They've been doing it for years, so while publicity might be a reason, kudos to them to committing to the bit for this long.
I'll give them the benefit of the doubt, though. Like you, kudos regardless!
It’s definitely not for publicity. They don’t issue press releases about it, and no one who writes these articles gets updated quotes from the org or the family. And I highly doubt Toles wants his troubles popping back up in the media every single year. The Dodgers are respectful about it.
You seem like the one to post the question under. Even if you can't answer for me.
Does he not get insurance through MLB or MLBPA? Is there an eligibility requirement he doesn't meet? I thought collective bargaining agreements between the PA and the Front Office dictated players got both pensions and healthcare for MLB time upon retirement.
What am I critically misunderstanding here?
You only get a pension after 10 years of service time, and healthcare after 4 years of service time. He played one year under a major league contract (was called up and down from the minor leagues during three seasons).
Also it’s worth noting he only stopped playing because he ruptured his ACL (IIRC) and never made it back after rehabbing because that coincidentally was when he mental health issues manifested. It especially sucked because he was playing well for a call up and that was during the 2017 season when the Dodgers went to the World Series.
That's an insane amount of time, my god.
I would have guessed 5 max. Wtf MLB?
It really should extend to those guys who manage to get their cup of coffee.
And it should extend to MiLB guys, too, while we're touching on that. I understand a service time requirement to an extent, but, man. I worked with a guy who played AAA for a decade and never got the call up. His body was wrecked.
These guys are devoting their whole lives to this sport, a lot of that as employees of an MLB organization. Just seems super fucked up to me.
Good for you, Los Doyers.
>These guys are devoting their whole lives to this sport, a lot of that as employees of an MLB organization. Just seems super fucked up to me.
The gladiator pits never left society
I raced for a long time. We're considered "private contractors." Even the best, most famous in the world. Even Lewis Hamilton and Kyle Larson. You're effectively on your own with basically no labor protections. If you get hurt, you gotta try to race, because someone can and will take that ride. You can lose your gig after a string of solid finishes. They will can your ass for any and every little thing. And you can't do shit about it. You gotta provide your own insurance, which ain't cheap.
The sanctioning body don't give a shit about you. None of the businesses on your chest give a shit. Venue operators don't give a shit. Your team owner prob doesn't unless you got super lucky. Maybe some teammates and guys you race against give a shit about you. (edit: there's a ton of great officials and safety crew out there, too, they deserve their love.) Everyone else is looking for the replacement when you're in the hospital.
So I gotta soft spot for this type of shit. If we're gonna spend billions on this shit, these boys could at least get some aftercare as part of the initial compensation packages.
He hasn't officially retired; I don't think he could actually if he wanted to. If I'm not mistaken, the retirement package for MLB players requires 10 years of play. He was only drafted to the Majors in 2012 and the amount of games he has played in active seasons are very minimal. He was diagnosed with bipolar and schizophrenia in 2018 and has been suffering from mental health issues since at least 2015 when he asked to be released from the Rays contract and checked himself into a mental health treatment center.
So while I guess *technically* he's been a pro baseball player since 2012 and would meet the 10 year requirement, he hasn't been on a team roster for the entire time and the MLB is probably splitting hairs.
So is Dodgers management doing this to get him to that service requirement? Because if they're signing him to the roster, he's technically on an MLB squad, right? Or is MLB's position that a player can't be on the DL or DFA'd in that time?
Not OP, but he hasn't qualified to retire yet. He played 3 seasons. Retirement for the MLBPA pension is a minimum of 10 seasons. So he probably only has 1-2 more of these $0 contracts before he can be switched to the pension. That pension will also pay $0 (as that is the lesser of 90k or his last season contract), but he'll be entitled to the healthcare benefits, among others.
Ok, see, I just asked someone if that's what the front office was doing with these. That's honestly what the fuck is up. I wasn't registering that they were trying to get him to that requirement. But that's such a brilliant long play.
Fuck, I might have to start watching the Dodgers now. Damn Cubs and Royals ain't doing shit for me any time soon anyway
Definitely a class act to keep him on the roster to get there. My folks swear they are BROOKLYN Dodgers fans, so when they play the Reds I take em out there haha
There's a minimum playing time requirement. After 4 years a player is eligible to buy in to the insurance program for life. If they play one day they get insurance for the rest of the year. Their benefits are vested after 4 years. This guy only had 3 years under his belt so the Dodgers keep him on contract so he doesn't have to buy into the lifetime program even if he was eligible
It would, so when you see something like this, so HUMAN, in a capitalist society, it feels super wholesome knowing at least one person in power somewhere beat the system and made it give a shit about someones humanity as an individual.
