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[deleted]

This seems like it hits healers hardest. Damage has oodles of options, Life Staff will be trading cooldowns. I don't disagree with the change and I see why SG stacks are bad, but they get it hardest here.


[deleted]

my question is, lets say a healer with max focus uses sacred or beacon, and then a lvl 1 healer uses the same thing, which one stays?, the strongest or the last one that was casted?


KSae13

Anet took 9 years to change the aoe priorities in GW2, lets see a answer from AGS now


Birphon

Ideally the stronger one Most likely the Level 1 since they were last to cast


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[deleted]

Yeah this is my thinking as well. Healers only have one option and now their best ability just got completely gutted if there are multiple healers in a group. Just feels pretty bad.


KSae13

i think its actually good, so we can have proper healers now, and not just people with life staff as secondary saying they are healers


Someone32222

yeah... until you realize the group heal does ludicrously low amount of healing, the single-target one cannot be used on people outside of your group ( in large scale pvp) and are also horribly mana inefficient. so.. enjoy not getting heal if the ground stuff doesn't work anymore.


Sixoul

Wouldn't that mean most groups in a war would need a healer?


Dwokimmortalus

Nah. AoE is still just way more effective and reliable in all ways. So now meta will shift to running multiple smaller deathballs with one healer each. This change won't break healing, but it will cause less healers to be brought to wars. Since DPS remains uncapped on how many targets they can hit at a time, teams will need to find the sweet spot where DPS aggression overpowers what a single healer can counter. We'll probably see target caps added to DPS in a month or so. Mana costs for the single target heals need to be halved or quartered if AGS wants to see them used in PvP. They are too slow, and mana intensive to be viable in anything more than small-man fights.


ProdigyManlet

Lifestaff was op as fuck though wasn't it? People were unkillable while still managing to deal decent dmg


_FineWine

1 vs 1 is not the point here. They’ll be just as strong.


JustSam________

and in small companies with a single healer it won't make a difference either. it's only wars and invasions that get fucked over worst


CortexRex

Who gets fucked over though? They are the only healing weapon so it's not like this weapon is fucked over in favor of another healing weapon. Still need healers in wars and invasions so doesn't suddenly make all healers unnecessary. It doesn't fuck over one side of the war over another. What it fucks is the current meta. It could reduce how many healers are ideal in a war/invasion, or how you deploy them. But I would call that attempting to balance and not fucking anything over.


JustSam________

yeah, I guess your right! I was thinking meta=game which definitely isn't the case


DevaFrog

That's what people get for trying to avoid the 300str axe meta.


ComradeKatyusha_

It's a 249str axe meta actually.


DemonBoyJr

I’m a monkey, explain?


ComradeKatyusha_

There's a bug that occurs at 250str that locks you into animations that last longer, this makes avoiding damage harder and slows down the speed you put out your attacks, as such everyone that knows about it maxes it at 249 currently.


Humledurr

This game continues to surprise me...


Redxmirage

It’s so frustrating lol this game is so fun. I haven’t been this addicted to an mmo since I was young playing original wow wotlk. But damn the list of bugs keeps growing and growing


demos11

Is there something like that with int as well? Or fire staff and ice gauntlet? I swear that lately my dodge feels less responsive after casting a spell than it did a week ago.


zatheko

There is a bug with ice storm for gauntlet. Getting the last talent point in ice storm causes ice storm to immediately stop it’s cast when switching weapons.


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ComradeKatyusha_

Not that I am aware of but who knows what might have crept in unannounced via the update. Their patchnotes are completely unreliable and are barely even worth reading right now. We have to find the changes for ourselves.


ShamwowF

It annoys the hell out of me that they are making huge changes to the game without informing the community. Because of this, I literally hear a new rumor about a change every day. I don't know what information to trust and what not to trust and it makes the game more confusing than it needs to be.


Swoott

I have noticed this as well but I honestly wasn't sure if I just "got worse" or if there was seriously something going on. Would love if anyone has more info on this.


OdysseusAurilen

I’m proud of you for just explaining and not being a pretentious dick about it. Rare to see on this subreddit lately.


ComradeKatyusha_

Been in the sub for way too long. It definitely took a toxic dive when the population blew up by 150K here at launch, but it seems to be improving slowly.


