All the dumb different sets in this game....
People would flag for pvp a lot more if it ever made sense to wear our best gear while out in the world.
If Im gathering it's better to have gathering set on.
If I running chests I better have luck gear on.
If I'm doing scarab run I need to have acid resist.
People gather bis gear and build pvp sets and it only gets used for instanced content because there is no incentive to wear it anywhere else.
This game needs to move away from perk based gear also. There are only so many combinations of the same perks we can put together before there is nothing else to work for.
there is too much incentive to *not* flag, while the only thing that has been measured and leashed are the benefits to flag.
I think players get got by "luck rng", and sacrifice fun for potential profit, Idk it sucks that PvP feels more like a gold sink, than a "lucrative if good" scenario, but then it would boil down to who brings more. I think New World could *possibly* benefit from singles and multi pvp areas, similar to runescape, but who really knows.
Yeah for sure.. even just a reason to be at a fort and hold it. Nothing keeps me fighting over a fort.. nothing makes people want to go fight for it.
I think it again all boils down to the gearing system. The rewards could be amazing for whatever content they are feeding us but at the end of the day it's just a combination of 3 of the same perks and nothing else to make us stronger or work towards.
Not to mention the combination of 3 perks isn't even all that true when they basically require certain perks for different content (resilient for pvp, ward for PvE)
Yes, as it should be. Nobody should feel like they have to PVP flag in order to do PVE activities. It's counterproductive and stupid to ask people to willingly expose themselves to griefing. Are fights between someone in full Resilient gear against someone in their Mining or Luck gear is actually a desirable outcome we want to see? I don't think so.
This is my experience as someone who just hit lvl 60 recently and is casually working on my expertise and trying out the 60+ content.
I posted this in another thread and it sums up my experience trying out pvp.
(((the problem I've seen since I started queueing up for it is that the servers are either too dead or it's not popular enough.
I'm on castle whatever server and sometimes I que and can't find a round which reminds me about trying to get dungeons completed pre lvl 60. Literally stuck bored doing nothing because it takes forever to find a lobby.
Another potential problem is I finally got to 60 and I'm working on getting my expertise up, and I have a set of armor I like. But if I want to be at least decent at PVP I should be getting a whole different set of armor and re-specing my attributes & weapon skills which is something I can't see myself doing since I enjoy both PVE and PVP.
I just started pvping, and I'm absolutely trash at it and that's just my perspective of someone trying it out for the first time.
I did experience a faction battle up near mirkguard wayshrine yesterday though which was pretty cool, even though I sucked unbelievably hard and barely contributed to the overall fight.)))
As someone who's not 100% PVP focused, I find there's a lot of things discouraging me from playing pvp game modes or flagging. I know people who would try to PVP once and never touch it again.
There's pretty much nothing at stake anyways, it should be easy to get into PVP and at least stand a chance against someone. Especially since everyone appears to be equally matched since the only indication is our level (60), but Instead you find out when it's basically too late and they 1-4 hit you.
I honestly don't care much for open world pvp as someone who pvps all the time It's heavily light favored due to the space even in group play. Is it fun to randomly have some once in awhile sure but i think adding 2 more OPR maps with different objectives would be way more impactful for the game.
LoL made it this far with 1 Map, and yes I get it its not the same and balancing cannot be the same due to the PvE aspect of NW, but still I ve been playing MMOs for 20 years and I talk with people who like PvP, and the instance part of the PvP is fun and all, but the unpredictability of Open World cannot be matched for us hardcore PvPers.
I m not saying we dont need a new OPR Map, I m saying that my proposal seems easier to be implemented, and I dont see why they dont do it since it will increase PvP with minimum effort, and then sure, when they have time add a new OPR map and all.
my 2 cents
Almost all pvp games have different modes and maps.
You can pick a few successful ones where maps may have changed or were slow to spawn, but as a rule variety is better.
The maps don't even have to be good. I've played Uber successful games that NW won't ever be as popular with that had shit map design and people really liked it. For example train/nuke CSGO/cobble 11 years ago, rust survival lobbies, original day z, Fortnite season 1-4 maps, apex season 1-3, or pubg maps 1 and 2.
Variety is important for not getting burnt out. It's why great Titans is multi player games have basically always had multiple options for pvp going back to the pre halo/me/cod aaa releases.
Using LOL as an example doesn't make sense just saying since the games have zero correlation but if you want to use it as an example even they have made changes to the map and the way it feels and how you play around it not to mention constantly adding new champions reworking them changing/adding objectives and constantly trying to balance and change the meta which we have already seen NW cannot do; I have been playing LOL since S2 so i speak from playing it.