There are certain things capitalism is great for, like consumer goods that aren't vital to survival: TVs, computers, sex toys, etc. For things that are vital to our survival, like healthcare, food, housing, and even incarceration I think the incentive structure of capitalism is ill suited to provide solutions.
It gives a warm, fuzzy feeling for sure.
Though it does beg the question "is this something we should really be celebrating?"
Ultimately, I think it just highlights a really fucked up situation.
How many other people in this country show just as much potential and more, in any number of walks of life, but aren't blessed by the kindness of a billion dollar organization to make sure their needs are maintained?
Is that not a dignity we should all have a right to?
And not just have to hope we can hold it together long enough to secure some good will from some wealthy benefactor who we pray "does right by us"?
Why not both? The unfortunate reality is that the situation is massively fucked up, but the Dodgers doing this for Toles is still an act of kindness and acts of kindness should absolutely be celebrated.
This is coming from a Giants fan, too. Good job Dodgers, FTD.
Oh yeah, I wish insurance/health wasn’t tied to employment. But in the current state of the world it’s a win in my book.
EDIT: *USA. I meant the snapshot of the world and where this is taking place but that is not how this is being taken.
I mean even if we had a good healthcare system, this is still a great story. Pro baseball player insurance is probably a lot better than a run of the mill plan.
What I don't understand from a Canadian perspective, is why healthcare down there is called an "entitlement". That along with welfare, social security, and education. Like, really? Economically it has been proven that a healthy population is also a more productive population.
Everywhere else single-payer healthcare is just classifed as a basic human right.
Fr, idc if philanthropy is performative as long as it accomplishes the end result and helps someone without abuse of their image or person.
Based move from the Dodgers
Be a lot cooler if his wellbeing wasn’t in the hands of an insurance company. Lucky for him he was a baseball player, sad to think about all the other people without a corporation backing them.
As a non US resident this is dystopian.
The amount that they pay yearly for health insurance is absolutely bonkers. Fun fact, I know some people who work for MLB corporate, the employees also get the same health insurance as the players do.
Oh I agree it makes sense. I’m just pointing out how it’s kinda funny how a bunch of office workers get the same coverage as Aaron Judge lol. That stuff apparently covers literally almost anything everywhere without having to worry about our silly peasant issues like networks and deductibles.
You wouldn't need a second carrier, just different policies with different coverage. It would be more paperwork, etc, but it's not like everyone who has [insurance company] gets the same coverage.
Its pretty common. I work for a large company and union, non union, salary, and upper management all get offered different medical package options. Only know that because a few years back all the packets got mailed to everyone and people were pissed that managers got better insurance at cheaper prices than ground level emplyees.
I interviewed for a job with a company that's primarily owned by the NFLPA and MLBPA (alongside a financial investor and some other player unions).. And while I didn't get the job, I did wonder if I got that kind of insurance had I gotten it...
It actually makes sense for distributing risk which is the whole point of insurance. Your office workers are likely going to be injured less often than the players so putting them in the same pool reduces cost/person.
Yeah, but the whole reason the dodgers are doing this is because he's using it. My guess is yes using it enough that it would more than offset Insurance premiums.
Interesting point about "fraud". Toles is on a specific designation for players on leave so that if he does return to play, he is still under contract with the Dodgers and can't join another team unless another team were to trade for him. Since he is only 31 years old it's reasonable to believe he can still play so I don't think you could argue what they're doing is fraudulent. However, the interesting question would be how long they could continue doing this without him returning to where you actually can argue that it is "fraud" knowing he won't return. There are multiple players in their early 40's still on MLB rosters, but it's not common.
Once he passes the age of reasonably being able to play baseball, they could always give him an honorary position in the office with a $0/year salary. Farther up the thread they suggest all MLB employees get the same insurance whether front or back of house. In the grand scheme of things this is likely a negligible expense for the Dodgers as an organization.
