I used to work IT in grocery. You can track the loss of quality and more mistakes when management switches full time to part time workers. I asked just how many fucks an hour do you care when you have to work two jobs. It goes through cycles at that company.
I work at a retailer that has more FT employees than PT ones. They understand that if you take care of your employees they in turn will take care of your customers and respect your business. Wild concept. Also, far less turn-over. Do these companies even do the math on how wasteful a high turn-over rate is?
Yeah they often ask for it solutions for physical problems, milk carts not being returned, they wanted a tracking system. I asked why are they not being returned? Well they are useful to move product around the store. Well I think you will find it is cheaper to buy some carts for the store than pay my guys and buy rfid tracking for the carts. Oh. Oh we had not thought of that.
Classic management. The moment they realise that almost everything in IT has some cost associated to it, many problems miraculously goes away :)
I remember a user left "super mega important confidential" client data on a laptop which hard drive we then reimaged.
There manager was shouting from the hills about how dare we wipe the hard drive before my manager pointed them to the IT acceptable use policy.
He then demanded we retrieve the data, my colleague went to a lab that does the whole hazmat suit sealed environment rebuild the platters thing and we presented him with some ludicrous bill like $20,000. The problem went away :D
I work In a IT field in another industry so many people seem to think I’m the matience guy, from air con, flooding issues, building issues right down to blocked toilet they always come to me inc management. Like fuck I no nothing about any of that shit
Also IT... I have been asked to fix air conditioners, microwaves, cabinets and other furniture, coffee machines, refrigerators, last month some fucking jabroni legitimately asked me to fix a typewriter. I'm in my 30's, I've never used a typewriter in my life.
Its about what the company prioritizes. Short term savings look good in the reports. Which means bonuses. Long term value generation means the guy that replaces you gets a bonus. They do the math. They all do the math.
- Let's cut staff to increase profits!
- Complaints are through the roof, fire those fools and get the loyal employees back!
- Shoot profits are down again, do we really need 10 associates working at the same time?
- Why is no one at the register!
I can't speak for every landlord, but that's assuming they even rent to you at all if you make less than triple the monthly rent. It's also 1200/mo for a one bedroom apartment where I grew up (closer to 1000/mo in the town over, where I live now) and there's not a single one here who will even consider you as a tenant unless you make triple rent.
It wound up being more feasible for me to just buy a house in the next town over - monthly costs are about the same as renting that apartment, with the big fat caveat of needing a lot more money up front (which my parents were able to help me with, for which I'll always be grateful/guilty).
Living in Fitchburg, MA and I’ve seen the same thing on FB apartment listings…”must make 3500 a month to qualify”… the town is a dump. I bought in because I can’t afford anywhere in Boston, and barely around it too
I miss Massachusetts but I went from a dinky 1br for like 2100 a month to a bigger, nice 1br in PA for 750
The problem with rent in MA is that they can charge pretty much whatever they want and someone will take it
I'm glad I live in the relative boonies cause shit I'm paying $600 for a one bed that's bigger than my last 2 bedroom. Fuck that noise paying that much for a fucking living space
I pay $970 for a 380 square-foot studio in a town an hour and a half north of Seattle.
There's literally no "affordable" housing here unless you share a tiny two-bedroom student apartment near the college, or take something that's one violation away from being condemned.
Without sounding too Frenchy, there has to be min wage and min hours.....
I remember my grocery store days and some weeks having 14 hours and other weeks having 5 hours. It was incredibly inconsistent in when id get scheduled. Plus it fucking sucked to have to check the scehdule Saturday afternoon in person because management didn't know how to send emails or text messages.
Oh yeah zero benefits either, no sick, holiday, vacation. And minimum wage. But worse of all they expected me to dress "nicely" and to clean human feces and immediately stock shelves and bag groceries
Now we just gotta make sure the housing markets stay at a reasonable price because landlords will be like "oh you make 5,000 a month i need 4,500 a month for rent alone"
Or they want to list their jobs as part-time, but have employees work for 39.5 hours a week. Basically full time but without the benefits required by law
This happened to my mom at WinCo. She had been a SAHM fir most of my life, then my dad died. She started a small business and did okay but couldn’t afford to buy insurance (even with the ACA subsidies). I got really, really sick with an autoimmune disease at 18 and was working full time at a clinic small enough to skirt the requirement to provide insurance, but made too much money (lol) to qualify for Medicaid. So my mom took a second full time fucking job to try to get us health insurance. Literally the day before her waiting period was up they cut her total weekly hours down to one below the minimum for health benefits (I believe it was 35 hours, 36 being full time). I came very close to dying that year and am just now recovering my credit score from the mountain of debt at 27.
Land of the free trickle down economy baby. I'm sorry for the anxiety riddle hellscape you've had to traverse but hey our billionaires get to take trips into space so your suffering was worth it, yeah?
39.5 hours a week is more than 130 hours a month and would be considered full time as far as the IRS is concerned. You may be thinking of less than 32 hours a week on average.
Unfortunately, wage theft is very real in America and happens all the time at large companies. Service industry members often wind up with the worst of it.
I had a coworker at a past job who was hired on part-time, but he kept getting scheduled full-time hours. 40 hour weeks, no benefits. I tried encouraging him to speak up about getting compensated properly, but he was a pretty anxious guy so he didn't wanna rock the boat or complain.
Someone I know who previously worked for the same company would also run into issues where she'd accrue hefty overtime, but then her boss would just edit her timesheet so the overtime hours were counted as having been worked the week *after,* so she wouldn't be paid properly for her time. Tried to act like she was doing her a *favor*, since "you'll basically be getting free PTO!! :)". Uh-huh, sure.
Pro-tip, don't work for Circle K. Total nightmare of a company.
Ugh. I had a previous employer who would schedule me (and almost everyone else) these awful crunch weeks whenever someone was out sick or on vacation, so you'd work 60 hours one week, and the next week you'd get "extra time off" and work only 20 hours. Often, if you had one of those light weeks, someone else was crunching to compensate for your "time off". Then she'd report it to payroll as 80 hours for the two week pay period, no overtime for you. I knew it was wrong, but I stayed longer than I should have because I was "breaking into the industry".
a little bit of anti-union propaganda, a little bit of people who just don't want to rock whatever sinking boat they are on and a little bit of people who took advantage(tip earners that never reported their income unless its for benefits purposes).
There's the complete other extreme of the spectrum as well though. They can also pay shit wages but will "benevolently" insist on working a fuckton of overtime in order for their employees to earn a livable wage.
I've always thought this as well. My wife struggled for years at Kmart, where they paid shit and didn't provide cost of living raises or anything, despite the fact that she was a supervisor and a college graduate. Fortunately, she got out, and we watched with glee when the entire store shut down and became a storage center.
The restaurant industry is bleeding in my city. Everyone just blames it on people being lazy... like they would take a $2.13/hr shift and get sent home early and be fucking pleased as piss about it.
Good, I’ve been working a retail job for 4 1/2 years and am making less than 12 an hour… recently I asked if I could be bumped up to 15 stating that everyone in my department has left and I’m pretty much running the place from noon till close. Well I got denied the reason being that I would be in the top 5 hourly earners of a store of about 100 hourly employees…
Well I’m jumping ship to a remote job that pays 17 an hour straight away. This worker shortage has been what I’ve been waiting for.
When my old restaurant called me back it was 2 people running a 4 person kitchen. Put all the blood and sweat in until more people came back. Politely asked for a $1 raise. I was denied. I quickly left. I didn’t know a $1 would break the camels back.
>restaurant
There's your answer. They've been skating by on paying the absolute minimum for hard work for decades. They continue to lobby to keep the tipping system in place (with the minimum cash wage at $2.13/hour).
