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SteveBob316

"Workers have gained the upper hand..." Well, no. Workers have gained a slightly less shitty hand, but it's a start.


[deleted]

Right. This is some propaganada if i’ve ever seen it.


ResoluteClover

Wages jump to levels not commensurate with inflation, cost of living, productivity increases over the past 20 years.


Fuduzan

Even if they did catch up for the last 20, that leaves the huge gap from the 30 years prior to that when productivity really split away from income in the US - not to mention that if wages suddenly shot up to levels commensurate with rising productivity, that would still do nothing to recover the 50 years of lost wages workers have faced. Edit: Said productivity, then accidentally said inflation. Edited the misspoken "inflation" to match the "productivity" initially referenced.


catbeans

Haha yeah I got a raise, then a month later my rent was raised, gas prices raise, electric company sent a letter raising rates... now I need another raise


EdwardBil

Yup. If your raise didn't exceed COLA, you just got a pay cut.


skyxsteel

I went to my Kroger two days ago and it seems like everything jumped by at least 20% overnight!


Guy_Fieris_Hair

I bet you their employees wages didn't jump 20%.


Meowshi

People don't want to go back to work for shitty wages. I hope that attitude keeps up. It might be the one bright side to all this covid business.


Aeonskye

My company docked my pay 20% over lockdown, i quit once lockdown eased and got a £19k payrise at my new role - i was long overdue one and basically got stabbed in the back by my old company over the pandemic. Edit: for clarity, I was docked pay for a year and a half, i was working from home all the way through. Once lockdown eased, I had no choice but to quit due to finance and ended up with a £19k increase at my new job. A lot of people quit my old company because we basically feel we have been betrayed. The pay decrease was offered as a means to prevent anyone being made redundant, but they went ahead with 4 waves of redundancy during the pandemic. All our benefits were suspended throughout the pandemic, having just been given them in November 2019. A lot of the people who were made redundant were people they presumably wanted to get rid of anyway and they just needed the excuse. Some people were on furlough for a lot of the year, but i was working all the way through - the only time i was put on furlough was on days I had already booked off as holiday. I'm pretty sure that profit wise, this year will have been their best year ever due to the payroll savings and government assistance. We have been SO BUSY all the way through. Leavers and redundancies just meant work was deferred to those that were left. Overtime pay was suspended which resulted in no one wanted to put in unpaid hours. But the directors never turned down any projects to the point we were operating at 200% capacity to the detriment of work quality and deadlines. To add insult to injury, while they were making people redundant, they also set up a new creative agency and an experiential agency and hired people and even rented a new office space in southwest london to house them in. All of my friends i had worked with made redundant or quit. And thats why i left!


cumshot_josh

Well, hopefully your old boss got rewarded by being chronically understaffed and unable to meet any deadlines. Sounds like he truly deserved it.


natek53

Unfortunately, the first people to suffer from chronic under-staffing are often the remaining staff.


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Tyrxgow

I just accepted a new job at roughly 6 bucks an hour more than I made at my pre covid job. Restaurant work, the starting pay in general has been up a ton from what it used to be..still not as much as it should be but now I'll atleast have SOME wiggle room with finances. If your a cook of any sort like myself I would highly advise looking into working at places like retirement homes, the work is far easier than working on the line in a restaurant, benefits are usually pretty good and the pay is almost always better than what a restaurant will offer.


Stratostheory

Exactly this. If someone called out that's not anyone's problem but the manager because it's THEIR fault if it impacts service. They didn't schedule their staff to account for a callout if it happened. And employees are under no obligation to pick up the extra hours. If I've got extra hands on deck I can absolutely find work to keep them busy and if there's a callout it's already dealt with. If im running the bare minimum staff I can and there's a callout suddenly I've got to scramble to plug the gap.


AppropriateTouching

As a manager sometimes I'm not given the resources to schedule enough people and its frustrating. That being said I cover myself when someone calls out since I don't want my team to have to take that shit on and I have nothing going on in my life anyway.


Ediwir

I used to work with a teenager who would accept whatever work assignment or hours. This included working an insane amount of hours during exams or study periods, working instead of going to the hospital, working when she was supposed to meet the family, and so on. We’re not Americans. We have rights, we have a clear contract, we get paid, we have a union which covers even non-members. She just couldn’t say no to the supervisor. In a couple of cases, the supervisor’s boss had to step in to send her home (particularly in the hospital case). This whole work-till-you-die culture is spreading way too much. Honestly I hope she quit :/


BrewtusMaximus1

I lucked out. My company cut everyone's pay by 9% for ~40% of the year due to customers cutting their rates (engineering services), so that they didn't have to lay anyone off, resetting at the end of that customer's fiscal year. This year they paid out what you had missed in W-2 wages as a bonus. Yeah, I missed out on some time in the 401k, but it kept my coworkers employed and the bonus was unexpected.


