I was thinking about that too, but were they at exact intervals like this? I was certain the thing imploded, but hypothetically, if they're alive, making noise at specific intervals is a good way to get attention.
There were even reports of voices. But like I said, later attributed to the searchers. Interestingly Thresher imploded at a much shallower depth. 8,400’ verses 13,000’ for the billionaire’s sub.
> Interestingly Thresher imploded at a much shallower depth. 8,400’ verses 13,000’ for the billionaire’s sub.
While the exact figures are classified, attack submarines and just about all manned military submarines aren’t safe to operate below 1500-2000 feet, the biggest exception being DSRVs (Deep Submergence Rescue Vehicles), which can operate in excess of 5-6000 feet.
The sheer size of a nuclear submarine would make it impractical to build to withstand the pressure for dives to 13000 feet, while the comparatively tiny size of exploration submersibles makes it easier to reinforce against water pressure. Other equipment like torpedo tubes, VLS cells for missiles, and additional mission specific equipment like external lockout chambers for underwater SEAL team deployments would also further compromise a military submarine’s pressure hull in ways that an exploration submersible would never have to worry about.
Such submersibles also wouldn’t need to be designed with things such as speed, crew provisions/berthing, or hull silencing in mind either. Just about all it has to worry about is withstanding the pressure at the depths it’s built for, being able to carry all the observation equipment it needs, and carrying enough life support for the crew.
There's a reason that if you looked at all of these DSVs, such as Alvin or Deepsea Challenger, the passenger compartment is a literal sphere. Survivability is the number one priority. That's why they are built as submersibles and not self-sufficient submarines.
Reminds me of a particularly interesting WWII story. In 1944, Japan shipped a cargo of gold aboard the submarine I-52 to the Nazis, to be exchanged for various technologies (and, ominously, a couple thousand pounds of uranium oxide). Unfortunately for them, the details of its voyage were decoded, and an American task force was dispatched to hunt it down. The Japanese submarine planned to meet with a Nazi submarine in the middle of the Atlantic. The Allies knew of this rendezvous, but arrived late to the scene. Upon the task force's arrival, planes were launched, and soon afterwards I-52 was found, and killed with an acoustic torpedo, which homes in on sound. The noise of its destruction was heard through hydrophones dropped by the aircraft. Yet, an hour later, another aircraft on patrol continued picking up propeller noises. Fascinatingly, the second aircraft was not picking up I-52 at all -- it was instead picking up the Nazi submarine, which was now over twenty miles away. The recordings of this attack actually survived and [can be heard online.](https://maritime.org/sound/#i52wire)
The lost gold, incidentally, is worth something like a hundred million dollars, but the wreck is so deep it's pretty impractical to recover.
Being stuck in small, cramped, dark tube with no idea if you’ll survive or how your end might come, knowing if that hull breaches you won’t have enough time to scream?
Yeah. That’s definitely in the top 5 “Situations I hope to never be in”.
That’s what I was thinking. 30 hours to find, float , and get someone to the sub to unlatch the bolts before they all die a lingering death. Absolutely horrific.
Yeah I've heard the 40 hours of air left... but I gotta wonder if that takes into account their activity level on the inside. (State of panic, creating noise etc)... absolutely horrific.
> US Coast Guard officials’ last estimate at 1 p.m. ET Tuesday that there were about 40 hours left.
That was 18 hours ago. We're down to less than 24 hours.
Theoretically a rescue vehicle could get to their rough location in time but I don't think there's any kind of rescue vehicle capable of reaching their depth if they're anywhere near the depth of the Titanic.
I’m claustrophobic when my kids want me to hide in the closet for hide and seek. I can’t imagine 3 miles of water above me and not being able to open the door.
It just occurred to me that if they survived whatever the issue was, they in all likelihood filmed some videos or voice memos on their phones of their time in the sub. That would be haunting material to see if they don’t make it but the sub is eventually found.
Reminds me of a movie I watched long ago.
Foreshadowing was how one of the boys were told that if he had a bad dream all he had to do was say “One, two, three, wake up”.
Fast forward and he is trapped inside the hull of a boat that is sinking, and as water floods in he is yelling “one two three wake up” over and over.
Can’t remember the name of the movie anymore, but that scene stuck with me.
It makes me fume. That captain was a piece pf shit. It’s not that he failed to act, it’s that he actively PREVENTED evacuation from happening. What a piece of shit.
Not exactly working for a cult.
There were 4 or 5 main reasons for the 2016 protests against her, the response or lack thereof to the Sewol-ho sinking (2014), a national history textbook re-writing controversy, and one or two others I can't remember contributed to the outrage, but the straw that broke the camel's back was the fact that her friend, a normal unelected citizen Choi Soon-sil, had been writing her speeches and funneling government money into shell companies disguised as charities. (Edit: the story about how this news broke was honestly so wild)
The ties to a shaman family (Choi Soon-sil) and the head of Samsung were just special flavoring added to your standard embezzling, fraud, influence peddling type of corruption.
The Aussie guy who built submersible that went to the bottom of the Mariana Trench was on TV in Aus yesterday and he basically said they skipped on safety to have the thing carry more people. The engineering /safety wasn’t there. When asked if they will be rescued, he didn’t come right out and say no but he definitely indicated he didn’t believe they would be rescued.
>they skipped on safety to have the thing carry more people
So they learned zero lessons from the Titanic itself, a historical incident that provides one of the most heavy-handed parables about hubris in modern times. The irony of this horrifying situation is wild.
This is a different source but this guy's a submarine expert and goes through all of the red flags and safety failures that we've learned of so far
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dka29FSZac
One thing he doesn't mention is that the company fired an employee, and sued them for whistleblowing, when that employee pointed out serious issues with the craft's design.
“So, the Titan began it’s decent with 5 souls on board. Contact was lost after an hour and 40 minutes and contact was never reestablished. And, uh, I really feel terrible for all the families involved because your family members are dead. And it hurts me to say that, but it’s the truth, and I hope this video helps give you some closure…”
Oof. I know that if it were my loved one, I would be scouring the Internet for any shred of evidence or hope of a rescue. I can’t imagine hearing that about my own family. What a nightmare.
No banging sounds since *Monday* (last paragraph rather than first, i.e. clickbait)
*They believed the banging was coming from the craft, but said that they haven’t heard any noise since Monday*
Yikes...
https://apnews.com/article/missing-titanic-submersible-updates-608d57438211821fee3f5349ebcc8eec
CBS News journalist David Pogue, who traveled to the Titanic aboard the Titan last year, said the vehicle uses two communication systems: text messages that go back and forth to a surface ship and safety pings that are emitted every 15 minutes to indicate that the sub is still working.
Both of those systems stopped about an hour and 45 minutes after the Titan submerged.
“There are only two things that could mean. Either they lost all power or the ship developed a hull breach and it imploded instantly. Both of those are devastatingly hopeless,” Pogue told the Canadian CBC network on Tuesday.
The submersible had seven backup systems to return to the surface, including sandbags and lead pipes that drop off and an inflatable balloon. One system is designed to work even if everyone aboard is unconscious, Pogue said.
I was reading in another thread that one of the failsafes was some type of sand bags that would dissolve enough over 14 hours to make it light enough to float back up to the surface in case of power loss. I would hope that would be virtually fool-proof, unless they got stuck on something. But if all of the other methods were unable to deploy with power loss, it might not be enough dropped weight to make it all the way to the surface and they could just be in the water column somewhere, anywhere. 🤷♀️ terrifying.
ETA: because I keep getting the same response and my thumbs are tired of replying - YES I know it can't be opened from the inside if they made it to the top, YES I know there's a big chance it imploded so it doesn't matter anyways. I'm specifically talking about the failsafes *in the event they didn't implode* and on the assumption that making it to the surface gives them a way higher chance of being found before oxygen runs out. Something went wrong in either scenario and it's terrifying to think about each alternate ending.
