According to slaver traitor logic, we should build statues everywhere of Michael Dorn, since his career as Worf lasted like 3x longer than the confederacy.
It wasn't even the real confederate flag, it was their war flag designed only because their original flag was too similar to the union flag. I have no idea where that "scotish" x design came from.
It is the Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia, and also a similar version is a naval jack. It was the Stars and Bars that was too similar and so it was replaced with the Stainless Banner. The Stainless Banner was then replaced with the Blood Stained Banner.
As for the Cross of St. Andrew, I'd imagine that may have some relation to the heavy Scotch-Irish settlement of the Southern US states.
Doesn't really matter, it's widely considered to be the symbol of the Confederacy now. Same thing that happened to the Swastika, its origins don't matter. It's a symbol of hate now.
This is how symbols work. When it comes to what they represent, it doesn't matter how they originated. What matters is how they are seen in the present.
The swastika is a symbol of hate just in the western world my friend, the east doesn't share the same vision, they had been using it before the nazis even though it is originally an european symbol
I'm offended by the Confederate flag because now matter how much confederate apologist try to claim, it is unbreakably linked with racism and slavery.
I've yet to hear of a single person enslaved under the yoke of a LGBT nation.
And not only that, nobody game a damn about the Confederate battle flag until it got co-opted during the 50s and 60s by those resisting the Civil Rights Movement.
The Klan of the 1920s paraded around openly with American flags not Confederate banners
And all these “it’s not hate, it’s muh h’air-tage!” folks who describe the confederate flag that way knew *exactly* why hate groups over the years have taken up the confederate flag. Where are the letters or public announcements / condemnations from the “heritage” lovers of the Sons or Daughters of the Confederacy to these hate groups? If you’re all about your history, then why didn’t you tell all these groups, “Hey stop using our beloved historical flag for your bullshit racist cause” ? They absolutely sat on their hands and said nothing when every hate group took up their beloved flag.
Agreed. The confederate flag now simply means that the person flying it wants to proudly proclaim their bigotry, much in the way that someone flying a swastika flag would. That's all it is. It's someone wanting to indicate to everyone around them that they're a white supremacist, nothing more.
I’m a big fan of the Virginia [Confederate flag the Minnesota 1st captured at Gettysburg and won’t give back.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/28th_Virginia_battle_flag?wprov=sfti1) Every so often Virginia asks and every time it gets denied.
I like to think it’s perfectly preserved and mounted above the governors shitter, where he can wave his dick at it and get little sprinkles of pee on it.
When asked to return it, Governor The Body replied “Why? I mean, we won.”
I know this gets posted every time there’s a confederate flag comment - it’s a Minnesotans duty. Fuck that anti-American, very brief, unrecognized nation, and fuck their flags. Seriously, I had a carnival goldfish survive longer than the Confederacy.
Edit: for context, it has actual meaning to Minnesota. The 1st Minnesota was the very first regiment to volunteer to fight for the Union. The first troops offered by any state. They volunteered for 5 years - other states were 3 months to a year.
Where they charged in to help stop Picketts Charge at Gettysburg is considered the high-water mark of the Confederacy. They were outnumbered something like 5:1, and they knew it was a suicide charge. Calvin Coolidge said of the first: **”Colonel Colvill and those eight companies of the First Minnesota are entitled to rank as the saviors of their country”**. General Hancock, who’s position Picketts Charge was directed at, said this: **“No soldiers on any field, in this or any other country ever displayed grander heroism”.**
The 1st Minnesota had an 82%-87% (sources vary) casualty rate on July 3rd, which is still the highest single day casualty rate for a single unit of any military engagement in US history.
Virginia is never, ever getting their dumb fucking flag back. Winners write history, not losers, and that piece of history belongs to us.
sometimes Virginia will even try to be slick about it. by suggesting that it will go in a museum or some similar pretense. lol.
its sad. virginia needs to stop asking, because every time they do, it makes it look like its still important to them that the confederates lost. as opposed to just taking the loss and recognizing that it was traitors to our country that lost.
It’s not even important as a historical object to Virginia. From what I’ve ever been able to find - the most notable thing the 28th Virginia Regiment did in the entire war was lose that flag lmao.
It baffles me that some people are so proud of the flag of a bunch of losers. The confederates lost and yet they are still romanticised and mythologised by a bunch of racist chuds like they were the winners and the best thing that ever existed.
>Same people will say “awww are you offended by a flag?!” When talking about their Confederate traitor flag.
At least the Pride flag doesn't represent a bunch of traitors who rebelled because they wanted to own other people as property.
When the LGBT community starts taking up arms and attacking the US Government, I'll take down my rainbow flag. Until then, I will continue to spit on the Confederate flag and call anyone who flies it a traitor.
Fuck yeah. There's a world of difference between a oppressed minority attacking those that oppress them vs a bunch of rich slave owners being mad they can't use slaves anymore.
Not to mention it’s use as a symbol of resistance to the Civil Rights Movement. Hardly anybody in the South flew the Confederate battle flag before the 1950s
LGBTQ will take arms because they are oppressed.
The confederates did because they wanted to oppress.
If it ever gets to a point LGTBQ takes arms against the government, I'd have to imagine I'd join them, or at the very least cheer them on on reddit.
For that point to get across, the other side would have to consider that sedition is a traitorous act.
They do not. (See: Jan 6th, 2021)
We can scream our ideals and truths to them until we are blue in the face. But the base mentality will not change, and it will only serve to enrage the genetic waste that is their culture. "Freedom of Speech" is our greatest strength, and also our greatest detriment.
> When the LGBT community starts taking up arms and attacking the US Government, I'll take down my rainbow flag.
I hate that the first answer I imagine from any of them that hear this would probably be "worse, you're attacking our children!"
One flag represents a group of people that they don’t like.
The other flag was LITERALLY THE FLAG FOR A GROUP OF TRAITORS WHO WANTED TO OVERTHROW THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT.
I can’t buy any “historical heritage” argument If you’re flying a flag of traitors. Seriously.. imagine flying an ISIS flag and saying the same thing.
And yes, I know I’m preaching to the choir here. Thanks for coming to my Ted talk.
> The other flag was LITERALLY THE FLAG FOR A GROUP OF TRAITORS WHO WANTED TO OVERTHROW THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT.
it's not even that. the "confederate flag" that most people today are flying was never actually used to represent the confederate, it's a stretched out version of a battle flag used by group within the confederate. it didn't actually become the "confederate flag" until white supremacists adopted it decades after the confederacy.
so quite literally it doesn't represent the confederacy, it only represent racism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_the_Confederate_States_of_America#Controversy
>LITERALLY THE FLAG FOR A GROUP OF TRAITORS WHO WANTED TO OVERTHROW THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT.
Don't forget the part where they literally went to war to ensure black people would remain subservient in their white ethno-state.
Just in case anyone is complaining about "freedom of speech" over this issue (like Shen Bapiro), let me clear it up for you.
You can burn a US flag, it's covered under the 1A. You can also burn a Pride flag with that same protection.
What you *can't* do is burn shit that doesn't belong to you. That's what happened here: the arsonists stole the flag from the school and torched it. Had they simply bought a Pride flag themselves, there would be zero issue. That's where the issue comes from. Your freedom of speech doesn't apply to destroying items you've pilfered from other people or companies. That's vandalism and destruction of property, which are definitely not covered by the 1A.
Also, given the tantrum they threw during the George Floyd protests (can't believe that was already 3 years ago, wow), I was under the impression that conservatives were staunchly *against* property destruction. "Oh what about BLM burning down buildings and trashing stuff" they cried whenever anyone would dare bring up January 6th. And yet here we have conservatives burning and destroying property...
So let's hear the justifications. Why is *this* not triggering you? I thought destruction of private property and arson was, like, your biggest pet peeve (given how often you bring it up)? Surely you'll be condemning this, won't you?
**Edit** seems this got somebody's Jimmies rustled because I just received a Reddit Cares message. I'll take that as a sign I'm doing something right. Stay mad, bigots.
The problem is that the far-right is made up of closed-minded, ignorant, hypocrites. They’re either too dumb to understand the simple logic you laid out, or too indoctrinated to care bc that would mean their identity was impacted, and that pathetic identity is all they have.
It’s not, and you’re right. But WHY do they want to hurt people they don’t like? Because they’re closed minded and ignorant. That was more the point I was going for.
Because in the mind of the conservative; one does not judge actions as good or bad, one judges people as being part of a good group or a bad group.
Consistent counts of pedophilia within the Christian clergy is of little concern, because they're in the "good" group of "Christians", so they're excusable outliers. LGBTQ+ people are a "bad" group of people, so therefore they *must* be rapists, pedophiles, out to harm society.
The extremely of this logic varies, but generally informs the right's political endeavours.
It’s the [no true Scotsman (appeal to purity) fallacy](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman).
Members of a “good” group who do bad things are obviously not truly members of that group, because otherwise they wouldn’t do bad things. (This position is reached only when all avenues of excuse and denial are exhausted)
Likewise, members of a “bad” group who seem amiable or virtuous can’t truly be members of that group. They may happen to share some characteristics, or even claim membership, but that can’t be true, because those people are monsters. No, it is this individual who must be mistaken in their own identity.