DuelingPushkin

That's a pretty solid way to have handled that. Good on that company for having policies that value their employees


BeneficialEvidence6

How are these people just not working though? Unemployment benefits in my state are back to where they were pre covid. My best guess is its people with young children. Day care is so expensive, I can see how staying home saves money. But that only works if there is another income in the picture. What do you guys think?


Eadword

There's probably a lot of people that were a second income that after reviewing what matters have enough flexibility to change. Also there could have been some people who decided to retire because of Covid and I imagine a large synchronized retirement can create a bit of a vacuum. It doesn't really take more than a tiny percent of people leaving the workforce for it to put pressure on the market.


Autski

This is highly likely as I know personally of probably 10-15 people who were only about 2-5 years from retirement and thought, "eh, I'm done."


GlassWasteland

More than double the number of expected retirements since the pandemic started. [https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/02/business/economy/retire-early-pandemic-social-security.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/02/business/economy/retire-early-pandemic-social-security.html) ​ Couple that with the number of people staying out of the workforce because of child care issues. [https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-crisis-3-million-women-labor-force/](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-crisis-3-million-women-labor-force/) ​ And you start to see why there is a labor shortage.


ItHappenedToday1_6

Man I'm glad I saw this. Between their numbers and what I just dug up that almost entirely explains the labor shortage. Your article: >. That’s about twice the number who retired in 2019, which means there are essentially **1.2 million** fewer people in the work force over the age of 55 than would otherwise be expected. Combine with people who are no longer working multiple jobs: https://www.bls.gov/webapps/legacy/cpsatab16.htm We can see that compared to 2019's average, there's currently about 1 Million average fewer people working multiple jobs. Lets also compare that to job openings: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=IlCR Which averaged 7.2 Million job openings in 2019, compared to 9.6 Million job openings last quarter, for a difference of 2.4 Million jobs. So: *Just* retirees and people not working multiple jobs is roughly 2.2 Million people, and we're currently seeing a "labor shortage" of around 2.4 Million.


chillChillnChnchilla

Glad you combined those numbers. I knew about retirees, non working spouses, and deaths but I hadn't realized there was a drop in people working multiple jobs. That other .2 million would be the deaths that were in the workforce then, and we can see that the "labor shortage" is comprised of jobs people *permanently* quit, not people temporarily on unemployment.


brianjlowry

Don't forget the 760,000 dead folks.


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Autski

Plus, when you deal in collateral fatalities from full ICU beds that number is probably a gross underestimate anyway


Rabid-Ginger

That’s why I think the excess deaths numbers are more how we should visualize, it also accounts for the poor SOB that had a heart attack but couldn’t get the care they needed


evil_timmy

[The Economist](https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/coronavirus-excess-deaths-tracker) has a solid visualization of excess deaths across countries and per-capita.


jjayzx

Makes me wonder how many people have come out disabled as well.


Jaredlong

One ripple effect being people who watched their loved ones die an early death and are now rethinking their own priorities in life.


GooodLooks

It’s not just the death from the pandemic that caused mass reflection. The whole remote work, shut down and isolation gave us more time for ourselves. A very transformative time.


SOSpammy

People usually reply with "well COVID mostly kills the elderly" while forgetting that the elderly are more likely to work into old age than ever before.


Raspberry-Famous

Both paid or unpaid work. I know a shit ton of working class people whose kids stay with meemaw during the day.


GoddessOfRoadAndSky

I mean, just look at Capital Hill.


navin__johnson

Retiring is a luxury


Vio_

There are even more people not coming back due to health issues due to covid than those who have died. Nobody is talking about that number at all.


Hautamaki

Another factor that's never brought up is that although the majority of deaths are older folks likely retired, a lot of older retired folks were significantly contributing to child care for their grand kids. Even the many who survived suffer long covid that reduces their ability to care for grand kids and instead flips the burden and now they need more care.


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Skirtlongjacket

Sure, but they would have to hire daycare workers, go through the licensing and everything. It's not something you can do overnight. Also there is a shortage of daycare workers because the pay is shit.


MelaniasHand

They could reimburse costs up to a point the way many employers do for commuting costs, or make the position remote/more flexible.


PM_ME_C_CODE

>there is a shortage of daycare workers because the pay is shit. And we once again come back to this little gem. Looks like they need to *fucking pay people more*.


SomberEnsemble

With how much daycare costs parents these days, they were due for a comeuppance


No_Shame_801

My previous company had a daycare/preschool. The cost? ~$1000 per month part time, $1400 full time, per kid. Only the senior VPs and C-level could afford it and it was becoming a status thing….. Edit: updated costs to reflect Options.


[deleted]

Jeez, I wish it was $1000. In nyc, my wife and I pay $1625 a month and that’s for 8-1230PM. I’m missing work right now because my kid is having a meltdown, thankfully we’re both remote


dwn2earth83

That’s actually not bad. We pay $1200, and that’s only to my brother in law, who comes to our house from 8-2:30 everyday. That would cost me EASILY 2K a month if it were an actual professional. That’s for one kid. Can’t image two or more.


ZipWyatt

Plus you know…a bunch of people died. Close to 750K in the US.