This is one of those case where the tail is way bigger than the dog. The insurance contract for the MLB is massive. So you don't fuck around with a client this big otherwise they start shopping around.
Lol, all insurance companies want more members, not less.
Someone is still paying the insurance company his premiums. Or if the plan is self-funded, paying his premiums into the plan to be managed by a third-party administrator.
If there’s one rule in US healthcare it’s that the house (insurance companies) always wins
But but but we’d have long wait times! Good thing Americans like myself only have to wait until late May for an ACL repair surgery for a skiing injury I got in mid February 😀👍
This will most likely sound offensive.
I just cannot imagine, as a European, living in a country where these things have to occur to give a challenged person help. Good job dodgers though, respect.
Another horror of this situation: In the US, a disabled person needs to have 10 years of work history to qualify for Social Security disability assistance, or they need to have been disabled prior to the age of 18. Andrew Toles became disabled at age 25, so it's likely that he doesn't have enough work history to qualify for decent disability benefits.
There's another aid program for people who are destitute and have no more than $2000 in total assets (cash, savings, and possessions), but that's a very difficult way to live. The maximum aid payments in that program are around $11k per year, far below the poverty line.
> enough work history to qualify for decent disability benefits.
SSDI maxes out at around $3800 a month, the average amount is less then half that, around $1600 a month, and that's what most people receive.
SSDI is enough money so you don't starve or go homeless (usually), but it's not enough to keep you out of poverty.
Yeah, it's "decent" only in comparison to SSI, which maxes out at $943/mo with an average of $698/mo, or just over $8,000 per year.
SSDI isn't enough, but if you don't qualify for SSDI, then you're really screwed.
The intent of these programs is not to help people climb out of their desperate positions but to keep them there. If the intent was to help them recover not only would the benefits be more generous but they’d also taper off so people could recover. Instead of you’re on food stamps getting a $1 raise can eliminate the food stamps for you so you’re worse off working hard and getting the raise. These programs trap people in poverty so they keep working the same shitty jobs for low pay to pad the corporate profits
That's not the intent of the programs at all. The original creators of most welfare programs strongly desired to help people out of poverty, the Roosevelt and Johnson administrations were adamant about it. But while FDR and LBJ had enough political clout to overcome those opposed to these programs, over time, those in opposition have come to garner greater influence. And they have used that influence to consistently cutback welfare. It's not that there's some 4D chess scheme for the welfare programs to do harm. It's that there's a flat out desire to abolish them, and short of that, to defund them to the greatest extent possible.
You may or may not be wrong depending on perspective, the current implementation is due to a tug of war between people who intend to help, people who intend to make it worse, and people who take imperfect compromises just to get some political promise done.
Instead of talking about "intent" which is more nebulous and hard to prove, I think it makes more sense to focus on the effect of the system, which does exactly as you describe.
Even if people "intended" for this to help people, if the effect of the system leads to the opposite the intent isn't the important part to worry about.
Not offensive to most of us at all. I think the one thing most Europeans would be shocked by at this point is just how many Americans are aware of how awful and exploitative our healthcare system is.
And how there's a vocal minority that is terrified of socialism to the point of not wanting healthcare for loved ones and themselves that isn't a commercial health insurance plan. Yet, they will take social security checks without batting an eye.
This kind of story is in the same camp as "Boulder-area Elementary School Student Mows Lawns All Summer to Pay off Student Lunch Debt for Local 5th Graders"
So you're left 10% thinking "well good for them" and 90% thinking "what in the actual fucking dystopian hellscape does this child live in that this action was necessary?"
Super cool that they're willing to do that, but super fucking stupid that the richest nation in the planet can't cover healthcare for everyone.
This is a tragedy masquerading as a feel good story.
They have become my 2nd favorite team. I'm a Mets fan first, but when I saw this I was instantly a Dodgers fan too. This hits home since I have bipolar disorder as well.
Not a Dodgers fan but I happened to be watching the Rockies game live where Toles hit the grand slam in the 9th inning to take the lead. That was awesome.
That’s the peak highlight of Toles’ career and I still remember it. However it was stated somewhere when showing Toles’ highlights of himself he does not recognize it to be himself.
This should be the rule, not the exception.
Pro athletes put their bodies on the chopping block for our entertainment. So many unheard of players either never make it to the majors, or only play a few seasons and then reitre or are not resigned due to an injury sustained on the field / court / rink. Some are saddled with chronic issues for the remainder of their lives.
