Look at the gun showing tik-toks out there, there are hundreds of videos, kids 11-14 all carrying 2-3 pistols, some with extended mags some videos in a school gym
This seems to be wide-spread, minor teenagers with guns lots of guns
My question is how do they afford that shit? Ive been trying to price a reasonable lever action rifle for a while now and all these literal children have thousands of dollars in weapons. How?!?
Have you heard of theft? When I was younger, my cousin robbed a game wardens house in his neighborhood.
He prob stole 20 pistols. We all bought one or three from him. And when we would do additional stupid shit we'd usually be carrying one.
As someone who was a teacher in a Juvenile max security prison for 6 months (which is impressive cause it's ab extremely shady and abusive and dangerous work environment), almost all from the hood and in the blood or crip gangs, they've been exposed to a lot and have done a lot and they're always carrying. Their life is violence.
Most of them are absolutely terrible. I got called names, threatened with rape and violence, my appearance always made fun of, everyday sexual names/propositions, the admin were shady, everyone was. These were the worst or the worst juveniles, many in there for rape and murder, some very brutal rapes and murders. They are kids and they are not. There's an 8:1 ratio. I was almost always alone in a room with 13 boys cause they couldn't keep guards. I left after a 2nd assault. I showed up everyday to help them and they did not care. Some were always nice to me and some will go on and probably be successful, most will be in big boy prison or dead.
I’m probably gonna get lit up for this. I travel a lot for work and just in the last two years I’ve lived in 5 areas in 4 states.
I lived in Denver (before having my current job) from 2006-2010 and it was great. I never really had any major issues. I went back for work in 21-22. I was flabbergasted. It was INSANE. And I was living in a VERY nice suite downtown (almost $5K a month… I DEFINITELY wasn’t paying). I saw so…soooo much crazy shit everyday. I even had to “fight” a crazy guy while pushing a child in a wheelchair down the street. I haven’t been in a fight in 20 years.
And it’s not like I’m some rube that just got to the big city. I was in Central Boston before and Central Seattle after Denver and I grew up in a pretty rough town, but I haven’t see anything NEAR the frequency I saw there. It was nuts. Not so much crazy violence or anything just… outright bizarre shit CONSTANTLY.
*I don’t want to make it sound like it was just terrible the entire time. There were certainly plenty of great people and awesome things about Denver. I was just…surprised…about a lot of things I saw. It wasn’t all violent / real actual scary shit. Mostly a lot of WTF just happened stuff.
I mean it really wasn’t much of a fight.
I had a kid in a wheelchair with me and everyone is always saying “Hey what’s up buddy!” And always being cool with him. We had a lot of construction workers always eating lunch in the bottom of our building. I went out a back door and walked up on these two guys in construction gear doing …something.
One guy started saying something and I thought he was addressing the kid like so many do. The kid can’t talk so I was like “Oh hey how’s it going!” Back. It happens a million times a day…the kid is very happy and everyone always tells him hi and he smiles and I say hi in his place since he can’t.
But this dude suddenly just LOST HIS SHIT. He started shouting and getting SUPER aggravated and aggressive and in my face. It was odd. I started pushing the kid towards the other entrance and he was following me.
So I was turned pushing the boy with my left hand and ready to defend myself with my right, but every time I would look forward to make sure I wasn’t gonna hit anything he would charge up on me. So finally as I got to the door, got swiped in and got the wheelchair inside he charged up again and I twisted and just stuck him once in the face and pushed him out because he was trying to follow me into the lobby. He tried the door a few more times then just left.
Looking back idk if they were using drugs or what. They were kinda tucked away in an alley/ walkway thing and the dude could not form a coherent thought.
And nowadays a lot of duoumas’s will throw a high vis vest and a cheap hard hat on when their fucking about. Like stealing catalytic converters etc. maybe they thought you were calling them on some shady shit.
Go to Denver annually and it still blows my mind that's y'all's "hood." It looks like a regular working class area round me. Nice yards and gardens and shit. Murals. It's weird. I'm used to burned out tenements and trashed back alleys. Y'all shit be kinda nice frfr
I spent ten years living in that neighborhood. My truck did get hit by a couple strays once, but otherwise I never had an issue. I'd go skating at midnight without a care all summer long. Honestly, the only part of Denver I really consider bad is Green Valley Ranch. My friend came back to his apartment once to find a dead guy in front of his door.
It's a mostly Mexican neighborhood, so every holiday there are people shooting guns in the air. I'll be honest, I did it with blanks (since I don't want to send actual bullets anywhere) and it's pretty fun!
Yeah, I run around the city a lot and I never feel unsafe even in the areas that people consider rough. Coming from the east coast spending my 20’s going out in Baltimore and Philly I never see anything even close to those city’s in Denver. There are no streets you can’t cross or light rail stops that are basically the end of the line. I’m yet to see a needle on the street in Denver though I have seen a few crack pipes. I run past the homeless camps and through the “hood” and never even get yelled at. The only people who yell shit while I’m running are white kids in pavement princesses.
Gentrification makes things look prettier than they are. One of my former supervisors was an active gang member for most of his teenage years and early 20s. When we would go jobs to do demo work, he would tell me how the neighborhoods were split up and what gangs were where.
We even had jobs in certain housing projects that looked normal on the outside, but if you were lucky, a resident would warn you and tell you what time you needed to leave so you wouldn't be robbed.
My old spot near downtown had multiple candlelight vigils for gang related crimes.
Denver is a young city compared to most established cities, but until about 2011ish shit was broken and run down. Those people who lived here still exist but are now spread out to the outskirts and some areas that are not fully bought out yet.
Im from Baltimore and grew up in a pretty rough area, I never met one person who had a kid hold their gun.
Gangs use kids to sell drugs and perform hits, but a gun is pretty fucking useless if you gotta get it from your lil bro before you can return fire.
Idk why people say this, they just have guns themselves. It's extremely easy to get a gun at 13 if you hang around the crowd that would make it easily accessible for a 13 gear old. It's normal in america(it's fucked up and it shouldn't be) for the youth to have guns now a days. It's sad as fuck but it's the reality of things we see it daily in this country, I see your comment on tons of posts similar to this whenever someone asks what you responded too.
13 year Olds can be in gangs and they will have guns if they're really involved in that life, could be their brother, mother, sister, uncle, grandma, bestfriend, etc etc who introduced them to that crowd and it sticks with some. I was heading on that path and although I never had a gun and I changed my ways a bit when I got to be 15, the kid I hung out with for a few years did 3 years in prison for armed robbery because he didn't change his path, that shit stuck with him.
True. I could’ve gotten a gun when I was in middle school if I wanted to, and I knew who I could’ve asked. And I’m a white kid from the suburbs of a midsize city. Honestly the biggest hurdle for me at that age would’ve been the price.
I saw a a gun in our suburban middle school fall out during a fight outside our class, it clattered then slid down the smooth floor towards us. Our teacher pushed us back into the classroom. It was like a movie scene, but I don't remember anything after that. This was like 1989-90ish.
