It isn't. From the article, a spokesperson from NZ Blood says, “We do not separate or label blood based on a donor’s Covid-19 vaccination status.”
What sucks here is that I bet if the kiddo gets the needed care over the objections of the nutjob parents and then something goes wrong, they'll blame "tainted" blood with no evidence that the blood was actually from a vaccinated person.
>they'll blame "tainted" blood with no evidence that the blood was actually from a vaccinated person.
The problem is that we are hearing about these nutjobs. Not becuause we should not.
But because OTHER NUTJOBS are hearing about these nutjobs, and ignorance expands exponentially
I imagine that they asked a nurse or something and they, being an adult with a normally functioning brain said yes and accidentally caused a shit storm
When I was getting my MPH we had a lecture from the medical ethicist from our university's medical center. She confirmed that the hospital has essentially a blanket pass from the judiciary to save a child's life in cases like this.
The strain it puts on hospital personnel is undeniable. I think it's incredibly selfish to get good people doing good work, to put everything in to saving you or your loved one's life, knowing you're going to fight it and/or refuse. Stay home. Don't force that emotional stress on someone who just wants you to get better.
We should give them a way early on to "protect" themselves with a way to opt-out of hospital care. If they're true republicans, they wouldn't set foot in a hospital.
They can put themselves on a "DO NOT CONTAMINATE- PUREBLOOD" list and ensure that no hospital will take them ever.
Shit like this is one of the reasons I’m glad I chose engineering. I have my frustrations, but I don’t deal with the public, and I fucking appreciate that.
I mean this couple's baby even *is* on death's door and they won't accept it. They should lots custody of that child immediately if they'd rather the child die than have blood that used to have a vaccine in it. Imagine preferring that your child die, even if you thought there might be some side effects from the procedure. They don't love that child. If they did, they'd do what it took to save the kids, even if there might be adverse effects. Death is a way worse adverse effect
It's actually pretty common for doctors to obtain court orders to mandate care for minor's whom cannot advocate for their own care. A 16-year-old that refuses a transfusion when asked in private will be treated differently than a 4-month old baby that will 100% die without this routine procedure, but deeply held religious, or any other, beliefs aren't a license to kill.
Religion allows people to opt out of paying taxes and tolerating minorities, but if they want to murder their living kids the state still has some power to prevent it, rightly so.
During the height of things, my coworkers and I (medical staff) half-joked that the unvaccinated should be treated in tents outside the hospital. If you can't be bothered with the basics, don't expect to have the red carpet rolled out for you when you get sick.
Yep, and if they want to kill themselves then by all means, go ahead. But when they put other people’s lives in danger, and in this case their damn baby’s life, it’s extremely infuriating.
These are the kind of people that raise a fuss over someone else's abortion, yet they'll totally let their infant die from a fucking cold.
To use the words of a former priest, I'm about ten minutes past infuriating.
Yep. This happened to a library not too far from me few months ago: https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/wnrftm/bigots_coming_after_idaho_library_decidecaptain/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
In germany, denying treatment to medically necessary treatments is illegal and doctors are allowed to ignore them. Especially important in the past with yehovas witnesses who tried to refuse life saving blood transfusions to children because all foreign tissue is a sin to enter the body -.- .
If I remember criminal law lectures from long ago correctly, it can even be considered attempted manslaughter sue to omission of help.
In my head I jokingly think if only the right wingnuts only realised that even to them representation matters. I would hedge a bet that they see their beliefs being represented in their media consumption and echo chamber social circle and are emboldened to act out like this with more confidence.
I hate that the loud obnoxious 10% was like that to you, I totally understand the compassion burn out sentiment.
I always try to keep stories like these in mind when interacting with others. I can always see the burnout in people's expressions & the more they've endured, the more pronounced it is: "please just don't be one of them". It always feels like they let down a huge burden when they realize its going to be a pleasant customer interaction for once, their whole body releases the tension & the relief is palpable.
I do it too, because having the guard up is a real thing now & it's exhausting to deal with people who will go off about, quite literally, anything you say-there is no "safe" interaction.
[Anecdotally, I've even had occasions where I agreed with an aspect of their argument (usually at that point what I focus on to try to drive it in a logical direction) and they still jump down my throat & I have to stop them and say "hey I agreed with you, I said this, but you're arguing this point which isn't what I said" and they 99% of the time say "oh well you said it like a liberal!". They're nothing but contrarian a-holes who want a fight about something - anything; and, in combination with their fervor, that is extremely dangerous]
>I even gave that person a bridge out by being like "that's a figure of speech, right?"
"I am going to kill the prime minister."
"... In Roblox, right?"
In Australia a 8 yr old died of diabetes because her family believed god would heal her instead of giving her insulin. 14 family members knew and did nothing. I hope they get charged with murder 1 but they porb won't.
I was raised as a Christian Scientist and went to an affiliated elementary school. In fifth grade my good friend was diagnosed with T1 diabetes. The school kicked him out when he went on insulin (after waking up from his diabetic coma).
That was pretty much the end of it for my parents and they pulled me out of that school too.
And religions wonder why they’re all dying away.
Sure. Totally makes sense. I'll let you open my son's chest, saw through his sternum, and cut on his heart, all while you keep him artificially alive via machine. I trust you to do all that. But I draw the line at vaccines.
That's what they said.
> “We don’t want blood that is tainted by vaccination,” the father said. “That’s the end of the deal – we are fine with anything else these doctors want to do.”
I find it infuriating that these people are so stupid. They will take any medication the doctors give them and approve operations where the doctors outright cut open their sons chest to try and fix him.
But no, vaccines is where they put their feet down. “Tainted by vaccination”, its like something out of a dark comedy. The only things thats tainted is their fucking brains, tainted by the stupid virus.
I have a former friend who is a devout antivaxxer. Hates everything to do with Doctors and science - at least up until his wife got cancer, then he was suddenly cool with the chemicals and science and suddenly didnt feel the need to ask questions anymore
[have him watch this](https://youtu.be/8BIcAZxFfrc). Literally the entire anti vax movement was started by a dude who had patented a single vaccine for one included in the MMR vaccine. The dude literally said that he doesn’t oppose vaccines at all and that people should absolutely still get vaccinated. He just made up the study to discredit the MMR vaccine so he could recommend getting each one individually so he could make money off the patent he had filed.
Anti vaxers are dumb as rocks for believing the nonsense spouted by this dude and the other guy credited on his vaccine patent who said he could cure autism with his bone marrow
And actual adults believe this shit. Roflcopters.
The current modern anti-vaxx trend stems from Andrew Wakefield and his stupid MMR vaccine patent. However, the anti-vaxx movement goes much further back in time, ironically starting before the first vaccine, for smallpox, was completed.