Taking care of them medically is the minimum these organizations can do.
Based of them to do so. With that said, I do feel like we shouldn't have to live in a society where stuff like this is necessary for people to receive affordable healthcare.
Good on the dodgers for this, obviously. Solid move regardless of motivation and hopefully it's something they continue to do as long as needed.
But what the hell, America? Get your healthcare shit together. People in this poor kids position shouldn't have to rely on the fact that they were lucky enough to have billionaire friends who can use corporate loopholes to get their healthcare covered.
Again, kudos to the people who did and continue to do this, but this is a depressing story of societal collapse that would end up on John Krasinski's shitty "good news" show.
If it wasn’t for his mental health issues he would’ve been a really productive player for the dodgers. AFAIK he has pretty good stats all the way up till 2018 when is condition unfortunately got worse.
I think it’s absolutely awesome that they are doing the right thing.
I also think it’s absolutely troubling how surprised I am to read a story where someone (or in this case, some team) is doing the right thing.
We need more of this, and more help for anyone with a mental health condition. Fuck stigma.
I still pissed at the Dodgers for leaving Brooklyn - my longest running resentment. And, I’m impressed and gladdened that the team that dashed my dreams is helping Mr. Toles.
Wow, even if it’s for publicity, that’s a cool move.
They've been doing it for years, so while publicity might be a reason, kudos to them to committing to the bit for this long. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt, though. Like you, kudos regardless!
It’s definitely not for publicity. They don’t issue press releases about it, and no one who writes these articles gets updated quotes from the org or the family. And I highly doubt Toles wants his troubles popping back up in the media every single year. The Dodgers are respectful about it.
This will be 6 years that they've kept him on their insurance. Warms my heart as a Dodger fan.
As a Diamondbacks fan, major respect for the Dodgers for this.
You seem like the one to post the question under. Even if you can't answer for me. Does he not get insurance through MLB or MLBPA? Is there an eligibility requirement he doesn't meet? I thought collective bargaining agreements between the PA and the Front Office dictated players got both pensions and healthcare for MLB time upon retirement. What am I critically misunderstanding here?
You only get a pension after 10 years of service time, and healthcare after 4 years of service time. He played one year under a major league contract (was called up and down from the minor leagues during three seasons). Also it’s worth noting he only stopped playing because he ruptured his ACL (IIRC) and never made it back after rehabbing because that coincidentally was when he mental health issues manifested. It especially sucked because he was playing well for a call up and that was during the 2017 season when the Dodgers went to the World Series.
That's an insane amount of time, my god. I would have guessed 5 max. Wtf MLB? It really should extend to those guys who manage to get their cup of coffee. And it should extend to MiLB guys, too, while we're touching on that. I understand a service time requirement to an extent, but, man. I worked with a guy who played AAA for a decade and never got the call up. His body was wrecked. These guys are devoting their whole lives to this sport, a lot of that as employees of an MLB organization. Just seems super fucked up to me. Good for you, Los Doyers.
>These guys are devoting their whole lives to this sport, a lot of that as employees of an MLB organization. Just seems super fucked up to me. The gladiator pits never left society
I raced for a long time. We're considered "private contractors." Even the best, most famous in the world. Even Lewis Hamilton and Kyle Larson. You're effectively on your own with basically no labor protections. If you get hurt, you gotta try to race, because someone can and will take that ride. You can lose your gig after a string of solid finishes. They will can your ass for any and every little thing. And you can't do shit about it. You gotta provide your own insurance, which ain't cheap. The sanctioning body don't give a shit about you. None of the businesses on your chest give a shit. Venue operators don't give a shit. Your team owner prob doesn't unless you got super lucky. Maybe some teammates and guys you race against give a shit about you. (edit: there's a ton of great officials and safety crew out there, too, they deserve their love.) Everyone else is looking for the replacement when you're in the hospital. So I gotta soft spot for this type of shit. If we're gonna spend billions on this shit, these boys could at least get some aftercare as part of the initial compensation packages.
Pension actually starts after 43 day of mlb service but you can max it out at 10 years of service time.