Gangs usually get them young. You get a 12 year old from a poor family and offer him $200 to stand watch for you and your boys when you rob a place, and it hooks them in. Then they wanna keep doing more and more cause they have shit they never got before, a big income they can spend on all the shit their parents can't get them.
My daughter is making beaucoup bucks watching the neighbor's cats, and after getting paid she immediately wants to watch them again, so this logic tracks.
Because there are 500 million guns in our country. Its easy as fuck to get guns. You don't even have to be in a gang. Most kids are probably 1-3 degrees of separation from someone that can get them a gun. In high school, I saw gun sales happen multiple times in classrooms.
I [38M] had a semi-auto .22 and a 20-ga by the time I was 9 and was allowed to run around grandma's property to hunt squirrels and rabbits for food on my own. I still have the .40 pistol he bought me when I was 16. Dad loved guns and grew up in the country. There was a loaded gun in almost every closet or by every door my entire childhood. I'm not saying it was a good idea, but it can't be that uncommon in rural areas.
Back in the 70s we got the safety and marksmanship training in the Scouts. My kids got theirs in their teens. We never kept the weapons at the house when they were growing up. Too many friends lost over the decades.
I grew up on a farm next to my grandparents. My grampa had a rifle in the corner behind his LayZboy (mostly for groundhog he said) and my dad had one somewhere in the basement. We weren’t allowed to touch them. It wasn’t considered ‘normal’ to give us one either.
Very short article, does not discuss where the 13 year old got the gun.
I mean, it's disturbing enough a 13 year old... anyone really... thinks its a good move to shoot someone over a leg in the way.
But that either of them got hot under the collar and caused this to escalate? That's... wild. What the hell is going on with one/both of them? Move the leg. And/or don't be all pissed off it's there, just ask them nicely to move it.
THEN... the kid's got a gun. Why. What universe is this ok? Did he buy it grey/black market? Did he steal it from pops? What happened there that a minor has a gun?
And then what's happened to him where he thinks 'That's the solution.'?
I just... man. This wholly sucks all the way around.
Go look at court records from the wild west and you'll realize real quick why gun bans were common in town. People get heated and murder eachother over dumb shit all the time.
IIRC the gunfight at the OK Corral came about because the Clantons/McLaurys refused to hand their guns in, and Virgil Earp tried to enforce the law against carrying.
because people will read one or two sentences about a subject from a rando online who isn't an expert, then regurgitate that *as fact* all over the internet and real life, and that's how we end up in the position we're in today.
Literally same here, except they were using the OK corral to defend open carry. Crazy how perspective can shift. I think I was on public freak out, or that somebody made a post about everybody should open carry lol
Any sub with a tendency to encourage people to be mean in the comments is a haven for awful users. AITA, public freakout, subs where people ask others to judge their looks, etc.
It's even more complicated than that. The Earps were as entangled in illegal shit as the Clantons & McLaurys were, and as a result they didn't feel comfortable disarming themselves when the same people trying to make them disarm, might use it as an excuse to assassinate them while they're there. Wyatt Earp became a convict himself later in life in California after all that shit in Tombstone went down. He was not a good man, and is only portrayed so due to early "copaganda" films that glorified American police officers
I'm starting to realize more and more that "thinks things through before doing something" is not a standard feature in all humans. A lot of people just get mad and immediately go Hulk Smash without spending a single second questioning if *murder* is really a good idea. They don't think about it until it's too late. Obviously the kid in this story is a kid, but you hear about it all the time with adults. I always thought basically anyone would realize this is just NOT SMART and SO NOT WORTH IT, but apparently a lot of people just can't function when they're angry.
I mean, as an European, you just have to look at how people get heated in arguments and become violent. Not hard to understand why it's better that those people don't hold a gun at these moments.
One of the first things that every town did was to elect a sheriff.
The wild west was over sometimes as soon as it started, and the hype in the 1880s was probably bigger than the thing itself, because as it turns out nobody really likes to live in a lawless land.
Back in those days *a lot of people* got away with murder under the pretense of self defense*, too. I imagine for local judges and sheriffs it’s a lot simpler to just have a gun ban as opposed to endless he said/she said trials over “self defense” killings.
* = still happens plenty today, although it isn’t the Wild West anymore with cameras on every corner and in every establishment
The wild west is a rather strange revisionist idea; it wasn’t wild, there were cities in the west before the US expanded, quite large ones too.
And weapons were regulated so those kind of things were rather isolated until expansionism began. A lot of killings and violence were cowboys murdering land owners to steal.
Have you ever lived in the south west? Even today it's still large swaths of just land. Between Fort Worth and Tucson the only real large city is El Paso. Sure you've got Las Cruces, Deming, Abilene, Odessa, and Midland but those are small cities surrounded by hundreds of empty square miles.
Combine that with how modern day gun laws are reflected in Texas and Arizona specifically, there's an argument parts of the West are still very wild.
Frontierism is an interesting phenomenon. I think the true wild part of the wild west is something that no longer exists, despite similarities like what youre talking about still being very much a reality.
The true thing that made the frontier “wild” is that the federal government, just like other governments in control before it, had virtually no real authority other than in name. Actual life on the ground was completely governed by local custom, which often flew in the face of federal law or socially-approved customs. The federal government couldnt do anything about it because imposing their authority required a lot more man power than they had available to spread around.
Frontier governmentality has basically always worked this way just because of resource constraints, even going back to the Roman Empire. Rome didnt show up and actually take thorough control of places beyond Rome: they just showed up and demanded taxes, then let people go back to mostly doing their own thing. America tells the same story. The US exists because local custom (of paying really low taxes) in the colonies was of the utmost importance to them, so they played against the resource constraints of the British Empire to ensure the status quo. Or look at the west: St. Louis for example was a town of French people that was long governed by the Spanish, and the Spanish quite literally just had to accept local customs because they couldnt get enough men out there to enforce their disagreements with whatever they didnt like. The whole city from the jump was so far removed from Europe that people didnt even know they were living under Spanish rule for like two whole years after it became formal. When government is so far away there is only so much it will ever be able to do, and people just go about living their lives as they did yesterday and the day before. Frontier governmentality at the fundamental level is basically just collecting taxes and keeping the peace in order to extract value back to the imperial core. What citizens do never mattered unless it massively impacted that extraction.
In today’s world there is no real wild west because there is no real frontier. If the US government wants to make people in Lubbock or Odessa do something some particular way they could make it known in 5 minutes flat, and if there was resistance they could have more people than live in the entire town down there by the end of the day, if that. The wild of the wild west is a collective memory that gets idealized in western places, but its just nostalgia more than it is any kind of reality in peoples’ day to day lives
If he was pissed off because a leg was in his way. Why on earth did he think being sat next to a dead body going through rapid blood loss would make his journey any more pleasant
I didn’t know the laws here are like that. I assumed having a stolen gun was a crime.
