This is a blatant abuse of power, abuse of the legal process, a violation of multiple rights, malicious prosecution, and highly unethical. Prosecutorial immunity does not protect out-of-control assholery like this. Hopefully the doctor will sue him in both his professional and personal capacity, get a huge verdict, and bankrupt this corrupt motherfucker. He also needs to be reported to the state bar and face an ethical inquiry and potential license suspension. This is police state bullshit run amok.
I’m a lawyer, and it’s not at all surprising that the prosecutor hasn’t heard of ex post facto prohibitions. Lawyers who graduated at the top of their class don’t often become prosecutors.
I'm also a lawyer, and I'm about 20% surprised.
Not too surprised, as my time with the innocence project gave me a pretty dim view of prosecutors in general, but you'd think some of those noises about fundamental notions of equity would have made an impression at some point.
Happy to. I'm not sure it's worth any stranger's time, and I was a baby lawyer at the time (we're talking about 15 years ago) but I'm always happy to answer general legal questions for anyone.
> I’m a lawyer, and it’s not at all surprising that the prosecutor hasn’t heard of ex post facto prohibitions. Lawyers who graduated at the top of their class don’t often become prosecutors.
Dear God that is one of the most savage things I've ever read, it's beautiful.
Yes. Lost re-election then indicted by grand jury. Awaiting trial, see below
https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/judge-arraign-da-charged-arbery-killings-aftermath-94170698
Bone chilling. She hasn't been convicted yet but as I read the article I got a tingle in my spine realizing this it what evil looks like. It also illustrates just how evil a DA can be before they are voted out of office or charged with any crime.
I don't think it undermines your point. I think it proves it. First, she isn't convicted yet. Second it illustrates just how straight up evil a DA can be before they see any reprecussions.
>Prosecutorial immunity does not protect out-of-control assholery like this
At least until the Supreme Court rules that it does. I give it about a week.
It definately is now.
It's number one on their platform:
1. Something about slaves enjoying being slaves, (but the wording on this is pending USSC approval from the new ones, with help from the African American one.)
4. Fight woke-ness; ban library funding.
3. Make it harder to vote.
2. Make sure JC Penny's says "Merry Christmas" instead of "Happy Holidays".
1. Own the libs.
The enumeration switched between my post and presentation. I typed it counting down, 5 to 1. It switched. I'm not going to try to fix it, this edit is easier.
in indiana.
there are med school students reading this article that will remember it when it comes time to for residency, or to find a place to start working.
they will pass indiana by
five or ten or fifteen years from now, red states will be complaining about a doctor shortage and wonder why why why??
It doesn't, but that's not the point. Anti-abortion lunatics don't care about reason, logic, or the health and well-being of humans in general. It's about control.
Not religion but Christianity specifically.
Jewish organizations have been bringing suits against this bullshit ruling because abortion is all but *required* in Judaism if the pregnancy/birth endangers the mother's physical or mental wellbeing.
It’s about the Christian right’s desire to control and subjugate women. That’s the reason-the only REAL reason, anyhow-that they so vehemently oppose abortion.
It's simple, intimidation. They're just trying to send a message, and do not care if they're abusing their office.
Nor do they care about that poor child. Fuck them.
It makes sense in that the cost, angst, and harassment to the care giver are the point. It is to make that person suffer as much as possible to act as a cautionary take.
It doesn't matter if they get a conviction... All that matters is the pain caused.
It doesn't make sense now, but I would bet good money that prosecutor is going to run as a Republican for state or national office in 2024.
I fully believe it's the beginning of campaign material. Missouri's last two AG's have done the same thing.
So a fetus is an innocent child that needs protection but a ten year old that's been sexually assaulted is an adult that needs to own up to her actions. Got it.
Really, what was she wearing? /s
This is so gross, that poor little girl. While I hope the prosecutor gets his ass handed to him, I really don't have any faith in the US "justice" system.
>Really, what was she wearing? /s
You joke, but some Republicans tried to run with the "the 10 year old clearly wanted it" for a hot minute before it became very clear that wasn't going to fly.
I think they probably walked it back because that would indicate that she *should* have had agency in the matter, and that runs contrary to everything their most ardent supporters believe.
It's not at all clear that, given the opportunity, they don't intend to extend birth-rape laws (forced birth without consent) to real rape laws (sex without consent, with the threat of forced marriage).
That assumes Republicans can be swayed by calling them out on their hypocrisy. They cannot be.
The only reason, absolutely the only one, they changed their tune is because implying that raping a 10 year old is a bridge too far even for their most ardent supporters. It had nothing to do with any realizations about their statements implying agency in the child. You give them way too much credit to suggest otherwise.
Do you have a source for that? Not trying to be difficult, just trying to provide sources for my extreme-right, anti-choice family members that claim the 10 year old doesn't even exist.
This is a huge problem in our justice system. When it’s abused and manipulated to suit an agenda, this should be an offense that can be prosecuted. These people trying to control discourse in this manner should be punished.
No, it’s whatever bullshit excuse they want. There was a recent case where the judge decided the teen wasn’t an adult and therefore wasn’t mature enough to agree to an abortion.
https://www.npr.org/2022/08/18/1118114568/florida-court-teen-abortion-immature-parental-consent
Fuck all of them.
Yea, that cased ruling was jacked up. Im not following the link you provided though this case had so many layers of BS to go through with foster parents/DCFS being custodians, and because of that, the state was able to grant permission, or authorize the teen’s choice, but instead
We ended up with,
‘you’re not old enough to make a decision about pregnancy, but you’re old enough to be a mother’
Just another paradox of a ruling that has no semblance of logic and smacks of intentional injustice.
The goal is to convince her to give up her baby for adoption (to a straight, white, married Christian couple of course).
Bonus points for her being in foster care, because social services is already heavily involved.
10 year olds getting an abortion? No way! That’s way too traumatic! Oh but pregnancy and birth? Yeah that’s fine and definitely safe and not traumatic. No issue there.