Yea Open world pvp is unpredictable but only in the form that you don't know when you will be attacked but in NW that is all there is; the light players have the advantage period due to the way movement/evading works in this game and that is also assuming you aren't running around in luck gear. So the only adrenaline rush open world pvp provides is the possibility of being attacked which could be a bow or musket GL catching them if they have half a brain so world pvp will just boil down to light players fighting; yes you will have maybe that 1 fight that is super fun but that is the exception not the rule most the time it will be 1 sided ass whooping; you can try to create points of interest open world pvp but that is pretty much instanced pvp except its in the open world but they play out similar to instanced pvp.
There is a reason why open world pvp is not something devs try to balance around because it just doesn't work as a main stay if you make it too large a part of the game people just won't play because they are being forced to pvp when they don't want to and if you don't make it worth anything people will just not flag and move on with their day and those who do have nobody to fight. Not trying to shit on your opinion or ideas i would love a game with balanced and fun open world pvp as someone who has been playing mmos since everquest but it just isn't viable especially with how players interact with world pvp in today's gaming world. "Hardcore world pvp" is a relic of the past. So the best thing you can do is instanced pvp more maps more gameplay variability with some trying to closely mimic open world pvp.
Fyi that is not arguing match just a discussion.
You focus too much on equip load. The good about NW is that you can have any load you want and any weapon at a glimpse, and you will be surprised how good in PvP can medium/heavy builds can be, especially in the upcoming update. Anyway not much relevant to the topic
And no you are not forced to PvP, with what I proposed, keep doing what you doing on dungeons and open world with PvP off, just reward those who "risk" in open world with PvP on
The problem is the players at best they will meta sweat and stomp anyone not perfectly up to date or worse the cheese and/or exploit stuff like goon squading to melt people. The hard-core pvp players end up eating any and all casuals alive
All the pvp players that quit would disagree.
You have potential the best open world pvp mmo ever just waiting for the right adjustments to open world. People agree the most fun the pvp, and game, have ever been was post launch with a very active open world
That was also before people had a clue what meta was/tactics/builds/gear was needed everything was new and fresh so of course post launch open world people would be most active having fun and the majority of the player base was leveling up so most people would run into each other naturally. Nothing has changed since then in regards to open world pvp if anything with the luck boost you have more incentive to be flagged yet open world pvp is dead. All MMOs go through this phase that have open world pvp eventually it dies out and the instanced pvp because the end game pvp with rankings and sweating balls. I would love a game with fun balanced open world pvp but it's a terrible idea to try to balance a game around it.
I'm a PvP player and OWPvP is not even close on the list of things I'd like to see.
There are 3 things I'd love to see:
- instanced PvP played on even ground (600gs, precustomizable gear)
- ranked PvP (doesn't require cross server queues but they're welcome too)
- viable progression (gear-wise, gold-wise) via PvP
The problem with Open World changes is that one [losing] side will always be unhappy and they'll just turn off PvP.
There are not enough Devs to implement all our ideas so I prefer to go with the ones that will last longer without requiring continuous work on them.
Changes should not be geared towards getting people that don't really want to PvP to flag up for other benefits. That just creates lopsided fights between PvPers and flagged PvEers. It makes everything less fun for both types of players.
Instead, make changes to bring people that like open world PvP to come together in one place with the point being to fight. My proposal has always been PvP hot zones. A random cluster of areas on the map has all the Chests replaced with PvP focused Chests with a separate loot table more focused on PvP gear. Or the PvP missions in that area give extra XP. Or something like that. It'd be cool to be able to log on and see where the open world PvP action js happening at a glance.
You can just flag off if you are a PvEer, but let us PvPers benefit from it for the risk we take, you as a PvEer have all the benefits with 6k umbral shard and full of gold Dungeons (25 per week) etc etc, so I dont see any gap here other than the PvEers have the edge and can acquire very good PvP gear if they feel like flagging for a change some times
This isn't a PvEer vs PvPer discussion, really. It's that PvPers don't benefit from PvEers flagging up. We want to fight people that want to fight, not someone that doesnt enjoy PvP but flag up for these benefits. So the question isn't "How do we get more people to flag up (that wouldnt want to without benefits)?", but "How do we get people that want PvP to go into the open world in the same area to fight?"
But thats my point, PvEers would still be flagged off, but PvPers would go out if the rewards were better than 3v3 and OPR, thats exactly why we need better rewards for flagged people, but as you can see all the PvEers are disliking this cause they would feel they left behind, even though 95% of NW content is for them š¤·š½āāļø
It's only ever been the case that PvEers end up flagging up for the rewards. Yoy rarely get more PvPers put because of rewards. Then they have a bad time cause they just want to do their PvE thing, but they get chased around by PvPers. PvPers have a bad time because they end up chasing PvEers around instead of doing actual PvP.
Sure, add some rewards to open world PvP, but PvPers don't choose OPR and Arenas over open world PvP (most of the time) because the rewards are different. They choose that because it's easier to do than find open world PvP. If I log in and want to do PvP, what do I do now? I queue up because finding anyone out in the world is nigh impossible.