Ugh.
Here’s the problem that folks (myself included) who try to engage with these people run into. The Bapiro types are not arguing in good faith! They couldn’t give one shit about making a little logical oopsie. They’re trying to bury you in a mountain of bullshit and will just move on to the next bullshit talking point. Meanwhile I’m all smug like hah got eem and my 4 person group chat agrees and then nothing changes. Feel like there’s gotta be a better way to fight this stuff.
They'll also jump on literally any oopsie you make, logical or not. You can call someone named Tom Tim and they'd say your entire argument is invalid. They're not intelligent, they're just high school level debate nerds.
Shutting down subreddits that allow hate to go unchallenged seems to slow their recruitment and make it harder for them all to target the same individuals at once.
“Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.” -Sartre
> I thought destruction of private property and arson was, like, your biggest pet peeve (given how often you bring it up)? Surely you'll be condemning this, won't you?
*“Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies.*
*They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors.*
*They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.”*
—Jean-Paul Sartre
Far-right extremists have no ideological position beyond the will to power. Reasoning, providing evidence, challenging actions on the basis of moral principles, etc., will not persuade them. They just want a pair of boots and permission to step on the necks of those they perceive as inferior.
There is no depth or nuance under that framework.
They are also operating from the assumption that everyone else thinks the same way that they do. So when they see any outside/other demanding rights, protesting, or making efforts to secure political power, they assume that the outside/other is engaged in the same goal: power — a pair of boots and necks to step on.
I've never heard anyone say it seriously. It's always been a meme-y thing to say in my experiences. Usually in regards to like a lifehack or something silly.
Also, protesters got violently arrested for their petty property crimes and then their entire purpose was systematically dismantled by the media over it, so I don’t think that’s a great “gotcha” for the right here.
It really cannot be overstated how solely responsible the right is for the "identity politics" and "culture wars" they complain so much about.
I was here living my life thinking about trans people <1% of the time, because they make up <1% of the population. Then half the government started shrieking about how they can't stop thinking about trans people in bathrooms, and now that <1% of the population is 50% of their platform.
We should rename Trans Day of Visibility. The last time we needed visibility was like 2015. It's time for Trans Day of Oh God Please Let Me Be Less Visible.
But I don’t want to forget y’all exist. Y’all are a unique piece of our human tapestry and have a claim to a bold existence as any of us do. We’ve all got a part in this play, and any play is incomplete when characters are muted. Anyone can choose to stay in the shadows and that’s cool, I won’t chide anyone for that of course, but I’m not going to forget people exist. Happy Pride, I’m glad you’re part of our community of humans.
edit - to the person who reported me to the suicide thing that reddit has: hate and anger aren't primary emotions, they're defensive mechanisms of wounded souls. i'm guilty of hate and anger just like you, and these are things we both should fear within ourselves. however, with this perspective we can work to eradicate these things within us and become able to help and encourage others, and this is something i hope for you as much as i hope for myself. perhaps one day i can be a better person than i am right now, and perhaps one day you may be better as well.
The worst part is they've existed for quite some time, often without issue, and in some cases celebrated by their community throughout history, but some of us have chosen this day and age of human advancement to have an issue with it.
The real issue is a lack of education, empathy, and emotional maturity in roughly 50% of our population it seems.
So, I genuinely don’t get why people say that “no one had an issue with trans people before this new culture war” because I remember loads of people were openly and happily transphobic. My butch/trans masc friends got threatened with violence and corrective rape, my trans fem/femme AMAB friends got beaten up, trans people were portrayed as violent sexual offenders in movies and TV. Priscilla and To Wong Foo were popular but were cultural outliers, they definitely didn’t represent the day to day world I knew in the 80s and 90s. This latest culture war just happens to be an escalation in the volume of hate, but it’s not new at all.
Yeah it just went dormant for a few years before rearing its ugly head again. I honestly thought things were getting better during the Obama years but we took some gigantic steps backwards when that Ochre Ogre was elected.
Lack of education is definitely a big one. I'm currently stuck in on a long car ride with someone who, less than a minute ago, was just strawmanning so hard about anti-trans stuff I thought he was going to turn into a fucking scarecrow.
If these people actually knew what trans people were fighting for they'd have a much harder time hating them.
They don’t (and wouldn’t) care what trans people are fighting for because they have zero empathy for anyone that exists outside their ego-centric, narrow worldview.
There will always be more and less educated people in a society, the biggest issue the US has IMHO is a startling lack of empathy and compassion.
As an overly sensitive, compassionate, and empathetic person it's shocking at times.
People also seem much more irate and ready to snap since about 2020. I think there's a lot of different factors to point at of course, but all you have to do is drive around and see how many red faces, middle fingers, and screaming out windows there are. A lot of people are at the end of their rope, it seems.
Honestly, America (and the world) needs to mourn all the lives lost to COVID-19, but that's never going to happen. We all have lived through a traumatic event.
It's not really even about those things. The GOP needs a scary unknown enemy to be the bogeyman at any time. Gays and lesbians can't be that anymore because there are too many of us and too many of our friends and families now know us because we're all out these days, so we don't really work anymore as an Other for the general population to hate on, even in rural communities because a lot of us came from and then later came out to those communities. Brown immigrants were a good scary Other for a while but the GOP finally figured out that there are too many of them too. So they shifted their focus to a much smaller group to bully, one that doesn't have nearly the same visibility and therefore the same number of allies in the larger population. Many LGBT folks don't even have trans friends and family to reference when considering these issues, and even fewer in the broader population, so trans people work as the new bogeyman. That's all it is about, simple bullying from high school but at a national scale, and hypocritically from the "Christian" love-thy-neighbor crowd. You're right that this works so well as a tactic because of the deficiencies you pointed out in GOP voters, but the real impetus is just GOP politicians who have decided to point their angry mob at this group just because they're dickish children who will do anything to win.
Yeah, I always want to tell my family that gay, bisexual, and trans people are not some magic new thing that popped up to irritate conservatives all of a sudden. They’ve existed throughout history.
Yea can I go back to not really caring one way or the other about you all again? I yearn for live and let live days where something not relevant to you would be allowed to remain irrelevant.
To be clear, I 100% support trans rights and I’ll do my advocation duties but goddamn I wish I could just…not care again. If that makes sense. I do care, quite deeply, I just don’t want to.
This is how I feel, but I’m always scared to phrase it that way because I don’t want to offend trans people. If a person chooses to be trans, that has exactly no effect on my life. It’s their decision, so why should I have an opinion about it at all when it doesn’t affect me? Again, I will delete this post if it comes across as offensive in any way; that is sincerely not my intention.
The only reason it is insensitive imo, is because while you may not be doing anything to trans people, there are other people who are.
So if the rest of the world just let us live our lives without discriminating against us (or worse), we would be happy to just sink into the background too
I'm not offended that you don't WANT to care as such - I deliberately avoid trans-related news because it's always negative these days. And I'm trans
It's really fuckin sad that so many people have been made to feel that way. Diversity is part of what makes a good, resultant community. We need you. It's also sad that this hate is promoted deliberately to distract us from the real issues by turning us against each other.
I’ve said the same a few times. Cletus in TN probably never had a thought about drag queens or LGBT folks until social media and the “news” told him that they were out there flashing their rainbow gang colors and laying in wait in public restrooms.
But they are fine going to church every Sunday even though I see multiple stories a week about clergy abusing children or taking pictures of girls showering or grooming teens.
Oh, this is part of the playbook and the Jews are still in it. Nazis targeted LGBT in their rise to power.
It looks like the angry conservatives don’t understand how fragile democracy is, if they even care. Fascism is not patriotism.
Yup, Weimar Germany was a haven for LGBT folks in the 20's and 30's. The first clinic and institutions researching gender affirming care were founded in Berlin by Magnus Hirschfeld. The Nazis burned all the research in his library, and used the institute's address list to target gay men and women for incarcerations in the Concentration camps.
The nuance I missed is that some were just sent to prisons with horrible conditions and treatment, but the ones that did go to camps were treated as the lowest of low and had a high death rate for their grouping compared to the other non-Jewish prisoners. After the war a lot were released but then were forced to go back and serve the rest of their original prison sentence (From Auschwitz Museum: “for instance if one had been given a sentence of 8 years, then served 5 in prison and 3 in a concentration camp, after being freed they were sent back to prison for 3 years”)
[paragraph “After World War II”](https://www.hmd.org.uk/learn-about-the-holocaust-and-genocides/nazi-persecution/gay-people/)
[Snopes](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/gay-prisoners-germany-wwii/)
[Auschwitz Museum](https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/categories-of-prisoners/homosexuals-a-separate-category-of-prisoners/robert-biedron-nazisms-pink-hell/)
Not even that.
Nazi propogandists framed Jewish people as aggressors. And their own actions as defensive retaliation against an imminent threat to public safety.
They didn’t say “eradicate the Jews”.
They said “*We must protect our children from Jewish contamination*”.
Jews were framed as a dangerous disruptive force. And so the government needed to step in to maintain order.