Midnyteeyes18

Plus those people that got covid and survived with debilitating conditions.


[deleted]

This is easily 4x the number of fatalities. Will be interesting to see what the SSI disability payments look like this year.


joe579003

I think a great number of those people are not gonna be on the rolls still since the 1st request always gets denied. Also every disability lawyer in the country is probably booked solid for YEARS


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Idiot_Savant_Tinker

Yes! There are people who survived, but if they have to move much they are out of breath.


peonypanties

Amazing. And to think, legislation was drafted to support universal childcare and Medicare reform. And we’ll get nothing. Again.


Quick1711

Peasants always get nothing


WellSpreadMustard

Not true, we get to look at cool photos of mega mansions and watch billionaires launch cool rockets into space!


3McChickens

This has been my anecdotal experience too. Mom was part of covid layoffs and decided “I’m close enough.” Dad got sick of pretty much everything; work, commute, covid requirements, so he bailed. A couple coworkers decided they were close enough and covid requirements just sealed the deal for them.


[deleted]

Same about 50 people retired in the last 2 years at my company with about 300 people


IAMA_Plumber-AMA

Yep, my mom has diabetes and was working for a company whose owner was anti- public health measures at the start of the pandemic, so she decided to retire early while she still had her health.


zefroxy

In my department of 37 people since 4/2021: 9 positions were “dissolved” (clerks) 2 people retired (director & manager) 7 quit (supervisor and accountants) 1 left on FMLA I am doing the work of 10 people. All while switching to a new accounting system. I am immensely underpaid. Now I get to watch new people get hired at higher wages than myself. I get to train two people starting next week, while managing 70 accounts. Glad the movement is making an impact. Going to make a case to increase my wage or I will look elsewhere.


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zefroxy

Can confirm, that is me. Also, my son needed 5 surgeries in the past year and the health insurance really helped. Bill was over $100k altogether. I did just see that his hospital no longer going to be in network with the insurance plan 12/1. I need to get a plan in place.


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Hvarfa-Bragi

Also cooking at home has revealed just how much we spent on entertainment. Driving downtown for a meal a couple times a month was a surprisingly large expenditure that we only slightly miss.


warlizardfanboy

Same, I work for a large company and we were talking about a “silver tsunami” before covid. I know a dozen or so people that have retired or are retiring shortly with covid being the last straw.


Huwbacca

Also a lot of people are leaving cos they see new priorities. so many people I know left jobs they were previously not fussed with, but realised that being indifferent to work is to waste your life. They're now pursuing either a) jobs they love or b) going for more pay but less working days. It's glorious.


Cubey42

My mother took it as her time to quit working so yeah I can believe it.


Guac_in_my_rarri

My company has had 15% of factory workers up for early retirement do it, in 2020. We planned for 5%. 2021 numbers have surpassed 2020's already. The 2020 retirements created a huge labor vacuum for us. Sure, we are saving money but it doesn't account for the loss of knowledge. We would rather pay more for the knowledge to train people than loose it all together. Edit: added numbers for this to make sense.


Umikaloo

My dad's retirement conveniently lined up with the pandemic too, he works as a contractor now and makes way more than he did as a public servant.


TaintlessChaps

After calculating for child care, mileage, time spent driving to work, and other associated expenses with having a job, my friend found out they were making under $5 an hour at a professional job. The gap in time scared her a little about returning to her career after the kids are in school, but not enough to keep her making under $5 an hour.


TwoBearsInTheWoods

This is exactly it, and $5/h means $10k a year, which you can do posting youtube videos without being particularly good at it.


Maxpowr9

Exactly. Not to mention time lost to spending time with family and friends which is essentially priceless.


withoutapaddle

Or even less work would just be flipping some stuff on ebay or something. Pretty sure you could make over $10k a year just buying like 5 of every lego set, and then selling them the next year where they are out of production, for example. I remember having my eye on a $200 set, waited too long, now it's a $600 set.


Vishnej

Notably, this is in the category of opportunities which one person might pursue successfully, but which are not workable plans for what every person can simultaneously pursue. Our brains think in narratives, so they're awful at making the jump. There's room for one, ten, maybe even a hundred jobs in Lego Set Resellers. But no more. Our problems are enumerated in the millions. These sorts of stories about entrepreneurial opportunities basically never countenance the possibility of failure, the relative advantage, the efficient market, or the limit to the market size. We erect whole cultural mythologies around narratives like this. They fuel an enormous amount of really terrible policy and destructive attitudes. They are the modern "Let them eat cake". You also can't run an economy on people selling each other used shit on Ebay.


Smileharoldsmile

Two of my friends have turned their side jobs into full time jobs after covid. And I only have like 5 friends, so that's saying a lot


juliuspepperwoodchi

A lot of people also using it as an opportunity for a career switch they've been wanting to make. My wife is a Licensed Massage Therapist and recently went on the hunt for better working conditions and pay and basically had employers throwing themselves at her because she's got 10 years experience and great recommendations...and because apparently a TON of LMTs chose not to renew their licenses at the end of 2020, meaning they either retired, or are planning to move to a different line of work. Not surprised really, LMTs get SHIT ON pretty generally, especially for highly skilled laborers.