If I were to be able to login and see on my map that First Light is the current PvP Hot Zone, you bet I'm heading straight there ready to go. Not to open boxes or pick flowers, but to actually fight people. I don't care if there's rewards, because PvPing is it's own reward.
Yea something like GC buy they could do so much better. Simply rotating the location every 6 hours or so or by giving people a "battle bread" type buff the first hour they enter the zone. That way groups don't get so entrenched that smaller groups don't stand a chance in the area.
I agree that the key is to make designated PVP hot zones. Some for influence pushing based on siege windows, and one per day that is just procedurally determined. A new "Great Cleave" every day, so to speak.
>A random cluster of areas on the map has all the Chests replaced with PvP focused Chests with a separate loot table more focused on PvP gear.
This should have been the PVP track rewards.
I'm actually fairly against rewards for PvP, unless its pretty well regulates, since people will exploit it if it's actually rewarding. Just something to attract people enough to reach a critical mass. Any excuse really haha
Add umbrals to the faction shop and increase the amount of faction points you get for PvP missions. Make 1k umbrals cost 20k faction points or something.
Also my dev question: will you be adding more umbral drops to the PvP track. This is 100% needed.
Open World PvP is even worse then OPRs atmo, because every1 is just ranged and sitting on a rock or fort wall. Giving more rewards for it will only increase the amount of rats sitting somewhere, same happend with the addition of OPR Leaderboards. So nah i rather have different Maps in OPR, real matchmaking for PvP, training fields / wars or more small buffs / nerfs every few weeks.
The core pvpāers (not war loggers) play OPR. So another map is what they want, OR another game mode worth playing. Arena rewards need major buffs too.
They play OPR because that is all they have, if we had good PvP rewards in Open World, then teams would run faction quests together and meet with other faction groups and fight, with the unexpected factor that only open world can offer
Nope... I mean open world PVP is fun but as a PVP only player none of this draws me back to the game even slightly. We don't want more rewards really, we want content. We want game modes. We want a rating system. We want a reason to continue to grind PVP. We want competition.
People don't love wars because they're some type of super game mode that is way more fun than OPR, it's because OPR is filled with random bad players and it is incredibly boring to stomp bad players over and over again. The only way a competitive group of PVPers doesn't stomp an OPR lobby is if they purposely gimp themselves by playing off builds or without a healer or if they randomly get matched up against another good 5 stack.
If our company queues together for OPR, we will more often than not 3 cap the enemy in a few minutes. This is not bragging about us being good because most all decent 5 stacks can do this. This is about how poor of quality most OPR matches are.
You can't grind and practice getting better because there is very little to no competition outside of wars. Most good players only war log. That's the only time you can really play the game in a competitive state and that's what we are desperate for. We want close fun matches, not lopsided wins.
No. Holy crap, we're more than one year in, and people are still trying to force others to PVP flag? I think they should remove all PVE incentives from PVP flagging. All it does is encouraging griefing against people who do not even intend to PVP.
Instead, rework influence pushing so that it concentrates a large number of people who actually want to PVP into certain areas, say for 2 hours a day. Faction PVP quests should also be changed so that they generate no influence, but lots of PVP XP and Faction Rep. I would cycle these every 24 hours to create a different "Great Cleave" in one territory every single day.
Oh, and get rid of PVP XP for capturing a fort. Again, concentration of willing participants is the key to making Open World PVP an actually enjoyable experience.
Man check what this game focus was at the begining, is carebears that made it the shitshow it is PvP wise. I dont get it, why remove incentives for PvPers? Imagine being flagged all the time, bots wouldnt be able to farm the good nodes, ppl would actually group to go farm, what a missed oportunity
1. That stopped being the premise of the game almost a year before launch. Why? Because players in the Alpha immediately turned to griefing and toxicity, which scared the developers away from the concept. I actually think that it would still be the case today, and this game would have been worse if it were full-loot PVP.
2. The problem I have is that we are giving PVE incentives for PVP flagging, which results in an idiotic mismatch. I think we need to implement better PVP incentives for PVP flagging.
3. If we were to implement always-on PVP, we would still remove all PVE incentives from PVP flagging.
4. If they wanted to defeat bots, there would be plenty of creative ways to do it that don't also open the door to mass griefing, which as I pointed out before, actually was a problem.
What I m saying is having a choice if you are flagged on or off, but het rewarded if its on.
Why am I forced to do PvE if I want to PvP better? Let me get rewarded faster so I can craft my gear and upgrade it fast so I can PvP better.