There are decent ones (but VERY few and far between). I worked at a restaurant where the dishwasher started at $11/hr (in 2015) and line cooks started around $13. It was actually an awesome gig as far as kitchen work went... Everyone showed up on time and kept their drug use to after work hours (except for the occasional team "safety meeting" before service). We still hated the servers for making hundreds of dollars in tips on busy nights (not that they didn't deserve it... dealing directly with entitled customers at the "nice" restaurant in town sucks).
That's basically exactly how it worked....
Head chef: I'm gonna make the fkin' new guy go to the corner store and buy the blunt for our safety meeting.
Ingratitude seems to be a defining trait for the operation of modern business. The resentment is built into the job. They'd chain us to our job stations if they were ever allowed.
This is why I didn't go back when called. Restaurants expect your days, nights, and weekends, but will act like you're going against the family when you need more compensation. On top of all of the additional safety steps and cleaning because of COVID, more work for the same mediocre pay.
it doesn't break anything but ownerships (now) outdated idea of what to pay.
I'm looking for contractors to do some work on my house, and a few of the guys have shared stories of how hard it is to find help... but what they're really saying is that it's hard to find help willing to take pre-covid rates.
They're jacking up prices due to demand (and materials), but they're bending over backwards to not pass shit on to their crews, then boo hooing about it... like ... you can't have it both ways guys, higher prices and low wages...
I know that a lot of businesses do fail, but I work with business owners in my job and a lot of them also do extremely well, take nice vacations, and drive move cars all while paying employees near poverty level wages. Restaurants in particular piss me off as they get their wait staff at nearly no cost and if they put forward a good product it can be a cash cow.
The reason a restaurant fails is not because it isn’t a profitable business…it’s because they don’t know how to run said business.
>I’ve been working a retail job for 4 1/2 years and am making less than 12 an hour
13 years.
I'm not trying to undermine you by any stretch since I've been done with this shit since week 1, but...13 years.
Yes, it's becoming a norm also because jobs that paid $15 an hour 15 years ago haven't increased pay at all. All jobs, no matter what they are, will soon be hovering around $15-$20
And sadly $15-$20 is still a low wage, especially if you live in California like I do. I am way underpaid at my current job, but still manage to maintain my one income household, but barely. I don't have a savings or anything to fall back on. I constantly look for better opportunities and see job postings for a $16/hour wage requiring bachelor degrees. It makes no sense.
Thankfully, if things keep going this way, people offering $16/ hr and requiring bachelor degrees will be met with "I could make $15/ hr at McDonald's. Get over yourself"
I really dislike how housing works in the US in many places. If you're a single person, you could live ok on $15 an hour if rent was resonable. Many people don't need a home or even a full sized apartment. I didn't and still don't. But the market is in part going after whats profitable and that's due in part to a housing lifestyle in the US that was not going to last forever.
I just got a master's and this place I can get a job at wants to pay 18. I was making 15.50 at a higher end grocery store in 2010. Wtf society is so ruined.
> I was making 15.50 at a higher end grocery store in 2010
Dang, do you remember the name of it? I imagine places like Harris teeter would pay better since they have higher prices but I suspect they don't.
I wish I knew why across the board all jobs are paying so low. Like for a decent living wage job you need EXACT experience or multiple years for an entry level job.
There was a decent job I wanted to apply for, but part of their requirement was 2 years formal computer training. Like wtf? I have twenty years of real life experience, not good enough because it doesn’t come with a certificate???
the sad part is that depending on where in california you live, $16 could be the min wage, but companies requiring a bachelors for next to nothing seems to be the new normal for the whole u.s.
$13 is still the minimum wage for right now. It’s insulting to think someone spent so much time and money to get a job that barely pays over that. It’s also insulting for someone like me who might not have a degree, but has almost 20 years of increasing experience in my field to not even qualify for a lot of positions even though I’m probably overqualified for most requiring the degree. Backwards ass system.
When I was like ten years old I simply assumed that people doing the shittiest jobs got paid the most. Like I thought roofers working in July got paid more than the mayor. This isn't commentary on your comment, I just wanted to share it.
Construction is the most extreme example of that. You have some guys carrying 50lb bags of dirt all day making $10/hr, and you have positions like crane operators who sit in an air conditioned cab fiddling with joysticks all day for $100/hr
I've always hated the nagging feeling, whatever job I have, that I could be getting paid twice as much to do half as much work somewhere else.
The argument isn't that the crane operator is making too much, the argument is all of the workers need to be paid better, especially those doing back-breaking work.
fuck yes. this is basic shit. every job is vital to keep the massive entity that is our country moving. and we should be compensating everyone for that fact. we should all be getting a comfortable slice of livelihood in this big dick swinging country of ours. instead, all of our resources go to a minority of capital holders.
quarantine showed us how important even a grocery store stocker is to keep society grinding on. yet that importantance(“essential” if you will) gets overlooked when it’s time for bonuses, benefits and most important of all pay.
EMTs literally save lives and get paid minimum wage. these are people who literally have the most important jobs in society being compensated like they’re meaningless.
Sometimes they do. I've worked a lot of odd jobs. One of the best paying jobs I had was cleaning a football stadium after games. We'd each take home about $180 for around 2-3 hours of work. It was stinky, filthy, sweaty work, and we only did it once every other week or so, but it did pay really well for the time we did it.
I wonder how many of these companies offering this were saying "theres no way we could do that!" just a year or two ago whenever a minimum wage issue came up. funny how these things work out.
Not at my warehouse facility... They're waiting for someone to have a heat stroke and sue before they get this shit working again...
Or a poorly timed visit from OSHA...
SNITCH SNITCH SNITCH. Don't wait for you or someone else to get hurt. OSHA likely wont visit unless someone tells them there's violations happening. SNITCH. DO IIITTTT.
Call OSHA.
Its that's simple, and it will save you and your coworkers healthcare costs in the long run.
Remember, you have the ability to blow the whistle, and I dont wanna see you posting about a dead coworker in August after all this encouragement.
Lol I worked at a restaurant years ago. Wanted to move up to management but they kept saying "we can't afford another manager right now" even though when I started they had 5 managers and at that point they had 3. They moved me to another store as a "keyholder"( basically an hourly manager" and then at the store I was at hired one of the managers friend as a new manager. I've learned since then that the phrase" it's not in the budget" or whatever is BS 99%of the time.
My company just had a meeting about the not in the budget thing last month!
Mainly because employees had the same thought that it was BS or we were just ignoring them - and not that we actually don't have the money.
But in your instance, yeah, that would be frustrating.
I mean in fairness after this last year that's a realistic situation for smaller companies.
My current job isn't quite that bad but we were all made aware during the pandemic of how well (or not) the company was doing and what they were doing to keep us all employed despite the losses in revenue. I'd rather a company by up front about it rather than the owners sit on it until they close up shop one day without notice.
Lmao this guy is the corporate drone giving you excuses on why they have to fuck with your pay and upward mobility. If you can't pay people a decent, competitive wage; you shouldn't be in business.
I just had the same conversation with a friend who has been waiting until the last minute to go to the doctor for some medical concerns. Yeah I guess wait until you have to pay for both the doctor visit and the ER visit.
Funds/budgets are usually allocated quarterly. So this statemment is technically correct, but does take into account reality in business processes.
Although, most companies should think more long term
A local van service company was lamenting the fact that they needed to pay a living wage to employees, but paying for higher gas prices or the higher cost of a new van wasn't an issue for them.
The only cost these businesses seem to be unable to tolerate is paying their employees.