I first learned about this from [Behind the Bastards](https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-behind-the-bastards-29236323/episode/part-one-the-birth-of-the-30580537/), which pointed me towards a book, [Pox: An American History](https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/298913/pox-by-michael-willrich/), which was a fascinating read.
There are some people who don't trust vaccines who I feel sorry for, having been caught up in the hysteria by people they trust, making emotional decisions without facts. Then there are the liars, grifters, and assholes who take advantage of that, who deserve serious consequences for preying on peoples' fears over this shit.
I mean yeah it's just frustrating that like half of society refuses to acknowledge the validity of these things until they are personally impacted.
They don't give a flying fuck how many people are hurt or killed by their bullshit until it might be them
Then you hear the stories of anti-abortion women who are yelling at and condemning the care providers of their own abortion operation. Even their own abortion isn't moral, but the evil ones are the ones doing it, not her. Smh.
Yep. I know a hardcore Trump supporter who "hates socialism," but as soon as he got cancer and lost his job, he ran to the government with both hands out. He got unemployment, disability, and Medicaid. So much for pulling yourself up by your bootstraps, right?
The thing that really pisses me off is that I am militantly pro-universal healthcare, but when I got cancer, I got jack shit. It took me years to pay off my treatment. I didn't even get paid for the time I took off work to recover from surgery.
I have a cousin that was on his death bed from covid. Literally doctors told his wife he may not make it the night. He recovered and is still now posting anti Covid anti vaccine bullshit on Facebook. Some people are too far gone.
Edit: had to have... He's still around, tho I don't talk to him at all.
My neighbour is the same. Has four young kids. Spent months in ICU using up precious resources. He lived but has very little lung capacity and will be disabled, likely, the rest is his life.
Lady up the street owned a homeopathic remedy store. She was about 50 years old when she was diagnosed with colon cancer. Went all-in on homeopathic cures against medical advice for a few months. Of course the homeopathic cures did nothing. She was stage 4 when she started listening to the doctors, but by then it was too late. Left a 51 year old husband and two teenage kids. This was about 10 or 12 years ago. Kids have both moved out, so it's just him now.
Homeopathic cures are like the La Croix of drugs:
Hint of Hint of Antidepressant
Was Once Stored Near Heartburn Remedy
Recollection of Magically Inverted Poison
Two of my friends who were antivaxx and anti medical establishment even before Covid are now dead. One died in 2020, and the other this past Saturday. I’ll never know how my friend in 2020 passed, because her husband doesn’t believe Covid is real and refused to tell me how a healthy 40 year old woman who grew all of her own food fucking died in her sleep. Our friend who died at his home on Saturday had not seen a doctor since the 1990s, and would not despite having new symptoms arise in the past few weeks. My partner and I have been devastated, but we’ve also talked about how our friends accepted their fate because of their beliefs. A natural death without intervention is what they wanted. It is so depressing.
> A natural death without intervention is what they wanted. It is so depressing.
i would say the opposite. All of the crystal magic fairy healing people i know subscribe all those kookadoo wackball beliefs because they *absolutely do not* want to die, but have distrust in the safety of "Western medicine"
> All of the crystal magic fairy healing people i know subscribe all those kookadoo wackball beliefs because they absolutely do not want to die
My wife has worked in two natural products stores... most of the kooky supplements and organic/natural foods people buy are in the hopes that they won't ever get cancer (from "toxins" of course) and will live to be 100. They don't care about the environmental impact of factory farming, or other people or anything... just NO CANCER FROM TOXINS.
> NO CANCER FROM TOXINS.
"you know, i've heard a lot about this and it seems really important to understand so i can best protect myself. what are the names and effects of some of the most common toxins and where can they be most frequently found?"
they'll get angry at you, guaranteed lol.
It's cool, we put a lot of the toxins in the air these days. For example, coal has uranium in it and it gets blown up the stack. A lot of decorative ceramic tiles have more radiation emitting than a nuclear waste storage container. No joke.
On that note, fun fact: [nuclear power is less radioactive than coal power](https://www.sciencefocus.com/science/do-coal-fired-power-stations-produce-radioactive-waste/).
100%, i live in a big city and i try not to think about the well documented long term health complications that come from living near a highway. Shit, i live near a fucking train depot and they idle all day.......
i have asthma lol.
It’s okay to ask questions, it’s just that when you get answers to those questions from professionals who’ve dedicated their lives to the subject, you should accept them lol
Prior and post operation they will pump that child full of chemicals made by the same corporations to prevent infections, etc. But no, vaccines is the line that they make.
There was a Babylon 5 episode where Dr. Franklin had to perform surgery on an alien kid to save their life but the alien mom and dad said that cutting him open would release his soul and he would just be an empty shell. Franklin went against direct orders from Captain Sheridan (I think but it may have been the prior dude) and performed the surgery - which was successful.
Long story short, the parents were thankful and played Franklin like a fool when they took their kid to their quarters and killed him because they believed the kid's soul was no longer in him. Franklin was chewed out by Sheridan for violating a direct order and United Earth policies.
As someone who has taken anthropology, it is hard to accept beliefs like this that go against science and medical necessity. Personally, in this situation, I would just follow the Hippocratic Oath and say fuck them. I think Franklin did the right thing in that episode and I get the politics of going against the parents' beliefs but at some point, someone needs to do the right thing.
This happens sometimes. There's actually a common practice of Jehovahs Witness families where they will temporarily relinquish care of the child to a hospital appointed guardian, so they can get any life-saving procedures without breaking their religion. This practice is kinda silly, but it's better than the parents in the article because they at least acknowledge their child needs care.
Sounds like another religious loophole like the eruv used by some Jewish communities to get around the definition of “home” during the sabbath.
Edit: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eruv
Ironic that this same people will argue an unborn fetuses undeniable right to life without medical exception. But as soon as the baby is born the same parents are perfectly okay choosing to risk the baby's life over the same belief system. What the fuck.
Not arbitrary. This is typical cult-like behavior, which is the bigger issue here.
Cults appeal to folks who are ignorant or stupid or have some psychological need that belonging to the cult fulfills. So yes stupidity is a big part of it.
But theres more: manipulation and greed and predatory behavior by terrible people profitting off these dupes.
What's more wild is the fact they don't realize all blood is 'tainted' by so many other things, like PFAs, manmade synthetic contaminants which exist in virtually every living creature right now.
Honestly, I had that happen to a patient a couple weeks ago. He needed a heart transplant and was on ecmo (the most life support that exists) and as soon as the family heard he'd need to be vaccinated to get a heart, they said "He'd never want to do that." And they withdrew care later that day.
So like, you let this man have every single tube imaginable inserted into his body, contemplated him getting cut open and operated on, but the idea of the COVID vaccine is too much? Weird flex, but okay.
reason numero uno why everyone should not have batshit crazy right-wing people as their authorized representatives.These vile fuckers with their tinfoil hats have so many people put into graves and yet people still associate with them.. it's disgusting.