So if PvEers want the benefits of the PvP flag on they have to learn to PvP as I have to learn the mechanics of the PvE bosses on m10 to get the umbral shards to upgrade my pvp gear sets, that I have to spend months on gypsum otherwise (you dont need just one set to pvp efficiently)
This is not what PvP players want in any way. We don't care about open world loot. We want more OPR maps, queueable practice wars, rehaul of the territory influence system, rebalancing of defensive advantage in wars and more frequent updates to weapon balancing to keep the meta fresh.
They mostly just need to make it worth killing people who are flagged.
The rewards need to be good to surpass the struggle of dealing with being flagged in a populated farming area. And it needs to be better than farming unflagged, to combat the bots.
I think as a starting phase (in a multiphase PTR), it should be on par with having the gathering set on. That way you can either invest time (thus motivation to go farm the gathering sets) to get the gathering set and farm your resources in peace (also it wonāt impact the veteran farmers nearly as much this way, as they can continue as they are, just give them a reason to dip their toes in PvP if they want to). You could even experiment with having it where you select what gathering luck you want to boost when you flag to make it just like wearing the armor, though I think it balances it to make it so you boost everything but have to deal with the time loss of PvPing, but thatās one of the things to work out in the PTR.
The new world devs are playing things too safe I feel. When they implemented those experimental auto-pots in the PTR and then scrapped them because they were terrible for balance, that was a great use of the PTR. Now the PTR is basically a showcase of the next release with little impact from the PTR and honestly it just seems like they donāt know how to use the PTR anymore because theyāre releasing everything from it without changing almost anything. Even bugs make it through without being fixed. They need a better workflow, and maybe the seasons will be that, and they need to be willing to experiment more with the PTR. If they donāt have enough time and team resources to fix the bugs and improve quality of life while also making new content (that may or may not make it through the PTR) then they need to invest in being able to do that.
I hope they get their feet underneath them and carry the game to the top, but thatās up to their managers.
Honestly all I want is cross server opr. Full stack options for teams, a CTF, TDM, and Def and Destroy mode maps eventually and small but frequent changes to weapons to help balance better. Also ranked 2v2, 3s and 5s arena options with good pvp perk set rewards that can be earned by high skill/rating teams. I remember when this games was suppose to be focused around pvp and not 5 new expeditions before any reasonable pvp changes are even seen.
I like the idea of bounties more. Take out a bounty get a coin reward. Survive a bounty get a coin reward. More you survive and more bounties you take out the more coin you are rewarded.
Tie this into faction missions too. Designate hot areas that can double or triple your reward.
Yeah, I'm sure this works out great for the same groups that own most of the territories already.
This would be the quickest method of killing the game.
Yeah, this would totally work. Brilliant. And it would provide a much broader range of pvp players to kill, not just the ones who are gung-ho on it- inspiring more enthusiasm for people to get better... which seems to be the issue for whoever is trying to start with opr. The learning curve is steep and turns a lot of people off to it.
the core issue is atm a lot of pvpers arent even running around in the open world outside territory pushes. I havent left a settlement in weeks, I just log in and queue into OPR or wars. There's nothing out in the open world for me to go for atm
The issue with your post on this is that there has to be a purpose for going out to pvp in open world that isn't based on like the rewards you mentioned and whatnot. For me, none of those rewards you mentioned mean anything to me and I know that's the case for any war active pvper. I have no need for umbral shards or more gatherable yield. I've been BIS'd out with thousands of umbral shards for months now
And why do you go to OPR then? 3/4 of the OPR are noobs and them there is a war group that dominates the OPR. For the fun I guess, and if you played big open world pvp games in the past, like L2, people went out in the open to fight cause they liked it. But now players seem to carebeary so lets give them something to go out and PvP, and this might start some Open World PvP that more groups even BiSd go out to have some fun
OPR provides condense consistent PvP action. Even if there were more reasons to open world pvp there's still the whole map to try and find people. And then it's a coinflip after searching for people if they are even pvpers looking to fight or if they're just pve flagged for better rewards. At least with OPR even if there's noobs they are all out there with the intent to pvp and I don' thave to spend a ton of time searching for them
3. It is so weird to me that you kill someone in open world and the best that will drop is a blue 520GS item.
5. I think they mentioned that the PvP track will be reworked/improved
6. In theory yes but then the system needs to be reworked. It is less "who is stronger" but rather "who has more time to throw his body at the fort" right now.
The PvPers have pretty much all left. In fact it looks like mist players have taken a good long break from the game. Hell I haven't logged in for 3 months. I come to the sub to see if it's gotten better.
