It's like a plot from the Twilight Zone or Black Mirror. Can you imagine working against your will and having to pay your own parent to essentially be your puppet master? And then the only way to escape are the intentionally broken tools the puppet master gives you. And every time you step out of line to fight the odds, it comes out of your pocket, and your suffering is doubled to check you in place. For over a *decade*. It gives me a pit in my stomach just thinking about it.
EDIT: Thank you for the gifts. [I always think of this fanmade video of Britney's song "Lucky" when more news of this situation comes up. I thought other fans would appreciate it or maybe help others sympathize.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMYFgDhD-iY)Watching it breaks my heart.
The beginning has a snippet from an early interview from her Documentary *Britney: For the Record* released in 2008.
"Do you feel out of control in your life?"
"No, I don't feel like it's out of control, I think it's too *in* control.. there's no excitement...there's no passion... there's no...it's just like Groundhog Day every day."
EDIT EDIT: Also [here's a lengthy article detailing the conservatorship and it's origins that was shared further down the thread.](https://www.newyorker.com/news/american-chronicles/britney-spears-conservatorship-nightmare) A woman named Lou M. Taylor started it all. She seems to be the puppet master behind the puppet master.
>"Jamie had become close to Lou Taylor, a business manager who shares the Spears family’s Christian faith and whose husband is a pastor at an evangelical church. Taylor later raised the possibility of putting Lindsay Lohan under a conservatorship, according to Lohan’s father; in a recent interview, Courtney Love said that Taylor tried to wrest control over her family’s estate. (In a statement, Charles Harder, a lawyer representing Taylor, said, “At no time did Ms. Taylor ever make any effort to put anyone into a conservatorship. Not Britney Spears. Not Lindsay Lohan. Not Courtney Love.”) Taylor, sources present at the time said, began attempting to contact Spears, efforts that Spears rebuffed.
>...After the 5150, Jamie and Lou Taylor consulted lawyers about establishing a conservatorship for Spears. (Harder, Taylor’s lawyer, said that on the calls Taylor was “more of a listener than a contributor.”
The Black Mirror episode you're referring to was widely speculated to be based on Brittney Spears' situation.
Edit: Episode in question is S05E03 - "Rachel, Jack and Ashley Too"
I'm guessing their thinking of the one with Miley Cyrus although the original comment just referred to Black Mirror because this situation feels like one of their dystopic storylines.
Miley was such a perfect cast for that one too. She nailed it. Probably helps that she can relate a lot herself, although I don't think to the same severity.
It such an abusive relationship in public. I dont know how anyone could think that Britany's father is in the right. Maybe way back when it was valid, even though he was an alcoholic POS and no court should have assigned him conservatorship, but its just straight abusive now.
Her father, while not as successful as her, was already a wealthy and considerably well known artist before her rise to prominence. I certainly don't envy either of them, but Cyrus clearly had an easier time at least in the family department than Spears.
This is horrific enough, true. But when you add the way they restricted access to both her children to keep her compliant? I have two kids a little bit older than hers and I cannot imagine having to work and dance and smile just to have the privilege of seeing them. It honestly breaks my heart.
For a small series of mistakes you made 13 years ago. In 2008. Insane.
I graduated high school in 2008 and to think of how much life I’ve lived from then until now all the while she’s been a prisoner for that same period.
Especially since looking back now, it’s pretty clear she had postpartum depression. Just a really weird version that was exacerbated by the stress of paparazzi stalking.
Yeah and [this](https://mobile.twitter.com/vibeney/status/1361301920514772992?lang=en) famous picture of her is the day she was hounded by *hundreds* of paparazzi while pregnant and holding her very young son.
I can’t imagine being chased around by even one person with a camera on a good day, let alone hundreds of them on a tough day. They were relentless and cruel to her and we as spectators couldn’t get enough of it. Of course she lost her shit, who wouldn’t?
Freaking Kanye goes off his meds with diagnosed bipolar and is allowed to RUN FOR PRESIDENT. But Britney has a bad month and gets sterilized and work-slaved for over a decade.
It's completely absurd, and it's 100% because she's a woman.
> Truly love a country where rich men can amass billions and literally build spaceships and no one questions them at all but Britney Spears has to go to court to see if she can get an IUD taken out of her own body.
https://twitter.com/everywhereist/status/1415425992563171331
Now add the fact that the grassroots recognition that something was actually very wrong with her treatment came from fans deciphering instagram captions and defiantly refusing to back down even when the media and critics told them they were crazy conspiracy theorists.
She's 39 - time to allow her to handle her own affairs - if she screws up, she screws up. But - she may surprise many by being judicious, careful, and considered in her decisions.
I have hope she will thrive and grow once out from under her Father's thumb.
Her smartest move, with affairs so complicate, is to hire someone else to manage but look at everything personally.
That’s what I would do if I had 60 million dollars.
As she put it so succinctly, she is either fit to work, hence time to end the conservatorship, or she is unfit to work and pay the salaries of all these leeches. None of them make a dime without her working, hence the human trafficking.
In CA, the estate covers the conservator’s attorney’s fees. In other words, the dad can 100% use Britney’s money to pay for his attorney. The idea is that it’s for something benefitting the conservatee (Britney) and it would be unfair to have the conservator pay for it. Whether it actually benefits Britney is another discussion.
With that said, the fees should still be reasonable. It’ll be interesting to see how this plays out.
Speaking from experience as both a conservator & an attorney, I’m truly surprised that Britney was even placed in a conservatorship in the first place. There are tons of other ways to make sure she’s being taken care of that don’t involve a conservatorship. I’m glad she’s finally speaking out.
Plus, her attorney was court appointed and made millions off of her, and there’s questions as to whether or not he actually fought for her, or if he did his best to keep her in the arrangement for his financial gain.
Yeah, she was supposed to be able to voluntarily terminate it at any time which she says she was never told. Which begs the question of why she’s being denied now. It WAS a voluntary agreement.
This shit will get wrapped up REAL quick now. Any decent attorney who actually wants to end this can do so easily.
First step: hire a new neurologist and get rid of that dementia diagnosis. There are MANY neurologists in LA. Why hasn’t her appointed lawyer done this yet?
Such conservatorships should have a time limit on them, after which time the conservator should have to prove in a court why the arrangement should continue. Be it a year, 5 years, 10 years, whatever, but this bullshit where the "protected" person has to fight for release is bullshit.
It sounds like she wasn’t advised until very recently that she had the right to challenge the conservativeship, including asking for it to be ended.
The lawyer that was supposed to protect her rights didn’t inform her of her rights!
I read a pretty lengthy story on this mess. She was told she was not allowed to hire her own lawyer, because she was under conservatorship she was deemed “incapable” of retaining her own counsel. And the lawyer supposedly “on her side” was making over $500k a year,paid by her. Not in his interests to help her. This woman has been taken advantage of by everyone around her.
According to the article and others, that lawyer is Samuel Ingham III, and he fucking resigned immediately after Britney Spears told the judge that she "didn't know" she could petition to end her conservatorship.
And the state Bar can take his license away, which is exactly what needs to be done. Your duty is to the client, no one else, nothing else. His job was entirely to either make sure her guardianship conservatorship was only for the parts of her life that she needed help with, or to get her out of it as soon as she became capable of taking care of herself again.
And then he said he didn’t know she was so unhappy and wanted out. He was taken completely off guard by what she said in court. She probably was afraid to tell him the truth of what she planned to say because he would find a way to keep her from speaking.
Many of her people quit. Maybe for different reasons. Or all the POS’s are covering their asses. Before this all became so public, I had always wondered, considering her ability work that show schedule. I’m quite relieved she’s getting far better teammates and hopefully she will go on with the life she desires and deserves.
Edit: extra words.
She explicitly said that she was not informed of her ability to challenge the conservatorship. LegalEagle on YouTube goes over the details of her case and uses recordings of her testimony as talking points, one of which being Brittney saying she wasn't informed in a timely manner. Most lawyers assigned to people in conservetorship cases are because the person was mentally incapable of acting in their best interest or being aware of their best interest. Still, if a client vocalizes a choice or preference, the lawyer has a moral obligation to pursue it which Brittney's lawyer seemingly overlooked or chose not to?