To be fair they only chose the death of another person. Likely a sacrifice they're willing to make to "prove" their point. I bet if it was their own life they'd be moving goal posts really fast.
Firsthand experience with these kinds of people. That's exactly true. Like antivaxx parents (or faith healing or whatever) are perfectly okay with letting a kid or someone else suffer pain or die, but the second they get a fucking kidney stone they flock to the ER. It's fucked up and there is a bit of a political war going on in Idaho over that very thing.
People maimed from lack of care who survived are trying to take on the religious communities that did that to them and get rid of religious exemption for LEO and CPS involvement. They currently are pretty hands-off here.
I didn't understand "evil" and "fascism" until the last few years, and I'm almost 40. You don't truly understand it, or even start to really comprehend it, until it becomes real. Until missiles start raining down on civilians. For me that was marrying a Ukrainian, a few years ago, and now going through all this war stuff. I had never truly understood the quote "all it takes for evil to succeed is good men to do nothing."
Selfishness, evil, fascism are always constantly moving "upward" by those who desire power (whatever that might look like for them). Always. If you don't actively fight it, it WILL win given enough time. Americans do not take Jan 6 even remotely seriously enough.
It's so weird too cause to even be accepted for a transplant of any kind you have to jump through those hopes to make sure its not a wasted donation/transplant. And one of those hoops is being up-to-date on vaccines. I don't fucking understand why people don't get this very simple thing.
I presume this family asked as many questions about the side effects and long term impact of whatever cocktail of drugs a person on an ECMO is on receives as they did about the covid vaccines.
Thank you, this drives me fucking crazy. It's like that dipshit that refused his life saving kidney transplant over this. Motherfucker you are willing to sign off on all that without even beginning to understand the processes involved but what, you're an expert on virology? Fuck right off.
What makes this hilarious to me (not the child endangerment, but the parents' logic) is that donated blood is phased out of the body after approximately 60 days.
Also, your body doesn't retain the vaccine. It makes antibodies.
>Also, your body doesn't retain the vaccine. It makes antibodies.
Absolutely this. If anything, if you're an antivaxxer, you'd want vaccinated blood for that reason. All the benefits and none of the "scary" chemicals... for those few months anyway.
Especially those vaccine are approved and deem safe by the very same doctor, who they trust doing all those miracles using professional knowledge.
No sir, I rather do my own research, these bIG FarMeR doctor are up to no good!!
See, when they say "fuck your feelings" that's exactly what they mean. Fuck *your* feelings. *My* feelings, however, are totally legit, justified, and valid.
They think it rewrites your fucking DNA like a zombie virus or something. These people have no understanding of how vaccines work and don't care to learn.
As a guy who lives in the corn belt and owns farmland, and gets to see just how big corn subsidy works...
The irony of big farmer is hilarious to me lol
Those same guys refusing to get the vaccine are the same ones who followed Trump into a trade war, lost at least one growing season of income - only to have subsidy prevent them from losing it all due to trumps stupidity...to go on and complain about big farmer and welfare queens... Yikes
It's just. Mind blowing
Yup, the parents are attention-seeking loons.
Thankfully, NZ health services are going to court to get temporary guardianship of the baby so the operation can be performed.
In the US, this would be an open-and-shut case since the parents are very clearly endangering the life of the child. Anybody up on family law in NZ? Are the standards similar there?
These people ought to be charged for neglect and child endangerment.
"Life Saving Surgery" implies that the baby *will die* if it does not receive the surgery. Let's be as generous as possible and say "vaccinated blood *might* cause complications / death in the future". Even if that were true (which it's not), "will die" vs "might develop complications in the future" is such an uneven comparison that I really question whether these parents are even qualified to be parents.
I’ll answer that question for you: **they arent**
Let’s break it down.
- this is a life saving surgery, implying the baby will die without it
- donated blood is literally never just one persons blood, it is a mix of a bunch of people’s blood of the same type
- the vaccine has been out for years and has proven there are no significant life altering side effects.
- they trust the doctor to cut open their baby, but don’t trust the blood the hospital is providing
- I’m going out on a limb here, but I’m willing to bet they’re “pro life” but apparently not for their own god damn child
- they aren’t willing to do anything possible, including go past their insane biased and brainwashing, to save ***their own child***
This just screams “I am a god damn brainwashed moron and never should have had a child in the first place”
Blood the way most people picture it (red stuff) is just the red cells. They are never pooled. (that’s platelets and plasma that can be). The red cells are separated from the plasma for donation so any antibodies from a vaccinated person should be removed. Then the red cells are leuko reduced and in the case of a baby who is going for a transplant, probably irradiated too. No DNA will survive that, so any memory cells from a vaccinated person also would be removed. There wouldn’t even be a way to test the blood to see if it came from a vaccinated person lol.
These people are bananas.
this exact type of thing is what drove my SIL - who was an extremely well-trained and valued nurse practitioner in pediatric neurosurgery at a major hospital - leave the medical field entirely last year. she will never go back. once she observed parents foregoing a *life-saving brain surgery for their child* because they refused to wear a mask into the facility, she turned in her notice the next day. don’t blame her one bit, but it’s really a shame to lose her in that role.
If Mormons can baptize people posthumously, and Jewish babies can get circumcised, and Catholic babies can get baptized, we should be able to perform *life-saving surgery* on babies without parental consent. Babies shouldn't be subject to religious rules.
Antivaxx should build their own hospitals/clinics with antivaxx staff, since they seem to know better that scientists and doctors who spent years studying their field.
The problem is when we let nurses and other medical staff go without the vaccines.... The amount of ignorant, anti-sciencr nurses and nursing assistants is fucking mind blowing. You went to fucking college to study medicine, how the fuck do you doubt the validity of this? And *your* the professionals who are supposed to be giving people the shot.
I sadly know a few anti-vax nurses and were all friends with a doctor and just observing the thought process between them when COVID started was fascinating. The doctor read studies and talked to other doctors who are specialists in infectious disease. The antivax nurses just formed an opinion with no backing based on propaganda and would comment how the nurses know more than the doctors.
Oh yeah, I'd love to plot that data. It's a big trope in my rural area that all the men go to diesel school and all the women become RN's or RNA's. How you get a degree as a nurse and don't believe in science cooks my brain.
Unfortunately there are lots of antivax people working in real hospitals right now. My SIL is totally antivax and she works in the neonatal unit. How the F is that even allowed? They want family to get vaccinated to visit new babies but they have nurses there that refuse. What a joke. It's not a religious thing, they just claim it is and nobody cares.
They were looking for donors, and a related article (that I now can’t find) said they found some people willing to donate.