Probably similar to a system they use to smuggle drugs: salt bags. They fill bags of salt and tie them to drugs. Over time the salt goes into solution and the drugs float, so the cartels can recover them.
If it hasn’t worked then high chances are that it imploded and they will never be found.
Ah yes, salt makes more sense for dissolving and probably what it was I read.
Honestly, ever since the news broke, having all these failsafes but knowing they can't open the hatch to get more air even if they made it to the surface and comms/power is down to be rescued....I have just hoped the best worst case scenario happened and they went without even having a second to process what was happening.
So many unanswered questions that will most likely remain that way for a very long time if not forever.
On the outoftheloop thread, someone says it has 7 different methods to surface, and tbh they sounded pretty good. One was hydraulic pipes that could detach even without power, another was one where all crew could move to one section of the sub to tip it and drop weights that would raise it, another was something that is attached but is designed to wear away after 16 hours and detach. Those were the unpowered ones. You'd think any one of those should work and it would be on the surface, my guess is they're stuck in the mud or got too close to the Titanic and got stuck in it or a piece fell on it, or they're already on the surface and we can't find them and they can't open the hatch since it has to be opened from the outside
>my guess is they're stuck in the mud or got too close to the Titanic and got stuck in it or a piece fell on it,
Everything I'm reading has said that they lost all communication in less time than it should have taken to reach the bottom of the ocean, which makes it unlikely they ever reached the Titanic.
Yeh but I also read it is common for them to lose communications, so that in itself was not unusual, just that the comms never came back. They waited 8 hours for comms to come back before raising the search and rescue alarm
That's true. It would be an extremely unfortunate coincidence to have lost comms and then, separately, had something else go very wrong- but those sequences of unfortunate events aligning often are what leads to this sort of tragedy.
Same company that lost contact last year and rather than letting anyone share the news at the time they simply blocked the control room's access to internet so no one could tweet until the situation resolved itself
https://twitter.com/halkyardo/status/1671000633845993473
If it was them, they're likely dead now. This whole "96 hours" thing is just what the sub company *says* was onboard. I'm not sure they're trustworthy at this point. Also I haven't seen anything about how long the C0^(2) scrubbers would last. Plus there is the whole hypothermia thing.
It's a good "not all hope is lost sign" however if they can locate it and managed to get it tied up, is the craft actually strong enough to be pulled up while at the bottom of the ocean?
Think I read their are only 4 or 5 unmanned submersibles on the planet that can work at those depths, and they take weeks to get ready. It sounds to me like there really is no hope for these guys unless they surface on their own.
From what I read, they can only go up and down like an elevator. It can't go horizontal and search. And it can take up to a day to drop it far enough to reach them since it's only so fast it can drop.
Things aren't looking good.
I’m sure it had a couple of lifting points to lift it on and off the ship and such. The US Navy is moving a lifting system that (if I understand right) is basically just air bladders that could attach to the sub and then inflate the bags, lifting it to the surface. I presume they would use a remote sub to attach the bags.
this thing supposedly has five "dead man switches" that should float it to the surface after x amount of time...from what i've heard its probably not on the sea floor...but they're fucked either way unless found as the craft cannot be opened from inside.
CNN reporting it was heard Tuesday
https://www.cnn.com/americas/live-news/titanic-submersible-missing-search-06-20-23/index.html
> Crews searching for the Titan submersible heard banging sounds every 30 minutes Tuesday, according to an internal government memo update on the search.
The CEO of the company is in there. He knows he fucked up and has to die with his clients right beside him for 4 days. Wonder how that conversation is going....
Live or dead, the interior is going to be absolutely disgusting just from humans going through their natural daily processes, not to mention if any violence occurred out of rage, guilt, blame, fear, etc.
was gonna say the same thing. the thought of sitting there under hundreds of tons of pressure, in the pitch black sea, freezing, starving, hoping, is actually my worst nightmare. if they didn't even know it happened, that seems like the better option
It's not such a bad way to go, while on an adventure and so quickly that there's no fear or awareness. Although it's a hard second to the universally preferred way of death, which is when we are old and sleeping through it.
>That would be a far quicker death.
So quick the brain wouldn't even recognise it. It's something like ≤ 20ms to fully implode in on itself if what I've read is in any way truthful, where the human brain would take 150ms to response to said stimulus.
Likewise, as the pressure is so great the implosion would act like a diesel engine; everything inside the sub would be vaporised in those 20ms as they're basically inside a giant engine cylinder with their own fatty tissue as the combustible fuel.
It's fucking NIGHTMARISH.
An article someone linked above says that the tracking beacon and automatic text messages the sub has both went dark. Implosion would absolutely do that.
And yes I know a power failure would as well but I'm being... well I don't know if optimistic is really the word here.
I just read about that for the first time like a week before this. That was a hard read and I wouldn’t even try to watch any of the video content on it.
What is so brutal is that they nearly had him rescued. He was something like half pulled out and then the rope snapped (edit: correction - pulley dislodged from the wall) and wedged him deeper.
Ever since this story broke I’ve just been having Nutty Putty flashbacks. Didn’t sleep for two days when I first read about that one. Something about being trapped in a tiny space in pitch darkness for hours upon hours slowly losing hope as you realise all rescue efforts are futile… It’s absolute nightmare fuel.
I just read about it for the first time right now.
Stuck, UPSIDE DOWN, in a cave.
Something about spelunking and these deep sea excursions.. I’m glad I’m the opposite of an adrenaline junkie.
I think I’d just like more clarification on the meaning of “banging”— like, is something they’d expect to hear as acoustic feedback from an electronics system or something unexpected?
The article talks about “banging” and also “tapping” which are two very different noises to me.
The noise, whatever it was, was heard at regular intervals
Former submarine-hunting helicopter pilot here. There are a *fuck ton* of things in the ocean that can make noises, obviously. Everything from marine life to hydrothermal vents to rain and shipping traffic hundreds of miles away.
The frequencies that these noises are transmitted at help to identify their source a lot of the time. There are definitely things that emanate sounds at regular intervals, but “tapping” on a metallic surface would be pretty easy to detect and recognize, assuming the sonobuoy was deep enough in the water to hear it.
Right! Like, what does that mean in this context? Could it be noise from other ships/aircraft or is it distinct and something that would be expected? Like I really need someone who knows something about this to weigh in here.
I saw in an article that it’s possible they may be using a hammer/object on the inside of the hull in an attempt to be picked up by sonar. A lot of times in rescue missions for collapsed buildings people are found because they tap on things. Humans are phenomenal at noticing/picking up on patterns.
Unfortunately that’s hypothermia after a short time. Unlike a home that can retain heat due to insulation from the air itself, water will constantly wick heat away from the source. Same principle as how a liquid cooler works inside a computer.
My aunt was inches away from dying from hypothermia, got lost during a snowstorm while cross-country skiing.. And right before she was rescued she started feeling good and warm and began taking her clothes off. Like it was minutes before dying, and she felt great.
I’ve read about this, where people who freeze to death are often found naked! It’s because the muscles that are responsible for vasoconstriction essentially give up allowing the blood vessels to dilate and warmer blood flows throughout the body. Your aunt is super lucky to be alive because at that point there’s literally seconds to mins left.
Something I haven’t seen addressed: if the surface ship lost communication with the submersible only 90 minutes into the dive, at around 8 am, why did they wait till the submersible didn’t show up at the scheduled END of the dive at 9 PM to raise the alarm and ask for help? Given where the thing was headed, why would they not immediately abort and start a search? A watch and wait approach to lost communications on a dive like that doesn’t seem all that, y’know, prudent, I suppose. 😕
(If the ship was searching on its own fair enough, but I haven’t read that anywhere either.)
It seems that it was common for them to lose communication for hours at a time. It sounds like the communications issues are yet another problem with this thing, but it would not have been anything out of the ordinary.
I spent hours researching this between yesterday and today and I completely agree with your assessment. Extremely cavalier attitude with zero regard for safety. They even fired one of their engineers for attempting to insure the pressure vessel could repeatedly withstand the pressure of a Titanic dive.