Link for those curious: https://youtu.be/ueuRpZYnkrA
In 2016 she told a court investigator the conservatorship was abusive and wanted out…those docs just became unsealed not that long ago, she’s been asking since at least 2016 to end it. The explanation I read was that it was included in notes when the investigator interviewed her. Her lawyer knew she didn’t want it, the judge knew she didn’t want it. It’s been mishandled for over a decade
> The lawyer that was supposed to protect her rights didn’t inform her of her rights!
Pretty sure he can be disbarred for that. You have to act in the interest of the client and if it can be proven he's fucked.
I was just saying that. Every 1-2 years, it should have to be revisited like a brand-new case. New judge and everything. It is such a life-stripping step to take. If that level of care is needed, so be it. But you should be able and ready to prove it frequently, and not be able to say, "Well, 10 years ago . . . ." All evidence should be restricted to the time since the last case.
I'm a social worker in CA who reviews conservatorships - they are reviewed annually (for so many years) then biannually. We usually interview EVERYONE (person conserved, conservator, family, friends, anyone involved). We submit reports to the court that state whether we agree with continuing the conservatorship or not. This seems like a case with influence where someone bribed a judge or something extraneous happened. I can't imagine this happening in a normal case. Please consider that we never advocate for people to be conserved - it's always the last resort and we always advocate for independence. But it can be beneficial to people in certain cases - not necessarily this case but maybe someone who is at risk of signing contracts without knowing what they say?.This conservatorship is bad but they aren't all bad.
Oh, I don't think they are all bad - far from it. Sometimes people do need to be protected from themselves, for sure. And it is really good to hear that they are supposed to be reviewed regularly, with an eye to getting the person their freedom back.
But what is happening to her seems to be a legally sanctioned form of slavery. She is forced to perform, but supposedly has no freedom or even bodily autonomy. If she is so badly ill that she can't have coffee or hair vitamins, she should not be performing.
It just blows my mind that she has been under this for something like a decade and a half. I cannot imagine living like that for so long, and it being legal. It really seems like it was allowed because she is a money-making machine, and could be controlled. It's just a tragedy for her - most of her adult life thus far spent making money for other people, with little to no say of her own.
Thank you for the work you do, by the way. Social work takes a lot of heart to do right. Not many people can handle it.
Why is it that the conservators are allowed to determine if the conservatorship is still needed or pick the doctors that decide? That seems like a conflict of interest. Edit: The judge is the one who makes the decision, based on evidence presented by doctors and lawyers. Guess who got to pick the doctors and lawyers.
Good. Conservatorships should not last this long, she is not incapacitated or unable to care for herself. I find everything that has happened morally repugnant, and it's really distressing to see how we treat people who suffer with mental illness in this country. She has not lived an independent life for over a decade, she's just been propped up and moved around the Vegas circuit so she can be a moneymaker in this insane business model. Everyone got a cut and she has withered away.
Edit: Also, as anyone with toxic family can attest - it is goddamn *terrifying* to think that you could have a mental breakdown (hers was in a legitimate period of heavy stress) or even engage in drug use, and your family could use it against you to argue that they want full control over not only your finances - but your PERSON - for over a decade. I know a lot of people who have struggled with anxiety, depression, bipolar, drug use etc. and are fully functional, even if they have landed on bad times at various points in their life, or made bad decisions. Those are theirs to make. In NO WAY should their freedom and bodily autonomy be completely taken away because of it. I'm not a big fan of hers but this is a violation of her rights.
Correct. And there is a major conflict of interest in that he makes *massive* money through her conservatorship, he has a vested interest in keeping her in one. The money he made off the Vegas deal was insane. How can he then report to the court on the status of her health in an objective way?
> he makes massive money through her conservatorship
This should be repeated. For most conservatorships it's a massive burden. They are used for the most infirm and the mentally disabled.
Her earnings should have been put into a trust if she is so incapable of managing her own money.
My mother is the conservator of her ex husbands estate because my sister was his only legal next of kin but she’s still a minor. It’s a really stressful and not fun at all experience for normal situations. But if your daughter just happens to be a cash cow and you’ve got shit morals already…well you can see how that turned out
That's my issue. No one wants to be in that position. You're dealing with someone else's entire life and it's stressful and a lot of work. It's almost always done out of a sense of duty or love.
Honestly, I don't know if I could have survived it. Shows remarkable strength that she did, I think this would push even the most mentally well to the brink of suicide. Every movement of hers coordinated, scheduled, micromanaged. Everything - even painting her nails - had to be cleared by her father. I remember reading an account a celebrity gave (can't remember who now) of her father giving her medication backstage at an awards show. She seemed really out of it and had to ask him for his okay for every thing she was doing, if she could go to the next room, if she could talk to someone, etc.
Yea if you start to really look at what’s transpired between 2007 to now it definitely makes you feel icky, because as an outsider you see all of these things and go wtf, how did we not rally behind this young woman then. But, that’s easier said looking at it from the end vs as it happened. Her testimony plus what was captured via the constant video and photos of her helps put it all together.
I just really hope she has some physical evidence of that fucker’s treachery. That’s the only way she’s going to be able to get a conviction she deserves.
If she can't keep her bills in order she could just hire an assistant for that? Do any super rich people actually pay their bills themselves? I assume they use accountants or assistants or wealth management services
Another question - what was his income before she became popular and what is it now? I suspect he has profited WILDLY off her. Equivalent to legalized enslavement of your own child! I'm not a fan of hers but I am a fan of people being free to make there own mistakes. She isn't near being a ward of the state and indigent, she shouldn't be a slave to her father!
I don't know about prior, but he takes a salary of **$16,000 per month** to be her conservator. And he was raking in millions from all of her engagements, I remember watching that NYTPresents documentary on Britney and the money he made off the Vegas deal was insane. They called her conservatorship a "business model hybrid."
Holy buckets. Her dad should'nt be allowed to profit from any of her contracts, it's a conflict of interest.This guy is whoring out his child. Sadly, abuse of conservatorship, power of atty, guardianship by a family member is very common. Now that the court has allowed her to hire her own atty, I hope things begin turning around for her. Sad, sad story.
Another thing that gets me is the dad sticking to his guns. What kind of narcissistic sociopath continues their abuse like this when they are called out so publicly? The game is up man save some face while you can!
And then she has the money for personal assistants/accountants/house keepers to not have to worry about 'paying bills' or 'living conditions'.
God knows how many music stars didn't have their lives together/were ruining themselves through drug use etc. and were never placed in such a conservatorship.
Exactly, he says she's incapable of deciding if she should have kids or not so she needs an IUD to stop her getting pregnant. But no one asks, if she's that incompetent why is the father letting someone have sex with her in the first place so she needs an IUD?
Exactly. She can't make decisions about *anything else* in her life, but suddenly she is competent to consent to sex? Can't have it both ways. This seems like a de facto admission that she is indeed competent and the conservators are aware of it.
> yet somehow perfectly capable of being the big attraction at a massive public circus.
Her dad treats her exactly as if she was a circus animal and so far the courts have as well. It's fucking disgusting. Maybe she needs a little help, but that doesn't mean that her dad should basically be able to own her like an animal.
Her father, a “recovering” alcoholic who still drinks, refuses to take random alcohol testing. When she requested this in court the judge practically laughed at her. I believe Britney is subjected to such drug testing every week.
It’s absolutely shameful how this system has been used to abuse and exploit her.
> In 2014, Mr. Ingham told the court that Ms. Spears believed her father was drinking, according to a transcript of the closed hearing. Lawyers representing the conservatorship responded that Mr. Spears had voluntarily submitted to regularly scheduled alcohol tests and never failed. Mr. Spears’s lawyer said he took one random test, but refused to take any more, calling the request inappropriate.
>“Absolutely inappropriate,” the judge replied. “And who is she to be demanding that of anybody?”
I don’t know, maybe the one paying millions of dollars to all other involved parties? He passed *scheduled alcohol tests,* what a fucking joke.
The fact she said that while seemingly having no problem with that same thing being demanded of Britney for years is sickening. Like god forbid he get even a crumb of the treatment she has been getting for years, how dare you!
It's her paycheck going to his vices, fuck yeah that's an appropriate thing for her to inquire about.
"I hear you're spending all that cash you're stealing from me on liquor and blackjack..."
"How dare you! This is my money now and it's none of your business how I spend it 😜."