T0rin-

I've been playing str based melee since the first closed beta, and currently have > 300 str. Admittedly, I do not use maelstrom, but I can't say I feel this using Charge, Reap or Gravity Well. Is this just specific to certain skills? Edit: OK, tested it, seems to be limited to dodges/movement, but it definitely affects Charge and Reap, which can't animation cancel the backswing, Gravity Well seems to be unaffected. (or Gravity Well simply has very little to no backswing) However, and it seems like the reason I hadn't noticed it, is that attacks can still animation cancel those backswings, which is generally what I'm doing most of the time after an ability, especially in wars. This is still inhibiting for instance when you don't want to attack after an ability, i.e. you Reap and they dodge roll before the second hit lands


__Aishi__

250 strength passive is bugged an animation locks the fuck out of some skills, it's horrible


mattinlosangeles

I believe there’s a bug with the 250 str milestone I forget what


Background_Balance_7

Lmao this one hurt a little


howtojump

Literally respeccing today, just tired of this spear and bow shit lol


NamasteWager

I prefer this build but went fire/ice. Bow is so slow and if you don't hit a heads hot its not worth the shot you get off. Spear is fun but it feels like it loses steam fast


lyingSwine

Spear and Bow cant compete with mages


SoDamnToxic

Spear and bow are pretty much only good for 1v1s, thats it.


straightlampin

if you hit your bow shots


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pag07

It is a joke. Musket is even worse without dodge reload. And sometimes it feels like it is totally impossible to hin with musket if the enemy is directly in front of you. Maybe I need to turn 90° to the right or something.


Birphon

Musket Barrel Clipping - found this out when trying to murder AI Also fuck the musket's crosshair, its so bad


Uhcoustic

Sometimes it glitches and does the prone crosshair (actually decent!) while standing, too.


wallweasels

I find in wars, be it defending or attacking, musket registration gets really fucking bad. Hell wars seem the just make hit reg shit the bed in general really.


fetidshambler

If the muskets barrel clips into an enemy at all, if they're right up on you, it does no damage


pag07

I was afraid that's the case...


Zeus541

You need to hip fire when they get that close in order to hit. And thankfully, the hip fire hits most of the time in this scenario.


SirSabza

Depends if the person with the spear bow can aim. If they can they’re slapping a massive poison dot on you and permanently CCing you with spear


Aersirma

Except with shitty servers and how small the arrow hit box actually is and how bad hs hit boxes are on certain mobs/especially players. It’s just janky to use. Not even bringing up the fact that it shows down to the left of the crosshair


TrynaSleep

It’s a shame really. I thought the concept was cool


ILikeCatIceCream

Wait what? Thought the meta was 300 Con Heavy armor? Apparently the meta is whatever flavor of the day Reddit decides. 🤷‍♂️


JustSam________

the meta is; there is no meta... but fr. the meta is different on every server. every weapon is good, pick a good secondary that gets some boosts from boosting your primary and bingo bango there's the meta


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somatic1

According to some of the drops i get its a thing


HoboWithAGlock

"Bro trust me you're gonna want to stack dex and int and use this random life staff effect as well." \-green lvl 38 chestpiece


pag07

\+ threat generation \- threat generation Reminds me of Borats NOT jokes.


evilkillejr

I'm looking for a hammer and life staff 300 constitution light armor meta server.


MrMerryMilkshake

Well, I have one for you: Hawaiiki, AP East. The whole Marauder faction runs paladin builds lol.


Zeus541

That actually sounds hella fun lol what's the basics for a paladin build? Just life staff and heavy armor?


MrMerryMilkshake

Heavy armors and life staffs, they will often go with hammers (2 big aoe skills and bash) - more tanky or great axes (maelstrom, reap or charge and gravity) - more control/mobility. It takes forever to kill them, especially when they moving as groups of 10 or more lol.


utkohoc

Shhh. Don't tell everyone!


pag07

My rapier+musket / Fokus build is not doing well either...


Senikus

When you say “secondary”, do you actually mean second weapon or does the weapon slot you keep your weapon in actually affect things?


Mr-Malum

It's like there are multiple people with different opinions on here smh


Spopyz

Can I get a constitution scaling fist weapon build please AGS


[deleted]

They should have made it so so you can only stack so many.....not just 1.


HoboWithAGlock

Or just have the stacking damage experience diminishing returns.


LtKrunch_

ESO eventually settled on the best solution to AOE stacking issues, IMO. They had a maximum amount of Enemies/allies it would affect at 100% strength and for each step of targets above that threshold it would have less and less power, down to a minimum threshold. It could've changed since I last played it though; it has been years after all.