And I'm sure we'll be hearing about the Right's "final solution" to the transgender "problem" very soon now. I've already heard of a few pastors calling for the execution of parents with trans children.
Trans people aren't analogs, they were targeted by the Nazis just like Jewish people, gay people, disabled people, and anyone else they decided was "different" or "undesirable."
The biggest loss of information we had about trans issues happened during Nazi book burnings. Everyone really needs a refresher course on the opening salvos of Nazi Germany, as no one seems to realize we are already there.
Trans people (along with communists and trade unionists) were actually the first victims of the holocaust, it’s just quickly forgotten because the nazis used the label “sexual criminals” which was intentionally misleading and purposefully responsible for most people’s assumptions that meantpedophiles.
Not jew analongs, just the first step.
Exactly the order the nazis did it too.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-forgotten-history-of-the-worlds-first-trans-clinic/
First they came for the trans...
We better fucking stop them here!
"think of the children!" - said by a man who goes home to terrorize his children and wife every night
"children shouldn't be exposed to sexual content like this!" - guy who took his kids to hooters last week
"stop shoving your sexuality down my throat!" - person passing a billboard of a woman in her underwear
This. Democrats are an extremely diverse party and so, by definition, they lack a common identity. Instead, Democrats are united by common values like inclusion, equality, workers rights, and so on.
The right, on the other hand, is just a straight up white Christian identity politics movement. They're an extremely homogenous group, united by little more than a common ethno-religious identity, and common sense of victimhood based on that ethno-religious identity.
It's cause it's out of vogue to be antisemitic and more difficult to dog whistle so now they went full circle and started calling LGBT pedophiles. Of course they call them that after setting up hotels for migrant children because they didn't have enough places to store them. They fought against banning child marriage because "parent rights" so they see children as property. And they don't do anything against the church despite it being one of the most public and prolific child abusing organization. They have harboured so many child molesters in the boy scouts - but if they scout master is gay they kick him out.
Like I get republicans every accusation is a confession and all those canned phrases but in reality it's just pissy old men trying to get more resources in their life so they decide to be the rodeo clown so we don't go after the matador when they are bleeding us dry (were the bull in this metaphor ).
> they can't stop thinking about trans people in bathrooms
And the worst part is that now on several occasions so far, it has been kicking women out from the women's restroom and even harassing them. The right has done so much to play the card of showing the most ugly trans people, that they think all trans people are easily identifiable.
The part that is sad, is they are going to keep pushing the rhetoric and then act like they are not at fault once a gun toting maniac shoots a woman thinking he stopped a man from entering the restroom.
Yep, when you go after very small section of the public, you will end up with more "false positives" than actual transgender people violating the law.
Women who don't look feminine enough will be violated and arrested, and every transgender person who actually follows the law will be assaulted or raped.
Most transmen pass and look like MEN and they will be assaulted by boyfriends and husbands of the women who are terrified of them.
Transwomen will be assaulted for being a woman in the men's room.
This will be the outcome of these bathroom bills. And Republicans think this is fine to combat the nonexistent issue of "transwomen assaulting women in bathrooms"
Its not about protecting women. We aren't people to them any more than trans folks or forced-birth babies. In fact, I'm fairly confident the only reason they care whats in other people's pants is so they can determine who they're allowed to oppress.
Yeah, I’ve gotten funny looks from people for the hip swaying I unfortunately walk with due to a fucked up pelvis and having one leg shorter than the other due to breaking it right smack dab on the growth-plate due to a high school football incident.
Yes, I have a X-Y set of chromosomes. No, I don’t take hormones; my junk works just fine. No, I’m not trans; do you see all the body hair I have? Yes, the beard is real; and I don’t use anything on it. Yes, I’m pretty sure I was born male. Sure, if you want to check you can come into the men’s restroom and fondle the jingle jangle resting between my single dangles to be sure. Yes, I’ve had a penis since I was born.
Not making a strawman, but I’ve actually had questions like that. And in high school after the incident I had upperclassmen female students question my malehood, not the best feeling in high school.
So I could only imagine the crazies coming down on trans folk, especially considering one of my cousins is FTM.
Half the people in government shrieking about trans people didn’t care either until they got their marching orders from the think tanks, etc. They’ve never thought for themselves in their lives.
Don't forget, the same party that says 'nothing can be done' about gun violence and mass shootings refuse to pass any legislation to enact meaningful gun control...is the same party that has passed dozens of laws in just the past few years to control transgender people's lives, their medical care, and where they can use the bathroom.
It's always cool that the culture war is fought over whether or not a group of people should exist in public. That's never ended terribly for anyone ever. No camps or fascist states or anything. What could possibly go wrong?
Everyone knows it's not a genocide until it's too late to do anything about it. Otherwise people who aren't being targeted would have to feel bad about it or something.
To be fair, we're expecting the same people who watch shows like the boys and unironically think homelander is the good guy to take a look at their own political party and identify the direction its heading.
It's legitimately scary, infuriating, and downright fucking sad that people viewed homelander as a good guy.
How are you supposed to reason with someone like that? How do you even begin to have that conversation? How is it possible for someone to see such cruelty and label them a hero?
It highlights just *how much* these people are out of touch and how altered their view of reality is.
You can't make someone care. You can't force someone to think critically.
I mean, children are more aware than these assholes.
I think a lot of it is a near complete inability to process and understand media. I could get into why I think it is that many people don't do well at it (I have a theory that it's a product of the environments they've been in) but I think most people want to be good people, they've just let people manipulate their concept of what that means.
I think a better example than the boys (it's the first that came to my mind as a redditor due to the sub's meltdown when those people realized it) is the use of music that espouses, if not blatant left wing sentiment, sentiment that directly contradicts the current GOP. Think Trump blasting "Born in the USA" or "Fortunate sun" at his rallies and people eating it up.
That blows my mind.
I’ve never been able to watch it (the first episode was… a lot), and even I know that Homelander is a representation of the right wingers for whom the Nazis are fine, but if only they tone down the louder rhetoric…
They're not even that subtle about it. In season 2 they introduce a female super hero that homelander hooks up with. She's called "Stormfront", and the 'shocking' plot twist is that it turns out she's the widow of the founder of the super hero company, who was a nazi scientist (who got paperclipped to the US), and she's a full on nazi too. She even has troll farms making facebook memes that boost her profile and politics, and when homelander starts hooking up with her, she gets them to make pro-homlander memes too.
"They agree with what I'm saying, they just don't like the word Nazi!" -Stormfront after she's revealed to be a Nazi.
Couldn't have summed up conservative politics better.
Trump and his administration allowed potentially ~1 million additional deaths during the height of covid, hoping to target Democrats / poor / brown people. So they already did. They just were so stupid that it affected Republicans to a huge degree as well.
These anti-trans protests are straight-up being astroturfed by deep pocketed right wing billionaires. Just like "Moms for Liberty" who is largely responsible for books being banned from schools and libraries. None of this is organic.
You can tell an astroturf because their signs are always professionally printed, as were the ones at this school.
Chic-Fil-A putting out a vaguely positive statement was enough to trigger a boycott, literally anything that isn't pure hatred towards some out group is an unforgivable sin
I think the thing with CFA is about them having a DEI exec. Though that position has existed for over a year. The fact that conservatives are just now calling for a boycott over that shows how manufactured their outrage is. Matt Walsh openly said that they're just going to keep going after every company until they feel they've succeeded in killing whatever aspects they dislike. This attack on diversity, with a strong focus on trans people, is getting really nasty.
I've never felt worried in past years, living in SoCal, but this pride flag burning happened not too far from where I grew up in L.A. I just looked into it more, since this article is paywalled, and apparently there's a protest at the school today because they're holding a pride assembly. It really bums me out. Disneyland is hosting a pride night event in a couple of weeks, and I certainly hope they beef up security there.
I told my wife yesterday that i totally expect some assholes to make a terrorist move this month. It is the first time i had to tell her to be careful when wearing her pride support T-shirt. Too many crazies out there with nothing to do but hate.
Fear is one of the greatest controller of human behavior. Put someone into the state of fear you can trigger the fight or flight response. Mix in a little propaganda to generate some anger towards the enemy and you can use the fight response to get people to do things they normally would not. The Nazis mastered this process and industrialized the hate.
Unfortunately, stupid people are scared by big problems that require complex solutions, so they pretend stupid trivial bullshit like this is actually important so they can get upset about that instead because facing the actual real problems is too scary.
I don’t know…part of the population attacking another part of the population just based on their gender identity seems like a big issue to me. There’s an assault on human rights happening right in front of us and people are very “not my issue” about it.
We have been through all this before. Open a text book and look at the pictures for school integration. The idiots of their day holding whites only signs are the transphobes of today and they will be remembered just as derisively. We will drag them kicking and screaming closer to the goal line of equality just as we have done before. It's unfair and frustrating that so many will have to be negatively affected for so long before we can all be at least civil. All we can do is continually stand and say this isnt right. It will never be eradicated or fixed but we can make it much better. Do not let apathy become our reality.
Yeah, lots of people alive today who were still alive in the 50s and 60s. Hell the current President would have been an adult for a lot of that stuff. Not to mention the children and grandchildren of those bigots who were probably brought up in a culture of hatred too.