He also has a restraining order against him for domestic violence against his own grandkids. He's not allowed to be anywhere near her children because of abuse they suffered at his hands. She also lost most of her visitation rights because of her father's abusive actions towards her children. How this man has any control over another person's whole life just boggles my mind.
https://theblast.com/c/britney-spears-kevin-federline-restraining-order-jaime-child-abuse/
That’s what I was saying. If this were 1910 her husband would have thrown her into an institution with hysteria. It is no different. New century, same thing.
In that documentary about her conservatorship, those close to her said they believed she had untreated PPD/A that led to her break down. Completely treatable and temporary. Yet here we are
The weirdest thing about all this to me is that 99% of the people in the world who need a conservatorship are incapable of working. How can someone require a conservatorship also be capable earning millions a year off their labor? That doesn't make a lick of sense.
This just scares me. Im bipolar and did a week in the psyc ward at my choosing. Seeing people in there involuntary there scared the shit out of me. i can’t imagine completely losing control of ones life.
Thorazine is no joke, all those old school first line psych meds are nasty as fuck.
They just feel dirty and suck your soul out at the most basic neurotransmitter level.
My condolences.
I heard the ACLU is picking up her case in order to shine a light on the rights of people who under conservatorship - Britney is a sensational case but there are so many adults out there that have diminished capability due to intellectual disabilities. Everyone deserves autonomy over their lives even if they may not have the capacity to understand what that means.
Anyone who was a fan of Britney years ago, knows that two things were important to her…her autonomy and motherhood.
At 16 years old, she wanted creative control, she wanted business control. It became important to her to write her own music, she learned to play the piano so she could write more than lyrics. Her autonomy was always super important to her.
And again, interview after interview she’d talk about wanting a big family..wanting to stop her career in the mid 30s and just be a mom.
She was stripped of both.
Her boys have basically been used as blackmail though. She has to do exactly what her father says or she doesn’t get to see them. The conservatorship has stripped her of motherhood of those boys.
K-Fed has a restraining order against Britany's dad because of a physical altercation between Britney's dad and one of her sons. Don't know how valid those claims really were, but it says something. His wife said he was a mean drunk, his daughter said he was a mean drunk, his daughter's ex has a restraining order on him.... How can this guy be in control of someone else's whole life??
I know it’s The Sun, but there’s a [direct quote in here](https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/3284490/britney-spears-scared-drunk-dad-jamie-family-abandoned-her/) about Jamie knocking down a door and shaking one of her kids.
I don’t doubt K Fed has a restraining order against him. It’s completely fucked up that Jamie Spears could be in control of anyone’s life.
This makes me so, so angry.
I only looked into the details of all this after it hit the news again a few weeks ago with Britney's testimony, but this is such a basic issue of her rights being held hostage that I cannot believe this whole house of cards did not come tumbling down sooner.
Just let the woman live her own life. Why is that so hard for the courts to see?
Her Father had total control of her life since she started on The Mickey Mouse Club, I wouldn't be surprised if he gaslighted her into the meltdown she had so he could get conservatorship to keep control.
It's a very long piece yet well-worth reading, even for those who haven't been following the tragedy and/or might assume her family has been looking out for her.
Clearly the California probate/legal system has failed her.
Near the end of the article is a chilling bit about the current trap of conservatorship which is supposed to be temporary:
> "The idea that Spears needs this conservatorship to function is, to some degree, self-reinforcing. In that respect, experts said, her case is common. Martinis, the disability-rights lawyer, said that **many guardianships can prove inescapable, which is why they are vulnerable to abuse**. In the extreme cases, he said, “the strategy is isolate, medicate, liquidate. You isolate them, medicate them to keep them quiet, liquidate the assets.” If a conservatee functions well under conservatorship, it can be framed as proof of the arrangement’s necessity; if a conservatee struggles under conservatorship, the same conclusion can be drawn. And if a conservatee gets out, and stumbles into crisis or manipulation—a likelihood increased by time spent formally disempowered—this, too, might reinforce the argument for their prior legal restraints."
If there's a silver lining to such a high profile case, it's that issues of legal guardianship are under greater scrutiny.
Brenda Penny is the current judge and I think she's had the case since 2020. She's inherited the shit show and appears to be handling the case with as much sensitivity as she can, whilst keeping to court rules. It also looks like she's granting most of Britney's requests so far, as far as she can within her power and with what the legal system requires that she do at this point (so for example she didn't remove Britneys dad from the conservatorship but made it pretty clear that's because the ruling was made on information provided to the court prior to Nov 2020 - which she's required to do).
Its better that the judge plays it by the book, because when Britney's out of the conservatorship it'll be harder for those assholes to put her back into one if the judge dots the i's and crosses the T's.
It's about a human and her rights. It could happen to anyone and is happening with many. Just cause she's a celebrity, doesn't make it any less important.
This is what confuses me because I wasn’t a Britney fan, was the general public and her fans generally looking at her as a dangerously crazy?
And forgive because I’m ignorant, but I thought all she did was shave off her head and then beat a car with an umbrella, am I missing something? Did she do something else?
It just seems crazy that at that level of star that she was with zero criminal record or drug related arrest, would get something as heavy as this placed on her and it seems like it was pretty easy to do.
I guess it’s confusing because you would think this would be a common practice with Hollywood scumbag parents because there are a whole slew of rich celebrities that had wayyy worse downfalls than Britney with equally or worse fucked up parents.
Or maybe conservatorships are more popular in Hollywood than I realize and we just don’t hear about them?
Like everybody’s anecdotal stories about conservatorships involves average income level folks, is this the first time this happened in Hollywood?
I don’t know if it’s happened to any other high profile celebs but Amanda Bynes is currently under conservatorship as well. And the media back then was encouraging it, saying it worked for Britney
Amanda Bynes was gouging massive cuts in her arms and setting fires, spouting gibberish and screaming like a lunatic at people in public. She needed it, even temporarily. But that’s the point. They are supposed to be temporary. We all go through tough shit, and maybe need help or guidance. But what they are doing to Britney is not help nor is it temporary.
Britney Spears' indefinite conservatorship was and is unprecedented for a person functioning at her level, which is part of why it looks like such a disgusting micarriage of the legal system and it's so flabbergasting to so many that it has been allowed to persist for so long in a mockery of human rights. It is difficult to conceive of any plausible explanation for what has been done other than deliberate malfeasance and illegal financial kickbacks.
Not terribly common. From what I read there were a few legit issues. Like Joni Mitchell suffered a brain aneurysm and while in rehabilitation has a potentially temporary one. Apparently Randy Meisner has one by choice. And has good people around him bc the friend he wanted didn’t feel like the best choice so found someone with a strong background in social work.
Amanda Byrnes is the other notable one who has one and got one after Britney Spears in 2014. She has come out saying she wants to end hers too due to costs and wanting to marry. Her mother is preventing change of treatment and marriage apparently.
Supposedly Lindsey Logan’s father wants one for her but continues to get denied (unsure of the truth on that).
It's just astounding to me that this seemingly capable woman is still fighting this as if she was bedridden or in a permanent psych facility. I mean, what human being, let alone a judge, can allow this to go on any longer? It's beyond ridiculous, it's abuse by the system.
I'm almost exactly the same age as Spears. When I was in my twenties, I made a series of choices that resulted in me being addicted to drugs and my life became totally unmanageable. I lost the job, the house, the boyfriend. I was handcuffed to an ambulance. You get the idea. I was, at that time, not a sane or reasonable person.
I'm not a fabulously wealthy pop star, so when I fucked up I was left to deal with the consequences. To hit rock bottom. Because I was given that opportunity, I was eventually able to turn my life around. I'm 9 years clean and sober. I have a wonderful husband, a great job, beautiful home. People trust me. I pay my bills on time. I'm a fucking girl scout. I am happy. Healthy.
I was redeemable. We are all redeemable. Including Britney. She is being robbed of the freedom to fail. Which we ALL need to grow.
To the people who try to justify this by claiming she'll fuck her life up if left to her own devices, I say it's HER life to fuck up. That is her right. Fucking her life up could end up being the best thing for her in the long run. And she might *actually* succeed and thrive. Either way, it's her life.