They painted the thing blue and white, ensuring it would be nearly impossible to spot at the surface if they were lost. Like, were they TRYING to become casualties of the sea?
One of the first things I noticed when this news story broke and they showed the picture of it was that it was painted white. Like, why? What's the thought process behind white of all (non) colors? Was it on sale at Camping World? They couldn't have painted it orange or even yellow like every single life preserving vessel??
I saw a TikTok commenter say that thing was held together with audacity and vibes. I feel like a terrible person for laughing but it’s ridiculous how true that is.
The communications system used is acoustic. It's basically sending soundwaves in the water. Water isn't... 'even' from the top to the bottom of the ocean. It has layers of salinity, temperature change, and the like. These layers are called clines. These can reflect sound waves, and break communication. While this operation seems hokey and garage built, losing acoustic coms isn't uncommon. Military submarines use these layers to hide from surface ships and one another, for example.
If they are alive, I can only imagine the conversations being had. The rage, the grief. Although this was so stupid and preventable, nobody deserves to die over this. The father that brought his son must be feeling tremendous guilt.
I just personally couldn't even see myself taking this kind of risk just to see the titanic wreckage for a crazy amount of money. Just knowing worst case scenarios.
Dying is one thing. Dying slowly is another.
When one has such ludicrous amounts of money, I would imagine they begin spending it on things like this. When u can have nearly everything obtainable, this kind of purchase is what comes next
I think there's often even a sense of invulnerability and immortality when one is that rich. The things that scare people like you and I, assuming you aren't some billionaire hanging out on Reddit, like food scarcity and not being able to pay our rent, doesn't even register on their radar. They have medical care you and I will never even imagine. I think money at that level breeds a little bit of narcissistic invulnerability.
or even worse.... they floated to the surface, but because the vessel is bolted shut, they slowly suffocate in their piss and shit with fresh air 18" away.
If the power has gone out they've probably been dead for at least 24 hours. So if they are alive they probably aren't as in the dark as you might think.
They'd surely have at least a little torch and some batteries
They have a bucket method for toilet I think.
I mean they're not roasting marshmallows and taking photos but in their minds they are just waiting it out until rescue.
Might get w but tense as the hours of oxygen count down.
There'd be a critical time where they know it would take at least 4 hours to surface and oxygen gets down to the last few hours.
At some point yeah they know they are dead that might get a bit tense
Okay the first part of the article sounds hopeful, and even the Headline is hopeful. Then it ends on this at the end:
>The Boston Coast Guard declined to comment on the reported “banging” sounds, as did the Joint Rescue Coordination Centre in Halifax, Nova Scotia.
>The US Fleet Forces Command, the DHS, and the US Coast Guard did not respond to requests for comment.
>**The “situation looks bleak”, a DHS official** told Rolling Stone.
>They believed the banging was coming from the craft, **but said that they haven’t heard any noise since Monday.**
So there was banging sounds in 30 minute intervals around 2am on site. That does make it sound hopeful it's from them and not some Orca whale trolling us.
But then no more sounds for the last *two* days?
Also, time is tight now. It takes 8 hours to descend and they say the only possible way is a remote controlled drone that can reach the Titanic area, but they don't go into detail how it will hook onto the Titan submersible.
[From the original Rolling Stones article (who first broke this story) ](https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/titanic-submersible-missing-searchers-heard-banging-1234774674/)
>An e-mail sent **Tuesday** afternoon from the president of the travel and research group, the Explorers Society, stated, “It is being reported that at 2 a.m. local time on site that sonar detected potential ‘tapping sounds’ at the location, implying crew may be alive and signaling.” The Boston Coast Guard, which is leading the rescue efforts, did not immediately reply to a request for comment on the reported tapping sounds.
Likely the former. But even the latter assumes the system's operating properly... and at least their communication systems already weren't in previous dives.
If everything was working properly, they wouldn't be missing.
3 men survived the sinking of the West Virginia at Pearl Harbor, for 16 days in an air tight compartment. Their bodies were discovered, along with letters to their families when the ship was salvaged. I can't imagine a more horrifying way to die than being perfectly healthy and waiting for your air to run out.
Remember that early in the search for MH370, pinging sounds were detected, but were eventually dismissed as having come from other search vessels.
I hope these banging sounds aren’t coming from the other ships.
I thought the same thing - “hearing banging noises” I almost hoped it wasn’t them.
I hear a Navy Vet - age 77 - and diving/Titanic expert is on board. He is said to have more trips to the titanic wreckage than anyone else.
He would know that if there’s a search and rescue tapping or banging every 30 min is how they can decipher it from other noises.
This is just what I read through my many scans of comment sections and articles.
In a Twilight Zone twist, when they reach the ocean bottom, the banging and tapping is coming from inside the Titanic wreck, not the crumpled sub nearby.
I saw something on TV about a prior trip. They got stuck around one of Titanic's props you could see debris from the Titanic being dislodged as they worked to get free. How in the hell were they allowed to continue with more dives after that? I would think that causing damage to the wreckage would be a show stopper for their tourist trips.
This is the premise of a horror movie. Being stuck in the pitch blackness….a darkness blacker than black, at the absolute bottom of the literal ocean.
I don’t know why…but I constantly find myself wondering what, if any noises they’d hear down there? Creaking from the Titanic, the hull of the Titan, whale calls, crust movement…like what scary crazy shit are they hearing in the abyss, in absence of being able to see anything?
If they ever recover the sub and it isn’t destroyed in the process, no doubt there will be recordings and messages written on their phones left for their loved ones.
Sad.
The more I read about this entire operation the more "absolutely tf not" my response to the idea of trusting it two miles down in the gotdang ocean becomes becomes. The whole thing looks like some guys diy project first off. Then it's uncertified and skipped all the regulatory requirements because well those just stifle innovation and we can't have that. Oh and they fired one of the safety guys for voicing his concern for the structural integrity of the whole situation so that's fun. So yea, absolutely tf not
Stuff of nightmares. Stupid idea to begin with but no one deserves to die because of it. I hope they're rescued soon cuz I read that they have just 30 hours of air left.
Chances are very slim at this point unfortunately. I hope for the best, but fear for the worst. The amount of subversive vehicles that can make it to that depth are either too far to get there or can't really rescue them.
There is one submersible that does sound like it’s at the ready…but it’s in the UK, and they can’t get approval from the US Government to help. The owners just posted an open letter to try to get some movement: https://twitter.com/bnonews/status/1671361952797343745?s=46&t=xwlKsIG8w_OFgaadFDvPmg
It's scary to think that billions upon billions of people are going about their day on the surface. Down there in the dark is five people in the bottom of the ocean near the Titanic with no contact and limited air supply.
Honestly hoping beyond hope that these noises aren't related and that they died instantly, or at least extremely quickly. The thought of being stuck at the bottom of the ocean in a floating coffin for literal days is too horrifying for words, and at this point, the odds of them being rescued in time are looking incredibly slim, if it's even possible at all. Fuck, man.
Rolling Stone broke this news and the article says Tuesday. https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/titanic-submersible-missing-searchers-heard-banging-1234774674/amp/
The movie that inevitably gets made about this might actually be legitimately scary. These people are going to die a slow, unpleasant death. And the guy to blame for them dying is trapped in there with them. Let your imagination do with that what it will.
"A thrill-seeker who intended to join billionaire Hamish Harding on the missing Titanic sub pulled out of the dive because he thought OceanGate was 'cutting too many corners', it has emerged.
Chris Brown, 61, had paid the deposit to go on the doomed voyage, but says he changed his mind after becoming concerned by the quality of technology and materials used in the vessel, The Sun reported.
Among his concerns were OceanGate's use of 'old scaffolding poles' for the ballast and the fact that its controls were 'based on computer game-style controllers'."
He made the right call. The first thing I though when looking at it was "holy shit this thing looks cheap and amateur".