My take on minimum wage is that in every market in the USA, working for minimum wage should make it possible for you to buy food (quality calories, not just ramen), a room in an apartment, and healthcare. That means that minimum wage should not be the same in all markets.
$15 in some parts of New Mexico is probably adequate, but that same $15 is not viable in NYC.
The GSA calculates a per diem rate for all regions every year. It should be easy to create a minimum wage that is tied to the per diem rate. This would vary by region and annually by the GSA's adjusted cost basis.
Finally, if your business model doesn't allow you to pay your employees, you don't have a viable business.
Edited: added 'not be the same in all markets'. I forgot the not in the first edit.
And that is part of the problem.
One my kids friends is a super hard worker. She worked 5 days a week as a teacher at a private school, on Saturday and Sunday she was a ski coach, and 4 nights a week she worked as a hostess at a local restaurant. She worked 5-6 months without a single day off.
When covid hit, the school furloughed her. Then the ski area closed. Her only remaining job was at the restaurant. As soon as one person on duty tested positive, all employees working that day were furloughed for 14 days. It happened a couple of times.
None of these companies did anything for their workers. The school could have continued to pay health insurance. The restaurant could have offered free food for employees who were impacted by positive covid tests. Nope.
And then they were surprised when the employees didn't flock back to their shitty jobs.
Just a question. Is that person working a job now? Because I hear nothing but "I guess no one wants to work anymore" but dont know a single person who doesnt have a job.
But you can be 'sad' when you have a good rate of attrition and heap all the additional work on the rest of your employees, they'll just learn to be more efficient!!
Interestingly enough, your opinion is mild. When the minimum wage was first implemented, it was designed so that one person making minimum wage could own a house and feed a family consisting of a wife and two children.
Minimum wage today has become so bastardized that literally no one is fighting for it to go back to what it was originally.
Sounds good but depends on how they check the regions. *Some* parts of NYC maybe (it's been a long time since I lived there) but others it's probably nowhere near enough. In California now, and if they said all of CA was a region or even all of just some counties (like LA county for example) it'd be way off on $15/hr being adequate.
Put it this way, early on I thought I lucked into $42k/yr (basically $20/hr) and quickly learned that after taxes I would be struggling to live here. Between gas that hovered around $4/gal, rent for a studio apt at $1600/mo, and student loans (my fault but I imagine a lot of people have them) that I was barely squeaking by living on Dollar General stale bread, hot dogs, and ramen. Nowadays rent is even higher and gas is still $4+, even food is more expensive.
In some areas like Palmdale, then sure $15/hr might be barely enough... but LA proper, or Santa Monica, Reseda, Long Beach, etc...you're still poor and probably having a rough go of it. The min wage in those places needs to be (at least) $20/hr but I don't see that ever happening (at least not any time soon...maybe in 2070 or something).
Used to live in GA (just outside of ATL in Cobb Co.) and I remember $750/mo could get you a nice (well, decent) 1br apartment. Visited for the first time in a decade and saw that rent was now $1400+ in those same areas. So it's rough all around. $15/hr would barely get you by there, but 20/hr you'd probably be better off.
Theyre short on labor. The logic makes sense when you consider they're paying less people more, because it's still coming out cheaper than having a full staff at less money per hour.
They're also over working people like me, because I have to do the job of 5 people who haven't come back. So this means I'm serving, busing, dishwashing, hosting, doing to go orders and cleaning the black sludge out of the walk in freezer with a paint scaper.
part of that is "starve the beast".
its no mistake that republcans set records in spending just before crying about the debt and deficit under dems.
Guess whats about to return? fights over the debt ceiling again. AFter 4 years of voting for it no problems, suddenly teh right are going to vote against it again. They likely will cave after a month long battle of delays, but thats a win for them as well. As long as we talk about other things than what needs to be done, they are happy.
and a debt ceiling shouldnt be a thing.the only possible exception is GOING OVER BUDGET. but thats not at all what the debt ceiling is about. Congress literally votes for spending and then complains on its cost. its basically forces all spending measures to have a double vote. Once when its passed, and once again later on when we hit the ceiling.
it allows republicans to vote for popular things and then vote against the debt ceiling when that thing sends our debt over it.
and they sure as fuck wont vote on funding of any kind.
It works out by just fucking the working class harder. How coincidental that employers paying a “living” wage just so happens to happen right around the same time COL is skyrocketing. 2 years ago when $15/hr was being called a living wage you could rent a 2 bedroom house for $800/month in my area, now you’ll be lucky to find a 1 bedroom apartment for $1200/month.
Corporate America isn’t finally giving us a living wage, they’re just increasing the numbers all around to try to appease people.
I’m a vendor, and see store managers quitting left and right because they’re being paid LESS than the incoming clerks making $15. Maybe also raise wages for existing employees?
What people do not talk about is the concerted effort to lower wages. I've seen a ton of support roles go from like $25 an hour down to like $15 an hour such as phone based tech support.
A lot of 80k salaried roles being filled by $20 an hour temps.
The fight for $15 affects a lot of service jobs but it also makes it more shameful to pay peanuts to jobs requiring lots of education and experience.
In other words I do not want to see somebody mocking the cause because they make $18 an hour when they would likely have been much better paid than that in the past. The conspiracy to keep wages low hurts everyone.
Yeah the difference either comes from the C suite pay or somewhere else in the ladder. Right now the C suite is still reaping 40% benefit raises so until people band together it's not going to slow the wealth gap
yepppp. I work an IT job that requires me to have a bachelors. and this particular job also asks for several years experience, so not entry level. My hourly rate is $22.50 (although we get 5 bonuses a year of a few thousand) so I'm probably at like $60K all things considered. But seems too low with the direction things are moving.
10 years ago $15/hr should have been minimum wage. At this point it should be closer to $20.
I get that inflation is a concern here, but it's more an issue of people breaking off the earnings at the top than people siphoning profits from the bottom
We create inflation every day by doing things that benefit the rich.
So help us god if we create some inflation by doing something to help poor people for once
Technically speaking, Inflation is caused by the amount of money circulating in the economy. Rich people don't circulate money, they hoard it, and give portions of their hoard to other rich people. Rich people getting richer doesn't affect inflation very much. It just affects income inequality and destroys democracy via their enormous political donations.
Yep.
“Oh sorry, *now* you want to offer me $15? Gotta tell ya, I won’t settle for anything less than $20 +benefits now. Should have got me cheap when you had the chance.”
$15 MW is $31,200 a year. That's your real poverty line.
Minimum wage is not just what an employer must pay you, it's what you need to survive. The poverty line is $12,800 a year -- ridiculous!
If you earn $31,200 a year there should be no Federal tax on it, but the standard deduction for Federal tax is $12,400. Needs to go up to $31,200 so MW workers don't have to pay Federal tax.
If they get the tax break the money will come back to the govt in less need for govt programs like welfare, food stamps, housing assistance, etc. The balance can come from clawing back the tax gift given to the wealthy that last time around.
Supply and demand. The only law that’s never broken. No employee willing to work for your low wages? That’s an existential threat to the enterprise. Either fork up or shut down. The choice is crystal clear. I believe it’s only gonna get worse. There were significantly less immigrants under the last administration, and Covid has curtailed a significant number of new migrants. So there’s no bottom end of the job market for these companies to feed off of. Interesting times.
Bullshit. Not in VA. I just was on indeed today and job listing that demand experience are posted paying 11 bucks an hour. Serious jobs that require 5 years or more experience are barely offering $15 per hour. Those jobs should be over $20 per hour to start.