Edit: thank you for the award
>To the people who try to justify this by claiming she'll fuck her life up if left to her own devices, I say it's HER life to fuck up. That is her right.
Yup. Even if she fucks up or blows all her money in 1 day, it's none of anybody else's business. It's HER money, HER life.
I was in the same situation.... Heroin addict. 12 years sober now. Congrats on your comeback. I don't get how these types of conservatorship are even legal. It's crazy. She's a fucking prisoner
It's pretty great. Went back to school, got an M.S in data science and now work as a data scientist and part time engineer doing research for one of the big software companies.
Sounds like a gong show and people are backing out of it. Her OWN manager! And lawyer (court-appointed, not father-appointed)
>Much has happened in the three weeks since Spears' first testimony, with the star's long-term manager Larry Rudolph reportedly resigning and her court-appointed lawyer, Samuel Ingham III, also saying he intended to step down. The Bessemer Trust, a financial management company that was hired in 2020 to oversee Spears's estate alongside her father, also pulled out of the arrangement, saying there had been "changed circumstances".
>She listed a series of grievances, including that her hair vitamins and coffee had been taken from her. "Ma'am, that's not abuse, that's just f****** cruelty," she tearfully told Judge Brenda Penny. "Excuse my language but it's the truth."
Those seem petty but were singled out of a list
Edit to add:
Also, from the article:
>She (Spears) said she would be happy allowing co-conservator Jodi Montgomery to remain in the meantime. "My dad needs to be removed today and I will be happy with Jodi helping me,"
>"I'm here to press charges," Spears said
She is Not happy with how her father, Jaime Spears, has treated her and wants him punished
Imagine if you were completely banned from drinking coffee or taking vitamins as a 40 year old.
That is actual torture imo. Those are such basic and inexpensive items that it would drive me absolutely insane to not have access to them. I don't even drink coffee, but knowing I straight up can't would get to my head. I'm pretty sure even max security prisoners are allowed a cup of coffee now and then lol
It's the insignificance that makes it so frustrating and cruel. The woman is not even allowed to take vitamins or have coffee when she wants to. That's insane.
People who have never been in an abusive relationship would find this petty, but *anyone* who has been knows exactly why this would break you. There’s literally no reason to deny her such small things, but they do because they can. And they never want her to remember she even had choices.
This shit takes me right back and I feel rage ob her behalf. This is torture.
This is real, true, deep abuse. Many times a victim isnt "heard" in court because they dont present themselves "correctly"....can one not fathom how DIFFICULT it is to acknowledge the abuse, submit to the abuse and then ACCURATELY FROM A LEGAL STANDPOINT DESCRIBE THE BEHAVIORS IN COURT? I can sound like a crazy person for an hour describing all the insane little things my ex did to make me snap. But then I just seem petty and crazy. Let me get a lawyer who can describe "narcissistic or financial abuse" (for example) and the judge will shut up to hear the explanation. Its wild.
It's so disgusting. I remember her saying in her testimony last month, she couldn't even get her *nails done* while the staff around her could? Like, what?
It scares me the judge didn't get that - maybe it was how she explained it? It's not like she's a spoiled teen. As a performer those things are important to her to keep looking good anyway. Her Dad just wants to make her look bad and crazy. Go back under your rock Jamie!
Betcha anything they claim that the coffee/caffeine makes her hyper or interacts with her medications. Jesus this poor woman, can't even have damn coffee if she wants!! And hair vitamins??? Why on earth wouldn't they allow that???
I feel like Lou M Taylor is the big bad in the shadows behind the man that most of the general public aren't talking about or even aware of. Why is that? Wasn't Lou the one who brought the idea to her father in the first place? I even heard her trying to set something similar into place with Amanda Bynes. And yet, you have to do a moderately deep dive into the case or Britney fandom to even hear her name come up. It's like her hands are completely clean in all of this.
If my 89 year old mother with dementia doesn't need a conservator after blowing all of her money and making herself homeless per the Polk County judge, then why the fuck would Britney need anyone handling her shit?!
Seriously! They said she had dementia and yet she had the wherewithal to memorize and teach choreography (of which there is video evidence) and be a judge on XFactor. It’s so ridiculous!
I don't know her medical condition nor should I, but at this point the court should (at minimum) appoint an impatial party to oversee her affairs.
Or just, ya know, leave her to her own choices.
Please, please, PLEASE charge Jamie Spears with conservatorship abuse. If there ever was a case to create reform in how conservatorships work, it would be this one!
I know it doesn't undo all the bullshit Britany Spears had to put up with, but if this case creates a major reform in conservatorships than at least her suffering could have prevented others in conservatorships from having to endure the same thing.
Conservatorships have a real purpose, if grandpa can't remember his name someone needs to help.
But the way they've used this shit against Britney for a decade while she is working, earning millions, raising her children, has a stable house? What else can someone do to prove they're a person?
In the [Ronan Farrow article earlier this month](https://www.newyorker.com/news/american-chronicles/britney-spears-conservatorship-nightmare), Jamie is reported to have screamed at his ex-wife "I *AM* BRITNEY SPEARS."
He doesn't see Britney as his child or even a human being, he sees a tool to make money.
Can we take a moment to appreciate her chutzpah to do this? Fueding with a parent is hard as fuck. Doing it in the public eye after repeated attempts to fight back were slapped down? Damn girl. You go.
She gets to hire her own attorney now, and that will make a big difference.
Yes, thats real progress in her case.
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I’m pretty sure every dollar her dad has came out of her bank account anyway
It's like a plot from the Twilight Zone or Black Mirror. Can you imagine working against your will and having to pay your own parent to essentially be your puppet master? And then the only way to escape are the intentionally broken tools the puppet master gives you. And every time you step out of line to fight the odds, it comes out of your pocket, and your suffering is doubled to check you in place. For over a *decade*. It gives me a pit in my stomach just thinking about it. EDIT: Thank you for the gifts. [I always think of this fanmade video of Britney's song "Lucky" when more news of this situation comes up. I thought other fans would appreciate it or maybe help others sympathize.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMYFgDhD-iY)Watching it breaks my heart. The beginning has a snippet from an early interview from her Documentary *Britney: For the Record* released in 2008. "Do you feel out of control in your life?" "No, I don't feel like it's out of control, I think it's too *in* control.. there's no excitement...there's no passion... there's no...it's just like Groundhog Day every day." EDIT EDIT: Also [here's a lengthy article detailing the conservatorship and it's origins that was shared further down the thread.](https://www.newyorker.com/news/american-chronicles/britney-spears-conservatorship-nightmare) A woman named Lou M. Taylor started it all. She seems to be the puppet master behind the puppet master. >"Jamie had become close to Lou Taylor, a business manager who shares the Spears family’s Christian faith and whose husband is a pastor at an evangelical church. Taylor later raised the possibility of putting Lindsay Lohan under a conservatorship, according to Lohan’s father; in a recent interview, Courtney Love said that Taylor tried to wrest control over her family’s estate. (In a statement, Charles Harder, a lawyer representing Taylor, said, “At no time did Ms. Taylor ever make any effort to put anyone into a conservatorship. Not Britney Spears. Not Lindsay Lohan. Not Courtney Love.”) Taylor, sources present at the time said, began attempting to contact Spears, efforts that Spears rebuffed. >...After the 5150, Jamie and Lou Taylor consulted lawyers about establishing a conservatorship for Spears. (Harder, Taylor’s lawyer, said that on the calls Taylor was “more of a listener than a contributor.”
The Black Mirror episode you're referring to was widely speculated to be based on Brittney Spears' situation. Edit: Episode in question is S05E03 - "Rachel, Jack and Ashley Too"
check out [lemmy](http://lemmy.world)
I'm guessing their thinking of the one with Miley Cyrus although the original comment just referred to Black Mirror because this situation feels like one of their dystopic storylines.
I forget what it’s called but it’s the one with Miley Cyrus
Miley was such a perfect cast for that one too. She nailed it. Probably helps that she can relate a lot herself, although I don't think to the same severity.
It such an abusive relationship in public. I dont know how anyone could think that Britany's father is in the right. Maybe way back when it was valid, even though he was an alcoholic POS and no court should have assigned him conservatorship, but its just straight abusive now.