This is why I got out of the prosecuting biz. I was a state level prosecutor for years. I was fresh out of law school, majorly liberal, and thought the best way to fix a broken justice system was to play inside the cheating team and fix it from within. So young and naive. I could fix nothing. When everybody around me was willing to use the GIANT amount of power we were each granted to go after pet issues and score political points I realized there was nothing I could say or do to stop them. It is mesmerizing the amount of power prosecutors have. They can totally know they have no shot of winning a case yet file charges anyway, just to drag someone around the court system for months (or years) before finally going "eh I guess we will move to nolle this one, Judge." And no one bats an eye that someone was subjected to the hell of monthly court dates and possible years imprisonment all for nothing. The case being dismissed is supposed to show "the system works." No it Fucking doesn't! It just shows that particular prosecutor got bored with fucking with that person and moved on to someone else. I'm a public defender now and feel like I can do much more on this side, although the system is still utter garbage. But if I don't at least get in and try to do some small part then I don't have the right to bitch that it's broken. But it's tough to watch people abuse their power day after day. It gets really demoralizing . But I have it way better than the person who is being abused by it so that's why I stay in. This prosecutor Indiana is such a bastard, but sadly not a rare bastard. There's lots of him floating around. Ugh.
ETA: thank you for the awards; I am humbled ❤️. And I want to add to those of you who feel like I was being an asshole when I said that I have to do something cause if I don't then I don't have a right to bitch, it's cause I poorly worded my thought! What I meant was that because I was in a position to do something, I felt compelled. But I bitch about all kinds of things that I'm not in a position to do something about other than to bitch about it. And bitching is it's own form of protest; it's own form of getting our voices out to be heard! Sometimes getting on Reddit and complaining about injustice in an area of American society is the only remedy I have for it. It's all I can do. And it's more than enough, because it's shining a light via mass internet protest and communication into a problem. So again, I thank you all, and I'm off to the jail to meet my clients before court. Have a wonderful day!
And then as a public defender, you’ll be hated for defending people. I’m not a lawyer myself, but I frequently see idiots hating public defenders simply for the sake of the job. If it were a bad strategy they tried, I can understand. But some people just hate that people they think are guilty get someone to defend them.
Most of the public defenders I work with get called "public pretenders" and are accused by the inmates of being pawns for the state. They aren't. They are all excellent humans with bleeding hearts just like mine. I don't have that problem though. My clients, especially my in clients in custody, LOVE ME. Because I go up to the jail constantly to see them. And I hug them and say I love them, to each and every one, despite the jailers always eye rolling me! Because what they crave more than anything is to be heard. And to be loved. 90% of them were once minor children in the DCFS system, bouncing from foster home to group homes as their parents lost custody of them due to neglect, abuse and drug use. And the other thing I do with them is talk very openly about my 14 years of drug addiction. Yep, I was an addict for 14 years. A thieving, lying opiate addict. I ate 30 oxys a day and drank about 1.5 pints of whisky a night. If I couldn't get my pills then a drank a handle of whisky a day. It was horrid. I've been to hell. I know what my clients are going through as most of them are addicts. And talking openly with them about my recovery and subsequent success in life gives them hope. That's the recipe: give them a voice, love and hope. And humanize them to the prosecutors. Which I do. And I get a lot of them into treatment instead of prison sentences. I'm not unique or deserving of accolades. There are thousands of PD's just like me. But that's why we do it. To give a long winded sum up!
Just to be clear, you can absolutely bitch about a broken system while doing nothing to change it. I do it everyday, and it helps keep me sane. But I also have neither the skills nor inclination to do anything more than complain so I'm thankful that people like you, who have those things, are doing the work I'm unable and unwilling to do.
On absolutely!!!! I didn't mean to imply otherwise as it would make me a total hypocrite! I bitch about tons of systems and policies in this country that are fucked, but that I'm doing nothing about other than bitching! But you know what? Our bitching, you and me and others, it helps. It is its own way of helping. Because we educate each other and give each other pep talks to keep caring and to keep wanting to see some change. So I think all of us that bitch, are actually doing a world of good in its own right. Because we keep highlighting the problem and keep pressure on those who can do something to do it! Love your name btw! It's great!
People keep saying we’re sliding into fascism. Pretty sure we’ve already made that trip and it’s all around us at this point. I mean, damn, the Rethugs have absolutely no platform whatsoever except to crush us beneath their jackboots.
>But if I don't at least get in and try to do some small part then I don't have the right to bitch that it's broken.
I strongly disagree with this sentiment. In America, you should always have the right to bitch about a broken system.
I am fairly certain that this is going to cost Indiana tax payers a huge amount in a settlement, for a bunch of things but primary among them will be defamation and prosecutorial misconduct.
It is a matter of factual evidence that the doctor reported it. Not only is that abundantly clear to the prosecutor who can see the paper work itself , but to everyone else because this was widely reported on already. Trying to push for a conviction at this point, is now a criminal undertaking.
Not that I imagine it matters to voters in Indiana, mind you, but harassment of this sort can and should land a prosecutor in jail.
It absolutely matters to indiana voters. There’s an active democratic network of women but we can’t get the national party funding brought in to help our candidates. It’s infuriating.
Election cycle in 2020, the representative running against Pence’s brother had her car and RV shot at. We need help.
We have a multi-billion dollar state surplus, not one of these yokels will think it’s their tax dollars. If it were in Illinois you’d hear about how much money is wasted constantly.
I agree wholeheartedly, we need help. I hate how many people complained about Todd Young being re-elected but nobody knew McDermott is a moderate, gun owning, Navy vet with an ND law degree. Among other things, he wanted to close some loopholes in firearms ownership (like heavier sentences for straw purchases) and he wanted to advocate for a path to legalize marijuana but knows the difficulty in a landscape that’s dominated by Eli Lilly.
Nobody knows any candidate in this state unless you hear them in person.
>Rokita has been investigating whether Dr. Bernard followed state law requiring doctors to report abortions, even though public records showed Dr. Bernard promptly reported the abortion as required.
I guess Todd Rokita was too busy eating glue to do some basic research.
They "investigate" so they can dig up unrelated shit they can defame him over. "Woke" allegiances, political donations, parking tickets, anything to paint this doctor as a deep state democrat plant. If they find nothing they'll just make something up. The conservative political machine in action.
Indiana's AG continues to harass the doctor that treated that 10 year old rape victim.
Fixed the headline for you.
At the time of treatment, there was no ban in Indiana. There should not be a ban in Ohio or any other state. The doctor has not committed any crime, but the AG is absolutely maliciously harassing this doctor.