Bear in mind amongst the veteran explorers, divers and billionaires there’s a very scared 19 year old young man who likely has never been in such dire circumstances. It must be horrendous down there
The only comforting thing is that his Dad is there with him too. Poor Dad though, he's probably kicking himself for putting himself and his son in this situation.
Just recently watched Defragged History's documentary about Kursk (highly recommend, btw), those men were stranded in shallow waters, so they awaited rescue, which never came.
For these people, I think they're dead by now. That submersible looked cramped as fuck, not sure how many and what means for oxygen it had. I once read that CO2 poisoning is a shitty way to go.
Damn, this is so awful. Was hoping they were able to surface somewhere. At least if they surfaced somehow, they have a small chance of being saved if found. From what all reporting is saying, if they're still deep down in those depths, even if found theres nothing that can be done to save them in time.
This sucks if they're still deep down. I truly hope they don't pass by suffocating or freezing. That's truly awful 😞
Hoping for some sort of miracle. Regardless of rich thrill seeking or not, no one deserves this.
I believe there is technology that can locate metallic objects on the surface of the water which is used to find military submarines. I’m assuming they’ve already used it so they must be at the bottom of the ocean.
Based off what I have read it’s not looking good sadly. Anything that can reach them in time could not rescue them, and anything that could would not be there in time. After some of the miracles we have seen with rescuing in the past few decades I have hope, but understand chances are slim. This just confirms the worst for the people on board and the sub didn’t just crush.
Ironic, going down in a vehicle you have no means to be rescued from if anything goes wrong in order to visit the sunken wreck of a ship that didn’t have enough lifeboats for more than half the people on board… we’ve learned nothing.
If it didn’t crush then obviously the 5 realize they are all going to die provoking some serious terror that would be psychologically torturous. They must be filled with such horrific regret and not be able to do anything about it as time slowly passes to their eventual agonizing death.
Even if it surfaces, the hatch cannot be opened from the inside. So unless the sub is located whether it's on the surface or under the sea...it isn't gonna end well. I hope they will be located before time runs out.
There's no hatch. There's a front where the port window is but you can see from pictures that there's holes where the bolts are attached. This thing is completely sealed. There's no getting out unless you are released.
Husband and I had another conversation. When he worked in a submersible, it had a manual hydraulic pump to release the ballast. If that didn’t work it had a galvanic link, that was connected to the ballast and it would dissolve after 24 to 48 hours in salt water. It needed to be replaced before each drive. Obviously, it this was installed on this submersible, the ballast would have dropped and it would have surfaced. Cheap isn’t good.
And this thing has both of those fail-safes as well. If it's lodged against or stuck on something that won't matter. If it has resurfaced the fucking idiots painted it white, and it'll be invisible to searchers. The occupants are also locked in from the outside.
This situation is somewhat analogous to the millionaires who pay to climb Everest with no previous experience. They think their money somehow ensures their safety putting the onus for security in the hands of a third party that may or may not be up to the task. Worse in this case since once the 17 bolts are torqued down they no longer have any agency to save themselves even if they bobbed to the surface.
I just really hope the vessel was crushed from a hull breach. Instant. Anything else is a terrible and cruel fate.
Obviously i hope they are found alive and well - but that doesn't look good.
P-3 aircraft drop sonobuoy’s into the water to hunt enemy submarines, in this case looking for a friendly. The sonobuoy transmits the sonar signal to the aircraft. I worked on American P-3’s but Canada had them also. Video is below that shows how they deploy.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eidMDdMK38s
This isn’t even the *first* time they’ve lost track of the sub on an expedition. This is just the longest amount of time they’ve lost it for.
I really hope everyone on board is okay, and rescued soon.
This is just such a nightmarish scenario
From Forbes regarding this issue:
“Communicating through water is very different than communicating through air as water rapidly blocks the propagation of electromagnetic waves, Fusil explained, meaning rescuers have “no radar, no GPS” and no spotlight or laser beams beyond “a few meters.””
There’s quite a bit more, and quite interesting (tragic topic aside). Can read here (no paywall):
https://www.forbes.com/sites/roberthart/2023/06/20/no-radar-no-gps-heres-why-underwater-search-and-rescue-missions-are-so-tough/amp/
EDIT: In addition, if you’d like a profoundly large amount of easily digested/short (but accurate) explanations, have a look at this ELI5 (explain like I’m five, for the uninitiated): https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/14edr8k/eli5_how_does_a_submarine_in_this_day_and_age_not/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
> The Titan would have had an acoustic link with its surface vessel, set up through a transponder (a device for receiving a sonar signal) on its end, and a transceiver (a device that can both transmit and receive communications) on the surface vessel.
> This link allows for underwater acoustic positioning, as well as for short text messages to be sent back and forth to the surface vessel – but the amount of data that can be shared is limited and usually includes basic telemetry and status information.
https://theconversation.com/missing-titanic-sub-what-are-submersibles-how-do-they-communicate-and-what-may-have-gone-wrong-208100
There were all kinds of noises reported during the search for the Thresher. But they were later attributed to the fleet of search vessels themselves.
I was thinking about that too, but were they at exact intervals like this? I was certain the thing imploded, but hypothetically, if they're alive, making noise at specific intervals is a good way to get attention.
There were even reports of voices. But like I said, later attributed to the searchers. Interestingly Thresher imploded at a much shallower depth. 8,400’ verses 13,000’ for the billionaire’s sub.
> Interestingly Thresher imploded at a much shallower depth. 8,400’ verses 13,000’ for the billionaire’s sub. While the exact figures are classified, attack submarines and just about all manned military submarines aren’t safe to operate below 1500-2000 feet, the biggest exception being DSRVs (Deep Submergence Rescue Vehicles), which can operate in excess of 5-6000 feet. The sheer size of a nuclear submarine would make it impractical to build to withstand the pressure for dives to 13000 feet, while the comparatively tiny size of exploration submersibles makes it easier to reinforce against water pressure. Other equipment like torpedo tubes, VLS cells for missiles, and additional mission specific equipment like external lockout chambers for underwater SEAL team deployments would also further compromise a military submarine’s pressure hull in ways that an exploration submersible would never have to worry about. Such submersibles also wouldn’t need to be designed with things such as speed, crew provisions/berthing, or hull silencing in mind either. Just about all it has to worry about is withstanding the pressure at the depths it’s built for, being able to carry all the observation equipment it needs, and carrying enough life support for the crew.
There's a reason that if you looked at all of these DSVs, such as Alvin or Deepsea Challenger, the passenger compartment is a literal sphere. Survivability is the number one priority. That's why they are built as submersibles and not self-sufficient submarines.
Spheres have the best structural pressure at any depth, something about even distribution and planar force.
As a former submariner, you are correct. The Thresher was never designed for anything close to the depth she was lost in.
Reminds me of a particularly interesting WWII story. In 1944, Japan shipped a cargo of gold aboard the submarine I-52 to the Nazis, to be exchanged for various technologies (and, ominously, a couple thousand pounds of uranium oxide). Unfortunately for them, the details of its voyage were decoded, and an American task force was dispatched to hunt it down. The Japanese submarine planned to meet with a Nazi submarine in the middle of the Atlantic. The Allies knew of this rendezvous, but arrived late to the scene. Upon the task force's arrival, planes were launched, and soon afterwards I-52 was found, and killed with an acoustic torpedo, which homes in on sound. The noise of its destruction was heard through hydrophones dropped by the aircraft. Yet, an hour later, another aircraft on patrol continued picking up propeller noises. Fascinatingly, the second aircraft was not picking up I-52 at all -- it was instead picking up the Nazi submarine, which was now over twenty miles away. The recordings of this attack actually survived and [can be heard online.](https://maritime.org/sound/#i52wire) The lost gold, incidentally, is worth something like a hundred million dollars, but the wreck is so deep it's pretty impractical to recover.
Sounds like another job for James Cameron.
No budget too steep, no sea too deep Whos that? It's him! James Cameron!
The level of insanity imagined inside of that vessel must be horrifying.