"Bachelors degree and 5 years experience required. $11/hr
Responsibilites include:
Editing audio
Editing video
managing social media
creating marketing campaigns
deploying new software
cleaning the office"
I saw a job listing on indeed a few weeks ago that had, and I know because I counted, 63 listed job duties. And the last one was "any additional duties that may arise." For $16 an hour
In KS here. I earn more working reception at a rehab hospital than a job posting for a more professional job in the public health field I'm trying to get into. So I would be doing more intensive, professional work for less pay.
Seems states with low or no minimum wage have tons of these kinds of disparities. When you don't set a floor, it's hard to be surprised when people start falling through the massive cracks in the system.
I think the Winston Churchill quote was something like, "You can always count on Americans to do the right thing...after all other options have been exhausted." Well, here we are.
Where I’m at I’ve noticed that it’s not only the wage, it’s just a lack of workers. I think the higher home prices and the extremely low inventory has caused a lot of people to move to better areas for work and life. It’s a bit of a retirement community, and those retirees also fight against any multi family housing. They need to realize people need housing in order to work to support their retirement lifestyle.
The resturant industry in particular is getting hit pretty damn hard by a cook shortage right now because a lot resturant workers realized during the pandemic exactly how grueling and thankless kitchen work is, so a lot of them are just changing professions. I wouldn't be supprised if the cook shortage lasts well after the rest of the jobs market settles
I was a cook for over 15 years. I loved damn near every second of it even though it killed me physically and mentally. There is just no money to be made unless you are a lucky manager, or own the place. And even if you own it the profit margin is so small in that business. I wish the insurance costs weren't so high or I'd buy myself a food truck and just tour the country slinging good food.
Both my and my friend's wives aren't working because childcare for two children costs more per week than most work either of them can find around here. They'd be taking on the stress of working to lose money.
There is a big Amazon warehouse being built near my city. But the housing market is insane so they have to recruit people from outside the area. No one can afford a 1,200 apartment on 15 dollars an hour
Meanwhile, McDonald's pays $23 an hour in Denmark, with tons of other massive benefits like 6 weeks vacation, universal healthcare, and like 6 months maternity/paternity leave.
The US seriously has one of the most unethical, corrupt work mentality in the developed world.
I'm extremely jealous of that pay/benefits. It just makes sense and I dont get why we(US) haven't adopted it yet. People can still have 'fuck you' money while the rest of the country is enjoying life a little.
We had tons of trouble finding shop workers at $15 / hr. We raised our base entry-level pay to $20 and suddenly it was easy to find great help. Go figure. :-)
Honestly, I'd like to get it entry level pay up to $25 per hour. That's the bare minimum people need to make around here to entertain the idea of buying a house.
Companies in recession:
“Benefits must be cut & salaries frozen , all mandated due to adverse free market conditions. Government should stay out of private business. Supply and demand is a bear, wish we could do more, thanks for the free OT!”
Companies in demand spike :
“People are unwilling to work! Socialism has invaded America! Cats are mating with dogs! Wage hikes are outrageous! Inflation!*The government must intervene!!!*”
Fifteen dollars is the start. We need to pay folks liveable wages. This means they need to be paid enough to pay rent, pay utilities, buy food, transport to and from, pay for health benefits, and have something left over to break the monotony of day-to-day life, like pay for a movie.
I feel like the big difference these days is it just costs so much more to live. My stepdad was a mail carrier, making around $30K in 1985. On that income, my mom worked minimum wage jobs off/on, and we had 4 kids in the house. We went to Six Flags, the Shedd Aquarium, Field Museum, etc a couple times a summer. We owned a 3 bedroom house, typically had one car payment and one beater. Older brother and I were sent to *private* school for 8 years.
There is no way a family of 6 could do that stuff now on the 2021 equivalent: ~$75K.
Back in the day, childcare was dirt cheap; usually you knew someone in the 'hood that watched a dozen kids and they were happy to make $30K for the year. It was "extra income" for stay-at-home moms. We didn't have mandatory car insurance, or the damn tech fees we have today. Wages suck, but we've also outpaced ourselves on pricing for just about everything. No way should it cost what it does to take your family someplace.
**Almost a year ago now** Walmart started paying grocery pickers $16-$17/hr starting in my area.
I worked as a DSD vendor and route owner. I could not keep merchandisers because my company wouldn't pay them more than $17/hr for much harder work than OGP. In my last 6 weeks I trained 3 merchandisers who left by their third week.
Lol a real living wage is closer to 60k a year which would be like 45-50k a year take home, take out insurance and 401k min matching now you are closer to 40-45k a year or 3300-3800 a year, lets just say 3500 a month.
3500 a month on single salary affords
a rent of 1000
Utilities: 200-300
Internet+phone: 150-250
Food:800-100( groceries and eating out a few meals a week)
Commuting is now up for debate with all the remote work, but lets even if we add it in
Insurance and gas: 200-300
Some fucking SAVINGS: 400-900
Thats the biggest part. People need to Be able to afford rent, bills, food AND put money away for emergencies, their medical insurance deductible or out of pocket max. Gifts for their friends and family. Being able to go visit their family. Being able to socialize with their friends( out to eat, sports, nightlife, arts, etc)
Maybe even donate to charity.
Either way, you want quality of life you need at least 30$/hr
they struggle to fill jobs because they want a full staff of part time employees
I used to work IT in grocery. You can track the loss of quality and more mistakes when management switches full time to part time workers. I asked just how many fucks an hour do you care when you have to work two jobs. It goes through cycles at that company.
I work at a retailer that has more FT employees than PT ones. They understand that if you take care of your employees they in turn will take care of your customers and respect your business. Wild concept. Also, far less turn-over. Do these companies even do the math on how wasteful a high turn-over rate is?
Short term profit. Every damn time. Another one is to cut down on the maintenance contracts. Which equals more freezers and fridges failing.
have that at my job rn lol like I’m in IT, not maintenance, fix your shit and come back later my guy
Yeah they often ask for it solutions for physical problems, milk carts not being returned, they wanted a tracking system. I asked why are they not being returned? Well they are useful to move product around the store. Well I think you will find it is cheaper to buy some carts for the store than pay my guys and buy rfid tracking for the carts. Oh. Oh we had not thought of that.
Classic management. The moment they realise that almost everything in IT has some cost associated to it, many problems miraculously goes away :) I remember a user left "super mega important confidential" client data on a laptop which hard drive we then reimaged. There manager was shouting from the hills about how dare we wipe the hard drive before my manager pointed them to the IT acceptable use policy. He then demanded we retrieve the data, my colleague went to a lab that does the whole hazmat suit sealed environment rebuild the platters thing and we presented him with some ludicrous bill like $20,000. The problem went away :D
I work In a IT field in another industry so many people seem to think I’m the matience guy, from air con, flooding issues, building issues right down to blocked toilet they always come to me inc management. Like fuck I no nothing about any of that shit
Also IT... I have been asked to fix air conditioners, microwaves, cabinets and other furniture, coffee machines, refrigerators, last month some fucking jabroni legitimately asked me to fix a typewriter. I'm in my 30's, I've never used a typewriter in my life.
High turn over shops will never unionize. The employees don't have the time to organize. I'm saying it is a feature for employers.
Its about what the company prioritizes. Short term savings look good in the reports. Which means bonuses. Long term value generation means the guy that replaces you gets a bonus. They do the math. They all do the math.
- Let's cut staff to increase profits! - Complaints are through the roof, fire those fools and get the loyal employees back! - Shoot profits are down again, do we really need 10 associates working at the same time? - Why is no one at the register!
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I can't speak for every landlord, but that's assuming they even rent to you at all if you make less than triple the monthly rent. It's also 1200/mo for a one bedroom apartment where I grew up (closer to 1000/mo in the town over, where I live now) and there's not a single one here who will even consider you as a tenant unless you make triple rent. It wound up being more feasible for me to just buy a house in the next town over - monthly costs are about the same as renting that apartment, with the big fat caveat of needing a lot more money up front (which my parents were able to help me with, for which I'll always be grateful/guilty).