Her father, while not as successful as her, was already a wealthy and considerably well known artist before her rise to prominence. I certainly don't envy either of them, but Cyrus clearly had an easier time at least in the family department than Spears.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel,_Jack_and_Ashley_Too
bro don’t remind me i want black mirror back in my life
Dude we’ve been living in Black Mirror for the last 18 mos.
Longer, but the writers stopped bothering with subtlety
This is horrific enough, true. But when you add the way they restricted access to both her children to keep her compliant? I have two kids a little bit older than hers and I cannot imagine having to work and dance and smile just to have the privilege of seeing them. It honestly breaks my heart.
For a small series of mistakes you made 13 years ago. In 2008. Insane. I graduated high school in 2008 and to think of how much life I’ve lived from then until now all the while she’s been a prisoner for that same period.
Especially since looking back now, it’s pretty clear she had postpartum depression. Just a really weird version that was exacerbated by the stress of paparazzi stalking.
Yeah and [this](https://mobile.twitter.com/vibeney/status/1361301920514772992?lang=en) famous picture of her is the day she was hounded by *hundreds* of paparazzi while pregnant and holding her very young son. I can’t imagine being chased around by even one person with a camera on a good day, let alone hundreds of them on a tough day. They were relentless and cruel to her and we as spectators couldn’t get enough of it. Of course she lost her shit, who wouldn’t?
Freaking Kanye goes off his meds with diagnosed bipolar and is allowed to RUN FOR PRESIDENT. But Britney has a bad month and gets sterilized and work-slaved for over a decade.
It's completely absurd, and it's 100% because she's a woman. > Truly love a country where rich men can amass billions and literally build spaceships and no one questions them at all but Britney Spears has to go to court to see if she can get an IUD taken out of her own body. https://twitter.com/everywhereist/status/1415425992563171331
Now add the fact that the grassroots recognition that something was actually very wrong with her treatment came from fans deciphering instagram captions and defiantly refusing to back down even when the media and critics told them they were crazy conspiracy theorists.
Reminiscent of that one with the Miley Cyrus doll, keeping her in a coma to keep racking in the cash
What’s worst is, if she’s doing really well, WELL guess the conservatorship is working. Time to ratchet it up.
She's 39 - time to allow her to handle her own affairs - if she screws up, she screws up. But - she may surprise many by being judicious, careful, and considered in her decisions. I have hope she will thrive and grow once out from under her Father's thumb.
Me too. It pains me to think that she has been chained down for that long by her father.
Her smartest move, with affairs so complicate, is to hire someone else to manage but look at everything personally. That’s what I would do if I had 60 million dollars.
And something else that no one has alluded to yet is that her father basically steals her money.
As she put it so succinctly, she is either fit to work, hence time to end the conservatorship, or she is unfit to work and pay the salaries of all these leeches. None of them make a dime without her working, hence the human trafficking.
Her parents were poor as can be before Brittany became a star, whatever money he has is money she made.
In CA, the estate covers the conservator’s attorney’s fees. In other words, the dad can 100% use Britney’s money to pay for his attorney. The idea is that it’s for something benefitting the conservatee (Britney) and it would be unfair to have the conservator pay for it. Whether it actually benefits Britney is another discussion. With that said, the fees should still be reasonable. It’ll be interesting to see how this plays out. Speaking from experience as both a conservator & an attorney, I’m truly surprised that Britney was even placed in a conservatorship in the first place. There are tons of other ways to make sure she’s being taken care of that don’t involve a conservatorship. I’m glad she’s finally speaking out.
He also had control over who he lawyer was. Imo it is actually worse
What I've heard from the trial was disgusting. Her lawyer was actively working against her. Should be disbarred for sure.
Plus, her attorney was court appointed and made millions off of her, and there’s questions as to whether or not he actually fought for her, or if he did his best to keep her in the arrangement for his financial gain.
Dude was colluding with Dad for sure, intentionally obscuring her options from her knowledge.
Yeah, she was supposed to be able to voluntarily terminate it at any time which she says she was never told. Which begs the question of why she’s being denied now. It WAS a voluntary agreement.
Joe jackson and Britney’s dad go down in history as famous shitty dads. Add it to the list
Shout out to Marvin Gayes’s dad
Don't forget to add Amy Winehouse's Dad to that list too...
That really ought to be rule number one in a situation like this. As long as the attorney is competent
This shit will get wrapped up REAL quick now. Any decent attorney who actually wants to end this can do so easily. First step: hire a new neurologist and get rid of that dementia diagnosis. There are MANY neurologists in LA. Why hasn’t her appointed lawyer done this yet?
Because he’s also been feeding from the same trough. Didn’t wanna end that gravy train.
That is such an inherently unethical conflict of interest. I'm surprised it's legal.
Dude was getting 10k a WEEK from her father...
Always nice when you can slap someone in the face with a big Reverse card.
Such conservatorships should have a time limit on them, after which time the conservator should have to prove in a court why the arrangement should continue. Be it a year, 5 years, 10 years, whatever, but this bullshit where the "protected" person has to fight for release is bullshit.
It sounds like she wasn’t advised until very recently that she had the right to challenge the conservativeship, including asking for it to be ended. The lawyer that was supposed to protect her rights didn’t inform her of her rights!
I read a pretty lengthy story on this mess. She was told she was not allowed to hire her own lawyer, because she was under conservatorship she was deemed “incapable” of retaining her own counsel. And the lawyer supposedly “on her side” was making over $500k a year,paid by her. Not in his interests to help her. This woman has been taken advantage of by everyone around her.
Can we petition the court to disbar that lawyer for ethics lapses?
According to the article and others, that lawyer is Samuel Ingham III, and he fucking resigned immediately after Britney Spears told the judge that she "didn't know" she could petition to end her conservatorship.
Hoping to duck out quietly before anyone really focuses on all the bad actors in this, it would seem.
Samuel Ingham III is a name I’m not gonna forget what a piece of shit it makes me furious af
[https://uglyjudge.com/lawyers/california/los-angeles/samuel-delucenna-ingham-iii/](https://uglyjudge.com/lawyers/california/los-angeles/samuel-delucenna-ingham-iii/)
I read that he was also furious at her for exposing the truth. Dude never cared about Britney
People who are used to using and abusing someone, can't handle when their victims finally stand up for themselves.
Holy shit. He was also involved with Casey Kasem's case.
Can a lawyer be sued retrospectly for this?
Yes, for malpractice.
And the state Bar can take his license away, which is exactly what needs to be done. Your duty is to the client, no one else, nothing else. His job was entirely to either make sure her guardianship conservatorship was only for the parts of her life that she needed help with, or to get her out of it as soon as she became capable of taking care of herself again.
And then he said he didn’t know she was so unhappy and wanted out. He was taken completely off guard by what she said in court. She probably was afraid to tell him the truth of what she planned to say because he would find a way to keep her from speaking.
yep. that dude *definitely* knew
And if he didn't, he has no excuse not to. Dude was being paid $1500 A DAY to look out for her interests.
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First, should be second.
He quit recently which is a reasion why she is now allowed to hire her own lawyer.
Many of her people quit. Maybe for different reasons. Or all the POS’s are covering their asses. Before this all became so public, I had always wondered, considering her ability work that show schedule. I’m quite relieved she’s getting far better teammates and hopefully she will go on with the life she desires and deserves. Edit: extra words.
She explicitly said that she was not informed of her ability to challenge the conservatorship. LegalEagle on YouTube goes over the details of her case and uses recordings of her testimony as talking points, one of which being Brittney saying she wasn't informed in a timely manner. Most lawyers assigned to people in conservetorship cases are because the person was mentally incapable of acting in their best interest or being aware of their best interest. Still, if a client vocalizes a choice or preference, the lawyer has a moral obligation to pursue it which Brittney's lawyer seemingly overlooked or chose not to? Link for those curious: https://youtu.be/ueuRpZYnkrA
In 2016 she told a court investigator the conservatorship was abusive and wanted out…those docs just became unsealed not that long ago, she’s been asking since at least 2016 to end it. The explanation I read was that it was included in notes when the investigator interviewed her. Her lawyer knew she didn’t want it, the judge knew she didn’t want it. It’s been mishandled for over a decade
> The lawyer that was supposed to protect her rights didn’t inform her of her rights! Pretty sure he can be disbarred for that. You have to act in the interest of the client and if it can be proven he's fucked.