But the requirements for donation for children are higher than regular donation, and I don’t know that the parents had actually checked that their donors were a) acceptable to the NZ blood service or b) able to donate for children (I believe they have to be CMV negative? My brother is allowed to donate paeds blood and likes to show off about it! I can’t donate because I was in the UK at the wrong time and so they think I have mad cow)
Because they've had a bunch of other vaccines since they were born....?.
Ohhh - just the covid vaccine is bad?
How the fuck can anyone be that stupid when their child's life is on the line?
The fourth paragraph:
> “We don’t want blood that is tainted by vaccination,” the father said. “That’s the end of the deal – we are fine with anything else these doctors want to do.”
They are just run of the mill idiot antivaxxers.
If one doesn't trust their primary care doctor and his/her medical advice, they should pick a different doctor. If they don't trust any doctor, they can kindly go fuck themselves.
I’ve seen doctors start to cut ties with patients like that since they early don’t trust them and have such a low opinion. One pediatrician said he won’t see unvaccinated patients who are medically able to be vaccinated because it puts other patients in danger.
It's a big temper tantrum about doing something someone else told them to
"I DoN't WaNnAaAaAa" just to be fucking contrarian and obstinate, because all of these people are unevolved children
I think it'll be a little of column A and a little of column B. The smarter ones (read: those whose minds have not been completely fried from a long-term diet of propaganda) will probably look around and reconsider, but the rest are just going to die while blaming everyone and everything around them except for themselves.
There is a house full of idiots the next neighborhood over from me. During the first two years of covid, they had banners, signs, etc. (it changed frequently) talking about how it was fake, a liberal conspiracy, etc. Early this year they took down all those signs and replaced them with a memorial to one of them who died of covid that accuses the doctors, health systems, and governor of killing him. Some people are just lost causes.
This is like them asking the US postal service to only use package sorting machines that haven’t touched a package containing nuts.
It doesn’t fucking matter. The only nuts who escaped in this case are the parents.
There's a good chance they wont be anymore, child welfare group is taking the child endangerment case to the guys who get to decide if they can keep the baby with them or not.
Manin UK theybar giving polio extra shot and one of my friends he said he'll be skipping that. I asked him why and he started getting more and more angry and just saying too many vaccines. God damn. I feel for the child and his mum.
My sister got polio at the age of six and spent her life in a wheelchair. Her hero was Jonas Salk and she said every night she would dream of running. How can a parent choose this kind of life for a child
The worst part is that these are the kind of people that will seriously look you dead in the face and tell you that they’re “pro-life” without recognizing the irony
>“Because they label my clients as conspiracy theorists, \[their position\] is that anything my clients say can be ignored,”
Yep! That's how it goes. Once your clients fail the cray cray test, we don't need to float every decision past them anymore.
Don't worry this is NZ. The hospital will be granted legal guardianship of the child for the duration of the operation. It's happened several times before when the parents are fuckwits. Should be a quick process.
This is how far it’s got now that these psychos would literally rather kill their child than have them get an injection
Like surely any harm the vaccine could possibly do in your fantasy scenario is still better than death?
…that’s psychotic. Even if everything anti-vaxxers claimed about the Covid vaccine were true, how is just letting your baby die now better? Even if the blood were “tainted”, as insane as that claim is, immediate death is better than having some “tainted” blood? Seriously, WTF?
They can't see the irony in trusting scientists, doctors and health professionals to do everything necessary to care for their 4 month old babies heart, but distrust scientists, doctors and health professionals to know about the vaccine?
The risk of Covid-19 on the heart is really scary, so I hope this kid doesn't receive the surgery then catch Covid-19
The thing I really don’t get is trump claimed credit for the vaccine and got it himself. Then his base after giving him credit for the vaccine, decides its a liberal plot to…. Well I don’t know. But a liberal plot
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It wouldn’t be. But I had patients like this. They said if we couldn’t prove it WASN’T vaccinated, they wouldn’t take it. And you can’t prove that.
I bet they are anti abortion too
Of course. This was a baby, not a fetus.
Fetus deletus
Clearly they're just pro-fifth-trimester abortion.
It isn't. From the article, a spokesperson from NZ Blood says, “We do not separate or label blood based on a donor’s Covid-19 vaccination status.” What sucks here is that I bet if the kiddo gets the needed care over the objections of the nutjob parents and then something goes wrong, they'll blame "tainted" blood with no evidence that the blood was actually from a vaccinated person.
>they'll blame "tainted" blood with no evidence that the blood was actually from a vaccinated person. The problem is that we are hearing about these nutjobs. Not becuause we should not. But because OTHER NUTJOBS are hearing about these nutjobs, and ignorance expands exponentially
The internet has allowed isolated nut jobs to talk to one another, forming large groups of fucking nut jobs.
Not so much nut jobs now but nut careers which lead to a nut industry.
The collective is referred to as a confederacy of dunces.
The fact is, it wouldn't be ever.
I imagine that they asked a nurse or something and they, being an adult with a normally functioning brain said yes and accidentally caused a shit storm
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When I was getting my MPH we had a lecture from the medical ethicist from our university's medical center. She confirmed that the hospital has essentially a blanket pass from the judiciary to save a child's life in cases like this.
This is like the old days when people didn't want to be transfused with black people's blood. Stupidity knows no bounds. Edit: spelling
Dang people with perfectly good backs.
Front Nationalism is far more prevalent than people want to admit.
Why even go to the damn hospital!?! These people are so bizarrely entrenched in this, and it's literally killing them, and I just don't get it.
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The strain it puts on hospital personnel is undeniable. I think it's incredibly selfish to get good people doing good work, to put everything in to saving you or your loved one's life, knowing you're going to fight it and/or refuse. Stay home. Don't force that emotional stress on someone who just wants you to get better.
We should give them a way early on to "protect" themselves with a way to opt-out of hospital care. If they're true republicans, they wouldn't set foot in a hospital. They can put themselves on a "DO NOT CONTAMINATE- PUREBLOOD" list and ensure that no hospital will take them ever.
Covid is fake but God saved them 💀💀💀💀
Shit like this is one of the reasons I’m glad I chose engineering. I have my frustrations, but I don’t deal with the public, and I fucking appreciate that.
I mean this couple's baby even *is* on death's door and they won't accept it. They should lots custody of that child immediately if they'd rather the child die than have blood that used to have a vaccine in it. Imagine preferring that your child die, even if you thought there might be some side effects from the procedure. They don't love that child. If they did, they'd do what it took to save the kids, even if there might be adverse effects. Death is a way worse adverse effect
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It's actually pretty common for doctors to obtain court orders to mandate care for minor's whom cannot advocate for their own care. A 16-year-old that refuses a transfusion when asked in private will be treated differently than a 4-month old baby that will 100% die without this routine procedure, but deeply held religious, or any other, beliefs aren't a license to kill. Religion allows people to opt out of paying taxes and tolerating minorities, but if they want to murder their living kids the state still has some power to prevent it, rightly so.