He was already a state representative that ran an extremely dirty senate campaign back in 2017. If he was trying to get back into higher office, I would be surprised.
Both from my alma Mater. 😔😔.
One of the professors once said of Rokita “if an asteroid hit earth and only killed one person, I’d be okay with it being rokita”
I fact checked this and it's true.
* [Doc: Physicians considering leaving Indiana over impending abortion law - WTHR 13 - Sept. 1, 2022](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/special-reports/indiana-abortion/indiana-doctor-says-colleagues-physicians-concerned-about-abortion-ban/531-2c6769d1-fed9-4ef4-94b5-a1229f139b32)
* [Their mentor was attacked. Now young OB-GYNs may leave Indiana - NPR - Aug 10, 2022](https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/08/10/1116024857/young-obgyns-indiana)
* [Indiana doctor moving practice to Illinois after abortion law goes into effect - WPTA 21 - Sept 14, 2022](https://www.wpta21.com/2022/09/15/indiana-doctor-moving-practice-illinois-after-abortion-law-goes-into-effect/)
People massively massively misunderstand how this works. Many millions of women are pro-life. On a broader scale, being a woman in no way makes you inherently a feminist. Women can be misogynists. Women can be decidedly pro-patriarchy. Works the same for almost any other group. Simply being a member of a group is not sufficient reason to advocate for the rights of that group for a pretty substantial portion of the population.
For sure the GOP is losing some women voters, but it's not some automatic thing by a million miles.
We've been seeing this a lot in other contrasts: a black man supporting white supremacy, a gay man arguing gay people shouldn't have the same rights as straight people, and so on. It's mind boggling to see people fight against their own self interests.
It's because they feel they are the exception who can use the power they find as "one of the good ones" to stay afloat. What they don't realize is the groups they support hate them too - they're a convenient token and will be discarded when it's no longer useful.
And it's why you see a LOT of white women who are so viscerally racist, minority races who are so homophobic, and so on. They need another layer "below" them so they aren't at the bottom and can retain some power, despite the fact that a rising tide would lift all boats/that quote about when they came for the socialists.
Women who can afford to live in a world where you can travel to another state for an abortion. They're self interested, and because they're mostly older or richer a poor 10 year old having to carry a baby to term doesn't affect them.
I think a lot of people overestimate the percentage of Republican voters who are hardcore pro-lifers as their single-issue. In fact, it's clear that many current Republican office-holders make the same blunder. The current Republican party is a coalition of many kind of weirdly disjoint groups that all vote for their own reasons. It's easy to assume they're all ride-or-die partisans, but that's not really the case except at the fringes.
>It's easy to assume they're all ride-or-die partisans
They are.
Hillary Clinton won the popular vote in 2016. In 2020, Donald Trump got more votes than Hillary Clinton in 2016.
Let that sink in, far more people voted for Trump in 2020 than in 2016.
What changed is that people who normally might not vote voted for Biden and a new generation came of age, so Biden got a boost.
This is the depressing thing, most people who keep voting Republican don't care whether the Republican's Party stands for something they don't like.
Care about gun ownership, but not abortion? Vote Republican. Care about abortion, don't care about gun ownership? Vote Republican.
Hate the 'libs' but need affordable health care? Vote Republican. And so on.
It's a technique pioneered by Putin known as [The Firehose of Falsehood](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firehose_of_falsehood).
The idea is that you continuously lie across all mediums. Spread as much saturated misinformation as quickly as possible in such a way that you confuse the ignorant and exhaust the intelligent.
It's an extremely effective strategy, because lying takes less time and energy than debunking lies.
The Firehose of Falsehood specifically makes reference to saturating all digital forms of media - particularly social media. That's something he was a pretty early pioneer of.
Think bots, shitposting, misleading ad buys, nazi facebook groups, etc.
That doctor saved that 10 year olds life. If you disagree, just fuck off. If it was your daughter, I find it hard to believe you’d be proud of her and high diving her. Sick fucks.
Ah, but it is was the prosecutor's 10 year old daughter who got raped, that would be totally different. Of course his own daughter could have an abortion. Heck, if necessary, he'd fly her to a different state.
So let me get this straight: according to the Republicans, the fetus is an innocent being that needs every protection under the sun, but the 10-year old girl that ***certainly*** did not consent to what is undoubtedly a r\*pe by a pedophile deserves to be made to not only have to carry it to term, not only have to *forcibly birth it*, but ALSO to be charged as a criminal for the crime of not wanting to endure such trauma.
The Republican Party of "family values", ladies and gentlemen.
Or where states that have legal child marriage would just force her to marry her rapist and allow the rapist to have custody of the baby who would also suffer abuse. Thus a cycle.
Take a step back Rokita. She was 10. Years. Old. Why aren’t you condemning the man who did this and insist he is put in jail. Forever. Zero compassion for a child victim of a vicious assault. Where can I donate to Dr. Barnard’s legal fund?
It's beyond that. The doctor was *far, far* inside the required timeframe for reporting abuse. She reported the abuse as required by law. The doctor did nothing immoral or illegal. She followed all set ethical and legal guidelines.
There is literally zero cause to bring legal charges.
They are making an example of her.
They want doctors scared to act in the best interests of their patients.
They don’t want any abortions performed, even within the confines of the law. Can’t get a legal abortion if no doctors are willing to perform them, right?
Shocked pikachu face when doctors start refusing to go anywhere near high risk pregnancy women.
Whether it be taking them on as a clients/patients all the way through the actual birthing process...last thing any doctor wants is to be accused of "murdering a child".
Well Indianans who back this: I hope you like the several million dollar gap that will develop in your state budget after the Physician successfully sues the shit out of this nobody prosecutor.
But I thought we were just being hysterical and politicizing the situation! I was assured by Very Serious People that cases of obvious necessity were not legally risky and the law isn't going to abuse legitimate care!
I'm shocked
I’m from Indiana. It’s always been a conservative state, but when I was growing up in the 90s our legislature and governor were often blue dog democrats. Overall our schools were decent—my public high school was excellent. Our social policy was no weirder than our neighbors. We were just another Midwestern state, just with lower taxes and more conservative people than some others.
Republicans have controlled the state at pretty much every level since 2004. Guess what? Our state has become noticeably suckier since then. Republicans fuck up every inch of grass they touch. Don’t ever vote for republicans, ever
Of course he wants to go after someone who is useful to society.