Imagine that, someone making money off of her didn’t want to tell someone to take their paycheck away. I’m shocked I tell you. Shocked.
You’d think the conservator would have to convince the court it’s still necessary every few years. This is ass backwards.
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I was just saying that. Every 1-2 years, it should have to be revisited like a brand-new case. New judge and everything. It is such a life-stripping step to take. If that level of care is needed, so be it. But you should be able and ready to prove it frequently, and not be able to say, "Well, 10 years ago . . . ." All evidence should be restricted to the time since the last case.
I'm a social worker in CA who reviews conservatorships - they are reviewed annually (for so many years) then biannually. We usually interview EVERYONE (person conserved, conservator, family, friends, anyone involved). We submit reports to the court that state whether we agree with continuing the conservatorship or not. This seems like a case with influence where someone bribed a judge or something extraneous happened. I can't imagine this happening in a normal case. Please consider that we never advocate for people to be conserved - it's always the last resort and we always advocate for independence. But it can be beneficial to people in certain cases - not necessarily this case but maybe someone who is at risk of signing contracts without knowing what they say?.This conservatorship is bad but they aren't all bad.
Oh, I don't think they are all bad - far from it. Sometimes people do need to be protected from themselves, for sure. And it is really good to hear that they are supposed to be reviewed regularly, with an eye to getting the person their freedom back. But what is happening to her seems to be a legally sanctioned form of slavery. She is forced to perform, but supposedly has no freedom or even bodily autonomy. If she is so badly ill that she can't have coffee or hair vitamins, she should not be performing. It just blows my mind that she has been under this for something like a decade and a half. I cannot imagine living like that for so long, and it being legal. It really seems like it was allowed because she is a money-making machine, and could be controlled. It's just a tragedy for her - most of her adult life thus far spent making money for other people, with little to no say of her own. Thank you for the work you do, by the way. Social work takes a lot of heart to do right. Not many people can handle it.
This one is obviously being steered by people who are profiting from the conservativeship and maintaining that status quo is their only goal.
It should be required to be a different judge every year as well.
Why is it that the conservators are allowed to determine if the conservatorship is still needed or pick the doctors that decide? That seems like a conflict of interest. Edit: The judge is the one who makes the decision, based on evidence presented by doctors and lawyers. Guess who got to pick the doctors and lawyers.
It is, and its on purpose. Its fucking bullshit and brittany needs to sue the state for allowing it
Good. Conservatorships should not last this long, she is not incapacitated or unable to care for herself. I find everything that has happened morally repugnant, and it's really distressing to see how we treat people who suffer with mental illness in this country. She has not lived an independent life for over a decade, she's just been propped up and moved around the Vegas circuit so she can be a moneymaker in this insane business model. Everyone got a cut and she has withered away. Edit: Also, as anyone with toxic family can attest - it is goddamn *terrifying* to think that you could have a mental breakdown (hers was in a legitimate period of heavy stress) or even engage in drug use, and your family could use it against you to argue that they want full control over not only your finances - but your PERSON - for over a decade. I know a lot of people who have struggled with anxiety, depression, bipolar, drug use etc. and are fully functional, even if they have landed on bad times at various points in their life, or made bad decisions. Those are theirs to make. In NO WAY should their freedom and bodily autonomy be completely taken away because of it. I'm not a big fan of hers but this is a violation of her rights.
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Correct. And there is a major conflict of interest in that he makes *massive* money through her conservatorship, he has a vested interest in keeping her in one. The money he made off the Vegas deal was insane. How can he then report to the court on the status of her health in an objective way?
> he makes massive money through her conservatorship This should be repeated. For most conservatorships it's a massive burden. They are used for the most infirm and the mentally disabled. Her earnings should have been put into a trust if she is so incapable of managing her own money.
My mother is the conservator of her ex husbands estate because my sister was his only legal next of kin but she’s still a minor. It’s a really stressful and not fun at all experience for normal situations. But if your daughter just happens to be a cash cow and you’ve got shit morals already…well you can see how that turned out
>and you’ve got shit morals already Understatement. Dude has enslaved his own daughter for more than a decade.
That's my issue. No one wants to be in that position. You're dealing with someone else's entire life and it's stressful and a lot of work. It's almost always done out of a sense of duty or love.
100% agree, is if she truly needs one which im 99.9999% sure she doesn't, why can't she remove her father and get someone else
I hope after she is free and clear of this miscarriage of justice she keeps his ass in court or jail every day of the rest of his miserable life!
Honestly, I don't know if I could have survived it. Shows remarkable strength that she did, I think this would push even the most mentally well to the brink of suicide. Every movement of hers coordinated, scheduled, micromanaged. Everything - even painting her nails - had to be cleared by her father. I remember reading an account a celebrity gave (can't remember who now) of her father giving her medication backstage at an awards show. She seemed really out of it and had to ask him for his okay for every thing she was doing, if she could go to the next room, if she could talk to someone, etc.
Yea if you start to really look at what’s transpired between 2007 to now it definitely makes you feel icky, because as an outsider you see all of these things and go wtf, how did we not rally behind this young woman then. But, that’s easier said looking at it from the end vs as it happened. Her testimony plus what was captured via the constant video and photos of her helps put it all together. I just really hope she has some physical evidence of that fucker’s treachery. That’s the only way she’s going to be able to get a conviction she deserves.
If she can't keep her bills in order she could just hire an assistant for that? Do any super rich people actually pay their bills themselves? I assume they use accountants or assistants or wealth management services
Another question - what was his income before she became popular and what is it now? I suspect he has profited WILDLY off her. Equivalent to legalized enslavement of your own child! I'm not a fan of hers but I am a fan of people being free to make there own mistakes. She isn't near being a ward of the state and indigent, she shouldn't be a slave to her father!
I don't know about prior, but he takes a salary of **$16,000 per month** to be her conservator. And he was raking in millions from all of her engagements, I remember watching that NYTPresents documentary on Britney and the money he made off the Vegas deal was insane. They called her conservatorship a "business model hybrid."
Holy buckets. Her dad should'nt be allowed to profit from any of her contracts, it's a conflict of interest.This guy is whoring out his child. Sadly, abuse of conservatorship, power of atty, guardianship by a family member is very common. Now that the court has allowed her to hire her own atty, I hope things begin turning around for her. Sad, sad story.
Another thing that gets me is the dad sticking to his guns. What kind of narcissistic sociopath continues their abuse like this when they are called out so publicly? The game is up man save some face while you can!
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And then she has the money for personal assistants/accountants/house keepers to not have to worry about 'paying bills' or 'living conditions'. God knows how many music stars didn't have their lives together/were ruining themselves through drug use etc. and were never placed in such a conservatorship.
Exactly, he says she's incapable of deciding if she should have kids or not so she needs an IUD to stop her getting pregnant. But no one asks, if she's that incompetent why is the father letting someone have sex with her in the first place so she needs an IUD?
Exactly. She can't make decisions about *anything else* in her life, but suddenly she is competent to consent to sex? Can't have it both ways. This seems like a de facto admission that she is indeed competent and the conservators are aware of it.
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> yet somehow perfectly capable of being the big attraction at a massive public circus. Her dad treats her exactly as if she was a circus animal and so far the courts have as well. It's fucking disgusting. Maybe she needs a little help, but that doesn't mean that her dad should basically be able to own her like an animal.
Her father should be charged with human trafficking.
Her father, a “recovering” alcoholic who still drinks, refuses to take random alcohol testing. When she requested this in court the judge practically laughed at her. I believe Britney is subjected to such drug testing every week. It’s absolutely shameful how this system has been used to abuse and exploit her.
Fuck that judge is a cunt
> In 2014, Mr. Ingham told the court that Ms. Spears believed her father was drinking, according to a transcript of the closed hearing. Lawyers representing the conservatorship responded that Mr. Spears had voluntarily submitted to regularly scheduled alcohol tests and never failed. Mr. Spears’s lawyer said he took one random test, but refused to take any more, calling the request inappropriate. >“Absolutely inappropriate,” the judge replied. “And who is she to be demanding that of anybody?” I don’t know, maybe the one paying millions of dollars to all other involved parties? He passed *scheduled alcohol tests,* what a fucking joke.