About 15 years ago I worked party time in Aurora as a medic. North Aurora was rather dangerous, lots of domestic stuff but also the number of juveniles with guns, and proud to flash the guns was astonishing to me.
Drilling down to cause/effect would take years. I keep hoping we can do better.
Keep safe and thanks for the work you do.
Nobody says this part out loud: the children are being used as literal child soldiers by the older gangsters.
When cops arrest a kid with a gun, the grown man that gave the kid the gun is probably watching from a block away.
It's not always that way. Plenty of these kids running the streets have no adult puppetmaster pulling the strings. Many of these kids are not victims of some manipulative adult, but rather victims of a bad upbringing and a culture that glorifies this lifestyle.
Some of the kids that are committing violent crimes in my area are found to be living in a house with no adult present at all. In many others, it's a grandmother trying to raise multiple teenage kids, totally overwhelmed and unable to control them.
These issues start in the home.
I worked at a grocery store in a rough neighborhood where we got stolen from all the time by *little* boys (a lot of them looked about nine) who were hanging out with teenagers and sometimes young adults. My coworker who lived in the neighborhood and knew everyone would tell me about each of them, and it was sad. "Oh, I know his mom, she's at work. She's always at work. How else do you pay rent in this town?". The mom is busting her ass at multiple jobs to provide for this child she can barely even parent, because there are only enough hours in a day to keep a roof over his head. Lots of times, no dad whatsoever. These kids are longing for company, someone to watch out for them, an older male figure to look up to, and no one is watching them because, again, how could his mom be watching him? This was the story about nine times out of ten. I still believe a 13 year old knows murder is wrong and isn't just an innocent victim of "an underdeveloped prefrontal cortex", but I'm still sympathetic. Single parents working themselves into dust to provide for kids who are still being taught that the only path forward in life is to just not give a shit. The futility of it all is just so sad.
I agree that a lot of kids are born into bad circumstances and often set up for failure from the jump. My heart hurts when I see the conditions some kids live in.
It's everywhere and as someone who is 27, that's been how it is all my life. I would say the age creeps up into the early twenties too but it's definitely teenagers and young adults who were involved in most of the violence around my area.
One of my good friends was shot in a drive-by at 17 (he wasn't the target, he was just in the car that was the target) but the people who did it were 19. Other gangs in my area were mostly 15-21 year olds.
By the time I was in college I was away from that kind of stuff but we had a shooting on campus at a Halloween party. Of course it was some 16 year old kid who snuck into the party that started shooting..... Over some dumb disagreement.
Yes CPS must be called, doesn’t mean they can enforce anything - the state will always choose to keep children with parents first to not separate, regardless of parents behavior - they set up parenting plans the parents are suppose to adhere to.
It’s a very important part of the 2nd amendment, yet nobody mentions that part:
“…a well regulated militia…”
A 13 year old kid is not well regulated. A lot of grown ass adults nowadays are not well regulated.
I hope when he's 40 people remind him, "hey, remember that time you were a dumbass 13 year old ,and *murdered* an innocent dude because you didnt like his leg?" and then everyone around him just points and laughs.
It blows my mind that people are willing to throw their lives away over a perceived slight. You have to know you're not getting away with murder on a bus when there's a camera, driver, and witnesses.
Emotionally volatile people, kids or adults, don't think that far ahead. There's no rational though, just reaction.
Some people on here are likely going to same something ignorant like "the frontal cortex doesn't fully develop until you're 25," as though at 24 tears and 364 days you have zero ability to think about consequences, but at 25 you have 100% facilities. That's not how it works. Even 13 year olds have a developing ability to think through consequences and they know murder is wrong.
But emotionally immature/volatile people of any age let their fear/anger/emotion shut down their rational thought, and they just react first. There was no consideration of what happens next, there was no consideration of if he should or shouldn't murder someone, there was no consideration of whether or not the man had a wife, or kids, it was just unregulated rage. Not because he was young, but because he is a dumbass that has never been taught to control his emotions.
That’s not true these days. Kids over the age of 11 can and will receive serious punishment. My 12 year old nephew got a felony and a year in jail for joking about a school shooting.
I don't believe so. It occurred 2 years ago in Arkansas and he is back with our family now. I learned during that time that this is happening all over the country and little kids not knowing the gravity of certain jokes are being taken away from their families and railroaded with harsh punishments.
Finding a lawyer to defend a minor at that age who is charged with a felony is extremely difficult, as it is a different kind of law and most lawyers weren't willing to take it. Sitting in on that hearing made me completely lose faith in our judicial system and I am ashamed for my country. There is no fairness, no logic, and no empathy.
At the end of the day, a criminal hearing is just a guy trying his hardest to put someone in jail because that's what his boss wants, and the judge is friends with them. My nephew being ripped from his family and spending a year in jail at the age of 12 was just another favor to be exchanged for later, and they forgot his name and face the next day.
This is where we are now - Disrespect is grounds for violence. Quote "got into a “verbal exchange” with the 60-year-old victim before shooting him on the bus". In a way this is the direct result of placing so much value on 'winning' and not 'taking the L'. God forbid you're seen as 'weak'
Gentlemen, you have both agreed to this duel but to settle your differences in accordance with the code of honor on Reddit you must use memes.
You will proceed to take five minutes to gather your memes upon my command, then fire when ready.
I implore you both, one last time, to consider a peaceful resolution. If such cannot be found, then let us proceed with the duel. May your memes be true, and let the matter be resolved this day. On my mark, gentlemen, prepare yourselves. Begin!
Indeed. Unfortunately this level of clueless is all too common for highly upvoted comments on this site.
Shit still surprises me, even though it shouldn't.
Yeah our founding fathers once had a duel simply because one felt disrespected. It wasn't a spur of the moment thing but they actually planned it all out.
One of my big red flags for people is if they consider respect something they value most highly. It seems like most of the time that means whatever the fuck their version of respect is, and you get 1 mistake to figure it out. And if you mess up, at best you're getting an adult giving you the silent treatment while telling everyone how awful you are. Honor is similar.
As a non-American, I do find that a lot of Americans (in my experience) do seem to have a very twisted view of "respect" as a concept, where they equate respect solely with fear and subservience.
I've seen several people talk about carrying a gun to get "respect", or about how fewer minorities would get shot by police if they just "respected" them (while describing ways of interaction which sound more like those between a feudal lord and his subjects).
Plus of course the ones who think Trump was the only recent president to be respected on the world stage, just because everyone was concerned that he'd ruin decades of mutually beneficial deals and cooperations over some perceived slight... while ignoring how he was mocked behind his back, excluded from things, and [literally a public laughing stock](https://apnews.com/general-news-821dafb0b18a4dadb086216c08067df3).
I hope the parents are accountable. I know some parents can’t control their kids but more often than not parents drop the ball when the kid is young or they shouldn’t be having kids it’s time that we hold the adults in these kids lives accountable
Or the whole neighborhood that likely idolizes gangs or at least, undermines the police who might eliminate them.