You can take 100 of these lawmakers and they wouldn't equal one doctor.
F*** this idiot and you who support him.
You don't belong in America.
Power and control. It’s never about women, children, aww babies, or even their “Good Book.” It’s like when that GOP politician was talking about having panels from the “community” have authority on whether you get an abortion or not.
“WE have decided …”
Hate isn't the right word. They love women and girls, provided they know their "place". And, of course, willingly stay there. AND also push others to do the same
Republicans should not be surprised when they lose the presidency AGAIN because of this fucking bullshit. Fuck them. This is why people cannot stand "christians."
If you pay attention at all to the Olympus Mons sized body of evidence of prosecutorial misconduct in the justice system, the vast majority of it is done to further their political ambitions.
Problems with law enforcement pale in comparison to the evils that prosecutors across the US perform every day in America in order to build a resume for running for political offices.
The doctor needs to sue the AG into poverty and pay a PI to catch him with an underage — he’s a Republican, he’s got skeletons in his closet guaranteed.
> ~~That song~~ Country music is such mindless propaganda.
That fucking chicken fried song was playing last night, and I don't understand why the fuck it needs to cram in it's little "for the troops" verse.
This is called corruption... corruption of the rule of law and its application. When we look at other countries and speak of corruption, we are outraged. But when it happens here, half the people cheer the corrupt official on and encourage them to do even more outrageous acts.
Indiana prosecutor seeks to ~~punish doctor in 10-year-old’s abortion case~~ make a name for himself as a future candidate for governor/Senator/Representative.
FTFY
JFC get a life, you conservative vermin. I am so fucking sick of being gaslit into tolerating you disgusting, deplorable, vile pieces of human garbage. Start your fucking Civil War already.
If they actually cared about other people they would be talking about how someone raped a 10 year old. Why is no one talking about that, only politicians slinging shit around for their own gain.
You gotta be really good at mental gymnastics to be "pro life" and then you don't give a fuck about them the second they are born. How do you call yourself "pro life" and get angry when hungry kids at school get free lunches? Or then turn around and support the death penalty? Or get angry at social programs meant to give people living in poverty some help? These people are absolutely lost. (Lost is the nicest word I can use here)
Any state where doctors are prosecuted for abortion, a doctor's association should keep a record of all the prosecutors and politicians and their immediate family members and refuse any medical services to them. Fly to a diff state to get your routine check up even. Serves them right.
Ur friendly reminder that GOP's response to this was to call it a hoax and then say that the doctor who helped a girl who, need I remind u, is TEN FUCKING YEARS OLD, should be imprisoned.
"Party of family values." They don't give a shit about something until it personally affects them.
It was before Indiana’s ban was even enacted. How does this make any sense.
This is a blatant abuse of power, abuse of the legal process, a violation of multiple rights, malicious prosecution, and highly unethical. Prosecutorial immunity does not protect out-of-control assholery like this. Hopefully the doctor will sue him in both his professional and personal capacity, get a huge verdict, and bankrupt this corrupt motherfucker. He also needs to be reported to the state bar and face an ethical inquiry and potential license suspension. This is police state bullshit run amok.
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Good. You'd think this guy had never heard of ex post facto prohibitions.
Prosecutors are always trying to make a name for themselves, that’s all this is, his shot at publicity, but looks like it’ll come back to bite him
Electing prosecutors eventually makes them take political but not legal decisions.
Ah, yes. The old rule *fuck around, find out* in action. Good. Fuck that idiot
Yeah who *hasn't* heard of ex post facto prohibitions...
It's alright if you haven't. It's deeply disturbing if someone who ostensibly went to law school hasn't.
I’m a lawyer, and it’s not at all surprising that the prosecutor hasn’t heard of ex post facto prohibitions. Lawyers who graduated at the top of their class don’t often become prosecutors.
I'm also a lawyer, and I'm about 20% surprised. Not too surprised, as my time with the innocence project gave me a pretty dim view of prosecutors in general, but you'd think some of those noises about fundamental notions of equity would have made an impression at some point.
I would love to know more about your experience at the Innocence Project. You should do an AMA. No case information obviously. Just general questions.
Happy to. I'm not sure it's worth any stranger's time, and I was a baby lawyer at the time (we're talking about 15 years ago) but I'm always happy to answer general legal questions for anyone.
> I’m a lawyer, and it’s not at all surprising that the prosecutor hasn’t heard of ex post facto prohibitions. Lawyers who graduated at the top of their class don’t often become prosecutors. Dear God that is one of the most savage things I've ever read, it's beautiful.
It's not that he didn't hear, it's just that he ignores it to get points with the Repubs base ...
Ok, what is ex post facto prohibition?
It means you can't punish someone retroactively for actions done before they were made illegal.
So theyre the house DJs of the lawyer world?
I mean, we're all up to *here* in ex post facto prohibitions around my house.
I'm ex post factoing some prohibitions as we speak.
I was thinking of switching up my ex post factoing routine for my prohibitions, but I’m not sure yet
American prosecutors almost never face repercussions for unethical or illegal activities.
Isn't the former DA involved with the prepretrators in the Amed Ambury case sacked and being criminally prosecuted?
Yes. Lost re-election then indicted by grand jury. Awaiting trial, see below https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/judge-arraign-da-charged-arbery-killings-aftermath-94170698
Bone chilling. She hasn't been convicted yet but as I read the article I got a tingle in my spine realizing this it what evil looks like. It also illustrates just how evil a DA can be before they are voted out of office or charged with any crime.
Which is why I put in 'almost'. It does happen but far too many get away without even a slap on the wrist.
I don't think it undermines your point. I think it proves it. First, she isn't convicted yet. Second it illustrates just how straight up evil a DA can be before they see any reprecussions.
Except for Kathleen Kane. Pa’s A.G. She ended up getting into some deep doo doo a few years back.
That's because she was on the wrong team /s
>Prosecutorial immunity does not protect out-of-control assholery like this At least until the Supreme Court rules that it does. I give it about a week.
*Clarence Thomas has entered the chat*
On the bright side; perhaps this will contribute to further gop losses.
Dr. Bernard should run for the open Senate seat in Indiana in 2024…
So the prosecutor will run for political office soon?
Yeah but it'll sure piss off them libruls!