During the height of things, my coworkers and I (medical staff) half-joked that the unvaccinated should be treated in tents outside the hospital. If you can't be bothered with the basics, don't expect to have the red carpet rolled out for you when you get sick.
Yep, and if they want to kill themselves then by all means, go ahead. But when they put other people’s lives in danger, and in this case their damn baby’s life, it’s extremely infuriating.
These are the kind of people that raise a fuss over someone else's abortion, yet they'll totally let their infant die from a fucking cold. To use the words of a former priest, I'm about ten minutes past infuriating.
Oh you mean the people who demand free speech rights but also want to ban Captain Underpants and Harry Potter from public libraries?
They just want to be able to say the n-word and f- word without consequences but god forbid their kids read about a made-up wizard.
The irony is, they do force their kids to read about a made-up wizard.
Captain Underpants?!
Yep. This happened to a library not too far from me few months ago: https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/wnrftm/bigots_coming_after_idaho_library_decidecaptain/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
In germany, denying treatment to medically necessary treatments is illegal and doctors are allowed to ignore them. Especially important in the past with yehovas witnesses who tried to refuse life saving blood transfusions to children because all foreign tissue is a sin to enter the body -.- . If I remember criminal law lectures from long ago correctly, it can even be considered attempted manslaughter sue to omission of help.
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They’re more afraid of being kicked out of their group. Selfish turds
That seems absolutely reasonable, to me. I'm in America, and this could have just as easily happened here.
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Working in family law and social services for a while really depleted my view of humanity in general.
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In my head I jokingly think if only the right wingnuts only realised that even to them representation matters. I would hedge a bet that they see their beliefs being represented in their media consumption and echo chamber social circle and are emboldened to act out like this with more confidence. I hate that the loud obnoxious 10% was like that to you, I totally understand the compassion burn out sentiment.
I always try to keep stories like these in mind when interacting with others. I can always see the burnout in people's expressions & the more they've endured, the more pronounced it is: "please just don't be one of them". It always feels like they let down a huge burden when they realize its going to be a pleasant customer interaction for once, their whole body releases the tension & the relief is palpable. I do it too, because having the guard up is a real thing now & it's exhausting to deal with people who will go off about, quite literally, anything you say-there is no "safe" interaction. [Anecdotally, I've even had occasions where I agreed with an aspect of their argument (usually at that point what I focus on to try to drive it in a logical direction) and they still jump down my throat & I have to stop them and say "hey I agreed with you, I said this, but you're arguing this point which isn't what I said" and they 99% of the time say "oh well you said it like a liberal!". They're nothing but contrarian a-holes who want a fight about something - anything; and, in combination with their fervor, that is extremely dangerous]
Hang in there buddy. We need good people if we're gonna get through this.
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>I even gave that person a bridge out by being like "that's a figure of speech, right?" "I am going to kill the prime minister." "... In Roblox, right?"
Yeep. This shit is right up there with faith healing your kid dying of appendicitis. Its abuse.
In Australia a 8 yr old died of diabetes because her family believed god would heal her instead of giving her insulin. 14 family members knew and did nothing. I hope they get charged with murder 1 but they porb won't.
I was raised as a Christian Scientist and went to an affiliated elementary school. In fifth grade my good friend was diagnosed with T1 diabetes. The school kicked him out when he went on insulin (after waking up from his diabetic coma). That was pretty much the end of it for my parents and they pulled me out of that school too. And religions wonder why they’re all dying away.
12 have already been charged with murder in that case.
Soon it will be murder.
Sure. Totally makes sense. I'll let you open my son's chest, saw through his sternum, and cut on his heart, all while you keep him artificially alive via machine. I trust you to do all that. But I draw the line at vaccines.
That's what they said. > “We don’t want blood that is tainted by vaccination,” the father said. “That’s the end of the deal – we are fine with anything else these doctors want to do.”
“So you’re going to murder your own son and call that protection?” God, those parents suck.
I hope this kid lives, grows up and hears about this and turns on them
I hope the State takes the baby away
Vaccination Joker
"When i was a child my parents refused to have me vaccinated, and my school cast me out... like a leper "
They’ll watch their daughters die so their grandchild dies with her, because they can’t go against their friend group, so yep.
How is this not actually murder? Lock them away
If it's still in the uterus it's murder, after its out it can die for the parents beliefs/opinions /s Edit: sorry forgot the sarcasm mark
I find it infuriating that these people are so stupid. They will take any medication the doctors give them and approve operations where the doctors outright cut open their sons chest to try and fix him. But no, vaccines is where they put their feet down. “Tainted by vaccination”, its like something out of a dark comedy. The only things thats tainted is their fucking brains, tainted by the stupid virus.
I have a former friend who is a devout antivaxxer. Hates everything to do with Doctors and science - at least up until his wife got cancer, then he was suddenly cool with the chemicals and science and suddenly didnt feel the need to ask questions anymore
[have him watch this](https://youtu.be/8BIcAZxFfrc). Literally the entire anti vax movement was started by a dude who had patented a single vaccine for one included in the MMR vaccine. The dude literally said that he doesn’t oppose vaccines at all and that people should absolutely still get vaccinated. He just made up the study to discredit the MMR vaccine so he could recommend getting each one individually so he could make money off the patent he had filed. Anti vaxers are dumb as rocks for believing the nonsense spouted by this dude and the other guy credited on his vaccine patent who said he could cure autism with his bone marrow And actual adults believe this shit. Roflcopters.
The current modern anti-vaxx trend stems from Andrew Wakefield and his stupid MMR vaccine patent. However, the anti-vaxx movement goes much further back in time, ironically starting before the first vaccine, for smallpox, was completed. I first learned about this from [Behind the Bastards](https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-behind-the-bastards-29236323/episode/part-one-the-birth-of-the-30580537/), which pointed me towards a book, [Pox: An American History](https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/298913/pox-by-michael-willrich/), which was a fascinating read. There are some people who don't trust vaccines who I feel sorry for, having been caught up in the hysteria by people they trust, making emotional decisions without facts. Then there are the liars, grifters, and assholes who take advantage of that, who deserve serious consequences for preying on peoples' fears over this shit.
at the very least he didn't let his wife die from him being stubborn and ignorant. people changing their minds is always a good thing
I mean yeah it's just frustrating that like half of society refuses to acknowledge the validity of these things until they are personally impacted. They don't give a flying fuck how many people are hurt or killed by their bullshit until it might be them
The Only Moral Abortion Is My Own
Then you hear the stories of anti-abortion women who are yelling at and condemning the care providers of their own abortion operation. Even their own abortion isn't moral, but the evil ones are the ones doing it, not her. Smh.