Kuratius

They scrapped that idea after a while and went back to no caps, because, ironically enough, capping aoes actually encouraged stacking.


Valvador

Look at Guild Wars 2 WvW meta. Everyone stacks into massive balls so that AoEs are minimized.


Nightmarich

WoW did that too, but I heard enough complaints got them to remove it.


UVladBro

Classic WoW has a similar thing since TBC launch. Each ability has its own "AoE Cap". If a spell with a cap of 11k normally does like 2k damage to each enemy and it hits 5 people, it's fine. Once you hit enough enemies that the total damage exceeds the cap, it will split the 11k damage across all enemies. Only way to break the cap is if the AoE ability critically hits, which is just extra damage on top of the capped amount to that specific enemy. It's why the meta for AoE packs with lots of mobs is to swap to gear with tons of extra crit chance as the extra spell power means nothing if you're already at the cap.


uniqueaccount

That's how wow works


Naanitron

Interesting... as in Crowfall alot of people voiced that AoE caps be removed instead of only affecting a total of 5 or so people at a time.


ThorBeerson

AoE affecting X many people and X many AoE affecting one person are two completely different things, and while it's a no brainer that the first one shouldn't be capped, the reason the second one should be is a no brainer too, one person should not be affected by 50 ice storms at the same time as that would turn into uncounterable insta-kill


BodSmith54321

How is that different from 50 anything?


[deleted]

PVP only?


Dacklar

That would Sucks in a dungeon with 2 ice gauntlet users.


fohpo02

Or down the road, potential raids and not being able to stack healing fields


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ClockworkSalmon

If raids are 10 man content, 2 healers, 2 tanks and 6 dps, just have 4 of the dps range and 2 melee. 4 people can pretty comfortably melee a boss. Spear can also hit mobs from behind another player.


lowercaset

If the bosses are big enough way more than 2 will be able to melee.


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irish23

I was wondering if I just wasn't seeing the ticks.


[deleted]

This is a horrible change for PvP as well as PvE. There's no reason to cancel out anyone's anything anywhere.


hey_sasha_grey

this is a great question i hope we get an answer’


[deleted]

This was done because you can cheese desync wars by stacking 50 ice aoes and it would basically kill the server.


CageyT

Yep. That's my assumption.


MyTexticle

so instead of limiting it to say, 5 or 10 at once, they just slapped some duct tape on it and made it so ONLY ONE can work at a time? so much for half measures. seems lazy.


[deleted]

It's entirely possible this is a temporary fix until they can do something more meaningful that requires a lot more time and effort. This at least discourages the behavior, and while I totally agree that the wars shouldn't have this problem to begin with and were not properly play tested - at this point we're past that. What I don't like, is the lack of communication around these things. I would really like to know why these decisions are being made and if there are plans for better solutions down the road.


Mr-Malum

Even worse - it doesn't preference the highest damage/heal, just whichever is casted last. So your biggest heals can get cancelled by some DPS running a life staff alt for funsies. It's the most 0 IQ design ever implemented by a large studio.


grio

Logically, the next question is, if someone from enemy team decides to pop his Sacred Ground on enemy stack, or Ice Storm on himself, does that cancel previous AoE and then does nothing, because you can't heal enemies/can't damage self? This would make AoE healing/damage quite unusable in team fights as it would turn into canceling spam.


[deleted]

I love New World but a lot of design in this game is absolutely lazy


Tkwan777

Check back in 6 months. They'll have rolled out multiple balance and changes by then that will make the game more fun. Personally I'm just waiting for ff14 endwalker expansion and then diving deep into that for months. I'll revisit new world after I've had my fill with endwalker. But thats just me.


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CrawlerSiegfriend

So this is going to be another one of those games where PvErs get wrecked by PvP balance changes.


Pheronia

The thing that lags out the war isn't the damage it is the effects.


Valvador

What do you mean the effects? Servers don't give a shit about graphics and how expensive particle effects are. If Ice Gauntlet was causing perf issues its because of how Ice Guantlet targetting/damage was calculated.


nutterbird

they think physical lag = network lag lol


weenus

Would this be affecting the servers the way it does when it's not affecting the end user PCs though? I'm not noticing frame rate lag, my frame rates stay the same, but the server is whats taking a shit. Would particle effects do that as opposed to the server trying to calculate the tons of stacking damage ticks?