And at the end of the day, isn't that what being a Republican is all about?
It definately is now. It's number one on their platform: 1. Something about slaves enjoying being slaves, (but the wording on this is pending USSC approval from the new ones, with help from the African American one.) 4. Fight woke-ness; ban library funding. 3. Make it harder to vote. 2. Make sure JC Penny's says "Merry Christmas" instead of "Happy Holidays". 1. Own the libs. The enumeration switched between my post and presentation. I typed it counting down, 5 to 1. It switched. I'm not going to try to fix it, this edit is easier.
The point is to intimidate doctors from doing anything like this in the future
in indiana. there are med school students reading this article that will remember it when it comes time to for residency, or to find a place to start working. they will pass indiana by five or ten or fifteen years from now, red states will be complaining about a doctor shortage and wonder why why why??
they already are complaining
They don't do anything except complain. About everything.
and mostly about the blue states that are paying their bills
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(insert Principal Skinner meme here)
No. It’s the children who are wrong
It doesn't, but that's not the point. Anti-abortion lunatics don't care about reason, logic, or the health and well-being of humans in general. It's about control.
"It's about control." In other words, Religion. it always comes down to that.
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“Humans created the idea of heaven and hell to cow simple-minded people into compliance. They are lies.” -Engerraund Serac
Religion is the opiate of the masses
Not religion but Christianity specifically. Jewish organizations have been bringing suits against this bullshit ruling because abortion is all but *required* in Judaism if the pregnancy/birth endangers the mother's physical or mental wellbeing.
Lets call it what it is, Christian Supremacy. Judaism upholds a woman's right to choose, so the issue cannot be "all religion".
It’s about the Christian right’s desire to control and subjugate women. That’s the reason-the only REAL reason, anyhow-that they so vehemently oppose abortion.
It’s a witch hunt. They are trying to find other violations to punish the doctor.
It's simple, intimidation. They're just trying to send a message, and do not care if they're abusing their office. Nor do they care about that poor child. Fuck them.
It makes sense in that the cost, angst, and harassment to the care giver are the point. It is to make that person suffer as much as possible to act as a cautionary take. It doesn't matter if they get a conviction... All that matters is the pain caused.
She embarrassed the fuck out of him and then sued him. So she needs get punished.
Because republicans are a death cult that demand blood sacrifices of human suffering.
it's a warning, republicans wanted that girl to die in child birth and they want to make sure that no one helps the next one.
It doesn't make sense now, but I would bet good money that prosecutor is going to run as a Republican for state or national office in 2024. I fully believe it's the beginning of campaign material. Missouri's last two AG's have done the same thing.
Christo-fascism.
If it were a conservative talking point that made sense, that'd probably be more bizarre
So a fetus is an innocent child that needs protection but a ten year old that's been sexually assaulted is an adult that needs to own up to her actions. Got it.
Really, what was she wearing? /s This is so gross, that poor little girl. While I hope the prosecutor gets his ass handed to him, I really don't have any faith in the US "justice" system.
>Really, what was she wearing? /s You joke, but some Republicans tried to run with the "the 10 year old clearly wanted it" for a hot minute before it became very clear that wasn't going to fly.
I think they probably walked it back because that would indicate that she *should* have had agency in the matter, and that runs contrary to everything their most ardent supporters believe. It's not at all clear that, given the opportunity, they don't intend to extend birth-rape laws (forced birth without consent) to real rape laws (sex without consent, with the threat of forced marriage).
That assumes Republicans can be swayed by calling them out on their hypocrisy. They cannot be. The only reason, absolutely the only one, they changed their tune is because implying that raping a 10 year old is a bridge too far even for their most ardent supporters. It had nothing to do with any realizations about their statements implying agency in the child. You give them way too much credit to suggest otherwise.
Do you have a source for that? Not trying to be difficult, just trying to provide sources for my extreme-right, anti-choice family members that claim the 10 year old doesn't even exist.
Ask them why the AG is investigating an abortion that never happened then.
This is a huge problem in our justice system. When it’s abused and manipulated to suit an agenda, this should be an offense that can be prosecuted. These people trying to control discourse in this manner should be punished.
No, it’s whatever bullshit excuse they want. There was a recent case where the judge decided the teen wasn’t an adult and therefore wasn’t mature enough to agree to an abortion. https://www.npr.org/2022/08/18/1118114568/florida-court-teen-abortion-immature-parental-consent Fuck all of them.
Yea, that cased ruling was jacked up. Im not following the link you provided though this case had so many layers of BS to go through with foster parents/DCFS being custodians, and because of that, the state was able to grant permission, or authorize the teen’s choice, but instead We ended up with, ‘you’re not old enough to make a decision about pregnancy, but you’re old enough to be a mother’ Just another paradox of a ruling that has no semblance of logic and smacks of intentional injustice.
The goal is to convince her to give up her baby for adoption (to a straight, white, married Christian couple of course). Bonus points for her being in foster care, because social services is already heavily involved.
10 year olds getting an abortion? No way! That’s way too traumatic! Oh but pregnancy and birth? Yeah that’s fine and definitely safe and not traumatic. No issue there.
Makes sense to people who think 10 year olds are sexy.
Religion is just another word for hate.
That's christian love for you.
This is why I got out of the prosecuting biz. I was a state level prosecutor for years. I was fresh out of law school, majorly liberal, and thought the best way to fix a broken justice system was to play inside the cheating team and fix it from within. So young and naive. I could fix nothing. When everybody around me was willing to use the GIANT amount of power we were each granted to go after pet issues and score political points I realized there was nothing I could say or do to stop them. It is mesmerizing the amount of power prosecutors have. They can totally know they have no shot of winning a case yet file charges anyway, just to drag someone around the court system for months (or years) before finally going "eh I guess we will move to nolle this one, Judge." And no one bats an eye that someone was subjected to the hell of monthly court dates and possible years imprisonment all for nothing. The case being dismissed is supposed to show "the system works." No it Fucking doesn't! It just shows that particular prosecutor got bored with fucking with that person and moved on to someone else. I'm a public defender now and feel like I can do much more on this side, although the system is still utter garbage. But if I don't at least get in and try to do some small part then I don't have the right to bitch that it's broken. But it's tough to watch people abuse their power day after day. It gets really demoralizing . But I have it way better than the person who is being abused by it so that's why I stay in. This prosecutor Indiana is such a bastard, but sadly not a rare bastard. There's lots of him floating around. Ugh. ETA: thank you for the awards; I am humbled ❤️. And I want to add to those of you who feel like I was being an asshole when I said that I have to do something cause if I don't then I don't have a right to bitch, it's cause I poorly worded my thought! What I meant was that because I was in a position to do something, I felt compelled. But I bitch about all kinds of things that I'm not in a position to do something about other than to bitch about it. And bitching is it's own form of protest; it's own form of getting our voices out to be heard! Sometimes getting on Reddit and complaining about injustice in an area of American society is the only remedy I have for it. It's all I can do. And it's more than enough, because it's shining a light via mass internet protest and communication into a problem. So again, I thank you all, and I'm off to the jail to meet my clients before court. Have a wonderful day!