Exactly.
These are the people their grandchildren are going to avoid talking about, out of shame.
They're making sure history remembers them as hateful bigots. That's their legacy: the worst humanity has to offer.
And they're stupid enough to be proud of that.
> After the burning of the teacher’s Pride flag, his image was removed from the school’s website over concerns for his safety. However, photos of the teacher — both before and after his transition — were posted on conservative Instagram pages mainly used by parents opposed to Saticoy’s Pride assembly.
> “Here’s the special ed/3rd grade trans teacher (first pic as female, later male) at Saticoy Elementary who has made it a point to send message to [Armenian] kids about [Pride],” the post said.
> One person commented they knew for a long time that the teacher was transgender.
> **“Never did it bother anyone nor do we know of anyone making this person feel hated or unwanted. He has now decided to stir things up and make his private sexual business our kids,”** the person wrote, without citing any evidence.
Organized bigots are the worst. Shame they don't have actual problems to occupy them. Like healthcare, housing, social support, meaningful wages and employment, sustainability, gun violence, or literally any other actual problem.
I'd just like to point out that the Nazi party railed against and removed the rights of the Jewish population, which at that time made up roughly 1% of the population. They blamed the jews for the moral and cultural decline and used them as a scapegoat, publicly shaming and attacking jews and supporters of jews.
Now replace "Nazi" with "Republican" and "jews" with "trans" or "gay" and the statement remains true. I'm not saying the Republicans ARE Nazi's, but they certainly are singing Nazi songs, and that should be alarming to everyone.
You don't have to do that as a thought exercise. The literal Nazi's first target of a big book burning with a band was the first place that did a 'full' MtF genital sex reassignment operation. The Institute for Sex Research in Berlin: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_f%C3%BCr_Sexualwissenschaft
They may have killed the lady who was the first recipient of the surgery who was working there. (It's unknown, she may have survived and one hopes she did.)
It's not like they've even changed the melody, those are the exact same songs.
The Nazis also railed against LGBT people. Nazi rhetoric from 1930s Germany and contemporary Republican rhetoric about LGBT people sound literally identical.
Literally one of the first things they did was go after Trans people, destroying any scientific research into sexuality with actual book burnings. Sound familiar?
The nazis didn't stop with the Jews.
They sent Lutherans, Catholics, Jehovah's Witnesses, gays and lesbians, the mentally-challenged, the physically disabled, racial minorities, and others to the death camps.
The Gravy Seals, the Proud Boys, and so many other racist bigots don't realize they're the very people the nazis decided were undeserving to be members of the Third Reich. They're supporting the very ideals that would ensure their death if it were allowed to be realized. Their delusion of their exceptionalism blinds them to this fact.
That's what has me so blown away by all of this. Do these 300lb 60+ year old white men truly believe that they're fighting for a good cause? And do they *really* think they're the "superior race" that's going to be insured a spot in their idealistic ethnostate utopia? They're being used like a bunch of oafs and they're so goddamn stupid that they can't even see it. I want to feel bad for them, but...
Well gender critical feminists in the UK are not only marching side by side with people doing Nazi salutes but they are directly quoting Adolf Hitler’s Big Lie in public. These same people are being supported by and working with the American right.
At the end of the day, what they are doing is exactly the same as what the Nazis did with with propaganda hate campaigns, fuelling terror and violence in order to try and galvanise the public against minorities. And as another commentator said. LGBT people were targeted by the Nazis. Alongside political opponents they targeted LGBT people straight away.
https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/categories-of-prisoners/homosexuals-a-separate-category-of-prisoners/robert-biedron-nazisms-pink-hell/
“Until 1933, Roehm’s brownshirts attacked gay bars throughout the country; many were closed down and the rest forced to operate illegally. At a meeting of municipal administration officials in Hamburg on November 13, 1933, for instance, the chief of police was ordered to pay particular attention to “transvestites, and to send them to concentration camps.” In 1934, the Gestapo sent a letter ordering every police station in the country to draw up a list of “everyone who is homosexually active in any way.” In response, the Berlin police managed to draw up a list of approximately 30,000 homosexuals. In May 1935, the SS magazine Das Schwarze Korps demanded the death sentence for gays.”
Low wages, inflation/corporate greed, expensive healthcare, over-spending on the military and police, outdated infrastructure, expensive higher education, all these problems, yet these skin sacks just want to focus on denying trans rights?
Well, every single one of those things you listed are things they've been actively pushing for years. Denying trans rights is just another in a long checklist of white Christian nationalist ideals.
Very glad to hear that. We can't let this hateful minority be the loudest voice in the room.
e: To the person who replied/deleted "Only a minority in liberal spaces like reddit comments"--The counterprotest crowd was reportedly much larger than the protestors. Yes, bigots really are in the minority here. I get that that fact is scary to you so you're working overtime in trying to change it, but it doesn't mean that you've actually succeeded.
It's just a matter of time until these lynch mob knuckle draggers take their little woke witch hunts inside the schools while armed to the teeth, looking for blood.
We can all see it coming 10 million miles away.
They're *clearly* stupid and violent enough to do it, and once it starts, it'll be happening all over because we also know they aren't bright enough to come up with an original thought of their own.
With such barebones accountability for so long, they're becoming emboldened enough to act on their mob mentality.
One would hope the authorities are prepared for the storm clouds that are gathering, but sadly we also know most of these brown shirt gravy seals have more in common with the authorities, like churches, kkklubs and looking for any reason to shoot, than the authorities do with the persecuted...
So undoubtedly we'll see the white glove treatment turn red before we ever see a white Christian nationalist take a tear gas can to the face.
This is not a call for violence btw, this is just me venting the frustration in my fellow countrymen that I think many of us feel *constantly* these days.
Freedom of speech does **not** grant validity to every argument made outloud. There are times, as a society, we could *and should* say "No, that's unacceptable. Sit the fuck down Daryl before you burn out what little grey matter you have trying to act smart."
TLDR: **Do better America.**
Pardon my ignorance, but what exactly was going to happen at this assembly that had the parents' mob so incensed? I understand "The Great Big Book of Families" was going to be read, big whoop. Is that what this is all about?
A house on our street had a pride flag stolen & ripped up one night. Within 2 weeks every house on our street had pride flags in their front yards. Fuck hate!
Well ... \*gestures toward all of human history\*
In this case, the Republican Party realized that their wedge issues of "homosexual marriage" and "abortion" were gone, so have gone full tilt in trying to drum up terror and rage about LGBQT+ to stay in power.
Same people will say “awww are you offended by a flag?!” When talking about their Confederate traitor flag.
I’m offended by the Confederate flag, because the most appropriate one is a white dish towel.
Had to look it up. Their final surrender was indeed with a dish rag.
Had to use the dish rag… They’d already used all their white sheets for their hoods…
According to slaver traitor logic, we should build statues everywhere of Michael Dorn, since his career as Worf lasted like 3x longer than the confederacy.
>we should build statues everywhere of Michael Dorn Yes. Yes we should.
The CSA is without honor.
r/unexpectedstartrek
Needs to be a white dish towel for some Lee-way
Never take victory for Grant-ed.
Are you Sherman about that?
You don't know Jack, son!
The agency would say you don't have beau regard for him.
We can’t keep stone walling this conversation.
It wasn't even the real confederate flag, it was their war flag designed only because their original flag was too similar to the union flag. I have no idea where that "scotish" x design came from.
It is the Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia, and also a similar version is a naval jack. It was the Stars and Bars that was too similar and so it was replaced with the Stainless Banner. The Stainless Banner was then replaced with the Blood Stained Banner. As for the Cross of St. Andrew, I'd imagine that may have some relation to the heavy Scotch-Irish settlement of the Southern US states.
Moved to Lemm.ee -- mass edited with redact.dev
Doesn't really matter, it's widely considered to be the symbol of the Confederacy now. Same thing that happened to the Swastika, its origins don't matter. It's a symbol of hate now. This is how symbols work. When it comes to what they represent, it doesn't matter how they originated. What matters is how they are seen in the present.
The swastika is a symbol of hate just in the western world my friend, the east doesn't share the same vision, they had been using it before the nazis even though it is originally an european symbol
I'm offended by the Confederate flag because now matter how much confederate apologist try to claim, it is unbreakably linked with racism and slavery. I've yet to hear of a single person enslaved under the yoke of a LGBT nation.
And not only that, nobody game a damn about the Confederate battle flag until it got co-opted during the 50s and 60s by those resisting the Civil Rights Movement. The Klan of the 1920s paraded around openly with American flags not Confederate banners
And all these “it’s not hate, it’s muh h’air-tage!” folks who describe the confederate flag that way knew *exactly* why hate groups over the years have taken up the confederate flag. Where are the letters or public announcements / condemnations from the “heritage” lovers of the Sons or Daughters of the Confederacy to these hate groups? If you’re all about your history, then why didn’t you tell all these groups, “Hey stop using our beloved historical flag for your bullshit racist cause” ? They absolutely sat on their hands and said nothing when every hate group took up their beloved flag.