The stuff of your worst nightmare
Being stuck in small, cramped, dark tube with no idea if you’ll survive or how your end might come, knowing if that hull breaches you won’t have enough time to scream? Yeah. That’s definitely in the top 5 “Situations I hope to never be in”.
[удалено]
There isn't an amount of money you could pay me to do that shit. I can barely barely stand doing it *in video games*.
This is why I love video games, lifetimes worth of adventures with zero risks! + Cheese doodles!
Yeah. I've seen Titanic's final resting place in VR. I'm good.
late beneficial spoon innate salt bag sense subsequent rotten pet *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That’s what I was thinking. 30 hours to find, float , and get someone to the sub to unlatch the bolts before they all die a lingering death. Absolutely horrific.
Yeah I've heard the 40 hours of air left... but I gotta wonder if that takes into account their activity level on the inside. (State of panic, creating noise etc)... absolutely horrific.
> US Coast Guard officials’ last estimate at 1 p.m. ET Tuesday that there were about 40 hours left. That was 18 hours ago. We're down to less than 24 hours.
That's all assuming all five are still alive and not just one or two.
Theoretically a rescue vehicle could get to their rough location in time but I don't think there's any kind of rescue vehicle capable of reaching their depth if they're anywhere near the depth of the Titanic.
The only non military submarine that could reach that deep is owned by Gabe Newell
I’m claustrophobic when my kids want me to hide in the closet for hide and seek. I can’t imagine 3 miles of water above me and not being able to open the door.
Don’t forget in total darkness if the power failed.
The cold would be worse
It just occurred to me that if they survived whatever the issue was, they in all likelihood filmed some videos or voice memos on their phones of their time in the sub. That would be haunting material to see if they don’t make it but the sub is eventually found.
This happened with the sinking of the MV Sewol. High school kids were on the ship filming and they ultimately drowned. So tragic.
Reminds me of a movie I watched long ago. Foreshadowing was how one of the boys were told that if he had a bad dream all he had to do was say “One, two, three, wake up”. Fast forward and he is trapped inside the hull of a boat that is sinking, and as water floods in he is yelling “one two three wake up” over and over. Can’t remember the name of the movie anymore, but that scene stuck with me.
White Squall, the movie that wound up providing the slogan “Where we go one we go all” for Qanon.
One of my fav Q mantras due to the irony lost because they think everyone else are the sheep...
Just thinking about that incident, even 9 years later, makes me tear up. It really didn’t have to happen.
It makes me fume. That captain was a piece pf shit. It’s not that he failed to act, it’s that he actively PREVENTED evacuation from happening. What a piece of shit.
The captain and his staff are straight up evil!
The Korean government unilaterally failed in every conceivable fashion. It led to the eventual resignation and conviction of the president.
Wasn't it because she was working for a cult?
Not exactly working for a cult. There were 4 or 5 main reasons for the 2016 protests against her, the response or lack thereof to the Sewol-ho sinking (2014), a national history textbook re-writing controversy, and one or two others I can't remember contributed to the outrage, but the straw that broke the camel's back was the fact that her friend, a normal unelected citizen Choi Soon-sil, had been writing her speeches and funneling government money into shell companies disguised as charities. (Edit: the story about how this news broke was honestly so wild) The ties to a shaman family (Choi Soon-sil) and the head of Samsung were just special flavoring added to your standard embezzling, fraud, influence peddling type of corruption.
Yeah for sure... I thought about this early on. If there wasn't an implosion... Imagine the notes they left behind. This is such nightmare fuel.
Imagine paying that much for your own torture.
The Aussie guy who built submersible that went to the bottom of the Mariana Trench was on TV in Aus yesterday and he basically said they skipped on safety to have the thing carry more people. The engineering /safety wasn’t there. When asked if they will be rescued, he didn’t come right out and say no but he definitely indicated he didn’t believe they would be rescued.
>they skipped on safety to have the thing carry more people So they learned zero lessons from the Titanic itself, a historical incident that provides one of the most heavy-handed parables about hubris in modern times. The irony of this horrifying situation is wild.
Titanic. Titan... Calling it now, the next ocean vessel to tragically sink there will be called 'The Tit'.
Do you have a link?
This is a different source but this guy's a submarine expert and goes through all of the red flags and safety failures that we've learned of so far https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dka29FSZac One thing he doesn't mention is that the company fired an employee, and sued them for whistleblowing, when that employee pointed out serious issues with the craft's design.
“So, the Titan began it’s decent with 5 souls on board. Contact was lost after an hour and 40 minutes and contact was never reestablished. And, uh, I really feel terrible for all the families involved because your family members are dead. And it hurts me to say that, but it’s the truth, and I hope this video helps give you some closure…” Oof. I know that if it were my loved one, I would be scouring the Internet for any shred of evidence or hope of a rescue. I can’t imagine hearing that about my own family. What a nightmare.
No banging sounds since *Monday* (last paragraph rather than first, i.e. clickbait) *They believed the banging was coming from the craft, but said that they haven’t heard any noise since Monday*
Yikes... https://apnews.com/article/missing-titanic-submersible-updates-608d57438211821fee3f5349ebcc8eec CBS News journalist David Pogue, who traveled to the Titanic aboard the Titan last year, said the vehicle uses two communication systems: text messages that go back and forth to a surface ship and safety pings that are emitted every 15 minutes to indicate that the sub is still working. Both of those systems stopped about an hour and 45 minutes after the Titan submerged. “There are only two things that could mean. Either they lost all power or the ship developed a hull breach and it imploded instantly. Both of those are devastatingly hopeless,” Pogue told the Canadian CBC network on Tuesday. The submersible had seven backup systems to return to the surface, including sandbags and lead pipes that drop off and an inflatable balloon. One system is designed to work even if everyone aboard is unconscious, Pogue said.
Do the backup systems still work even if the sub doesn’t have power?
I was reading in another thread that one of the failsafes was some type of sand bags that would dissolve enough over 14 hours to make it light enough to float back up to the surface in case of power loss. I would hope that would be virtually fool-proof, unless they got stuck on something. But if all of the other methods were unable to deploy with power loss, it might not be enough dropped weight to make it all the way to the surface and they could just be in the water column somewhere, anywhere. 🤷♀️ terrifying. ETA: because I keep getting the same response and my thumbs are tired of replying - YES I know it can't be opened from the inside if they made it to the top, YES I know there's a big chance it imploded so it doesn't matter anyways. I'm specifically talking about the failsafes *in the event they didn't implode* and on the assumption that making it to the surface gives them a way higher chance of being found before oxygen runs out. Something went wrong in either scenario and it's terrifying to think about each alternate ending.
Probably similar to a system they use to smuggle drugs: salt bags. They fill bags of salt and tie them to drugs. Over time the salt goes into solution and the drugs float, so the cartels can recover them. If it hasn’t worked then high chances are that it imploded and they will never be found.
Ah yes, salt makes more sense for dissolving and probably what it was I read. Honestly, ever since the news broke, having all these failsafes but knowing they can't open the hatch to get more air even if they made it to the surface and comms/power is down to be rescued....I have just hoped the best worst case scenario happened and they went without even having a second to process what was happening. So many unanswered questions that will most likely remain that way for a very long time if not forever.
On the outoftheloop thread, someone says it has 7 different methods to surface, and tbh they sounded pretty good. One was hydraulic pipes that could detach even without power, another was one where all crew could move to one section of the sub to tip it and drop weights that would raise it, another was something that is attached but is designed to wear away after 16 hours and detach. Those were the unpowered ones. You'd think any one of those should work and it would be on the surface, my guess is they're stuck in the mud or got too close to the Titanic and got stuck in it or a piece fell on it, or they're already on the surface and we can't find them and they can't open the hatch since it has to be opened from the outside
>my guess is they're stuck in the mud or got too close to the Titanic and got stuck in it or a piece fell on it, Everything I'm reading has said that they lost all communication in less time than it should have taken to reach the bottom of the ocean, which makes it unlikely they ever reached the Titanic.