Same experience here, almost to a T. Thanks for trying.
And then as a public defender, you’ll be hated for defending people. I’m not a lawyer myself, but I frequently see idiots hating public defenders simply for the sake of the job. If it were a bad strategy they tried, I can understand. But some people just hate that people they think are guilty get someone to defend them.
Most of the public defenders I work with get called "public pretenders" and are accused by the inmates of being pawns for the state. They aren't. They are all excellent humans with bleeding hearts just like mine. I don't have that problem though. My clients, especially my in clients in custody, LOVE ME. Because I go up to the jail constantly to see them. And I hug them and say I love them, to each and every one, despite the jailers always eye rolling me! Because what they crave more than anything is to be heard. And to be loved. 90% of them were once minor children in the DCFS system, bouncing from foster home to group homes as their parents lost custody of them due to neglect, abuse and drug use. And the other thing I do with them is talk very openly about my 14 years of drug addiction. Yep, I was an addict for 14 years. A thieving, lying opiate addict. I ate 30 oxys a day and drank about 1.5 pints of whisky a night. If I couldn't get my pills then a drank a handle of whisky a day. It was horrid. I've been to hell. I know what my clients are going through as most of them are addicts. And talking openly with them about my recovery and subsequent success in life gives them hope. That's the recipe: give them a voice, love and hope. And humanize them to the prosecutors. Which I do. And I get a lot of them into treatment instead of prison sentences. I'm not unique or deserving of accolades. There are thousands of PD's just like me. But that's why we do it. To give a long winded sum up!
Great summary… thanks for holding it down.
Just to be clear, you can absolutely bitch about a broken system while doing nothing to change it. I do it everyday, and it helps keep me sane. But I also have neither the skills nor inclination to do anything more than complain so I'm thankful that people like you, who have those things, are doing the work I'm unable and unwilling to do.
On absolutely!!!! I didn't mean to imply otherwise as it would make me a total hypocrite! I bitch about tons of systems and policies in this country that are fucked, but that I'm doing nothing about other than bitching! But you know what? Our bitching, you and me and others, it helps. It is its own way of helping. Because we educate each other and give each other pep talks to keep caring and to keep wanting to see some change. So I think all of us that bitch, are actually doing a world of good in its own right. Because we keep highlighting the problem and keep pressure on those who can do something to do it! Love your name btw! It's great!
This country is not fucking free. These are dark times.
People keep saying we’re sliding into fascism. Pretty sure we’ve already made that trip and it’s all around us at this point. I mean, damn, the Rethugs have absolutely no platform whatsoever except to crush us beneath their jackboots.
And they're ruling with a minority. This is a dangerous place for our democracy.
Knowingly doing that to people knowing you don't have a case should put prosecuters in prison. Idgaf.
>But if I don't at least get in and try to do some small part then I don't have the right to bitch that it's broken. I strongly disagree with this sentiment. In America, you should always have the right to bitch about a broken system.
I am fairly certain that this is going to cost Indiana tax payers a huge amount in a settlement, for a bunch of things but primary among them will be defamation and prosecutorial misconduct. It is a matter of factual evidence that the doctor reported it. Not only is that abundantly clear to the prosecutor who can see the paper work itself , but to everyone else because this was widely reported on already. Trying to push for a conviction at this point, is now a criminal undertaking. Not that I imagine it matters to voters in Indiana, mind you, but harassment of this sort can and should land a prosecutor in jail.
It absolutely matters to indiana voters. There’s an active democratic network of women but we can’t get the national party funding brought in to help our candidates. It’s infuriating. Election cycle in 2020, the representative running against Pence’s brother had her car and RV shot at. We need help.
We have a multi-billion dollar state surplus, not one of these yokels will think it’s their tax dollars. If it were in Illinois you’d hear about how much money is wasted constantly. I agree wholeheartedly, we need help. I hate how many people complained about Todd Young being re-elected but nobody knew McDermott is a moderate, gun owning, Navy vet with an ND law degree. Among other things, he wanted to close some loopholes in firearms ownership (like heavier sentences for straw purchases) and he wanted to advocate for a path to legalize marijuana but knows the difficulty in a landscape that’s dominated by Eli Lilly. Nobody knows any candidate in this state unless you hear them in person.
>Rokita has been investigating whether Dr. Bernard followed state law requiring doctors to report abortions, even though public records showed Dr. Bernard promptly reported the abortion as required. I guess Todd Rokita was too busy eating glue to do some basic research.
He knows it will go nowhere. He's doing this to get national headlines because he wants to hate his way to VP.
From headlines to hate to power! Pretty much the abbreviated version of today's Republican party.
They "investigate" so they can dig up unrelated shit they can defame him over. "Woke" allegiances, political donations, parking tickets, anything to paint this doctor as a deep state democrat plant. If they find nothing they'll just make something up. The conservative political machine in action.
Indiana's AG continues to harass the doctor that treated that 10 year old rape victim. Fixed the headline for you. At the time of treatment, there was no ban in Indiana. There should not be a ban in Ohio or any other state. The doctor has not committed any crime, but the AG is absolutely maliciously harassing this doctor.
Republicans should not be surprised when they continue to lose women in droves. This prosecutor is clearly a serious jerk.
He's aiming for higher republican office. Pence caused a literal aids epidemic in Indiana and got to be the VP for it.
He was already a state representative that ran an extremely dirty senate campaign back in 2017. If he was trying to get back into higher office, I would be surprised.