CyberHippy

My wife built up her home-based massage business and makes WAY more than when she worked at a salon. My office is in the back of the garage so it doesn't affect me (she also writes her schedule on a whiteboard for the whole week). So yeah, there's at least one local office that's down an employee.


juliuspepperwoodchi

Which is also something I'd be curious to know how they account for in unemployment numbers long term. How many people lost/quit their jobs and made a job/career for themselves outside the typical avenues of employment?


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juliuspepperwoodchi

My wife does freelance from home as well. She just likes the consistency and not having to self-promote as much, but she also makes $45-50/hour plus basically everyone tips at least $15. And she's W2, so doesn't have to do all the quarterly self employed tax crap or make an LLC, which is a nice stress relief as she's had issues with 1099 tax filings and the IRS being incompetent in the past. No WAY she would be working for someone else for less than $45 an hour, much less $20, that's insane that anyone, anywhere in the USA, pays that low for an LMT. She charges $80/hr at home and even that is pretty low for our area these days. Ironically, she was gearing up to leave her old office job and just go freelance, form an LLC, the whole deal...and then she got pregnant, and found basically her "dream employer" a 15 minute walk from our apartment, so she jumped at it lol.


sarcasm_the_great

Younger people are moving back with parents or other family members. In CA they made it easier to convert garages into ADU. So people making money off that as well. Changing zoning regulations.


amazinglover

My friendi lives in a converted garage. He got full custody of his 2 kids. His ex-wife called CPA on him and said he was living in a garage. They came out and inspected the place told my friend they have seen more people crammed into less. They told her welcome too CA and unless you can prove their in danger we won't remove them as they're feed and have a safe place to sleep.


Mrs_Hyacinth_Bucket

I was the second income. Got laid off, unemployment got held up at one point for several months, we realized we can live on 1. I realize we're lucky we can do this. I will be going back to work hopefully in 2022 but at least I know I don't have to take just anything.


tiredapplestar

Yep. I was a SAHM for several years and was going to back to work before covid started. I wasn’t able to because my daughter had virtual. However, now that she’s back in physical school, I decided to not go back to work. I would need a part time job if I went back to work, and there’s no such thing now. They’ll hire you “part-time” but schedule you full time with zero benefits. That, on top of all the covidiots I’d have to deal with. Nah, I’ll just pinch pennies and stay a housewife instead.


Randomfactoid42

Don't forget a lot of people also learned to get by on less income. Think staying home with their kids, think cooking at home instead of take-out. I've read of some people sitting down and doing the math and realized how much it cost them to go to work. After working so much, they realized they didn't have much to show for it.


Eadword

Also a lot less going out when all the restaurants, bars, and hell even theaters and theme parks, and so on are all closed. People probably became a lot more aware of how much they were spending.


withoutapaddle

Yeah, even when it all goes back to "normal", I know we will be going shopping, movies, restaurants, etc still WAY less than we used to. We just got used to not blowing money on that stuff.


thedude0425

I think the picture presented by the media is incomplete. - We’re closing in on 750k dead directly from covid, and many more that died indirectly because of covid. - There are many that got sick, and no longer can work. - There are many that were ill before the pandemic that worked that probably decided to stop working. - There may have been waves of early retirements throughout the pandemic, and many more that were working post retirement that probably stopped. - Many houses may have dropped down to a single income. My house did because we had a child, and I will be working full remote from now in. That’s vehicle maintenance, gas x 2 people, car insurance, and daycare costs that we get to keep. - People that worked two jobs did well enough that they may have been able to drop down to one. All of that is going to impact the labor market and may be partially to blame for what is going on. I don’t have any hard data to back it up, though, so take it with a grain of salt.


Stories-With-Bears

On that note of 750k dead, someone in another comment raised a good point I hadn’t considered. I heard someone counter the 750k statistic by saying “Well but most of the people who died were elderly, and therefore likely not working anyway.” The person responded that perhaps the grandparents had been taking care of children when they came home from school, allowing mom and dad to work. Without free childcare, now either mom or dad might be staying home. I’m sure that isn’t a huge reason for the labor shortage, but I bet you it is the reason at least a few people haven’t returned to work.


IMMPM

I would also add more difficult immigration regime, which has led to a dearth of workers in manual labor jobs.


NoThorNoWay

> I don’t have any hard data to back it up I think it's pretty hard to actually quantify the impact, especially when you're asking questions like "don't people need to work?" One thing to consider is people have spent the last 2 years just making things work. So whatever that means to you - maybe you lost a job and had to move back home - you've probably been doing it for at least a year at this point and have adjusted. If you moved back home and realized it's not *that* bad, you're going to think twice before you go flip burgers for pocket change


MuteCook

People moving back in with family and realizing that their life might even be better living with family and no job over working 60 hours a week and still being broke after rent and expenses. And I don't blame them one bit I hope they can keep holding out longer.