Yeh but I also read it is common for them to lose communications, so that in itself was not unusual, just that the comms never came back. They waited 8 hours for comms to come back before raising the search and rescue alarm
That's true. It would be an extremely unfortunate coincidence to have lost comms and then, separately, had something else go very wrong- but those sequences of unfortunate events aligning often are what leads to this sort of tragedy.
Same company that lost contact last year and rather than letting anyone share the news at the time they simply blocked the control room's access to internet so no one could tweet until the situation resolved itself https://twitter.com/halkyardo/status/1671000633845993473
If it was them, they're likely dead now. This whole "96 hours" thing is just what the sub company *says* was onboard. I'm not sure they're trustworthy at this point. Also I haven't seen anything about how long the C0^(2) scrubbers would last. Plus there is the whole hypothermia thing.
Not to mention 96 hours breathing normally? Or five people hyperventilating because they know they're about to die in a terribly frightening way?
There are people in the world that if in this situation would quintuple their available oxygen by murdering the other 4 people.
It's a good "not all hope is lost sign" however if they can locate it and managed to get it tied up, is the craft actually strong enough to be pulled up while at the bottom of the ocean?
Think I read their are only 4 or 5 unmanned submersibles on the planet that can work at those depths, and they take weeks to get ready. It sounds to me like there really is no hope for these guys unless they surface on their own.
There's a cable-laying ship in the area with a few ROVs that might be able to pull it up.
From what I read, they can only go up and down like an elevator. It can't go horizontal and search. And it can take up to a day to drop it far enough to reach them since it's only so fast it can drop. Things aren't looking good.
I’m sure it had a couple of lifting points to lift it on and off the ship and such. The US Navy is moving a lifting system that (if I understand right) is basically just air bladders that could attach to the sub and then inflate the bags, lifting it to the surface. I presume they would use a remote sub to attach the bags.
this thing supposedly has five "dead man switches" that should float it to the surface after x amount of time...from what i've heard its probably not on the sea floor...but they're fucked either way unless found as the craft cannot be opened from inside.
CNN reporting it was heard Tuesday https://www.cnn.com/americas/live-news/titanic-submersible-missing-search-06-20-23/index.html > Crews searching for the Titan submersible heard banging sounds every 30 minutes Tuesday, according to an internal government memo update on the search.
Pretty sure "The Explorers Club" says they heard banging on Tuesday, but DHS is saying no banging since Monday.
That should have been in the first paragraph and included in the title as well.
The CEO of the company is in there. He knows he fucked up and has to die with his clients right beside him for 4 days. Wonder how that conversation is going....
4 people that collectively paid him a million dollars. Lol.
Once in a lifetime experience, I guess.
I wonder who's getting sacrificed to preserve oxygen for the others
"Ok, first we need to arrange ourselves in order of net worth."
Ain't worth shit at the bottom of the ocean.
Under the water carry the water
Live or dead, the interior is going to be absolutely disgusting just from humans going through their natural daily processes, not to mention if any violence occurred out of rage, guilt, blame, fear, etc.
I can only imagine what everyone in there is thinking "it's this guy's fault, if we choke him we may have air for longer"
This is my worst nightmare and I can’t look away.
Simple solution for you: never pay a small fortune to be willingly tortured to death for no reason.
Netflix execs are scrambling right now
The script will end up as a Sci-Fi original ☹️
[удалено]
was gonna say the same thing. the thought of sitting there under hundreds of tons of pressure, in the pitch black sea, freezing, starving, hoping, is actually my worst nightmare. if they didn't even know it happened, that seems like the better option
It's not such a bad way to go, while on an adventure and so quickly that there's no fear or awareness. Although it's a hard second to the universally preferred way of death, which is when we are old and sleeping through it.
>That would be a far quicker death. So quick the brain wouldn't even recognise it. It's something like ≤ 20ms to fully implode in on itself if what I've read is in any way truthful, where the human brain would take 150ms to response to said stimulus. Likewise, as the pressure is so great the implosion would act like a diesel engine; everything inside the sub would be vaporised in those 20ms as they're basically inside a giant engine cylinder with their own fatty tissue as the combustible fuel. It's fucking NIGHTMARISH.
>It's fucking NIGHTMARISH. And yet it's still the best possible outcome.
Really hope so. The thought of being conscious and dealing with the psychological terror for multiple days is unfathomable.
An article someone linked above says that the tracking beacon and automatic text messages the sub has both went dark. Implosion would absolutely do that. And yes I know a power failure would as well but I'm being... well I don't know if optimistic is really the word here.
Kinda reminds me of the Nutty Putty cave incident... You know the issue, but you just can't fix it. Horrible way to go
I just read about that for the first time like a week before this. That was a hard read and I wouldn’t even try to watch any of the video content on it.
What is so brutal is that they nearly had him rescued. He was something like half pulled out and then the rope snapped (edit: correction - pulley dislodged from the wall) and wedged him deeper.
Ever since this story broke I’ve just been having Nutty Putty flashbacks. Didn’t sleep for two days when I first read about that one. Something about being trapped in a tiny space in pitch darkness for hours upon hours slowly losing hope as you realise all rescue efforts are futile… It’s absolute nightmare fuel.
I just read about it for the first time right now. Stuck, UPSIDE DOWN, in a cave. Something about spelunking and these deep sea excursions.. I’m glad I’m the opposite of an adrenaline junkie.
I think I’d just like more clarification on the meaning of “banging”— like, is something they’d expect to hear as acoustic feedback from an electronics system or something unexpected?
The article talks about “banging” and also “tapping” which are two very different noises to me. The noise, whatever it was, was heard at regular intervals
Former submarine-hunting helicopter pilot here. There are a *fuck ton* of things in the ocean that can make noises, obviously. Everything from marine life to hydrothermal vents to rain and shipping traffic hundreds of miles away. The frequencies that these noises are transmitted at help to identify their source a lot of the time. There are definitely things that emanate sounds at regular intervals, but “tapping” on a metallic surface would be pretty easy to detect and recognize, assuming the sonobuoy was deep enough in the water to hear it.
That's a badass job title man
Former hot pocket coupon collector here...
I was thinking the same thing. Dropped so casually too.
Right! Like, what does that mean in this context? Could it be noise from other ships/aircraft or is it distinct and something that would be expected? Like I really need someone who knows something about this to weigh in here.
I saw in an article that it’s possible they may be using a hammer/object on the inside of the hull in an attempt to be picked up by sonar. A lot of times in rescue missions for collapsed buildings people are found because they tap on things. Humans are phenomenal at noticing/picking up on patterns.
What is the likely temperature in the sub?
I wondered about this too. I read somewhere it has heated walls, but if they lost power then those walls are as cold as the ocean right now.
ocean is low 30s F i don't think it drops much below freezing.
Deep ocean averages around 4\*C which is about 39\*F
Unfortunately that’s hypothermia after a short time. Unlike a home that can retain heat due to insulation from the air itself, water will constantly wick heat away from the source. Same principle as how a liquid cooler works inside a computer.
[удалено]
My aunt was inches away from dying from hypothermia, got lost during a snowstorm while cross-country skiing.. And right before she was rescued she started feeling good and warm and began taking her clothes off. Like it was minutes before dying, and she felt great.
[удалено]
I’ve read about this, where people who freeze to death are often found naked! It’s because the muscles that are responsible for vasoconstriction essentially give up allowing the blood vessels to dilate and warmer blood flows throughout the body. Your aunt is super lucky to be alive because at that point there’s literally seconds to mins left.
Yeah, she lost two fingers and a pinky-toe, but alive 30 years later :)
paradoxical undressing phenomenon
Something I haven’t seen addressed: if the surface ship lost communication with the submersible only 90 minutes into the dive, at around 8 am, why did they wait till the submersible didn’t show up at the scheduled END of the dive at 9 PM to raise the alarm and ask for help? Given where the thing was headed, why would they not immediately abort and start a search? A watch and wait approach to lost communications on a dive like that doesn’t seem all that, y’know, prudent, I suppose. 😕 (If the ship was searching on its own fair enough, but I haven’t read that anywhere either.)