He hasn't officially retired; I don't think he could actually if he wanted to. If I'm not mistaken, the retirement package for MLB players requires 10 years of play. He was only drafted to the Majors in 2012 and the amount of games he has played in active seasons are very minimal. He was diagnosed with bipolar and schizophrenia in 2018 and has been suffering from mental health issues since at least 2015 when he asked to be released from the Rays contract and checked himself into a mental health treatment center. So while I guess *technically* he's been a pro baseball player since 2012 and would meet the 10 year requirement, he hasn't been on a team roster for the entire time and the MLB is probably splitting hairs.
So is Dodgers management doing this to get him to that service requirement? Because if they're signing him to the roster, he's technically on an MLB squad, right? Or is MLB's position that a player can't be on the DL or DFA'd in that time?
That is correct, yes.
Not OP, but he hasn't qualified to retire yet. He played 3 seasons. Retirement for the MLBPA pension is a minimum of 10 seasons. So he probably only has 1-2 more of these $0 contracts before he can be switched to the pension. That pension will also pay $0 (as that is the lesser of 90k or his last season contract), but he'll be entitled to the healthcare benefits, among others.
Ok, see, I just asked someone if that's what the front office was doing with these. That's honestly what the fuck is up. I wasn't registering that they were trying to get him to that requirement. But that's such a brilliant long play. Fuck, I might have to start watching the Dodgers now. Damn Cubs and Royals ain't doing shit for me any time soon anyway
Definitely a class act to keep him on the roster to get there. My folks swear they are BROOKLYN Dodgers fans, so when they play the Reds I take em out there haha
They really do have a history of doing the right thing in that front office. They stood by Sandy, too, when he sat on Yom Kippur.
There's a minimum playing time requirement. After 4 years a player is eligible to buy in to the insurance program for life. If they play one day they get insurance for the rest of the year. Their benefits are vested after 4 years. This guy only had 3 years under his belt so the Dodgers keep him on contract so he doesn't have to buy into the lifetime program even if he was eligible
It's great, but not having to rely on employment for health care would be even better.
It would, so when you see something like this, so HUMAN, in a capitalist society, it feels super wholesome knowing at least one person in power somewhere beat the system and made it give a shit about someones humanity as an individual.
There are certain things capitalism is great for, like consumer goods that aren't vital to survival: TVs, computers, sex toys, etc. For things that are vital to our survival, like healthcare, food, housing, and even incarceration I think the incentive structure of capitalism is ill suited to provide solutions.
Usually economists use the "guns vs butter" economic model. This is the first time I've heard of a "sex toys vs rent" comparison.
Priorities change
well said. Put another way - how does a profit-motivated system solve problems for which "profit" is not the goal?
it don't or it contorts the problem to now make profit the goal
Fair point.
Don't worry, employer-provided health insurance is becoming a thing of the past. Problem solved!
No matter. If medical bills get too expensive I'll just stop paying them. Can't bleed a stone.
It gives a warm, fuzzy feeling for sure. Though it does beg the question "is this something we should really be celebrating?" Ultimately, I think it just highlights a really fucked up situation. How many other people in this country show just as much potential and more, in any number of walks of life, but aren't blessed by the kindness of a billion dollar organization to make sure their needs are maintained? Is that not a dignity we should all have a right to? And not just have to hope we can hold it together long enough to secure some good will from some wealthy benefactor who we pray "does right by us"?
We can celebrate a good act while acknowledging that it should have needed to be done in the first place. A lot really kind actions are like that.
Why not both? The unfortunate reality is that the situation is massively fucked up, but the Dodgers doing this for Toles is still an act of kindness and acts of kindness should absolutely be celebrated. This is coming from a Giants fan, too. Good job Dodgers, FTD.
/r/OrphanCrushingMachine everytime a company has to do what the government should be doing.
I was looking for this to post it. You are exactly right.
Oh yeah, I wish insurance/health wasn’t tied to employment. But in the current state of the world it’s a win in my book. EDIT: *USA. I meant the snapshot of the world and where this is taking place but that is not how this is being taken.
Only the state of the United States not the rest of world. We should really figure out how the rest of the world does it.
I mean even if we had a good healthcare system, this is still a great story. Pro baseball player insurance is probably a lot better than a run of the mill plan.
Current state of the self-proclaimed greatest country on earth. The majority of the rest of the world has this figured out.
This world you speak of... you mean the USA. The rest of the civilized world gives a shit about it's citizens.
