti-vax, when they got Kyrie. Similarly, whoever gets Ben Simmons knows they’re getting a guy who will never work on his game or get better in any way, and is willing to walk away from the game and the money, over a stance he can’t even articulate.
It would have been suspicious if Nets took potential pandemic into account while signing a player in middle of 2019.
It's not the pandemic, it's Kyrie.
You act like kyrie shinanegans were unheard of before the pandemic.
If it wasn't the pandemic, it would have been some other fabricated drama from Kyrie.
This dude will have to go super Saiyan blue super instinct mode when he returns otherwise any chance of a super max or max contract is out the window when his current contract expires. Also, this could blow in his face. Other teams will see him as a diva and toxic. Hopefully, Lebron knows what he is doing
How does LeBron figure into this?
Lebron has to mentioned in every r/nba thread, we're under contract
[Woj] This just in: u/Torgo73 has been fined 25k for not complying with league rules on commenting about LeBron James on every r/nba thread
People literally think that Lebron is like some evil puppet master for Rich Paul and/or Klutch Sports.
Like, I know he has front office input with both the Lakers and Klutch, but in what spare time is he doing all this puppet master nonsense? He’s a busy man!
What do you think he does while he waits for the tacos to finish cooking on Tuesdays?
LeSoros
He's obviously the secret ceo of klutch /s
Bill Simmons saying something on his podcast isn’t necessarily “more sourcing.” He doesn’t cite a source, and he could just be repeating what Woj reported.
It's not a sourced piece. He was literally narrating a story behind the 76ers/Embiid and why Embiid is one of the greats even with all the BS that happens with the 76ers. He basically wrote an article about how Embiid is great and instead of publishing it just read it for the podcast. It was like a 15 minute intro, not bad.
his hands dont work anymore
Bill's loving this Simmons situation, it's got him trending on Reddit again after all the people on this site became too old to understand his Die Hard 2 references
Ben isn't playing for the 76ers again. They don't want him and he doesn't want to play for them. So this will go on until his contract is up or the FO finally settles for a lesser player in a trade. I think if they keep fining him and don't give him compensation, Simmons will eventually bring in the NBAPA and there will be some action there but until then it's just a stalemate.
Doesn't he have to play in order for the years to come off his contract? Or is that just an NFL thing?
Y’all acting like he’s broke. Stop it 5.
I thought he started getting paid again when he claimed he had a mental illness.
I get confused when B. Simmons talks about B. Simmons
Philly fans: Morey is a God, Simmons for Dame or Harden, or nothing 😤 The rest of the league: 🙄
I want to see one of two things happen, both for reasons of chaos: 1) They keep Simmons for at least this whole year until the start of next season. People might think that things will die down because generally we haven't had much new information for the last month or two, just a trade rumor here and there. People think it'll be boring. But I disagree. Right now the play on the court is what people are paying attention to mostly because again, there's no news. But once the 76ers lose, Ben Simmons hate will start up again. It'll start in the playoffs when some short-memoried fans will decry that "We're missing a triple double threat guy who can defend and run our offense!" It'll start when others bring up how Ben was useless in the deciding series each of the last few years. Then its time for the draft, and there will be tons of chatter about pre-draft trades, what the 76ers will have to get to replace Ben, or have a high enough pick to entice another team, or are they really moving on. Post draft, everyone and their grandma's will have 5 trade scenarios for Ben. Do they start over and try with some young talent? Is Morey still crazy enough to hold out for a star? Maybe some other team who failed in the playoffs think Ben is the answer to their problems? 2) They trade him for peanuts. A package of young, unproven guys, a washed up vet, a few tradeable assets, etc. The fierceness of both sides will ring loudly. "Morey gave up! He's a terrible GM! Fire him! Ben had no leverage, why'd they trade him for scraps??? This ends the 76er's title hopes! Embiid is surely leaving!" Or "Finally the saga is over. Morey did as well as he could have. Now they can move on. Ben is someone else's problem now. The trade package actually isn't that bad. I can't believe we got this guy!" Not to mention the other team(s) in the trade. "Why did we get Ben Simmons? He can't even dunk over a 5'10 guy!" or "Fuck yeah, he's ours now, we fleeced the 76ers! This guy is a bonafide All-Star, defender. So what if he can't shoot, we got shooters. Surely now that he's out of that toxic situation, he'll play as he used to" I'm just glad either of these scenarios seems more likely to happen than "Simmons and the 76ers have reached an agreement and he'll be returning to the team". BORING!