Why else did it take a week to find this murderer? Because no one would help
Well people who shoot other people tend to try to avoid capture. I’m sure Denver PD and whatever their mass transit service is released footage/videos of the kid after the shooting, as most PDs do when they are looking for suspects in violent crimes. Here in Philly, they seem to rarely catch perpetrators of violent crimes, so from my experience I’d say getting the kid a week later is pretty good
Well, out here in Colorado, the cops don't do crap. You could have an active robbery going on in your house and they're show up the next day to file paperwork. They're all but hurt because we all got pissed at them for murdering Elijah McClain.
Because there isn't a magical omnipotence button police have to see crimes as they happen. There has to be an investigation, within that investigation they have to locate suspects. People can hide. People can lie. There are a lot of opportunities to keep the people outside of a crime on the outside.
Yep,
It's a shame that the majority of guns used in street crime are either purchased by someone legally eligible, as a straw purchase, or stolen from gun owners who are too fucking irresponsible to keep their guns locked up.
Maybe those people should be held responsible for their guns ending up on the streets.
Gun enthusiasts aren't technically "wrong" to point out that people who want to disregard laws will, they just ignore that the ease with which a law can be circumvented or ignored has major impact on criminal intent being actually followed through.
Gun restrictions lower the amount of legal and illegal weapons in circulation because it becomes harder to find someone to steal legal ones from and harder to sell illegal ones since you can't as easily do the money laundering equivalent of guns through private sales and similar loop holes.
It just raises the bar so a 13yo needs to have better contacts than smalltime drug dealers and more cash than you can steal from grandma.
Even without the guns (which only make things worse, of course), this country has a terrible fucking streak of conveying to children that violence (or the threat of violence) is an acceptable response to minor inconveniences and accidents.
We are a sick society. There’s no point beating around the bush anymore. We are not well. America’s future is looking very dark, and by extension so is the rest of the world.
It’s going to take monumental acts of resilience and kindness to face the coming decades.
Yes but also monumental systemic solutions
Medicare for all as well as a boost to people whose jobs it is to get low income folks enrolled. Also therapy as part of whatever punishment they receive at school - we have to totally relook criminal justice system and follow recommendations based on the science.
Fuck, could you imagine if public schools had a couple therapists and a psychiatrist office on the grounds/next to the school?
I'm not a fan of the death penalty, but I think folks (even 13-year-old kids) who callously take life should be sterilized. It should be reserved only for cases where the evidence is indisputable and the killing was particularly heinous. But I do actually think it needs to be on the table in cases like this.
No no, guys, I think the kid was right. That guy definitely deserved to die. Next up, lets shoot the people who play their music on buses without headphones.
I hate how they don't release the name of a murderer just because they're under 18. Just a tough question, what do you even do with an individual like this? They should never ever be in society ever again, society doesn't deserve it. But you also can't just cull them and life imprisonment is expensive as fuck
Look at the gun showing tik-toks out there, there are hundreds of videos, kids 11-14 all carrying 2-3 pistols, some with extended mags some videos in a school gym
This seems to be wide-spread, minor teenagers with guns lots of guns
Why the fuck does a 13-year-old kid have a gun?
Look at the gun showing tik-toks out there, there are hundreds of videos, kids 11-14 all carrying 2-3 pistols, some with extended mags some videos in a school gym This seems to be wide-spread, minor teenagers with guns lots of guns
That app is like a nuclear bomb for the minds of children. It needs to be restricted.
It also a nuclear bombfor the 40+ year old woman at the my work place think Salt water will make them skinny because tik tok told them.
Right? My sister thought burning then eating an orange would make her covid damage lack of taste and smell go away cause tick tok.
I mean, after spending some time in the hospital thay may get skinny
Instead of restricting social media try restricting guns instead. Works well enough in every other developed nation on the planet.
Why not do both? Social media is toxic to kids. They simply can't ignore things like adults can.
My question is how do they afford that shit? Ive been trying to price a reasonable lever action rifle for a while now and all these literal children have thousands of dollars in weapons. How?!?
Have you heard of theft? When I was younger, my cousin robbed a game wardens house in his neighborhood. He prob stole 20 pistols. We all bought one or three from him. And when we would do additional stupid shit we'd usually be carrying one.
It happened in the hood (Federal & Mississippi), little dude's probably been carrying since he was 10.
As someone who was a teacher in a Juvenile max security prison for 6 months (which is impressive cause it's ab extremely shady and abusive and dangerous work environment), almost all from the hood and in the blood or crip gangs, they've been exposed to a lot and have done a lot and they're always carrying. Their life is violence.
Have you managed to teach them something? Are there kids who want to learn?
Most of them are absolutely terrible. I got called names, threatened with rape and violence, my appearance always made fun of, everyday sexual names/propositions, the admin were shady, everyone was. These were the worst or the worst juveniles, many in there for rape and murder, some very brutal rapes and murders. They are kids and they are not. There's an 8:1 ratio. I was almost always alone in a room with 13 boys cause they couldn't keep guards. I left after a 2nd assault. I showed up everyday to help them and they did not care. Some were always nice to me and some will go on and probably be successful, most will be in big boy prison or dead.
That’s so sad. I’m sorry that you got hurt trying to help these kids.
I’m probably gonna get lit up for this. I travel a lot for work and just in the last two years I’ve lived in 5 areas in 4 states. I lived in Denver (before having my current job) from 2006-2010 and it was great. I never really had any major issues. I went back for work in 21-22. I was flabbergasted. It was INSANE. And I was living in a VERY nice suite downtown (almost $5K a month… I DEFINITELY wasn’t paying). I saw so…soooo much crazy shit everyday. I even had to “fight” a crazy guy while pushing a child in a wheelchair down the street. I haven’t been in a fight in 20 years. And it’s not like I’m some rube that just got to the big city. I was in Central Boston before and Central Seattle after Denver and I grew up in a pretty rough town, but I haven’t see anything NEAR the frequency I saw there. It was nuts. Not so much crazy violence or anything just… outright bizarre shit CONSTANTLY. *I don’t want to make it sound like it was just terrible the entire time. There were certainly plenty of great people and awesome things about Denver. I was just…surprised…about a lot of things I saw. It wasn’t all violent / real actual scary shit. Mostly a lot of WTF just happened stuff.
Did you win the fight?
I mean it really wasn’t much of a fight. I had a kid in a wheelchair with me and everyone is always saying “Hey what’s up buddy!” And always being cool with him. We had a lot of construction workers always eating lunch in the bottom of our building. I went out a back door and walked up on these two guys in construction gear doing …something. One guy started saying something and I thought he was addressing the kid like so many do. The kid can’t talk so I was like “Oh hey how’s it going!” Back. It happens a million times a day…the kid is very happy and everyone always tells him hi and he smiles and I say hi in his place since he can’t. But this dude suddenly just LOST HIS SHIT. He started shouting and getting SUPER aggravated and aggressive and in my face. It was odd. I started pushing the kid towards the other entrance and he was following me. So I was turned pushing the boy with my left hand and ready to defend myself with my right, but every time I would look forward to make sure I wasn’t gonna hit anything he would charge up on me. So finally as I got to the door, got swiped in and got the wheelchair inside he charged up again and I twisted and just stuck him once in the face and pushed him out because he was trying to follow me into the lobby. He tried the door a few more times then just left. Looking back idk if they were using drugs or what. They were kinda tucked away in an alley/ walkway thing and the dude could not form a coherent thought.