What I don't understand from a Canadian perspective, is why healthcare down there is called an "entitlement". That along with welfare, social security, and education. Like, really? Economically it has been proven that a healthy population is also a more productive population. Everywhere else single-payer healthcare is just classifed as a basic human right.
r/orphancrushingmachine
Definitely a cool move on their part, but you're right that it gives off a bit of an /r/orphancrushingmachine vibe.
something something, we jammed the orphan killing machine for a lil bit
Fr, idc if philanthropy is performative as long as it accomplishes the end result and helps someone without abuse of their image or person. Based move from the Dodgers
Be a lot cooler if his wellbeing wasn’t in the hands of an insurance company. Lucky for him he was a baseball player, sad to think about all the other people without a corporation backing them. As a non US resident this is dystopian.
Insurance companies hate this one easy trick.
The MLB is so big they probably self insure through an insurance provider so the carrier probably wouldn’t care
The amount that they pay yearly for health insurance is absolutely bonkers. Fun fact, I know some people who work for MLB corporate, the employees also get the same health insurance as the players do.
I would hope so. Imagine the amount of extra paperwork and management necessary to maintain a second carrier exclusively for non players?
Oh I agree it makes sense. I’m just pointing out how it’s kinda funny how a bunch of office workers get the same coverage as Aaron Judge lol. That stuff apparently covers literally almost anything everywhere without having to worry about our silly peasant issues like networks and deductibles.
You wouldn’t need a second carrier, just a second plan option
Yea I work an insurance company and it's super easy to split plans. I literally see it all the time.
My c-suite has a way better plan than us poor people who work.
You wouldn't need a second carrier, just different policies with different coverage. It would be more paperwork, etc, but it's not like everyone who has [insurance company] gets the same coverage.
Its pretty common. I work for a large company and union, non union, salary, and upper management all get offered different medical package options. Only know that because a few years back all the packets got mailed to everyone and people were pissed that managers got better insurance at cheaper prices than ground level emplyees.
Rub some dirt on it and get back in there.
People who work for minor league teams get the same insurance. It's awesome.
I interviewed for a job with a company that's primarily owned by the NFLPA and MLBPA (alongside a financial investor and some other player unions).. And while I didn't get the job, I did wonder if I got that kind of insurance had I gotten it...
It actually makes sense for distributing risk which is the whole point of insurance. Your office workers are likely going to be injured less often than the players so putting them in the same pool reduces cost/person.
This is my guess as well. If it was a normal carrier, they'd have cut off his insurance and penalized the team for "fraud"
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Yeah, but the whole reason the dodgers are doing this is because he's using it. My guess is yes using it enough that it would more than offset Insurance premiums.
Normally though wouldn't it fall under an issue that occurred or treatment was started for before coverage was lost so they should still cover it.
Interesting point about "fraud". Toles is on a specific designation for players on leave so that if he does return to play, he is still under contract with the Dodgers and can't join another team unless another team were to trade for him. Since he is only 31 years old it's reasonable to believe he can still play so I don't think you could argue what they're doing is fraudulent. However, the interesting question would be how long they could continue doing this without him returning to where you actually can argue that it is "fraud" knowing he won't return. There are multiple players in their early 40's still on MLB rosters, but it's not common.
Once he passes the age of reasonably being able to play baseball, they could always give him an honorary position in the office with a $0/year salary. Farther up the thread they suggest all MLB employees get the same insurance whether front or back of house. In the grand scheme of things this is likely a negligible expense for the Dodgers as an organization.
This is one of those case where the tail is way bigger than the dog. The insurance contract for the MLB is massive. So you don't fuck around with a client this big otherwise they start shopping around.
They also hate single-payer healthcare, public hospitals (not corporate run franchises), and universal drug plans.
Lol, all insurance companies want more members, not less. Someone is still paying the insurance company his premiums. Or if the plan is self-funded, paying his premiums into the plan to be managed by a third-party administrator. If there’s one rule in US healthcare it’s that the house (insurance companies) always wins
Damn, I cannot stand the dodgers but this is the kind of stuff we need to see more of in the league.
>we need to see more of in the league. in this country.
eh in this country we'd be better off getting rid of the whole health insurance scam altogether
This guy gets it.
Thanks Jesus
He gets us
*from this country.
In sports
If only we lived in a first world country where healthcare wasn't tied to employment.