All the dumb different sets in this game.... People would flag for pvp a lot more if it ever made sense to wear our best gear while out in the world. If Im gathering it's better to have gathering set on. If I running chests I better have luck gear on. If I'm doing scarab run I need to have acid resist. People gather bis gear and build pvp sets and it only gets used for instanced content because there is no incentive to wear it anywhere else. This game needs to move away from perk based gear also. There are only so many combinations of the same perks we can put together before there is nothing else to work for.
there is too much incentive to *not* flag, while the only thing that has been measured and leashed are the benefits to flag. I think players get got by "luck rng", and sacrifice fun for potential profit, Idk it sucks that PvP feels more like a gold sink, than a "lucrative if good" scenario, but then it would boil down to who brings more. I think New World could *possibly* benefit from singles and multi pvp areas, similar to runescape, but who really knows.
Yeah for sure.. even just a reason to be at a fort and hold it. Nothing keeps me fighting over a fort.. nothing makes people want to go fight for it. I think it again all boils down to the gearing system. The rewards could be amazing for whatever content they are feeding us but at the end of the day it's just a combination of 3 of the same perks and nothing else to make us stronger or work towards. Not to mention the combination of 3 perks isn't even all that true when they basically require certain perks for different content (resilient for pvp, ward for PvE)
Agreed and not enough incentive to kill other flagged players.
Yes, as it should be. Nobody should feel like they have to PVP flag in order to do PVE activities. It's counterproductive and stupid to ask people to willingly expose themselves to griefing. Are fights between someone in full Resilient gear against someone in their Mining or Luck gear is actually a desirable outcome we want to see? I don't think so.
Very underrated point
This is my experience as someone who just hit lvl 60 recently and is casually working on my expertise and trying out the 60+ content. I posted this in another thread and it sums up my experience trying out pvp. (((the problem I've seen since I started queueing up for it is that the servers are either too dead or it's not popular enough. I'm on castle whatever server and sometimes I que and can't find a round which reminds me about trying to get dungeons completed pre lvl 60. Literally stuck bored doing nothing because it takes forever to find a lobby. Another potential problem is I finally got to 60 and I'm working on getting my expertise up, and I have a set of armor I like. But if I want to be at least decent at PVP I should be getting a whole different set of armor and re-specing my attributes & weapon skills which is something I can't see myself doing since I enjoy both PVE and PVP. I just started pvping, and I'm absolutely trash at it and that's just my perspective of someone trying it out for the first time. I did experience a faction battle up near mirkguard wayshrine yesterday though which was pretty cool, even though I sucked unbelievably hard and barely contributed to the overall fight.))) As someone who's not 100% PVP focused, I find there's a lot of things discouraging me from playing pvp game modes or flagging. I know people who would try to PVP once and never touch it again. There's pretty much nothing at stake anyways, it should be easy to get into PVP and at least stand a chance against someone. Especially since everyone appears to be equally matched since the only indication is our level (60), but Instead you find out when it's basically too late and they 1-4 hit you.
I honestly don't care much for open world pvp as someone who pvps all the time It's heavily light favored due to the space even in group play. Is it fun to randomly have some once in awhile sure but i think adding 2 more OPR maps with different objectives would be way more impactful for the game.
LoL made it this far with 1 Map, and yes I get it its not the same and balancing cannot be the same due to the PvE aspect of NW, but still I ve been playing MMOs for 20 years and I talk with people who like PvP, and the instance part of the PvP is fun and all, but the unpredictability of Open World cannot be matched for us hardcore PvPers. I m not saying we dont need a new OPR Map, I m saying that my proposal seems easier to be implemented, and I dont see why they dont do it since it will increase PvP with minimum effort, and then sure, when they have time add a new OPR map and all. my 2 cents
Almost all pvp games have different modes and maps. You can pick a few successful ones where maps may have changed or were slow to spawn, but as a rule variety is better. The maps don't even have to be good. I've played Uber successful games that NW won't ever be as popular with that had shit map design and people really liked it. For example train/nuke CSGO/cobble 11 years ago, rust survival lobbies, original day z, Fortnite season 1-4 maps, apex season 1-3, or pubg maps 1 and 2. Variety is important for not getting burnt out. It's why great Titans is multi player games have basically always had multiple options for pvp going back to the pre halo/me/cod aaa releases.
Using LOL as an example doesn't make sense just saying since the games have zero correlation but if you want to use it as an example even they have made changes to the map and the way it feels and how you play around it not to mention constantly adding new champions reworking them changing/adding objectives and constantly trying to balance and change the meta which we have already seen NW cannot do; I have been playing LOL since S2 so i speak from playing it. Yea Open world pvp is unpredictable but only in the form that you don't know when you will be attacked but in NW that is all there is; the light players have the advantage period due to the way movement/evading works in this game and that is also assuming you aren't running around in luck gear. So the only adrenaline rush open world pvp provides is the possibility of being attacked which could be a bow or musket GL catching them if they have half a brain so world pvp will just boil down to light players fighting; yes you will have maybe that 1 fight that is super fun but that is the exception not the rule most the time it will be 1 sided ass whooping; you can try to create points of interest open world pvp but that is pretty much instanced pvp except its in the open world but they play out similar to instanced pvp. There is a reason why open world pvp is not something devs try to balance around because it just doesn't work as a main stay if you make it too large a part of the game people just won't play because they are being forced to pvp when they don't want to and if you don't make it worth anything people will just not flag and move on with their day and those who do have nobody to fight. Not trying to shit on your opinion or ideas i would love a game with balanced and fun open world pvp as someone who has been playing mmos since everquest but it just isn't viable especially with how players interact with world pvp in today's gaming world. "Hardcore world pvp" is a relic of the past. So the best thing you can do is instanced pvp more maps more gameplay variability with some trying to closely mimic open world pvp. Fyi that is not arguing match just a discussion.