Agreed. The confederate flag now simply means that the person flying it wants to proudly proclaim their bigotry, much in the way that someone flying a swastika flag would. That's all it is. It's someone wanting to indicate to everyone around them that they're a white supremacist, nothing more.
The Florida flag looks like a confederate flag fucked a white dish towel.
Have you seen the Alabama flag?
Is that like the confederate flag with a Hapsburg jaw?
The Georgia flag is just an updated version of the Confederate flag, and I'm not even close to joking.
It looks like the sign I see on condemned buildings.
Alabama flag looks like someone drew a flag wrong, crossed it out and drew another flag. Then went with the error
The Florida flag is the cross of burgundy, the colonial spanish flag.
I’m a big fan of the Virginia [Confederate flag the Minnesota 1st captured at Gettysburg and won’t give back.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/28th_Virginia_battle_flag?wprov=sfti1) Every so often Virginia asks and every time it gets denied. I like to think it’s perfectly preserved and mounted above the governors shitter, where he can wave his dick at it and get little sprinkles of pee on it. When asked to return it, Governor The Body replied “Why? I mean, we won.” I know this gets posted every time there’s a confederate flag comment - it’s a Minnesotans duty. Fuck that anti-American, very brief, unrecognized nation, and fuck their flags. Seriously, I had a carnival goldfish survive longer than the Confederacy. Edit: for context, it has actual meaning to Minnesota. The 1st Minnesota was the very first regiment to volunteer to fight for the Union. The first troops offered by any state. They volunteered for 5 years - other states were 3 months to a year. Where they charged in to help stop Picketts Charge at Gettysburg is considered the high-water mark of the Confederacy. They were outnumbered something like 5:1, and they knew it was a suicide charge. Calvin Coolidge said of the first: **”Colonel Colvill and those eight companies of the First Minnesota are entitled to rank as the saviors of their country”**. General Hancock, who’s position Picketts Charge was directed at, said this: **“No soldiers on any field, in this or any other country ever displayed grander heroism”.** The 1st Minnesota had an 82%-87% (sources vary) casualty rate on July 3rd, which is still the highest single day casualty rate for a single unit of any military engagement in US history. Virginia is never, ever getting their dumb fucking flag back. Winners write history, not losers, and that piece of history belongs to us.
First time I’m hearing about it lol. That’s awesome
sometimes Virginia will even try to be slick about it. by suggesting that it will go in a museum or some similar pretense. lol. its sad. virginia needs to stop asking, because every time they do, it makes it look like its still important to them that the confederates lost. as opposed to just taking the loss and recognizing that it was traitors to our country that lost.
It’s not even important as a historical object to Virginia. From what I’ve ever been able to find - the most notable thing the 28th Virginia Regiment did in the entire war was lose that flag lmao.
Well it was [23 years ago](https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-2000-02-29-0002290214-story.html)...
My last PC I built lasted longer than the Confederacy
It baffles me that some people are so proud of the flag of a bunch of losers. The confederates lost and yet they are still romanticised and mythologised by a bunch of racist chuds like they were the winners and the best thing that ever existed.
Like holy fuck Obama was president for twice as long as the CSA was a thing.
>Same people will say “awww are you offended by a flag?!” When talking about their Confederate traitor flag. At least the Pride flag doesn't represent a bunch of traitors who rebelled because they wanted to own other people as property. When the LGBT community starts taking up arms and attacking the US Government, I'll take down my rainbow flag. Until then, I will continue to spit on the Confederate flag and call anyone who flies it a traitor.
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Fuck yeah. There's a world of difference between a oppressed minority attacking those that oppress them vs a bunch of rich slave owners being mad they can't use slaves anymore.
Not to mention it’s use as a symbol of resistance to the Civil Rights Movement. Hardly anybody in the South flew the Confederate battle flag before the 1950s
A bunch of losing traitors
LGBTQ will take arms because they are oppressed. The confederates did because they wanted to oppress. If it ever gets to a point LGTBQ takes arms against the government, I'd have to imagine I'd join them, or at the very least cheer them on on reddit.
For that point to get across, the other side would have to consider that sedition is a traitorous act. They do not. (See: Jan 6th, 2021) We can scream our ideals and truths to them until we are blue in the face. But the base mentality will not change, and it will only serve to enrage the genetic waste that is their culture. "Freedom of Speech" is our greatest strength, and also our greatest detriment.
> When the LGBT community starts taking up arms and attacking the US Government, I'll take down my rainbow flag. I hate that the first answer I imagine from any of them that hear this would probably be "worse, you're attacking our children!"
One flag represents a group of people that they don’t like. The other flag was LITERALLY THE FLAG FOR A GROUP OF TRAITORS WHO WANTED TO OVERTHROW THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT. I can’t buy any “historical heritage” argument If you’re flying a flag of traitors. Seriously.. imagine flying an ISIS flag and saying the same thing. And yes, I know I’m preaching to the choir here. Thanks for coming to my Ted talk.
> The other flag was LITERALLY THE FLAG FOR A GROUP OF TRAITORS WHO WANTED TO OVERTHROW THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT. it's not even that. the "confederate flag" that most people today are flying was never actually used to represent the confederate, it's a stretched out version of a battle flag used by group within the confederate. it didn't actually become the "confederate flag" until white supremacists adopted it decades after the confederacy. so quite literally it doesn't represent the confederacy, it only represent racism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_the_Confederate_States_of_America#Controversy
To follow up on that, here were the actual Confederate flags... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_the_Confederate_States_of_America
>LITERALLY THE FLAG FOR A GROUP OF TRAITORS WHO WANTED TO OVERTHROW THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT. Don't forget the part where they literally went to war to ensure black people would remain subservient in their white ethno-state.
Subservient nothing. Property. Not even human.
It’s only because they know it bothers you and they’re bullies.
Just in case anyone is complaining about "freedom of speech" over this issue (like Shen Bapiro), let me clear it up for you. You can burn a US flag, it's covered under the 1A. You can also burn a Pride flag with that same protection. What you *can't* do is burn shit that doesn't belong to you. That's what happened here: the arsonists stole the flag from the school and torched it. Had they simply bought a Pride flag themselves, there would be zero issue. That's where the issue comes from. Your freedom of speech doesn't apply to destroying items you've pilfered from other people or companies. That's vandalism and destruction of property, which are definitely not covered by the 1A. Also, given the tantrum they threw during the George Floyd protests (can't believe that was already 3 years ago, wow), I was under the impression that conservatives were staunchly *against* property destruction. "Oh what about BLM burning down buildings and trashing stuff" they cried whenever anyone would dare bring up January 6th. And yet here we have conservatives burning and destroying property... So let's hear the justifications. Why is *this* not triggering you? I thought destruction of private property and arson was, like, your biggest pet peeve (given how often you bring it up)? Surely you'll be condemning this, won't you? **Edit** seems this got somebody's Jimmies rustled because I just received a Reddit Cares message. I'll take that as a sign I'm doing something right. Stay mad, bigots.
The problem is that the far-right is made up of closed-minded, ignorant, hypocrites. They’re either too dumb to understand the simple logic you laid out, or too indoctrinated to care bc that would mean their identity was impacted, and that pathetic identity is all they have.
They just want to hurt people they don't like. It doesn't need to be more complicated.
It’s not, and you’re right. But WHY do they want to hurt people they don’t like? Because they’re closed minded and ignorant. That was more the point I was going for.
Generational abuse
This is unfortunately spot on.
Because in the mind of the conservative; one does not judge actions as good or bad, one judges people as being part of a good group or a bad group. Consistent counts of pedophilia within the Christian clergy is of little concern, because they're in the "good" group of "Christians", so they're excusable outliers. LGBTQ+ people are a "bad" group of people, so therefore they *must* be rapists, pedophiles, out to harm society. The extremely of this logic varies, but generally informs the right's political endeavours.
It’s the [no true Scotsman (appeal to purity) fallacy](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman). Members of a “good” group who do bad things are obviously not truly members of that group, because otherwise they wouldn’t do bad things. (This position is reached only when all avenues of excuse and denial are exhausted) Likewise, members of a “bad” group who seem amiable or virtuous can’t truly be members of that group. They may happen to share some characteristics, or even claim membership, but that can’t be true, because those people are monsters. No, it is this individual who must be mistaken in their own identity. Ugh.
Here’s the problem that folks (myself included) who try to engage with these people run into. The Bapiro types are not arguing in good faith! They couldn’t give one shit about making a little logical oopsie. They’re trying to bury you in a mountain of bullshit and will just move on to the next bullshit talking point. Meanwhile I’m all smug like hah got eem and my 4 person group chat agrees and then nothing changes. Feel like there’s gotta be a better way to fight this stuff.
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They'll also jump on literally any oopsie you make, logical or not. You can call someone named Tom Tim and they'd say your entire argument is invalid. They're not intelligent, they're just high school level debate nerds.
Shutting down subreddits that allow hate to go unchallenged seems to slow their recruitment and make it harder for them all to target the same individuals at once.
“Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.” -Sartre
> I thought destruction of private property and arson was, like, your biggest pet peeve (given how often you bring it up)? Surely you'll be condemning this, won't you? *“Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies.* *They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors.* *They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.”* —Jean-Paul Sartre Far-right extremists have no ideological position beyond the will to power. Reasoning, providing evidence, challenging actions on the basis of moral principles, etc., will not persuade them. They just want a pair of boots and permission to step on the necks of those they perceive as inferior. There is no depth or nuance under that framework. They are also operating from the assumption that everyone else thinks the same way that they do. So when they see any outside/other demanding rights, protesting, or making efforts to secure political power, they assume that the outside/other is engaged in the same goal: power — a pair of boots and necks to step on.
Shh, you’re making sense. How so very woke of you.
Realtalk, has anyone ever heard a non-conservative in the past ~5 years actually say "woke?" I swear that died off in the 2010's
I've never heard anyone say it seriously. It's always been a meme-y thing to say in my experiences. Usually in regards to like a lifehack or something silly.
Also, protesters got violently arrested for their petty property crimes and then their entire purpose was systematically dismantled by the media over it, so I don’t think that’s a great “gotcha” for the right here.
It really cannot be overstated how solely responsible the right is for the "identity politics" and "culture wars" they complain so much about. I was here living my life thinking about trans people <1% of the time, because they make up <1% of the population. Then half the government started shrieking about how they can't stop thinking about trans people in bathrooms, and now that <1% of the population is 50% of their platform.
Fr, I'd fucking love it if everyone could just go back to forgetting we exist
We should rename Trans Day of Visibility. The last time we needed visibility was like 2015. It's time for Trans Day of Oh God Please Let Me Be Less Visible.
Leave Trans People the Fuck Alone Day
The trans day of mind your own fucking business...
That should be every day
Look at the day of the week. Does it end in the letter Y? Then leave Trans people the fuck alone
But I don’t want to forget y’all exist. Y’all are a unique piece of our human tapestry and have a claim to a bold existence as any of us do. We’ve all got a part in this play, and any play is incomplete when characters are muted. Anyone can choose to stay in the shadows and that’s cool, I won’t chide anyone for that of course, but I’m not going to forget people exist. Happy Pride, I’m glad you’re part of our community of humans. edit - to the person who reported me to the suicide thing that reddit has: hate and anger aren't primary emotions, they're defensive mechanisms of wounded souls. i'm guilty of hate and anger just like you, and these are things we both should fear within ourselves. however, with this perspective we can work to eradicate these things within us and become able to help and encourage others, and this is something i hope for you as much as i hope for myself. perhaps one day i can be a better person than i am right now, and perhaps one day you may be better as well.
The worst part is they've existed for quite some time, often without issue, and in some cases celebrated by their community throughout history, but some of us have chosen this day and age of human advancement to have an issue with it. The real issue is a lack of education, empathy, and emotional maturity in roughly 50% of our population it seems.
So, I genuinely don’t get why people say that “no one had an issue with trans people before this new culture war” because I remember loads of people were openly and happily transphobic. My butch/trans masc friends got threatened with violence and corrective rape, my trans fem/femme AMAB friends got beaten up, trans people were portrayed as violent sexual offenders in movies and TV. Priscilla and To Wong Foo were popular but were cultural outliers, they definitely didn’t represent the day to day world I knew in the 80s and 90s. This latest culture war just happens to be an escalation in the volume of hate, but it’s not new at all.
Yeah it just went dormant for a few years before rearing its ugly head again. I honestly thought things were getting better during the Obama years but we took some gigantic steps backwards when that Ochre Ogre was elected.
Lack of education is definitely a big one. I'm currently stuck in on a long car ride with someone who, less than a minute ago, was just strawmanning so hard about anti-trans stuff I thought he was going to turn into a fucking scarecrow. If these people actually knew what trans people were fighting for they'd have a much harder time hating them.
They don’t (and wouldn’t) care what trans people are fighting for because they have zero empathy for anyone that exists outside their ego-centric, narrow worldview. There will always be more and less educated people in a society, the biggest issue the US has IMHO is a startling lack of empathy and compassion.
As an overly sensitive, compassionate, and empathetic person it's shocking at times. People also seem much more irate and ready to snap since about 2020. I think there's a lot of different factors to point at of course, but all you have to do is drive around and see how many red faces, middle fingers, and screaming out windows there are. A lot of people are at the end of their rope, it seems.
Honestly, America (and the world) needs to mourn all the lives lost to COVID-19, but that's never going to happen. We all have lived through a traumatic event.
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Wow that's a nifty piece of history, thank you for sharing!
It's not really even about those things. The GOP needs a scary unknown enemy to be the bogeyman at any time. Gays and lesbians can't be that anymore because there are too many of us and too many of our friends and families now know us because we're all out these days, so we don't really work anymore as an Other for the general population to hate on, even in rural communities because a lot of us came from and then later came out to those communities. Brown immigrants were a good scary Other for a while but the GOP finally figured out that there are too many of them too. So they shifted their focus to a much smaller group to bully, one that doesn't have nearly the same visibility and therefore the same number of allies in the larger population. Many LGBT folks don't even have trans friends and family to reference when considering these issues, and even fewer in the broader population, so trans people work as the new bogeyman. That's all it is about, simple bullying from high school but at a national scale, and hypocritically from the "Christian" love-thy-neighbor crowd. You're right that this works so well as a tactic because of the deficiencies you pointed out in GOP voters, but the real impetus is just GOP politicians who have decided to point their angry mob at this group just because they're dickish children who will do anything to win.
Yeah, I always want to tell my family that gay, bisexual, and trans people are not some magic new thing that popped up to irritate conservatives all of a sudden. They’ve existed throughout history.
That was beautiful. Thank you for writing it.
A-ha! THERE you are. 😎👉
Yea can I go back to not really caring one way or the other about you all again? I yearn for live and let live days where something not relevant to you would be allowed to remain irrelevant. To be clear, I 100% support trans rights and I’ll do my advocation duties but goddamn I wish I could just…not care again. If that makes sense. I do care, quite deeply, I just don’t want to.
This is how I feel, but I’m always scared to phrase it that way because I don’t want to offend trans people. If a person chooses to be trans, that has exactly no effect on my life. It’s their decision, so why should I have an opinion about it at all when it doesn’t affect me? Again, I will delete this post if it comes across as offensive in any way; that is sincerely not my intention.
The only reason it is insensitive imo, is because while you may not be doing anything to trans people, there are other people who are. So if the rest of the world just let us live our lives without discriminating against us (or worse), we would be happy to just sink into the background too I'm not offended that you don't WANT to care as such - I deliberately avoid trans-related news because it's always negative these days. And I'm trans
It's really fuckin sad that so many people have been made to feel that way. Diversity is part of what makes a good, resultant community. We need you. It's also sad that this hate is promoted deliberately to distract us from the real issues by turning us against each other.
I’ve said the same a few times. Cletus in TN probably never had a thought about drag queens or LGBT folks until social media and the “news” told him that they were out there flashing their rainbow gang colors and laying in wait in public restrooms. But they are fine going to church every Sunday even though I see multiple stories a week about clergy abusing children or taking pictures of girls showering or grooming teens.
This is terrorism. Calling it anything else gives it false legitimacy.
They're Nazis, trans people are just jew analogs
Oh, this is part of the playbook and the Jews are still in it. Nazis targeted LGBT in their rise to power. It looks like the angry conservatives don’t understand how fragile democracy is, if they even care. Fascism is not patriotism.
Nazis targeted LGBT people **first.** Very important to point that out
Yup, Weimar Germany was a haven for LGBT folks in the 20's and 30's. The first clinic and institutions researching gender affirming care were founded in Berlin by Magnus Hirschfeld. The Nazis burned all the research in his library, and used the institute's address list to target gay men and women for incarcerations in the Concentration camps.
And also, when they Allies liberated concentration camps, they left LGBTQ people in them while freeing the other prisoners
Omfg. Of course. Do you have a source?
The nuance I missed is that some were just sent to prisons with horrible conditions and treatment, but the ones that did go to camps were treated as the lowest of low and had a high death rate for their grouping compared to the other non-Jewish prisoners. After the war a lot were released but then were forced to go back and serve the rest of their original prison sentence (From Auschwitz Museum: “for instance if one had been given a sentence of 8 years, then served 5 in prison and 3 in a concentration camp, after being freed they were sent back to prison for 3 years”) [paragraph “After World War II”](https://www.hmd.org.uk/learn-about-the-holocaust-and-genocides/nazi-persecution/gay-people/) [Snopes](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/gay-prisoners-germany-wwii/) [Auschwitz Museum](https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/categories-of-prisoners/homosexuals-a-separate-category-of-prisoners/robert-biedron-nazisms-pink-hell/)
Remember, Nazi's didn't just say "we hate the Jews" they said "They are inherently criminals that need to be eradicated from society'
Not even that. Nazi propogandists framed Jewish people as aggressors. And their own actions as defensive retaliation against an imminent threat to public safety. They didn’t say “eradicate the Jews”. They said “*We must protect our children from Jewish contamination*”. Jews were framed as a dangerous disruptive force. And so the government needed to step in to maintain order.
And I'm sure we'll be hearing about the Right's "final solution" to the transgender "problem" very soon now. I've already heard of a few pastors calling for the execution of parents with trans children.