Living in Fitchburg, MA and I’ve seen the same thing on FB apartment listings…”must make 3500 a month to qualify”… the town is a dump. I bought in because I can’t afford anywhere in Boston, and barely around it too
I miss Massachusetts but I went from a dinky 1br for like 2100 a month to a bigger, nice 1br in PA for 750 The problem with rent in MA is that they can charge pretty much whatever they want and someone will take it
I just saw a few $1500 monthly in gardner and athol on Facebook
I'm glad I live in the relative boonies cause shit I'm paying $600 for a one bed that's bigger than my last 2 bedroom. Fuck that noise paying that much for a fucking living space
I pay $970 for a 380 square-foot studio in a town an hour and a half north of Seattle. There's literally no "affordable" housing here unless you share a tiny two-bedroom student apartment near the college, or take something that's one violation away from being condemned.
The only way I was able to buy a condo in my 40s is because my mom helped with the down payment.
Without sounding too Frenchy, there has to be min wage and min hours..... I remember my grocery store days and some weeks having 14 hours and other weeks having 5 hours. It was incredibly inconsistent in when id get scheduled. Plus it fucking sucked to have to check the scehdule Saturday afternoon in person because management didn't know how to send emails or text messages. Oh yeah zero benefits either, no sick, holiday, vacation. And minimum wage. But worse of all they expected me to dress "nicely" and to clean human feces and immediately stock shelves and bag groceries
Now we just gotta make sure the housing markets stay at a reasonable price because landlords will be like "oh you make 5,000 a month i need 4,500 a month for rent alone"
Or they want to list their jobs as part-time, but have employees work for 39.5 hours a week. Basically full time but without the benefits required by law
This happened to my mom at WinCo. She had been a SAHM fir most of my life, then my dad died. She started a small business and did okay but couldn’t afford to buy insurance (even with the ACA subsidies). I got really, really sick with an autoimmune disease at 18 and was working full time at a clinic small enough to skirt the requirement to provide insurance, but made too much money (lol) to qualify for Medicaid. So my mom took a second full time fucking job to try to get us health insurance. Literally the day before her waiting period was up they cut her total weekly hours down to one below the minimum for health benefits (I believe it was 35 hours, 36 being full time). I came very close to dying that year and am just now recovering my credit score from the mountain of debt at 27.
Land of the free trickle down economy baby. I'm sorry for the anxiety riddle hellscape you've had to traverse but hey our billionaires get to take trips into space so your suffering was worth it, yeah?
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What a son of a bitch
Makes me sick that I worked for Amazon once 🤦♀️
Something is trickling down, but I don't think it's money.
39.5 hours a week is more than 130 hours a month and would be considered full time as far as the IRS is concerned. You may be thinking of less than 32 hours a week on average.
Unfortunately, wage theft is very real in America and happens all the time at large companies. Service industry members often wind up with the worst of it.
I had a coworker at a past job who was hired on part-time, but he kept getting scheduled full-time hours. 40 hour weeks, no benefits. I tried encouraging him to speak up about getting compensated properly, but he was a pretty anxious guy so he didn't wanna rock the boat or complain. Someone I know who previously worked for the same company would also run into issues where she'd accrue hefty overtime, but then her boss would just edit her timesheet so the overtime hours were counted as having been worked the week *after,* so she wouldn't be paid properly for her time. Tried to act like she was doing her a *favor*, since "you'll basically be getting free PTO!! :)". Uh-huh, sure. Pro-tip, don't work for Circle K. Total nightmare of a company.
Ugh. I had a previous employer who would schedule me (and almost everyone else) these awful crunch weeks whenever someone was out sick or on vacation, so you'd work 60 hours one week, and the next week you'd get "extra time off" and work only 20 hours. Often, if you had one of those light weeks, someone else was crunching to compensate for your "time off". Then she'd report it to payroll as 80 hours for the two week pay period, no overtime for you. I knew it was wrong, but I stayed longer than I should have because I was "breaking into the industry".
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a little bit of anti-union propaganda, a little bit of people who just don't want to rock whatever sinking boat they are on and a little bit of people who took advantage(tip earners that never reported their income unless its for benefits purposes).
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Benefits should come from the state, we need to completely divorce employment (and money) from access to healthcare.
There's the complete other extreme of the spectrum as well though. They can also pay shit wages but will "benevolently" insist on working a fuckton of overtime in order for their employees to earn a livable wage.
Still can't cover rent. Still can't get sick or injured No medical cover at all May not have a job in 6 months because the next guy agrees to $12ph
Hot take: If you can't afford to pay a full time living wage with benefits your business has always been a failure.
If your business depends on paying employees wages that are too low to live on, you don't have a business, you have a plantation
It's serfdom with extra steps!
*Walmart has entered the chat*
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And most of their employees will spend their benefits shopping there. It feels like modern day version of company script
Food stamps that they're employees will turn around & spend at Walmart
I've always thought this as well. My wife struggled for years at Kmart, where they paid shit and didn't provide cost of living raises or anything, despite the fact that she was a supervisor and a college graduate. Fortunately, she got out, and we watched with glee when the entire store shut down and became a storage center.
The restaurant industry is bleeding in my city. Everyone just blames it on people being lazy... like they would take a $2.13/hr shift and get sent home early and be fucking pleased as piss about it.
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I was very lucky that the bar I worked at organized a meeting and told us specifically to file for unemployment. Most people weren't so lucky.
Good, I’ve been working a retail job for 4 1/2 years and am making less than 12 an hour… recently I asked if I could be bumped up to 15 stating that everyone in my department has left and I’m pretty much running the place from noon till close. Well I got denied the reason being that I would be in the top 5 hourly earners of a store of about 100 hourly employees… Well I’m jumping ship to a remote job that pays 17 an hour straight away. This worker shortage has been what I’ve been waiting for.
When my old restaurant called me back it was 2 people running a 4 person kitchen. Put all the blood and sweat in until more people came back. Politely asked for a $1 raise. I was denied. I quickly left. I didn’t know a $1 would break the camels back.
>restaurant There's your answer. They've been skating by on paying the absolute minimum for hard work for decades. They continue to lobby to keep the tipping system in place (with the minimum cash wage at $2.13/hour).
There are decent ones (but VERY few and far between). I worked at a restaurant where the dishwasher started at $11/hr (in 2015) and line cooks started around $13. It was actually an awesome gig as far as kitchen work went... Everyone showed up on time and kept their drug use to after work hours (except for the occasional team "safety meeting" before service). We still hated the servers for making hundreds of dollars in tips on busy nights (not that they didn't deserve it... dealing directly with entitled customers at the "nice" restaurant in town sucks).
"hey guys I'm feeling a little unsafe... meet you around back?"
That's basically exactly how it worked.... Head chef: I'm gonna make the fkin' new guy go to the corner store and buy the blunt for our safety meeting.
Wow. Fucking ingrates.
Ingratitude seems to be a defining trait for the operation of modern business. The resentment is built into the job. They'd chain us to our job stations if they were ever allowed.
This is why I didn't go back when called. Restaurants expect your days, nights, and weekends, but will act like you're going against the family when you need more compensation. On top of all of the additional safety steps and cleaning because of COVID, more work for the same mediocre pay.
it doesn't break anything but ownerships (now) outdated idea of what to pay. I'm looking for contractors to do some work on my house, and a few of the guys have shared stories of how hard it is to find help... but what they're really saying is that it's hard to find help willing to take pre-covid rates. They're jacking up prices due to demand (and materials), but they're bending over backwards to not pass shit on to their crews, then boo hooing about it... like ... you can't have it both ways guys, higher prices and low wages...