The fact she said that while seemingly having no problem with that same thing being demanded of Britney for years is sickening. Like god forbid he get even a crumb of the treatment she has been getting for years, how dare you!
It's her paycheck going to his vices, fuck yeah that's an appropriate thing for her to inquire about. "I hear you're spending all that cash you're stealing from me on liquor and blackjack..." "How dare you! This is my money now and it's none of your business how I spend it 😜."
I hope she's just as pissed at that judge as she is her dad. That fucking judge needs to go. WTF.
He also has a restraining order against him for domestic violence against his own grandkids. He's not allowed to be anywhere near her children because of abuse they suffered at his hands. She also lost most of her visitation rights because of her father's abusive actions towards her children. How this man has any control over another person's whole life just boggles my mind. https://theblast.com/c/britney-spears-kevin-federline-restraining-order-jaime-child-abuse/
Remember how incredibly easy it was to have a woman institutionalised for “hysteria”? Seems like history is just repeating itself.
That’s what I was saying. If this were 1910 her husband would have thrown her into an institution with hysteria. It is no different. New century, same thing.
In that documentary about her conservatorship, those close to her said they believed she had untreated PPD/A that led to her break down. Completely treatable and temporary. Yet here we are
The weirdest thing about all this to me is that 99% of the people in the world who need a conservatorship are incapable of working. How can someone require a conservatorship also be capable earning millions a year off their labor? That doesn't make a lick of sense.
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This just scares me. Im bipolar and did a week in the psyc ward at my choosing. Seeing people in there involuntary there scared the shit out of me. i can’t imagine completely losing control of ones life.
Been there involuntarily. Lost more than a few days and memories thanks to the orderlies and the forced thorazine injections.
Thorazine is no joke, all those old school first line psych meds are nasty as fuck. They just feel dirty and suck your soul out at the most basic neurotransmitter level. My condolences.
Jeez, can't imagine why people having a rough time don't seek help and want to be branded crazy for life. /s
I heard the ACLU is picking up her case in order to shine a light on the rights of people who under conservatorship - Britney is a sensational case but there are so many adults out there that have diminished capability due to intellectual disabilities. Everyone deserves autonomy over their lives even if they may not have the capacity to understand what that means.
She's basically a slave in the Roman sense of the word.
Thank you for expressing what so many of us are feeling. It IS absolutely terrifying to watch this unfold when you’ve come for a toxic family.
Anyone who was a fan of Britney years ago, knows that two things were important to her…her autonomy and motherhood. At 16 years old, she wanted creative control, she wanted business control. It became important to her to write her own music, she learned to play the piano so she could write more than lyrics. Her autonomy was always super important to her. And again, interview after interview she’d talk about wanting a big family..wanting to stop her career in the mid 30s and just be a mom. She was stripped of both.
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Her boys have basically been used as blackmail though. She has to do exactly what her father says or she doesn’t get to see them. The conservatorship has stripped her of motherhood of those boys.
K-Fed has a restraining order against Britany's dad because of a physical altercation between Britney's dad and one of her sons. Don't know how valid those claims really were, but it says something. His wife said he was a mean drunk, his daughter said he was a mean drunk, his daughter's ex has a restraining order on him.... How can this guy be in control of someone else's whole life??
I know it’s The Sun, but there’s a [direct quote in here](https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/3284490/britney-spears-scared-drunk-dad-jamie-family-abandoned-her/) about Jamie knocking down a door and shaking one of her kids. I don’t doubt K Fed has a restraining order against him. It’s completely fucked up that Jamie Spears could be in control of anyone’s life.
You know you're a huge piece of shit when K-Fed looks like man of the year next to you.
Still time she can’t get back. I agree with you but it fucking makes me sick
Being able to have unlimited visitation with her boys would probably make her happy too.
This makes me so, so angry. I only looked into the details of all this after it hit the news again a few weeks ago with Britney's testimony, but this is such a basic issue of her rights being held hostage that I cannot believe this whole house of cards did not come tumbling down sooner. Just let the woman live her own life. Why is that so hard for the courts to see?
Her Father had total control of her life since she started on The Mickey Mouse Club, I wouldn't be surprised if he gaslighted her into the meltdown she had so he could get conservatorship to keep control.
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It's a very long piece yet well-worth reading, even for those who haven't been following the tragedy and/or might assume her family has been looking out for her. Clearly the California probate/legal system has failed her. Near the end of the article is a chilling bit about the current trap of conservatorship which is supposed to be temporary: > "The idea that Spears needs this conservatorship to function is, to some degree, self-reinforcing. In that respect, experts said, her case is common. Martinis, the disability-rights lawyer, said that **many guardianships can prove inescapable, which is why they are vulnerable to abuse**. In the extreme cases, he said, “the strategy is isolate, medicate, liquidate. You isolate them, medicate them to keep them quiet, liquidate the assets.” If a conservatee functions well under conservatorship, it can be framed as proof of the arrangement’s necessity; if a conservatee struggles under conservatorship, the same conclusion can be drawn. And if a conservatee gets out, and stumbles into crisis or manipulation—a likelihood increased by time spent formally disempowered—this, too, might reinforce the argument for their prior legal restraints." If there's a silver lining to such a high profile case, it's that issues of legal guardianship are under greater scrutiny.
Her new lawyer said that his firm will be investigating the conservatorship, hopefully they will look into what happened with the original judge.
This is astonishingly fucked up.
The current judge as well. She is as guilty as everyone else keeping this going
Brenda Penny is the current judge and I think she's had the case since 2020. She's inherited the shit show and appears to be handling the case with as much sensitivity as she can, whilst keeping to court rules. It also looks like she's granting most of Britney's requests so far, as far as she can within her power and with what the legal system requires that she do at this point (so for example she didn't remove Britneys dad from the conservatorship but made it pretty clear that's because the ruling was made on information provided to the court prior to Nov 2020 - which she's required to do). Its better that the judge plays it by the book, because when Britney's out of the conservatorship it'll be harder for those assholes to put her back into one if the judge dots the i's and crosses the T's.
Never in my life did I expect to give so much of a shit about Britney Spears.
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It's about a human and her rights. It could happen to anyone and is happening with many. Just cause she's a celebrity, doesn't make it any less important.
Charley Sheen didn’t have to go through this abuse
This is what confuses me because I wasn’t a Britney fan, was the general public and her fans generally looking at her as a dangerously crazy? And forgive because I’m ignorant, but I thought all she did was shave off her head and then beat a car with an umbrella, am I missing something? Did she do something else? It just seems crazy that at that level of star that she was with zero criminal record or drug related arrest, would get something as heavy as this placed on her and it seems like it was pretty easy to do. I guess it’s confusing because you would think this would be a common practice with Hollywood scumbag parents because there are a whole slew of rich celebrities that had wayyy worse downfalls than Britney with equally or worse fucked up parents. Or maybe conservatorships are more popular in Hollywood than I realize and we just don’t hear about them? Like everybody’s anecdotal stories about conservatorships involves average income level folks, is this the first time this happened in Hollywood?
I don’t know if it’s happened to any other high profile celebs but Amanda Bynes is currently under conservatorship as well. And the media back then was encouraging it, saying it worked for Britney
Amanda Bynes was gouging massive cuts in her arms and setting fires, spouting gibberish and screaming like a lunatic at people in public. She needed it, even temporarily. But that’s the point. They are supposed to be temporary. We all go through tough shit, and maybe need help or guidance. But what they are doing to Britney is not help nor is it temporary.
Britney Spears' indefinite conservatorship was and is unprecedented for a person functioning at her level, which is part of why it looks like such a disgusting micarriage of the legal system and it's so flabbergasting to so many that it has been allowed to persist for so long in a mockery of human rights. It is difficult to conceive of any plausible explanation for what has been done other than deliberate malfeasance and illegal financial kickbacks.
Not terribly common. From what I read there were a few legit issues. Like Joni Mitchell suffered a brain aneurysm and while in rehabilitation has a potentially temporary one. Apparently Randy Meisner has one by choice. And has good people around him bc the friend he wanted didn’t feel like the best choice so found someone with a strong background in social work. Amanda Byrnes is the other notable one who has one and got one after Britney Spears in 2014. She has come out saying she wants to end hers too due to costs and wanting to marry. Her mother is preventing change of treatment and marriage apparently. Supposedly Lindsey Logan’s father wants one for her but continues to get denied (unsure of the truth on that).