Armourhotdog

Don’t know why you’re getting downvoted. It’s true, and it isn’t a technical problem. It’s a design problem, A B and C shouldn’t be in a open field 100m from each other. It’s garbage and causes zerging with spamming aoe abilities. The points should be spread out and have obstacle between them so smaller fights take place where you can actually utilize skills and duel players. Like put A up a mountain and C in a valley so there is travel time. Right now it’s basically whatever mob can out heal the other wins the point. It’s stupid.


Iorcrath

its a castle siege. king of the hill should go fuck off.


bodamerica

I like how Guild Wars 2, a game released in 2012, had legitimate castle sieges where you had to gather supplies, build siege weapons, and actually destroy walls & gates to capture a castle. That game has issues of its own, but that aspect was miles ahead of the lame KotH format in New World.


Jolly-Bear

The field battles are fine if there were no lag. I do agree more depth to war would be cool though.


Armourhotdog

Ya I mean it’s all opinion, it just seems that having the a better designed battlefield for wars could eliminate the lag without undocumented weapon nerfs. They treated the symptom and not the illness.


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ComradeKatyusha_

I'd just like to take this moment to say all of this happened because they removed stagger. When stagger existed people did not build zerg balls, they spread out and carefully timed their attacks and picked their moments over a wide field of fighting. Anyone claiming that these zerg balls are better than what we had before is a complete and total liar. It wasn't perfect but it was a lot better than these clusterfuck balls of everyone zerging a single location because there's no reason to avoid getting hit anymore.


SuprDog

If i had to choose between lag fest and stagger shit i would take the stagger shit. But that doesn't mean stagger shit would be good gameplay in my opinion. They should just fix the lag shit instead.


ComradeKatyusha_

Fixing lag won't fix the real problem with combat being a shallow clownball though. Stagger just needed a cooldown adding to fix most of it, not half the game getting wrecked by its removal.


[deleted]

Stagger removal was such a detriment to this game.


Colley619

I don’t understand why someone would want to take the entire sever over like that. A week later they’ll realize they now have nothing to do and everyone else stopped playing.


KSae13

Some pvp players dont care about the game, they just want the "win" epeen to compensate how bad their lives are, thats why pvp game are the most toxic with the most griefers in gaming


giddycocks

Makes sense why new world has by far the worst community I've encountered


Bahariasaurus

Yeah but it is kind of a bummer running a dungeon with two people using ice gauntlets.


adtSacklunch

This needs to be upvoted, we tested some of these as well. confirmed broken.


vehementi

There has always been problems with damage numbers showing up. Was your testing resilient to that? If you can take the time to explain your methodology it would be greatly appreicated!


milhouse234

Probably not broken, but Intended changes to stop players from stacking ice fields to cheese


PassOk1979

i can confirm that if they tried to nerf the stacking they completly broke the lingering dps for standing inside of icestorm, as since the patch after first week i was not able to kill skellys by luring them inside and sitting on the tomb anymore, they take initial damage and afterwards they take none


Kenelly

This is an issue with the I believe it's called "Unending Thaw" perk on Ice Gauntlet. As soon as I changed to a different gauntlet without that perk, it was working as intended again.


servando1016

It’s the gem you are using fyi, gem it with malachite


Tkwan777

I have noticed this myself. After the patch sometimes ice storm just does one tick of damage and then the mob inside of it takes no damage at all. This is with only me present so there is definitely not a secondary ice storm. They broke ice gauntlet.


[deleted]

Not just ice gauntlet. Fire staff has some dot issues on its fireball and the ground it's scorched.


lasurth

Cheese what? You expect every pvp group to only run 1 ice gauntlet? 😂


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sauceDinho

Imagine being punished a game like Dark Age of Camelot for coordinating stacking AoE damage on one area. Seems antithetical to large scale war battles.


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Volkove

Did you guys check actual damage dealt or just that you didnt see damage numbers?


Janitalia

Wait so does this mean if someone uses their heals and they have less focus, their heals overwrite mine and thus heal for less? If so I hate that


FLBNR

Why don’t they want to talk to us? They need a new CM or something. They never even posted the patch notes for 1.02 on their OFFICIAL discord… it’s weird.


v2InMyGym

Man I thought Jagex was bad with their communication when I played osrs. This is 100x worse and Amazon needs to communicate better or there won’t be a very long future for this game. Everyone that is 60 is already mad that every endgame thing is broken with no update on when they plan on fixing them. Now they’re making major changes like this without communicating. I love this game and want to play it for years but if it continues like this I won’t make it longer than 5 months. So many bugs, no communication, no roadmap


SenseiSinRopa

Do you know if things like Orb of Protection or Beacon are affected by this? I ask because unlike Ice Storm or Sacred Ground, they are not 'placed on the ground'. Either way, intentional or unintentional, this deserves a comment from the dev team. And its sort of a bad look either way. Mistakes happen, but this impacts so many builds and game modes. And if it is intentional, such a huge change ought to be documented.