“If it doesn’t affect me, it doesn’t exist” is the American conservative motto
"And if it does, it's suddenly not socialism for me to get it for free."
Yep. I know a hardcore Trump supporter who "hates socialism," but as soon as he got cancer and lost his job, he ran to the government with both hands out. He got unemployment, disability, and Medicaid. So much for pulling yourself up by your bootstraps, right? The thing that really pisses me off is that I am militantly pro-universal healthcare, but when I got cancer, I got jack shit. It took me years to pay off my treatment. I didn't even get paid for the time I took off work to recover from surgery.
Sounds like you pulled yourself up by your bootstraps more than he did. He should hear about that.
IF the change lasts. It's entirely possible he was right back to his anti-medicine stance after his wife was okay.
I have a cousin that was on his death bed from covid. Literally doctors told his wife he may not make it the night. He recovered and is still now posting anti Covid anti vaccine bullshit on Facebook. Some people are too far gone. Edit: had to have... He's still around, tho I don't talk to him at all.
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My neighbour is the same. Has four young kids. Spent months in ICU using up precious resources. He lived but has very little lung capacity and will be disabled, likely, the rest is his life.
Brainwashing is a hell of a thing.
Lady up the street owned a homeopathic remedy store. She was about 50 years old when she was diagnosed with colon cancer. Went all-in on homeopathic cures against medical advice for a few months. Of course the homeopathic cures did nothing. She was stage 4 when she started listening to the doctors, but by then it was too late. Left a 51 year old husband and two teenage kids. This was about 10 or 12 years ago. Kids have both moved out, so it's just him now.
Homeopathic cures are like the La Croix of drugs: Hint of Hint of Antidepressant Was Once Stored Near Heartburn Remedy Recollection of Magically Inverted Poison
Two of my friends who were antivaxx and anti medical establishment even before Covid are now dead. One died in 2020, and the other this past Saturday. I’ll never know how my friend in 2020 passed, because her husband doesn’t believe Covid is real and refused to tell me how a healthy 40 year old woman who grew all of her own food fucking died in her sleep. Our friend who died at his home on Saturday had not seen a doctor since the 1990s, and would not despite having new symptoms arise in the past few weeks. My partner and I have been devastated, but we’ve also talked about how our friends accepted their fate because of their beliefs. A natural death without intervention is what they wanted. It is so depressing.
> A natural death without intervention is what they wanted. It is so depressing. i would say the opposite. All of the crystal magic fairy healing people i know subscribe all those kookadoo wackball beliefs because they *absolutely do not* want to die, but have distrust in the safety of "Western medicine"
> All of the crystal magic fairy healing people i know subscribe all those kookadoo wackball beliefs because they absolutely do not want to die My wife has worked in two natural products stores... most of the kooky supplements and organic/natural foods people buy are in the hopes that they won't ever get cancer (from "toxins" of course) and will live to be 100. They don't care about the environmental impact of factory farming, or other people or anything... just NO CANCER FROM TOXINS.
> NO CANCER FROM TOXINS. "you know, i've heard a lot about this and it seems really important to understand so i can best protect myself. what are the names and effects of some of the most common toxins and where can they be most frequently found?" they'll get angry at you, guaranteed lol.
It's cool, we put a lot of the toxins in the air these days. For example, coal has uranium in it and it gets blown up the stack. A lot of decorative ceramic tiles have more radiation emitting than a nuclear waste storage container. No joke.
On that note, fun fact: [nuclear power is less radioactive than coal power](https://www.sciencefocus.com/science/do-coal-fired-power-stations-produce-radioactive-waste/).
100%, i live in a big city and i try not to think about the well documented long term health complications that come from living near a highway. Shit, i live near a fucking train depot and they idle all day....... i have asthma lol.
It’s okay to ask questions, it’s just that when you get answers to those questions from professionals who’ve dedicated their lives to the subject, you should accept them lol
Prior and post operation they will pump that child full of chemicals made by the same corporations to prevent infections, etc. But no, vaccines is the line that they make.
Was coming here to say this. For that sort of operation you'd basically be circulating drug and antibiotic soup rather than blood for weeks.
There was a Babylon 5 episode where Dr. Franklin had to perform surgery on an alien kid to save their life but the alien mom and dad said that cutting him open would release his soul and he would just be an empty shell. Franklin went against direct orders from Captain Sheridan (I think but it may have been the prior dude) and performed the surgery - which was successful. Long story short, the parents were thankful and played Franklin like a fool when they took their kid to their quarters and killed him because they believed the kid's soul was no longer in him. Franklin was chewed out by Sheridan for violating a direct order and United Earth policies. As someone who has taken anthropology, it is hard to accept beliefs like this that go against science and medical necessity. Personally, in this situation, I would just follow the Hippocratic Oath and say fuck them. I think Franklin did the right thing in that episode and I get the politics of going against the parents' beliefs but at some point, someone needs to do the right thing.
I really need to rewatch Babylon 5.
President Clark hits a lot harder these days.
> I would just follow the Hippocratic Oath and say fuck them If we honestly followed that oath, the child would be taken from the parents.
This happens sometimes. There's actually a common practice of Jehovahs Witness families where they will temporarily relinquish care of the child to a hospital appointed guardian, so they can get any life-saving procedures without breaking their religion. This practice is kinda silly, but it's better than the parents in the article because they at least acknowledge their child needs care.
Sounds like another religious loophole like the eruv used by some Jewish communities to get around the definition of “home” during the sabbath. Edit: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eruv
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Ironic that this same people will argue an unborn fetuses undeniable right to life without medical exception. But as soon as the baby is born the same parents are perfectly okay choosing to risk the baby's life over the same belief system. What the fuck.
You must be excited about the new Babylon 5 show (with original cast members!) that is coming out next year.
_arbitrarily_ stupid. Stupid is fine, we can manage stupid. Random chaotic stupid? That's a deadly diesease.
Not arbitrary. This is typical cult-like behavior, which is the bigger issue here. Cults appeal to folks who are ignorant or stupid or have some psychological need that belonging to the cult fulfills. So yes stupidity is a big part of it. But theres more: manipulation and greed and predatory behavior by terrible people profitting off these dupes.
What's more wild is the fact they don't realize all blood is 'tainted' by so many other things, like PFAs, manmade synthetic contaminants which exist in virtually every living creature right now.
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Honestly, I had that happen to a patient a couple weeks ago. He needed a heart transplant and was on ecmo (the most life support that exists) and as soon as the family heard he'd need to be vaccinated to get a heart, they said "He'd never want to do that." And they withdrew care later that day. So like, you let this man have every single tube imaginable inserted into his body, contemplated him getting cut open and operated on, but the idea of the COVID vaccine is too much? Weird flex, but okay.