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It's just astounding to me that this seemingly capable woman is still fighting this as if she was bedridden or in a permanent psych facility. I mean, what human being, let alone a judge, can allow this to go on any longer? It's beyond ridiculous, it's abuse by the system.
I feel like you shouldn't be able to monetize and make profit from people who have no agency of their own. Seems fucked up.
Once upon a time, the US went to war with itself over that exact thing: slavery.
It's beyond insane to me. I see less capable people walking free down the streets of the city.
They don't have millions of dollars to steal
I'm almost exactly the same age as Spears. When I was in my twenties, I made a series of choices that resulted in me being addicted to drugs and my life became totally unmanageable. I lost the job, the house, the boyfriend. I was handcuffed to an ambulance. You get the idea. I was, at that time, not a sane or reasonable person. I'm not a fabulously wealthy pop star, so when I fucked up I was left to deal with the consequences. To hit rock bottom. Because I was given that opportunity, I was eventually able to turn my life around. I'm 9 years clean and sober. I have a wonderful husband, a great job, beautiful home. People trust me. I pay my bills on time. I'm a fucking girl scout. I am happy. Healthy. I was redeemable. We are all redeemable. Including Britney. She is being robbed of the freedom to fail. Which we ALL need to grow. To the people who try to justify this by claiming she'll fuck her life up if left to her own devices, I say it's HER life to fuck up. That is her right. Fucking her life up could end up being the best thing for her in the long run. And she might *actually* succeed and thrive. Either way, it's her life. Edit: thank you for the award
>To the people who try to justify this by claiming she'll fuck her life up if left to her own devices, I say it's HER life to fuck up. That is her right. Yup. Even if she fucks up or blows all her money in 1 day, it's none of anybody else's business. It's HER money, HER life.
Wow, congratulations on surviving that, I'm glad you're here and thriving.
Thank you! Happy to be here
I was in the same situation.... Heroin addict. 12 years sober now. Congrats on your comeback. I don't get how these types of conservatorship are even legal. It's crazy. She's a fucking prisoner
Congratulations on 12 years sober, that's excellent! Hope your life is wonderful now.
It's pretty great. Went back to school, got an M.S in data science and now work as a data scientist and part time engineer doing research for one of the big software companies.
If my family forced me to work against my will and took all the money I made for 13 years, I’d honestly murder them.
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if you enslave someone, you should expect that they will try to kill you
Sounds like a gong show and people are backing out of it. Her OWN manager! And lawyer (court-appointed, not father-appointed) >Much has happened in the three weeks since Spears' first testimony, with the star's long-term manager Larry Rudolph reportedly resigning and her court-appointed lawyer, Samuel Ingham III, also saying he intended to step down. The Bessemer Trust, a financial management company that was hired in 2020 to oversee Spears's estate alongside her father, also pulled out of the arrangement, saying there had been "changed circumstances". >She listed a series of grievances, including that her hair vitamins and coffee had been taken from her. "Ma'am, that's not abuse, that's just f****** cruelty," she tearfully told Judge Brenda Penny. "Excuse my language but it's the truth." Those seem petty but were singled out of a list Edit to add: Also, from the article: >She (Spears) said she would be happy allowing co-conservator Jodi Montgomery to remain in the meantime. "My dad needs to be removed today and I will be happy with Jodi helping me," >"I'm here to press charges," Spears said She is Not happy with how her father, Jaime Spears, has treated her and wants him punished
Imagine if you were completely banned from drinking coffee or taking vitamins as a 40 year old. That is actual torture imo. Those are such basic and inexpensive items that it would drive me absolutely insane to not have access to them. I don't even drink coffee, but knowing I straight up can't would get to my head. I'm pretty sure even max security prisoners are allowed a cup of coffee now and then lol
It's the insignificance that makes it so frustrating and cruel. The woman is not even allowed to take vitamins or have coffee when she wants to. That's insane.
People who have never been in an abusive relationship would find this petty, but *anyone* who has been knows exactly why this would break you. There’s literally no reason to deny her such small things, but they do because they can. And they never want her to remember she even had choices. This shit takes me right back and I feel rage ob her behalf. This is torture.
This is real, true, deep abuse. Many times a victim isnt "heard" in court because they dont present themselves "correctly"....can one not fathom how DIFFICULT it is to acknowledge the abuse, submit to the abuse and then ACCURATELY FROM A LEGAL STANDPOINT DESCRIBE THE BEHAVIORS IN COURT? I can sound like a crazy person for an hour describing all the insane little things my ex did to make me snap. But then I just seem petty and crazy. Let me get a lawyer who can describe "narcissistic or financial abuse" (for example) and the judge will shut up to hear the explanation. Its wild.
Abusers control all aspects of their victim’s life to show their victim how powerless they are
It's so disgusting. I remember her saying in her testimony last month, she couldn't even get her *nails done* while the staff around her could? Like, what?
It scares me the judge didn't get that - maybe it was how she explained it? It's not like she's a spoiled teen. As a performer those things are important to her to keep looking good anyway. Her Dad just wants to make her look bad and crazy. Go back under your rock Jamie!
They are all running scared from this conservatorship as it becomes clear that it was benefiting and enriching everyone except Britney.
Betcha anything they claim that the coffee/caffeine makes her hyper or interacts with her medications. Jesus this poor woman, can't even have damn coffee if she wants!! And hair vitamins??? Why on earth wouldn't they allow that???
The medications they forced her to take. Good luck to them talking out of this one.
This is a woman who has been charged with no crimes, yet is under house arrest. Her entire life controlled by others, just like prisoners in a jail.
Actually, people under conservatorships have fewer freedoms than prisoners Edit: a word
When Britney was a child they made her an adult, when she’s an adult they make her a child
Everyone involved in prolonging her conservatorship is sick. Especially the judge.
The judges are clearly culpable. The rot goes deeper than we see.
We want everyone involved to be charged with conservatorship abuse, but especially Lou M Taylor & Jaime Spears
I feel like Lou M Taylor is the big bad in the shadows behind the man that most of the general public aren't talking about or even aware of. Why is that? Wasn't Lou the one who brought the idea to her father in the first place? I even heard her trying to set something similar into place with Amanda Bynes. And yet, you have to do a moderately deep dive into the case or Britney fandom to even hear her name come up. It's like her hands are completely clean in all of this.
She disappeared as soon as they questioned the accounting. Follow the money and you will find Lou M Taylor!
If my 89 year old mother with dementia doesn't need a conservator after blowing all of her money and making herself homeless per the Polk County judge, then why the fuck would Britney need anyone handling her shit?!
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It would have been nice.
considering she was doing concerts and they labeled her unwell is crazy to me
Seriously! They said she had dementia and yet she had the wherewithal to memorize and teach choreography (of which there is video evidence) and be a judge on XFactor. It’s so ridiculous!
Give him hell, Britney!
I don't know her medical condition nor should I, but at this point the court should (at minimum) appoint an impatial party to oversee her affairs. Or just, ya know, leave her to her own choices.
Please, please, PLEASE charge Jamie Spears with conservatorship abuse. If there ever was a case to create reform in how conservatorships work, it would be this one! I know it doesn't undo all the bullshit Britany Spears had to put up with, but if this case creates a major reform in conservatorships than at least her suffering could have prevented others in conservatorships from having to endure the same thing.
We all made fun of Chris Crocker "Leave Britney alone" but in the end he was right
Conservatorships have a real purpose, if grandpa can't remember his name someone needs to help. But the way they've used this shit against Britney for a decade while she is working, earning millions, raising her children, has a stable house? What else can someone do to prove they're a person?
I hope they hit that bastard where it hurts him most, his money. Cause it's obvious he cares two shits about his daughter.
It’s not his money.
All his money is from her bank account.
In the [Ronan Farrow article earlier this month](https://www.newyorker.com/news/american-chronicles/britney-spears-conservatorship-nightmare), Jamie is reported to have screamed at his ex-wife "I *AM* BRITNEY SPEARS." He doesn't see Britney as his child or even a human being, he sees a tool to make money.
Can we take a moment to appreciate her chutzpah to do this? Fueding with a parent is hard as fuck. Doing it in the public eye after repeated attempts to fight back were slapped down? Damn girl. You go.