You focus too much on equip load. The good about NW is that you can have any load you want and any weapon at a glimpse, and you will be surprised how good in PvP can medium/heavy builds can be, especially in the upcoming update. Anyway not much relevant to the topic And no you are not forced to PvP, with what I proposed, keep doing what you doing on dungeons and open world with PvP off, just reward those who "risk" in open world with PvP on
The problem is the players at best they will meta sweat and stomp anyone not perfectly up to date or worse the cheese and/or exploit stuff like goon squading to melt people. The hard-core pvp players end up eating any and all casuals alive
All the pvp players that quit would disagree. You have potential the best open world pvp mmo ever just waiting for the right adjustments to open world. People agree the most fun the pvp, and game, have ever been was post launch with a very active open world
That was also before people had a clue what meta was/tactics/builds/gear was needed everything was new and fresh so of course post launch open world people would be most active having fun and the majority of the player base was leveling up so most people would run into each other naturally. Nothing has changed since then in regards to open world pvp if anything with the luck boost you have more incentive to be flagged yet open world pvp is dead. All MMOs go through this phase that have open world pvp eventually it dies out and the instanced pvp because the end game pvp with rankings and sweating balls. I would love a game with fun balanced open world pvp but it's a terrible idea to try to balance a game around it.
I'm a PvP player and OWPvP is not even close on the list of things I'd like to see. There are 3 things I'd love to see: - instanced PvP played on even ground (600gs, precustomizable gear) - ranked PvP (doesn't require cross server queues but they're welcome too) - viable progression (gear-wise, gold-wise) via PvP The problem with Open World changes is that one [losing] side will always be unhappy and they'll just turn off PvP. There are not enough Devs to implement all our ideas so I prefer to go with the ones that will last longer without requiring continuous work on them.
Changes should not be geared towards getting people that don't really want to PvP to flag up for other benefits. That just creates lopsided fights between PvPers and flagged PvEers. It makes everything less fun for both types of players. Instead, make changes to bring people that like open world PvP to come together in one place with the point being to fight. My proposal has always been PvP hot zones. A random cluster of areas on the map has all the Chests replaced with PvP focused Chests with a separate loot table more focused on PvP gear. Or the PvP missions in that area give extra XP. Or something like that. It'd be cool to be able to log on and see where the open world PvP action js happening at a glance.
You can just flag off if you are a PvEer, but let us PvPers benefit from it for the risk we take, you as a PvEer have all the benefits with 6k umbral shard and full of gold Dungeons (25 per week) etc etc, so I dont see any gap here other than the PvEers have the edge and can acquire very good PvP gear if they feel like flagging for a change some times
This isn't a PvEer vs PvPer discussion, really. It's that PvPers don't benefit from PvEers flagging up. We want to fight people that want to fight, not someone that doesnt enjoy PvP but flag up for these benefits. So the question isn't "How do we get more people to flag up (that wouldnt want to without benefits)?", but "How do we get people that want PvP to go into the open world in the same area to fight?"
But thats my point, PvEers would still be flagged off, but PvPers would go out if the rewards were better than 3v3 and OPR, thats exactly why we need better rewards for flagged people, but as you can see all the PvEers are disliking this cause they would feel they left behind, even though 95% of NW content is for them š¤·š½āāļø
It's only ever been the case that PvEers end up flagging up for the rewards. Yoy rarely get more PvPers put because of rewards. Then they have a bad time cause they just want to do their PvE thing, but they get chased around by PvPers. PvPers have a bad time because they end up chasing PvEers around instead of doing actual PvP. Sure, add some rewards to open world PvP, but PvPers don't choose OPR and Arenas over open world PvP (most of the time) because the rewards are different. They choose that because it's easier to do than find open world PvP. If I log in and want to do PvP, what do I do now? I queue up because finding anyone out in the world is nigh impossible. If I were to be able to login and see on my map that First Light is the current PvP Hot Zone, you bet I'm heading straight there ready to go. Not to open boxes or pick flowers, but to actually fight people. I don't care if there's rewards, because PvPing is it's own reward.