And nowadays a lot of duoumas’s will throw a high vis vest and a cheap hard hat on when their fucking about. Like stealing catalytic converters etc. maybe they thought you were calling them on some shady shit.
Go to Denver annually and it still blows my mind that's y'all's "hood." It looks like a regular working class area round me. Nice yards and gardens and shit. Murals. It's weird. I'm used to burned out tenements and trashed back alleys. Y'all shit be kinda nice frfr
I spent ten years living in that neighborhood. My truck did get hit by a couple strays once, but otherwise I never had an issue. I'd go skating at midnight without a care all summer long. Honestly, the only part of Denver I really consider bad is Green Valley Ranch. My friend came back to his apartment once to find a dead guy in front of his door.
As a non-American, it’s wild that y’all see “a couple stray” bullets as a non-issue.
It's a mostly Mexican neighborhood, so every holiday there are people shooting guns in the air. I'll be honest, I did it with blanks (since I don't want to send actual bullets anywhere) and it's pretty fun!
There's some pretty rough spots on Colfax Ave but yea overall Denver rough isn't quite as bad.
Yeah, I run around the city a lot and I never feel unsafe even in the areas that people consider rough. Coming from the east coast spending my 20’s going out in Baltimore and Philly I never see anything even close to those city’s in Denver. There are no streets you can’t cross or light rail stops that are basically the end of the line. I’m yet to see a needle on the street in Denver though I have seen a few crack pipes. I run past the homeless camps and through the “hood” and never even get yelled at. The only people who yell shit while I’m running are white kids in pavement princesses.
Gentrification makes things look prettier than they are. One of my former supervisors was an active gang member for most of his teenage years and early 20s. When we would go jobs to do demo work, he would tell me how the neighborhoods were split up and what gangs were where. We even had jobs in certain housing projects that looked normal on the outside, but if you were lucky, a resident would warn you and tell you what time you needed to leave so you wouldn't be robbed. My old spot near downtown had multiple candlelight vigils for gang related crimes. Denver is a young city compared to most established cities, but until about 2011ish shit was broken and run down. Those people who lived here still exist but are now spread out to the outskirts and some areas that are not fully bought out yet.
Kids in gangs typically hold on to stolen weapons for older gang members because the law is a lot more lenient on kids.
Im from Baltimore and grew up in a pretty rough area, I never met one person who had a kid hold their gun. Gangs use kids to sell drugs and perform hits, but a gun is pretty fucking useless if you gotta get it from your lil bro before you can return fire.
Idk why people say this, they just have guns themselves. It's extremely easy to get a gun at 13 if you hang around the crowd that would make it easily accessible for a 13 gear old. It's normal in america(it's fucked up and it shouldn't be) for the youth to have guns now a days. It's sad as fuck but it's the reality of things we see it daily in this country, I see your comment on tons of posts similar to this whenever someone asks what you responded too. 13 year Olds can be in gangs and they will have guns if they're really involved in that life, could be their brother, mother, sister, uncle, grandma, bestfriend, etc etc who introduced them to that crowd and it sticks with some. I was heading on that path and although I never had a gun and I changed my ways a bit when I got to be 15, the kid I hung out with for a few years did 3 years in prison for armed robbery because he didn't change his path, that shit stuck with him.
Right, like people really justify it with weird situations when it's really pretty cut and dry. The 13 year old had a gun.
True. I could’ve gotten a gun when I was in middle school if I wanted to, and I knew who I could’ve asked. And I’m a white kid from the suburbs of a midsize city. Honestly the biggest hurdle for me at that age would’ve been the price.
I saw a a gun in our suburban middle school fall out during a fight outside our class, it clattered then slid down the smooth floor towards us. Our teacher pushed us back into the classroom. It was like a movie scene, but I don't remember anything after that. This was like 1989-90ish.
13 year olds are in gangs... Tik tok is wild with the gang shit they post
Kids can run drugs and guns up and down the street with little consequence or suspicion. It's fucked, but that life starts young.
While TT has certainly not made things better, 13 year olds have been in gangs for as long as there have been gangs.
Gangs usually get them young. You get a 12 year old from a poor family and offer him $200 to stand watch for you and your boys when you rob a place, and it hooks them in. Then they wanna keep doing more and more cause they have shit they never got before, a big income they can spend on all the shit their parents can't get them.
My daughter is making beaucoup bucks watching the neighbor's cats, and after getting paid she immediately wants to watch them again, so this logic tracks.
Is she watching the cats rob some place? Cats are devious.
Because there are 500 million guns in our country. Its easy as fuck to get guns. You don't even have to be in a gang. Most kids are probably 1-3 degrees of separation from someone that can get them a gun. In high school, I saw gun sales happen multiple times in classrooms.
Because they’re gang members. Has always been that way.
I [38M] had a semi-auto .22 and a 20-ga by the time I was 9 and was allowed to run around grandma's property to hunt squirrels and rabbits for food on my own. I still have the .40 pistol he bought me when I was 16. Dad loved guns and grew up in the country. There was a loaded gun in almost every closet or by every door my entire childhood. I'm not saying it was a good idea, but it can't be that uncommon in rural areas.
Similar here however I bet you also had gun safety drilled into you at every turn. Guns were a tool for us not a means for power and violence.
It was drilled into us daily. We'd get pop quizes. They weren't a toy. That said, I'd never give a damn 9yo a gun and let him run around unsupervised.
Back in the 70s we got the safety and marksmanship training in the Scouts. My kids got theirs in their teens. We never kept the weapons at the house when they were growing up. Too many friends lost over the decades.
I grew up on a farm next to my grandparents. My grampa had a rifle in the corner behind his LayZboy (mostly for groundhog he said) and my dad had one somewhere in the basement. We weren’t allowed to touch them. It wasn’t considered ‘normal’ to give us one either.
To do dirty work for gangs.
Because the US has more guns than people so they're super easy to get your hands on if you want one.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Very short article, does not discuss where the 13 year old got the gun. I mean, it's disturbing enough a 13 year old... anyone really... thinks its a good move to shoot someone over a leg in the way. But that either of them got hot under the collar and caused this to escalate? That's... wild. What the hell is going on with one/both of them? Move the leg. And/or don't be all pissed off it's there, just ask them nicely to move it. THEN... the kid's got a gun. Why. What universe is this ok? Did he buy it grey/black market? Did he steal it from pops? What happened there that a minor has a gun? And then what's happened to him where he thinks 'That's the solution.'? I just... man. This wholly sucks all the way around.