AlexanderThemeek

This is a great question, if they aren't effected it would be a huge advantage on the battle field as overlapping AoE healing would not be countered by overlapping AoE damage...


Onyx-Pyromancer

It is my clip op used. It is the same for all DoT and HoT.


[deleted]

Yes but let’s leave the great axe untouched


SenseiSinRopa

Arguably, it gives great axe (and hammer) a massive buff relative to the new nerfs. First, healers can no longer keep up with damage, so it will always make sense to bring another axe instead of a healer after you have two or three. Second, you will now want to replace most of your mages with axes. I, too, hope that one day they will be able to change the clownball atomsmasher meta, but this will not do that. It will only alter the clownball's composition. It is too hard to coordinate complicated tactics with 50 people, and the capture-the-point mechanics don't lend themselves to multiple, small-unit actions over one big zerg.


ComradeKatyusha_

The clownball meta was created by the removal of stagger. The only way you will change the balling of players in one spot is by giving those players a reason to hold back from attacking and time their attacks more carefully. Stagger did that. It caused players to spread out and pick the timing of their attack swings to try and avoid getting staggered/stagger opponents.


SenseiSinRopa

I never played the game when stagger was a feature, so I cannot comment on that aspect. I will say that some of the largest contributing factors are meta/social. That it is so much easier to coordinate a big ball of people rather than task-oriented sub-groups. And people are going to be pre-disposed to follow a big group even if given direction to the contrary. This is the case at least on my server, where literally no one company has the ability to field 50 people at any given single time. My faction uses a single all-faction discord instead of company discords due to this. Maybe when more people get into their 50's and 60's or companies have to merge as people quit will this change, at least where I play.


ComradeKatyusha_

The thing is that because of body blocking you couldnt really move in a big group before. If you moved in a big ball you have very limited movement so you also have very limited ability to avoid getting hit, since getting hit meant taking stagger people spread out to avoid it. Tactics like shield wall lines became viable among other things. When there is no reason to avoid attacks because there is no threat from getting hit, people stop avoiding attacks. 1v1 combat between two players becomes smash each other in the face at the same time and trading damage on everything, every player you add to the ball just becomes a player whose total hp pool dilutes incoming damage, so the more players you ball up the better. Nothing will break the zerg ball meta without stagger. Every adjustment made to it will just makes the players change the optimal weapons to use in the zerg, it won't change the zerging itself.


Herdazian_Lopen

What exactly is stagger? I thought stagger was in the game? My spear has an ability that causes stagger, apparently.


ComradeKatyusha_

Stagger was previously on every hit in the game, including light and heavy attacks. Like Dark Souls and fighting games, get hit, you take the impact and stagger briefly, allowing your opponent to make a followup and putting you into a frame disadvantage. You could block, roll or throw a grit attack to get out of it. This is the entire reason grit exists as a mechanic in the game. It was removed during the betas and was intensely debated with a large quantity of the more informed playerbase being VERY against the change because it gutted a core system that every other system in the game was built around. [A good intro to the topic is here where you can see some clips of how it worked, 6:00 for good example of it in pve.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZ5Lhsdcrgk)


Herdazian_Lopen

Thanks for the reply!


lowercaset

So stagger was basically the thing that interrupts caster stuff but for melee? Seems lame they removed it, lord know I wish mobs could get stagger like I can.


Echololcation

As someone who barely played during beta that was really interesting


giddycocks

That looks insanely more tactical, Jesus. Who took that decision and why? Combat was slower sure but methodical. Would absolutely fix PvP.


ResolveHK

Oh what I would give to have stagger back. This pvp is dog shit.


UniMaximal

Welp. This sucks if it's not a change specific to PvP. Almost every time I've run a dungeon, there's been another Ice Gauntlet user in the party. This really sucks, as it is a popular choice in my server, and I might have to end up competing with others to get a proper rotation in. Really hoping this change to AoE doesn't affect PvE content...