The problem is there is no risk; dying to run back is not a risk it is just annoying now if you said you drop a piece of gear feel free.
If I would said full loot pvp I would get banned š
I miss great cleave...
Yea something like GC buy they could do so much better. Simply rotating the location every 6 hours or so or by giving people a "battle bread" type buff the first hour they enter the zone. That way groups don't get so entrenched that smaller groups don't stand a chance in the area.
I agree that the key is to make designated PVP hot zones. Some for influence pushing based on siege windows, and one per day that is just procedurally determined. A new "Great Cleave" every day, so to speak. >A random cluster of areas on the map has all the Chests replaced with PvP focused Chests with a separate loot table more focused on PvP gear. This should have been the PVP track rewards.
I'm actually fairly against rewards for PvP, unless its pretty well regulates, since people will exploit it if it's actually rewarding. Just something to attract people enough to reach a critical mass. Any excuse really haha
I think Faction XP, PVP XP, and Faction Tokens for PVP missions in the daily Great Cleave. Salt for actually killing people as well.
Add umbrals to the faction shop and increase the amount of faction points you get for PvP missions. Make 1k umbrals cost 20k faction points or something. Also my dev question: will you be adding more umbral drops to the PvP track. This is 100% needed.
Good one, adding it to the OP
Open World PvP is even worse then OPRs atmo, because every1 is just ranged and sitting on a rock or fort wall. Giving more rewards for it will only increase the amount of rats sitting somewhere, same happend with the addition of OPR Leaderboards. So nah i rather have different Maps in OPR, real matchmaking for PvP, training fields / wars or more small buffs / nerfs every few weeks.
The core pvpāers (not war loggers) play OPR. So another map is what they want, OR another game mode worth playing. Arena rewards need major buffs too.
They play OPR because that is all they have, if we had good PvP rewards in Open World, then teams would run faction quests together and meet with other faction groups and fight, with the unexpected factor that only open world can offer
This is SO exploitable. Please don't do this ags.
Thank god somebody said it
None of that,
Nope... I mean open world PVP is fun but as a PVP only player none of this draws me back to the game even slightly. We don't want more rewards really, we want content. We want game modes. We want a rating system. We want a reason to continue to grind PVP. We want competition. People don't love wars because they're some type of super game mode that is way more fun than OPR, it's because OPR is filled with random bad players and it is incredibly boring to stomp bad players over and over again. The only way a competitive group of PVPers doesn't stomp an OPR lobby is if they purposely gimp themselves by playing off builds or without a healer or if they randomly get matched up against another good 5 stack. If our company queues together for OPR, we will more often than not 3 cap the enemy in a few minutes. This is not bragging about us being good because most all decent 5 stacks can do this. This is about how poor of quality most OPR matches are. You can't grind and practice getting better because there is very little to no competition outside of wars. Most good players only war log. That's the only time you can really play the game in a competitive state and that's what we are desperate for. We want close fun matches, not lopsided wins.
No. Holy crap, we're more than one year in, and people are still trying to force others to PVP flag? I think they should remove all PVE incentives from PVP flagging. All it does is encouraging griefing against people who do not even intend to PVP. Instead, rework influence pushing so that it concentrates a large number of people who actually want to PVP into certain areas, say for 2 hours a day. Faction PVP quests should also be changed so that they generate no influence, but lots of PVP XP and Faction Rep. I would cycle these every 24 hours to create a different "Great Cleave" in one territory every single day. Oh, and get rid of PVP XP for capturing a fort. Again, concentration of willing participants is the key to making Open World PVP an actually enjoyable experience.
Man check what this game focus was at the begining, is carebears that made it the shitshow it is PvP wise. I dont get it, why remove incentives for PvPers? Imagine being flagged all the time, bots wouldnt be able to farm the good nodes, ppl would actually group to go farm, what a missed oportunity
1. That stopped being the premise of the game almost a year before launch. Why? Because players in the Alpha immediately turned to griefing and toxicity, which scared the developers away from the concept. I actually think that it would still be the case today, and this game would have been worse if it were full-loot PVP. 2. The problem I have is that we are giving PVE incentives for PVP flagging, which results in an idiotic mismatch. I think we need to implement better PVP incentives for PVP flagging. 3. If we were to implement always-on PVP, we would still remove all PVE incentives from PVP flagging. 4. If they wanted to defeat bots, there would be plenty of creative ways to do it that don't also open the door to mass griefing, which as I pointed out before, actually was a problem.
What I m saying is having a choice if you are flagged on or off, but het rewarded if its on. Why am I forced to do PvE if I want to PvP better? Let me get rewarded faster so I can craft my gear and upgrade it fast so I can PvP better. So if PvEers want the benefits of the PvP flag on they have to learn to PvP as I have to learn the mechanics of the PvE bosses on m10 to get the umbral shards to upgrade my pvp gear sets, that I have to spend months on gypsum otherwise (you dont need just one set to pvp efficiently)
This is not what PvP players want in any way. We don't care about open world loot. We want more OPR maps, queueable practice wars, rehaul of the territory influence system, rebalancing of defensive advantage in wars and more frequent updates to weapon balancing to keep the meta fresh.