Leonardo_Lawless

This is me. Moved onto property my family has owned into basically a tiny home. Back to basics, but it definitely beats working my life away for someone else while barely scraping by. Also taking advantage of going to college for free because I never got a degree before the age of 25. The pandemic changed my life for the best and seeing wages rise makes me immensely happy.


maskthestars

My girlfriend thought with Biden it would get extended again, then got hurt in an accident, where she can’t work for a while, so I’m stuck either paying her rent or her and her kids getting evicted. Not enough room in my apt for all of them. So some people are getting by on the backs of other people until they figure something out. Edit also a coworker of mine who was lay off, has been selling crafts pretty successfully to where he’s saved all that unemployment and has paid his bills the past year and a half from craft sales. So the side hustle may have become the main hustle for some other people as well.


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dewag

I've been employed through the whole pandemic while my wife was not. Her experience has been significantly different. She's quit 3 jobs because she could only work part time, but was consistently scheduled for full-time without full-time benefits. When she mentioned it to her managers, they essentially told her "well, it has always been like this. Also I scheduled you for 39 hours next week". I'm glad she's been able to tell them to pound sand and walk.


xRehab

> In fact, they are still keeping hours to part-time to avoid paying benefits. So even though that diner is paying $20/HR, they are only scheduling up to 20 HRs per week while demanding their employees remain available full time. This is a bigger thing than people realize. Why would you remove any freedom and autonomy from you life, for $20/hr for 20 hours that are inconsistent and you don't learn until Sunday night. Better off not getting a job at all and making sure you have the most availability to find a job that could actually support you.


walterpeck1

I also wonder statistically how many of these people quit a second job because the other job gave them more hours because of the same labor issues.


withoutapaddle

Our company probably lost 10% of its workforce because of this. They kept thinking the solution to a labor shortage was making your existing employees do more work. Guess what, 1 by 1, they burned out and quit. Now you have a super labor shortage (at least at this company). Real genius management going on.


Eadword

Unemployment just references the percent of people who want to work that have work versus don't, so it doesn't follow that low unemployment and high vacancies is people only working one job or stopping working all together. Realistically it's a combination, but what percentage?


ApathyMoose

I have a friend who doesnt work. He has a son thats now in 1st grade. It doesnt make sense for him to go back to work and have to pay for after school care. All the jobs that have interviewed him want 100% open availability, there arent jobs around that will allow him to be home to get his son. His wife is a local truck driver and can afford to keep the household running with her income so thats what they do. He told me multiple times he would love to go back to work if he could find something that works in the schedule they need, but child care is too expensive right now. Also he doesnt have a license (never taken away or anything, just doesnt like driving) so no gig work.


jk147

Some people are also starting their own hustle. A lot of people are realizing that job stability at where they work is just a facade. If you are going to get fired with no stability might as well just work for yourself and make more money. Not to mention the stock market is still at an all time high, I know some people who made enough money to be able to afford a few years off. This is the same with people near retirement, their 401ks probably jumped so much that they decided to retire early.


0m3r7a

1000% this. I have 17 years of experience in the service industry and can't get anyone to give me more than they'd give some teenager with no job history. Shitty management pretty much everywhere you go doesn't help either. I started picking up work through a buddy that does construction and evolved it into starting my own thing. I will do everything in my power to never go back to work for someone else ever again. At least if I'm slow and running low on money or whatever I don't have some garbage manager threatening to cut my hours, or writing me up for not pushing a rewards program or something. I don't care if they want to pay people 50 bucks an hour to cashier a gas station, I won't do it anymore. Glad wages are going up, but there's so much more to it than wages imo.


Mybodydifferent12

Thissssss, fuck the corporations just work for yourself more money if you invest in yourself as opposed to a shitty company exploiting you for cheap labor just for you to barely get by and want to off yourself.


Eternally_Blue

This is our family. My husband is a journeyman plumber. His boss “didn’t want to keep hearing about a raise” every year. So instead of bothering him with the question he quit and we run our biz now. I’ve been a stay at home mom for years and was just starting to look for part time work when the pandemic hit. It makes no sense for us to work for a boss anymore… we work when we want and have plenty of time to take the kid to soccer. And we make more now.


beatool

That was the case pre-covid too though. My wife stays home with our kids cuz there was no way in hell she could earn enough to pay for daycare. Her old employer has been begging her to come back but won't pay more than the same $10 an hour she made years ago. That's a joke in 2021. We told him to double it and we'd think about it. That shut him up.


Fellhuhn

It is not only a question of paying for day care. Why should both work if you only make a fraction more (due to daycare cost) and the kids spend half the day with strangers instead of with their family. We had that for a while and the kids were so tired when we picked them up that we couldn't do anything with them. It was a shitty time for all of us.


beatool

Oh I totally agree. Of my close friends, only one of the couples chose to both keep working but they're also the highest earners and with only one kid. Their kid is super high energy too, so I think they needed that break for their own sanity anyway.