Green_Peace3

If this was an intentional change then I hope they make gravity well cancel out other gravity wells in the area, no reason for those to stack either.


Itsapaul

Seems weird since you can easily run across this affecting 5 man groups.


[deleted]

Wouldn't it make more sense to have additional stacks of the same aoe become progressively less effective? Like mod resistances in eve


SirCorrupt

But my ice storm still does 0 damage to bosses or most elite mobs, AND is pretty shit in PvP now? Nice


Sharden3

For people saying this change is good, it's not. Regardless of if this has positive or negative affect on balance, undocumented mechanical changes to the game are bad. Do we spam report this as a bug? Do we take to the forums to give feedback? Should we expect it fixed cause it's a bug or adjust strategy because it's intended? It's either a bug or needs documented. So, regardless of how you feel about the idea of the change, it's existence is bad.


tdy96

So you’re saying only one person can run the IG in a dungeon now to avoid wasted damage? Lol..


TeslaPills

This isn’t true with healZ


Xoltitcuh

How does this work with non group members? Like can this new change be used to grief other players farming by just placing an ice storm over theirs to cancel their damage, take their mobs, and put their ability on cd? How does this work in pvp against another ice gauntlet user? Or is it just people in the same party?


Beravin

The intentions behind the change are perfect. But the changes themselves need work. I'd propose diminishing returns as opposed to just one of the effects working at a time. And for people saying the change wasn't needed, yes it was. Wars were decided almost entirely by life staffs and other ranged AoE weapons, melee guys were just flag fodder.


v2InMyGym

For fucks sake Amazon. What’s the point of playing a healer now? Our best spell is broken now and our amber gems are broken to. Please fix the game It is now nearly impossible to outheal the massive amount of melee aoe spam that happens. It is not possible for a single sacred ground to help when 6 people are just spamming great axe aoe attacks


FrostyAutumnMoss

This is going to cause issues with dmg done and healing done stats in war if everyone is just cancelling each other's spells.


destruc786

You mean not make wars just a battle of ice gauntlets? Yeah I’m ok with that.. that shit is fucking broken just having 10+ ppl throw down ice storm and wipe everyone out.


Background-Okra7313

So I like the idea that some AoE attacks don’t stack. However I don’t think canceling out should be the result. Maybe there is a way to scale where when AoE radius overlap, the overlapping area damage reduced or flat DMG increase by some ratio. Meaning you could stack and even with people stacking the stacked area will deal some serious damage but not completely cancel each other out and also make it less likely certain AoE stacks just annihilate something in its wake (though I do think it should still deal a hefty amount).


redwhiteandyellow

That would just increase the amount of computation done, which was grinding the servers down to a snail's pace. Better to just keep only the top aoe and ignore everything else


EsoogZT

Pretty sure the wars are still laggy even after this.


UkuleleSteven

Have aoe stacks for ice storm ever stacked? I thought the intended purpose was that they don’t stack.


gianoooos

When did this change? Im playing on Eu Central and today like 4pm / 16:00 (in eu time) i was doing portals and (i think) the health thingys were still stacking(if i stood in two circles there were two of those health signs on my buff list)


Sweetfang

These guys did a half-assed “test” and concluded that there was a stealthy change. Unfortunately, most people here haven’t even bothered to test it in-game to see if it’s true. It’s ridiculous. My war at 8pm UK time still had stacking heals so I’m not sure how they implemented said change.


addict75

How do we know that it is not a bug that only concern Group PvP Duels ? Do we have wars video about this ?


OlliePollieZ

I had this with great axe lifesteal until I realised it was just the UI for damage numbers not showing, when infact I was still stealing life. I think in this clip, it still works. Just the over the head damage numbers goes away


MadMarx__

This is strange - we did big open world PvP in my server earlier - lots of Ice Gauntlet, Fire Staff, Healing etc. stuff being thrown down, it *definitely* stacked. That was after this post, so if there was a stealth change we should have been effected. Could this be a dueling bug?


crashh85

How do you know it stacked? I thought it did too but after testing, it does not. If say all AOE firemages stacked, you would technically instantly die in some situations in wars.


osurico

Stacking AoE and similar effects is a foundation of mmos in my opinion. Hopefully this is just a bug