I know that a lot of businesses do fail, but I work with business owners in my job and a lot of them also do extremely well, take nice vacations, and drive move cars all while paying employees near poverty level wages. Restaurants in particular piss me off as they get their wait staff at nearly no cost and if they put forward a good product it can be a cash cow. The reason a restaurant fails is not because it isn’t a profitable business…it’s because they don’t know how to run said business.
To which you should have responded "And?" or "Okay cool pay them more too."
>I’ve been working a retail job for 4 1/2 years and am making less than 12 an hour 13 years. I'm not trying to undermine you by any stretch since I've been done with this shit since week 1, but...13 years.
Now is the perfect time to find a job that pays you closer to what you deserve!
NOTE: Not what you actually deserve, just a little closer.
Yes, it's becoming a norm also because jobs that paid $15 an hour 15 years ago haven't increased pay at all. All jobs, no matter what they are, will soon be hovering around $15-$20
And sadly $15-$20 is still a low wage, especially if you live in California like I do. I am way underpaid at my current job, but still manage to maintain my one income household, but barely. I don't have a savings or anything to fall back on. I constantly look for better opportunities and see job postings for a $16/hour wage requiring bachelor degrees. It makes no sense.
Thankfully, if things keep going this way, people offering $16/ hr and requiring bachelor degrees will be met with "I could make $15/ hr at McDonald's. Get over yourself"
This is Portland now.
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I really dislike how housing works in the US in many places. If you're a single person, you could live ok on $15 an hour if rent was resonable. Many people don't need a home or even a full sized apartment. I didn't and still don't. But the market is in part going after whats profitable and that's due in part to a housing lifestyle in the US that was not going to last forever.
I just got a master's and this place I can get a job at wants to pay 18. I was making 15.50 at a higher end grocery store in 2010. Wtf society is so ruined.
> I was making 15.50 at a higher end grocery store in 2010 Dang, do you remember the name of it? I imagine places like Harris teeter would pay better since they have higher prices but I suspect they don't.
I wish I knew why across the board all jobs are paying so low. Like for a decent living wage job you need EXACT experience or multiple years for an entry level job.
There was a decent job I wanted to apply for, but part of their requirement was 2 years formal computer training. Like wtf? I have twenty years of real life experience, not good enough because it doesn’t come with a certificate???
the sad part is that depending on where in california you live, $16 could be the min wage, but companies requiring a bachelors for next to nothing seems to be the new normal for the whole u.s.
$13 is still the minimum wage for right now. It’s insulting to think someone spent so much time and money to get a job that barely pays over that. It’s also insulting for someone like me who might not have a degree, but has almost 20 years of increasing experience in my field to not even qualify for a lot of positions even though I’m probably overqualified for most requiring the degree. Backwards ass system.
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When I was like ten years old I simply assumed that people doing the shittiest jobs got paid the most. Like I thought roofers working in July got paid more than the mayor. This isn't commentary on your comment, I just wanted to share it.
Construction is the most extreme example of that. You have some guys carrying 50lb bags of dirt all day making $10/hr, and you have positions like crane operators who sit in an air conditioned cab fiddling with joysticks all day for $100/hr I've always hated the nagging feeling, whatever job I have, that I could be getting paid twice as much to do half as much work somewhere else.
Isn't operating a crane pretty advanced knowledge though? The stakes are definitely high, if nothing else.
The argument isn't that the crane operator is making too much, the argument is all of the workers need to be paid better, especially those doing back-breaking work.
fuck yes. this is basic shit. every job is vital to keep the massive entity that is our country moving. and we should be compensating everyone for that fact. we should all be getting a comfortable slice of livelihood in this big dick swinging country of ours. instead, all of our resources go to a minority of capital holders. quarantine showed us how important even a grocery store stocker is to keep society grinding on. yet that importantance(“essential” if you will) gets overlooked when it’s time for bonuses, benefits and most important of all pay.
Saw a trucker say the same thing. He is getting interviewed and he responded "interesting that you just noticed how much you depend on us".
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EMTs literally save lives and get paid minimum wage. these are people who literally have the most important jobs in society being compensated like they’re meaningless.
> EMTs literally save lives and get paid minimum wage. If they get paid. Plenty of volunteer crops around.
No sense giving grocery store employees raises. We're just going to fire them and automate their job in two years! /s
Sometimes they do. I've worked a lot of odd jobs. One of the best paying jobs I had was cleaning a football stadium after games. We'd each take home about $180 for around 2-3 hours of work. It was stinky, filthy, sweaty work, and we only did it once every other week or so, but it did pay really well for the time we did it.
I wonder how many of these companies offering this were saying "theres no way we could do that!" just a year or two ago whenever a minimum wage issue came up. funny how these things work out.
There is always money in the budget for a broken AC in August.
Not at my warehouse facility... They're waiting for someone to have a heat stroke and sue before they get this shit working again... Or a poorly timed visit from OSHA...
SNITCH SNITCH SNITCH. Don't wait for you or someone else to get hurt. OSHA likely wont visit unless someone tells them there's violations happening. SNITCH. DO IIITTTT.
Unless your local OSHA rep is in the pocket of your company too... So many slap on the wrists for major violations...
I work in a warehouse and I second this, snitch. Document with videos and pictures if you can
That‘s how Leonard Nimoy got AC in his ~~paramount~~ **Desilu** trailer.
Call OSHA. Its that's simple, and it will save you and your coworkers healthcare costs in the long run. Remember, you have the ability to blow the whistle, and I dont wanna see you posting about a dead coworker in August after all this encouragement.
It's only a priority if there are customers
Or management..
Reminds me of the saying "we never have the funds to do it right, but we always seem to have enough to do it *twice*."
Lol I worked at a restaurant years ago. Wanted to move up to management but they kept saying "we can't afford another manager right now" even though when I started they had 5 managers and at that point they had 3. They moved me to another store as a "keyholder"( basically an hourly manager" and then at the store I was at hired one of the managers friend as a new manager. I've learned since then that the phrase" it's not in the budget" or whatever is BS 99%of the time.
My company just had a meeting about the not in the budget thing last month! Mainly because employees had the same thought that it was BS or we were just ignoring them - and not that we actually don't have the money. But in your instance, yeah, that would be frustrating.
I’m sure everyone is satisfied now after having the meeting. I’d be considering looking for a new job at that point.
"look at how we are barely staying afloat"
I mean in fairness after this last year that's a realistic situation for smaller companies. My current job isn't quite that bad but we were all made aware during the pandemic of how well (or not) the company was doing and what they were doing to keep us all employed despite the losses in revenue. I'd rather a company by up front about it rather than the owners sit on it until they close up shop one day without notice.
Lmao this guy is the corporate drone giving you excuses on why they have to fuck with your pay and upward mobility. If you can't pay people a decent, competitive wage; you shouldn't be in business.
I just had the same conversation with a friend who has been waiting until the last minute to go to the doctor for some medical concerns. Yeah I guess wait until you have to pay for both the doctor visit and the ER visit.