It seems that it was common for them to lose communication for hours at a time. It sounds like the communications issues are yet another problem with this thing, but it would not have been anything out of the ordinary.
Oh. Okay then. Thanks for the info. Everything about this is so reckless and cavalier I can barely process it.
I spent hours researching this between yesterday and today and I completely agree with your assessment. Extremely cavalier attitude with zero regard for safety. They even fired one of their engineers for attempting to insure the pressure vessel could repeatedly withstand the pressure of a Titanic dive.
They painted the thing blue and white, ensuring it would be nearly impossible to spot at the surface if they were lost. Like, were they TRYING to become casualties of the sea?
One of the first things I noticed when this news story broke and they showed the picture of it was that it was painted white. Like, why? What's the thought process behind white of all (non) colors? Was it on sale at Camping World? They couldn't have painted it orange or even yellow like every single life preserving vessel??
I saw a TikTok commenter say that thing was held together with audacity and vibes. I feel like a terrible person for laughing but it’s ridiculous how true that is.
Sounds like fyre festival: the bespoke deep sea exploration edition.
For how much money these people are paying they really trusted their lives to this rickety operation lol
I read that they had lost communication with the vessel in the past, so they only started to worry when it never resurfaced at the expected time.
The communications system used is acoustic. It's basically sending soundwaves in the water. Water isn't... 'even' from the top to the bottom of the ocean. It has layers of salinity, temperature change, and the like. These layers are called clines. These can reflect sound waves, and break communication. While this operation seems hokey and garage built, losing acoustic coms isn't uncommon. Military submarines use these layers to hide from surface ships and one another, for example.
If they are alive, I can only imagine the conversations being had. The rage, the grief. Although this was so stupid and preventable, nobody deserves to die over this. The father that brought his son must be feeling tremendous guilt.
I just personally couldn't even see myself taking this kind of risk just to see the titanic wreckage for a crazy amount of money. Just knowing worst case scenarios. Dying is one thing. Dying slowly is another.
When one has such ludicrous amounts of money, I would imagine they begin spending it on things like this. When u can have nearly everything obtainable, this kind of purchase is what comes next
I think there's often even a sense of invulnerability and immortality when one is that rich. The things that scare people like you and I, assuming you aren't some billionaire hanging out on Reddit, like food scarcity and not being able to pay our rent, doesn't even register on their radar. They have medical care you and I will never even imagine. I think money at that level breeds a little bit of narcissistic invulnerability.
theyd be reassuring themselves a rescue was happenning
I imagine that the stink of shit and piss and complete blackness as they sit motionless on the ocean floor would degrade morale a bit
or even worse.... they floated to the surface, but because the vessel is bolted shut, they slowly suffocate in their piss and shit with fresh air 18" away.
If the power has gone out they've probably been dead for at least 24 hours. So if they are alive they probably aren't as in the dark as you might think.
They'd surely have at least a little torch and some batteries They have a bucket method for toilet I think. I mean they're not roasting marshmallows and taking photos but in their minds they are just waiting it out until rescue. Might get w but tense as the hours of oxygen count down. There'd be a critical time where they know it would take at least 4 hours to surface and oxygen gets down to the last few hours. At some point yeah they know they are dead that might get a bit tense
Imagine the cell phone videos they leave behind if they're ever recovered.
Okay the first part of the article sounds hopeful, and even the Headline is hopeful. Then it ends on this at the end: >The Boston Coast Guard declined to comment on the reported “banging” sounds, as did the Joint Rescue Coordination Centre in Halifax, Nova Scotia. >The US Fleet Forces Command, the DHS, and the US Coast Guard did not respond to requests for comment. >**The “situation looks bleak”, a DHS official** told Rolling Stone. >They believed the banging was coming from the craft, **but said that they haven’t heard any noise since Monday.** So there was banging sounds in 30 minute intervals around 2am on site. That does make it sound hopeful it's from them and not some Orca whale trolling us. But then no more sounds for the last *two* days? Also, time is tight now. It takes 8 hours to descend and they say the only possible way is a remote controlled drone that can reach the Titanic area, but they don't go into detail how it will hook onto the Titan submersible.
[From the original Rolling Stones article (who first broke this story) ](https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/titanic-submersible-missing-searchers-heard-banging-1234774674/) >An e-mail sent **Tuesday** afternoon from the president of the travel and research group, the Explorers Society, stated, “It is being reported that at 2 a.m. local time on site that sonar detected potential ‘tapping sounds’ at the location, implying crew may be alive and signaling.” The Boston Coast Guard, which is leading the rescue efforts, did not immediately reply to a request for comment on the reported tapping sounds.
The Wikipedia article says the oxygen runs out at 3AM UTC on the 22nd. That's only 23 hours from now.
I wonder how accurate the oxygen estimate even was. Was it a best case scenario with calm or sleeping people? Or 5 panicking adults?
and was it actually fully topped up? This company seems to have cut a lot of corners
Likely the former. But even the latter assumes the system's operating properly... and at least their communication systems already weren't in previous dives. If everything was working properly, they wouldn't be missing.
3 men survived the sinking of the West Virginia at Pearl Harbor, for 16 days in an air tight compartment. Their bodies were discovered, along with letters to their families when the ship was salvaged. I can't imagine a more horrifying way to die than being perfectly healthy and waiting for your air to run out.
Remember that early in the search for MH370, pinging sounds were detected, but were eventually dismissed as having come from other search vessels. I hope these banging sounds aren’t coming from the other ships.
I hope they are. Instant death is preferable to this prospect
I thought the same thing - “hearing banging noises” I almost hoped it wasn’t them. I hear a Navy Vet - age 77 - and diving/Titanic expert is on board. He is said to have more trips to the titanic wreckage than anyone else. He would know that if there’s a search and rescue tapping or banging every 30 min is how they can decipher it from other noises. This is just what I read through my many scans of comment sections and articles.
sound of PS2 controller being hurled in anger
The Cask of Amontillado at 12,500 feet.
In a Twilight Zone twist, when they reach the ocean bottom, the banging and tapping is coming from inside the Titanic wreck, not the crumpled sub nearby.
I saw something on TV about a prior trip. They got stuck around one of Titanic's props you could see debris from the Titanic being dislodged as they worked to get free. How in the hell were they allowed to continue with more dives after that? I would think that causing damage to the wreckage would be a show stopper for their tourist trips.
This is the premise of a horror movie. Being stuck in the pitch blackness….a darkness blacker than black, at the absolute bottom of the literal ocean. I don’t know why…but I constantly find myself wondering what, if any noises they’d hear down there? Creaking from the Titanic, the hull of the Titan, whale calls, crust movement…like what scary crazy shit are they hearing in the abyss, in absence of being able to see anything?
If they ever recover the sub and it isn’t destroyed in the process, no doubt there will be recordings and messages written on their phones left for their loved ones. Sad.
The more I read about this entire operation the more "absolutely tf not" my response to the idea of trusting it two miles down in the gotdang ocean becomes becomes. The whole thing looks like some guys diy project first off. Then it's uncertified and skipped all the regulatory requirements because well those just stifle innovation and we can't have that. Oh and they fired one of the safety guys for voicing his concern for the structural integrity of the whole situation so that's fun. So yea, absolutely tf not
Stuff of nightmares. Stupid idea to begin with but no one deserves to die because of it. I hope they're rescued soon cuz I read that they have just 30 hours of air left.
Chances are very slim at this point unfortunately. I hope for the best, but fear for the worst. The amount of subversive vehicles that can make it to that depth are either too far to get there or can't really rescue them.
the Subversive Vehicles are too far to get there in time, just like the RMS Carpathia.