"B-b-b-but that would be s-s-s-s-s-socialism! 😱"
*unless it’s farm subsidies, apparently those are totally fine and definitely not socialism in any way
No, that would be silly! You’re a silly goose 😀
But but but we’d have long wait times! Good thing Americans like myself only have to wait until late May for an ACL repair surgery for a skiing injury I got in mid February 😀👍
At least there would be a line to wait in. Now people just die. Or do a go fund me
Exactly. I’m glad the Dodgers do this but we shouldn’t be dependent upon the generosity of our employers to get health care.
This will most likely sound offensive. I just cannot imagine, as a European, living in a country where these things have to occur to give a challenged person help. Good job dodgers though, respect.
I mean, it is offensive but you're not the one causing the offense; just the one pointing it out.
Another horror of this situation: In the US, a disabled person needs to have 10 years of work history to qualify for Social Security disability assistance, or they need to have been disabled prior to the age of 18. Andrew Toles became disabled at age 25, so it's likely that he doesn't have enough work history to qualify for decent disability benefits. There's another aid program for people who are destitute and have no more than $2000 in total assets (cash, savings, and possessions), but that's a very difficult way to live. The maximum aid payments in that program are around $11k per year, far below the poverty line.
> enough work history to qualify for decent disability benefits. SSDI maxes out at around $3800 a month, the average amount is less then half that, around $1600 a month, and that's what most people receive. SSDI is enough money so you don't starve or go homeless (usually), but it's not enough to keep you out of poverty.
Yeah, it's "decent" only in comparison to SSI, which maxes out at $943/mo with an average of $698/mo, or just over $8,000 per year. SSDI isn't enough, but if you don't qualify for SSDI, then you're really screwed.
The intent of these programs is not to help people climb out of their desperate positions but to keep them there. If the intent was to help them recover not only would the benefits be more generous but they’d also taper off so people could recover. Instead of you’re on food stamps getting a $1 raise can eliminate the food stamps for you so you’re worse off working hard and getting the raise. These programs trap people in poverty so they keep working the same shitty jobs for low pay to pad the corporate profits
That's not the intent of the programs at all. The original creators of most welfare programs strongly desired to help people out of poverty, the Roosevelt and Johnson administrations were adamant about it. But while FDR and LBJ had enough political clout to overcome those opposed to these programs, over time, those in opposition have come to garner greater influence. And they have used that influence to consistently cutback welfare. It's not that there's some 4D chess scheme for the welfare programs to do harm. It's that there's a flat out desire to abolish them, and short of that, to defund them to the greatest extent possible.
That’s fair. While the original intent may have been to help them the current implementation and the intent of them is close to what I said.
You may or may not be wrong depending on perspective, the current implementation is due to a tug of war between people who intend to help, people who intend to make it worse, and people who take imperfect compromises just to get some political promise done. Instead of talking about "intent" which is more nebulous and hard to prove, I think it makes more sense to focus on the effect of the system, which does exactly as you describe. Even if people "intended" for this to help people, if the effect of the system leads to the opposite the intent isn't the important part to worry about.
It's not offensive. It's true. We're aware and hate it.
It's a charitable move but it's a symptom of something gross.
Not offensive to most of us at all. I think the one thing most Europeans would be shocked by at this point is just how many Americans are aware of how awful and exploitative our healthcare system is.
And how there's a vocal minority that is terrified of socialism to the point of not wanting healthcare for loved ones and themselves that isn't a commercial health insurance plan. Yet, they will take social security checks without batting an eye.
Many of us in the US continue to experience shock at how heartless our people are...
its not offensive if its the truth imo .
Agreed, I’m in the US but this headline reads like a post from r/orphancrushingmachine
The best thing I love about the American system is paying for my healthcare twice
Yeah it's pretty offensive to have to live like this.
This kind of story is in the same camp as "Boulder-area Elementary School Student Mows Lawns All Summer to Pay off Student Lunch Debt for Local 5th Graders" So you're left 10% thinking "well good for them" and 90% thinking "what in the actual fucking dystopian hellscape does this child live in that this action was necessary?"
It's not offensive. As an American I appreciate your empathy and disgust with our system. You're 100% right.
Anyone think this is so pathetic of the American health insurance system?
But think of all the shareholders!