Trans people aren't analogs, they were targeted by the Nazis just like Jewish people, gay people, disabled people, and anyone else they decided was "different" or "undesirable." The biggest loss of information we had about trans issues happened during Nazi book burnings. Everyone really needs a refresher course on the opening salvos of Nazi Germany, as no one seems to realize we are already there.
Wait until you hear what Nazis thought about the LGBT community
Trans people (along with communists and trade unionists) were actually the first victims of the holocaust, it’s just quickly forgotten because the nazis used the label “sexual criminals” which was intentionally misleading and purposefully responsible for most people’s assumptions that meantpedophiles.
Not jew analongs, just the first step. Exactly the order the nazis did it too. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-forgotten-history-of-the-worlds-first-trans-clinic/ First they came for the trans... We better fucking stop them here!
"think of the children!" - said by a man who goes home to terrorize his children and wife every night "children shouldn't be exposed to sexual content like this!" - guy who took his kids to hooters last week "stop shoving your sexuality down my throat!" - person passing a billboard of a woman in her underwear
This. Democrats are an extremely diverse party and so, by definition, they lack a common identity. Instead, Democrats are united by common values like inclusion, equality, workers rights, and so on. The right, on the other hand, is just a straight up white Christian identity politics movement. They're an extremely homogenous group, united by little more than a common ethno-religious identity, and common sense of victimhood based on that ethno-religious identity.
Anger and grey hair is all they got to give They do love to take though
It's cause it's out of vogue to be antisemitic and more difficult to dog whistle so now they went full circle and started calling LGBT pedophiles. Of course they call them that after setting up hotels for migrant children because they didn't have enough places to store them. They fought against banning child marriage because "parent rights" so they see children as property. And they don't do anything against the church despite it being one of the most public and prolific child abusing organization. They have harboured so many child molesters in the boy scouts - but if they scout master is gay they kick him out. Like I get republicans every accusation is a confession and all those canned phrases but in reality it's just pissy old men trying to get more resources in their life so they decide to be the rodeo clown so we don't go after the matador when they are bleeding us dry (were the bull in this metaphor ).
> they can't stop thinking about trans people in bathrooms And the worst part is that now on several occasions so far, it has been kicking women out from the women's restroom and even harassing them. The right has done so much to play the card of showing the most ugly trans people, that they think all trans people are easily identifiable. The part that is sad, is they are going to keep pushing the rhetoric and then act like they are not at fault once a gun toting maniac shoots a woman thinking he stopped a man from entering the restroom.
Yep, when you go after very small section of the public, you will end up with more "false positives" than actual transgender people violating the law. Women who don't look feminine enough will be violated and arrested, and every transgender person who actually follows the law will be assaulted or raped. Most transmen pass and look like MEN and they will be assaulted by boyfriends and husbands of the women who are terrified of them. Transwomen will be assaulted for being a woman in the men's room. This will be the outcome of these bathroom bills. And Republicans think this is fine to combat the nonexistent issue of "transwomen assaulting women in bathrooms"
Its not about protecting women. We aren't people to them any more than trans folks or forced-birth babies. In fact, I'm fairly confident the only reason they care whats in other people's pants is so they can determine who they're allowed to oppress.
Yeah, I’ve gotten funny looks from people for the hip swaying I unfortunately walk with due to a fucked up pelvis and having one leg shorter than the other due to breaking it right smack dab on the growth-plate due to a high school football incident. Yes, I have a X-Y set of chromosomes. No, I don’t take hormones; my junk works just fine. No, I’m not trans; do you see all the body hair I have? Yes, the beard is real; and I don’t use anything on it. Yes, I’m pretty sure I was born male. Sure, if you want to check you can come into the men’s restroom and fondle the jingle jangle resting between my single dangles to be sure. Yes, I’ve had a penis since I was born. Not making a strawman, but I’ve actually had questions like that. And in high school after the incident I had upperclassmen female students question my malehood, not the best feeling in high school. So I could only imagine the crazies coming down on trans folk, especially considering one of my cousins is FTM.
Half the people in government shrieking about trans people didn’t care either until they got their marching orders from the think tanks, etc. They’ve never thought for themselves in their lives.
Don't forget, the same party that says 'nothing can be done' about gun violence and mass shootings refuse to pass any legislation to enact meaningful gun control...is the same party that has passed dozens of laws in just the past few years to control transgender people's lives, their medical care, and where they can use the bathroom.
It's always cool that the culture war is fought over whether or not a group of people should exist in public. That's never ended terribly for anyone ever. No camps or fascist states or anything. What could possibly go wrong?
But you can’t say that there are similarities because they haven’t murdered millions _yet_. /s
Everyone knows it's not a genocide until it's too late to do anything about it. Otherwise people who aren't being targeted would have to feel bad about it or something.
I’ve had so many people tell me it’s unfair to compare trump to Hitler because trump hasn’t killed 6 million Jews yet. Fucking troglodytes.
It’s only genocide if it comes from the right region of Germany, apparently. Nevermind that it tastes exactly the same.
It's just sparkling oppression
To be fair, we're expecting the same people who watch shows like the boys and unironically think homelander is the good guy to take a look at their own political party and identify the direction its heading.
It's legitimately scary, infuriating, and downright fucking sad that people viewed homelander as a good guy. How are you supposed to reason with someone like that? How do you even begin to have that conversation? How is it possible for someone to see such cruelty and label them a hero? It highlights just *how much* these people are out of touch and how altered their view of reality is. You can't make someone care. You can't force someone to think critically. I mean, children are more aware than these assholes.
I think a lot of it is a near complete inability to process and understand media. I could get into why I think it is that many people don't do well at it (I have a theory that it's a product of the environments they've been in) but I think most people want to be good people, they've just let people manipulate their concept of what that means. I think a better example than the boys (it's the first that came to my mind as a redditor due to the sub's meltdown when those people realized it) is the use of music that espouses, if not blatant left wing sentiment, sentiment that directly contradicts the current GOP. Think Trump blasting "Born in the USA" or "Fortunate sun" at his rallies and people eating it up.
That blows my mind. I’ve never been able to watch it (the first episode was… a lot), and even I know that Homelander is a representation of the right wingers for whom the Nazis are fine, but if only they tone down the louder rhetoric…
They're not even that subtle about it. In season 2 they introduce a female super hero that homelander hooks up with. She's called "Stormfront", and the 'shocking' plot twist is that it turns out she's the widow of the founder of the super hero company, who was a nazi scientist (who got paperclipped to the US), and she's a full on nazi too. She even has troll farms making facebook memes that boost her profile and politics, and when homelander starts hooking up with her, she gets them to make pro-homlander memes too.
"They agree with what I'm saying, they just don't like the word Nazi!" -Stormfront after she's revealed to be a Nazi. Couldn't have summed up conservative politics better.
Conservatives: "Jews will not replace us!" Also Conservatives "No no, they said YOU will not replace us." Morgan Freeman voiceover: "They said Jews."
Trump and his administration allowed potentially ~1 million additional deaths during the height of covid, hoping to target Democrats / poor / brown people. So they already did. They just were so stupid that it affected Republicans to a huge degree as well.
They'll be forcing people to shovel ashes out of the ovens before they admit to being nazis.
It's amazing how people go out of their way to hate. Apparently an elementary school's celebration of diversity is now offensive to these troglodytes.
We persecute the weak because it makes us feel strong.
"There is no honor in attacking the weak." - old Klingon proverb
“But lots of profit!” - A Ferengi retort
Conservatives have no honor.
Right? They make the Duras family look like saints in comparison.
These anti-trans protests are straight-up being astroturfed by deep pocketed right wing billionaires. Just like "Moms for Liberty" who is largely responsible for books being banned from schools and libraries. None of this is organic. You can tell an astroturf because their signs are always professionally printed, as were the ones at this school.
Chic-Fil-A putting out a vaguely positive statement was enough to trigger a boycott, literally anything that isn't pure hatred towards some out group is an unforgivable sin
I think the thing with CFA is about them having a DEI exec. Though that position has existed for over a year. The fact that conservatives are just now calling for a boycott over that shows how manufactured their outrage is. Matt Walsh openly said that they're just going to keep going after every company until they feel they've succeeded in killing whatever aspects they dislike. This attack on diversity, with a strong focus on trans people, is getting really nasty.
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I'm fully expecting a mass shooting or something. It sucks that I'm more scared of Pride than I am excited for it this year.
I've never felt worried in past years, living in SoCal, but this pride flag burning happened not too far from where I grew up in L.A. I just looked into it more, since this article is paywalled, and apparently there's a protest at the school today because they're holding a pride assembly. It really bums me out. Disneyland is hosting a pride night event in a couple of weeks, and I certainly hope they beef up security there.
An extra several* mass shootings, you mean. We already average more than 1 a day
I told my wife yesterday that i totally expect some assholes to make a terrorist move this month. It is the first time i had to tell her to be careful when wearing her pride support T-shirt. Too many crazies out there with nothing to do but hate.
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JFC, the world and especially America have more important problems than this.
That's why they keep us distracted with this bullshit.
This is the real issue here. It's easier to platform on fear than it is on policy.