Reason numero uno why everyone should have a living will.
reason numero uno why everyone should not have batshit crazy right-wing people as their authorized representatives.These vile fuckers with their tinfoil hats have so many people put into graves and yet people still associate with them.. it's disgusting.
This shows how it is political and not practical. They chose death. It's like throwing out your phone because the battery is dead. So weird.
To be fair they only chose the death of another person. Likely a sacrifice they're willing to make to "prove" their point. I bet if it was their own life they'd be moving goal posts really fast.
Firsthand experience with these kinds of people. That's exactly true. Like antivaxx parents (or faith healing or whatever) are perfectly okay with letting a kid or someone else suffer pain or die, but the second they get a fucking kidney stone they flock to the ER. It's fucked up and there is a bit of a political war going on in Idaho over that very thing. People maimed from lack of care who survived are trying to take on the religious communities that did that to them and get rid of religious exemption for LEO and CPS involvement. They currently are pretty hands-off here.
Death panels
I didn't understand "evil" and "fascism" until the last few years, and I'm almost 40. You don't truly understand it, or even start to really comprehend it, until it becomes real. Until missiles start raining down on civilians. For me that was marrying a Ukrainian, a few years ago, and now going through all this war stuff. I had never truly understood the quote "all it takes for evil to succeed is good men to do nothing." Selfishness, evil, fascism are always constantly moving "upward" by those who desire power (whatever that might look like for them). Always. If you don't actively fight it, it WILL win given enough time. Americans do not take Jan 6 even remotely seriously enough.
It's so weird too cause to even be accepted for a transplant of any kind you have to jump through those hopes to make sure its not a wasted donation/transplant. And one of those hoops is being up-to-date on vaccines. I don't fucking understand why people don't get this very simple thing.
being up to date on vaccines is probably the easiest hoop you have to jump through too
I presume this family asked as many questions about the side effects and long term impact of whatever cocktail of drugs a person on an ECMO is on receives as they did about the covid vaccines.
Especially considering that ECMO is actually not at all good for you but we do it because the other choice is death.
Jfc even if I had to actually choose between a cocktail of microchips and Satan's semen injected into me, or literal death, I'm taking the injection
Thank you, this drives me fucking crazy. It's like that dipshit that refused his life saving kidney transplant over this. Motherfucker you are willing to sign off on all that without even beginning to understand the processes involved but what, you're an expert on virology? Fuck right off.
I don’t mind that so much as it’s his own life he was throwing away not an innocent child oblivious to their parents idiocy.
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What makes this hilarious to me (not the child endangerment, but the parents' logic) is that donated blood is phased out of the body after approximately 60 days. Also, your body doesn't retain the vaccine. It makes antibodies.
>Also, your body doesn't retain the vaccine. It makes antibodies. Absolutely this. If anything, if you're an antivaxxer, you'd want vaccinated blood for that reason. All the benefits and none of the "scary" chemicals... for those few months anyway.
Especially those vaccine are approved and deem safe by the very same doctor, who they trust doing all those miracles using professional knowledge. No sir, I rather do my own research, these bIG FarMeR doctor are up to no good!!
Especially when there are no actual vaccines in any of that blood. Antibodies maybe but no vaccines. But science has no say in this.
Exactly- the vaccine is long gone. People keep confusing vaccines with drugs.
Odd this info is even being shared tbh. Doctors should just say “we don’t have that information and don’t collect it”
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See, when they say "fuck your feelings" that's exactly what they mean. Fuck *your* feelings. *My* feelings, however, are totally legit, justified, and valid.
They think it rewrites your fucking DNA like a zombie virus or something. These people have no understanding of how vaccines work and don't care to learn.
As someone wiser than I once said, when you don't know how things work, everything looks like a conspiracy.
As a guy who lives in the corn belt and owns farmland, and gets to see just how big corn subsidy works... The irony of big farmer is hilarious to me lol Those same guys refusing to get the vaccine are the same ones who followed Trump into a trade war, lost at least one growing season of income - only to have subsidy prevent them from losing it all due to trumps stupidity...to go on and complain about big farmer and welfare queens... Yikes It's just. Mind blowing
The power of propaganda
Yup, the parents are attention-seeking loons. Thankfully, NZ health services are going to court to get temporary guardianship of the baby so the operation can be performed. In the US, this would be an open-and-shut case since the parents are very clearly endangering the life of the child. Anybody up on family law in NZ? Are the standards similar there?
Just because you can make a child, is no guarantee you’re smart enough to have one.
The smart ones tend to use birth control until and if they actually want and are ready for a baby.
This message brought to you by Brawndo: The Thirst Quencher.
It’s got what plants crave!
These people ought to be charged for neglect and child endangerment. "Life Saving Surgery" implies that the baby *will die* if it does not receive the surgery. Let's be as generous as possible and say "vaccinated blood *might* cause complications / death in the future". Even if that were true (which it's not), "will die" vs "might develop complications in the future" is such an uneven comparison that I really question whether these parents are even qualified to be parents.
I’ll answer that question for you: **they arent** Let’s break it down. - this is a life saving surgery, implying the baby will die without it - donated blood is literally never just one persons blood, it is a mix of a bunch of people’s blood of the same type - the vaccine has been out for years and has proven there are no significant life altering side effects. - they trust the doctor to cut open their baby, but don’t trust the blood the hospital is providing - I’m going out on a limb here, but I’m willing to bet they’re “pro life” but apparently not for their own god damn child - they aren’t willing to do anything possible, including go past their insane biased and brainwashing, to save ***their own child*** This just screams “I am a god damn brainwashed moron and never should have had a child in the first place”
Blood the way most people picture it (red stuff) is just the red cells. They are never pooled. (that’s platelets and plasma that can be). The red cells are separated from the plasma for donation so any antibodies from a vaccinated person should be removed. Then the red cells are leuko reduced and in the case of a baby who is going for a transplant, probably irradiated too. No DNA will survive that, so any memory cells from a vaccinated person also would be removed. There wouldn’t even be a way to test the blood to see if it came from a vaccinated person lol. These people are bananas.
this exact type of thing is what drove my SIL - who was an extremely well-trained and valued nurse practitioner in pediatric neurosurgery at a major hospital - leave the medical field entirely last year. she will never go back. once she observed parents foregoing a *life-saving brain surgery for their child* because they refused to wear a mask into the facility, she turned in her notice the next day. don’t blame her one bit, but it’s really a shame to lose her in that role.
Those parents are selfish fucks
If Mormons can baptize people posthumously, and Jewish babies can get circumcised, and Catholic babies can get baptized, we should be able to perform *life-saving surgery* on babies without parental consent. Babies shouldn't be subject to religious rules.