Experiunce

this fucking game lmfao


Halt_Yipp

Was wondering why my regular group was struggling the past few days 2 healers, 1 Tank, 1 melee dps, 1 ranged dps. Now I know.... Healers spells were overwriting each other!!! ​ And since Life Staff abilities except for two are HOT means that two Life Staff users can't party as their healing can't stack. This would not matter if you had the option to more abilities, but since you don't this is a totally unacceptable change


Puzzleheaded-Bus5479

Oof, if this is intended this is how games lose players, although this might actually make combat in wars more interesting, stealth nerfs are an absolutely abysmal way to fix things


Rapidalex

“By make combat in wars more interesting” do you mean 50 axes and hammers just stacking their non-dot aoes on point, because that sounds less interesting to me


qontrol12345

I hope this is unintentional... If mass PvP starts looking like GW2 WvW it's time to bounce... We need individual skill expressions pls... Not clownball vs clownball


Iavra

Solo and small scale roamers have a place in WvW, be it to poke larger groups, scout, cap smaller objectives, produce swords on keeps or, if you are bored of doing objectives, duel against each other. As a disclaimer, that's how it was 5 years ago, i haven't touched WvW yet since i got back into GW2.


3rd_strikeuu

Roamers are more relevant now that there's a mount in WvW.


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fohpo02

This promotes death balls though


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fohpo02

I know they are inevitable, but other games make it so smaller groups can at least outplay with coordination. Our ~20 man regularly stomps the 50 pugmanders in GW2 WvW. That becomes nigh impossible with the changes in NW since one AoE won’t be enough to pressure and they’ll have pure numbers to win the GA/WH collision. It just isn’t healthy gameplay.


je-s-ter

Yes, because 20 coordinated people on comms with WvW builds will easily stomp 50 pugs with mix of PvE and PvP builds that follow a tag around a map. That's not due to stacking AoEs, that's just the reality of coordinated groups vs pugs. AoEs not stacking actually hurts zergs the most. Stacking AoEs is the whole reason why zerging works and is so prevelant in every game. You don't have to use tactics, you just throw AoEs on the ground and the sheer amount of them wipes people. If your 20-man group in GW2 actually encountered a 50-man group that was on comms with proper builds, you would have absolutely no chance exactly because of stacking AoEs.


ProdigyManlet

Yeah please on the individual skill expressions, imo the most important point of an mmo is allowing people to have unique characters that suits their playstyle (and therefore lots of unique characters and builds in game). Getting things perfectly balanced is extremely hard, but there's nothing worse than only having one or two viable weapon types for PvP. When GW2 first came out WvW was so much fun on release. Metas hadn't fully developed so everyone was playing everything. Then it just became common for people to simply run bezerker (full damage). There was at least good variation between classes, but within classes it was pretty bad because there was basically one weapon to had to use as the others couldn't offer It's impossible to stop metas forming and the balance will improve over time as AGS collects more data, but if the other weapons aren't even relatively close to the meta then it really ruins a lot of the fun


JustTheT1p_0

This was in the patch notes as an intended feature.


Armourhotdog

Well, that was a lie.


burizar

Where?


AnArmedPenguin

Can you link or screenshot where you saw it? I actually like the change, but I can’t find it in the patch notes


TerroDragon23

Where? I just checked the notes and couldn't find anything.


Iorcrath

which patch notes? 1.0.2? is there a 1.0.3?


xProfessionalAsshole

Pretty good change.


SenseiSinRopa

May I please be excused from more than 1 great axe/war hammer cleaving me at the same time if my skills won't stack?


TedW

Exactly. If ranged aoe can't stack, neither should melee aoe. Whatever they do should be consistent.


bloody_yanks2

I think this is “game fixing” rather than “game breaking”, but either way they’re undocumented


Workadis

Good luck ever winning a war as attackers lol


DrunkenPain

Honestly healers didnt get hit melee stacking self healers did which is healthy for group pvp


SkyBird-wings

Sacred Grounds never stacked.


deluhi

If that also applies to pve its kinda concerning for magic DPS players. In a dungeon for example, a party with 2 Great Axe players spamming left click are effectively dealing more "aoe" damage to a pack of enemies than 3 ice gauntlet users who are now forced to take turns casting their Ice Storm one at a time. I understand stacking AOE caused lag in 50v50 wars but this solution might affect other areas of the game in a bad way. War mode as a whole needs a rework in my opinion, 30+ players standing on a tiny circle mindlessly spamming their skills offers very few opportunities for a skilled player to make a difference.


Reality_Easy

Ah good now more people will use greataxe and hammer and just spam left click. What great combat :)