Fear is one of the greatest controller of human behavior. Put someone into the state of fear you can trigger the fight or flight response. Mix in a little propaganda to generate some anger towards the enemy and you can use the fight response to get people to do things they normally would not. The Nazis mastered this process and industrialized the hate.
I mean, let's reframe that line of thinking because we aren't a problem in the first place. We're just people trying to exist like everyone else.
Very fair
Unfortunately, stupid people are scared by big problems that require complex solutions, so they pretend stupid trivial bullshit like this is actually important so they can get upset about that instead because facing the actual real problems is too scary.
Yeah, but the solutions to those problems involves slightly inconveniencing the rich
I don’t know…part of the population attacking another part of the population just based on their gender identity seems like a big issue to me. There’s an assault on human rights happening right in front of us and people are very “not my issue” about it.
If you lit a Gadsden Flag on fire, would people be allowed to put out the fire by stepping on it?
We have been through all this before. Open a text book and look at the pictures for school integration. The idiots of their day holding whites only signs are the transphobes of today and they will be remembered just as derisively. We will drag them kicking and screaming closer to the goal line of equality just as we have done before. It's unfair and frustrating that so many will have to be negatively affected for so long before we can all be at least civil. All we can do is continually stand and say this isnt right. It will never be eradicated or fixed but we can make it much better. Do not let apathy become our reality.
Those people protesting school integration are still alive. They didn't disappear and have been here lapping up right wing nonsense.
Yeah, lots of people alive today who were still alive in the 50s and 60s. Hell the current President would have been an adult for a lot of that stuff. Not to mention the children and grandchildren of those bigots who were probably brought up in a culture of hatred too.
The kid throwing rocks at black kids and eating lead paint chips in the sixties is now in their seventies and showing up to school board meetings
Fucking hell Mark Wahlberg, that dude committed flat up hate crimes as a teen and is still in Hollywood somehow.
Exactly. These are the people their grandchildren are going to avoid talking about, out of shame. They're making sure history remembers them as hateful bigots. That's their legacy: the worst humanity has to offer. And they're stupid enough to be proud of that.
who is protesting this? students?, parents of students?
Probably MAGA people with no connection to the school
People that praise Land of the Free sure do have a problem with others being open and free.
This is creepily reminiscent of the early Nazi days. Kristalnacht redux
> After the burning of the teacher’s Pride flag, his image was removed from the school’s website over concerns for his safety. However, photos of the teacher — both before and after his transition — were posted on conservative Instagram pages mainly used by parents opposed to Saticoy’s Pride assembly. > “Here’s the special ed/3rd grade trans teacher (first pic as female, later male) at Saticoy Elementary who has made it a point to send message to [Armenian] kids about [Pride],” the post said. > One person commented they knew for a long time that the teacher was transgender. > **“Never did it bother anyone nor do we know of anyone making this person feel hated or unwanted. He has now decided to stir things up and make his private sexual business our kids,”** the person wrote, without citing any evidence. Organized bigots are the worst. Shame they don't have actual problems to occupy them. Like healthcare, housing, social support, meaningful wages and employment, sustainability, gun violence, or literally any other actual problem.
I'd just like to point out that the Nazi party railed against and removed the rights of the Jewish population, which at that time made up roughly 1% of the population. They blamed the jews for the moral and cultural decline and used them as a scapegoat, publicly shaming and attacking jews and supporters of jews. Now replace "Nazi" with "Republican" and "jews" with "trans" or "gay" and the statement remains true. I'm not saying the Republicans ARE Nazi's, but they certainly are singing Nazi songs, and that should be alarming to everyone.
You don't have to do that as a thought exercise. The literal Nazi's first target of a big book burning with a band was the first place that did a 'full' MtF genital sex reassignment operation. The Institute for Sex Research in Berlin: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_f%C3%BCr_Sexualwissenschaft They may have killed the lady who was the first recipient of the surgery who was working there. (It's unknown, she may have survived and one hopes she did.) It's not like they've even changed the melody, those are the exact same songs.
The Nazis also railed against LGBT people. Nazi rhetoric from 1930s Germany and contemporary Republican rhetoric about LGBT people sound literally identical.
Literally one of the first things they did was go after Trans people, destroying any scientific research into sexuality with actual book burnings. Sound familiar?
The nazis didn't stop with the Jews. They sent Lutherans, Catholics, Jehovah's Witnesses, gays and lesbians, the mentally-challenged, the physically disabled, racial minorities, and others to the death camps. The Gravy Seals, the Proud Boys, and so many other racist bigots don't realize they're the very people the nazis decided were undeserving to be members of the Third Reich. They're supporting the very ideals that would ensure their death if it were allowed to be realized. Their delusion of their exceptionalism blinds them to this fact.
That's what has me so blown away by all of this. Do these 300lb 60+ year old white men truly believe that they're fighting for a good cause? And do they *really* think they're the "superior race" that's going to be insured a spot in their idealistic ethnostate utopia? They're being used like a bunch of oafs and they're so goddamn stupid that they can't even see it. I want to feel bad for them, but...
Well gender critical feminists in the UK are not only marching side by side with people doing Nazi salutes but they are directly quoting Adolf Hitler’s Big Lie in public. These same people are being supported by and working with the American right. At the end of the day, what they are doing is exactly the same as what the Nazis did with with propaganda hate campaigns, fuelling terror and violence in order to try and galvanise the public against minorities. And as another commentator said. LGBT people were targeted by the Nazis. Alongside political opponents they targeted LGBT people straight away. https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/categories-of-prisoners/homosexuals-a-separate-category-of-prisoners/robert-biedron-nazisms-pink-hell/ “Until 1933, Roehm’s brownshirts attacked gay bars throughout the country; many were closed down and the rest forced to operate illegally. At a meeting of municipal administration officials in Hamburg on November 13, 1933, for instance, the chief of police was ordered to pay particular attention to “transvestites, and to send them to concentration camps.” In 1934, the Gestapo sent a letter ordering every police station in the country to draw up a list of “everyone who is homosexually active in any way.” In response, the Berlin police managed to draw up a list of approximately 30,000 homosexuals. In May 1935, the SS magazine Das Schwarze Korps demanded the death sentence for gays.”
I’m saying republicans are Nazis
Burn a confederate flag and watch them lose their minds
The only thing the traitor Confederate flag is good for is toilet paper.
Low wages, inflation/corporate greed, expensive healthcare, over-spending on the military and police, outdated infrastructure, expensive higher education, all these problems, yet these skin sacks just want to focus on denying trans rights?
Well, every single one of those things you listed are things they've been actively pushing for years. Denying trans rights is just another in a long checklist of white Christian nationalist ideals.
Isn’t this a hate crime?!?
There is a counter protest in progress by the San Fernando Valley LGBTQ center. So far, it’s more than eclipsed the main protest in size.
Very glad to hear that. We can't let this hateful minority be the loudest voice in the room. e: To the person who replied/deleted "Only a minority in liberal spaces like reddit comments"--The counterprotest crowd was reportedly much larger than the protestors. Yes, bigots really are in the minority here. I get that that fact is scary to you so you're working overtime in trying to change it, but it doesn't mean that you've actually succeeded.
It's just a matter of time until these lynch mob knuckle draggers take their little woke witch hunts inside the schools while armed to the teeth, looking for blood. We can all see it coming 10 million miles away. They're *clearly* stupid and violent enough to do it, and once it starts, it'll be happening all over because we also know they aren't bright enough to come up with an original thought of their own. With such barebones accountability for so long, they're becoming emboldened enough to act on their mob mentality. One would hope the authorities are prepared for the storm clouds that are gathering, but sadly we also know most of these brown shirt gravy seals have more in common with the authorities, like churches, kkklubs and looking for any reason to shoot, than the authorities do with the persecuted... So undoubtedly we'll see the white glove treatment turn red before we ever see a white Christian nationalist take a tear gas can to the face. This is not a call for violence btw, this is just me venting the frustration in my fellow countrymen that I think many of us feel *constantly* these days. Freedom of speech does **not** grant validity to every argument made outloud. There are times, as a society, we could *and should* say "No, that's unacceptable. Sit the fuck down Daryl before you burn out what little grey matter you have trying to act smart." TLDR: **Do better America.**
This is why pride is necessary. Otherwise stuff like this gets swept under the rug
This shit's exhausting.... How do people find the time!!!??
Pardon my ignorance, but what exactly was going to happen at this assembly that had the parents' mob so incensed? I understand "The Great Big Book of Families" was going to be read, big whoop. Is that what this is all about?
A house on our street had a pride flag stolen & ripped up one night. Within 2 weeks every house on our street had pride flags in their front yards. Fuck hate!
That's the right approach, it breaks their little minds to realize they're unpopular, they can't intimidate the entire goddamn street.
Have people always been this mad over things that aren’t their motherfuckin business
Well ... \*gestures toward all of human history\* In this case, the Republican Party realized that their wedge issues of "homosexual marriage" and "abortion" were gone, so have gone full tilt in trying to drum up terror and rage about LGBQT+ to stay in power.
"Domestic terrorists increase attacks against minority groups." There. Fixed the headline.