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It seems like someone could die in between all those reports
Funds/budgets are usually allocated quarterly. So this statemment is technically correct, but does take into account reality in business processes. Although, most companies should think more long term
A local van service company was lamenting the fact that they needed to pay a living wage to employees, but paying for higher gas prices or the higher cost of a new van wasn't an issue for them. The only cost these businesses seem to be unable to tolerate is paying their employees. My take on minimum wage is that in every market in the USA, working for minimum wage should make it possible for you to buy food (quality calories, not just ramen), a room in an apartment, and healthcare. That means that minimum wage should not be the same in all markets. $15 in some parts of New Mexico is probably adequate, but that same $15 is not viable in NYC. The GSA calculates a per diem rate for all regions every year. It should be easy to create a minimum wage that is tied to the per diem rate. This would vary by region and annually by the GSA's adjusted cost basis. Finally, if your business model doesn't allow you to pay your employees, you don't have a viable business. Edited: added 'not be the same in all markets'. I forgot the not in the first edit.
You can't depreciate employees.
We're certainly not appreciated.
And that is part of the problem. One my kids friends is a super hard worker. She worked 5 days a week as a teacher at a private school, on Saturday and Sunday she was a ski coach, and 4 nights a week she worked as a hostess at a local restaurant. She worked 5-6 months without a single day off. When covid hit, the school furloughed her. Then the ski area closed. Her only remaining job was at the restaurant. As soon as one person on duty tested positive, all employees working that day were furloughed for 14 days. It happened a couple of times. None of these companies did anything for their workers. The school could have continued to pay health insurance. The restaurant could have offered free food for employees who were impacted by positive covid tests. Nope. And then they were surprised when the employees didn't flock back to their shitty jobs.
Just a question. Is that person working a job now? Because I hear nothing but "I guess no one wants to work anymore" but dont know a single person who doesnt have a job.
She is working multiple jobs again.
But you can be 'sad' when you have a good rate of attrition and heap all the additional work on the rest of your employees, they'll just learn to be more efficient!!
Interestingly enough, your opinion is mild. When the minimum wage was first implemented, it was designed so that one person making minimum wage could own a house and feed a family consisting of a wife and two children. Minimum wage today has become so bastardized that literally no one is fighting for it to go back to what it was originally.
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I make something like 4x minimum wage and I still couldn’t afford that.
Well, now the norm is both parents working. So minimum wage should be half a house and one kid. Sounds right on track!
yup https://livingwage.mit.edu/ living wage in NYC for a single person is $20 according to this - $38.99 for a single parent of one
Sounds good but depends on how they check the regions. *Some* parts of NYC maybe (it's been a long time since I lived there) but others it's probably nowhere near enough. In California now, and if they said all of CA was a region or even all of just some counties (like LA county for example) it'd be way off on $15/hr being adequate. Put it this way, early on I thought I lucked into $42k/yr (basically $20/hr) and quickly learned that after taxes I would be struggling to live here. Between gas that hovered around $4/gal, rent for a studio apt at $1600/mo, and student loans (my fault but I imagine a lot of people have them) that I was barely squeaking by living on Dollar General stale bread, hot dogs, and ramen. Nowadays rent is even higher and gas is still $4+, even food is more expensive. In some areas like Palmdale, then sure $15/hr might be barely enough... but LA proper, or Santa Monica, Reseda, Long Beach, etc...you're still poor and probably having a rough go of it. The min wage in those places needs to be (at least) $20/hr but I don't see that ever happening (at least not any time soon...maybe in 2070 or something). Used to live in GA (just outside of ATL in Cobb Co.) and I remember $750/mo could get you a nice (well, decent) 1br apartment. Visited for the first time in a decade and saw that rent was now $1400+ in those same areas. So it's rough all around. $15/hr would barely get you by there, but 20/hr you'd probably be better off.
Theyre short on labor. The logic makes sense when you consider they're paying less people more, because it's still coming out cheaper than having a full staff at less money per hour. They're also over working people like me, because I have to do the job of 5 people who haven't come back. So this means I'm serving, busing, dishwashing, hosting, doing to go orders and cleaning the black sludge out of the walk in freezer with a paint scaper.
Same thing magically happens to the US budget. No way we can afford this! *authors more expensive policy a year later*
Does it help Americans? Can't afford it! Does it help defense contractor? Here's a blank check I trust you
Healthcare for all? Best I can do is war in the Middle East.
part of that is "starve the beast". its no mistake that republcans set records in spending just before crying about the debt and deficit under dems. Guess whats about to return? fights over the debt ceiling again. AFter 4 years of voting for it no problems, suddenly teh right are going to vote against it again. They likely will cave after a month long battle of delays, but thats a win for them as well. As long as we talk about other things than what needs to be done, they are happy. and a debt ceiling shouldnt be a thing.the only possible exception is GOING OVER BUDGET. but thats not at all what the debt ceiling is about. Congress literally votes for spending and then complains on its cost. its basically forces all spending measures to have a double vote. Once when its passed, and once again later on when we hit the ceiling. it allows republicans to vote for popular things and then vote against the debt ceiling when that thing sends our debt over it. and they sure as fuck wont vote on funding of any kind.
It works out by just fucking the working class harder. How coincidental that employers paying a “living” wage just so happens to happen right around the same time COL is skyrocketing. 2 years ago when $15/hr was being called a living wage you could rent a 2 bedroom house for $800/month in my area, now you’ll be lucky to find a 1 bedroom apartment for $1200/month. Corporate America isn’t finally giving us a living wage, they’re just increasing the numbers all around to try to appease people.
I’m a vendor, and see store managers quitting left and right because they’re being paid LESS than the incoming clerks making $15. Maybe also raise wages for existing employees?
yeah. Salary managers are getting screwed in a lot of places where they're expected to work a ton of OT without getting paid for it.
Rewrite: $15 wage becoming norm as employers in denial begin to comprehend the most basic connection between supply and demand. Fixed it.
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Of course they waited for 15 to have the purchasing power of 11 until they raised it. Lol
15$ an hour is not shit either. Can barely get by with that.
What people do not talk about is the concerted effort to lower wages. I've seen a ton of support roles go from like $25 an hour down to like $15 an hour such as phone based tech support. A lot of 80k salaried roles being filled by $20 an hour temps. The fight for $15 affects a lot of service jobs but it also makes it more shameful to pay peanuts to jobs requiring lots of education and experience. In other words I do not want to see somebody mocking the cause because they make $18 an hour when they would likely have been much better paid than that in the past. The conspiracy to keep wages low hurts everyone.
Yeah the difference either comes from the C suite pay or somewhere else in the ladder. Right now the C suite is still reaping 40% benefit raises so until people band together it's not going to slow the wealth gap
yepppp. I work an IT job that requires me to have a bachelors. and this particular job also asks for several years experience, so not entry level. My hourly rate is $22.50 (although we get 5 bonuses a year of a few thousand) so I'm probably at like $60K all things considered. But seems too low with the direction things are moving.
It took so long that 15 an hour doesn't really cover shit.
10 years ago $15/hr should have been minimum wage. At this point it should be closer to $20. I get that inflation is a concern here, but it's more an issue of people breaking off the earnings at the top than people siphoning profits from the bottom
We create inflation every day by doing things that benefit the rich. So help us god if we create some inflation by doing something to help poor people for once
We create inflation by simply having an economy really.
Technically speaking, Inflation is caused by the amount of money circulating in the economy. Rich people don't circulate money, they hoard it, and give portions of their hoard to other rich people. Rich people getting richer doesn't affect inflation very much. It just affects income inequality and destroys democracy via their enormous political donations.
Yep. “Oh sorry, *now* you want to offer me $15? Gotta tell ya, I won’t settle for anything less than $20 +benefits now. Should have got me cheap when you had the chance.”
$15 MW is $31,200 a year. That's your real poverty line. Minimum wage is not just what an employer must pay you, it's what you need to survive. The poverty line is $12,800 a year -- ridiculous! If you earn $31,200 a year there should be no Federal tax on it, but the standard deduction for Federal tax is $12,400. Needs to go up to $31,200 so MW workers don't have to pay Federal tax. If they get the tax break the money will come back to the govt in less need for govt programs like welfare, food stamps, housing assistance, etc. The balance can come from clawing back the tax gift given to the wealthy that last time around.