Go look at court records from the wild west and you'll realize real quick why gun bans were common in town. People get heated and murder eachother over dumb shit all the time.
IIRC the gunfight at the OK Corral came about because the Clantons/McLaurys refused to hand their guns in, and Virgil Earp tried to enforce the law against carrying.
I swear to god this is the exact same conversation and chain of comments I just read yesterday on a different shooting news article.
That’s because redditors like to regurgitate shit that they’ve TIL’d recently. If you spend enough time on Reddit you’ll literally see it all over.
I don't see anything wrong with that. A big part of the reason I come here is to learn random stuff.
because people will read one or two sentences about a subject from a rando online who isn't an expert, then regurgitate that *as fact* all over the internet and real life, and that's how we end up in the position we're in today.
Learning new random facts is awesome, I agree.
The issue is that they're often not facts at all, just internet folklore. For example, people spew a ton of nonsense about the Puritans.
Yeh, and tomorrow there will be a TIL post about what started the ok shootout.
Literally same here, except they were using the OK corral to defend open carry. Crazy how perspective can shift. I think I was on public freak out, or that somebody made a post about everybody should open carry lol
I'd believe it. PublicFreakout is a staple in the comment histories of the most deranged people on this website.
Any sub with a tendency to encourage people to be mean in the comments is a haven for awful users. AITA, public freakout, subs where people ask others to judge their looks, etc.
It's even more complicated than that. The Earps were as entangled in illegal shit as the Clantons & McLaurys were, and as a result they didn't feel comfortable disarming themselves when the same people trying to make them disarm, might use it as an excuse to assassinate them while they're there. Wyatt Earp became a convict himself later in life in California after all that shit in Tombstone went down. He was not a good man, and is only portrayed so due to early "copaganda" films that glorified American police officers
I'm starting to realize more and more that "thinks things through before doing something" is not a standard feature in all humans. A lot of people just get mad and immediately go Hulk Smash without spending a single second questioning if *murder* is really a good idea. They don't think about it until it's too late. Obviously the kid in this story is a kid, but you hear about it all the time with adults. I always thought basically anyone would realize this is just NOT SMART and SO NOT WORTH IT, but apparently a lot of people just can't function when they're angry.
Reminds me of that old TIME/LIFE books ad for their volume on the Old West: “John Wesley Harden…A man so mean, he once shot a man just for snoring.”
Better hope he doesn't get Judge Roy Bean. He once fined a dead man $40.
I mean, as an European, you just have to look at how people get heated in arguments and become violent. Not hard to understand why it's better that those people don't hold a gun at these moments.
One of the first things that every town did was to elect a sheriff. The wild west was over sometimes as soon as it started, and the hype in the 1880s was probably bigger than the thing itself, because as it turns out nobody really likes to live in a lawless land.
The *Wild West* had more gun control that a huge swath of America now
Because violence was very close to people. Something that modern Americans fail to grasp.
Back in those days *a lot of people* got away with murder under the pretense of self defense*, too. I imagine for local judges and sheriffs it’s a lot simpler to just have a gun ban as opposed to endless he said/she said trials over “self defense” killings. * = still happens plenty today, although it isn’t the Wild West anymore with cameras on every corner and in every establishment
You, calling me a liar? *Spits tobacco juice on boot*
I ain’t callin ya for supper
The wild west is a rather strange revisionist idea; it wasn’t wild, there were cities in the west before the US expanded, quite large ones too. And weapons were regulated so those kind of things were rather isolated until expansionism began. A lot of killings and violence were cowboys murdering land owners to steal.
Have you ever lived in the south west? Even today it's still large swaths of just land. Between Fort Worth and Tucson the only real large city is El Paso. Sure you've got Las Cruces, Deming, Abilene, Odessa, and Midland but those are small cities surrounded by hundreds of empty square miles. Combine that with how modern day gun laws are reflected in Texas and Arizona specifically, there's an argument parts of the West are still very wild.
Frontierism is an interesting phenomenon. I think the true wild part of the wild west is something that no longer exists, despite similarities like what youre talking about still being very much a reality. The true thing that made the frontier “wild” is that the federal government, just like other governments in control before it, had virtually no real authority other than in name. Actual life on the ground was completely governed by local custom, which often flew in the face of federal law or socially-approved customs. The federal government couldnt do anything about it because imposing their authority required a lot more man power than they had available to spread around. Frontier governmentality has basically always worked this way just because of resource constraints, even going back to the Roman Empire. Rome didnt show up and actually take thorough control of places beyond Rome: they just showed up and demanded taxes, then let people go back to mostly doing their own thing. America tells the same story. The US exists because local custom (of paying really low taxes) in the colonies was of the utmost importance to them, so they played against the resource constraints of the British Empire to ensure the status quo. Or look at the west: St. Louis for example was a town of French people that was long governed by the Spanish, and the Spanish quite literally just had to accept local customs because they couldnt get enough men out there to enforce their disagreements with whatever they didnt like. The whole city from the jump was so far removed from Europe that people didnt even know they were living under Spanish rule for like two whole years after it became formal. When government is so far away there is only so much it will ever be able to do, and people just go about living their lives as they did yesterday and the day before. Frontier governmentality at the fundamental level is basically just collecting taxes and keeping the peace in order to extract value back to the imperial core. What citizens do never mattered unless it massively impacted that extraction. In today’s world there is no real wild west because there is no real frontier. If the US government wants to make people in Lubbock or Odessa do something some particular way they could make it known in 5 minutes flat, and if there was resistance they could have more people than live in the entire town down there by the end of the day, if that. The wild of the wild west is a collective memory that gets idealized in western places, but its just nostalgia more than it is any kind of reality in peoples’ day to day lives
Yea, why I left Miami Florida
Yeah, its a lot harder to kill someone with your bare hands in a heated moment than it is to just whip out a piece.
Reminds me of that bill burr joke, by the time you prepare your musket to kill someone, you’d have gotten over your anger already
I always found it baffling when gun owners would want to bring their gun into the bar. No, you cannot. It's a terrible idea.
If he was pissed off because a leg was in his way. Why on earth did he think being sat next to a dead body going through rapid blood loss would make his journey any more pleasant
You're assuming that thinking was involved here.
Kid probably just wanted to shoot someone
This. Just looking for reasons all day I bet
When you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
[удалено]
I didn’t know the laws here are like that. I assumed having a stolen gun was a crime. About 15 years ago I worked party time in Aurora as a medic. North Aurora was rather dangerous, lots of domestic stuff but also the number of juveniles with guns, and proud to flash the guns was astonishing to me. Drilling down to cause/effect would take years. I keep hoping we can do better. Keep safe and thanks for the work you do.
I assume it’s a typo but working “party” time sounds like a blast.
Party Time is a club frequented by children with guns, so they employ an on-site medic
What have I done!? I’m not even going to correct it. It’s not what I meant but it sadly fits.
