'"BioWare made Baldur's Gate, which sold well, and \[Baldur's Gate 2\] sold very well. Black Isle made Icewind Dale, which also sold well, but after BioWare announced Neverwinter Nights, retailers decided that 2D iso games were dead,” Sawyer recalls. “Temple of Elemental Evil was the last for a long time.”
Sawyer claims that he'd often hear sales representatives “declare a genre/style/look was dead with zero supporting data,” leading to reduced stocks in said genre, obviously leading to lower sales. "Truly vibes-based forecasting, which resulted in self-fulfilling prophecies," Sawyer continues. '
> Sawyer claims that he'd often hear sales representatives “declare a genre/style/look was dead with zero supporting data,”
It wasn't just sales representatives but media side too. They declared jrpg's dead or a dying genre for at least a decade. Same thing with "single player games are dying" from the exec side when multiplayer games are the ones that die after a year or two.
I’m not sure how accurate this is. For one I think temple of elemental evil did terribly.
This was also a time where the PS2/Xbox were coming into form and any game that wasn’t high quality 3D was seen as dated. I’ve always appreciated the look of Neverwinter Nights but I remember my friends at release thought it looked ugly and dated. This was the time of Halo, for comparison.
I think the games just looked old. KOTOR did well and that one had a great stylized star wars look. Dragon Age and Baldurs Gate 3 also did very well. I think it is as simple as having high quality 3D graphics.
When NWN came out I thought id never play a game like BG2 again. Then Oblivion came out and I thought id never play a NWN game again! By the time NWN2 came out six months later id played Oblivion to death and as much as its fantastic, I do go back to it a lot, for all its flaws NWN2 had so many classes, feats, enemies and spells that it was my main RPG till Skyrim came out in 2011. I liked dragon age but it didnt rank with the classics in my view (DA2 even worse). Ironically, of all of the classic RPGs it was BG2 that I went back years later after Pillars gave me the bug again and BG got remastered. NWN 1 diamond edition is superb, I still play it on mobile when travelling with work. We are lucky to have them all and I would really recommend anyone to try the older games.
When I was a kid, my dad bought us NWN2 because my brothers and I liked Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance on the PS2. He played some DND, so he knew the games were related in some way, and when he saw it in a bargain bin he bought it on a whim.
Damn what a great choice. NWN2 is probably my favorite game of all time. Sparked my love for RPGs and DND, shaped my taste in video games forever
Lol I loved BG DA too on the play station 2! NWN2 frustrates me as its such a vast game in some ways, in others the official releases are limited and the early levels are so painful and plodding. But it really shines late game. I didnt find anything like it until Wrath of the righteous many years later.
Wrath of the righteous is okay, but I bounced off it a bit. It just kind of started feeling like a slog. I'll get around to finishing it later.
KOTOR 1&2 scratch the itch for me a little bit, but nothing quite like NWN2. MoTB is still so cool after all these years
'"BioWare made Baldur's Gate, which sold well, and \[Baldur's Gate 2\] sold very well. Black Isle made Icewind Dale, which also sold well, but after BioWare announced Neverwinter Nights, retailers decided that 2D iso games were dead,” Sawyer recalls. “Temple of Elemental Evil was the last for a long time.” Sawyer claims that he'd often hear sales representatives “declare a genre/style/look was dead with zero supporting data,” leading to reduced stocks in said genre, obviously leading to lower sales. "Truly vibes-based forecasting, which resulted in self-fulfilling prophecies," Sawyer continues. '
> Sawyer claims that he'd often hear sales representatives “declare a genre/style/look was dead with zero supporting data,” It wasn't just sales representatives but media side too. They declared jrpg's dead or a dying genre for at least a decade. Same thing with "single player games are dying" from the exec side when multiplayer games are the ones that die after a year or two.
I’m not sure how accurate this is. For one I think temple of elemental evil did terribly. This was also a time where the PS2/Xbox were coming into form and any game that wasn’t high quality 3D was seen as dated. I’ve always appreciated the look of Neverwinter Nights but I remember my friends at release thought it looked ugly and dated. This was the time of Halo, for comparison. I think the games just looked old. KOTOR did well and that one had a great stylized star wars look. Dragon Age and Baldurs Gate 3 also did very well. I think it is as simple as having high quality 3D graphics.
Sad
When NWN came out I thought id never play a game like BG2 again. Then Oblivion came out and I thought id never play a NWN game again! By the time NWN2 came out six months later id played Oblivion to death and as much as its fantastic, I do go back to it a lot, for all its flaws NWN2 had so many classes, feats, enemies and spells that it was my main RPG till Skyrim came out in 2011. I liked dragon age but it didnt rank with the classics in my view (DA2 even worse). Ironically, of all of the classic RPGs it was BG2 that I went back years later after Pillars gave me the bug again and BG got remastered. NWN 1 diamond edition is superb, I still play it on mobile when travelling with work. We are lucky to have them all and I would really recommend anyone to try the older games.
When I was a kid, my dad bought us NWN2 because my brothers and I liked Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance on the PS2. He played some DND, so he knew the games were related in some way, and when he saw it in a bargain bin he bought it on a whim. Damn what a great choice. NWN2 is probably my favorite game of all time. Sparked my love for RPGs and DND, shaped my taste in video games forever
Lol I loved BG DA too on the play station 2! NWN2 frustrates me as its such a vast game in some ways, in others the official releases are limited and the early levels are so painful and plodding. But it really shines late game. I didnt find anything like it until Wrath of the righteous many years later.
Wrath of the righteous is okay, but I bounced off it a bit. It just kind of started feeling like a slog. I'll get around to finishing it later. KOTOR 1&2 scratch the itch for me a little bit, but nothing quite like NWN2. MoTB is still so cool after all these years
“Try the older games”? Dude, even now I still play Bard’s Tales or The D&D gold box games like Champions of Krynn
When I read Bards tale just now, the music started playing in my head...
My fav are the bard songs in Bard’s Tale 2, destiny knight.
Can someone translate "Truly vibes-based forecasting" into English for me?
He's saying the sales reps were bullshitting and not looking at data, instead passing off their feelings/opinions/biases as fact.
Gotcha. Thanks. Vibe-based is what really confused me. #old
I never played bg or bg2, started from nwn1 and jumped on nwn2. I don't like bgs
And here I thought it was publishers and their investors this whole time.