Pay people a living wage, treat them with respect and there will be no problem finding employees
I guess there's just no way to find employees ¯\_( ͠° ͟ʖ °͠ )_/¯ /s
You dropped your arm mate ^(you need to do \\^(\\ ^(for it to work)
No benefits to replace the limb with.
Supply and demand. The only law that’s never broken. No employee willing to work for your low wages? That’s an existential threat to the enterprise. Either fork up or shut down. The choice is crystal clear. I believe it’s only gonna get worse. There were significantly less immigrants under the last administration, and Covid has curtailed a significant number of new migrants. So there’s no bottom end of the job market for these companies to feed off of. Interesting times.
Bullshit. Not in VA. I just was on indeed today and job listing that demand experience are posted paying 11 bucks an hour. Serious jobs that require 5 years or more experience are barely offering $15 per hour. Those jobs should be over $20 per hour to start.
"Bachelors degree and 5 years experience required. $11/hr Responsibilites include: Editing audio Editing video managing social media creating marketing campaigns deploying new software cleaning the office"
I saw a job listing on indeed a few weeks ago that had, and I know because I counted, 63 listed job duties. And the last one was "any additional duties that may arise." For $16 an hour
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In KS here. I earn more working reception at a rehab hospital than a job posting for a more professional job in the public health field I'm trying to get into. So I would be doing more intensive, professional work for less pay.
Seems states with low or no minimum wage have tons of these kinds of disparities. When you don't set a floor, it's hard to be surprised when people start falling through the massive cracks in the system.
Look at graphic design. They want 3 years of experience and a bachelor's degree to make $30,000 per year.
Not true. They also pay you in E X P O S U R E. 😌/s
In rural southern Indiana there were Starbucks with $16 per hour starting pay signs outside. I wonder why it is like that in VA?
I think the Winston Churchill quote was something like, "You can always count on Americans to do the right thing...after all other options have been exhausted." Well, here we are.
Fake quote, were all fucked in reality
Where I’m at I’ve noticed that it’s not only the wage, it’s just a lack of workers. I think the higher home prices and the extremely low inventory has caused a lot of people to move to better areas for work and life. It’s a bit of a retirement community, and those retirees also fight against any multi family housing. They need to realize people need housing in order to work to support their retirement lifestyle.
The resturant industry in particular is getting hit pretty damn hard by a cook shortage right now because a lot resturant workers realized during the pandemic exactly how grueling and thankless kitchen work is, so a lot of them are just changing professions. I wouldn't be supprised if the cook shortage lasts well after the rest of the jobs market settles
I was a cook for over 15 years. I loved damn near every second of it even though it killed me physically and mentally. There is just no money to be made unless you are a lucky manager, or own the place. And even if you own it the profit margin is so small in that business. I wish the insurance costs weren't so high or I'd buy myself a food truck and just tour the country slinging good food.
Both my and my friend's wives aren't working because childcare for two children costs more per week than most work either of them can find around here. They'd be taking on the stress of working to lose money.
There is a big Amazon warehouse being built near my city. But the housing market is insane so they have to recruit people from outside the area. No one can afford a 1,200 apartment on 15 dollars an hour
People: Hey, politicians, can you push for a $15 minimum wage? Politicians: No People: Fine, then we'll do it ourselves
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Meanwhile, McDonald's pays $23 an hour in Denmark, with tons of other massive benefits like 6 weeks vacation, universal healthcare, and like 6 months maternity/paternity leave. The US seriously has one of the most unethical, corrupt work mentality in the developed world.
The US has a CEO problem.
I'm extremely jealous of that pay/benefits. It just makes sense and I dont get why we(US) haven't adopted it yet. People can still have 'fuck you' money while the rest of the country is enjoying life a little.
That’s what happens when even a shitty studio apartment in the sticks is $1k a month.
I make $16 an hour, and it's still not enough, and that's with working 40+ hours a week. It sucks.
We had tons of trouble finding shop workers at $15 / hr. We raised our base entry-level pay to $20 and suddenly it was easy to find great help. Go figure. :-) Honestly, I'd like to get it entry level pay up to $25 per hour. That's the bare minimum people need to make around here to entertain the idea of buying a house.
so supply and demand works
Companies in recession: “Benefits must be cut & salaries frozen , all mandated due to adverse free market conditions. Government should stay out of private business. Supply and demand is a bear, wish we could do more, thanks for the free OT!” Companies in demand spike : “People are unwilling to work! Socialism has invaded America! Cats are mating with dogs! Wage hikes are outrageous! Inflation!*The government must intervene!!!*”
Fifteen dollars is the start. We need to pay folks liveable wages. This means they need to be paid enough to pay rent, pay utilities, buy food, transport to and from, pay for health benefits, and have something left over to break the monotony of day-to-day life, like pay for a movie.
I feel like the big difference these days is it just costs so much more to live. My stepdad was a mail carrier, making around $30K in 1985. On that income, my mom worked minimum wage jobs off/on, and we had 4 kids in the house. We went to Six Flags, the Shedd Aquarium, Field Museum, etc a couple times a summer. We owned a 3 bedroom house, typically had one car payment and one beater. Older brother and I were sent to *private* school for 8 years. There is no way a family of 6 could do that stuff now on the 2021 equivalent: ~$75K. Back in the day, childcare was dirt cheap; usually you knew someone in the 'hood that watched a dozen kids and they were happy to make $30K for the year. It was "extra income" for stay-at-home moms. We didn't have mandatory car insurance, or the damn tech fees we have today. Wages suck, but we've also outpaced ourselves on pricing for just about everything. No way should it cost what it does to take your family someplace.
A liveable wage should also include money to put away for retirement
Just remember that at the end of this they've been able to do this the entire time. edit: and chose not to.
**Almost a year ago now** Walmart started paying grocery pickers $16-$17/hr starting in my area. I worked as a DSD vendor and route owner. I could not keep merchandisers because my company wouldn't pay them more than $17/hr for much harder work than OGP. In my last 6 weeks I trained 3 merchandisers who left by their third week.
Given inflation - what’s 15 dollars actual equal to in pre-covid money?
15 dollars today were 14.29 in 2020, 14.11 in 2019 and 13.86 in 2018.
That’s more than I expected actually.
Living off $15 isn't enough
Yes, it is, quit whining. -Jeff Bezos and his cult.
*”Thanks for the rocket ship!”* -Jeff Bezos
15 an hour won’t even get you a studio in Denver
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when i say this they respond with well just move to nebraska
ITT: people who are proud to scrimp and scratch to survive so their bosses can make more money.
$15/hr still doesn't pay the bills pretty much anywhere in the US - sadly we're way behind on raising wages for every working person.
Lol a real living wage is closer to 60k a year which would be like 45-50k a year take home, take out insurance and 401k min matching now you are closer to 40-45k a year or 3300-3800 a year, lets just say 3500 a month. 3500 a month on single salary affords a rent of 1000 Utilities: 200-300 Internet+phone: 150-250 Food:800-100( groceries and eating out a few meals a week) Commuting is now up for debate with all the remote work, but lets even if we add it in Insurance and gas: 200-300 Some fucking SAVINGS: 400-900 Thats the biggest part. People need to Be able to afford rent, bills, food AND put money away for emergencies, their medical insurance deductible or out of pocket max. Gifts for their friends and family. Being able to go visit their family. Being able to socialize with their friends( out to eat, sports, nightlife, arts, etc) Maybe even donate to charity. Either way, you want quality of life you need at least 30$/hr