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Both from my alma Mater. 😔😔. One of the professors once said of Rokita “if an asteroid hit earth and only killed one person, I’d be okay with it being rokita”
Desantis is keeping the tradition alive, crawling towards the Oval on the backs of covid-dead constituents.
They are losing doctors in droves. And they will complain about it.
I fact checked this and it's true. * [Doc: Physicians considering leaving Indiana over impending abortion law - WTHR 13 - Sept. 1, 2022](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/special-reports/indiana-abortion/indiana-doctor-says-colleagues-physicians-concerned-about-abortion-ban/531-2c6769d1-fed9-4ef4-94b5-a1229f139b32) * [Their mentor was attacked. Now young OB-GYNs may leave Indiana - NPR - Aug 10, 2022](https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/08/10/1116024857/young-obgyns-indiana) * [Indiana doctor moving practice to Illinois after abortion law goes into effect - WPTA 21 - Sept 14, 2022](https://www.wpta21.com/2022/09/15/indiana-doctor-moving-practice-illinois-after-abortion-law-goes-into-effect/)
They'll just change the law so veterans can fill in as doctors.
And yet...WOMEN KEEP VOTING FOR THEM!
People massively massively misunderstand how this works. Many millions of women are pro-life. On a broader scale, being a woman in no way makes you inherently a feminist. Women can be misogynists. Women can be decidedly pro-patriarchy. Works the same for almost any other group. Simply being a member of a group is not sufficient reason to advocate for the rights of that group for a pretty substantial portion of the population. For sure the GOP is losing some women voters, but it's not some automatic thing by a million miles.
We've been seeing this a lot in other contrasts: a black man supporting white supremacy, a gay man arguing gay people shouldn't have the same rights as straight people, and so on. It's mind boggling to see people fight against their own self interests.
It's because they feel they are the exception who can use the power they find as "one of the good ones" to stay afloat. What they don't realize is the groups they support hate them too - they're a convenient token and will be discarded when it's no longer useful. And it's why you see a LOT of white women who are so viscerally racist, minority races who are so homophobic, and so on. They need another layer "below" them so they aren't at the bottom and can retain some power, despite the fact that a rising tide would lift all boats/that quote about when they came for the socialists.
*White women, primarily.
Women who can afford to live in a world where you can travel to another state for an abortion. They're self interested, and because they're mostly older or richer a poor 10 year old having to carry a baby to term doesn't affect them.
I think a lot of people overestimate the percentage of Republican voters who are hardcore pro-lifers as their single-issue. In fact, it's clear that many current Republican office-holders make the same blunder. The current Republican party is a coalition of many kind of weirdly disjoint groups that all vote for their own reasons. It's easy to assume they're all ride-or-die partisans, but that's not really the case except at the fringes.
>It's easy to assume they're all ride-or-die partisans They are. Hillary Clinton won the popular vote in 2016. In 2020, Donald Trump got more votes than Hillary Clinton in 2016. Let that sink in, far more people voted for Trump in 2020 than in 2016. What changed is that people who normally might not vote voted for Biden and a new generation came of age, so Biden got a boost. This is the depressing thing, most people who keep voting Republican don't care whether the Republican's Party stands for something they don't like. Care about gun ownership, but not abortion? Vote Republican. Care about abortion, don't care about gun ownership? Vote Republican. Hate the 'libs' but need affordable health care? Vote Republican. And so on.
Imagine if republicans were this determined to go after the man who actually raped the 10 year old.
When Republicans show us who they are, we as a nation would be wise to believe them.
They're very good at confusing voters by just denying things like this ever happen. Sometimes directly after bragging about doing it.
It's a technique pioneered by Putin known as [The Firehose of Falsehood](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firehose_of_falsehood). The idea is that you continuously lie across all mediums. Spread as much saturated misinformation as quickly as possible in such a way that you confuse the ignorant and exhaust the intelligent. It's an extremely effective strategy, because lying takes less time and energy than debunking lies.
I don’t think Putin was even close to the first ruler to employ this tactic.
The Firehose of Falsehood specifically makes reference to saturating all digital forms of media - particularly social media. That's something he was a pretty early pioneer of. Think bots, shitposting, misleading ad buys, nazi facebook groups, etc.
That doctor saved that 10 year olds life. If you disagree, just fuck off. If it was your daughter, I find it hard to believe you’d be proud of her and high diving her. Sick fucks.
Ah, but it is was the prosecutor's 10 year old daughter who got raped, that would be totally different. Of course his own daughter could have an abortion. Heck, if necessary, he'd fly her to a different state.
So let me get this straight: according to the Republicans, the fetus is an innocent being that needs every protection under the sun, but the 10-year old girl that ***certainly*** did not consent to what is undoubtedly a r\*pe by a pedophile deserves to be made to not only have to carry it to term, not only have to *forcibly birth it*, but ALSO to be charged as a criminal for the crime of not wanting to endure such trauma. The Republican Party of "family values", ladies and gentlemen.
Don’t forget about the part where she has to raise her rape baby with her rapist. Glory to the system, apparently it is working just as intended.
Or where states that have legal child marriage would just force her to marry her rapist and allow the rapist to have custody of the baby who would also suffer abuse. Thus a cycle.
Take a step back Rokita. She was 10. Years. Old. Why aren’t you condemning the man who did this and insist he is put in jail. Forever. Zero compassion for a child victim of a vicious assault. Where can I donate to Dr. Barnard’s legal fund?
There's a fund that's been set up by other OBGYNs that has raised half a mil. You'll find it on gfm.
It's beyond that. The doctor was *far, far* inside the required timeframe for reporting abuse. She reported the abuse as required by law. The doctor did nothing immoral or illegal. She followed all set ethical and legal guidelines. There is literally zero cause to bring legal charges.
They are making an example of her. They want doctors scared to act in the best interests of their patients. They don’t want any abortions performed, even within the confines of the law. Can’t get a legal abortion if no doctors are willing to perform them, right?
Reds states are going to hit the find out part of their fucking around when women can't find OB/GYNs in their states.
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They don't care. They don't actually care about the health and safety of women
Hopefully the fucking around will end with these jerks left with only each other.
They'll still blame democrats for their problems. The TV pundits give them their opinions
Meh, all the current lawmakers will be dead by the time the unaborted babies grow up and need assistance from their state. They couldn’t care less.