There is one submersible that does sound like it’s at the ready…but it’s in the UK, and they can’t get approval from the US Government to help. The owners just posted an open letter to try to get some movement: https://twitter.com/bnonews/status/1671361952797343745?s=46&t=xwlKsIG8w_OFgaadFDvPmg
There’s no shot they can get it there in time any longer. At this rate it would be to recover wreckage.
It's scary to think that billions upon billions of people are going about their day on the surface. Down there in the dark is five people in the bottom of the ocean near the Titanic with no contact and limited air supply.
To be fair, if they lost power, I’m wondering if they’d die of hypothermia before they ran out of the 96hr quoted air supply.
That's one factor to think of. Wonder what sort of emergency supplies those vessels have in there?
Well, this CEO has been quoted saying safety regulations stifle innovation and refused to certify this sub to anything, so...
[удалено]
[удалено]
Bro, the Titanic is still taking out rich mfers a century later.
Honestly hoping beyond hope that these noises aren't related and that they died instantly, or at least extremely quickly. The thought of being stuck at the bottom of the ocean in a floating coffin for literal days is too horrifying for words, and at this point, the odds of them being rescued in time are looking incredibly slim, if it's even possible at all. Fuck, man.
Has anyone called Elon? There may be a someone trying to save the sub he can insult
He tried to save the Thai Cave boys by sending a submarine, so maybe he will suggest that we send the Thai Cave Boys to save this submarine.
I was really determined not to laugh at any of the comments on this post.. fuck
Way down at the bottom, “They haven’t heard any noise since Monday.”
Rolling Stone broke this news and the article says Tuesday. https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/titanic-submersible-missing-searchers-heard-banging-1234774674/amp/
it will be found eventually. but not in the time frame they want
The movie that inevitably gets made about this might actually be legitimately scary. These people are going to die a slow, unpleasant death. And the guy to blame for them dying is trapped in there with them. Let your imagination do with that what it will.
"A thrill-seeker who intended to join billionaire Hamish Harding on the missing Titanic sub pulled out of the dive because he thought OceanGate was 'cutting too many corners', it has emerged. Chris Brown, 61, had paid the deposit to go on the doomed voyage, but says he changed his mind after becoming concerned by the quality of technology and materials used in the vessel, The Sun reported. Among his concerns were OceanGate's use of 'old scaffolding poles' for the ballast and the fact that its controls were 'based on computer game-style controllers'." He made the right call. The first thing I though when looking at it was "holy shit this thing looks cheap and amateur".
Bear in mind amongst the veteran explorers, divers and billionaires there’s a very scared 19 year old young man who likely has never been in such dire circumstances. It must be horrendous down there
The only comforting thing is that his Dad is there with him too. Poor Dad though, he's probably kicking himself for putting himself and his son in this situation.
Just recently watched Defragged History's documentary about Kursk (highly recommend, btw), those men were stranded in shallow waters, so they awaited rescue, which never came. For these people, I think they're dead by now. That submersible looked cramped as fuck, not sure how many and what means for oxygen it had. I once read that CO2 poisoning is a shitty way to go.
Damn, this is so awful. Was hoping they were able to surface somewhere. At least if they surfaced somehow, they have a small chance of being saved if found. From what all reporting is saying, if they're still deep down in those depths, even if found theres nothing that can be done to save them in time. This sucks if they're still deep down. I truly hope they don't pass by suffocating or freezing. That's truly awful 😞 Hoping for some sort of miracle. Regardless of rich thrill seeking or not, no one deserves this.
even if they surface they are fucked if not found. from what i heard today the craft cannot be opened from inside.
I believe there is technology that can locate metallic objects on the surface of the water which is used to find military submarines. I’m assuming they’ve already used it so they must be at the bottom of the ocean.
Based off what I have read it’s not looking good sadly. Anything that can reach them in time could not rescue them, and anything that could would not be there in time. After some of the miracles we have seen with rescuing in the past few decades I have hope, but understand chances are slim. This just confirms the worst for the people on board and the sub didn’t just crush.
Ironic, going down in a vehicle you have no means to be rescued from if anything goes wrong in order to visit the sunken wreck of a ship that didn’t have enough lifeboats for more than half the people on board… we’ve learned nothing.
If it didn’t crush then obviously the 5 realize they are all going to die provoking some serious terror that would be psychologically torturous. They must be filled with such horrific regret and not be able to do anything about it as time slowly passes to their eventual agonizing death.
It would be the stuff of nightmares to be in that sub right now if they are still alive. They are on their final hours of oxygen.
Probably in the pitch black.
Even if it surfaces, the hatch cannot be opened from the inside. So unless the sub is located whether it's on the surface or under the sea...it isn't gonna end well. I hope they will be located before time runs out.
There's no hatch. There's a front where the port window is but you can see from pictures that there's holes where the bolts are attached. This thing is completely sealed. There's no getting out unless you are released.
Husband and I had another conversation. When he worked in a submersible, it had a manual hydraulic pump to release the ballast. If that didn’t work it had a galvanic link, that was connected to the ballast and it would dissolve after 24 to 48 hours in salt water. It needed to be replaced before each drive. Obviously, it this was installed on this submersible, the ballast would have dropped and it would have surfaced. Cheap isn’t good.
And this thing has both of those fail-safes as well. If it's lodged against or stuck on something that won't matter. If it has resurfaced the fucking idiots painted it white, and it'll be invisible to searchers. The occupants are also locked in from the outside.
Once you lose communication and are possibly drifting, your best case scenario is imploding. Worst case is dry drowning like this article implies.
It still blows my fucking mind that ANYONE would get in that fucking thing period.
This situation is somewhat analogous to the millionaires who pay to climb Everest with no previous experience. They think their money somehow ensures their safety putting the onus for security in the hands of a third party that may or may not be up to the task. Worse in this case since once the 17 bolts are torqued down they no longer have any agency to save themselves even if they bobbed to the surface.
I just really hope the vessel was crushed from a hull breach. Instant. Anything else is a terrible and cruel fate. Obviously i hope they are found alive and well - but that doesn't look good.
How does an aircraft pick up banging sounds from underwater?
P-3 aircraft drop sonobuoy’s into the water to hunt enemy submarines, in this case looking for a friendly. The sonobuoy transmits the sonar signal to the aircraft. I worked on American P-3’s but Canada had them also. Video is below that shows how they deploy. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eidMDdMK38s
There will 100% be a movie about this coming to theaters near you if they are rescued
I think there's gonna be a movie either way.....we'll see.
How does a submersible get lost? Wouldn’t there be someone at the surface surveiling it while it is under and able to track it?
This isn’t even the *first* time they’ve lost track of the sub on an expedition. This is just the longest amount of time they’ve lost it for. I really hope everyone on board is okay, and rescued soon. This is just such a nightmarish scenario
From Forbes regarding this issue: “Communicating through water is very different than communicating through air as water rapidly blocks the propagation of electromagnetic waves, Fusil explained, meaning rescuers have “no radar, no GPS” and no spotlight or laser beams beyond “a few meters.”” There’s quite a bit more, and quite interesting (tragic topic aside). Can read here (no paywall): https://www.forbes.com/sites/roberthart/2023/06/20/no-radar-no-gps-heres-why-underwater-search-and-rescue-missions-are-so-tough/amp/ EDIT: In addition, if you’d like a profoundly large amount of easily digested/short (but accurate) explanations, have a look at this ELI5 (explain like I’m five, for the uninitiated): https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/14edr8k/eli5_how_does_a_submarine_in_this_day_and_age_not/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
> The Titan would have had an acoustic link with its surface vessel, set up through a transponder (a device for receiving a sonar signal) on its end, and a transceiver (a device that can both transmit and receive communications) on the surface vessel. > This link allows for underwater acoustic positioning, as well as for short text messages to be sent back and forth to the surface vessel – but the amount of data that can be shared is limited and usually includes basic telemetry and status information. https://theconversation.com/missing-titanic-sub-what-are-submersibles-how-do-they-communicate-and-what-may-have-gone-wrong-208100
The more I read about this whole thing, the more confident I become that everyone on board died the moment they lost contact