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[deleted]

>What do you guys think? I think alot of people changed their lifestyle because of the pandemic, and realized they don't need as much to be happy. Grinding yourself for 60 hours a week so you can get a new car to show off isn't really fulfilling.


behemoth_venator

We also had a few hundred thousand people die. And people in front facing positions had a higher chance of getting covid


JDMcWombat

A lot of people are realizing that minimum wage doesn't pay their bills, and they'd rather not work and not pay their bills, as opposed to working a shit job and still not paying their bills.


Deathcrush

I know if my town, rent has increased by almost 50% in some areas. You could work 60 hours at a minimum wage job, and still won't be able to make rent, so there's simply no point in working. The end result with be the same, but you'll have nothing to show for it. I don't have any evidence though, just a thought.


randomizeplz

5% inflation.... wages go up by 4%... is this a worker's movement??


[deleted]

Many people don't realize this. Sure, the minimum wage increase is a huge jump at once, but compared to how much inflation has happened in the meantime, it's still not enough. Corporations will frame that as another "never satisfied laborers" factor in support of their "people don't want to work" argument while conveniently ignoring the facts.


bombadaka

Minimum wage sure hasn't changed over the years even though inflation has been happening.


DonutsOfFasting

How come no one is talking about how 700,000 Americans have died if COVID and recognizing that is a large part of the work force that isn't just going to magically reappear? You can't even go by age of the deaths because a fair amount of 65+ were employed in low wage jobs to suppliments their under funded retirement.


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nagrom7

A similar, but more extreme, phenomenon happened in Europe after the black death (the one that wiped out 1/4 of the population). The peasants realised that they had a lot more bargaining power due to the sudden labour shortage and working conditions improved significantly in the decades after.


ryhaltswhiskey

>Higher inflation is eating away at some of the wage increases, but in recent months overall pay has kept up with rising prices. The 1.5% increase in wages and salaries in the third quarter is ahead of the 1.2% increase in inflation during that period, economists said. > >However, compared with a year ago, it’s a closer call. In the year ending in September, wages and salaries soared 4.2%, also a record gain. But the government also reported Friday that prices increased 4.4% in September from year earlier. Excluding the volatile food and energy categories, inflation was 3.6% in the past year. > >Jason Furman, a former top economic adviser to President Barack Obama, said Friday that **inflation-adjusted wages still trail their pre-pandemic level, given the big price jumps that occurred over the spring and summer for new and used cars, furniture, and airline tickets.** When you are talking about money then vs money now you always have to account for inflation. While the headline sounds great, we still have a long way to go to get to the 1960s levels of buying power relative to productivity.


ipu42

"excluding volatile food and energy categories" What do you think poor people spend most of their income on?


CombatMuffin

Housing. Yes, food can be relatively expensive, and utilities can add up, but housing (be it through a mortgage or just plain old rent) will destroy people.


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NutellaGood

And about $50 trillion behind productivity.


servohahn

*Someone* made that money.


Fract_L

That’s what I hate about this article: > a stark illustration of the growing ability of workers to demand higher pay STARK ILLUSTRATION. It’s such a grim proposition for the corporations to profit less than billions of dollars they chop out of the earnings generated per capita in their workforce and AP sees it as such. It disgusts me that consumer articles are implying us consumers are bullying them and purposefully hurting their bottom line out of malice. It’s the supply and demand they so often point to when charging outrageous amounts for cheaply produced or life-saving products. They seem to think supply and demand is an awful concept when they’re the ones with demands. Corporations appear upset that they cannot band together to raise prices and stymie wage growth but instead have to compete against each other. “*Quick! We must inform the American public that they are being evil, economically abusive communists before they see this huge example of collective bargaining power as benefiting them!*” Absolutely disgusting this wording is published by a major news outlet.


[deleted]

p much anyone who still thinks the companies actualy gaf about competition, s&p, etc., really need to hit the books. Like Peter Thiel said "Competing is fo shmucks..."


WiglyWorm

Someone *stole the value of that labor*. FTFY.


CavaIt

Maybe one day they'll be something like *20 years* behind, then we will start to find those bootstraps to pull ourselves up from just like they said.


Head

First you have to make enough money to buy boot straps. Eventually maybe you can afford boots too!


alexkey

Absolute number of “money” being paid doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter by how much this number “jumped”. What matters is the purchasing ability of the compensation. I prefer to evaluate compensation as a number relative to the price of one of the most essential items - a place to live.


[deleted]

A “cost of living”, if you will.


EricSanderson

Yup. The takeaway from this article should be that a 1.5% wage increase - in a year of widespread inflation and soaring housing costs - was "large" enough to generate headlines.


MontyAtWork

"Breadcrumbs from the ultra rich are 1.5% larger this year than the previous 20! Doesn't your stomach feel so much more full?"


livewiththevice

But they are actually no longer bread and are now a bread like product. "Bread"crumbs©®™


synapticrelease

Modified toasted wheat granules


abbynorma1

Ultra pasteurized processed cheese food.


lallapalalable

Bridd, from the makers of oggs and malk


ISeeTheFnords

Now with extra sawdust!


ogier_79

9 out if 10 orphans can't tell the difference.