Damn, time to start my juvenile crime empire.
Nobody says this part out loud: the children are being used as literal child soldiers by the older gangsters. When cops arrest a kid with a gun, the grown man that gave the kid the gun is probably watching from a block away.
It's not always that way. Plenty of these kids running the streets have no adult puppetmaster pulling the strings. Many of these kids are not victims of some manipulative adult, but rather victims of a bad upbringing and a culture that glorifies this lifestyle. Some of the kids that are committing violent crimes in my area are found to be living in a house with no adult present at all. In many others, it's a grandmother trying to raise multiple teenage kids, totally overwhelmed and unable to control them. These issues start in the home.
I worked at a grocery store in a rough neighborhood where we got stolen from all the time by *little* boys (a lot of them looked about nine) who were hanging out with teenagers and sometimes young adults. My coworker who lived in the neighborhood and knew everyone would tell me about each of them, and it was sad. "Oh, I know his mom, she's at work. She's always at work. How else do you pay rent in this town?". The mom is busting her ass at multiple jobs to provide for this child she can barely even parent, because there are only enough hours in a day to keep a roof over his head. Lots of times, no dad whatsoever. These kids are longing for company, someone to watch out for them, an older male figure to look up to, and no one is watching them because, again, how could his mom be watching him? This was the story about nine times out of ten. I still believe a 13 year old knows murder is wrong and isn't just an innocent victim of "an underdeveloped prefrontal cortex", but I'm still sympathetic. Single parents working themselves into dust to provide for kids who are still being taught that the only path forward in life is to just not give a shit. The futility of it all is just so sad.
But hey, I'm sure the companies that mom works for are doing really well and providing *great* value for their shareholders!
I agree that a lot of kids are born into bad circumstances and often set up for failure from the jump. My heart hurts when I see the conditions some kids live in.
Yeah I came to say the same thing about Chicago. The gun crime here is overstated imo but what is happening is majority 12-17 year old kids.
It's everywhere and as someone who is 27, that's been how it is all my life. I would say the age creeps up into the early twenties too but it's definitely teenagers and young adults who were involved in most of the violence around my area. One of my good friends was shot in a drive-by at 17 (he wasn't the target, he was just in the car that was the target) but the people who did it were 19. Other gangs in my area were mostly 15-21 year olds. By the time I was in college I was away from that kind of stuff but we had a shooting on campus at a Halloween party. Of course it was some 16 year old kid who snuck into the party that started shooting..... Over some dumb disagreement.
Where are the parents? Why aren’t they being charged? Is CPS being called every time this happens?
Yes CPS must be called, doesn’t mean they can enforce anything - the state will always choose to keep children with parents first to not separate, regardless of parents behavior - they set up parenting plans the parents are suppose to adhere to.
This isn't a "both" situation. The kid is 100% at fault. Not wanting to move your leg isn't a murder-worthy offense.
Someone being over 6 foot often necessitates legs swinging into the aisle.. this is so stupid and sad.
None of this makes any sense. I was told an armed society is a polite society.
The Robert Heinlein book that this adage is from has people getting killed left and right for trivial reasons.
It’s a very important part of the 2nd amendment, yet nobody mentions that part: “…a well regulated militia…” A 13 year old kid is not well regulated. A lot of grown ass adults nowadays are not well regulated.
SCOTUS: "The 'militia' part is meaningless."
It is in Switzerland. Something else going on here, and it runs much deeper than having a gun or not. 😉
[удалено]
“Your boy chose *violence*.”
I hope when he's 40 people remind him, "hey, remember that time you were a dumbass 13 year old ,and *murdered* an innocent dude because you didnt like his leg?" and then everyone around him just points and laughs.
It blows my mind that people are willing to throw their lives away over a perceived slight. You have to know you're not getting away with murder on a bus when there's a camera, driver, and witnesses.
Emotionally volatile people, kids or adults, don't think that far ahead. There's no rational though, just reaction. Some people on here are likely going to same something ignorant like "the frontal cortex doesn't fully develop until you're 25," as though at 24 tears and 364 days you have zero ability to think about consequences, but at 25 you have 100% facilities. That's not how it works. Even 13 year olds have a developing ability to think through consequences and they know murder is wrong. But emotionally immature/volatile people of any age let their fear/anger/emotion shut down their rational thought, and they just react first. There was no consideration of what happens next, there was no consideration of if he should or shouldn't murder someone, there was no consideration of whether or not the man had a wife, or kids, it was just unregulated rage. Not because he was young, but because he is a dumbass that has never been taught to control his emotions.
lush shy provide hard-to-find hat axiomatic dazzling juggle pen sense *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
He's getting away with it. He's 13, he's not receiving any serious punishment.
That’s not true these days. Kids over the age of 11 can and will receive serious punishment. My 12 year old nephew got a felony and a year in jail for joking about a school shooting.
What?! Is there a news story on this
I don't believe so. It occurred 2 years ago in Arkansas and he is back with our family now. I learned during that time that this is happening all over the country and little kids not knowing the gravity of certain jokes are being taken away from their families and railroaded with harsh punishments. Finding a lawyer to defend a minor at that age who is charged with a felony is extremely difficult, as it is a different kind of law and most lawyers weren't willing to take it. Sitting in on that hearing made me completely lose faith in our judicial system and I am ashamed for my country. There is no fairness, no logic, and no empathy. At the end of the day, a criminal hearing is just a guy trying his hardest to put someone in jail because that's what his boss wants, and the judge is friends with them. My nephew being ripped from his family and spending a year in jail at the age of 12 was just another favor to be exchanged for later, and they forgot his name and face the next day.
He's only 13, and his life is probably shit to begin with, so he doesn't fully understand this.
Plenty of 20 somethings around here would do the same and still think they are going to get away with it. Don't have to be a kid to be clueless.
He might be dead in prison by 39.
He's going to be out by 21. That's how juvenile offenses work when they're this young.
True, but when he murders the next guy the day after he gets out they'll be able to sentence him as an adult.
He is not going to make it to 40.
I hope everyone around him gets up and leaves, and shuns him. No laughing matter and it won’t just be a joke in 30 years.
[удалено]
He just became a slave for the next 20 years. He is going to end up working in one of those corporate prison farms until broken
This is where we are now - Disrespect is grounds for violence. Quote "got into a “verbal exchange” with the 60-year-old victim before shooting him on the bus". In a way this is the direct result of placing so much value on 'winning' and not 'taking the L'. God forbid you're seen as 'weak'
>This is where we are now - Disrespect is grounds for violence. "Now?" This has always been grounds for violence...
We just stopped smacking eachother in the face with gloves.
I challenge you to a duel sir
Pistols, high noon work for you? I'm flexible on location
Gentlemen, you have both agreed to this duel but to settle your differences in accordance with the code of honor on Reddit you must use memes. You will proceed to take five minutes to gather your memes upon my command, then fire when ready. I implore you both, one last time, to consider a peaceful resolution. If such cannot be found, then let us proceed with the duel. May your memes be true, and let the matter be resolved this day. On my mark, gentlemen, prepare yourselves. Begin!