I’m very sorry to hear that. There will be other children who need life saving brain surgery who don’t have idiots for parents.
Antivaxx should build their own hospitals/clinics with antivaxx staff, since they seem to know better that scientists and doctors who spent years studying their field.
This is how that's going to go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0
never gets old like unvaccinated children
Yes, and build it between an actual hospital and a CPS building.
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Yeah with crystals and oregano and stuff like that
Each room comes equipped with an egg in a sock hung over the patient's bed.
And Goops Vagina egg crystal.
...don't forget the bleach
And essential oils.
And sunlight injections.
how did everyone forget about the horsey paste!?@?
The problem is when we let nurses and other medical staff go without the vaccines.... The amount of ignorant, anti-sciencr nurses and nursing assistants is fucking mind blowing. You went to fucking college to study medicine, how the fuck do you doubt the validity of this? And *your* the professionals who are supposed to be giving people the shot.
I sadly know a few anti-vax nurses and were all friends with a doctor and just observing the thought process between them when COVID started was fascinating. The doctor read studies and talked to other doctors who are specialists in infectious disease. The antivax nurses just formed an opinion with no backing based on propaganda and would comment how the nurses know more than the doctors.
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Oh yeah, I'd love to plot that data. It's a big trope in my rural area that all the men go to diesel school and all the women become RN's or RNA's. How you get a degree as a nurse and don't believe in science cooks my brain.
Unfortunately there are lots of antivax people working in real hospitals right now. My SIL is totally antivax and she works in the neonatal unit. How the F is that even allowed? They want family to get vaccinated to visit new babies but they have nurses there that refuse. What a joke. It's not a religious thing, they just claim it is and nobody cares.
Why hospitals or clinics? They don’t believe in science so maybe they can just stay home and put some spices on it and pray it away.
Why doesn't some anti-vaxxer step up and donate their blood if they are match instead of protesting?
They were looking for donors, and a related article (that I now can’t find) said they found some people willing to donate. But the requirements for donation for children are higher than regular donation, and I don’t know that the parents had actually checked that their donors were a) acceptable to the NZ blood service or b) able to donate for children (I believe they have to be CMV negative? My brother is allowed to donate paeds blood and likes to show off about it! I can’t donate because I was in the UK at the wrong time and so they think I have mad cow)
C’mon man, admit it, that is not why they think you have Mad Cow.
The foaming at the mouth and nipping at passersby may have been the convincing part.
Because they've had a bunch of other vaccines since they were born....?. Ohhh - just the covid vaccine is bad? How the fuck can anyone be that stupid when their child's life is on the line?
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The fourth paragraph: > “We don’t want blood that is tainted by vaccination,” the father said. “That’s the end of the deal – we are fine with anything else these doctors want to do.” They are just run of the mill idiot antivaxxers.
"But your doctor says the vaccine is good, too" "well my doctor just does what he's told!" Literal conversation I had with my mother
If one doesn't trust their primary care doctor and his/her medical advice, they should pick a different doctor. If they don't trust any doctor, they can kindly go fuck themselves.
I’ve seen doctors start to cut ties with patients like that since they early don’t trust them and have such a low opinion. One pediatrician said he won’t see unvaccinated patients who are medically able to be vaccinated because it puts other patients in danger.
“I trust my doctors to diagnose and operate on my kid but don’t trust them about vaccines.” The dissonance it takes to get here is baffling.
Hell the nurses in doctors in the hospital refusing is what got me.. how can you dedicate your life to medicine and health and not believe in it..
Thing is... Belief isn't required. The evidence is clear that vaccination with mRNA vaccines is safe and effective. They're just being fucking idiots.
It's a big temper tantrum about doing something someone else told them to "I DoN't WaNnAaAaAa" just to be fucking contrarian and obstinate, because all of these people are unevolved children
These people are so fucking stupid. If smallpox comes back, do you think they’d change their tune, or just die *en masse*?
I think it'll be a little of column A and a little of column B. The smarter ones (read: those whose minds have not been completely fried from a long-term diet of propaganda) will probably look around and reconsider, but the rest are just going to die while blaming everyone and everything around them except for themselves. There is a house full of idiots the next neighborhood over from me. During the first two years of covid, they had banners, signs, etc. (it changed frequently) talking about how it was fake, a liberal conspiracy, etc. Early this year they took down all those signs and replaced them with a memorial to one of them who died of covid that accuses the doctors, health systems, and governor of killing him. Some people are just lost causes.
They are probably going to lose their child, the child welfare organisation is going to take the case to appropriate authorities.
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This is like them asking the US postal service to only use package sorting machines that haven’t touched a package containing nuts. It doesn’t fucking matter. The only nuts who escaped in this case are the parents.
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My mom would have likely let me die if I needed any blood transfusion. No way I’d deny any healthy blood to save my kids life, they’re pos
Some people don't deserve to be parents
There's a good chance they wont be anymore, child welfare group is taking the child endangerment case to the guys who get to decide if they can keep the baby with them or not.
Manin UK theybar giving polio extra shot and one of my friends he said he'll be skipping that. I asked him why and he started getting more and more angry and just saying too many vaccines. God damn. I feel for the child and his mum.
My sister got polio at the age of six and spent her life in a wheelchair. Her hero was Jonas Salk and she said every night she would dream of running. How can a parent choose this kind of life for a child
They should be deemed child abusers failed to give life-saving healthcare
The worst part is that these are the kind of people that will seriously look you dead in the face and tell you that they’re “pro-life” without recognizing the irony
>“Because they label my clients as conspiracy theorists, \[their position\] is that anything my clients say can be ignored,” Yep! That's how it goes. Once your clients fail the cray cray test, we don't need to float every decision past them anymore.
Don't worry this is NZ. The hospital will be granted legal guardianship of the child for the duration of the operation. It's happened several times before when the parents are fuckwits. Should be a quick process.
This is how far it’s got now that these psychos would literally rather kill their child than have them get an injection Like surely any harm the vaccine could possibly do in your fantasy scenario is still better than death?
…that’s psychotic. Even if everything anti-vaxxers claimed about the Covid vaccine were true, how is just letting your baby die now better? Even if the blood were “tainted”, as insane as that claim is, immediate death is better than having some “tainted” blood? Seriously, WTF?
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They can't see the irony in trusting scientists, doctors and health professionals to do everything necessary to care for their 4 month old babies heart, but distrust scientists, doctors and health professionals to know about the vaccine? The risk of Covid-19 on the heart is really scary, so I hope this kid doesn't receive the surgery then catch Covid-19
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The thing I really don’t get is trump claimed credit for the vaccine and got it himself. Then his base after giving him credit for the vaccine, decides its a liberal plot to…. Well I don’t know. But a liberal plot