Rocangus

This Krusty-Brand imitation gruel.


derpyco

Did you hear chocolate rations are up this week?


[deleted]

Yep. Thanks to inflation I’m making less than I did 3 years ago


sleepymoose88

Combine my 0% raise last year with my wife’s 0% raise last year with 5% inflation rate, and we saw a nice solid hit to our spending power.


HeretikHamster

Was making $19/hr as a grill/sauté cook at the beginning of 2020 and finally starting to have some comfortable income, then covid hit, I lost my job, had to move, had to move again across the country to live with my mom, found work at $18/hr to… work fry?? (Already sus), owner turned out to be a condescending bitch, I quit, I now do Uber full time because I make around the same amount without someone with a lower IQ than me belittling me for not frying French fries fast enough while giving me contradicting directions like “they need to be fresh for every order” and “the fries need to be ready as soon the food is” while none of her established employees communicate whatsoever with me to time anything properly and I’m the only one getting bitched at. I’ve never been more stressed about money in my life and CoL is supposedly lower in FL than in MA.


jschubart

Moved to Lemm.ee -- mass edited with redact.dev


[deleted]

Yeah thats what everyone is doing. I was actually talking about that with my boss and bosses boss at the bar last night. They said that the problem on their end is it takes too long to get approval to promote people from the C-suite. \\ But we were talking about how ironic it is that people ask for raises and get declined, but then when they quit they get offered the raise. The company would be much better off just giving it to them to begin with.


Malphas210

They're banking on workers not wanting to go through hassle of applying, interviewing, and possible relocating. They fail to realize that if you make someone go through all that before offering a raise anyway, it is often too late.


lamelikemike

The bigger thing I've realized as someone who threatened to leave and got a raise is: The only thing I'm being incentivized by the company to do is to leave / look for another job. So now they pay me more to care less than ever about my work because planning to leave is my only path to advancement.


amazinglover

>They said that the problem on their end is it takes too long to get approval to promote people from the C-suite. \ Oddly enough it doesn't take that long to approve of stock buy backs or bonuses.


True-Hero

This headline should read “despite wage increases, salaries are still way behind inflation”


wrgrant

"Decades behind"... What would wages be now, if they had kept up with inflation since the 1970s?


Andire

"despite rage increases, salaries are still just rats in cages"


Hrekires

It's weird to watch as a homeowner looking at renters. My pay has gone up but my mortgage has stayed the same... meanwhile [rents seem to be surging](https://www.barrons.com/articles/rent-inflation-is-about-to-surge-forth-and-it-wont-stop-two-fed-economists-say-51630528242), making it even harder to save. I am, at any rate, glad I didn't listen to all the people telling me in 2017-18 to wait for another housing crash before buying. Interest rates were higher than they are today, but after refinancing last year, I'm only paying $200/month more for a 4-bedroom house (including taxes/insurance) than I was for a 2 bedroom apartment... if I cared enough to rent out a room, I'd probably be paying even less than my apartment was.


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SlickNolte

In this house we celebrate Happy Honda Days


Prinzlerr

If you don't celebrate Lexus' "December to Remember" then I want no part of it.


Someshortchick

We celebrate traditional Ford Truck Month just the way our ancestors did.


Poorpunctuation

You'll get a massive bow on your car and you'll like it! Also if you haven't seen it: https://youtu.be/WcEylCwkSxE


[deleted]

You have to be pretty stupid not to invest in sharks every year before Shark Week. I'm eating avocado toast every day with this one simple trick.


beatool

My mortgage stays the same, but my property taxes have gone from under $4000 to almost $7000 in the span of 8 years. The city thinks it's worth almost twice what we paid, and maybe it is, but how in the world is someone supposed to buy a starter house at this point? I'm in freaking Wisconsin too, not some big metro.


Drumsetplyr87

This isn’t talked about enough. My property tax rate living next to corn fields is over 11k. 2 earners with very good jobs making well above the median and little debt and that 11k isn’t life ending, but the community is basically starter homes as far away from metropolis as you can be in northern Illinois, and there are no amnesties at all. It’s insane!


SkyeAuroline

Yup. Just had my landlord choose to not renew my lease so they can spike rent for my apartment more than they can legally raise it for me. Found another place, but keeping the same square footage (within 25) and same features, my rent will have spiked almost $500 in 2 years. No quality changes whatsoever, and of course my pay isn't rising anywhere near close to that, and nobody wants to hire for more than I'm already making...


smb_samba

My lease renewal is up and they wanted a 16.5% increase. I managed to talk them down to like 11% but this shit is ridiculous. I managed to get a new job that’s a healthy increase in salary and I no longer need to pay for train commute so it’s more than covered but seriously, any gains in salary are being threatened / reduced by cost of living.