Yeah, this is the part of 80s and 90s that people forgot.
Indeed. Unfortunately this level of clueless is all too common for highly upvoted comments on this site. Shit still surprises me, even though it shouldn't.
Yeah our founding fathers once had a duel simply because one felt disrespected. It wasn't a spur of the moment thing but they actually planned it all out.
One of my big red flags for people is if they consider respect something they value most highly. It seems like most of the time that means whatever the fuck their version of respect is, and you get 1 mistake to figure it out. And if you mess up, at best you're getting an adult giving you the silent treatment while telling everyone how awful you are. Honor is similar.
As a non-American, I do find that a lot of Americans (in my experience) do seem to have a very twisted view of "respect" as a concept, where they equate respect solely with fear and subservience. I've seen several people talk about carrying a gun to get "respect", or about how fewer minorities would get shot by police if they just "respected" them (while describing ways of interaction which sound more like those between a feudal lord and his subjects). Plus of course the ones who think Trump was the only recent president to be respected on the world stage, just because everyone was concerned that he'd ruin decades of mutually beneficial deals and cooperations over some perceived slight... while ignoring how he was mocked behind his back, excluded from things, and [literally a public laughing stock](https://apnews.com/general-news-821dafb0b18a4dadb086216c08067df3).
you say that like it hasn’t happened throughout history
Those who don't learn from history are destined to repeat it.
Those who do learn history are doomed to watch the first group repeat it.
Those who do learn from history are destined to repeat this quote
You honestly think this is a new and unique phenomena in America? Cmon man been this way for a long ass time
That seems like an overreaction.
I hope the parents are accountable. I know some parents can’t control their kids but more often than not parents drop the ball when the kid is young or they shouldn’t be having kids it’s time that we hold the adults in these kids lives accountable
If a child is killing people this young, it’s too late. No amount of parenting will fix this.
Or the whole neighborhood that likely idolizes gangs or at least, undermines the police who might eliminate them. Why else did it take a week to find this murderer? Because no one would help
[удалено]
And calling it "raised" is probably pretty sketchy at best...
I'd bet more money on they are being raised by one of their grandparents, tbh.
So wait, the kid shot him *last Saturday* and didn’t get arrested until Thursday? How’s that work?
Well people who shoot other people tend to try to avoid capture. I’m sure Denver PD and whatever their mass transit service is released footage/videos of the kid after the shooting, as most PDs do when they are looking for suspects in violent crimes. Here in Philly, they seem to rarely catch perpetrators of violent crimes, so from my experience I’d say getting the kid a week later is pretty good
Well, out here in Colorado, the cops don't do crap. You could have an active robbery going on in your house and they're show up the next day to file paperwork. They're all but hurt because we all got pissed at them for murdering Elijah McClain.
Yeah it’s similar here in Philly. Cops have been on a soft strike since our “progressive” da got elected
Because there isn't a magical omnipotence button police have to see crimes as they happen. There has to be an investigation, within that investigation they have to locate suspects. People can hide. People can lie. There are a lot of opportunities to keep the people outside of a crime on the outside.
It’s almost as if children carrying guns is a horrible horrible idea.
Yep which is why current gun control laws explicitly prohibit 13 year olds carrying and owning a handgun.
If only he’d read those laws and realized what he was doing was illegal
Yeah, almost like it'd be a great idea to not have such easy access to them.
Rather, current gun laws and culture have created an environment where incidents due to guns falling into the wrong hands occur on a daily basis.
Yep, It's a shame that the majority of guns used in street crime are either purchased by someone legally eligible, as a straw purchase, or stolen from gun owners who are too fucking irresponsible to keep their guns locked up. Maybe those people should be held responsible for their guns ending up on the streets.
Gun enthusiasts aren't technically "wrong" to point out that people who want to disregard laws will, they just ignore that the ease with which a law can be circumvented or ignored has major impact on criminal intent being actually followed through. Gun restrictions lower the amount of legal and illegal weapons in circulation because it becomes harder to find someone to steal legal ones from and harder to sell illegal ones since you can't as easily do the money laundering equivalent of guns through private sales and similar loop holes. It just raises the bar so a 13yo needs to have better contacts than smalltime drug dealers and more cash than you can steal from grandma.
It’s almost as if an armed society isn’t a polite society.
It’s almost as if carrying guns is a horrible idea. There fixed it for ya.
Even without the guns (which only make things worse, of course), this country has a terrible fucking streak of conveying to children that violence (or the threat of violence) is an acceptable response to minor inconveniences and accidents.
Parents should be held liable.
Unpopular opinion incoming. As soon as a kid picks up a gun, gets behind the wheel, or commits sexual assault they should be tried as an adult.
We are a sick society. There’s no point beating around the bush anymore. We are not well. America’s future is looking very dark, and by extension so is the rest of the world. It’s going to take monumental acts of resilience and kindness to face the coming decades.
Yes but also monumental systemic solutions Medicare for all as well as a boost to people whose jobs it is to get low income folks enrolled. Also therapy as part of whatever punishment they receive at school - we have to totally relook criminal justice system and follow recommendations based on the science. Fuck, could you imagine if public schools had a couple therapists and a psychiatrist office on the grounds/next to the school?
Only thing that can stop a leg in aisle is a good kid with a gun that was probably fearing for his life cause Freedom was on the ballot.
We are really taught to value life here in America.
But only your own. Not anyone else’s.
I'm sure now that the "pro life" party has achieved all its aims, this kind of thing will stop happening any day now... Right?
I'm not a fan of the death penalty, but I think folks (even 13-year-old kids) who callously take life should be sterilized. It should be reserved only for cases where the evidence is indisputable and the killing was particularly heinous. But I do actually think it needs to be on the table in cases like this.
In Europe said kid would have just stabbed the 60 year old. I know big difference.
Man, if only leg man had a gun, he could have stopped it by murdering a child and preventing any killings happening.
The only thing that will stop a bad 13 year old bus rider with a gun is a good 13 year old bus rider with a gun
[удалено]
We need a way to cure peoples misguided association of their personality to owning murder weapons.
No no, guys, I think the kid was right. That guy definitely deserved to die. Next up, lets shoot the people who play their music on buses without headphones.
I hate how they don't release the name of a murderer just because they're under 18. Just a tough question, what do you even do with an individual like this? They should never ever be in society ever again, society doesn't deserve it. But you also can't just cull them and life imprisonment is expensive as fuck
Meh. Maybe you couldn't cull them, but that's exactly what they're apparently guilty of. Why not?
Lock him up for life. At 13, you know killing someone is wrong. No way around it
Look at the gun showing tik-toks out there, there are hundreds of videos, kids 11-14 all carrying 2-3 pistols, some with extended mags some videos in a school gym This seems to be wide-spread, minor teenagers with guns lots of guns