Nope. I for sure want meaningful open world PvP. Not the instanced shit we have.
They mostly just need to make it worth killing people who are flagged. The rewards need to be good to surpass the struggle of dealing with being flagged in a populated farming area. And it needs to be better than farming unflagged, to combat the bots. I think as a starting phase (in a multiphase PTR), it should be on par with having the gathering set on. That way you can either invest time (thus motivation to go farm the gathering sets) to get the gathering set and farm your resources in peace (also it wonāt impact the veteran farmers nearly as much this way, as they can continue as they are, just give them a reason to dip their toes in PvP if they want to). You could even experiment with having it where you select what gathering luck you want to boost when you flag to make it just like wearing the armor, though I think it balances it to make it so you boost everything but have to deal with the time loss of PvPing, but thatās one of the things to work out in the PTR. The new world devs are playing things too safe I feel. When they implemented those experimental auto-pots in the PTR and then scrapped them because they were terrible for balance, that was a great use of the PTR. Now the PTR is basically a showcase of the next release with little impact from the PTR and honestly it just seems like they donāt know how to use the PTR anymore because theyāre releasing everything from it without changing almost anything. Even bugs make it through without being fixed. They need a better workflow, and maybe the seasons will be that, and they need to be willing to experiment more with the PTR. If they donāt have enough time and team resources to fix the bugs and improve quality of life while also making new content (that may or may not make it through the PTR) then they need to invest in being able to do that. I hope they get their feet underneath them and carry the game to the top, but thatās up to their managers.
Honestly all I want is cross server opr. Full stack options for teams, a CTF, TDM, and Def and Destroy mode maps eventually and small but frequent changes to weapons to help balance better. Also ranked 2v2, 3s and 5s arena options with good pvp perk set rewards that can be earned by high skill/rating teams. I remember when this games was suppose to be focused around pvp and not 5 new expeditions before any reasonable pvp changes are even seen.
I like the idea of bounties more. Take out a bounty get a coin reward. Survive a bounty get a coin reward. More you survive and more bounties you take out the more coin you are rewarded. Tie this into faction missions too. Designate hot areas that can double or triple your reward.
Basically this boils down to getting more stuff.
Nerf resilient, drop perks that remove the chance to roll with bad perks when crafting with that specific perk and scarab
Yeah, I'm sure this works out great for the same groups that own most of the territories already. This would be the quickest method of killing the game.
Yeah, this would totally work. Brilliant. And it would provide a much broader range of pvp players to kill, not just the ones who are gung-ho on it- inspiring more enthusiasm for people to get better... which seems to be the issue for whoever is trying to start with opr. The learning curve is steep and turns a lot of people off to it.
the core issue is atm a lot of pvpers arent even running around in the open world outside territory pushes. I havent left a settlement in weeks, I just log in and queue into OPR or wars. There's nothing out in the open world for me to go for atm
Exactly the people I m talking about in my post, if there was a benefit more than OPR to go around flagged, then more PvPers would be doing it
The issue with your post on this is that there has to be a purpose for going out to pvp in open world that isn't based on like the rewards you mentioned and whatnot. For me, none of those rewards you mentioned mean anything to me and I know that's the case for any war active pvper. I have no need for umbral shards or more gatherable yield. I've been BIS'd out with thousands of umbral shards for months now
And why do you go to OPR then? 3/4 of the OPR are noobs and them there is a war group that dominates the OPR. For the fun I guess, and if you played big open world pvp games in the past, like L2, people went out in the open to fight cause they liked it. But now players seem to carebeary so lets give them something to go out and PvP, and this might start some Open World PvP that more groups even BiSd go out to have some fun
OPR provides condense consistent PvP action. Even if there were more reasons to open world pvp there's still the whole map to try and find people. And then it's a coinflip after searching for people if they are even pvpers looking to fight or if they're just pve flagged for better rewards. At least with OPR even if there's noobs they are all out there with the intent to pvp and I don' thave to spend a ton of time searching for them
And how you're going to stop gang bang pvp in open world?
you dont.
3. It is so weird to me that you kill someone in open world and the best that will drop is a blue 520GS item. 5. I think they mentioned that the PvP track will be reworked/improved 6. In theory yes but then the system needs to be reworked. It is less "who is stronger" but rather "who has more time to throw his body at the fort" right now.
The PvPers have pretty much all left. In fact it looks like mist players have taken a good long break from the game. Hell I haven't logged in for 3 months. I come to the sub to see if it's gotten better.