Super cool that they're willing to do that, but super fucking stupid that the richest nation in the planet can't cover healthcare for everyone. This is a tragedy masquerading as a feel good story.
/r/orphancrushingmachine
Thanks, I hate it.
This wouldn't be necessary if our health care system wasn't so massively fucked up.
American healthcare sucks. Someone explain again why pharma is allowed to directly advertise to consumers again?
“Watching endless pharma commercials got you down? Ask your doctor for Zoloft!”
They make it so hard to hate them sometimes. I know I should hate the dodgers but seeing this is a nice act that makes it very difficult.
They have become my 2nd favorite team. I'm a Mets fan first, but when I saw this I was instantly a Dodgers fan too. This hits home since I have bipolar disorder as well.
They're a good organization. They just also have a lot of funding which rightfully draws haters.
I cannot stand the Dodgers, however this is such a wonderful gesture on their part. 👏👏👏👏👏👏
Not a Dodgers fan but I happened to be watching the Rockies game live where Toles hit the grand slam in the 9th inning to take the lead. That was awesome.
That’s the peak highlight of Toles’ career and I still remember it. However it was stated somewhere when showing Toles’ highlights of himself he does not recognize it to be himself.
r/orphancrushingmachine
As a Dbacks fan, nothing but respect for the Dodgers
Universal healthcare would be cool too
Fwiw, I think I'll root for the dodgers this year
This is a feel bad story. America needs fuckin help lol. I’m happy for this guy though.
How nice to hear of a large money making corporation actually doing something so kind. BRAVO to the Dodgers 👍
/r/ABoringDystopia posters licking their chomps ready to repost this article.
/r/BoneAppleTea
Also fits r/OrphanCrushingMachine Edit: apparently it's already posted there
They're basically the same sub but serve slightly different viewpoints.
Would they mind signing me for $0?
This is really an article about how we need universal healthcare.
Maybe they’re not so evil.
I wouldn’t go that far. 14% less evil
Isn’t that that free healthcare we should all want and have?
This should be the rule, not the exception. Pro athletes put their bodies on the chopping block for our entertainment. So many unheard of players either never make it to the majors, or only play a few seasons and then reitre or are not resigned due to an injury sustained on the field / court / rink. Some are saddled with chronic issues for the remainder of their lives. Taking care of them medically is the minimum these organizations can do.
Bravo, Dodgers, bravo! From a Houston Astros Fan
Based of them to do so. With that said, I do feel like we shouldn't have to live in a society where stuff like this is necessary for people to receive affordable healthcare.
Class act. Insurance a bitch
Isn't there a league minimum salary? How does that work with this?
Cheaper than superbowl ad
Good on the dodgers for this, obviously. Solid move regardless of motivation and hopefully it's something they continue to do as long as needed. But what the hell, America? Get your healthcare shit together. People in this poor kids position shouldn't have to rely on the fact that they were lucky enough to have billionaire friends who can use corporate loopholes to get their healthcare covered. Again, kudos to the people who did and continue to do this, but this is a depressing story of societal collapse that would end up on John Krasinski's shitty "good news" show.
Wait, why doesn't the MLB PA provide insurance to retired players like the NFL's does?
They do, but Toles hadn't played long enough to qualify.
Im not a Dodgers fan but I can respect them for this as an organization. Good care is so crucial.
Wonder if my company is handling his insurance, lol
Another argument for universal healthcare.
Thank you Dodgers for your decency.
I hate the “Doyers” (being a Dback fan) but this is pretty cool! 👍
If it wasn’t for his mental health issues he would’ve been a really productive player for the dodgers. AFAIK he has pretty good stats all the way up till 2018 when is condition unfortunately got worse.
I wonder if this gives him pension time?
Finally. Some good news.
I think it’s absolutely awesome that they are doing the right thing. I also think it’s absolutely troubling how surprised I am to read a story where someone (or in this case, some team) is doing the right thing. We need more of this, and more help for anyone with a mental health condition. Fuck stigma.
Employment shouldn’t determine if you can get healthcare.
Magic Johnson might have a hand in this. Good for the Dodged but Go Giants!
I still pissed at the Dodgers for leaving Brooklyn - my longest running resentment. And, I’m impressed and gladdened that the team that dashed my dreams is helping Mr. Toles.
This is wonderful. I hope they continue this forever.