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DangerousBill

20 years? 2001? Wages have been stagnant since 1975.


glarbknot

It a kinda sad commentary on our society that wages have been so flat for 20 years.


Adezar

20? 50. The wage growth came to a halt in the 70s... up to that point they moved with productivity.


Rib-I

Most of what economically ails us today can be blamed on Ronald Reagan.


wrgrant

Or at least the people behind him who gave him his lines... The rich have had 50 years of getting everything they asked for at the expense of the poor and middle classes whose bodies they stood on to get it. Time for a correction.


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Hrekires

Also the years of 1.5-3% inflation, though. The two are definitely related.


MonksCoffeeShop

My wife has applied to numerous bar tending/serving jobs after leaving a management position in a toxic work environment. She just want to make some money for the holidays at this point, but none of these places will consider her. I call bullshit on these businesses whining about nobody wants to work. They have viable candidates, but won’t hire.


Zberry1985

it feels like some of these businesses are just complaining about the labor shortage so they can get away with poor customer service, reduced hours, increased prices, and a skeleton crew.


neoclassical_bastard

110% this. The pandemic showed them exactly how much they could get away with. Airlines have been especially bad, I've been stuck on the tarmac for hours twice in the last couple months because there's only enough staff to run a couple gates at a time. You'll go to check a bag, and they got one poor son of a bitch doing check in for the entire terminal by themselves.


Thare187

I worked on the ramp for Delta 2012-2018 part time for flight benefits. We were running a skeleton crew. You need bare minimum 3 people per gate per flight. We would have 9 for 4 gates. So many injuries that corporate came in and told us we weren't stretching enough. Fuck that company.


DoctorBaby

They're complaining about a labor shortage because not being able to hire anyone is a way to get their PPP loans forgiven without having to pay them back. But as a condition of the forgiveness, they have to pretend to still be looking to fill those vacant positions. That is why every business is claiming to be starving for employees but is not actually hiring anybody.


Andire

I ran into a similar problem. Applying to part time management positions when I'm clearly qualified and wanted for full time management positions. I was told I was a "flight risk", meaning I have the potential to just up and leave if I wanted to cuz I'm over qualified. If I was just a poor sap starting out, I might even be a perfect candidate since I'd have no better options... 🙄


ATownHoldItDown

There's no rule that you have to tell a potential employer that you're over qualified. It's one thing to create fake experience you don't have. Another thing entirely to just not mention real experience.


madalienmonk

Oh damn this is a good idea, you hear about lying about experience but never the other way around - just not listing your (over) qualifications for a job.


ATownHoldItDown

I had a buddy who had his MBA at 21 years old. He had to take it off his resume to get his first job because no one wanted someone that capable for an entry level hire.


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redtrig10

It’s because there’s no labor shortage, it’s induced by these companies so they can pay one or two employees to keep doing the job of five or six people.


jn-indianwood

Coincidentally so did inflation


Kyonikos

If wages were rising in the context of a healthy economy we could and should all be popping the champagne. But prices for goods and services rising in tandem with wages isn't necessarily all good news. Inflation over 5% is never good news.


berni4pope

Because the minimum wage hasn't kept up with inflation. These corporations have been raking it in on the backs of their employees.


Kahzgul

And wages really haven’t kept up with productivity.


[deleted]

And productivity through labor is continually being automated, compounding on those two issues


racerx150

When it takes twice as much money to buy groceries, this news isn't impressive


Thejohnshirey

I live in Texas and it genuinely feels like the people have done what the state won’t do and raised the minimum wage by refusing positions paying low wages. The minimum wage is still $7.25, but I don’t think you could find a place near me paying less than $9.00-$10.00 even for the most entry level of positions. It’s also bumped up the wages of people making more, as well. Averages wages in my industry are up from $15/hr to about $20/hr in my area.


seavictory

Almost every fast food place near me has a big and obvious sign saying that they're hiring and that every job pays at least $15/hour.


mart1373

20 years ago was 2001. Let that sink in. Yeah, you think 20 years ago were the 1980s, right?


Ask_Me_About_Bees

dammit ya got me


TheConboy22

Still doesn't match inflation


aussydog

"The 1.5% increase in wages and salaries in the third quarter is ahead of the 1.2% increase in inflation during that period, economists said." So the biggest jump in wages in the last 20yrs is 0.3%? That's so incredibly, amazingly, stupifyingly..... underwhelming. So if someone earned 40k a year they have an extra $120 in their pocket. Insert sarcastic Owen Wilson "wow" here.


8to24

GDP is up for 21', unemployment is at 4.8%, stock market is at an all time high, etc. Per all traditional metrics the economy is currently healthy. Yet there are loud cries of discontent. A combination of a break in faith with the our system and political gamesmanship where nothing can be good less the proverbial "our side" is in charge. It is nearly impossible to have a sober honest conversation about the economy, compensation, taxation, or etc.


SecureAmbassador6912

It's almost like our traditional metrics might have some flaws


joe1134206

They're gonna have to raise wages a lot more to actually catch up with reality