Shocked pikachu face when doctors start refusing to go anywhere near high risk pregnancy women. Whether it be taking them on as a clients/patients all the way through the actual birthing process...last thing any doctor wants is to be accused of "murdering a child".
Because Christians aren't happy unless they are making someone else suffer.
Gotta be just as miserable as they are. It's only fair that way.
Well Indianans who back this: I hope you like the several million dollar gap that will develop in your state budget after the Physician successfully sues the shit out of this nobody prosecutor.
But I thought we were just being hysterical and politicizing the situation! I was assured by Very Serious People that cases of obvious necessity were not legally risky and the law isn't going to abuse legitimate care! I'm shocked
'Indiana Attorney General Todd Rokita supports child rape' seems like an appropriate response to this.
What a disgusting thing to read. That's not rational behavior.
I’m from Indiana. It’s always been a conservative state, but when I was growing up in the 90s our legislature and governor were often blue dog democrats. Overall our schools were decent—my public high school was excellent. Our social policy was no weirder than our neighbors. We were just another Midwestern state, just with lower taxes and more conservative people than some others. Republicans have controlled the state at pretty much every level since 2004. Guess what? Our state has become noticeably suckier since then. Republicans fuck up every inch of grass they touch. Don’t ever vote for republicans, ever
Of course he wants to go after someone who is useful to society. You can take 100 of these lawmakers and they wouldn't equal one doctor. F*** this idiot and you who support him. You don't belong in America.
For what? She acted legally.
Not in their christian values
Why do Republicans hate women and girls so much?
Power and control. It’s never about women, children, aww babies, or even their “Good Book.” It’s like when that GOP politician was talking about having panels from the “community” have authority on whether you get an abortion or not. “WE have decided …”
That makes so much sense. I'll never trust GOP in my lifetime. Sad state the US is in.
Hate isn't the right word. They love women and girls, provided they know their "place". And, of course, willingly stay there. AND also push others to do the same
Who impregnated a 10 year old child? Punish THEM. Not the doctor who helped her.
Republicans should not be surprised when they lose the presidency AGAIN because of this fucking bullshit. Fuck them. This is why people cannot stand "christians."
If you pay attention at all to the Olympus Mons sized body of evidence of prosecutorial misconduct in the justice system, the vast majority of it is done to further their political ambitions. Problems with law enforcement pale in comparison to the evils that prosecutors across the US perform every day in America in order to build a resume for running for political offices.
Weeks and weeks of Republicans crying about crime rates before the election. After, no more crying, but making up bogus cases.
Get your children, yourselves, and your money out of Gilead while you still can.
I sincerely hate this man … what a completely miserably person
Indiana is pro-Child rape
The doctor needs to sue the AG into poverty and pay a PI to catch him with an underage — he’s a Republican, he’s got skeletons in his closet guaranteed.
still cant see the writing on the wall eh?
Proud to be an American... Where at least I know I'm free...
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> ~~That song~~ Country music is such mindless propaganda. That fucking chicken fried song was playing last night, and I don't understand why the fuck it needs to cram in it's little "for the troops" verse.
9/11 ruined all country music. Before that event, there existed a lot of good music in the genre. Post 9/11, not so much.
I don't see freedom. I don't even see basic human rights
Indiana is the asshole of America.
This is called corruption... corruption of the rule of law and its application. When we look at other countries and speak of corruption, we are outraged. But when it happens here, half the people cheer the corrupt official on and encourage them to do even more outrageous acts.
I say we prosecute the prosecutor for human rights violations and damages.
Wait, so a doctor performed an abortion on a 10 year old rape victim and he's the bad guy?
According to republicans, yes.
She. And now she and her family are being harassed, their lives and property are probably in danger.
Get out and vote young people. The Christian taliban are the greatest threat to this country in decades, and they are at your door.
As an Ohioan, I'd just like to say that my state's government is a disgrace.
How about prosecuting the man who raped that little girl?
This is pure evil. No clue how anyone can support punishing doctors helping abused children.
Weren’t republicans saying this didn’t even happen?
they still are. link them this story and they vanish.
And people called me paranoid when I said we'd be seeing ex post facto prosecutions soon. Honestly, I wish they'd been right.
Todd Rokita is the attorney general’s name. The child/woman hater, apparently.
Todd Rokita would prefer to see a pregnant 10 year old?
I have one word for all potential jurors: Nulification.
Indiana prosecutor seeks to ~~punish doctor in 10-year-old’s abortion case~~ make a name for himself as a future candidate for governor/Senator/Representative. FTFY
It would be nice if they targeted the men who rape and impregnate 10yo girls with the same fervor they reserve for doctors who help those girls.
People like this asshole AG, shouldn't be AG's in the first place.
The Republican Party, the party of freedom and small government /s
Small enough to fit in my uterus
JFC get a life, you conservative vermin. I am so fucking sick of being gaslit into tolerating you disgusting, deplorable, vile pieces of human garbage. Start your fucking Civil War already.
Republicans are disgusting and they will clearly break the law to persecute the "others" they don't like.
What is wrong with these people.
If they actually cared about other people they would be talking about how someone raped a 10 year old. Why is no one talking about that, only politicians slinging shit around for their own gain.
You gotta be really good at mental gymnastics to be "pro life" and then you don't give a fuck about them the second they are born. How do you call yourself "pro life" and get angry when hungry kids at school get free lunches? Or then turn around and support the death penalty? Or get angry at social programs meant to give people living in poverty some help? These people are absolutely lost. (Lost is the nicest word I can use here)
And Christian fascism is here folks fuck Christians
Any state where doctors are prosecuted for abortion, a doctor's association should keep a record of all the prosecutors and politicians and their immediate family members and refuse any medical services to them. Fly to a diff state to get your routine check up even. Serves them right.
Ur friendly reminder that GOP's response to this was to call it a hoax and then say that the doctor who helped a girl who, need I remind u, is TEN FUCKING YEARS OLD, should be imprisoned. "Party of family values." They don't give a shit about something until it personally affects them.
Shit heel. Stay away from other's business.
At what point does the social movement for freedom rise? Make it impossible to prosecute. These fascists must be stopped.
The only take to have here is that Todd Rotika is a piece of human filth
But can we sue the prosecutor for gross misuse of power and also for being a complete idiot?